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下一位請黃建豪召委好 謝謝主席 主席一樣我們請林部長請部長 謝謝"},{"start":15.669,"end":41.443,"text":"教委你好部長好辛苦了中午了繼續質詢部長我想一開始來討論一下其實大家注意到其實剛才談到這個數位任性的部分其實最近有個新聞前陣子有個新聞就是說這個兩岸有這個詐騙集團透過這個這個星鏈來做進行相關詐騙的工作那當然詐騙的部分這不是我們今天要討論的主題我要討論的主題是什麼討論星鏈這件事情"},{"start":42.483,"end":61.818,"text":"星鏈它在我們的就是這個Stalin它一樣在台灣的這個上空中這樣子有這樣相關的訊號能夠使用這樣子的訊號但是它沒有辦法落地嘛到目前為止沒有辦法落地所以我們就眼睜睜看著說這個樣子的一個客觀事實存在但是我們的法律或是我們的政府或是我們相關的這個技術面上沒有辦法直接的去"},{"start":62.999,"end":76.911,"text":"處理這件事情那我們看其他國家就是說其他國家包含說日本還有韓國他們過去當然有些限制當然說這個日本之前也是限制說有相關的法令不能直接來落地但日本之前也透過了這個他們的相關的集團"},{"start":78.532,"end":100.887,"text":"來授權Starlink能夠在日本做服務那韓國也是成立一個Starlink Korea LLC的公司的方式也讓Starlink在韓國也落地了那麼現在問題是說那台灣在這個部分因為包含部長剛剛一拆很多委員諮詢提到說海底電台會斷訊的問題那通訊任性會受到影響的問題那在這部分上面我們除了去"},{"start":102.928,"end":129.696,"text":"這種電纜的補救之外我們到底對於這種全球性這種星 像STARLINK這樣子這種衛星 第一個衛星這種訊號的這個的立場是什麼 現在的狀況是 那個對我們速發部或對整個政府來講我們當然是希望台灣能有越多的這個衛星通訊的那個選擇當然是越好那之前據我了解是因為那個STARLINK他堅持說他在台灣他希望是百分之百由他自己去"},{"start":131.536,"end":156.322,"text":"經營就設立那個分公司來或者是子公司100%來經營這個衛星的服務但是依照台灣的電信管理法第36條就是規定必須那個外資不能超過50%那因為這個事情就卡住了那後來就沒有談得很好那最近我們事實上是有主動的去問那個STARLINK就是說他們有沒有興趣來台灣結果他們給我們的回覆是說"},{"start":157.162,"end":184.162,"text":"因為台灣現在4G跟5G的那個普及率太高了人口覆蓋率已經超過99%了所以他認為說台灣的市場很小所以他認為說這個台灣對他們來講是low priority的市場所以他們不是很積極但是即使在這個狀況下我們還是我們資源師這邊還是會持續跟他們就是溝通一下看他們就是說有沒有哪些地方我們雙方可以共同討論共同合作的地方我想這樣部長當然喔"},{"start":185.783,"end":211.613,"text":"商業公司要不要來落地 要不要來開發 台灣這個市場是商業公司自己的佈局的問題但問題是說現在台灣就像部長提到 前面有法規問題就是我們在電信管理法的部分 有相關這樣的限制所以導致前面談得不是很順利 當然現在包含本席在內還有一些委員提單說可能在股權上放寬 或是用專案認定 或是用其他的方式包含說可能涉及到國家安全 或涉及到通訊認訊的問題用專案核可方式去做這樣子的變通"},{"start":212.353,"end":234.863,"text":"到這樣子的立場上 術衛部有沒有辦法去支持這樣的做法因為這方面我覺得委員說得非常對我們當然是希望說有更多的選擇但是我們也希望說對方要有意願要不然我們這邊主動修法 人家又不來到時候就覺得好像是我們去來部長我跟你說"},{"start":237.944,"end":249.739,"text":"其實我們一開始我給你舉日本跟韓國的例子是這樣就是說其實日本跟韓國他們當然他們的市區戶他們整個訊號的普及率也比我們差多少也是科技很進步的國家但他們也是"},{"start":250.945,"end":276.377,"text":"這樣落地將開放了 是那今天我們 包括說現在有台灣WEB然後剛剛部長也提到說你會可能跟Amazon去談相關的合作 是就我們還是希望說有更多的選擇嘛所以今天在站在有更多的選擇現象我們先不管這些商業公司他要不要進來 是應該是說在法令上我們要有這個空間 是未來有需要 假設或者他們評估或覺得台灣還是有潛在的空間潛在的市場 他們能夠來嘛那現在是因為法律上的限制 是導致他就算想來"},{"start":277.297,"end":304.943,"text":"或許他現在可能他可能此刻不願意來但我不知道可能下一季或明年有什麼狀況他們願意來等等的這種情況發生的時候或者真的萬一發生兩岸一些發生一些衝突狀況或是說我們的電纜被切斷了我們對外通訊被影響的時候是不是就有這個需求所以這部分我覺得是要大家你在世衛部我們應該要未雨綢繆去面對這件事情啦所以在法規上是不是應該去支持開放我現在問說你們會不會支持法規上要做一定程度的開放"},{"start":305.363,"end":330.856,"text":"如果他們有意願要來的話那我們這些都可以討論因為這個算再怎麼樣這也算是一個國際上的談判那因為牽涉到我們的那個國家當然我們還是可以顧那個國家主權當初電信法36條為什麼那樣設置我想一定有它背後的原因那背後的原因是不是已經消失了還是說繼續存在但是我們可以做調整這個都是可以討論的所以我們很希望就是說第一步我們先跟那個STARLINK那邊就是"},{"start":331.937,"end":357.584,"text":"你能明確的知道他們希望怎麼做再來我們在雙方再來坐下來談他們希望我們做什麼那我們希望他做什麼這個都是可以談的因為這種事情我們並不是說有什麼原因我們不喜歡他們或討厭他們不是這樣子我們就是在為了國家利益最重要的就是我們國家的利益我們必須去找到一個最好的方式"},{"start":357.864,"end":381.665,"text":"好 部長謝謝 因為像這個相關數據你們都知道包含說STARLINK MOBILE他們在這樣全球這麼多國家有覆蓋 有時候真的發生緊急狀況的時候很多地方他能夠對外通訊 甚至剛剛一凱提到連詐騙集團被斷訊的時候 他還是透過性聯繫去做詐騙當然後續他們有去做相關處置啦 我說代表說這個技術在各地已經開始應用了 所以我們希望台灣不要再落後在這個部分 好不好"},{"start":382.925,"end":402.391,"text":"接下來提到一個大家非常關心詐騙的問題今天一樣不是跟你談細節 要談一些管理的部分 責任歸屬的部分這個數位部的網路詐騙通報系統 當然你們能者多老啦感謝你們去做這樣的工作 去做相關通報讓大家能夠來通報 讓大家提早的警示但是如果我們從幾個數據上來看起來"},{"start":406.345,"end":416.993,"text":"在過去30天裡面是上代處理或重要性低的這個的這個比例大概佔17%那目前資訊上部署判斷的比例13%左右換句話說"},{"start":418.533,"end":445.003,"text":"除了確認是詐騙跟確認非詐騙以外的訊息大概有30%的比例它是不知道什麼狀況或是根本還沒處理的那這部分到底是誰的問題是數位部的問題是發布的問題還是是各機關所以目前顯示這個部分是各權責機關沒有去回應你們還是說你們在初步篩選的速度不夠還是說是平台業者去拒絕去做相關的回覆到底是什麼原因導致"},{"start":445.703,"end":473.417,"text":"我們還有衛生電還有百分之三十的這個這樣子的通報通報網上有了但通報資訊我們不知道它是什麼狀況是什麼原因造成的事實上那個委員講的兩個原因都有第一個就是說有些訊息我們的確是選擇不處理因為這個詐騙集團它用那個科技的方式用那個自動AI的方式它一直產生詐騙訊息如果每個訊息都去做人工判斷的話那會浪費我們大量的人力我們就是被它搞得那個貧民貧民奔命"},{"start":474.097,"end":488.54,"text":"所以我們對於那種就是它發布出來我們那個AI巡檢到但是根本沒有人閱讀到根本其他人也沒看到我們就擺在後面就先不處理那另外我們就是把這個分案分到各個部會的話他們也是用同樣的方式就是說"},{"start":489.321,"end":506.508,"text":"基本上我們分給他都已經是那個覺得說比較危險的他們要希望他們去處理但是有時候他們限於人力那現在那個像是內政部因為他們有警察系統他們是那個週末都有人在處理但是有些部會因為他週末沒有在上班所以他有時候處理會比較慢一點"},{"start":507.588,"end":530.996,"text":"因為之前你們在回覆審計部的時候是透過跨部會議去檢討各部會執行情形是 這個我們也有做對 那你們在檢討 但問題說我現在講說在你們這個行政分工裡面到底這個責任是訴發部要擔起來譬如說現在顯示的數據30%未知或是重要性低這個責任是你們承擔還是各部會有一個管考機制是誰來處理這個事情"},{"start":532.156,"end":558.138,"text":"是 我們現在行政院打詐辦公室這邊有一個打詐指揮中心這邊就是定期的會檢討就是各個部會他處理這些詐騙訊息的判斷的速度那一個很重要的原因就是說因為很難判斷的這些訊息公務員擔心說我萬一做了判斷有什麼責任那這個地方我們也希望說建立一個共識就是說該處理的儘快處理然後也減輕這個"},{"start":560,"end":585.772,"text":"一方面來打擊詐騙一方面減輕這些公務人員的壓力有實質上的壓力還有心理上的壓力這個我們都會想辦法去處理時間到了那最後一個問題就是我還是要有一個數據啦就是說其實這是有量化的這是量化數據要求的你們有沒有期待說多久時間或是什麼樣的能夠把這個上代處理或是資訊上部署判斷的比例能夠降下來因為現在大概佔30%嘛是你總要往下降吧有沒有這樣的一個期程目標"},{"start":589.755,"end":600.361,"text":"我們四月底會辦各部會的教育訓練讓他們更了解怎麼去判斷那個詐騙然後我們應該在六月底六月中之前應該可以把這個數字改善"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:43.234000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:43.755000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:43.975000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:45.216000+08:00","text":"主席，一樣我們請林部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:45.216000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:45.236000+08:00","text":"好，請部長，謝謝。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:51.789000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:51.969000+08:00","text":"召委你好！","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:52.349000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:52.610000+08:00","text":"部長好！","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:52.890000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:53.150000+08:00","text":"辛苦了！","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:53.330000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:56.672000+08:00","text":"中午了，繼續質詢啦！","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:56.672000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:03:58.112000+08:00","text":"部長，我想一開始來討論一下。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:03:59.233000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:04:11.199000+08:00","text":"剛剛談到數位韌性的部分，其實前陣子有一個新聞，就是兩岸有詐騙集團透過星鏈來進行相關詐騙的工作。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:04:12.120000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:04:16.682000+08:00","text":"當然詐騙的部分不是我們今天要討論的主題，我要討論的主題是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:04:16.682000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:04:17.423000+08:00","text":"要討論的是星鏈這件事情。","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:04:18.483000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:04:39.480000+08:00","text":"星鏈（Starlink）一樣在臺灣的上空中能夠使用這樣的訊號，因為它目前為止沒辦法落地，所以我們就眼睜睜看著這樣的一個客觀事實存在，但是我們的法律或是我們的政府，或是我們相關的技術面上沒有辦法直接地去處理這件事情。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:04:40.120000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:04:57.454000+08:00","text":"我們看其他國家，包含日本還有韓國，他們過去當然有些限制．像日本之前也有相關的法令規定不能直接來落地，日本之前也透過了他們相關的集團來授權Starlink能夠在日本做服務。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:04:58.095000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:03.378000+08:00","text":"韓國也是成立一個Starlink Korea LLC公司的方式，讓Starlink在韓國也落地了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:04.259000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:06.280000+08:00","text":"我們現在問的是臺灣在這個部分的情形。","quality":0.647},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:06.701000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:14.366000+08:00","text":"因為剛剛一開始很多委員質詢，都有提到海底電纜會斷訊的問題，以及通訊韌性會受到影響的問題。","quality":0.78},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:14.606000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:27.011000+08:00","text":"在這個部分，我們除了去做電纜的補救之外，我們到底對於這種全球性、像Starlink低軌衛星這種訊號的立場是什麼？","quality":0.788},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:27.011000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:27.711000+08:00","text":"現在的狀況？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:29.411000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:37.073000+08:00","text":"對數發部或者對整個政府來講，我們當然是希望臺灣能有越多衛星通訊的選擇是越好。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:38.274000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:05:53.057000+08:00","text":"之前就有了解，是因為Starlink堅持在臺灣希望是由它自己去設立分公司或者是子公司，100%來經營衛星服務。","quality":0.796},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:05:53.057000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:06:04.560000+08:00","text":"但是依照臺灣的電信管理法第三十六條規定外資不能超過50%，因為這個事情就卡住了，後來就沒有談得很好。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:06:04.940000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:06:21.188000+08:00","text":"最近我們事實上是有主動地去問Starlink有沒有興趣來臺灣，結果他們給我們的回覆是，因為臺灣現在4G跟5G的普及率太高了，人口覆蓋率已經超過99%了，所以它認為臺灣的市場很小。","quality":0.887},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:06:23.089000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:06:27.793000+08:00","text":"它認為臺灣對他們來講是low priority的市場，所以他們不是很積極。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:06:27.793000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:06:39.161000+08:00","text":"但是即使在這個狀況下，我們資源司這邊還是會持續跟他們溝通一下，看他們有沒有哪些地方是我們雙方可以共同討論、共同合作的。","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:06:39.942000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:06:47.665000+08:00","text":"部長，當然商業公司要不要來落地、要不要來開發臺灣這個市場，是商業公司自己布局的問題。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:06:47.665000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:06:55.848000+08:00","text":"但就像部長提到，臺灣因為有法規問題，就是我們在電信管理法部分有相關這樣的限制，所以導致前面談得不是很順利。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:06:56.369000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:07:07.593000+08:00","text":"那現在包含本席在內，還有一些委員提案可能在股權上放寬或是用專案認定，或是用其他的方式，包含可能涉及到國家安全或涉及到通訊韌性的問題，用專案核可的方式去做這樣的變通。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:07:08.733000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:07:12.035000+08:00","text":"這樣子的立場上，數發部有沒有辦法去支持這樣子的做法？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:07:14.136000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:07:29.162000+08:00","text":"我覺得委員說的非常對，我們當然是希望有更多的選擇，但是我們也希望對方要有意願，要不然我們這邊主動修法，人家又不來，到時候就覺得好像是我們一頭熱。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:07:30.022000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:07:47.705000+08:00","text":"部長，我跟你講，我們一開頭給你舉日本跟韓國的例子，其實日本跟韓國的4G、5G整個訊號的普及率也沒有比我們差多少，也是科技很進步的國家，但他們也是這樣落地、這樣開放了。","quality":0.89},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:07:49.646000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:07:55.669000+08:00","text":"現在有Taiwan Web，然後剛剛部長也提到你可能跟Amazon去談相關的合作，就是因為我們還是希望有更多的選擇嘛！","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:07:55.669000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:07:56.669000+08:00","text":"對，沒錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:07:56.049000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:09.455000+08:00","text":"所以今天在有更多的選擇前提下，我們先不管這些商業公司要不要進來，應該是在法令上我們要有提供這個空間，未來有需要，或是他們評估後覺得臺灣還是有潛在的空間、潛在的市場，讓他們能夠來嘛！","quality":0.904},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:09.836000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:30.421000+08:00","text":"那現在是因為法規上的限制，導致他就算想來……或許他此刻不願意來，但我不知道下一季或明年有什麼狀況讓他們願意來的時候，或者是真的萬一兩岸發生衝突狀況，或是我們的電纜被切斷了，我們對外通訊被影響的時候，是不是就有這個需求？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:31.001000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:35.042000+08:00","text":"所以我覺得數發部應該要未雨綢繆去面對這件事情啦！","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:35.042000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:36.042000+08:00","text":"是，沒錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:35.602000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:37.242000+08:00","text":"所以在法規上是不是應該去支持開放？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:37.482000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:40.923000+08:00","text":"我是要問，你們會不會支持法規上要做一定程度的開放？","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:41.363000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:44.565000+08:00","text":"如果他們有意願來，我們這些都可以討論。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:45.405000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:48.107000+08:00","text":"再怎麼樣，這個也算是一個國際上的談判。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:48.687000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:53.289000+08:00","text":"因為牽涉到我們國家，當然我們還是要顧國家主權。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:53.289000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:08:56.931000+08:00","text":"當初電信法第三十六條為什麼那樣設置，我想一定有它背後的原因。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:08:57.532000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:02.794000+08:00","text":"那背後的原因是不是已經消失了，還是繼續存在，但是我們可以做個調整，這個都是可以討論的。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:03.255000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:16.779000+08:00","text":"所以我們很希望，第一步我們先跟Starlink那邊能明確地知道他們希望怎麼做，我們雙方再坐下來談他們希望我們做什麼，以及我們希望他做什麼，這個都是可以談的。","quality":0.863},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:16.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:26.622000+08:00","text":"因為這種事情並不是有什麼原因讓我們不喜歡他們或討厭他們，不是這樣子的！","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:27.002000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:33.564000+08:00","text":"我們就是為了國家利益，最重要的就是我們國家的利益，我們必須去找到一個最好的方式。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:33.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:34.445000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝部長。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:35.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:44.213000+08:00","text":"我想相關數據你都知道，包含Starlink Mobile他們在全球這麼多國家有覆蓋，有時候真的發生緊急狀況的時候，很多地方它能夠對外通訊。","quality":0.766},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:44.213000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:51.119000+08:00","text":"甚至剛剛一開始提到，連詐騙集團被斷訊的時候，它還是透過星鏈去做詐騙，當然後續他們有去做相關處置。","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:51.639000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:09:57.625000+08:00","text":"這代表這個技術在各地已經開始應用的時候，我們希望臺灣不要在這個部分落後，好不好？是。","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:09:57.645000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:01.286000+08:00","text":"好，接下來談到一個大家非常關心詐騙的問題。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:01.286000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:05.927000+08:00","text":"今天一樣不跟你談細節，我們要談一些管理和責任歸屬的部分。","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:08.028000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:17.271000+08:00","text":"數發部的網路詐騙通報系統，當然你們能者多勞，也感謝你們去做這樣的工作，去做相關通報，讓大家能夠來通報，來讓大家提早地警示。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:17.751000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:32.493000+08:00","text":"但是如果我們從幾個數據上來看，在過去30天裡面，尚待處理或重要性低的比例大概占17%；目前資訊尚不足判斷的比例是13%左右。","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:32.973000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:44.897000+08:00","text":"換句話說，除了確認是詐騙跟確認非詐騙以外的訊息，大概還有30%的比例是不知道什麼狀況或是根本還沒處理的，這部分到底是誰的問題？","quality":0.982},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:44.897000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:49.218000+08:00","text":"是數發部的問題，還是各機關？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:49.378000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:56.661000+08:00","text":"目前顯示這個部分是各權責機關沒有去回應你們，還是你們在初步篩選的速度不夠？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:56.661000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:10:59.462000+08:00","text":"還是平台業者拒絕去做相關的回覆？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:10:59.982000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:09.407000+08:00","text":"到底是什麼原因，導致我們還有30%在通報網上有，但通報資訊我們不知道它是什麼狀況？","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:09.407000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:10.127000+08:00","text":"是什麼原因造成的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:10.247000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:12.328000+08:00","text":"事實上委員講的兩個原因都有。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:12.769000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:21.873000+08:00","text":"第一個，有些訊息我們的確是選擇不處理，因為詐騙集團用科技的方式、用自動AI的方式一直產生詐騙訊息。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:22.593000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:29.397000+08:00","text":"如果我們每個訊息都去做人工判斷的話，那會浪費我們大量的人力，我們就會被它搞得疲於奔命。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:30.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:38.210000+08:00","text":"所以我們對於那種發布出來，AI巡檢到，但是根本沒有人閱讀到，根本其他人也沒看到的，我們就擺在後面，我們就先不處理。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:38.711000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:43.959000+08:00","text":"另外，我們就是把這個分案分到各個部會的話，他們也是用同樣的方式。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:45.321000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:11:51.964000+08:00","text":"基本上我們分給他的都已經是覺得比較危險的，希望他們去處理，但是有時候他們限於人力。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:11:53.064000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:02.508000+08:00","text":"現在像內政部因為有警察系統，他們是週末都有人在處理，但是有些部會因為週末沒有在上班，所以他有時候處理會比較慢一點。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:03.588000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:10.690000+08:00","text":"因為之前你們回復審計部的時候，回應說是透過跨部會會議去檢討各部會執行情形。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:11.311000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:11.711000+08:00","text":"對，這個我們會做。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:12.191000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:26.495000+08:00","text":"對，你們在檢討，但我現在要講的是，在你們的行政分工裡面，到底這個責任是數發部要擔起來……比如現在顯示數據30%未知或重要性低，這個責任是你們承擔，還是各部會有一個管考機制？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:26.656000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:26.976000+08:00","text":"是誰來處理這個事情？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:28.857000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:40.206000+08:00","text":"現在行政院的打詐指揮中心定期都會檢討各個部會處理這些詐騙訊息判斷的速度。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:40.927000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:48.474000+08:00","text":"有一個很重要的原因，就是因為很難判斷的這些訊息，公務人員擔心說我萬一做了判斷，會有什麼責任。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:49.294000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:12:59.362000+08:00","text":"所以這個地方我們也希望建立一個共識，就是該處理的儘快處理，然後一方面來打擊詐騙，一方面也減輕這些公務人員的壓力。","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:12:59.522000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:02.943000+08:00","text":"有實質上的壓力還有心理上的壓力，這個我們都會想辦法去處理。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:03.624000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:03.744000+08:00","text":"時間到了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:03.964000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:05.965000+08:00","text":"最後一個問題，就是我還是要有一個數據啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:06.365000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:08.686000+08:00","text":"其實這是有量化的，這是量化數據要求的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:09.086000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:17.090000+08:00","text":"你們有沒有期待多久時間或是什麼樣的方式，能夠把尚待處理或是資訊尚不足判斷的比例降下來？","quality":0.829},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:17.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:18.351000+08:00","text":"因為現在大概占30%嘛！","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:19.351000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:20.072000+08:00","text":"你總要往下降吧？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:20.312000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:21.772000+08:00","text":"有沒有這樣的一個期程目標？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:21.772000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:25.755000+08:00","text":"請署長說明。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林署長俊秀","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:25.755000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:36.341000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們4月底會辦各部會的教育訓練，讓他們更了解怎麼去判斷那個詐騙，然後我們在6月中之前應該可以把這個數字改善。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:36.841000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:37.841000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:38.141000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:39.283857+08:00","text":"謝謝部長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:39.583857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:40.726714+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:41.026714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:42.741000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝黃召委。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:43.041000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:46.469571+08:00","text":"接下來邀請李坤城委員發言。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:46.769571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:49.055286+08:00","text":"李坤城、李坤城不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:49.355286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:51.926714+08:00","text":"接下來請伍麗華委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:52.226714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:55.083857+08:00","text":"伍麗華、伍麗華委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:55.383857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:13:57.955286+08:00","text":"接下來請林楚茵委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:13:58.255286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:01.112429+08:00","text":"林楚茵、林楚茵委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:01.412429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:03.983857+08:00","text":"接下來請邱志偉委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:04.283857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:07.141000+08:00","text":"邱志偉、邱志偉委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:07.441000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:09.441000+08:00","text":"接下來請鄭正鈐。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:09.741000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:12.598143+08:00","text":"鄭正鈐、鄭正鈐委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:12.898143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:14.898143+08:00","text":"接下來請葉元之。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:15.198143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:18.055286+08:00","text":"葉元之、葉元之委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:18.355286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:20.355286+08:00","text":"接下來請蘇清泉。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:20.655286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:23.512429+08:00","text":"蘇清泉、蘇清泉委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:23.812429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:25.812429+08:00","text":"接下來請洪毓祥。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:26.112429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:28.969571+08:00","text":"洪毓祥、洪毓祥委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:29.269571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:30.412429+08:00","text":"請鍾佳濱。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:30.712429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:34.426714+08:00","text":"鍾佳濱、鍾佳濱、鍾佳濱委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:34.726714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:37.298143+08:00","text":"接下來請徐欣瑩委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:37.598143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:40.455286+08:00","text":"徐欣瑩、徐欣瑩委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:40.755286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:42.183857+08:00","text":"最後請游顥。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:42.483857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:44.769571+08:00","text":"游顥、游顥委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:45.069571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:47.069571+08:00","text":"報告及詢答完畢。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:47.369571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:14:53.655286+08:00","text":"委員游顥、洪毓祥所提書面質詢，列入紀錄，並刊登公報。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-08T12:14:53.955286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-08T12:15:03.955286+08:00","text":"委員在質詢中要求提供相關書面資料或未及答復的部分，請數發部儘速以書面答復。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}