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局長大家早安剛才聽取了局裡面的報告我個人深感有關國家安全以及我們國家的核心利益它是一體兩面它是沒有妥協的空間那麼今天在場的所有涉及國安的"},{"start":28.53,"end":50.82,"text":"部會首長也都在場那麼除了國防部部以外幾乎都在場了所以我今天會用幾個方法論提供一些建議做參考那大家現在實際上我們的人才濟濟但是在橫向整合的過程中間我們還有一些努力的空間提出一些頭像尤其是剛剛局長也提到了"},{"start":51.7,"end":67.539,"text":"国外的媒体也有时候是为了他的商业利益做出一些不正确的资讯的这个残破那也许会影响到我们国内明星士气的判断那我下面这张图这个刚才您提到了就是2015年"},{"start":69.882,"end":82.493,"text":"2025年的美國國家安全戰略它是11月出來的那麼接著就是國防戰略那下一個版本就等著軍事戰略那我們關注要看的是什麼就是印太戰略那"},{"start":83.43,"end":105.657,"text":"去年我曾经代表我们院里面接待了15个美国国会助理团,都是法案助理,资深的助理团,也跟他们做了很多意见交换,他们提出来了,就是说因为他们有一个完整的国家安全战略,所以你看到这上面四个面向,四个P,就是在军事的能力上面,他们是预做准备,"},{"start":106.477,"end":134.776,"text":"在这个外交事务上他是做预防措施那么在他的经济上面他是要追求经济另外就是对于他的高科技内部安全管制法律手他是要做一个保护所以四个批那实际上就是包括美国的国务院现在叫做战争部还有CIA还有他的国会他们都有一个专门的特别小组研究中国大陆所有的行政军事企图"},{"start":136.035,"end":156.429,"text":"他们因为是可以横向交流所以有很多资料的分享因为我们目前还没有一个我们国家版的国家安全战略就是官方版那两个面向第一个是对国际的国家来讲他看不到我们的官方版就是对我的核心利益的价值观在评估上面会跟现实面有点落差"},{"start":156.969,"end":181.258,"text":"第二个就是国内的人士看不到官方版的国家安全战略因为我们现在只有国防战略你看这个上次的印太战略他们因为把AI当作工具所以现在各部会用分享资料上速度非常快最下面一个就是他在那个上一个版本的印太战略讲就是说我们台湾保有做两岸交流的自我决定这是他讲的话"},{"start":182.418,"end":202.3,"text":"那下一个就看国家安全战略国防战略军事战略印太的下面的战略因为我们国家目前还没有没有国家安全战略那么QDR四年期国防总检讨美国在2017年就已经停止了现在是国防战略一样四年一本下面呢就是他的军事战略我们刚刚"},{"start":202.961,"end":231.988,"text":"发表了我们的国防报告书可是在去年十月国防报告书出来的时候还没有提到台湾之盾也就是说这个东西将来要做滚动的修正了要把这个理念倒进去那现在就是说我还是建议从国安的角色像我们政府希望在这个执政党的任内能够推出官方版的这个公开版当然有机密的内部这样子对其他的国际的学者智库有人来看的时候"},{"start":232.828,"end":234.654,"text":"就比較容易掌握我們的核心價值"},{"start":239.829,"end":262.516,"text":"剛剛您在提到就是最近這個美國日本以及菲律賓他們都在強化對這個東海南海整個的監控那我這個資料也是從不同的資訊裡面把剛才您那個簡報裡面部署的菲律賓還有日本部署的這些武器裝備Sensor涵蓋範圍也做了一個套疊以及日本"},{"start":263.436,"end":292.655,"text":"公開版的因為上次我在國防研究院也碰到日本來訪的學者他也說你們這個圖怎麼做我們說是利用GIS做個校正把圖套疊出去你就可以看到一個大範圍的圖共同圖像我們在作業過程中共同圖像需要有很多工程的背景不是光一般的行政幕僚會用的這個大家我們共同努力我也可以把資料跟局裡面做分享"},{"start":294.451,"end":319.966,"text":"这样才产生了一个叫JCAPJoin,Original Picture所以看到的范围不仅止于台湾防空识别区乃至于旁边到宫古海峡下面到这个巴丹岛到南海这个都可以显示那这个图各位看是一个大的防空识别区因为这个海委会主委在他的这个脸书上公布了说这个中共的这个船"},{"start":321.297,"end":332.862,"text":"我們把套疊上去這是今天早上的防空這是國防部公布的把這個圖套上去再比較周遭的環境這個時候看出來的東西就比較客觀一點"},{"start":334.756,"end":357.021,"text":"像這個圖就是大範圍涵蓋了朝鮮半島日本東海南海台海那這是最近中共部一個限航區對不對但是他並沒有真正向IKEA申請那我們國內對這個判斷上就心裡會產生壓力因為他的時間很長了1327到5月6號那我們怎麼做呢第一個你要把上海飛航航線"},{"start":358.837,"end":369.231,"text":"不是光台灣的飛航情報區不是防空識別區是飛航情報區裡面的航線套疊上去我這邊可以顯示給各位看這個大區顯示出來了"},{"start":371.506,"end":397.768,"text":"這是今天早上的民航機的線路背景再把上海的航線套疊起來你發現並沒有影響但是因為公開的資訊很有限在民間有時候會誤解可能會遭到心理上的誤判這個時候如果有人帶風向就變成你內心不安或是做出一些不是智當的反應這裡面都套成四層圖到五層圖了"},{"start":399.642,"end":423.771,"text":"用這種方法論這是台灣的這個國際航線所以我們要顯示說要把上海飛航情報局的航線也把它抓出來那去對應的軌跡圖就可以做出結果那剛才您的報告裡面提到中共對海欄的狀況像在海峽中間有很多的破壞那我們就把海欄的圖經過校正全部顯示出來那麼再去跟"},{"start":424.591,"end":435.559,"text":"不同的海揽跟不同的公司有中華電信有遠傳各自簽約的廠商了解到這個如果有意外的時候修復它要多少時間那這做一個參考"},{"start":439.008,"end":456.221,"text":"这里面比较一个新的问题就是您刚刚里面提到就是现在实际上在国际情势里面看的就是这个我讲心理战媒体战法律战它纠结在一起现在是用AI对抗AI那在这个科技进步下法条的规则要更新"},{"start":457.122,"end":479.853,"text":"要跟得上AI那治理競賽那這裡面就是法律戰的作為心理戰的作為媒體戰作為我們中間會發現產生很多的假信息還有就是所謂的deep fake那最後是什麼希望導致你對一個事情的看法誤判下了一個錯誤的決心做了一個錯誤的決定"},{"start":481.494,"end":504.436,"text":"然後全民買單付出一個很錯誤的代價這個是我們要預防的尤其是中共的這個心理戰上面這過程中間所以它是三個面向那現在AI的技術非常進步那這個東西要大家滾動修正那將來我們還有機會再互動那這只是顯示一個所有跟AI相關的議題最後我們要因為這個月份國防部也要做這個漢光演習"},{"start":505.737,"end":528.63,"text":"那这里面实际上把AI导入的技术从它的节奏性你的基础防卫流程你涵盖的范围不同的层次以及能源现在讲穿了能源就是国安运善能力也是国安所以我们建议就是未来不管是执政在野我们要团结一心国家安全是不可以妥协请这个局长您做个回应"},{"start":529.19,"end":548.756,"text":"好 謝謝幾個重點跟委員做一些補充的說明第一部分是有關於國家安全戰略的部分那這部分委員先前也有多次的提醒我們內部會再來提出相關的討論那我知道委員也有相關的一個立法的提案那假如需要本局來提供意見的話我們很樂意來參與相關的一個意見的交流"},{"start":549.196,"end":573.182,"text":"那第二部分是有關於一些圖資的彙整怎麼樣用一個比較全面有系統的方式來呈現我們所面臨到比較複雜的國家安全包括海洋安全的一個圖像那這個部分我們跟委員辦公室也一直有在聯繫我們在這一部分也是我們努力的方向所以不管今天的公開版或機密版的部分我們都做相關的一個圖示的嘗試讓大家更能夠了解基本的一個樣態"},{"start":574.042,"end":588.676,"text":"那第三個部分是有關於中共所劃設的這個空域保留區那確實沒有影響到民航的部分因為我們第一時間就跟民航局有做過確認那他並沒有影響到民航的任何的航班航線也不用再跟上海飛航情報局做任何申請都不用"},{"start":589.116,"end":612.896,"text":"那我們判斷主要可能還是有點在測試外機在相關空域活動的狀況那因為有能力在當地空域活動的外機大概還是以美國為主所以我們後續再來注意美中在這一塊空域相關互動的情形那中共有沒有在相關的空域進行軍事演訓我們也會跟國防部合作透過聯合情監偵來做密切的一個助手謝委員"},{"start":614.135,"end":620.21,"text":"謝謝局長我們大家共同努力謝謝陳永康委員接下來我們請羅美玲委員"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:12:18.029000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:12:20.310000+08:00","text":"主席，有請局長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-08T10:12:20.650000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:12:27.493000+08:00","text":"請局長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:12:27.493000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:12:28.933000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，陳委員早。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:12:28.933000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:12:30.954000+08:00","text":"主席、局長，大家早安。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:12:32.074000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:12:57.375000+08:00","text":"剛才聽取了局裡面的報告，我個人深感國家安全以及我們國家的核心利益是一體兩面，沒有妥協的空間，今天所有涉及國安的部會首長也都在場，除了國防部以外，幾乎都在場，所以我今天會用幾個方法論提供一些建議做參考。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:12:59.556000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:13:05.979000+08:00","text":"實際上，現在我們的人才濟濟，但是在橫向整合的過程中間還有一些努力的空間。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:13:05.979000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:13:20.413000+08:00","text":"我提出一些圖象，尤其是剛剛局長也提到了國外的媒體，也有的時候是為了它的商業利益，做出一些不正確的資訊傳播，也許會影響到我們國內民心士氣的判斷。","quality":0.621},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:13:23.376000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:13:38.492000+08:00","text":"剛才您提到了2025年的美國國家安全戰略是11月出來的，那麼接著就是國防戰略，下一個版本就等著軍事戰略，我們關注的、要看的是什麼？","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:13:38.492000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:13:39.492000+08:00","text":"就是印太戰略。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:13:41.430000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:14:17.225000+08:00","text":"去年我曾經代表我們院裡面接待了15個美國國會助理團，都是法案助理、資深的助理團，也跟他們做了很多意見交換，他們提出來了，因為他們有一個完整的國家安全戰略，所以你看這上面四個面向，四個P，就是在軍事的能力上面，他們是預做準備；在外交事務上，他是做預防措施；在他的經濟上面，他是要追求經濟；另外對於他的高科技內部安全管制法律的時候，他是要做一個保護，所以四個P。","quality":0.725},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:14:18.586000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:14:54.409000+08:00","text":"實際上包括美國的國務院，現在叫做戰爭部，還有CIA，還有他的國會，他們都有一個專門的特別小組研究中國大陸所有行政、軍事、企圖，他們因為可以橫向交流，所以有很多資料的分享，因為我們目前還沒有一個國家版的國家安全戰略，就是官方版，那麼兩個面向，第一個，對國際的國家來講，他看不到我們的官方版，就是對我核心利益的價值觀，在評估上面會跟現實面有點落差。","quality":0.658},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:14:54.969000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:15:09.054000+08:00","text":"第二個，國內的人士看不到官方版的國家安全戰略，因為我們現在只有國防戰略，你看上次的印太戰略，他們因為把AI當作工具，所以現在各部會分享資料上，速度非常快。是。","quality":0.746},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:15:10.195000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:15:19.118000+08:00","text":"最下面一個，就是他在上一個版本的印太戰略講，我們臺灣保有做兩岸交流的自我決定，這是他講的話。","quality":0.738},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:15:21.299000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:15:29.067000+08:00","text":"下一個就看國家安全戰略、國防戰略、軍事戰略、印太的戰略，我們國家目前還沒有沒有國家安全戰略。","quality":0.634},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:15:30.469000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:15:39.660000+08:00","text":"QDR（四年期國防總檢討），美國在2017年就已經停止了，現在是國防戰略，一樣四年一本，下面是他的軍事戰略。","quality":0.721},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:15:39.860000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:15:52.924000+08:00","text":"我們剛剛發表了我們的國防報告書，可是在去年10月國防報告書出來的時候，還沒有提到臺灣之盾，也就是這個東西將來要做滾動的修正，要把這個理念導進去。","quality":0.585},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:15:53.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:16:12.634000+08:00","text":"現在我還是建議從國安的角色，希望我們政府在執政黨的任內，能夠推出官方版的公開版，當然有機密的、內部的，這樣當其他國際的學者、智庫，有人來看的時候，就比較容易掌握我們的核心價值。","quality":0.671},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:16:17.829000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:17:10.635000+08:00","text":"剛剛您提到最近美國、日本以及菲律賓，他們都在強化對東海、南海整個的監控，我這個資料也是從不同的資訊裡面，把剛才您簡報裡面菲律賓部署的，還有日本部署的這些武器裝備甚至涵蓋範圍也做了一個套疊，以及日本公開版的，因為上次我在國防研究院也碰到日本來訪的學者，他也詢問這個圖怎麼做，我們說是利用GIS做校正，把圖套疊出去，你就可以看到一個大範圍的共同圖像，我們在這個作業過程中，共同圖像需要有很多工程的背景，不是光一般的行政幕僚會用的，我們大家共同努力，我也可以把這個資料跟局裡面做分享。好。","quality":0.937},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:17:12.711000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:17:26.760000+08:00","text":"這樣才產生了一個叫J-COP，joint common operating picture（COP），所以看到的範圍不僅止於臺灣防空識別區，乃至於旁邊到宮古海峽，下面到巴丹島、到南海，這個都可以顯示。","quality":0.552},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:17:29.561000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:17:37.946000+08:00","text":"各位看，這個圖是一個大的防空識別區，因為海委會主委在他的臉書上公布中共的船。","quality":0.686},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:17:41.238000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:17:57.097000+08:00","text":"這是今天早上的防空，國防部公布的，我們把這個圖套上去，再比較周遭的環境，這個時候看出來的東西就比較客觀一點，像這個圖就是大範圍涵蓋了朝鮮半島、日本東海、南海、臺海。","quality":0.973},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:17:58.557000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:18:01.058000+08:00","text":"這是最近中共的一個限航區對不對？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:18:01.058000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:18:11.160000+08:00","text":"但是他並沒有真正向ICAO申請，我們國內對這個判斷上，心裡會產生壓力，因為它的時間很長，是3月27日到5月6日，我們怎麼做呢？","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:18:11.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:18:39.034000+08:00","text":"第一個，你要把上海飛航航線，不是光臺灣的飛航情報區、不是防空識別區，是飛航情報區裡面的航線套疊上去，我這邊可以顯示給各位看，這個大區顯示出來了，這是今天早上的民航機線路，背景再把上海的航線套疊起來，你發現並沒有影響。沒有。","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:18:39.034000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:18:54.047000+08:00","text":"但是因為公開的資訊很有限，在民間有時候會誤解，可能會遭到心理上的誤判，這個時候如果有人帶風向，就變成你內心不安，或是做出一些不適當的反應。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:18:54.047000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:19:02.924000+08:00","text":"這裡面都套成四層圖到五層圖了，用這種方法論，這是臺灣的國際航線。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:19:02.924000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:19:10.067000+08:00","text":"所以我們要顯示的時候，要把上海飛航情報區的航線也抓出來，去對應的軌跡圖就可以做出結果。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:19:11.847000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:19:33.539000+08:00","text":"剛才您的報告裡面提到中共對海纜的狀況，像在海峽中間有很多的破壞，那我們就把海纜的圖經過校正，全部顯示出來，再去跟不同的海纜、跟不同的公司，有中華電信、有遠傳，向各自簽約的廠商了解到，如果有意外，修復需要多少時間，做一個參考。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:19:37.168000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:20:29.263000+08:00","text":"這裡面一個比較新的問題就是您剛剛提到的，實際上在國際情勢裡面看的，就是我講的心理戰、媒體戰、法律戰，它糾結在一起，現在是用AI對抗AI，在科技進步下，法條的規則要更新，要跟得上AI治理競賽，這裡面就是法律戰的作為、心理戰的作為、媒體戰的作為，我們在中間會發現產生很多的假訊息，還有所謂的Deepfake，最後是希望導致你對一個事情的看法誤判，下了一個錯誤的決心、做了一個錯誤的決定，然後全民買單，付出一個很錯誤的代價，這是我們要預防的，尤其是中共的心理戰上面，在這過程中間，所以它是三個面向。","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:20:29.824000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:20:39.513000+08:00","text":"現在AI技術非常進步，這個東西要大家滾動修正，將來我們還有機會再互動，這只是顯示所有跟AI相關的議題。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:20:39.513000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:21:06.510000+08:00","text":"最後，因為這個月份國防部要做漢光演習，這裡面實際上把AI導入的技術，從它的節奏性、基礎防衛流程、涵蓋的範圍、不同的層次以及能源，現在講穿了，能源就是國安，運算能力也是國安，所以我們建議，未來不管是執政、在野，我們都要團結一心，國家安全是不可以妥協的，請局長做個回應。","quality":0.701},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:21:07.190000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:21:08.791000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:21:08.791000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:21:19.134000+08:00","text":"幾個重點跟委員補充說明，第一是有關國家安全戰略部分，這部分委員先前也有多次提醒，我們內部會再提出相關的討論。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:21:19.214000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:21:26.736000+08:00","text":"我知道委員也有相關的立法提案，假如需要本局提供意見，我們很樂意來參與相關的意見交流。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:21:27.316000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:21:51.182000+08:00","text":"第二部分是有關於一些圖資的彙整，怎麼樣用一個比較全面、有系統的方式來呈現我們所面臨到的比較複雜的國家安全，包括海洋安全的一個圖像，這個部分我們跟委員辦公室也一直有在聯繫，也是我們努力的方向，所以不管今天的公開版或機密版的部分，我們都有做相關的圖示嘗試，讓大家更能夠了解基本的樣態。","quality":0.985},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:21:52.182000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:22:30.896000+08:00","text":"第三個部分是有關於中共所劃設的空域保留區，這確實沒有影響到民航的部分，因為我們第一時間就跟民航局做過確認，並沒有影響到民航的任何航班、航線，也不用再跟上海飛航情報區做任何申請，都不用，我們判斷主要可能還是有點在測試外機在相關空域活動的狀況，因為有能力在當地空域活動的外機大概還是以美國為主，所以我們後續再來注意美中在這一塊空域的相關互動情形，至於中共有沒有在相關空域進行軍事演訓，我們也會跟國防部合作，透過聯合情監偵來做密切注蒐，謝謝委員。","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-04-08T10:22:32.135000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:22:35.202000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝局長，我們大家共同努力，謝謝。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-04-08T10:22:35.202000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T10:22:36.202000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-08T10:22:35.202000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:22:36.245000+08:00","text":"謝謝陳永康委員。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-08T10:22:36.245000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T10:22:38.210000+08:00","text":"接下來請羅美玲委員。","quality":1}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}