{"error":false,"id":["168590"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":168590,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168590","日期":"2026-04-15","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-26-6","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":6,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-04-15T12:48:53+08:00","結束時間":"2026-04-15T13:04:50+08:00","影片長度":"00:15:57","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3ec77822e2e6eae37e3a9a4c3c2061e98ea785098ebfecd577f1ea19c72f00142f230d750febacb15ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"王正旭","委員發言時間":"12:48:53 - 13:04:50","會議時間":"2026-04-15T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議（事由：邀請衛生福利部部長、行政院經貿談判辦公室、經濟部、農業部、教育部就「美國貿易代表署發布《2026年各國貿易評估報告》（2026NTE）提及技術性貿易壁壘或食品安全檢驗與動植物防疫檢疫SPS）壁壘之豬肉、牛肉與牛肉產品、β促進劑的最大殘留容許量等各項食農相關產品及技術之要求，我國所承諾之措施、移除產品禁令或取消輸入口岸檢疫程序等，並特就其中開放切片馬鈴薯帶芽（或腐爛或發黴）仍能整批進口與其敦促撤銷基改食品進校園，對我國食品安全造成之衝擊與因應作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n\n邀請衛生福利部、農業部、行政院消費者保護處就「寵物用藥新制上路在即，犬貓及非經濟動物急重症醫療銜接、藥品流向管理、飼主取得可近性與消費權益保障之整體配套」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n\n【專題報告綜合詢答】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":10.915343750000002,"end":16.39971875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":16.51784375,"end":18.44159375,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":19.85909375,"end":19.926593750000002,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":20.23034375,"end":20.83784375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":21.27659375,"end":21.512843750000002,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":21.816593750000003,"end":23.79096875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":23.85846875,"end":38.15159375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":29.629718750000002,"end":29.882843750000003,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":32.41409375,"end":32.430968750000005,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":38.455343750000004,"end":39.36659375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":39.87284375,"end":47.078468750000006,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":47.24721875,"end":50.23409375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":50.38596875,"end":63.210968750000006,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":63.70034375,"end":111.86159375000001,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":111.99659375,"end":112.51971875000001,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":112.68846875000001,"end":135.80721875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":136.46534375000002,"end":157.98096875000002,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":158.85846875000001,"end":182.68596875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":183.63096875000002,"end":258.53909375,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":253.71284375000002,"end":253.99971875000003,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":254.92784375000002,"end":255.40034375000002,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":258.58971875000003,"end":288.35721875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":288.98159375,"end":315.69471875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":315.74534375,"end":355.82346875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":356.11034375,"end":395.74971875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":395.74971875,"end":445.98659375000005,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":443.75909375000003,"end":444.11346875000004,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":445.98659375000005,"end":468.63284375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":468.68346875000003,"end":470.72534375000004,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":471.60284375000003,"end":490.87409375000004,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":491.21159375,"end":508.87971875000005,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":509.53784375000004,"end":534.51284375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":534.81659375,"end":535.1203437500001,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":535.9640937500001,"end":566.9297187500001,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":556.9734687499999,"end":557.42909375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":566.28846875,"end":585.3740937499999,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":585.9309687500001,"end":594.3684687500001,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"石部長崇良","start":594.30096875,"end":614.53409375,"speaker_score":0.827},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":594.6047187500001,"end":596.25846875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_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謝謝主席我們還是再請一下部長跟江署長好 有請施部長 江署長好 汪岩好部長 請看 署長好今天有兩三個問題來請教一下部長跟署長第一個就是公開健康風險評估報告第二個就是強化食安前端的預防還有後端的這個稽查的量能"},{"start":38.883,"end":55.883,"text":"最後一個小題目就是診所受護醫師的加保權益請教一下部長其實這個題目大家都已經請教過部長好幾次不過我們還是很相信對民眾有一個很透明的資訊是非常非常的重要"},{"start":56.323,"end":84.244,"text":"那以這次簽署這個台美對等貿易協定ART為例我們知道國人會非常非常的在意相關的一些議題尤其是在於美豬美牛這個進口管理上早上部長也有非常確認除了書面報告裡面也口頭再度強調堅持四大不變這四大不變就是包括這個敏感品項禁令不變"},{"start":85.104,"end":108.055,"text":"還有原產地標示不變校園採購國產不變還有就是食安管理制度機制不變這四大不變之下國人還是會擔心的有關於國人健康的項目就是這次在ART裡面會開放絞肉跟部分的內臟進口以及來自於標準的這個改裁"},{"start":108.855,"end":135.357,"text":"Codex的國際新標準這個我們不是臨床醫師嗎對這個國人的健康真的非常非常的重視不過有沒有未來健康真的不是一個人說了算他一定要有好的科學證據這個是一個很重要社會溝通的基礎那我們看2019年其實那時候也有發生類似的狀況那就有公告一個非常透過"},{"start":136.518,"end":152.011,"text":"成功大學李教授的一個風險健康評估這樣的一份內容讓民眾就非常的安心知道在這種推估之下對國人健康造成的影響那早上也有蠻多委員針對這個議題請教的部長那請問一下"},{"start":154.953,"end":182.21,"text":"我們目前針對在新的標準之下新的這些狀況之下這個健康風險評估的報告有沒有機會很快透過確定以後就能夠公開給大家做確認那同時呢什麼時候會提交給這個食安執意會來做最後確認跟討論這部分可以有一個比較好的承諾方式嗎"},{"start":183.68,"end":213.54,"text":"好 跟委員說明就是說我們大概在所有訂定這些標準的時候第一個會參考國際標準第二個會進行這個健康風險評估所以這兩個我們都會一併考慮的所以在這一次可能會調整的一個是屬於BSE風險的部分也就是所謂狂牛症風險的部分那我們按照國際的標準重新認定所謂的BSE風險來自於典型的BSE"},{"start":214.08,"end":231.806,"text":"那麼排除因為老化之後的這個BSE所以這個是根據國際標準來重新做這個定義那第二個呢是殘留標準的部分那那個都做過這個健康風險評估那麼參考了這個考慮了這個國人的飲食習慣跟國際標準還有相關鄰國的這個標準之後那麼來訂定的所以這個"},{"start":241.129,"end":258.509,"text":"健康風險評估我們都會公告在食藥署的有一個食品風險評估的專區裡面來給大家參考目前歷年都有所以我們再review一下有沒有漏放的"},{"start":258.629,"end":274.994,"text":"好如果是有把這個報告能夠讓民眾很安心的話我相信這個對民眾來講他們在選用這些產品的時候呢就更有所依據是好那第二部分就是強化死案前端的預防跟後端稽查的量能的部分"},{"start":276.955,"end":291.842,"text":"最近八卦在二月四月份的時候剛好是清明節嘛就有一個市場在高雄有個正義市場春泉的食物撞毒案那在去年的十月份呢也有台中"},{"start":292.822,"end":315.136,"text":"風雲烤肉 烤鴨店一些狀況出現讓民眾來講有這麼多的外食或者是大家在利用節慶的時候準備食物過程當中好像會有一些擔心這種擔心如果層出不窮的話我相信對民眾死的安全真的是要有很大很大要再加強的地方"},{"start":315.876,"end":332.197,"text":"那所以加強檢驗一直是我們這個十三五環裡面很重要的一環那現在基本上就承諾要加強這個邊境檢驗跟後市場稽查的管理自己都不會改變那我們看到這些狀況出現就會想要那個人力到底是不是"},{"start":332.857,"end":354.96,"text":"除了這些制度以外人力上面也沒有問題在去年其實就在爭取了更多的人力行政院也針對於邊境輸入查案的部分也增加了人力從增加了24位變成到105人可是我們好像目前還沒有辦法補到"},{"start":356.842,"end":374.602,"text":"這麼完整的人力好像看起來只有到85人在這個部分做工作那貨市場機場的部分只要數目前有79位的這些貨市場機場的人員好像比原來80人還要少7位很顯然"},{"start":375.823,"end":395.156,"text":"這是這麼重的工作對這些同仁來講可能有一些在招募人才的部分受到很大的限制所以這部分不知道部長怎麼來幫助署長或者是署長有哪些問題可以讓大家知道一下這個人力的招募目前的狀況如何"},{"start":395.956,"end":406.21,"text":"跟委員說明,當然行政院支持我們多增加人力,但是這一些特別是邊境查驗全年無休,隨時機場有進來我們就可能需要這樣。"},{"start":412.919,"end":440.844,"text":"那後市場的稽查也有相關的風險所以雖然我們有容額但是不見得照得滿所以我們現在也在研議呢應該在薪資條件的部分也應該要予以提升啦那比較能夠螺翅到這些人力那長期以來雖然我們有薪資的調整可是在專業的部分還有這些所謂危險的佳績的部分我們來爭取看看"},{"start":443.125,"end":470.083,"text":"讓這個人才的螺絲上能夠改善我們看各個地方政府的石藥裝稽查員也真的都相對很辛苦這麼有限的人力等於一個人要平均要負責1200家的業者的這些業務真的很需要各位長官其實給他們加油也同時能夠有更好的機制來幫忙他們來做一些處理"},{"start":471.664,"end":497.365,"text":"那這部分其實我們也知道除了這方面的努力以外那針對於這些食品的安全的部分也非常鼓勵傳統的商家來參加餐飲衛生管理的分級2010年食藥署就開始做這個分級的這些評鑑或者是相關的評核看起來百分比很高都能夠達到優惠量可是我們知道他們達到這個優惠量大部分都是連鎖餐飲業者"},{"start":498.846,"end":518.915,"text":"那針對於跟國人生活飲食相關很密切的就是傳統市場跟夜市攤販不曉得這個參與平和的這個百分比高不高那如果這個部分有所缺失或者是參與率不高的時候那目前有沒有好的誘因或者是什麼機制來請我們"},{"start":523.678,"end":549.6,"text":"針對傳統市場或夜市攤販來參與這樣的這個管理分級的這些平和有沒有更好的做法這部分部長或者是署長有沒有好的意見可以給我們做參考確實我們現在這個是自願制所以來申請的都是比較具規模的那對這種夜市攤商這個是屬於比較小型規模的"},{"start":550.481,"end":565.807,"text":"那麼怎麼樣來輔導我們來跟地方政府討論看看怎麼樣對這些比較小規模但是又是數量很龐大的這些攤商業者來看看怎麼"},{"start":566.747,"end":584.947,"text":"其實有一些地方他們跟那個夜市自治會他們會互相的合作那也提供一些標章可是這是各個地方政府自己處理啦都沒有全國統一的一個相關的標章可以來協助這方面的處置模式所以很希望如果能夠"},{"start":585.968,"end":602.693,"text":"把這個部分做好的話我相信對於整體的食安尤其我們看到最近的幾個案件應該會有更好的幫助跟委員說我們這個要分級因為過去可能要得到的這一些要通過這樣的平和的話標準會比較高"},{"start":604.574,"end":631.185,"text":"但是對這種小型的可能我們要另外一套的那個平和標準比較容易輔導我們再來跟地方政府一起討論再問一下那我們知道這個地方稽查人力真的非常不夠所以針對這個公務體系人力不堪負荷之下那有沒有其他的方式來協助整體國安實案的這些改善那我最近就是有"},{"start":632.145,"end":649.553,"text":"是不是能夠參考歐美建立第三方驗證的制度包括可以授權食品技師或者是工衛師在事前或者是在同時平時定期就能夠進行衛生管理製程管控制跟倉儲流程的把關"},{"start":650.774,"end":665.531,"text":"經過這一套制度之下我們又可以把相關的人力能夠引到這個食安的這些需求上面來所以如果能夠真的去做好食安的這個簽證制度讓這樣的這個制度運作的話相信可以"},{"start":666.152,"end":680.871,"text":"同時擴充這個政府的監管量能又能夠強化前端預防機制輔導業者來自主管理那這個其實之前部長或者是深雙政委他們也都了解到那也"},{"start":681.952,"end":707.697,"text":"表示說不反對有這個建立這個食安的簽證制度可能有助於這個強化事前的預防可是就是怎麼去釐清責任這個部分如何來加強因為這個部分大家會擔心如果前後這個責任無法釐清的話造成這個事前不同意後面的問題就會很麻煩所以不過這個公衛"},{"start":708.397,"end":735.118,"text":"市國公會他們也認為認同啦這個如果專業人員這個制度建立以後呢就是有權應該當要有責嘛就能夠把這些責任理清的非常的清楚那大方向大家有共識那有沒有可能麻煩我們主管機關惡務部這邊可以來繼續或者是開始來思考演繹推動這樣的死案簽證制度的推行或推廣"},{"start":736.58,"end":761.403,"text":"跟委員說確實過去我們是針對一定規模的會定有三級評管的方式內部它需要有相關證照人員包含食品祭祀等等那第二級的話就會有第三方的認證制度一定規模的那第三個才是最終的主管機關的這個稽查大概過去是這三個那但是就如同剛剛委員提到的"},{"start":762.904,"end":782.444,"text":"這個限於這個量能的關係所以可能沒有辦法破解到全面所以如果要全面的話也許就是要導入這個現有的這些人力包含公衛司、食品機制來進行這個食安簽證的制度不過責任的釐清還有如何的"},{"start":783.738,"end":802.663,"text":"這些負責簽證的人類的資格條件訓練等等這個我們來研究一下那也許是可以來補我們現在這個稽查人力不足讓他更往前坐在這個預防的那一端這樣"},{"start":803.183,"end":821.245,"text":"好啦,如果這個開始推動這個原意的話那可不可以兩個月給我們一個書面報告方便嗎?好,可以好,謝謝那最後就是診所受孤醫師加保全員這個部分其實我想部長也清楚那我們上個禮拜也在勞動部那邊"},{"start":822.407,"end":838.804,"text":"請紅部長還有勞保局的局長針對於如果是診所裡面的受僱醫師是單一的診所受僱或者是多診所受僱的話如何能夠讓他們的勞保的權益可以順利的來得到好的保障"},{"start":839.344,"end":863.197,"text":"那這部分 拉伯局局長是說需要跟這個衛護部這邊來討論相關如何能夠讓這樣的這些在改善的過程裡面有好的一個統計基礎所以是不是可以麻煩部長也能夠認同我們針對這些診所受護醫師在加保的權益上可以有更全面的一些處理模式"},{"start":863.838,"end":888.94,"text":"跟委員說明因為在診所的醫師他會有兩種型態一種他是用合夥關係共同成立所以這個就可能不是家保的問題那另外一個才是真的受雇所以現在我們當然職登上一定是只有一個負責醫師其他就是職登醫師但是他們的關係是在我們現在系統裡面看不出來"},{"start":889.6,"end":914.293,"text":"我們不知道他是受雇關係還是合夥關係所以這個很可能還要透過那個稅捐機關一起勾結如果他在申報的時候他是申報是執行業務所得那他就是合夥關係的認定那可能就沒有這個加保問題那但是如果他是以薪資所得來申報那他就很可能就是雇傭關係"},{"start":915.233,"end":940.727,"text":"那這個就要依照勞基法的這個規定來給他加保所以我們必須要前置的這些數據那可能我們還要不是只有勞動部的這個協助可能還需要這個稅捐機關的協助去勾結他們的這個關係那這部分部長可以幫忙我們再請財政部也提供給我們"},{"start":941.767,"end":952.073,"text":"相關在這些診所醫師 但是這個因為這個還有各自的問題 我們來跟器官討論一下好 謝謝 王中信委員的質詢"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:03.922000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:04.763000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:05.683000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:09.546000+08:00","text":"我們還是再請一下部長跟姜署長。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:09.546000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:11.227000+08:00","text":"好，有請石部長、姜署長。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:11.227000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:14.890000+08:00","text":"王委員好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:14.890000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:16.191000+08:00","text":"部長辛苦了！","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:17.752000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:17.932000+08:00","text":"署長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:19.053000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:22.796000+08:00","text":"今天有兩、三個問題來請教一下部長跟署長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:22.796000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:30.702000+08:00","text":"第一個就是公開「健康風險評估報告」，第二個就是強化食安前端的預防，還有後端稽查的量能。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:31.883000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:37.990000+08:00","text":"最後有一個小題目，就是針對診所受僱醫師的加保權益來請教一下部長。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:37.990000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:49:48.863000+08:00","text":"其實這個題目大家都已經請教過部長好幾次了，不過我們還是很相信，對民眾有一個很透明的資訊是非常重要的。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:49:49.463000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:50:04.554000+08:00","text":"以這次簽署臺美對等貿易協定（ART）為例，我們知道國人會非常在意相關的一些議題，尤其是在美豬、美牛進口管理上。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:50:05.615000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:50:26.148000+08:00","text":"早上部長也有非常確認，在書面報告裡面和口頭也再度強調堅持四大不變，這四大不變就是包括敏感品項禁令不變、原產地標示不變、校園採購國產不變，以及食安管理機制不變。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:50:26.148000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:50:43.356000+08:00","text":"在這四大不變之下，國人還是會擔心有關於國人健康的項目，就是這次在ART裡面會開放絞肉跟部分的內臟進口，以及萊劑標準改採Codex國際新標準。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:50:46.219000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:50:50.863000+08:00","text":"我們都是臨床醫師，對國人的健康非常重視。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:50:50.863000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:51:00.351000+08:00","text":"不過，有沒有危害健康，真的不是一個人說了算，它一定要有好的科學證據，這個是一個很重要社會溝通的基礎。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:51:00.451000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:51:21.768000+08:00","text":"我們看2019年其實也有發生類似的狀況，那時就有公告一份成功大學李教授的風險健康評估報告，其中的內容讓民眾非常安心知道，在這種推估之下，對國人健康所造成的影響。","quality":0.901},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:51:22.068000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:51:24.631000+08:00","text":"早上也有滿多委員針對這個議題請教部長。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:51:24.831000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:51:42.622000+08:00","text":"請問一下，我們目前在新的標準和狀況之下，健康風險評估的報告有沒有機會很快透過確定以後，就能夠公開給大家做確認？","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:51:43.282000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:51:50.607000+08:00","text":"同時，什麼時候會提交給食安諮議會來做最後確認跟討論？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:51:50.607000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:51:55.210000+08:00","text":"這部分可以有一個比較好的承諾方式嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:51:57.040000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:52:10.149000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，我們在所有訂定這些標準的時候，第一個會參考國際標準，第二個會進行健康風險評估，所以這兩個我們都會一併考慮的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:52:11.150000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:52:18.795000+08:00","text":"在這一次可能會調整的，一個是屬於BSE風險的部分，也就是所謂狂牛症風險的部分。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:52:19.395000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:52:36.303000+08:00","text":"我們也按照國際的標準重新認定所謂的BSE風險來自於典型的BSE，排除因為老化之後的BSE，所以這個是根據國際標準來重新做定義。","quality":0.983},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:52:36.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:52:44.666000+08:00","text":"第二個是殘留標準的部分，那個都做過健康風險評估，考慮了國人的飲食習慣跟國際標準，還有相關鄰國的標準之後來訂定的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:52:54.129000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:53:11.489000+08:00","text":"健康風險評估我們都會公告在食藥署有一個食品風險評估的專區裡面來給大家參考，歷年的資料都有，所以我們再review一下有沒有漏放的。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:53:11.629000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:53:22.992000+08:00","text":"好，如果是有這份報告能夠讓民眾很安心的話，我相信對民眾來講，他們在選用這些產品的時候，就更有所依據。是。好。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:53:23.492000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:53:39.419000+08:00","text":"第二部分就是強化食安前端的預防跟後端稽查量能的部分，最近在4月份的時候，剛好是清明節，在高雄正義市場有一個春捲的食物中毒案。","quality":0.877},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:53:40.220000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:53:50.905000+08:00","text":"另外，在去年10月份，臺中豐原烤鴨店也有一些狀況出現。","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:53:50.905000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:53:59.811000+08:00","text":"對民眾來講，尤其這麼多的外食，或者是大家在利用節慶的時候準備食物的過程當中，就會有一些擔心。","quality":0.881},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:54:00.891000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:54:08.116000+08:00","text":"這種擔心如果層出不窮的話，我相信對民眾食的安全真的是有很需要再加強的地方。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:54:09.577000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:54:20.451000+08:00","text":"加強檢驗一直是我們食安五環裡面很重要的一環，現在基本上就承諾要加強邊境檢驗，以及後市場稽查的管理制度不會改變。","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:54:20.571000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:54:29.581000+08:00","text":"我們看到這些狀況出現，就會想到除了這些制度以外，人力上面到底有沒有問題？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:54:29.581000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:54:50.443000+08:00","text":"在去年其實就爭取了更多的人力，行政院也針對邊境輸入查驗的部分增加了人力，一共增加了24位，達到105人，可是我們好像目前還沒有辦法補到這麼完整的人力。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:54:51.163000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:54:54.347000+08:00","text":"現在看起來，只有85人在這個部分工作。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:54:55.188000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:06.821000+08:00","text":"後市場稽查的部分，食藥署目前有79位後市場稽查人員，好像比原來86人還要少7位。","quality":0.719},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:07.462000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:17.789000+08:00","text":"很顯然這麼重的工作，對這些同仁來講，可能在招募人才的部分受到很大的限制。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:18.449000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:28.136000+08:00","text":"所以這部分不知道部長怎麼來幫助署長，或者是署長有哪些問題可以讓大家知道一下人力招募目前的狀況如何？好。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:28.956000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:34.664000+08:00","text":"我跟委員說明，當然行政院支持我們多增加人力啦！","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:35.425000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:39.210000+08:00","text":"但是特別是邊境查驗是全年無休，機場隨時有人入境，我們就可能需要這樣。","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:46.139000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:48.259000+08:00","text":"後市場的稽查也有相關的風險。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:48.259000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:55:52.680000+08:00","text":"所以雖然我們有容額，但是不見得招得滿。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:55:52.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:56:04.062000+08:00","text":"我們現在也在研議在薪資條件的部分也應該要予以提升，比較能夠羅致到這些人力。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:56:05.002000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:56:18.567000+08:00","text":"長期以來，雖然我們有薪資的調整，可是在專業的部分，還有所謂危險加給的部分，我們來爭取看看，讓人才的羅致上能夠改善。OK。","quality":0.887},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:56:19.808000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:56:27.053000+08:00","text":"事實上，我們看各個地方政府的食藥妝稽查員也真的都很辛苦啦！","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:56:28.414000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:56:43.063000+08:00","text":"這麼有限的人力，等於一個人平均要負責1,200家業者的業務，真的很需要各位長官持續給他們加油，也同時能夠有更好的機制幫忙他們來做一些處理。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:56:45.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:56:57.575000+08:00","text":"其實我們也知道，除了這方面的努力以外，針對於這些食品安全的部分，也非常鼓勵傳統的商家來參加餐飲衛生管理的分級。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:56:57.575000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:06.742000+08:00","text":"2010年食藥署就開始做分級的評鑑或者是相關的評核，看起來百分比很高，都能夠達到優或良。","quality":0.946},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:07.823000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:10.345000+08:00","text":"可是我們知道能達到優或良的大部分都是連鎖餐飲業者。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:12.266000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:23.772000+08:00","text":"針對於跟國人生活飲食相關很密切的，就是傳統市場跟夜市攤販，不曉得參與評核的百分比高不高？","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:24.432000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:40.821000+08:00","text":"如果這個部分有所缺失，或者是參與率不高的時候，目前有沒有好的誘因，或者是什麼機制來請這些傳統市場或夜市攤販來參與這樣的管理分級評核？","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:42.043000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:43.344000+08:00","text":"有沒有更好的做法？","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:44.064000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:49.849000+08:00","text":"針對這部分，部長或者是署長有沒有好的意見，可以給我們做參考？確實！","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:49.849000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:57:57.516000+08:00","text":"我們現在這個是自願制，所以來申請的都是比較具規模的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:57:59.718000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:58:18.807000+08:00","text":"對於夜市攤商這種屬於比較小規模，但是又是數量很龐大的攤商業者，我們來跟地方政府討論看看怎麼輔導。是。","quality":0.696},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:58:19.747000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:58:36.005000+08:00","text":"其實有一些地方他們跟夜市自治會會互相合作，也提供一些標章，可是這是各個地方政府自己處理，都沒有全國統一的一個相關標章可以來協助這方面的處置模式。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:58:37.647000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:58:46.851000+08:00","text":"如果能夠把這個部分做好的話，我相信對於整體的食安，尤其我們看到最近的幾個案件，應該會有更好的幫助。對。","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:58:48.231000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:58:55.673000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們這個要分級，因為過去可能要通過這樣的評核，標準會比較高。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:58:57.574000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:59:04.457000+08:00","text":"但是對這種小型的，可能我們要有另外一套的評核標準，會比較容易輔導。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T12:59:04.457000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:59:07.418000+08:00","text":"這個我們再來跟地方政府大家一起討論。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:59:07.418000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:59:07.958000+08:00","text":"好，再麻煩一下。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:59:08.598000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:59:21.264000+08:00","text":"我們知道地方稽查人力真的非常不夠，所以在公務體系人力不堪負荷之下，有沒有其他的方式來協助整體食安的改善？","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:59:25.145000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:59:42.553000+08:00","text":"是不是能夠參考歐美建立第三方驗證的制度，包括可以授權食品技師或者是公衛師在事前或者是在平時定期就能夠進行衛生管理、製程控制跟倉儲流程的把關？","quality":0.985},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:59:43.774000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T12:59:51.042000+08:00","text":"經過這一套制度之下，我們又可以把相關的人力引到食安的需求上面來。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T12:59:51.042000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:00:06.301000+08:00","text":"所以如果能夠真的去做好食安簽證制度，讓這樣的制度運作的話，相信可以同時擴充政府的監管量能，又能夠強化前端的預防機制，輔導業者自主管理。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:00:07.182000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:00:25.634000+08:00","text":"其實之前部長或者陳時中政委也都了解，也表示不反對建立食安簽證制度，可能有助於強化事前的預防，可是如何加強怎麼去釐清責任這部分？","quality":0.881},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:00:27.554000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:00:38.396000+08:00","text":"因為這部分大家會擔心，如果前後責任無法釐清的話，造成事權不統一，後面的問題就會很麻煩。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:00:39.637000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:01:08.118000+08:00","text":"不過他們也認同，如果建立專業人員制度以後就有權，當然應該要有責，就能夠把這些責任釐清得非常清楚，大方向大家有共識，有沒有可能麻煩主管機關衛福部可以繼續或者是開始思考研議食安簽證制度的推行或推廣？","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:01:09.580000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:01:31.440000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，確實過去我們是針對一定規模訂有三級品管的方式，內部它需要有相關證照人員，包含食品技師等等；第二級的話，就會有第三方的認證制度，一定規模的；第三個才是最終的主管機關稽查，大概過去是這三個。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:01:31.580000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:02:15.643000+08:00","text":"但是就如同剛剛委員提到的，限於量能的關係，所以可能沒有辦法擴及到全面，如果要全面的話，也許就要導入現有的這些人力，包含公衛師、食品技師來進行食安簽證制度，不過關於責任的釐清，還有負責簽證的人的資格、條件、訓練等等，這部分我們來研究一下，也許可以來補我們現在稽查人力的不足，讓它更往前做在預防的那一端。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:02:16.523000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:02:23.692000+08:00","text":"如果有開始推動研議的話，可不可以2個月給我們一個書面報告，方便嗎？可以。","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:02:23.873000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:02:25.495000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:02:25.635000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:02:28.939000+08:00","text":"最後就是診所受僱醫師加保權益這個部分。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:02:29.179000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:02:51.784000+08:00","text":"其實，我想部長也清楚，我們上個禮拜也在勞動部那邊，請洪部長跟勞保局局長，針對如果是診所裡面的受僱醫師是單一診所受僱或是多診所受僱，如何能夠讓他們的勞保權益可以順利得到好的保障？","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:02:52.624000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:03:16.177000+08:00","text":"這部分勞保局局長說需要跟衛福部討論如何能夠在改善的過程有一個好的統計基礎，所以是不是可以麻煩部長也能夠認同針對診所受僱醫師在加保權益上，可以有更全面的一些處理模式？","quality":0.924},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:03:16.838000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:03:30.149000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，因為在診所的醫師會有兩種型態，一種是用合夥關係共同成立，所以這個就可能不是加保的問題……了解。","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:03:30.269000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:03:31.530000+08:00","text":"另外一個才是真正受僱。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:03:32.631000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:03:50.764000+08:00","text":"現在當然執登上一定只有一個負責醫師，其他就是執登醫師，但是他們的關係在我們現在的系統裡面看不出來，我們不知道它是受僱關係還是合夥關係，所以這個很可能還要透過稅捐機關一起勾稽。","quality":0.927},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:03:51.525000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:13.676000+08:00","text":"如果申報的時候，他是申報執行業務所得，那就是合夥關係的認定，可能就沒有加保問題；但是如果他是以薪資所得申報，很可能就是僱傭關係，這個就要依照勞基法規定加保。是。","quality":0.972},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:15.297000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:17.098000+08:00","text":"所以我們必須要有前置的這些數據……","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:17.278000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:29.024000+08:00","text":"對，可能我們還不只是要勞動部的協助，可能還需要稅捐機關的協助，去勾稽他們的關係。","quality":0.861},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:29.164000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:30.185000+08:00","text":"是，這部分部長可以幫忙處理？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:31.125000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:43.352000+08:00","text":"可以，我們再請財政部也提供給我們相關這些診所的醫師，但是因為這個還有個資的問題，我們來跟機關討論一下。","quality":0.851},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:43.352000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:44.352000+08:00","text":"再麻煩你，謝謝。謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:44.252000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:45.073000+08:00","text":"謝謝王正旭委員的質詢。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:45.573000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:50.715857+08:00","text":"待會洪孟楷委員詢答完畢後，休息20分鐘用餐。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-15T13:04:51.015857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-15T13:04:53.873000+08:00","text":"現在請賴士葆委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}