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有請黃秘書長"},{"start":19.686,"end":46.739,"text":"民主黨您好我想其實監察院對於一般民眾來說就當作是憲法的一個守護者所以對於監察院也有很高的一個期待那身為當然國家最高的監察機關其實在過往有很多讓我們覺得非常敬畏的事情包括說1957年的時候監察院敢於挑戰威權的體制彈劾當時的行政院長余鴻鈞"},{"start":47.959,"end":63.94,"text":"那在2000年巴掌溪事件的時候呢監察院也火速調查彈劾當時的行政院秘書長李毅陽而且追究內政部跟消防署高層職責那在2015年的時候面對當時的台南市長賴清德"},{"start":65.422,"end":81.232,"text":"以政治理由拒禁議會手開地方這個自治史上的惡例的時候監察院也不為政治的壓力依法彈劾那所以在這個部分呢事實上是符合人民的一個期待覺得這也就是監察院該做的事情"},{"start":82.012,"end":103.047,"text":"那剛剛呢我想也有委員提到啊就是針對我們可以看一下就是監察院的這個國家人權委員會在4月9號的時候有公開呼籲政府要暫緩放寬外籍幫庸制度認為會衝擊到勞動權益跟性別平等結果勞動部連甩都不甩照樣推動喔"},{"start":103.547,"end":122.282,"text":"那我想剛剛呢我想人權委員會的秘書長好像也有回答說其實他們沒有調查跟糾正的權利他們只能建議那依照這個部分的話那請問一下那監察院為什麼不來做這件事情呢"},{"start":128.939,"end":156.638,"text":"我們監察院的職責尤其是監察委員對於公務人員的彈劾糾舉都是因為他有違法或是失職那這個部分還在政策的層面政策的層面的話就不屬於違法或失職的範疇所以目前來講我們的還沒有進入到相關的這種所謂的糾舉的一個程序監察的一個程序是事實但是"},{"start":157.378,"end":173.754,"text":"但是這個部分所有的人權委員他本身也身兼監察委員倘若委員也有發現有任何違法或失職之處委員當然也可以發動但是這只是制度上面會主動調查嗎"},{"start":174.795,"end":200.318,"text":"這我沒辦法就個案來跟您回應因為這畢竟是每個委員他的調查的職權我想既然人權委員會這邊會提出這樣子的一個建議那一定就是認為這個應該外傭行子應該不要這麼貿然的就上路當然道中部會在4月13日還是一樣照樣實施嘛那針對這個部分我是覺得與其尋求就立法院這邊的一個合作我覺得監察院應該要負起責任來"},{"start":202.199,"end":225.814,"text":"就針對如果有這樣子的違法失職的相關的事件的話監察院應該就要主動的來提起調查其實我一開始的時候就有跟大會報告是說真的監察院跟立法院本來就是合作的就是您的質詢權在最後當然進入到我們這邊也會都收到收錄到相關然後會進入到所謂的調查權的這個部分是"},{"start":226.795,"end":248.432,"text":"那針對這個部分當然這個案子剛剛已經提了那另外再一個案子就是說針對經貿辦的這個副總談判代表嚴惠心不信離實那因為傳出背後都有涉及到這個長期的職場霸凌那已經也有人到監察院去告發了那請問這個監察委員開始調查了嗎在海巡調查了解這個案子"},{"start":253.244,"end":281.098,"text":"這個案子已經有委員在函詢調查之中了解調查之中那目前的進度呢我們請我們業務處的處長來說明目前這個案子報告委員目前這個案子我們現在是函行政院那但是目前行政院的復函還沒有回來所以我們會回來你們函行政院多久了大概目前為止大概一個月左右"},{"start":282.031,"end":287.209,"text":"多久?不到一個月那請問行政院一般都會多久含富呢?"},{"start":288.157,"end":314.759,"text":"原則上談覆的期限在法規上面是兩個月所以這個案子總共要拖三個月才有可能啟動調查嗎因為我看有的案子其實非常快速因為你們監委就會主動的分案調查然後也非常快速的在執行那這個案子其實國人都非常關心因為對於這麼優秀的一個副總談判的代表"},{"start":315.359,"end":342.875,"text":"居然是遭到霸凌而離世那當然這個部分的話大家都會非常的關心這樣的一個進度那如果照這樣含複來含複去的話這可能一拖又是半年以上了委員在行政機關跟監察院之間它這個含複來含複去的過程有它的有時候也有它的必要性譬如說霸凌案的調查現在我看到行政院也有在啟動所以它的這整個的調查它那邊也要完備啊它也要完成之後當然我覺得當然調查"},{"start":343.615,"end":364.234,"text":"一定要有必要性但是有我覺得那個效率啦還有速度其實要不要就只是按照法規因為兩個月所以我就是兩個月我覺得這個部分的話應該當然這件事情我們當然一定要這個調查清楚那不管是怎樣就是至少我們要這個就是針對我們這個顏惠心副董"},{"start":364.974,"end":386.423,"text":"談判的部分能夠給他還他一個公道那當然這個部分我覺得監察院的話是不是可以這個更積極一點來去調查只要行政機關有一個法定的釐清事實我們這邊當然就可以再進入下一個監察院能夠好好的來去調查這個是不是有相關霸凌的事件那另外就是呢高雄市先前有發生台灣雕這個"},{"start":389.445,"end":411.195,"text":"檢驗數據有物質十倍的重大烏龍害慘了漁民然後另外呢最近又爆發了173人中毒的春捲事件然後先前的抽驗也全部都合格那也證明了地方的這個衛生治理跟風險通報系統完全的失靈請問一下秘書長這兩岸我們監察院有沒有自動立案調查這兩岸有沒有自動立案調查"},{"start":413.436,"end":432.245,"text":"因為他都已經行政為師導致重大損害也代乎職守致民眾的權益受損依照監察院的立案派查原則其實應該都有符合那請問一下你們有立案派查嗎方文文是不是我請衛環委員會的施主蜜來跟您回應請說"},{"start":434.466,"end":441.729,"text":"報告委員有關這兩個案子目前還沒有委員要啟動調查或是排查的狀態但是我們在這麼重大的一個實案事件但是這三年來我們的實案的案件我們大概有像蘇丹紅或者是超食品或者是草莓雞食品這些的案件我們總共有16還有保齡茶"},{"start":459.935,"end":487.897,"text":"對 我知道 我現在是針對我們有16案的調查案因為是高雄市政府嘛所以你們就不敢立案調查嗎這是在於委員的職權喔對 因為其實這個案子實案的問題其實現在相當大家對非常重視的那這個部分卻沒有自動立案調查所以說針對這個監察院喔對地方這個政府的失職的反應是不是有過於遲鈍或者是就是選擇性的包庇呢"},{"start":489.954,"end":494.396,"text":"我們會把您的建議帶回監察院另外我想大家都非常關心的就是這一次監察委員的這個不管是原來的秘書長李俊逸秘書長他用公務車去接送寵物每一種"},{"start":511.044,"end":521.451,"text":"那另外呢還有就是有監察委員用公務車去送機接送子女這些都引起社會對於監察院的監察委員的一個應該是要更為"},{"start":526.474,"end":554.032,"text":"高標準的去要求自己那所以大家對於這個監察院確實在你們的新聞稿裡面也特別提到說對監察院的形象也有這個重創但是呢我們看到你們的內部的調查報告呢看到的就只有就是道歉跟觸其注意一個請他在院會道歉一個請他觸其注意針對全國的標準來看一般民眾的標準來看這樣子的懲處是不是太輕了"},{"start":554.472,"end":569.052,"text":"我剛才有先回答大會的質詢也就是說會進入到下一個階段就進入到所謂的彈劾要在下一個階段我們的制度就是這個道歉接著就彈劾"},{"start":569.993,"end":591.378,"text":"那彈劾的部分我們查過所有全台灣我們針對公務人員的彈劾案裡面跟公務車有相關的就公務車濫用等等有相關的案件有進入到彈劾的一定他必須還是具有司法訴追也就是他有貪賭的行為在裡面啊或是他有背信等的行為在裡面"},{"start":593.318,"end":601.083,"text":"市法已經結案了嘛所以我們沒有具足的法律的理由沒有具足的法律理由來進入到南河但是這完全不符合一般民眾對於監察院的這種期待因為你看喔平常我們都要求全國的公務人員要守紀律要守連結"},{"start":612.871,"end":625.584,"text":"包括之前的32塊的電鍋結果呢送給拾荒老婦但是最後還是被判刑了但是呢對於監察委員的自己出問題的時候卻是這樣的輕輕放下那是不是有那種關關相護的感覺那這樣的社會會接受嗎大家能夠服眾嗎那針對這個部分難道監察委員自己本身都沒有這樣的一個自覺嗎"},{"start":635.874,"end":645.238,"text":"紀律委員會也要依據法制嘛那法制上面我們全國公務人員的標準就是有一個有嗎 這樣的全國公務人員的標準有一致嗎我們的彈劾的標準其實我想這個部分其實全國的公務人員都在看"},{"start":653.922,"end":676.433,"text":"千萬不能就是說監察委員對於全國的公務人員要求的這麼的嚴格然後只要有一點這樣子包括剛剛講的這32塊的電鍋就必須要這個有一些司法的一個追訴也被判刑結果監察委員自己遇到這樣子的事情的時候卻是輕輕放下這個完全不符合大家對於監察院的一個期待"},{"start":676.713,"end":701.607,"text":"您如果說的是那個刑事宿醉的話檢察官的部分我們當然是尊重嘛因為他就是不告發這個實在是讓大家覺得我們的機關就是依照我們過去的處理的相關原則就是進入到公務人員只要是公務車濫用這件事件進入到彈劾的都是有刑事宿醉的問題而且剛剛我想溫小林召委也有提到就是李俊一秘書長"},{"start":703.028,"end":730.426,"text":"這個部分在你們的這個報告裡面完全沒有提到那你們的理由是說因為他已經辭職了因為他已經辭職了他也不是在我們紀律委員會監察不過說真的剛才翁委員已經說他要提出相關的等於是我們會把這個您的相關的建議帶回去我們針對我們社會上的一些重大的案件的話你們其實是會自己自己自己"},{"start":730.906,"end":756.396,"text":"主動的這個分案調查那以這件事情的話難道我們的秘書長當然我想您是絕對不會這樣做啦但是呢前秘書長做這樣的事情之後他只要辭職就沒事的話那以後就是告訴全國的公務人員趕快我們犯了這個這樣子的一個問題之後如果有這樣的司法的上面的問題的時候我就是趕快辭職就沒事啦因為辭職之後就不用調查啦而且還有人檢舉前面秘書長"},{"start":761.445,"end":781.854,"text":"我們尊重委員的調查 那當然這個我們立法委員這邊也有提出建議 我們會把您的建議帶回去對啊 我想 因為其實我想最後啦 最後就是要跟MU長這邊還有監察院的同仁講一下就是因為現在為什麼大家對監察院的這個信任感越來越低就是因為監察院拿不出相稱的作為"},{"start":782.854,"end":803.672,"text":"包括该查不查 该硬不硬 该自律不自律流失的不只是形象而是整个监察制度的社会信任希望秘书长能够把我们今天的委员的一些质询的问题能够带回去好好的来去针对监察院的一个相关的问题大家好好的来去检讨谢谢"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:28:39.977000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:28:42.100000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，請監察院黃秘書長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:28:42.220000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:28:42.280000+08:00","text":"有請黃秘書長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:28:49.126000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:28:49.126000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:28:49.126000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:28:51.187000+08:00","text":"秘書長你好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:28:51.187000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:29:15.739000+08:00","text":"監察院對於一般民眾來說是憲法的守護者，所以對於監察院有很高的期待，身為國家最高的監察機關，其實過往有很多讓我們敬畏的事情，包括1957年的時候，監察院敢於挑戰威權的體制，彈劾當時的行政院長俞鴻鈞。","quality":0.989},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:29:17.079000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:29:28.474000+08:00","text":"在2000年八掌溪事件的時候，監察院也火速調查，彈劾當時的行政院秘書長李逸洋，而且追究內政部和消防署高層之責。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:29:28.595000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:29:42.847000+08:00","text":"在2015年的時候，面對當時的臺南市長賴清德以政治理由拒進議會首開地方自治史上惡例的時候，監察院也不畏政治的壓力，依法彈劾。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:29:43.808000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:29:50.212000+08:00","text":"所以事實上在這個部分是符合人民的期待，覺得這也就是監察院該做的事情。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:29:51.532000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:30:12.027000+08:00","text":"剛剛也有委員提到，針對監察院國家人權委員會在4月9日公開呼籲政府要暫緩放寬外籍幫傭制度，認為會衝擊到勞動權益和性別平等，結果勞動部連甩都不甩，照樣推動。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:30:13.968000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:30:24.797000+08:00","text":"剛剛人權委員會的執行秘書好像也有回答說，其實他們沒有調查跟糾正的權力，他們只能建議。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:30:25.037000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:30:31.062000+08:00","text":"依照這個部分，請問監察院為什麼不來做這件事情？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:30:39.080000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:31:22.314000+08:00","text":"監察院的職責，尤其是監察委員對於公務人員的彈劾、糾舉，都是因為他有違法或失職，這個部分還在政策的層面，就不屬於違法或失職的範疇，所以目前來講，還沒有進入相關糾彈的程序、監察的程序是事實，但是這個部分，所有的人權委員本身也身兼監察委員，倘若委員有發現任何違法或失職之處，委員當然也可以發動，但是這只是制度上面。","quality":0.986},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:31:22.594000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:31:22.754000+08:00","text":"會主動調查嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:31:23.795000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:31:29+08:00","text":"我沒辦法就個案來跟您回應，因為這畢竟是每個委員的調查職權。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:31:29+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:31:58.044000+08:00","text":"我想既然人權委員會提出這個建議，一定就是認為這個外傭新制不要貿然上路，當然，勞動部在4月13日還是照樣實施，針對這個部分，我覺得與其尋求立法院的合作，我覺得監察院應該要負起責任來，針對這樣違法失職的相關事件，監察院應該主動提起調查。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:31:59.164000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:32:14.714000+08:00","text":"我一開始就有跟大會報告，監察院和立法院本來就是合作的，您的質詢權在最後當然會收錄到我們這邊，然後會進入調查權的部分。","quality":0.926},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:32:16.396000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:32:36.671000+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，這個案子剛剛也已經提了，另外這個案子，針對經貿辦的副總談判代表顏慧欣不幸離世，傳出背後涉及長期的職場霸凌，也已經有人到監察院告發，請問監察委員開始調查了嗎？","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:32:42.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:32:47.407000+08:00","text":"這個案子已經有委員函詢了解、調查之中。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:32:48.287000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:32:49.108000+08:00","text":"目前的進度呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:32:50.868000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:32:54.850000+08:00","text":"我們請業務處的處長來說明這個案子。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃處長奕元","start":"2026-04-15T11:32:57.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:04.335000+08:00","text":"報告委員，目前這個案子是函行政院，目前行政院的覆函還沒有回來，回來之後，我們會繼續處理。","quality":0.769},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:04.715000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:06.596000+08:00","text":"你們函行政院多久了？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃處長奕元","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:07.036000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:11.152000+08:00","text":"大概1個月左右。多久？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃處長奕元","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:11.573000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:12.035000+08:00","text":"不到1個月。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:13.741000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:16.189000+08:00","text":"請問行政院一般都會多久函覆呢？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"王副秘書長增華","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:17.157000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:22.521000+08:00","text":"原則上函覆的期限在法規上面是2個月。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:23.782000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:29.247000+08:00","text":"等於這個案子總共要拖3個月才有可能啟動調查嗎？不是。","quality":0.826},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:29.247000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:33:54.785000+08:00","text":"因為我看有的案子其實非常快速，因為你們監委會主動分案調查，也非常快速執行，這個案子其實國人都非常關心，這麼一位優秀的副總談判代表居然受到霸凌而離世，當然這個部分大家都會非常關心進度，如果照函覆來、函覆去的話，可能一拖又是半年以上。","quality":0.934},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:33:55.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:34:10.934000+08:00","text":"在行政機關和監察院之間函覆來、函覆去的過程有時候有其必要性，例如霸凌案的調查，我看到行政院也有在啟動，整個調查來講，它那邊也要完備、也要完整。","quality":0.844},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:34:11.835000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:34:36.675000+08:00","text":"當然，調查一定要有必要性，但我覺得效率還有速度，不要只是礙於法規規定2個月，就2個月後……這件事情當然要調查清楚，不管怎樣，至少要針對顏慧欣副總談判代表的部分，能夠還她一個公道。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:34:37.756000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:34:41.717000+08:00","text":"這個部分監察院是不是可以更積極一點去調查？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:34:41.857000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:34:47.820000+08:00","text":"只要行政機關有法定的釐清事實，我們這邊當然就可以進入下一個階段。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:34:47.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:34:51.421000+08:00","text":"希望監察院能夠好好的調查相關霸凌的事件。","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:34:52.262000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:35:01.086000+08:00","text":"另外，高雄市先前發生臺灣鯛檢驗數據誤植10倍的重大烏龍，害慘了漁民。","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:35:01.886000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:35:18.314000+08:00","text":"另外最近又爆發了173人中毒的春捲事件，先前的抽驗也全部都合格，也證明了地方衛生治理和風險通報系統完全失靈，請問一下秘書長，這兩案監察院有沒有自動立案調查？","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:35:22.436000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:35:37.503000+08:00","text":"因為行政違失導致重大損害，也怠忽職守致民眾權益受損，依照監察院的立案派查原則，其實應該都有符合，請問一下，你們有立案調查嗎？","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:35:38.164000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:35:41.245000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我請衛環委員會的施主秘來說明。請說。","quality":0.65},{"speaker":"施主任秘書貞仰","start":"2026-04-15T11:35:43.466000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:35:44.907000+08:00","text":"報告委員，有關這兩個案子，目前還沒有委員要啟動調查或派查的狀態，但是我們在……","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:35:45.027000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:35:45.547000+08:00","text":"這麼重大的食安事件。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"施主任秘書貞仰","start":"2026-04-15T11:35:46.187000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:36:11.297000+08:00","text":"但是在這三年來，我們食安的案件，像是蘇丹紅、超加工食品或草莓即食品這些的案件，還有寶林茶室案，我們總共有16案的調查案。","quality":0.731},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:36:11.417000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:36:15.540000+08:00","text":"因為這是高雄市政府，所以你們就不敢立案調查嗎？","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"施主任秘書貞仰","start":"2026-04-15T11:36:15.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:36:17.462000+08:00","text":"這是委員的職權。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:36:20.024000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:36:36.877000+08:00","text":"食安的問題大家非常重視，這個卻沒有立案調查，所以監察院針對地方政府失職的反應有過於遲鈍或選擇性包庇呢？","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:36:38.954000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:36:40.595000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們會把你的建議帶回監察院。","quality":0.706},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:36:40.595000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:36:41.595000+08:00","text":"謝謝秘書長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:36:40.615000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:37:43.012000+08:00","text":"另外，我想大家都很關心不管是原來的李俊俋秘書長用公務車去接送寵物美容，另外還有監察委員用公務車去送機、接送子女，這些都引起社會對於監察院監察委員應該要更高標準的去要求自己，所以大家對於監察院……確實在你們的新聞稿裡面也特別提到重創監察院的形象，但是我們看到你們內部的調查報告就只有道歉和促其注意，一個請他在院會道歉，一個請他促其注意，針對全國的標準來看、一般民眾的標準來看，這樣子的懲處是不是太輕？","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:37:43.472000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:37:58.032000+08:00","text":"我剛有先回答大會的質詢，也就是會進入到下一個階段，就是進入到所謂的彈劾了，我們的制度就是道歉，接著就彈劾。","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:37:59.373000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:38:26.301000+08:00","text":"彈劾的部分，我們查過所有全臺灣針對公務人員的彈劾案裡面跟公務車的濫用等等相關的案件，有進入到彈劾的必須具有司法訴追，就是他有貪瀆的行為或背信等等的行為在裡面，司法已經結案了嘛，所以我們沒有具足的法律理由來進入到彈劾。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:38:26.661000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:38:52.862000+08:00","text":"但這個完全不符合一般民眾對於監察院的期待，平常我們都要求全國的公務人員要守紀律、廉潔，包括之前32塊的電鍋，送給拾荒老婦，但是最後還是被判刑了，但是監察委員自己出問題的時候，卻是這樣的輕輕放下，是不是有官官相護的感覺？","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:38:52.882000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:38:53.483000+08:00","text":"這樣社會會接受嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:38:53.483000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:38:54.143000+08:00","text":"大家能夠服眾嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:38:54.204000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:38:54.584000+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，難道監察委員自己本身都沒有這樣的自覺嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:04.874000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:39:11.777000+08:00","text":"紀律委員會也要依據法制、相關的法律，法制上面，我們全國公務人員的標準就是有一個……有嗎？","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:11.837000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:39:12.538000+08:00","text":"全國公務人員的標準有一致嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:12.578000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:39:12.698000+08:00","text":"彈劾的標準。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:12.878000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:39:45.413000+08:00","text":"我想這個部分其實全國的公務人員都在看，監察委員對於全國的公務人員要求得這麼嚴格，只要有一點包括剛才講的32塊的電鍋就必須要有司法的追訴、也被判刑，結果監察委員自己遇到這樣的事情時，卻輕輕放下，完全不符和大家對於監察院的期待。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:45.873000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:39:50.476000+08:00","text":"你如果說的是刑事訴追的話，檢察官的部分我們當然是尊重。","quality":0.88},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:51.536000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:39:54.118000+08:00","text":"當然，因為他就是我們告發的，這實在是讓大家覺得……","quality":0.762},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:39:54.558000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:40:05.845000+08:00","text":"我們的機關就是依照我們過去處理的相關原則，就是公務車濫用這件事進入到彈劾的都是有刑事訴追。","quality":0.953},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:40:06.685000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:40:17.572000+08:00","text":"而且剛剛翁曉玲召委也有提到，李俊俋秘書長這個部分在你們的報告裡面完全沒有提到，你們的理由是說因為他已經辭職了。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:40:18.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:40:22.295000+08:00","text":"他不是監察委員。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:40:23.416000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:40:33.162000+08:00","text":"剛才翁委員已經說要提出相關的陳情，我們會把相關的建議帶回去。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:40:33.942000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:41:05.196000+08:00","text":"我看你們有很多針對社會上一些重大案件會自己主動分案調查，以這件事情，難道你們的秘書長……當然，我想你是絕對不會這樣做，但是前秘書長做這樣的事情之後，他只要辭職就沒事的話，那以後就是告訴全國公務人員，犯了這樣的問題之後，如果有司法上面的問題的時候，趕快辭職就沒事了，因為辭職之後就不用調查了，而且還要有人檢舉。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:41:10.445000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:41:17.208000+08:00","text":"我們尊重委員的調查，立法委員這邊也有提出建議，我們會把你的建議帶回去。","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:41:19.089000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:41:28.213000+08:00","text":"最後，要跟秘書長和監察院的同仁講一下，現在為什麼大家對監察院的信任感越來越低？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-04-15T11:41:28.593000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T11:41:51.311000+08:00","text":"就是因為監察院拿不出相稱的作為，包括該查不查、該硬不硬、該自律不自律，流失的不只是形象，而是整個監察制度的社會信任，希望秘書長能夠把我們今天委員質詢的問題帶回去，好好的針對監察院的相關問題，大家好好去檢討，謝謝。","quality":0.708},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:41:51.811000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:41:52.953857+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:41:53.253857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:41:56.111000+08:00","text":"謝謝許宇甄委員的發言。","quality":0.1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:41:56.411000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:42:17.553857+08:00","text":"剛剛我在質詢的時候，其實相當程度是諷刺監察院對於違法失職的案件竟然是被動等待有檢舉陳情案進來的時候才會進行調查，依照監察法的規定，你們自己本身就可以立案啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:42:17.853857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:18.711000+08:00","text":"就可以自己進行調查，如果要講檢舉的話，也不是書面檢舉，口頭檢舉也成立，所以我剛剛在質詢臺上其實已經提出了我的口頭檢舉，希望秘書長可以把本席剛剛所提出來的意見帶回去給監察委員們，對於李俊俋的案子，監察院本身應該要主動去調查，連監察委員也都受到了相當程度的處分，雖然我想社會大眾覺得這樣的處分也違反一般社會的國民情感，但是對於李俊俋秘書長竟然完全沒有處理，也沒有進行任何調查、作出任何處分，我認為社會大眾是無法接受這樣的情形，所以請秘書長回去要轉告監察委員們。","quality":0.005},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:19.011000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:20.725286+08:00","text":"我們會帶回去。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:21.025286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:27.025286+08:00","text":"接下來請洪孟楷委員、洪孟楷委員，洪孟楷委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:27.325286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:32.182429+08:00","text":"鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員，鄭正鈐委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:32.482429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:37.339571+08:00","text":"蔡易餘委員、蔡易餘委員，蔡易餘委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:37.639571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:42.496714+08:00","text":"蘇清泉委員、蘇清泉委員，蘇清泉委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:42.796714+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:47.653857+08:00","text":"楊瓊瓔委員、楊瓊瓔委員，楊瓊瓔委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:47.953857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:43:53.668143+08:00","text":"所有登記發言的委員都已經發言完畢，詢答結束。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:43:53.968143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:44:04.825286+08:00","text":"委員質詢時要求提供的相關資料或以書面答復者，請相關機關儘速送交個別委員以及本會。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T11:44:05.125286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T11:44:13.696714+08:00","text":"委員蔡其昌所提書面質詢，列入紀錄，刊登公報，並請相關機關以書面答復。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}