{"error":false,"id":["168668"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":168668,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168668","日期":"2026-04-22","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-26-7","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":7,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-04-22T09:29:38+08:00","結束時間":"2026-04-22T09:41:25+08:00","影片長度":"00:11:47","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5b5880b40c5769f1bff54be497456ae3f38d440c98c629e729d978cd518bf594a7c63afbaf1f10e85ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林月琴","委員發言時間":"09:29:38 - 09:41:25","會議時間":"2026-04-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請環境部部長、國家科學及技術委員會、交通部、經濟部、內政部、農業部、衛生福利部、國家發展委員會就「我國氣候變遷調適現況檢討與全球調適目標接軌之推動情形」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、審查中華民國115年度中央政府總預算案關於環境部主管預算案。(公務及非營業特種基金預算案)\n三、審查中華民國115年度中央政府總預算案直轄市及縣市政府一般性補助款環境部主管部分預算。\n四、審查環境部函送財團法人環境資源研究發展基金會等4家財團法人115年度預算書案。\n\n【預算案僅詢答，115年4月30日下午5時截止收案】\n【專題報告及討論事項綜合詢答】\n\n【4月22日及23日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":5.127218750000001,"end":7.87784375,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":7.87784375,"end":8.92409375,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":11.067218750000002,"end":11.792843750000003,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":11.87721875,"end":13.007843750000003,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":13.649093750000002,"end":16.29846875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":16.53471875,"end":16.922843750000002,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":17.36159375,"end":56.039093750000006,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":35.282843750000005,"end":35.63721875,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":56.039093750000006,"end":84.47346875000001,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":83.30909375,"end":83.98409375,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":84.47346875000001,"end":99.12096875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":99.12096875,"end":99.17159375,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":99.17159375,"end":100.85909375,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":100.33596875,"end":115.94534375,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":115.94534375,"end":125.61471875000001,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":125.93534375,"end":135.28409375,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":135.67221875,"end":136.49909375000001,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":136.65096875,"end":140.76846875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":141.59534375,"end":146.62409375000001,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":146.99534375000002,"end":163.68471875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":164.42721875,"end":169.00034375,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長玲儀","start":169.25346875000002,"end":191.59596875000003,"speaker_score":0.974},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":192.06846875000002,"end":198.09284375000001,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":198.44721875000002,"end":199.15596875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":199.64534375000002,"end":201.07971875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":201.70409375000003,"end":204.42096875000001,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":204.48846875,"end":207.28971875000002,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":207.32346875000002,"end":207.52596875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":207.66096875000002,"end":245.00534375,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":245.41034375,"end":252.68346875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長玲儀","start":253.61159375000003,"end":286.07909375,"speaker_score":0.974},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長玲儀","start":286.31534375,"end":288.22221875,"speaker_score":0.974},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":288.37409375000004,"end":290.48346875000004,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":290.77034375,"end":291.86721875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":293.31846875,"end":306.95346875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":307.25721875,"end":312.20159375000003,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":312.20159375000003,"end":342.52596875,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":342.52596875,"end":396.79596875000004,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"林委員月琴","start":397.45409375,"end":402.97221875,"speaker_score":0.968},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":402.97221875,"end":435.25409375000004,"speaker_score":0.978},{"speak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麻煩我們的環境部部長有請部長部長早今天是世界的地球日 過去我們常常"},{"start":17.458,"end":24.861,"text":"在談氣候變遷的減緩但今天我們要特別來設定調試作為質詢的主題因為我覺得調試面對的事實上是現在已經發生的極端氣候的風險我們必須要誠實且要能夠去有效的去做應對我先問最根本的問題現在環境部負責國家氣候變遷調試行動計畫的"},{"start":41.406,"end":56.849,"text":"整體推動跟成果彙整那環境部對於我們氣候調適的成效是只負責收集彙整公開資料還是也負責評估國家整體的調適到底有沒有成效"},{"start":57.23,"end":84.162,"text":"好 謝謝委員理論上是我們要協助督導每一個部會但是因為我們過去對調適的預算掌握不是在環境部的手上所以也跟委員坦承的說我們大概都是他們送過來那可能是希望他們寫得更好並沒有一個更強制的一個手段所以沒有辦法像我們這次過去我們在推動淨領本部其實很強大的力道跟各個部會一起積極合作"},{"start":84.542,"end":97.891,"text":"部長如果各部會都說自己有做地方政府也說自己有交報告但最後高溫淹水乾旱海岸的災害跟健康風險沒有下降那環境部難道沒有一套那個判斷標準嗎來提供參考嗎"},{"start":100.813,"end":125.18,"text":"對 謝謝委員 這個就是我們未來如果在第四期我們很想要積極推動的因為過去是112到115這段期間其實這當中其實我是覺得力道還不夠就是報告可能是寫了之後真的執行又是另外一件事情可是這事實上是環境部的職責所在因為各部會的調適成果如果不夠具體不夠有效的話那環境部如果也沒有能力去要求補正的話"},{"start":126.02,"end":146.353,"text":"只是被動收件的話我覺得對這件事情不會有任何幫助尤其我們現在你也知道迫在眉梢已經要二到三度那甚至你剛剛有預計可能事實上是到四度高溫一度都會造成人際的傷害暴力的"},{"start":147.385,"end":168.161,"text":"這樣的一個可能會增加到4到6%那都不是好事更何況部長下一期的116年到119年的國家氣候變遷調適行動計畫10月就要呈報行政院了現在進度到哪裡各部會那個方案已經進入到指標整合還是仍然在各自體計畫"},{"start":169.568,"end":198.598,"text":"跟委員報告目前行政院就是從國發會那邊已經確定下一期的調試領域的這個這個領域範圍那現在各領域正在撰寫那現在比較需要花一點時間的是這一期的調試計畫會有我們去強調跨領域的這個合作尤其是像高溫的這樣的議題是當然我覺得高溫這一題也不會是單以環境部可是衛福部這些都也有關聯性那"},{"start":199.673,"end":214.365,"text":"COVID-30已提出備輪調適的指標我不要求59項的目標你都全部照抄看台灣應該建立自己的GJA的對應指標我特別比較關心我想部長也知道我這兩年來質詢的"},{"start":215.956,"end":241.622,"text":"就是消除貧困跟生計環境部不能夠能不能建立氣候風險跟社會脆弱度的指標說清楚誰最脆弱在哪裡需要什麼服務由誰負責成效怎麼看因為心理健康跟心理社會支持也應該納入例如受災人口的取得的支持的比例這也都是我過去從兒少跟社福的角度來一直來跟部長請教的氣候調適的問題所以我要問環境部會不會"},{"start":245.483,"end":252.45,"text":"建立臺灣自己的GGA的對應指標那我在意的這些議題會怎麼處理會不會放進去"},{"start":254.343,"end":281.31,"text":"就是GGA的指標目前有59項但是因為它是全球性的所以它也要求每一個國家在試用的時候還是要因地制宜那我們現在去看它的七大領域其實跟我們目前在調試的八大領域是相合那我們現在也特別強調就是對於像脆弱群體這個部分因為我們已經訂了風險評估作業準則那要求每一個領域必須把它的脆弱度"},{"start":281.73,"end":306.683,"text":"然後危害跟暴露去做一個中整的考慮然後納到他的領域別的條式作為署長我們不知道你剛剛講我自己在看我們跟他們之間還是有差的就是消除貧困跟生計跟文化遺產跟知識那你也知道我很在意的就是消除貧困跟生計我不知道你剛剛講說兩邊都是合的可是我怎麼看"},{"start":307.355,"end":329.18,"text":"中文看起來就是不太一致 我知道這邊到底有沒有什麼樣的落差這個問題我有在關注 那我們目前的做法是我們預計大概10到11月的時候我們會希望舉辦一個兒少的氣候的一個博士的一個論壇邀請小朋友來談 因為我們現在有一個國家的氣候變遷對策委員會 可是沒有針對兒少"},{"start":330.68,"end":353.274,"text":"那兒少其實那些有些小朋友他們已經跟我提出一個要求了所以我們現在要整合各界一起來辦一個兒少的因為他的項目跟我們成人想的的確是會不一樣對那當然另外一個貧困也不是只有兒少因為我們的老人社福機構都是所以部長認為下一期的116年到119年的調適計畫不能只"},{"start":355.775,"end":384.936,"text":"納入國際趨勢更要把目標具體化過去很多調適工作都偏在宣導面下一期的目標能不能從我們計畫完成率改成風險降低的指標不要只寫發幾把扇子辦幾場宣導印幾份的一個手冊而是要看熱傷害跟熱相關死亡率有沒有下降因為過去我一直在推兒童安全的時候會常問政府說不要告訴我你辦幾場活動告訴我兒少的死亡"},{"start":385.596,"end":402.723,"text":"事故傷害死亡有沒有下降同樣的問題也是在這邊我們也希望看到的是這個那你的水資源的運用也應該要有漏水率的降低這個具體的成果目標所以部長訂出這種跟調適風險直接相關的成果的KPI有沒有困難能不能做到"},{"start":403.223,"end":418.804,"text":"我們已經針對這個熱就是未來的切面例如說熱大概我們東亞鄰近的國家大概有針對幾個一個是水資源一個是很熱這兩個是最多的那我們應該優先針對這個因為水包含缺水跟這個水太多洪災"},{"start":419.725,"end":435.124,"text":"所以這個熱跟水的議題是我們列為一個橫切面的指標那如果這個指標定的話就可以減少說委員您特別提到這是我們第二期的報告他可能將那時候的確都是宣導為主並沒有實質上的指標的效益"},{"start":436.065,"end":457.436,"text":"還有上一期有很多領域超過半數的項目都列為優先計畫以健康領域為例14項裡面有10項是優先計畫那我問的是環境部怎麼判斷什麼叫做優先超過一半都列優先的話還叫優先嗎這到底是應對台灣最關鍵的氣候風險還是只是給各部會自己列"},{"start":459.32,"end":474.672,"text":"這個是因為以前在進行的時候沒有做風險評估所以每一個領域他都自己部會自己去覺得優先他就列優先那我們因為這一期有開始做風險評估那一定必須要依照風險評估的結果然後來排定優先順序"},{"start":475.433,"end":492.039,"text":"所以下一期我們應該會找出關鍵的風險指標優先來處理真正需要解決的問題嗎那我覺得就期待部長台灣不是聯合國氣候變化的綱要公約的締約方"},{"start":492.819,"end":518.892,"text":"但臺灣長期自主接軌國際規範推動氣候的治理那COP30之後全球的調試目標已經進入到指標化跟成效追蹤先環境部的調試行動計畫年度成果報告比較像行政體系的內部的成果公開來讓大家知道臺灣是不是也應該思考國家的調試計畫能不能建立更公開更制度化的審查機制"},{"start":520.356,"end":545.412,"text":"謝謝委員 這個部分是蠻好的一個做法因為我們本國不是聯合國會員國所以我們要送我們的NDC或調適的報告基本上送的就是已讀未回我們希望委員提到的建議說如果我們未來提的不管是NDC檢探的報告或是調適報告其實如果有一些國外的專家來幫我們審查然後讓各公眾的參與我們過去已經做了台灣本地的"},{"start":545.812,"end":559.198,"text":"很多的公聽討論但是如果有一個國際的事我非常的贊成所以我希望比照我們的CRC或CRPD的人權公約國家報告的審查模式因為我們一樣也不是在聯合國會員國"},{"start":560.822,"end":587.188,"text":"CRC或是CRPD都是邀國際委員來幫我們審視我們到底跟國際的接軌的落差到底是什麼所以我們希望這個能夠請我們的環境部開始示範有辦法嗎可以 包括委員因為我過去在民間的時候在開放政府還有開放國會我都有參與那這個當時就有類似的一套程序在進行那比較麻煩的是說當時很嚴格說這個錢不能由政府出"},{"start":587.668,"end":616.033,"text":"因為有政府出就有BIOS所以我們未來可能要解決這個問題我們就可以來克服我們也一樣期待我們希望能夠盡速的去做部長最後延續我們的選擇問題你年初的時候提到環境部跟國科會正在做跨部會討論成立國家氣候調適任性的中心那我支持成立更有整合能力的機制只要設計合理的話我也願意跟部長一起來做推動但我必須先問清楚現在已經有行政院的永續"},{"start":617.133,"end":632.438,"text":"好的一個氣候變遷跟進行轉型的專案小組那氣候法理國發國發費也是氣候變遷調適相應肆意的研擬跟推動四項的主辦機關之一那科學研究也有國科會的氣候台灣氣候變遷的推"},{"start":635.979,"end":658.764,"text":"推估資訊跟調適的知識的平台環境部自己也有氣候署跟國家環境研究院那所以想問部長說這個中心如何避免跌穿架屋的問題它必要性是什麼和既有的機構的權責怎麼去做區分最重要的是這個中心未來會不會有三種能力預算連結能力政策管考能力跟跨部會要求改善的能力"},{"start":659.965,"end":687.547,"text":"謝謝委員 這個其實過去的雨傘太多現在就是要一個大雨傘來支撐整個調試我們過去包含的NCDR就是國家災害防救科技中心他們有一個TCCIP在做這個事本部有兩個但是我的觀察是太多的連結就造成說彼此的分工雖然有分工但是等於沒有合作所以我們就希望這次也感謝各個國科會願意來一起來支持一起來推動這個事情"},{"start":688.007,"end":703.584,"text":"所以因為時間關係我們後邊就請環境部在一個月內就下面這幾個事項包含我們剛剛講的國家氣候調適的韌性中心設置的規劃都一併交報告給我這邊好沒問題謝謝委員謝謝謝謝林愛玄召委的發言"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:29:43.611000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:29:46.093000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，麻煩請我們的環境部部長。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T09:29:46.093000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:29:50.175000+08:00","text":"有請彭部長。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:29:50.175000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:29:51.175000+08:00","text":"召委好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:29:50.175000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:29:50.475000+08:00","text":"部長早。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:29:51.695000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:30:01.460000+08:00","text":"今天是世界地球日，過去我們常在談氣候變遷的減緩，但今天我們要特別設定調適作為質詢的主題，因為我覺得調適面對的是現在事實上已經發生的極端氣候風險，我們必須要誠實且要能夠有效地去做應對。","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:30:01.460000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:30:34.829000+08:00","text":"部長，我先問最根本的問題，現在環境部負責國家氣候變遷調適行動計畫的整體推動跟成果彙整，環境部對於我們氣候調適的成效是只負責蒐集、彙整公開資料，還是也負責評估國家整體的調適到底有沒有成效？","quality":0.954},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:30:36.110000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:30:36.871000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:30:36.871000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:31:02.142000+08:00","text":"理論上是我們要協助督導每一個部會，但是因為過去調適的預算不是掌握在環境部的手上，所以也跟委員坦誠的說，我們大概都是等他們送過來，那可能是希望他們寫得更好，並沒有一個更強制的手段，所以這次沒有辦法像我們過去在推動淨零，本部其實有很強大的力道跟各個部會一起積極合作。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:31:02.542000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:31:15.891000+08:00","text":"部長，如果各部會都說自己有做，地方政府也說自己有交報告，但最後高溫、淹水、乾旱、海岸的災害跟健康風險沒有下降，那環境部難道沒有一套判斷標準來提供參考嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:31:18.813000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:31:22.554000+08:00","text":"對，謝謝委員，這個就是未來在第四期我們很想要積極推動的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:31:22.694000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:31:33.657000+08:00","text":"因為過去在112年到115年這段期間，其實這當中我是覺得力道還不夠，就是報告可能寫了之後，真的執行又是另外一件事情。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:31:33.977000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:31:48.103000+08:00","text":"可是這事實上是環境部的職責所在，因為各部會的調適成果如果不夠具體、不夠有效，環境部如果也沒有能力去要求補正而只是被動收件的話，我覺得對這件事情不會有任何幫助。是。","quality":0.973},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:31:48.823000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:32:10.309000+08:00","text":"尤其，你也知道現在迫在眉梢，已經要升溫2到3度，甚至你剛剛也有預計可能事實上是到4度，越高溫每升溫一度，都會造成人際之間的暴力傷害可能會增加到4%到6%，那都不是好事。","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:32:11.030000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:32:21.077000+08:00","text":"更何況，部長，下一期的116年到119年的國家氣候變遷調適行動計畫，10月就要呈報行政院了，現在進度到哪裡？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:32:21.077000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:32:26.161000+08:00","text":"各部會的方案已經進入到指標整合還是仍然在各自提計畫？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"蔡署長玲儀","start":"2026-04-22T09:32:27.568000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:32:50.236000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，目前行政院從國發會那邊已經確定下一期的調適領域範圍，現在各領域正在撰寫，目前比較需要花一點時間的是，這一期的調適計畫會有我們強調的跨領域合作，尤其是像高溫這樣的議題。","quality":0.94},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:32:50.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:32:55.637000+08:00","text":"是，當然我覺得高溫這個議題也不會單是環境部的責任，衛福部這些也都有關聯性。","quality":0.794},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:32:57.673000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:33:10.223000+08:00","text":"COP30已提出《貝倫調適指標》（Belem Adaptation Indicators），我不要求這59項目標你都全部照抄，但臺灣應該建立自己的GGA的對應指標。","quality":0.551},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:33:10.223000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:33:27.219000+08:00","text":"我特別比較關心的，我想部長也知道，我這兩年來質詢的就是消除貧困與生計，環境部能不能建立氣候風險跟社會脆弱度的指標，說清楚誰最脆弱、在哪裡、需要什麼服務、由誰負責、成效怎麼看。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:33:28.139000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:33:47.067000+08:00","text":"心理健康跟心理社會支持也應該納入，例如受災人口取得支持的比例，這也都是我過去從兒少跟社福的角度一直以來跟部長請教的氣候調適的問題，所以我要問，環境部會不會建立臺灣自己的GGA對應指標？","quality":0.989},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:33:47.207000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:33:50.430000+08:00","text":"我在意的這些議題會怎麼處理，會不會放進去？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長玲儀","start":"2026-04-22T09:33:52.923000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:34:01.285000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，GGA的指標目前有59項，但因為它是全球性的，所以它也要求每一個國家在適用的時候還是要因地制宜。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"蔡署長玲儀","start":"2026-04-22T09:34:02.066000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:34:26.934000+08:00","text":"我們現在去看它的七大領域，其實跟我們目前在調適的八大領域是相合的，我們現在也特別強調，對於像脆弱群體這個部分，因為我們已經訂了風險評估作業準則，要求每一個領域必須把它的脆弱度、危害跟暴露去做綜整的考慮，然後納到它的領域別的調適作為。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:34:26.934000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:34:50.456000+08:00","text":"署長，我們不知道你剛剛講八大……我自己在看，我們跟他們之間還是有差的就是消除貧困與生計以及文化遺產與知識，你也知道我很在意的就是消除貧困與生計，我不知道你剛剛講說兩邊都是相合的，可是就中文看起來就是不太一致，我不知道這邊到底有沒有什麼樣的落差？","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:34:52.397000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:35:21.028000+08:00","text":"報告委員，這個問題我有在關注，我們目前的做法是，我們預計大概10到11月的時候，我們會希望舉辦一個兒少的氣候博士論壇，邀請小朋友來談，因為我們現在有一個國家氣候變遷對策委員會，可是沒有針對兒少，其實有些小朋友已經跟我提出一個要求了，所以我們將整合各界，一起來辦一個兒少的論壇，因為它的項目跟我們成人想的的確是會不一樣。對。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:35:21.748000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:35:27.531000+08:00","text":"另外，貧困也不是只有兒少，包括我們的老人、社福機構都是。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:35:28.172000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:35:45.604000+08:00","text":"所以部長，我認為下一期（116年到119年）的調適計畫，不能只納入國際趨勢，更要把目標具體化，過去很多調適工作都偏在宣導面，下一期的目標能不能從計畫完成率改成風險指標降低？","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:35:46.824000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:35:56.011000+08:00","text":"不要只寫發幾把扇子、辦幾場宣導、印幾份手冊，而是要看熱傷害跟熱相關死亡率有沒有下降。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:35:56.811000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:36:08.938000+08:00","text":"過去我一直在推兒童安全的時候會常問政府說，不要告訴我你辦了幾場活動，要告訴我兒少的事故傷害死亡有沒有下降，同樣的問題，在這邊我們也希望看到的是這個。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:36:09.298000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:36:20.043000+08:00","text":"你的水資源運用也應該要有漏水率降低這個具體的成果目標，請問部長，訂出這種跟調適風險直接相關的成果KPI有沒有困難？","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:36:20.043000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:36:20.703000+08:00","text":"能不能做到？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:36:21.223000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:36:53.104000+08:00","text":"我們已經針對這個熱的部分，就是未來的切面，例如說熱，我們東亞鄰近的國家大概有針對幾個，一個是水資源，一個是很熱，這兩個是最多的，我們應該優先針對這個……因為水包含缺水跟水太多、洪災，所以這樣的熱跟水的議題是我們列為一個橫切面的指標，如果這個指標定的話，就可以減少委員您特別提到的，這是我們第二期的報告，那時候的確都是宣導為主，並沒有實質上的指標的效益。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:36:54.065000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:06.491000+08:00","text":"還有，上一期有很多領域超過半數的項目都列為優先計畫，以健康領域為例，14項裡面有10項是優先計畫，那我要問的是，環境部怎麼判斷什麼叫做優先？","quality":0.983},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:06.972000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:10.473000+08:00","text":"超過一半都列優先的話，還叫優先嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:10.473000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:15.416000+08:00","text":"這到底是應對臺灣最關鍵的氣候風險，還是只是給各部會自己列？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長玲儀","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:17.320000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:32.652000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，這個是因為以前在進行的時候沒有做風險評估，所以每一個領域都是部會自己覺得優先就列優先，但我們這一期有開始做風險評估，那一定必須要依照風險評估的結果來排定優先順序。","quality":0.915},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:33.433000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:40.736000+08:00","text":"所以下一期我們應該會找出關鍵的風險指標，優先來處理真正需要解決的問題？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:40.736000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:41.736000+08:00","text":"對，沒錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:40.736000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:37:42.316000+08:00","text":"那我們就期待。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:37:44.077000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:38:16.872000+08:00","text":"部長，臺灣不是聯合國氣候變化綱要公約的締約方，但臺灣長期自主接軌國際規範，推動氣候的治理，在COP30之後，全球的調適目標已經進入到指標化跟成效追蹤，現在環境部的調適行動計畫年度成果報告比較像行政體系的內部成果公開來讓大家知道，臺灣是不是也應該思考國家的調適計畫能不能建立更公開、更制度化的審查機制？","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:38:18.356000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:38:19.257000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:38:19.257000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:38:47.654000+08:00","text":"這是一個滿好的做法，因為我們、不是聯合國會員國，所以我們要送我們的NDC或是調適的報告，基本上送了就是已讀未回，我們希望就是像委員提到的建議，我們未來提的不管是NDC減碳的報告或是調適報告，如果有一些國外的專家來幫我們審查，然後讓公眾參與，我們過去已經做了臺灣本地很多的公聽、討論，但是如果有一個國際的審查，我非常的贊成。","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:38:48.774000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:39:12.825000+08:00","text":"所以我希望比照CRC或CRPD的人權公約國家報告審查模式，因為我們一樣也不是聯合國會員國，可是CRC或是CRPD都是邀國際委員來幫我們審視我們跟國際接軌的落差到底是什麼，所以我們希望請環境部開始試辦，有辦法嗎？可以。","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:39:13.485000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:39:21.207000+08:00","text":"報告委員，因為我過去在民間的時候，在開放政府還有開放國會我都有參與，這個當時就有類似的一套程序在進行。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:39:21.987000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:39:26.428000+08:00","text":"比較麻煩的是，當時很嚴格的說這個錢不能由政府出，因為由政府出就會有bias。是。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:39:27.348000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:39:30.169000+08:00","text":"所以未來可能要解決這個問題，我們就可以來克服。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:39:30.189000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:39:33.709000+08:00","text":"我們也一樣期待，我們希望能夠儘速去做。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:39:34.109000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:40:24.641000+08:00","text":"部長，最後要延續我們的權責問題，年初的時候提到環境部跟國科會正在做跨部會討論成立國家氣候調適韌性中心，我支持成立更有整合能力的機制，只要設計合理的話，我也願意跟部長一起來推動，但我必須先問清楚，現在已經有行政院永續會的氣候變遷與淨零轉型專案小組，在氣候法裡，國發會也是氣候變遷調適相關事宜之研擬及推動事項的主辦機關之一，科學研究也有國科會的臺灣氣候變遷推估資訊與調適知識平台，環境部自己也有氣候署跟國家環境研究院，所以想問部長，這個中心如何避免疊床架屋的問題？","quality":0.903},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:40:24.641000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:40:25.762000+08:00","text":"它的必要性是什麼？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:40:25.762000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:40:28.262000+08:00","text":"和既有機構的權責怎麼區分？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:40:29.282000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:40:36.744000+08:00","text":"最重要的是，這個中心未來會不會有三種能力：預算連結能力、政策管考能力跟跨部會要求改善的能力？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:40:37.965000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:40:38.645000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:40:38.645000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:05.527000+08:00","text":"其實過去的雨傘太多，現在就是要一個大雨傘來支撐整個調適，過去包含NCDR，就是國家災害防救科技中心，他們有一個TCCIP在做這個事，本部也有兩個，但是我的觀察是，太多的連結就造成彼此的分工雖然有分工，但是等於沒有合作，所以我們就希望……這次也感謝國科會願意一起來支持、一起來推動這個事情。","quality":0.985},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:05.527000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:07.649000+08:00","text":"是不是請國科會處長來說明？","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:07.649000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:19.682000+08:00","text":"因為時間的關係，本席就請環境部在一個月內就下面這幾個事項，包含我們剛剛講的國家氣候調適韌性中心設置規劃，都一併交報告給本席。","quality":0.914},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:20.363000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:20.924000+08:00","text":"好，沒問題，謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:20.924000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:20.924000+08:00","text":"謝謝部長。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:20.924000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:21.564000+08:00","text":"謝謝林月琴召委的發言，也謝謝彭部長跟各級長官的應答。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"主席（林委員月琴）","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:22.064000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:27.206857+08:00","text":"方才我們的議事錄尚未確定，現在進行確定。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（林委員月琴）","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:27.506857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:33.506857+08:00","text":"請問委員會，上次會議議事錄有無錯誤或遺漏之處？","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（林委員月琴）","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:33.806857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:36.092571+08:00","text":"（無）沒有，議事錄確定。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（林委員月琴）","start":"2026-04-22T09:41:36.392571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:41:40.106857+08:00","text":"接下來我們請陳菁徽委員發言。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}