{"error":false,"id":["168731"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":168731,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168731","日期":"2026-04-22","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-26-7","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":7,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-04-22T11:37:45+08:00","結束時間":"2026-04-22T11:51:10+08:00","影片長度":"00:13:25","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5b5880b40c5769f10a27105e6dde1ac8f38d440c98c629e74f2050ed7b2b649b14e39bd33e9c15bb5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"王正旭","委員發言時間":"11:37:45 - 11:51:10","會議時間":"2026-04-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請環境部部長、國家科學及技術委員會、交通部、經濟部、內政部、農業部、衛生福利部、國家發展委員會就「我國氣候變遷調適現況檢討與全球調適目標接軌之推動情形」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、審查中華民國115年度中央政府總預算案關於環境部主管預算案。(公務及非營業特種基金預算案)\n三、審查中華民國115年度中央政府總預算案直轄市及縣市政府一般性補助款環境部主管部分預算。\n四、審查環境部函送財團法人環境資源研究發展基金會等4家財團法人115年度預算書案。\n\n【預算案僅詢答，115年4月30日下午5時截止收案】\n【專題報告及討論事項綜合詢答】\n\n【4月22日及23日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":7.40534375,"end":8.77221875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":9.396593750000001,"end":10.62846875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":10.45971875,"end":11.505968750000001,"speaker_score":0.971},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":14.239718750000002,"end":33.64596875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":34.455968750000004,"end":65.33721875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":65.89409375000001,"end":93.02909375,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":93.31596875000001,"end":97.50096875000001,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":97.55159375000001,"end":101.46659375,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":101.97284375000001,"end":118.54409375,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":119.37096875,"end":126.35721875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":126.39096875000001,"end":126.40784375000001,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":126.40784375000001,"end":157.32284375,"speaker_score":0.971},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":157.87971875000002,"end":166.28346875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":166.57034375,"end":188.87909375,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":189.35159375,"end":198.44721875000002,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":199.03784375,"end":223.48971875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":223.99596875,"end":228.46784375000001,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":228.97409375,"end":233.04096875000002,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":233.04096875000002,"end":291.54659375,"speaker_score":0.971},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":291.64784375,"end":344.95596875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":306.41346875,"end":306.75096875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":345.36096875000004,"end":379.09409375,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":379.19534375,"end":433.38096875,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"彭部長啓明","start":432.35159375,"end":445.78409375,"speaker_score":0.971},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":442.64534375000005,"end":443.18534375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":444.13034375,"end":444.70409375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":445.48034375000003,"end":445.63221875000005,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":445.78409375,"end":446.76284375,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":446.84721875,"end":468.17721875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":468.75096875,"end":471.43409375000005,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":471.97409375,"end":481.40721875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":481.71096875,"end":497.21909375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":497.60721875,"end":497.75909375000003,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":497.75909375000003,"end":519.5278437500001,"speaker_score":0.981},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":519.8484687499999,"end":520.1184687500001,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":521.0803437500001,"end":524.37096875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":525.77159375,"end":526.2609687500001,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":526.75034375,"end":528.48846875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"許副署長智倫","start":528.5053437500001,"end":532.38659375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"王委員正旭","start":528.60659375,"end":528.8090937500001,"speaker_score":0.981},{"spea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Trade Index在2025年的時候呢我們全台灣的排名是第10名看起來成績還算是讓大家可以接受那其實這是一個熱商管理學院瑞士跟韓理事基金會共同發布了一個研究在國際間有一定的這個參考的"},{"start":80.786,"end":107.1,"text":"一個價值的評比工具這個評比主要是在針對各經濟體在經濟社會環境三維度的一個永續貿易的表現那其實也是我們很重視的一個重要的參考指標在2023年的時候我們是第10名那2024年我們是第9名那2025年會回到第10名就是好像他在進步的部分沒有非常的"},{"start":107.72,"end":118.016,"text":"讓我們覺得很明顯那這樣這個指數的表現不是環境部單一部會可以能夠來解決的會涉及到跨部會的這個協力的表現"},{"start":119.5,"end":142.712,"text":"想要請教部長就是這個指標沒有明顯的進展不知道部長怎麼看這樣的意涵包委員我們那個資源循環推動法其實就要把這個概念放進去我相信我們那個法案如果在大院如果通過的話其實對我們整個循環這個永續的這種供應鏈會更完整那過去其實"},{"start":143.172,"end":157.168,"text":"我必須說雖然我們很努力但是法規政策預算其實或是整個人力的投入都可能還不夠所以我們現在希望說未來這個部分謝謝委員給我們這樣的數據我們希望未來可以往上走"},{"start":157.915,"end":182.086,"text":"好謝謝謝謝部長對他們的這個了解跟掌握未來可以再進步的部分其實剛剛講的是全指標那再過來針對環境部在掌管的環境指數方面我們的評比是第12名這個第12名其實跟之前相比真的是好很多在2023年的時候我們是第27名"},{"start":183.246,"end":198.044,"text":"那2024年那個時候部長剛上任那個時候已經進步到第16名那現在去年就更進步到12名表示說我們這方面的這個努力環境部的確可以看到很亮眼的成績可是我們看到"},{"start":199.085,"end":223.184,"text":"比較擔心的就是有幾個指標其實還是相對落後包括我們森林砍伐是第29位人均二氧化碳的排放第25位再生能源的再利用等等是27位其中還有兩個部分叫做廢水處理率跟生態足跡那時候甚至是沒有提供資訊給他們做排名的參考所以"},{"start":224.045,"end":250.103,"text":"部長怎麼看這樣的表現就是在這方面的結構上跟您剛剛所提到的進步的方向有沒有一致謝謝委員那個森林砍伐其實過去不是環境部主導的但是現在因為總統要求環境部要來整合都市林的部分我希望我們開始推動那個都市林要這個樹要倍增的這個方案可以把這個名次我們就會往上提升"},{"start":251.023,"end":275.108,"text":"人均的二氧化碳排放量我們是持續的降但是必須說因為整個我們的經濟發展實在太好了所以基本上我們的減碳的確都在每年2-3%我們今年開始的壓力才大我們減碳是要減到4-5%左右所以這個我們會努力再生能源就是屬於經濟部他們要做的工作其實現在的確會遇到一些波動"},{"start":275.848,"end":289.046,"text":"但是我目前我跟他們討論的時候其實他們還在往這個方向上面例如說再生能源要20 2030年要30這樣的目標要再前進我希望說我們如果有這個顯著的目標的話將來這個名次應該都還有機會再提升"},{"start":291.81,"end":305.28,"text":"是 那我們當然是希望整體排名能夠提升的同時其實是在各方面尤其在指標上面也不要有一部分落後太多那個才代表我們是整體的在進步謝謝部長這方面的說明"},{"start":307.822,"end":324.796,"text":"那再過來是醫療廢棄物去化跟落實循環的部分如何能夠提升這個再利用率我現在雙法處理以後呢應該會逐步的來改善這種狀況其實不管是一般廢棄物或者是失業廢棄物我們的這個去化量很多已經非常的緊繃相對來講可能"},{"start":327.018,"end":342.656,"text":"大家要持續更努力那如何能夠提升這個再利用力落實這個循環永續尤其在醫療廢棄物的部分因為我本身是出自這個醫療單位所以會相對比較關心那我們知道其實整體來講這個醫療廢棄物它的占比"},{"start":345.439,"end":359.775,"text":"其實並不多只佔0.63%可是如果說我們要希望能夠這個資源循環零廢棄這樣的政策目標不應該有任何一個部門要被忽略如果被忽略掉的話就沒有辦法"},{"start":360.356,"end":376.574,"text":"能夠真正的達標那我們也知道這個醫療廢棄物其實有它在利用上的一些困境包括說有感染的風險啊 增加的危險等等那處理的費用其實也是相對可能比其他的部門還要高一些"},{"start":377.054,"end":398.549,"text":"可是不管怎麼樣還是恆青部基本上是一個整股廢棄物的這個主管機關所以還是得擔負起這個體制制度的設計跟這個政策引導的責任所以除了衛福部自己努力以外所以部長有三點要請教就是對於這個醫療廢棄物持續上升會越來越多的趨勢"},{"start":399.269,"end":415.961,"text":"那環境部目前有沒有具體因應的策略這個策略應該只是在監測跟管理而已有沒有更好的政策工具第二點就是是否能夠針對醫療廢棄物訂定更明確的處理跟再利用的準則可以讓大家有所根據"},{"start":416.661,"end":445.368,"text":"第三點就是能不能考慮跟衛福部合作先有一些示範性的示範計畫未來大家有一個標竿學習的機會那這個示範計畫可能要選定幾家醫院那真的這三點部長有沒有什麼樣的好謝謝謝謝王委員因為我禮拜天的時候有遇到這個劉玉平劉師長他是主管這個醫療廢棄物的我們有交換一下意見那我是不是請我們副署長能夠來回答這個事情未來法的過後會我們一起來主導好"},{"start":445.928,"end":467.711,"text":"有請副市長檢要報告委員,我們幾個做法,我們其實今年已經跟醫事室開始合作那委員所提到的減費,其實就是第一個我們跟醫事室要針對幾個項目像是塑膠或常用的用品,我們不只是做一個平常的在利用而已我們希望做高質化的循環,但是對於醫療院所的人員"},{"start":468.812,"end":495.96,"text":"他可能要知道更多的做法心裡要有更大的信任感所以這個東西我們要合作訂出一個指引也就是委員剛才垂詢的部分要讓大家更知道第二個就是說像有一些像是在利用的部分其實現在的在利用已經是60%了那我們這個部分其實也一直持續的在跟醫術師跟醫療院所看能不能滅菌消毒等等或是少用這個都會持續的在努力現在滅菌已經達到26%"},{"start":497.7,"end":523.9,"text":"是 好 看起來兩個部會其實也對我在積極的處理這個議題不過我們在兩年前其實那個時候有請教過貴部就是有關於這個輔導醫療機構的執行內容不知道到目前為止有沒有比較好的執行方式或者是有沒有示範的案例可以給我們做參考報告委員 我們從這兩年已經跟"},{"start":527.161,"end":543.06,"text":"醫療部份是衛福部,其實部裡面不只是循環署、空品、水溫防治等等我們都有一個綠色醫療的推動方案,那我們有訂出不同類型的KPM不好意思因為我今天那個數據"},{"start":544.201,"end":561.557,"text":"沒有準備在身上,這個是不是我們另外再跟我們報告好,那就麻煩布里是不是提供這個可以讓我們看到的成果報告沒問題最後一個部分就是有關醫療機構減碳的政策其實我們在2027年希望能夠完善整體的總量"},{"start":563.539,"end":589.022,"text":"管制碳交易的部分2028年就要開始實施那現在醫療機構相信也是一個重要的部分雖然它整體的排放量佔比只有0.9%即使把這個醫療供應鏈相關的合併計算是4.4%其實這個佔比也在逐漸的上升當中所以綠色醫療跨部會的政策環境部目前的政策方向有沒有已經確定下來了"},{"start":589.802,"end":618.155,"text":"還有環境部可能可以協助醫院來做這個節能的具體方案嗎這個部分請教部長謝謝委員其實目前的我們認為醫院所要做的是節能節能就可以幫醫院減少開支醫院就財務就負擔不會那麼重所以目前長庚醫院做得最好那目前的這個慈濟醫院他現在我們經過我們協助輔導之下又給他們補助一些經費然後他們自己很努力也加入了ASCO的方案所以長庚集團"},{"start":619.815,"end":648.958,"text":"慈濟整個醫療體系會是下一個那其他的呢我們都有在參與但是這個很多的醫院或許他的這個有別的考慮啦真的比較慢那我們會再努力一下跟每個醫院不過因為很多的醫院我們是跟他們一直提醒要減碳要知道自己的用電從ESCO去做是最好的不見得要馬上去算那個碳他只要把這個用電節下來他的碳就跟著減了所以這個部分我們會再積極跟他們的永續長一起來這個努力"},{"start":649.398,"end":671.065,"text":"所以是有具體方案在執行有已經都有在做但是有時候到最後一里路就是這個醫院願不願意真的跳下去做X口有時候有些醫院真的不大願意好那如果具體方案的話也可以給我們一個書面報告好不好一個月裡面這邊經濟部能源署好像陳副署長也在現場剛剛部長有提到這個節能的部分非常重要"},{"start":671.585,"end":688.373,"text":"其實醫學中心真的是他為了要讓整體的環境尤其這個照顧可以更為完整所以這個用電真的是無法真的做有效的節能不過醫學中心裡面這個所有的能源用電電力佔了79%"},{"start":691.435,"end":708.213,"text":"這個電力裡面耗電當中空調又佔了15%照明佔了30%所以如何能夠讓這個節能的管理重點發揮作用這個就必須要相關的部會一起共同來努力"},{"start":708.934,"end":728.666,"text":"那這個部分呢我們如何能夠透過經濟部能源署來協助做一個節能的一些相關的處理模式那我們也了解這個經濟部其實是有一些補助的方案那這個補助裡面最近四年發現說補助三四二次的這個"},{"start":730.007,"end":747.215,"text":"醫院裡面呢公立的占了一半左右表示說公視率其實都有這個需求不過好像整個量並不是那麼足夠那114年度84件案裡面呢有19件是屬於醫院的部門那其中公立院是有6件所以"},{"start":748.055,"end":762.909,"text":"能不能夠 再麻煩請經濟部在這邊多努力包括未來經濟部跟環境部還有衛護部能不能夠針對醫療機構提出一個專案式的方式就是不是跟其他的這些部門做處理而是針對這個醫療部門做單獨的處理不是在這邊"},{"start":766.032,"end":787.1,"text":"OK 跟委員 委員好 跟委員間斷來說明經濟部目前大概有兩個專案在進行 從111年到今年的部分大概已經有補助了78家的一個醫院醫療院所來做這方面的節能每年大概可以節省了大概0.9億度的部分那剛剛委員推詢就是說能不能跟其他部會"},{"start":787.74,"end":805.973,"text":"有個專案的部分來跟醫療院所來做進一步的節能合作的部分那這部分我們跟衛福部相關的部會來一起合作來達到節能的效果好謝謝那我們期待這個會很快有成果給我們做一個參考好謝謝王振興委員發言接下來請張"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:37:53.184000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:37:59.387000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，再麻煩彭部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T11:37:59.387000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:00.387000+08:00","text":"請彭部長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:37:59.568000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:37:59.788000+08:00","text":"王委員好。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:00.528000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:00.908000+08:00","text":"彭部長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:01.429000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:13.096000+08:00","text":"今天就針對您的專案報告、相關的調適現況，還有和目標接軌的推動情形向你討教，早上您的專報真的做的非常完整。謝謝。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:13.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:15.377000+08:00","text":"非常謝謝，從裡面學到很多東西。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:16.058000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:35.927000+08:00","text":"不過我想我們今天談的這個問題，不只是談原則，更希望執行率能夠落實，所以要聚焦兩件事情：第一個就是臺灣永續表現的結構性落差；第二個部分就是有關於醫療體系在減碳和廢棄物方面的政策缺位。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:36.927000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:39.468000+08:00","text":"這兩個部分希望和部長討論一下。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:40.108000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:38:56.779000+08:00","text":"永續貿易指數，我相信部長應該比我更清楚，Sustainable Trade Index，在2025年的時候，臺灣的排名是第10名，看起來這個成績大家還算可以接受。","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:38:57.460000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:39:07.127000+08:00","text":"其實這是瑞士洛桑管理學院和韓禮士基金會共同發布的研究，是國際間有一定參考價值的評比工具。","quality":0.786},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:39:07.747000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:39:20.054000+08:00","text":"這個評比主要是針對各經濟體，在經濟、社會、環境三維度的永續貿易表現，也是我們很重視的重要參考指標。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:39:20.054000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:39:34.643000+08:00","text":"在2023年的時候，我們是第10名，2024年我們是第9名，2025年回到第10名，進步的幅度好像不是很明顯。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:39:35.364000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:39:43.016000+08:00","text":"當然，這個指數的表現不是環境部單一部會能夠解決的，涉及跨部會的協力表現。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:39:44.940000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:39:51.003000+08:00","text":"請教部長，這個指標沒有明顯的進展，不知道部長怎麼看這樣的意涵？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:39:52.384000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:40:07.011000+08:00","text":"我們的資源循環推動法，其實就是要把這個概念放進去，如果我們那個法案在大院通過的話，我相信整個循環永續的供應鏈會更完整。","quality":0.891},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:40:08.172000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:40:22.148000+08:00","text":"我必須說雖然過去我們很努力，但是法規、政策、預算或整個人力的投入都可能還不夠，因此，針對未來的這個部分，也謝謝委員提供這樣的數據，我們希望未來可以往上走。","quality":0.855},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:40:22.915000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:40:29.338000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝部長對這方面的了解，以及掌握了未來可以再進步的部分。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:40:32.019000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:41:02.263000+08:00","text":"剛剛講的是全指標，再來是環境部掌管的環境指數，我們在這方面的評比是第十二名，這個名次與之前相比真的是好很多，我們在2023年是第二十七名，2024年部長剛上任時已經進步到第十六名，去年更是進步到第十二名，表示環境部在這方面的努力的確是讓我們看到很亮眼的成績。","quality":0.752},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:41:02.383000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:41:27.344000+08:00","text":"但是，我們也看到有幾項指標相對落後，包括森林砍伐是第二十九位、人均二氧化碳排放是第二十五位、再生能源的再利用是第二十七位，其中還有兩個部分是廢水處理率與生態足跡，當時甚至沒有提供資訊讓他們作為排名的參考。","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:41:29.045000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:41:31.046000+08:00","text":"部長，你怎麼看待這樣的表現？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:41:32.427000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:41:37.331000+08:00","text":"這方面的結構與你剛剛提到的進步方向是否一致？","quality":0.81},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:41:38.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:41:38.912000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:41:39.172000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:41:55.083000+08:00","text":"過去森林砍伐其實並不是環境部主導，但現在因為總統要求環境部整合都市林的部分，我希望開始推動都市林倍增的方案之後，可以讓這個名次往上提升。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:41:56.023000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:42:13.927000+08:00","text":"人均二氧化碳排放量的部分，我們是持續的降低，但也因為我們的經濟發展實在太好了，基本上，我們每年的減碳的確都在2、3%，但是今年開始的壓力才大，因為我們的減碳要減到4、5%左右，所以我們會努力啦！","quality":0.843},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:42:14.667000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:42:34.026000+08:00","text":"再生能源就是屬於經濟部要做的工作，現在的確會遇到一些波動，但根據我與他們所做的討論，他們還在往譬如再生能源要達到20%、2030年要達到30%的目標前進，如果我們有這個顯著的目標，將來這個名次應該都還有機會再提升。","quality":0.837},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:42:36.810000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:42:50.260000+08:00","text":"是，我們當然希望在整體排名能夠提升的同時，在各方面、尤其是在指標方面，也不要有一部分落後太多，這樣才能表示我們是整體的進步，謝謝部長對這方面的說明。","quality":0.881},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:42:50.260000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T11:42:52.922000+08:00","text":"是，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:42:52.922000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:42:58.987000+08:00","text":"再來是醫療廢棄物去化與落實循環的部分，如何能夠提升再利用率？","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:42:59.107000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:43:13.140000+08:00","text":"我相信在雙法處理之後應該會逐步改善這種狀況，其實，無論是一般廢棄物或事業廢棄物，我們的去化量能都已經非常的緊繃，相對來講，大家可能要持續更努力。","quality":0.848},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:43:13.841000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:43:25.293000+08:00","text":"如何能夠提升再利用率以落實循環永續，尤其是在醫療廢棄物的部分，因為我本身是出自醫療單位，相對就會比較關心。","quality":0.898},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:43:26.915000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:43:47.338000+08:00","text":"整體而言，醫療廢棄物的占比其實並不多，只占了0.23%，但是，如果我們希望達到資源循環零廢棄的政策目標，不應該有任何一個部門被忽略，否則就無法真正地達標。","quality":0.836},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:43:47.438000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:14.102000+08:00","text":"我們也知道醫療廢棄物有其再利用上的一些困境，包括有感染的風險及針扎的危險等等，處理費用可能也相對比其他部門還要高一些，但是無論如何，基本上，環境部是整體廢棄物的主管機關，除了衛福部自己的努力之外，你們還是得擔負起這個制度的設計及政策引導的責任。","quality":0.728},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:17.525000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:26.531000+08:00","text":"部長，有3點要請教你，對於醫療廢棄物持續上升，而且有越來越多的趨勢，目前環境部有沒有具體因應的策略？","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:27.311000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:32.775000+08:00","text":"這個策略應該只是監測及管理而已，有沒有更好的政策工具？","quality":0.96},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:33.015000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:40.961000+08:00","text":"第二點，是否能針對醫療廢棄物訂定更明確的處理及再利用的準則，讓大家可以有所依據？","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:41.661000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:54.664000+08:00","text":"第三點，能不能考慮與衛福部合作，先訂定一些示範性的試辦計畫，可能要選定幾家醫院，未來大家可以有一個標竿學習的機會？","quality":0.615},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:54.904000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:57.105000+08:00","text":"針對以上三點，部長有沒有什麼樣的想法？","quality":0.647},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:57.385000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:44:58.925000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝王委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:44:59.185000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:45:07.427000+08:00","text":"我在星期天有遇到主管醫療廢棄物的劉玉萍劉司長，當時我們交換了一下意見，現在是不是能請副署長來回答？","quality":0.674},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:45:08.147000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:45:10.348000+08:00","text":"未來在法通過之後，我們會一起來主導。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:45:10.348000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:45:12.730000+08:00","text":"好，請副署長。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"許副署長智倫","start":"2026-04-22T11:45:12.730000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:45:43.335000+08:00","text":"簡要報告委員，我們有幾個作法，今年已經與醫事司開始合作，像是委員提到的減廢，第一個，我們與醫事司針對幾個項目，像是塑膠或常用的用品，不只是做平常的再利用而已，而是希望做高質化的循環，因此，醫療院所的人員可能就要知道更多的作法、心裡要有更大的信任感，所以我們會合作訂出一個指引，也就是委員剛才垂詢的部分，希望能讓大家更了解。","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"許副署長智倫","start":"2026-04-22T11:45:43.915000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:00.960000+08:00","text":"第二個，有一些再利用的部分，其實現在的再利用已經達到60%了，我們針對這個部分也一直持續與醫事司及醫療院所溝通，是否能夠滅菌消毒或是少用，這些都還在持續努力，現在的滅菌率已經達到26%了。","quality":0.747},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:03.100000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:08.024000+08:00","text":"好，看起來兩個部會也都積極在處理這個議題。","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:08.024000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:24.236000+08:00","text":"不過，我們在二年前也請教過貴部，關於輔導醫療機構的執行內容，到目前為止是否有比較好的執行方式，或是有沒有示範案例可以給我們參考？","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"許副署長智倫","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:26.458000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:46.298000+08:00","text":"報告委員，這兩年來在醫療部分是衛福部，其實部裡不只是循環署，針對空品及水汙染防治等等，我們部裡有一個綜合性的預設醫療推動方案，訂出不同類型的KPI。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"許副署長智倫","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:47.018000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:47.299000+08:00","text":"不好意思！","quality":1},{"speaker":"許副署長智倫","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:47.759000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:51.683000+08:00","text":"今天我沒有準備相關數據，是不是能另外再向委員報告？","quality":0.609},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:51.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:57.189000+08:00","text":"好，麻煩部裡再提供可以讓我們看的成果報告。","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:57.689000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:46:58.990000+08:00","text":"沒問題。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:46:58.990000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:47:34.002000+08:00","text":"最後一個是關於醫療機構的減碳政策，我們希望在2027年能夠完議整體的總量管制，碳交易於2028年就要開始實施，相信醫療機構也是一個重要的部分，雖然它的整體排放量占比只有0.9%，如果把醫療相關供應鏈合併計算則是4.4%，其實這個占比也是逐漸上升當中，因此要請教部長，針對綠色醫療跨部會政策，目前環境部的政策方向是否已經確定下來？","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:47:34.962000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:47:38.584000+08:00","text":"環境部是否可能協助醫院做節能的具體方案？","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:47:41.285000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:47:41.725000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:47:42.746000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:47:52.930000+08:00","text":"我們認為醫院首先要做的是節能，節能就可以幫醫院減少開支，醫院的財務負擔就不會那麼重，目前是長庚醫院做得最好。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:47:54.751000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:07.017000+08:00","text":"慈濟醫院經過我們的協助輔導、給予他們一些補助經費，再加上他們自己很努力，也加入了ESCO方案，所以慈濟整個醫療體系會是下一個。","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:07.157000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:17.165000+08:00","text":"至於其他的醫療院所，我們也都有參與，但是許多醫院或許有其他考慮，真的是比較慢，不過，我們也會再努力與每家醫院溝通。","quality":0.647},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:18.866000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:29.935000+08:00","text":"我們是提醒醫院要減碳、要知道自己的用電，從ESCO去做是最好的，不見得要馬上去計算碳量，只要把用電量節省下來，它的碳就會跟著減了。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:30.495000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:33.938000+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，我們會積極與他們一起努力。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:34.398000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:35.798000+08:00","text":"所以是有具體方案在執行？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:36.039000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:43.241000+08:00","text":"有，已經都在做了，但最後一哩路就是醫院願不願意真的跳下去做ESCO，有時候有些醫院真的不太願意。","quality":0.841},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:43.441000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:47.582000+08:00","text":"好，相關的具體方案也以書面報告提供給我們，好不好？好。","quality":0.609},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:48.202000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:48:48.462000+08:00","text":"一個月以內。好。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:48:50.563000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:49:08.431000+08:00","text":"經濟部能源署陳副署長也在現場，剛剛部長提到節能的部分非常重要，其實醫學中心為了讓整體環境及照護更為完整，用電方面真的是無法做有效的節能。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:49:08.951000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:49:42.379000+08:00","text":"在醫學中心所有的能源用電占了79%，其中空調占了55%、照明占了30%，因此，如何讓節能的管理重點發揮作用，必須由相關部會一起共同努力，這個部分如何透過經濟部能源署協助，進行一些節能的相關處理模式？","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:49:43.660000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:03.411000+08:00","text":"我們也了解經濟部是有一些補助的方案，最近四年發現在補助的醫院中，公立醫院占了一半左右，表示公私立其實都有這個需求，但整個量能好像並不是那麼足夠。","quality":0.851},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:04.091000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:27.429000+08:00","text":"114年度的補助案中有19件是屬於醫院部門，其中公立醫院只有6件，能不能麻煩經濟部這邊再多努力，包括未來經濟部與環境部及衛福部能否針對醫療機構提出一個專案式的方式，不是與其他的部門一起處理，而是針對醫療部門做單獨的處理，不知道你們的意見如何？","quality":0.787},{"speaker":"陳副署長崇憲","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:32.252000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:32.433000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳副署長崇憲","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:32.953000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:48.058000+08:00","text":"簡短向委員說明，目前經濟部有2個專案正在進行，從111年到今年大概已經補助了78家醫療院所做這方面的節能，每年大概可以節省0.9億度。","quality":0.891},{"speaker":"陳副署長崇憲","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:49.419000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:03.988000+08:00","text":"剛剛委員垂詢能否與其他部會訂定專案協助醫療院所進一步節能，我們會與衛福部等相關部會一起合作達到節能的效果，謝謝。","quality":0.811},{"speaker":"王委員正旭","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:04.108000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:07.870000+08:00","text":"好，我們期待很快就會有成果做為參考，謝謝。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:09.592000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:10.552000+08:00","text":"謝謝王正旭委員發言。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:10.792000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:10.973000+08:00","text":"接下來請張雅琳委員發言。","quality":0.455}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}