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接下來我們請鍾嘉賓委員質詢好 主席 在場的委員先進列席的總局長 總管官員 會長 工作夥伴 媒體機構的女士新生有請經濟部鞏部長以及水利署的林署長和台水公司的李董事長台水李董事長"},{"start":34.389,"end":56.519,"text":"莊委員長部長好 署長好 董事長好來 我們來關心一下上週是發生了一個叫做翡翠水庫的事情因為關心到我們水資源調度跟未來的水價來 我們往下看這個翡翠水庫的水資源流失是因為錯誤調度根據媒體報導因為台北市政府由於受到監察院的糾正"},{"start":58.2,"end":86.454,"text":"說因為你們過去曾經有5億噸的水流入大海所以要被監察院糾正因此管理局就說好啊那既然我被糾正我來台電說我要跟你收耗水補償費請問一下部長翡翠水為了水利發電的尾水是屬於流到大海消耗掉的嗎可以收耗水費嗎怎麼說應該是法律上是這個依據是有問題的依據法律上法律是哪一個法"},{"start":87.074,"end":108.675,"text":"就是水利法那我問一下水利發電的水有被浪費掉流到大海嗎沒有那既然沒有就不是監察院糾正台北市政府他水資源浪費的原因那到底台北市政府他的水資源浪費被監察院糾正的原因是什麼剛剛事實上曾董事長也有講事實上我們調度他的水只有150噸"},{"start":111.897,"end":132.811,"text":"我們收的那個耗水費,那個量是115萬噸他這個是5億,所以他結論講的是他那個水流下來,翡翠流出來的水沒有辦法全部運用我想這才是監察院調查的最主要的一個水利署你們專業看法怎麼看"},{"start":135.237,"end":150.215,"text":"報告委員 這個依照法規耗水費它事實上是用在工業大戶為原則每天300度的一個大戶那工業用水 那水公司呢我是為了要節用水使用那請問水公司有沒有要付耗水費"},{"start":152.949,"end":171.105,"text":"跟委員報告 耗水費是由水利署來開徵對 開徵對水 你有沒有被開徵過耗水費水供是沒有被開徵過那你們用原水要不要付錢要付付給誰水庫的管理單位水庫的管理單位那因為水利水庫不是你們管的啦對我說其他的水庫用水庫的水你們有付錢嗎有"},{"start":172.989,"end":201.488,"text":"像石溫水庫或是翡翠水庫離台水庫翡翠水庫是專攻台北市因為台北市的水公司跟我們不一樣它是北水處對它是北水處那你們不是你們不攻台北市的水我們還要請台北自來水事業處支援我們新北的供水那翡翠水庫除了供應台北之外還支援新北好那你們跟其他的南部的水庫用水有沒有付耗水費"},{"start":202.162,"end":222.036,"text":"沒有耗水費那好啦那我又不懂啦來部長那奇怪了那到底說工業大戶可以水庫管理機關可以跟他收耗水費但是可能使用水庫水很大量的是自來水公司那台北市政府他的翡翠水庫他自己拿來自己用自來水他當然不用收費嘛他不會收嘛"},{"start":223.373,"end":238.803,"text":"那其他的水庫有去收過耗水費嗎因為耗水費基本上是中央的中央的稅收 是啊只有中央可以收所以他就是他想要跟台電簽約但是台電說這樣他不願意簽所以說了半天"},{"start":239.903,"end":261.822,"text":"監察院糾正台北市政府他轉移焦點說然後轉過頭來說要跟台電收耗水費耗水費也不是他能收的他要透過簽約的商業行為來跟台電簽來我們看一下這個事情不是昨天才發生不是上週才發生是去年的11月4號的時候他們的水庫管理局的這個林育毅局長在回答議員質詢的時候說"},{"start":263.243,"end":268.979,"text":"台電曾經發文九次請他同意供水來發電有沒有這個事實"},{"start":271.482,"end":299.18,"text":"九次嘛我看那是去年是啦所以去年就講了嘛那因為呢後來他們要調高跟你們收費台電就覺得你怎麼可以跟我收這個錢呢就沒有同意嘛所以這個新聞會再出來台北市政府是借題發揮嘛去年11月4號市議會有人做球問他他就講了但是依法他不能收耗水費他就轉頭來跟台電說我要再跟你重新預約預約的內容是要調高地方米要調高為3元是這樣嗎"},{"start":300.741,"end":321.997,"text":"他是對他是說超過的部分要每度要加三要三元但是翡翠水庫的電水比很低啊就是幾乎是五噸水才發一度電所以你如果收三元他就成本會變所以他要跟台電收這個一度就是一立方米來說一路因為電也是度啦水也是度啦一立方米的水收三塊錢 於法有據嗎"},{"start":324.569,"end":349.018,"text":"這個我們不在這個耗水費範圍內 而且我跟委員報告其實水力發電沒有把水用掉 它只是因為那個高低差位能 我們只是只是利用那個位能 利用水的位能沒有把水用掉嘛對 那完全是兩件事情好 謝謝 部長知道了齁今天啊 這個事情是在台北市政府面對自己的市議會面對監察院的糾正"},{"start":350.839,"end":360.259,"text":"然後他轉過頭來要發作在台電省上請問台電有沒有供電給台北市有沒有 當然有有沒有收取差別電價"},{"start":361.806,"end":382.288,"text":"目前還沒有沒有啊所以做一個國營事業 公用事業他當然水公司你們的水費是不是全國都一致就扣除台北 台北你們管不到對是嗎所以連我們屏東供應最多水給水公司的也一樣對不對好我們現在看來謝謝謝謝來我們看一下就問水公司了"},{"start":382.848,"end":398.277,"text":"屏東自來水的普及率全國最低啊那原因是什麼 簡單講 因為我問過好幾次了根據我報告 其實屏東早期它地下水脈是很豐富地下水豐沛嘛 賺錢的就不用贏嘛 要求錢的就不用贏嘛好 來 部長 我要請你拜託部長承諾"},{"start":402.859,"end":419.317,"text":"就是說往下看其實呢除了這個之外我們還有水資源的運用效率屏東縣自來水的普及化感謝中央我們這連續幾年來大力的支持前瞻計畫八千億都有在支持對不對可是前瞻計畫結束了嘛"},{"start":421.139,"end":436.65,"text":"接下來經濟部支票繼續爭取編列預算幫助屏東的自來水普及 為什麼因為如果下的雨留不住漏的水也擋不了因為屏東的自來水普及率全國最低之外漏水率也是很高的那這個改善需要工程部長怎麼辦"},{"start":438.071,"end":464.026,"text":"我們還是會持續啊雖然前瞻預算已經結束了但是有關於這個自來水不管是無自來水也好或是漏水這個部分本來就是水利署不是或者是經濟部還有水公司最重要的工作是的所以我們不忍心看因為這個工程推動受到工程的進度預算的編列我們也希望把這個漏水率把它降低嘛因為水資源是珍貴的嘛"},{"start":464.406,"end":492.245,"text":"台北是那麼斤斤計較翡翠水庫的水我們也很計較說我們水公司的水運到用戶之前不要漏掉嘛所以改善漏水率是不是當務之急是好往下看所以呢水公司執行量呢我們看了一下喔113年114年比起來占比呢貴街的水戶啊都還持續的微微的下降那水公司的執行的量能過去有關心過有沒有有沒有辦法再增加除了預算之外有沒有受到我們工程量能的限制"},{"start":493.203,"end":517.711,"text":"部長工程量對因為不是說錢你丟給他就會做你要有工班啊絕對董事長跟委員報告其實我們屏東地區啦現在剛才委員所指的就我們積極在增加一些鹽管而且對既有的老舊的管線也在幫汰換那這些都需要我們的水管承裝商來協助我們是那"},{"start":518.311,"end":540.089,"text":"所有屏東區域的廠商確實是還不夠我們會從鄰近的縣市甚至我們會去跟水管商工會請他們多來協助我們屏東地區多來參與我們的標案謝謝 部長我要說的是水工是已經全力以赴不只用我們屏東的包商各地區的包商都來支援但是包商跟我反映說什麼"},{"start":541.73,"end":561.252,"text":"我們比例最高的沒有錯,我連續問了好幾年了,但是如果預算延宕的話,我們可不可以發包?已經刮槓就刮不腐啊,你有時候再給我千元,我是不是把那個時間融入到那個上面,部長了解嗎?我知道,好在這個是屬於延續性計畫,所以不會受影響"},{"start":562.193,"end":584.28,"text":"不會受影響所以如果預算不會受影響工期就要趕快的調度工班來加速進行遏止除了提高我們的普及率之外也要遏止這個漏水率好不好好那就請部長指示我們署長指示董事長加速進行還有建議那個曾董事長以後台電在面對台北市的他們都叫我們"},{"start":585.32,"end":601.448,"text":"管理處的處長來跟你們這個校正我是要你們要清楚的回應台電公司使用水輸的水來發電不屬於耗水費的範疇第二耗水費也不是你台北市政府可以主張的好嗎說清楚講明白部長可以嗎可以可以謝謝好謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:46:53.705000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:46:58.348000+08:00","text":"主席、在場委員先進、列席政府機關首長官員、會場工作夥伴、媒體記者女士先生。","quality":0.719},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:46:59.048000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:06.693000+08:00","text":"有請經濟部龔部長，以及水利署林署長和台水公司李董事長。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:06.693000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:10.389000+08:00","text":"請龔部長、水利署林署長和台水公司李董事長。","quality":0.263},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:10.389000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:11.590000+08:00","text":"鍾委員早安。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:11.590000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:14.191000+08:00","text":"部長好、署長好、董事長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:15.011000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:22.614000+08:00","text":"我們來關心一下上週四發生的翡翠水庫的事情，因為這關係到我們的水資源調度和未來的水價。","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:25.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:27.437000+08:00","text":"翡翠水庫水資源流失是因為錯誤調度嗎？","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:28.057000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:41.043000+08:00","text":"根據媒體報導，因為臺北市過去曾經有5億噸的水流入大海，所以臺北市政府被監察院糾正。","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:42.344000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:43.164000+08:00","text":"翡翠水庫管理局就說：好啊！","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:43.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:47.506000+08:00","text":"既然被糾正，我們就跟台電說要收耗水補償費。","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:47.506000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:54.130000+08:00","text":"請問一下部長，翡翠水庫水力發電的尾水是屬於流到大海、消耗掉的嗎？","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:54.130000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:55.730000+08:00","text":"可以收耗水費嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:55.730000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:47:57.391000+08:00","text":"你怎麼說？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:47:57.651000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:00.333000+08:00","text":"在法律上，這個依據是有問題的。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:01.173000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:01.473000+08:00","text":"法律上？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:01.653000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:02.434000+08:00","text":"法律是哪一個法？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:02.434000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:04.976000+08:00","text":"水利法。","quality":0},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:04.976000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:05.336000+08:00","text":"水利法？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:05.837000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:11.222000+08:00","text":"那我問一下，水力發電的水有被浪費掉、流到大海嗎？沒有。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:11.822000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:17.187000+08:00","text":"既然沒有，就不是監察院糾正臺北市政府浪費水資源的原因啊！","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:17.408000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:21.391000+08:00","text":"那到底臺北市政府浪費水資源、被監察院糾正的原因是什麼？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:21.391000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:24.675000+08:00","text":"剛剛曾董事長也有講，事實上我們調度它的水只有150噸……","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:24.675000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:28.078000+08:00","text":"董事長，請說。","quality":0},{"speaker":"曾董事長文生","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:28.078000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:35.282000+08:00","text":"他們收的那個耗水費的量是115萬噸。115萬噸？對。","quality":0.706},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:35.542000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:36.303000+08:00","text":"但它這個是5億噸。","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"曾董事長文生","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:36.303000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:36.463000+08:00","text":"所以它……","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:36.463000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:39.065000+08:00","text":"顯然不是指這一……","quality":0},{"speaker":"曾董事長文生","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:39.065000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:47.951000+08:00","text":"真正狀況、結論講的是，翡翠水庫流出來的水沒有辦法全部運用，我想這才是監察院調查最主要的一個原因。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:47.951000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:48:48.791000+08:00","text":"水利署的專業看法是怎麼樣？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"林署長元鵬","start":"2026-04-22T09:48:51.237000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:03.612000+08:00","text":"報告委員，依照法規，耗水費事實上是以用在工業大戶（每天用水300度）為原則，這是為了要節約用水。","quality":0.795},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:04.974000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:06.215000+08:00","text":"請問水公司有沒有付耗水費？","quality":1},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:08.949000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:11.751000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，耗水費是由水利署來開徵。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:11.751000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:11.751000+08:00","text":"對誰開徵？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:12.112000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:14.954000+08:00","text":"你們有沒有被開徵過耗水費？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:14.954000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:16.115000+08:00","text":"水公司沒有被開徵過。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:16.255000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:18.197000+08:00","text":"你們用原水要不要付錢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:18.197000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:18.417000+08:00","text":"要付費。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:18.658000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:19.659000+08:00","text":"付給誰？","quality":1},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:19.659000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:20.679000+08:00","text":"水庫的管理單位。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:22.001000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:24.283000+08:00","text":"因為翡翠水庫不是你們管的啦！","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:25.144000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:27.085000+08:00","text":"請問你們用其他水庫的水有付錢嗎？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:28.989000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:32.572000+08:00","text":"像石門水庫或是翡翠水庫、鯉魚潭水庫……","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:32.572000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:37.815000+08:00","text":"因為翡翠水庫是專供臺北市，臺北市的水公司跟我們不一樣……","quality":0.88},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:37.815000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:39.176000+08:00","text":"它是北水處。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:39.176000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:42.418000+08:00","text":"對，它是北水處，你們不是，你們不供臺北市的水。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:43.539000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:48.062000+08:00","text":"我們還要請臺北自來水事業處支援我們新北的供水。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:50.103000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:57.488000+08:00","text":"好，翡翠水庫除了供應臺北市之外，還支援新北，那你們跟其他南部的水庫用水，有沒有付耗水費？","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:58.162000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:49:59.343000+08:00","text":"沒有耗水費。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:49:59.343000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:00.624000+08:00","text":"那好了，我就不懂啦！","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:00.924000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:18.016000+08:00","text":"部長，奇怪了，水庫管理機關可以跟工業大戶收耗水費，但是可能使用水庫水很大量的是自來水公司，臺北市政府的翡翠水庫，他自己拿來自己用自來水，他當然不用收費，他不會收嘛！對。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:19.833000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:21.815000+08:00","text":"其他的水庫有收過耗水費嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:21.815000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:25.677000+08:00","text":"因為耗水費基本上是中央的稅收……是啊！","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:26.738000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:27.638000+08:00","text":"只有中央可以收。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:27.638000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:28.638000+08:00","text":"好，我們往下看。","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:27.818000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:34.182000+08:00","text":"所以就是他想要跟台電簽約，但是台電說這樣他不願意簽……","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:34.182000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:50:47.773000+08:00","text":"所以說了半天，監察院糾正臺北市政府，他轉移焦點，轉過頭來要跟台電收耗水費，耗水費也不是他能收的，他要透過簽約的商業行為來跟台電簽。對。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:50:47.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:51:04.979000+08:00","text":"我們看一下，這個事情不是昨天才發生，也不是上週才發生，是去年11月4日的時候，他們水庫管理局林裕益局長在回答議員質詢的時候，說台電曾經發文9次，請他同意供水發電，有沒有這個事實？","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:51:04.979000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:51:07.702000+08:00","text":"9次是有……","quality":0},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:51:07.702000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:51:08.883000+08:00","text":"9次嘛，我看到去年……對。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:51:09.163000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:51:35.180000+08:00","text":"是啊，所以去年就講了，因為後來他們要調高跟你們收費，台電就覺得你怎麼可以跟我收這個錢，於是沒有同意，所以這個新聞會再出來，臺北市政府是借題發揮，去年11月4日市議會有人做球問他，他就講了，但是依法他不能收耗水費，他就轉頭來跟台電說，要再跟台電重新議約，議約的內容是要調高，一立方米要調高為3元，是這樣嗎？","quality":0.91},{"speaker":"曾董事長文生","start":"2026-04-22T09:51:37.302000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:51:49.150000+08:00","text":"對，他是說超過的部分，每度要3元，但是翡翠水庫的電水比很低，幾乎是5噸水才發1度電，所以你如果給我收3元，成本會變高……","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:51:49.150000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:51:57.997000+08:00","text":"所以他要跟台電收這一度，就是一立方米，因為電也是度，水也是度，一立方米的水收3塊錢，於法有據嗎？","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"曾董事長文生","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:00.569000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:11.733000+08:00","text":"我們不在這個耗水費的範圍內，而且我跟委員報告，其實水力發電沒有把水用掉，它只是因為高低差位能，我們只是利用位能……","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:11.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:13.994000+08:00","text":"利用水的位能，沒有把水用掉嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"曾董事長文生","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:14.554000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:16.695000+08:00","text":"對，那完全是兩件事情。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:17.275000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:17.935000+08:00","text":"謝謝，部長，知道了喔！","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:18.735000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:32.712000+08:00","text":"今天這個事情是在臺北市政府面對自己的市議會，面對監察院的糾正，他轉過頭來要發作在台電身上，請問台電有沒有供電給臺北市？","quality":0.945},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:33.814000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:34.035000+08:00","text":"有沒有？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:34.716000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:34.856000+08:00","text":"有，當然有啊。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:35.317000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:36.259000+08:00","text":"有沒有收取差別電價？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:37.806000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:38.407000+08:00","text":"目前還沒有。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:38.607000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:38.987000+08:00","text":"沒有啊！","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:39.688000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:48.758000+08:00","text":"所以作為一個國營事業、公用事業，水公司，你們的水費是不是全國都一致，就扣除臺北，臺北你們管不到。對。","quality":0.953},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:48.758000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:49.758000+08:00","text":"我們的……是嘛！","quality":0.2},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:49.679000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:55.104000+08:00","text":"所以就連我們屏東供應最多水給水公司的也一樣，對不對？對。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:55.104000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:52:55.104000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:52:55.265000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:03.531000+08:00","text":"我們就問水公司了，屏東自來水的普及率全國最低，原因是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:03.531000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:04.831000+08:00","text":"簡單講，因為我問過好幾次了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:06.212000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:09.254000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，其實屏東早期地下水脈是很豐富……","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:10.314000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:12.556000+08:00","text":"對，地下水豐沛嘛，免費的就姑且用嘛，要收費的就不用了嘛。對。","quality":0.44},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:13.876000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:34.176000+08:00","text":"部長，我要拜託部長承諾，其實除了這個之外，我們還有水資源的運用效率，屏東縣自來水的普及化，感謝中央，我們連續這幾年來大力的支持，前瞻計畫8年8,000億都有在支持對不對？","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:34.176000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:42.623000+08:00","text":"可是前瞻計畫結束了，接下來經濟部是不是要繼續爭取編列預算，幫助屏東的自來水普及，為什麼？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:42.623000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:51.890000+08:00","text":"因為下的雨留不住，漏的水也擋不了，屏東的自來水普及率全國最低之外，漏水率也是很高的，這個改善需要工程。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:52.530000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:53:52.650000+08:00","text":"部長，怎麼辦？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:53:54.071000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:09.180000+08:00","text":"有，我們還是會持續，雖然前瞻預算已經結束了，但是有關於自來水，不管是無自來水也好，或是漏水，這個部分本來就是經濟部還有水公司最重要的工作……是的……","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:09.180000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:10.180000+08:00","text":"繼續在做。","quality":0},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:09.640000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:29.932000+08:00","text":"所以我們不忍心看，這個工程推動受到工程的進度、預算的編列影響，我們也希望把漏水率降低，因為水資源是珍貴的，臺北市那麼斤斤計較翡翠水庫的水，我們也很計較水公司的水運到用戶之前不要漏掉，所以改善漏水率是不是當務之急？是。好。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:31.073000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:49.743000+08:00","text":"所以水公司的執行量能，我們看了一下，113年、114年比起來，未接水戶占比都還持續微微下降，水公司的執行量能，過去也關心過，有沒有辦法再增加，除了預算之外，有沒有受到我們工程量能的限制？部長。","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:49.743000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:50.563000+08:00","text":"工程量能？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:51.044000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:54.205000+08:00","text":"對，因為不是你丟錢給他，他就會做，你要有工班啊！","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:55.005000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:54:55.725000+08:00","text":"董事長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"李董事長嘉榮","start":"2026-04-22T09:54:55.725000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:28.383000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，其實我們屏東地區，就剛才委員所指正的，我們積極在增加一些延管，而且對既有的老舊管線也在汰換，這些都需要水管承裝商來協助我們，只有屏東區域的廠商確實是還不夠，我們會從鄰近的縣市，甚至我們會請水管商公會，請他們多來協助我們屏東地區、多來參與我們的標案。謝謝。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:28.383000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:36.089000+08:00","text":"部長，我要說的是，水公司已經全力以赴，不只用我們屏東的包商，各地區的包商都來支援，但是包商跟我反映什麼？","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:36.089000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:37.730000+08:00","text":"……比例好像也是最高。","quality":0},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:37.730000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:44.177000+08:00","text":"我們比例是最高的，沒有錯，這個馬上回答你，我連續問了好幾年了，但是如果預算延宕的話，我們可不可以發包？","quality":0.822},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:44.938000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:51.526000+08:00","text":"已經趕工都趕不及了，你預算還遷延，我是不是把時間浪費到那個上面了？","quality":0.533},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:52.206000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:52.947000+08:00","text":"部長了解嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:52.947000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:56.591000+08:00","text":"我知道，不過好在這是屬於延續性計畫，我們就接下來……","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:56.591000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:57.252000+08:00","text":"所以不會受影響？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:57.252000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:55:58.853000+08:00","text":"因為這是延續性計畫……","quality":0},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:55:58.853000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:10.777000+08:00","text":"好，所以如果預算不會受影響，工期就要趕快的調度工班來加速進行，除了提高我們的普及率之外，也要遏止漏水率，好不好？好。","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:10.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:14.038000+08:00","text":"那就請部長指示我們署長、指示董事長加速進行。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:14.678000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:35.547000+08:00","text":"還有，建議曾董事長，以後台電在面對臺北市的時候，他們都叫他們管理處的處長來跟你們叫陣，我是覺得你們要清楚地回應，台電公司使用水庫的水來發電，不屬於耗水費的範疇；第二，耗水費也不是你臺北市政府可以主張的。好嗎？","quality":0.883},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:35.547000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:36.988000+08:00","text":"說清楚講明白，部長可以嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:36.988000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:37.368000+08:00","text":"可以、可以。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:37.428000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:37.428000+08:00","text":"可以，謝謝。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:37.928000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:41.070857+08:00","text":"謝謝鍾佳濱委員、謝謝部長。","quality":0.182},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T09:56:41.370857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T09:56:44.513714+08:00","text":"接下來請陳亭妃委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}