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請陳主委"},{"start":15.889,"end":38.737,"text":"五言早主委早安我想工程的安全施工安全非常的重要我們看到在三個月底就是3月31號在新北市新莊的衛福部台北醫院集中症大樓的新建工程五樓發生了一件工人失主墜落的意外"},{"start":39.597,"end":66.298,"text":"那很不幸的也因為傷重不治所以這樣子的一個事件一再的發生讓我們覺得非常的遺憾所以對於如何落實公安的一個防護避免這樣子的意外一再的發生非常的一個重要那我們也看到工程會在今天的這個業務報告裡面也有針對就是說如何落實職安也有提出了四個面向就是聘任具職安專長的委員然後"},{"start":68.893,"end":94.566,"text":"第二個是要求確實編制職安圖說集量化費用那第三就是與勞動部合作提升公共工程職安以及第四個職業安全項目納入金職獎的規定那我想先請教主委就是說這樣子的四個面向就是說在你就任之後有有比較創新的地方嗎還是說都是沿用過去的一些作為"},{"start":98.987,"end":112.101,"text":"關於職安的問題是跟勞動部都是相關主管機關那因為工程會是公共工程的職業安全也可以去集合那目前我們"},{"start":114.039,"end":127.77,"text":"工程會的金職獎部分有很嚴格的要求對職安的部分那麼會這個扣分甚至有重大職安事件那這個就金職獎還會追回那這個金職獎是牽涉到這個"},{"start":132.833,"end":160.288,"text":"這些廠商他承攬下一階段公共工程能不能加分能不能夠旅業保證減半等等所以我們是相當重視職安這件事情所以把金職獎的評分把職安納入重要考量那這一次呢我想這個徵聘具有職安專長的委員來做實地集合或者是做查核呢應該是我們是"},{"start":161.823,"end":162.126,"text":"過去有這樣做嗎?"},{"start":165.251,"end":190.92,"text":"謝委員跟委員報告我們今年除了原聘一般都是兩位外聘的委員那如果這兩位委員就相關的類別如果沒有職安專長我們都增加一位那另外跟委員報告因為實際上我想相關規定都有但是工程會這邊就藉由如果你原來有不良履歷的廠商或是我這一次查核是高風險的工程我們就加重查核那對職安世界也加重扣點"},{"start":191.96,"end":207.559,"text":"那另外就是有關危險場所我們去的時候都會看廠商就是你有沒有在請前確實告知所以我想規定都有就是落實問題那工程會這邊會會同勞眾部加重就是有關查核的部分謝謝委員"},{"start":208.226,"end":213.029,"text":"跟委員報告我們在工程查的時候增加那個職安專長委員這是新創的這是今年才開始推動的今年什麼時候開始實施"},{"start":227.099,"end":244.41,"text":"今年年初的時候年初就開始了今年是1月份才開始那委員檢報第4點那個職安的項目納入金職獎規定那是去年我們7月政治在金職獎的辦法裡面去做修正的那就是一個就是派專家去協助職安專家去協助"},{"start":245.37,"end":268.898,"text":"其實我們還是比較用積極性的態度去來去教這些工地的這些廠商那子彈項目這個其實也是算是一種肯定讓他如果他能夠做好那他會有一些加分但是如果他有一些過去的一些重大子彈他也會被予以扣分就讓他量化比較客觀化去處理我們當然希望工程會有更積極的一個作為然後確實來落實我跟委員報告"},{"start":270.218,"end":285.435,"text":"整個工作環境是否容易造成這個一些意外當然要投入成本他的相關的保護措施這些都需要成本所以工程會將來呢在比較重大的這些公共建設的"},{"start":286.876,"end":303.77,"text":"審查過程會建立主辦機關就這個職安環境所必須的費用來調高納入預算讓業者承攬這個工程之後他才有這個預算可以把整個工作環境職業安全的防護做得比較好"},{"start":305.132,"end":325.169,"text":"那這個環境呢跟會直接影響職安是不是會發生的比例啊所以我們願意將來會要求這個機關呢在做預算的準備的時候這部分要納入考量是好那當然在這方面如果我們的目標就是希望讓這個意外能夠降低甚至朝"},{"start":326.049,"end":352.646,"text":"這個零意外的一個目標所以對於任何積極性的做法我們都是給予肯定的那我們也來看一個統計表就是在去年度跟前年度的這個重大職災的死亡人數在去年度是有稍微降低了一些那當然我們就剛如同我剛所說的我們希望盡量朝向零意外的一個目標因為畢竟每一個"},{"start":353.286,"end":371.143,"text":"每一條人命都是非常的珍貴啦我們也不希望這樣的意外發生所以除了剛剛這些就是我們剛剛說的這四個面向之外就主委您的就是想法裡面還有沒有更好的做法或更積極的作為"},{"start":373.015,"end":401.614,"text":"這個我們工程會陸續都派我們的這個相關人員到比較關於這個工作環境比較完善的國家比方說歐洲、德國跟日本都陸續派員出去參考他們的制度跟方法那這些我們會逐步的納入相關的我們的這些工作指引包括我剛才所提的預算希望機關來寬列這部分那才能夠有效降低這個職安發生的比例啦"},{"start":402.194,"end":410.644,"text":"完全是一個工作的環境還有一些平常廠商是否具備這方面的重視這個都要逐步的來推動"},{"start":411.69,"end":438.537,"text":"是那就你們今天的這個郵報告的這個書面資料裡面那本席有看到你有提到就是說要擴大履歷制度納入工程參與人員就是為了提升施工品質與安全要進一步建立公共工程參與人員的履歷我想請教一下就是說你要如何去落實這個把這個履歷制度延伸到工程人員層面"},{"start":443.224,"end":469.254,"text":"這個會不會有點實際跟我們現在有兩個履歷系統一個是施工廠商我們已經建置一個就是廠商的履歷計分制度一個履歷系統第二個是針對你參與相關公共工程的人員包括建築師那專業工程的品管工程師或是相關的工地主任我們目前也建置了這個相關人員的一個履歷支應系統以上報告"},{"start":469.693,"end":488.898,"text":"是 可是這樣子一個系統的一個建制就是說對於工程人員的一個履歷的建制如果說他們有相關的比如說職災或者是懲戒紀錄那我們要怎樣去限制他參與未來工程的這個就是競標之類 有可能嗎"},{"start":492.823,"end":513.44,"text":"這個主要是公司啦 履歷這個公司 那麼廠商呢他在選商的時候 機關在選商的時候 比方說評選那評選他可以根據這個履歷來打分數嘛那至於個人 個人他如果在有這些慈安的事故他是否違反相關祭司法 那是可以懲處的是"},{"start":515.782,"end":539.544,"text":"那當然就是說我們對於職安的安全我們就是希望能夠盡量朝向這個零意外的一個方向那也希望就是說在任何可以達到目標的一個政策我們都予以肯定那當然也要去考慮到就是實務跟我們的政策的理想性是不是可以就是符合的一個地方這樣子好謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:08.914000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:09.055000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:09.536000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:11.440000+08:00","text":"請主席邀請工程會陳主委。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:12.482000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:12.602000+08:00","text":"請陳主委。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:19.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:19.109000+08:00","text":"委員早。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:19.829000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:20.410000+08:00","text":"主委早安。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:22.610000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:44.819000+08:00","text":"工程的施工安全非常重要，在上個月底，也就是3月31號，新北市新莊衛福部臺北醫院急重症大樓新建工程五樓發生了工人失足墜落意外，很不幸的傷者傷重不治。","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:46+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:49.443000+08:00","text":"這類事件一再發生，讓我們覺得非常遺憾！","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:45:50.664000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:45:56.788000+08:00","text":"因此，如何落實工安防護，避免意外一再發生非常重要。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:46:08.098000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:46:24.459000+08:00","text":"第一，聘任具職安專長委員；第二，要求確實編製職安圖說及量化費用；第三，與勞動部合作提升公共工程職安；第四，職業安全項目納入金質獎規定。","quality":0.915},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:46:26.320000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:46:35.225000+08:00","text":"請教主委，這四個面向在你就任之後有比較創新的地方嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:46:35.565000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:46:37.566000+08:00","text":"抑或都是沿用過去的作為？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:46:41.987000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:46:54.621000+08:00","text":"關於職安問題，本會與勞動部均為相關主管機關，因工程會負責公共工程的職業安全，可前往稽核。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:46:57.039000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:47:10.670000+08:00","text":"就工程會金質獎部分來說，對職安有很嚴格的要求，不僅會扣分，有重大職安事件甚至還會追回金質獎。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:47:10.690000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:47:30.941000+08:00","text":"金質獎牽涉到這些廠商承攬下一階段公共工程時能不能加分，履約保證能否減半等等，由於我們相當重視職安，故將職安列為金質獎評分的重要考量。","quality":0.71},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:47:31.722000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:47:45.106000+08:00","text":"這次增聘具有職安專長的委員做實地稽核或查核，應該是我們過去有這樣做……","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"林處長耀淦","start":"2026-04-13T09:47:48.251000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:47:48.611000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"林處長耀淦","start":"2026-04-13T09:47:48.611000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:47:58.775000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們一般是兩位外聘委員，今年這兩位委員之相關類別若沒有職安專長的話，我們會再增加一位。","quality":0.822},{"speaker":"林處長耀淦","start":"2026-04-13T09:47:59.535000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:23.591000+08:00","text":"另外跟委員報告，實際上相關規定都有，但如果是原來有不良履歷的廠商或該次查核屬於高風險工程者，我們會加重查核，對職安事件也會加重扣點；至於危險場所，我們去的時候會看廠商是否有在勤前確實告知。","quality":0.851},{"speaker":"林處長耀淦","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:24.171000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:30.559000+08:00","text":"所以規定都有，問題在於落實，工程會會會同勞動部，加重有關查核的部分，謝謝委員。","quality":0.853},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:30.559000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:31.559000+08:00","text":"照剛剛的回復來看，均是沿用過去的既有作為，是不是？","quality":0},{"speaker":"李副主任委員怡德","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:31.226000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:34.668000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，在工程查核時增加職安專長委員是新創的，這是今年才開始推動的。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:34.668000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:35.668000+08:00","text":"新創的？","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:35.369000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:36.009000+08:00","text":"今年的什麼時候開始實施？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"李副主任委員怡德","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:50.099000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:52.180000+08:00","text":"今年年初就開始了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:52.340000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:48:54.522000+08:00","text":"就是今年、115年1月份才開始？","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"李副主任委員怡德","start":"2026-04-13T09:48:54.862000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:49:02.487000+08:00","text":"委員簡報的第四點，將職安項目納入金質獎規定，是去年7月我們正式在金質獎辦法中修正的。","quality":0.737},{"speaker":"李副主任委員怡德","start":"2026-04-13T09:49:05.008000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:49:25.656000+08:00","text":"派職安專家去協助的部分，我們是採比較積極性的態度去教這些工地廠商，至於職安項目，這其實也算是一種肯定，如果他能夠做好就會加分，但過去如果有重大職安問題也會被扣分，使其可以量化、比較客觀化去處理。","quality":0.787},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:49:26.556000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:49:31.177000+08:00","text":"我們當然希望工程會有更積極的作為，並確實來落實。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:49:31.297000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:49:43.870000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，對於工作環境是否容易造成意外，這部分當然要投入成本，因為相關的保護措施都需要成本。","quality":0.837},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:49:44.350000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:50:20.842000+08:00","text":"所以工程會將來在比較重大的公共建設審查過程中，會建議主辦機關調高職安環境所必須之費用，將其納入預算，業者承攬這個工程之後，才有預算可以把整個工作環境的職業安全防護做得比較好，這個環境會直接影響職安事故是不是會發生的比例，所以我們將來會要求機關在做預算準備的時候，這個部分要納入。","quality":0.916},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:50:20.842000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-13T09:50:22.984000+08:00","text":"在編製的時候要納入考量，好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:50:22.984000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:50:34.953000+08:00","text":"當然在這個方面，我們的目標就是希望讓意外能夠降低，甚至朝零意外的目標，所以對於任何積極性的做法，我們都是給予肯定的。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:50:35.914000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:50:47.301000+08:00","text":"另外，我們也來看一個統計表，就是去年度及前年度的重大職災死亡人數，在去年度是有稍微降低了一些。","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:50:48.181000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:51:14.143000+08:00","text":"當然就如同我剛剛所說的，我們希望儘量朝向零意外的目標，因為畢竟每一條人命都非常珍貴，我們也不希望這樣的意外發生，所以除了我們剛剛說的這四個面向之外，就主委的想法裡面，還有沒有更好的做法或更積極的作為？","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:51:16.015000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:51:54.690000+08:00","text":"我們工程會都陸續派相關人員到工作環境比較完善的國家，比方歐洲、德國以及日本，參考他們的制度以及方法，這些我們會逐步納入我們的相關工作指引，包括我剛才所提的預算，希望機關寬列這個部分，才能夠有效降低職安事故發生的比例，完全是對工作環境，還有平常廠商是否具備這個方面的重視，這個都要逐步來推動。是。","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:51:56.050000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:52:21.517000+08:00","text":"在你們今天業務報告的書面資料裡面，本席有看到你有提到「擴大履歷制度，納入工程參與人員：為提升施工品質與安全，進一步建立『公共工程參與人員履歷』」，我想請教一下，你要如何去落實把這個履歷制度延伸到工程人員層面？","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:52:26.224000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:52:27.485000+08:00","text":"這個會不會實務與理想有點落差？","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"林處長耀淦：跟委員報告，我們現在有兩個履歷系統","start":"2026-04-13T09:52:31.646000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:52:51.474000+08:00","text":"一個是施工廠商的履歷系統，我們已經建置一個廠商履約計分制度的履歷系統；第二個是針對參與相關公共工程的人員，包括建築師、專任工程人員、品管工程師或是相關的工地主任，我們目前也建置了這個相關人員的履歷資訊系統。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林處長耀淦：跟委員報告，我們現在有兩個履歷系統","start":"2026-04-13T09:52:51.474000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:52:52.234000+08:00","text":"以上報告。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:52:52.693000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:53:11.898000+08:00","text":"是，可是這樣一個工程人員履歷系統的建置，如果他們有相關的，比如職災或者是懲戒紀錄，我們要怎樣去限制他參與未來工程的競標之類，有可能嗎？","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:53:15.823000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:53:36.300000+08:00","text":"主要是公司，機關在選商的時候，比方評選，他可以根據這個履歷來打分數；至於個人，他如果有職安事故，看他是否違反相關技師法，那是可以懲處的。好。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:53:39.543000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:54:00.922000+08:00","text":"當然對於職安，我們希望能夠儘量朝向零意外的方向，對於任何可以達到這樣目標的政策，我們也都予以肯定，當然也要去考慮到實務與我們政策的理想性是不是可以符合。","quality":0.901},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-13T09:54:02.524000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-13T09:54:02.544000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員素月","start":"2026-04-13T09:54:03.044000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-13T09:54:04.044000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-13T09:54:04.344000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-13T09:54:09.772571+08:00","text":"感謝陳素月委員，接下來邀請魯明哲委員發言。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}