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主席我們先請數位部林部長請速發部林部長"},{"start":20.193,"end":47.654,"text":"部長早部長我想一開始先討論一下我們剛剛那個臨時提案的部分其實先問一下就是數位部認不認同之前當然剛剛在有在提案裡面有討論到這個是當年國發發了篇文章介紹各國政府在探討制服部門經營這個粉絲專業這種像社群平台的時候有幾個指標一個是基本資料社群廣度社群互動社群關係跟貼文營運等等這五個構面這樣子的一個概念你們書發部現在認不認同這樣子的一個分類"},{"start":52.297,"end":73.669,"text":"因為這個是基本上是認同的今天會提出來就是因為其實我覺得很多你們應該也有注意到很多民眾也講這件事情就是說其實政府的資訊政府各個單位各機關大家都有或是被要求要去有臉書的時候設立臉書有IG的時候設立IG然後有YOUTUBE的時候設立YOUTUBE"},{"start":74.269,"end":91.014,"text":"是所以每個單位至少可能一個最多可能四個到五個社群平台是它的資訊是非常的碎片化是所以對民眾的困擾是說我要找相關資料的時候我可能我不一定能夠馬上找到我要的資訊那對數位部的期待是說你們有沒有機會去解決這個問題因為其實我們"},{"start":93.039,"end":109.161,"text":"進來的公務人員大家經過高考普考進來之後特考進來之後他的本職專長理論上他應該是專注在所謂行政業務上面在各項法令解釋上面所以現在變成是各單位為了去應付說我要有這個社群媒體我要去要求我各單位"},{"start":110.262,"end":124.709,"text":"好一點的可能部裡面一個或是一個團隊那可憐一點的可能一個科一個處裡面一定要一個所謂的新進的人員去擔任所謂數位小編去擔任這個小編的工作就他跟他本來的這個工作的職能還是有一定程度的落差"},{"start":125.589,"end":151.401,"text":"更有錢的當然外包嘛去找行銷公司去處理等等那我問說其實數位部有沒有機會去做一個相關的整合把先把盤點一下各單位到底目前有多少的那種所謂的殭屍型的賬號或是沒有沒有根本沒有在互動的或他的他的這個點閱率非常低的這種做一個盤點包含去去做去做去做這樣的整合之後把維護的成本跟人力更集中去做管理你們願意做這個你們可以做"},{"start":152.441,"end":167.137,"text":"可以做這件事情嗎謝謝委員提醒我們會我們應該可以做這件事情那也跟委員報告事實上通常因為我是來自產業界通常產業界會有一些退場機制那就是有一些那個不好的產品或者是不好的那個"},{"start":168.218,"end":194.859,"text":"推展狀況不好的網頁都會退場那當然在行政我們在政府部門裡面這個機制就是說會有一些政治上的考量但是我也是認為說應該就像委員所講的有些其實已經關注程度不是那麼高什麼應該有一種退場的機制這樣子的話整個環境會比較健全而且對於我們政府單位的公務人員來講他的負擔也不會這麼重"},{"start":195.74,"end":218.281,"text":"好 謝謝部長 我想希望大家對數位部的期待 當你們成立的時候當然大家對你們有不同的想像 但是至少這個你們作為這個政府機關 這個政府龐大組織管理數位的這部分 應該是大家共同的期待所以我們希望說這部分還是由你們來整合啦 好不好是 謝謝部長留著 繼續我們請那個NCC的陳代理主委 一起過來討論這個事情喔"},{"start":220.629,"end":242.185,"text":"我想我們今天這個提出的修法幫電信管理法他們討論到這個衛星發展的問題預算或說各項這個組織單位到底我國這種衛星通訊這個產業發展到底是NCC管呢還是數位部管呢還是太空中心管還是其他單位在管到底誰在管你們兩位可以"},{"start":244.528,"end":262.86,"text":"NCC管制電信事業是提供一般民眾電信服務的衛星業者至於國內衛星的產業發展 比如說它的供應鏈或發射器材或相關的一些東西不在NCC的資產範圍內"},{"start":266.714,"end":291.548,"text":"我想委員主要的疑問應該是在於產業推動那產業推動分幾個部分第一個就是說台灣事實上在國際的這個衛星產業鏈裡面佔有非常重要地位很多的那個產業鏈都在台灣那這個部分因為只是提供那個零組件還有那個就是這些component這個是經濟部在管的那發展自己的衛星系統是由國科會的TASA"},{"start":292.188,"end":306.142,"text":"就是太空中心那邊主管的但是韌性在使用上面等於說速發部這邊負責的主要是要透過使用這些產品來加強台灣的韌性其實是這樣你可以看一下我們先"},{"start":307.363,"end":333.203,"text":"不管我們看旁邊兩個日本跟韓國日本當然他們自己是由首相親自擔任宇宙開發戰略本部的部長去做相關的整合工作那韓國呢是開個CASA宇宙航空廳把過去不同的單位做一個整合因為韓國其實跟我們很像韓國以前當然也是分散在各部會裡面有像有一個像NCC的單位有一個像說服單位那現在把它整合起來成為同一個單位那未來我國的這個衛星所謂的衛星發展不管是要"},{"start":333.883,"end":355.029,"text":"先待會討論修法的問題但是在這個發展衛星發展的過程裡面有沒有可能做一個整合的一個部會出來還是有一個主責單位因為現在就像剛剛部長所回應的嘛包含主委提到了嘛現在等於這件事情就衛星產業或是所謂太空產業這個事情它事實上在各單位裡面是那包含說預算的部分分配"},{"start":357.179,"end":382.125,"text":"有研發有應用的監理補助的部分可以跟TASA申請像數化部也可以申請經濟部也可以申請產業升級那管理的時候又是NCC在管理然後再來是驗證的時候TASA要求的是活動安全那數化部要求的是數位認証跟治安NCC要求的是電磁干擾跟通訊品質所以這個產業在發展的過程裡面他要去驗證他要去申請他跑行政流程的時候他必須跟各單位"},{"start":382.825,"end":400.315,"text":"去討論去磨合然後這個事情會造成什麼結果這個事情造成我們產業的發展一定會比別人慢一點點吧因為我要先比如說我可能先看數位部先看ACC的電信管理法我符不符合電信管理法我符合之後來跟數位部討論數位部討論OK之後去找經濟部討論"},{"start":402.876,"end":413.378,"text":"所以在整個流程裡面我們的這個產業就會比別人落後一點所以說在這個整合的工作上面有沒有機會未來不管是數位部或NCC到底誰可以做一個主管的機關"},{"start":414.854,"end":435.808,"text":"跟委員報告,了解委員所關切的這個事情但是我們也必須說,因為台灣的產業的特性就是做水平的分工全世界只有少數,應該就只有一家就是STARLINK它自己發展衛星,而且自己發射衛星其他的大部分的公司,像說"},{"start":436.949,"end":461.442,"text":"Amazon Leo 他在發射衛星的時候也是找那個 SpaceX就是那個 Starlink 的母公司去發射的那在台灣的話這個分工會非常的細譬如說一座那個印刷電路板的做那個 module 的那基本上台灣大概都是在做這種比較是分工的這個狀況那台灣自己到目前為止並沒有那個專業的衛星發射的公司"},{"start":462.903,"end":480.956,"text":"確實就是說這就是我剛剛提到因為我今天如果假設今天有人想要做今天如果Elon Musk如果在台灣他搞不好也做不出Starlink了啦是我們講從預算來看這個現象就是說今天數位部你也編了3878萬要進行這個國際衛星服務上央落地的這個先期研究"},{"start":481.756,"end":507.853,"text":"那NCC呢也編了830萬說要做這個衛星通訊新網路形態的監理政策就是說不管是NCC也好 SWIFT也好大家都希望說去研究怎麼樣讓這些所謂的國際上的這個衛星能夠落地但實際上發生的就是大家都編了預算也都希望做這個事情但實務上發展的就是實務上就是現階段大家要用所謂的衛星呢它必須透過中華電信然後現在也只有one web可以正常來使用"},{"start":508.573,"end":531.463,"text":"它沒有辦法像我們剛剛包含說其他委員包含軍線委員和其他委員展示的你去日本或去國外你去Costco你去路邊的商店你就可以直接買到衛星接收設備它可以自己來使用就是台灣什麼時候今天我們提這個所謂電信管理法的修法我們的終極目標或它的期待就是希望說回到電信管理法本身電信管理法第一條你本身就是要鼓勵說"},{"start":533.244,"end":556.961,"text":"這個更開放多元的通訊更多的這個競爭的機制讓這個通訊能夠更加自由可是回到我們今天要所謂修的電信管理法第36條本身就是因為它有很多的限制導致這件事情不會發生我想問一下主委到底現在NC的態度因為你剛剛在回覆其他委員的時候一直跟我 我一直聽我在那邊一直提到一件事情是說你覺得現在不修法我們也可以做到"},{"start":557.822,"end":575.721,"text":"修法後本來期待的結果所以沒有修法的必要性目前是這個這樣子的政策的發展就是現行的條文36條不修正其實葉子願意來的話其實都不是問題因為其他one way都已經落地了那從"},{"start":579.125,"end":596.36,"text":"我們講的個案上的那家公司他雖然在過去數次對外表示說是我們的法規造成他的障礙但是我們在跟美方正式官方的討論像這次討論在ART的時候其實美方沒有這個需求這次公務員報告是確定的"},{"start":599.096,"end":622.1,"text":"主委有時候我覺得我們對話是要同一個頻率啦美方不一定有這個需求當然他市場很大他不一定要我這個市場我說美方沒有對台灣反映說你台灣這方面的法規有調適的需求來我們來問一下請問一下數位部部長如果今天你去跟Starlink談他現在是如果他如果他如果今天Elon Musk如果突然突然認為說他想要進台灣市場他就可以進來了嗎"},{"start":623.378,"end":647.28,"text":"事實上這個事情是這個答案是部分因為照理說他只要雙看他要不要讓步如果讓步依照現有的法規他那個股權不要超過50%的話他就可以進來可是他們就是很堅持就是說他們希望佔多數的股權那事實上之前我們台灣政府跟那個STAR LINK談判就卡在這個地方所以我們現在就是我們"},{"start":648.181,"end":669.138,"text":"現在也去詢問說STARLINK你到底如果說我們那個法律那個就是可以討論的話可以談的話你有沒有興趣結果那個STARLINK現在給我們的答案事實上是那個也算是蠻特別的他就說因為台灣的那個四G跟五G的人口覆蓋率已經超過百分之九九這張是我們討論過然後其他委員也跟你講過這個相關數據"},{"start":670.959,"end":695.107,"text":"但在你們的報告裡面也提到說 包含日本 韓國 荷蘭 菲律賓 越南也都是 他們也都有相關的限制 但他們同時已經開放跟可以使用了那到底 其實核心的問題就是說 那如果別的國家他們能夠做到在相關法律限制 也符合他們的條件 他們也有國安問題啊你說日本沒有國安問題嗎 他們當然也有國安問題啊 大家這麼近所以說 在這個限制同樣的情境之下 他們到底怎麼去做到開放 讓民眾"},{"start":696.167,"end":714.839,"text":"一般民眾他想用的時候他可以這個自由的選擇他需要的他一樣當然可以選擇local可以選擇本地電信沒問題但他如果今天他比如說住在偏鄉或他今天出國他要出外他能夠找他可以自己去買到這個設備那在家裡可以使用或是出國可以使用這樣子的情境在台灣什麼時候才會發生"},{"start":715.399,"end":731.156,"text":"所以這邊跟趙偉補充就是就以韓國好了韓國他能夠落地其實都是出籌碼交換或者前提的一些確保韓國用什麼來交換FTA日本用什麼交換"},{"start":732.503,"end":756.872,"text":"他在日本有落地Gateway歐洲國家外資全部開掉用什麼來交換用GDPR確保下的一些Gateway也是當地落地以上簡單補充因為Gateway跟本國業者參與其實是互為這個互補的可以讓這個國安的一些國安的確保還有通訊監察治安的部分可以達到實打實的一些掌握"},{"start":757.372,"end":775.04,"text":"好 主委這個部分我們希望說我們修法我們努力往這個方向來推動啦但是行政上面你要怎麼去談判或說你們覺得需要什麼條件我覺得在後續修法的過程裡面我們希望能夠好好的來討論終極的目標說這最後的一個結果我們還是希望說台灣的這個"},{"start":776.721,"end":793.15,"text":"通訊市場台灣的這個通訊自由或通訊品質能夠做到至少像國外這樣但是看到我可以自由的交易而不是說現在收到很多法規限制所以導致沒辦法使用這是我們提這個修法最初的這個初衷希望大家能夠支持以上好不好謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:45.008000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:45.148000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:45.348000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:48.132000+08:00","text":"主席，先請數發部林部長。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:48.132000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:48.732000+08:00","text":"請數發部林部長。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:48.732000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:59.193000+08:00","text":"召委您好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:59.193000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:50:59.293000+08:00","text":"部長早。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:50:59.613000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:05.217000+08:00","text":"部長，我想先討論一下剛剛臨時提案的部分，先問一下，數發部認不認同？","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:06.718000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:26.293000+08:00","text":"剛剛在提案裡面有討論到，當年國發會發了一篇文章，介紹各國政府探討政府部門經營粉絲專頁這種社群平台的時候有幾個指標，分別是基本資料、社群廣度、社群互動、社群關係和貼文營運等五個構面，這樣的分類概念，數發部現在認不認同？","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:32.677000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:33.478000+08:00","text":"基本上是認同的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:33.818000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:39.681000+08:00","text":"今天會特別提出來，我想你們應該也有注意到，因為很多民眾也在講這件事情。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:40.002000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:51:53.269000+08:00","text":"其實政府的資訊，政府各個單位、各機關都有做，或是被要求去做，有臉書的時候設立臉書，有IG的時候設立IG，有Threads的時候設立Threads，然後有YouTube的時候設立YouTube。是。","quality":0.64},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:51:53.589000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:52:06.213000+08:00","text":"所以每個單位可能至少有一個，最多可能有四個到五個社群平台，導致資訊非常碎片化，也造成民眾的困擾，因為要找相關資料的時候，不一定能夠馬上找到想要的資訊。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:52:06.353000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:52:09.774000+08:00","text":"我們對數發部的期待是，你們有沒有機會去解決這個問題？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:52:09.774000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:52:21.452000+08:00","text":"因為公務人員經過高考、普考或特考進來之後，他的本職專長理論上應該專注在所謂的行政業務上面及在各項法令解釋上面。","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:52:22.113000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:52:45.670000+08:00","text":"可是現在各單位為了應付要有社群媒體的要求，好一點的，可能是部裡面有一個人或是一個團隊處理，可憐一點的，可能是一個科、一個處裡面，一定要一個所謂的新進人員去擔任數位小編的工作，這和他本來的工作職能有一定程度的落差，更有錢的當然是外包嘛！","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:52:46.010000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:52:47.250000+08:00","text":"找行銷公司處理等等。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:52:48.111000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:52:50.452000+08:00","text":"我想問的是，數發部有沒有機會去做相關的整合？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:52:51.272000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:53:09.380000+08:00","text":"先盤點一下各單位目前到底有多少所謂的殭屍型帳號，或是根本沒有在互動的，或是點閱率非常低的，全部做一個盤點，做了這樣的整合之後，把維護的成本和人力集中管理。","quality":0.887},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:53:09.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:53:13.063000+08:00","text":"你們可以做這件事情嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:53:13.063000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:53:15.986000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員提醒，我們應該可以做這件事情。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:53:17.047000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:53:29.359000+08:00","text":"也跟委員報告，因為我來自於產業界，通常產業界會有一些退場機制，就是一些不好的產品，或者推展狀況不好的網頁都會退場。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:53:29.680000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:53:53.839000+08:00","text":"當然，在政府部門裡面，這個機制會有一些政治上的考量，但是我認為應該就像委員所講的，有一些關注程度不是那麼高的，應該有退場的機制，這樣的話，整個環境會比較健全，而且對於政府單位的公務人員來講，他的負擔也不會這麼重。","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:53:54.740000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:53:55.361000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:53:56.061000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:11.716000+08:00","text":"大家對數發部有所期待，當年你們成立的時候，雖然大家對你們有不同的想像，但是你們做為政府機關，管理政府這個龐大組織的數位部分，應該是大家共同的期待，所以我們希望這部分還是由你們來整合，好不好？","quality":0.874},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:12.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:12.957000+08:00","text":"是，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:12.957000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:17.161000+08:00","text":"部長留著，繼續請NCC陳代理主委一起討論這個事情。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:19.629000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:33.559000+08:00","text":"我想我們今天提出修法，關於電信管理法，討論到衛星發展的問題，還有預算或是各項的主責單位，我國衛星通訊的產業發展到底是NCC管呢？","quality":0.847},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:34.360000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:35.160000+08:00","text":"還是數發部管呢？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:35.901000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:37.082000+08:00","text":"還是太空中心管？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:37.962000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:38.923000+08:00","text":"還是其他單位管？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:39.143000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:39.563000+08:00","text":"到底誰來管？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:40.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:54:41.165000+08:00","text":"你們兩位可以回應一下吧？","quality":0.545},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T11:54:43.528000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:55:01.860000+08:00","text":"先向召委報告一下，NCC管的電信事業，是提供一般民眾電信服務的衛星業者，至於國內的衛星產業發展，比方它的供應鏈或者發射器材，或者相關的一些東西，尚不在NCC的職掌範圍內。","quality":0.795},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:55:05.714000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:55:26.666000+08:00","text":"我想委員主要的疑問應該是在於產業推動，產業推動分幾個部分，第一個，事實上臺灣在國際的衛星產業鏈裡面占有非常重要的地位，很多產業鏈都在臺灣，這個部分因為只是提供零組件，還有component，這是經濟部在管的。","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:55:27.826000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:55:32.489000+08:00","text":"發展自己的衛星系統是由國科會的TASA，就是太空中心主管。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:55:34.391000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:55:42.479000+08:00","text":"但是韌性的部分，就是在使用上面，數發部這邊負責的，主要是透過使用這些產品來加強臺灣的韌性。","quality":0.854},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:55:46.663000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:55:54.209000+08:00","text":"我們看旁邊的日本和韓國，日本他們是由首相親自擔任宇宙開發戰略本部的部長，做相關的整合工作。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:55:55.110000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:55:59.413000+08:00","text":"韓國是KASA宇宙航空廳，把過去的不同單位做一個整合。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:00.193000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:08.240000+08:00","text":"其實韓國和我們很像，韓國以前也是分散在各部會裡面，有一個像NCC的單位，有一個像數發部的單位，現在把它整合起來成為同一個單位。","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:08.800000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:20.805000+08:00","text":"未來我國所謂的衛星發展，當然要討論修法的問題，但是在衛星發展的過程裡面，有沒有可能由一個部會整合？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:22.246000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:23.106000+08:00","text":"還是有一個主責單位？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:23.266000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:32.228000+08:00","text":"因為現在就像剛剛部長所回應的，包含主委也提到了，現在衛星產業或是所謂的太空產業是四散在各單位裡面。是。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:32.729000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:43.301000+08:00","text":"包含預算部分的分配，有研發、有應用、有監理，補助的部分可以向TASA申請，好像數發部也可以申請，經濟部也可以申請產業升級。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:43.481000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:44.801000+08:00","text":"管理的時候，又是NCC在管理。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:45.681000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:56:53.923000+08:00","text":"再來是驗證的時候，TASA要求的是活動安全，數發部要求的是數位韌性和資安，NCC要求的是電磁干擾和通訊品質。","quality":0.88},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:56:53.923000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:05.767000+08:00","text":"所以這個產業在發展的過程中，它要去驗證、要去申請，要跑行政流程的時候，必須和各單位討論、磨合，這個事情會造成什麼結果？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:06.808000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:09.269000+08:00","text":"當然會造成我們產業的發展比別人慢一點點嘛！","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:10.570000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:16.133000+08:00","text":"比如可能要先看NCC的電信管理法，符不符合電信管理法？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:16.753000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:25.945000+08:00","text":"符合之後再和數發部討論，和數發部討論OK之後，再去找經濟部討論，走完整個流程，我們這個產業就會比別人落後一點。","quality":0.84},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:25.945000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:27.207000+08:00","text":"所以未來有沒有機會做整合的工作？","quality":0.467},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:29.191000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:32.378000+08:00","text":"不管是數發部或NCC，到底誰可以做主管機關？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:35.075000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:44.081000+08:00","text":"我們了解委員所關切的事情，但是我們也必須說，因為臺灣的產業特性就是做水平分工。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:46.203000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:57:51.826000+08:00","text":"全世界只有少數，應該只有一家，就是Starlink，它自己發展衛星，而且自己發射衛星。","quality":0.816},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:57:52.687000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:58:02.072000+08:00","text":"其他大部分的公司，像Amazon Leo，他們發射衛星的時候也是找SpaceX，就是Starlink的母公司去發射。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T11:58:02.613000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:58:21.903000+08:00","text":"在臺灣，這個分工非常細，比如做印刷電路板的、做module的，基本上臺灣大概都是在做這種，比較是分工的狀況，臺灣到目前為止並沒有專業的衛星發射公司。確實。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:58:22.364000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:58:29.068000+08:00","text":"這就是我剛才提到的，今天Elon Musk如果在臺灣，他搞不好也成立不了Starlink啦！","quality":0.881},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:58:29.869000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:58:47.180000+08:00","text":"我們從預算來看這個現象，今天數發部編列3,878萬元要進行國際衛星服務商用落地的先期研究，NCC也編列830萬元要做衛星通訊新網路形態的監理政策。","quality":0.873},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:58:48.181000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:06.833000+08:00","text":"不管是NCC也好，數發部也好，大家都希望去研究怎麼讓國際上的衛星能夠落地，大家都編了預算，也都希望做這個事情，但實務上，就是現階段大家要用衛星必須透過中華電信，現在也只有OneWeb可以正常使用。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:59:07.573000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:19.438000+08:00","text":"它沒有辦法像剛剛其他委員，包括俊憲委員和其他委員展示的，你去日本或是去國外，去Costco或是路邊的商店就可以直接買到衛星接收設備自己使用。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:59:21.259000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:27.321000+08:00","text":"其實我們提電信管理法的修法，終極目標或是期待就是希望回到電信管理法本身嘛！","quality":0.886},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:59:28.362000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:37.668000+08:00","text":"電信管理法第一條就是鼓勵開放多元的通訊，有更多的競爭機制，讓通訊能夠更加自由。","quality":0.972},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:59:38.228000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:44.553000+08:00","text":"可是回到我們今天要修的電信管理法第三十六條，就是因為它有很多限制，導致這件事情不會發生。","quality":0.927},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:59:45.854000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:48.256000+08:00","text":"我想問一下主委，到底現在NCC的態度是什麼？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T11:59:48.876000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T11:59:59.845000+08:00","text":"因為你剛剛回復其他委員的時候，我一直聽到一件事情，就是你覺得現在不修法，我們也可以做到修法後期待的結果，所以沒有修法的必要性。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:01.848000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:04.430000+08:00","text":"目前NCC是不是這樣的政策發展？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:04.771000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:14.061000+08:00","text":"就是現行的第三十六條條文不修正，只要業者願意來的話，其實都不是問題，因為像OneWeb都已經落地了。","quality":0.696},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:18.125000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:35.340000+08:00","text":"我們講的個案公司，雖然過去數次對外表示，是我們的法規造成他們的障礙，但是我們在和美方做正式的官方討論時，像這次討論ART的時候，其實美方沒有這個需求，這是確定的。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:38.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:41.840000+08:00","text":"主委，我覺得我們對話的時候要在同一個頻率啦！","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:42.541000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:43.301000+08:00","text":"美方不一定有這些需求？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:43.562000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:45.664000+08:00","text":"當然，因為他們的市場很大，不一定要我們這個市場。","quality":0.762},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:45.664000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:00:50.649000+08:00","text":"我是說美方沒有向臺灣反映，臺灣這方面的法規有調適的需求。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:00:51.770000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:01.100000+08:00","text":"請問一下數發部，部長，如果今天你們去和Starlink談，假設今天Elon Musk突然想要進臺灣市場，他就可以進來嗎？","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:02.378000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:14.810000+08:00","text":"事實上這個答案是部分，因為照理說要看他是否讓步，他們如果讓步，依照現有的法規，股權不要超過50%的話，他們就可以進來。","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:14.810000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:23.678000+08:00","text":"可是他們很堅持，希望占多數的股權，事實上之前臺灣政府和Starlink的談判就卡在這個地方。","quality":0.767},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:24.259000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:35.268000+08:00","text":"所以我們現在也去詢問Starlink，如果我們的法律可以討論、可以談的話，你們有沒有興趣？","quality":0.78},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:36.028000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:45.035000+08:00","text":"結果Starlink現在給我們的答案，事實上也算滿特別的，他們說因為臺灣4G和5G的人口覆蓋率已經超過99%……","quality":0.771},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:46.296000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:48.138000+08:00","text":"部長，這上次我們討論過，其他委員也跟你講過相關數據了。是。","quality":0.76},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:50.099000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:01:56.841000+08:00","text":"在你們的報告裡面也有提到，包含日本、韓國、荷蘭、菲律賓、越南，他們也都有相關的限制，但他們同時已經開放可以使用了。","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:01:58.202000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:06.204000+08:00","text":"其實核心的問題是，如果別的國家能夠做到，相關法令限制也符合他們的條件，他們也有國安問題，你說日本沒有國安問題嗎？","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:06.204000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:08.065000+08:00","text":"他們當然也有國安問題，大家距離這麼近。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:08.765000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:18.589000+08:00","text":"所以這個限制在同樣的情境之下，他們到底是怎麼做到開放，讓一般民眾想用的時候可以自由選擇需要的？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:18.969000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:21.411000+08:00","text":"他一樣可以選擇local的本地電信，沒問題。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:22.312000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:33.819000+08:00","text":"如果今天他住在偏鄉，或是出國，自己就可以買到設備在家裡使用，或是出國可以使用，這樣的情境，臺灣什麼時候才會發生？","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:35.660000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:46.052000+08:00","text":"向召委補充，以韓國來說好了，韓國能夠落地，其實都是出籌碼交換，或者是有前提的確保。","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:46.913000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:48.014000+08:00","text":"韓國用什麼交換？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:48.014000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:48.514000+08:00","text":"FTA。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:49.536000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:50.156000+08:00","text":"日本用什麼交換？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:51.723000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:53.824000+08:00","text":"它在日本有落地gateway。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:54.104000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:02:57.325000+08:00","text":"歐洲國家外資全部開放，用什麼交換？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:02:57.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:03.087000+08:00","text":"用GDPR確保一些gateway，也是當地落地，以上簡單補充。","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:03.187000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:15.852000+08:00","text":"因為gateway和本國業者參與其實是互補的，可以讓國安得以確保，通訊監察、資安的部分也可以達到實打實的掌握。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:16.372000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:23.696000+08:00","text":"好，主委，這部分我們希望修法努力往這個方向推動，但是行政上面，你們要怎麼去談判？","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:24.216000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:25.316000+08:00","text":"或是你們覺得需要什麼條件？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:25.877000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:30.299000+08:00","text":"後續修法的過程，我們希望能夠好好的討論。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:30.299000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:51.570000+08:00","text":"終極的目標，就是最後的結果，我們還是希望臺灣的通訊市場，臺灣的通訊自由或通訊品質至少能夠像國外可以自由交易，而不是像現在這樣受到很多法規的限制，導致沒辦法使用，這是我們提修法最初的初衷，希望大家能夠支持，以上。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"黃委員健豪","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:52.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:52.150000+08:00","text":"好不好？謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳代理主任委員崇樹","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:52.650000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:53.792857+08:00","text":"謝謝召委。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林部長宜敬","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:54.092857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:56.664286+08:00","text":"謝謝召委的支持，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:56.964286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T12:03:58.964286+08:00","text":"謝謝黃健豪召委。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（黃委員健豪）","start":"2026-04-22T12:03:59.264286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-22T12:04:02.407143+08:00","text":"接下來請葛如鈞委員發言。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}