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謝謝主席今天安排電信管理法第36條的詢問我們一起來關心台灣的國家通訊網路韌性的問題首先我們有請這個NCC的陳代理主委好 我們請陳代理主委"},{"start":35.407,"end":58.302,"text":"本席先前曾在上個會期總質詢的時候關心行政院所屬的各個部會對於通訊任性的立場不一致的問題直到目前為止NCC主管的電信管理法第36條還是有您剛剛提到的限制設置使用電信資源的公共電信網路者董事長要由中華民國國籍設置使用電信資源的業者"},{"start":59.122,"end":73.816,"text":"外國人直接持股總數不得超過49%直接及間接持股總數不得超過60%因此很多的外國衛星公司無法直接向台灣提供服務我覺得我們文字要清楚"},{"start":75.338,"end":90.87,"text":"可以來啊八成公司的架構可能可以來啊然後我透過誰來怎麼樣怎麼樣繞兩圈繞三圈我覺得這個我們都不是這樣因為各國已經都做給我們看了我們是最需要網路的國家我想大家都非常的清楚"},{"start":91.77,"end":107.029,"text":"即便這個速發布一直提到說強化國家認訊為政策目標數位認訊 通訊認訊但受限於這樣的一個法規其實台灣距離建構多元通訊網路真的還有很長的距離那我們今天"},{"start":107.91,"end":135.105,"text":"看見NCC審查報告我們看見一位英雄本席要感到非常欣慰為什麼呢因為感謝主委支持我們真正的通訊韌性的強化跟發展我們在法律修正案草擬的過程當中我們也不諱言有多次跟NCC的業務單位來進行溝通得到很多建議那NCC您在報告裡面就有提到如果要放寬電信管理法第36條設置使用電信資源之公眾電信網路者的董事長"},{"start":136.245,"end":151.71,"text":"國籍和外國人持股比例限制就放寬標準放寬範圍應具體明確這一點本席完全同意本席的修法版本本來就是要賦予主管機關專案核准的權限尊重專業嘛"},{"start":152.89,"end":177.492,"text":"如果NCC要以執法來明定董事長的國籍或外國人持股比例的放寬標準或放寬的範圍或者專案的條件本席表示支持那我們再次要謝謝主委在任內勇於承擔讓台灣的國家通訊認證信真的是要朝向正面積極那我也希望主委請回我這給您鼓勵因為您展現了這樣的一個方向"},{"start":177.992,"end":183.801,"text":"那我相信我們看得到出口那我們先請這個接下來請速發部林益晉部長"},{"start":192.486,"end":209.755,"text":"委員好部長好本席聽了4月8號速發部的業務報告的質詢部長當時答覆我們黃建豪召委的質詢提到對速發部對政府來說台灣有越多衛星通訊的選擇越好是這非常的棒是那對於部長的立場本席相當認同"},{"start":210.816,"end":231.658,"text":"有越多越大範圍的通信越好你說4G 5G還是有3G收救的問題還是有偏鄉的問題還是有緊急狀況的問題我想本席很認同您的整體概念這其實也是本席和黃建豪召委共同提出個別提出電信管理法第36條修法的目的台灣位處真的很重要的戰略位置"},{"start":232.279,"end":254.31,"text":"沒有網路我們沒有辦法經營商業沒有網路無人機很可能在緊急狀況也沒有辦法操控我們沒有辦法理解前線的戰事維持國家的通訊人心真的至關重要我就要問部長正當現在Right this moment本席在質詢部長您的時候部長知道負責我們國家國際和國內通訊的25條海欄當中有幾條是斷線或部分斷線的狀態嗎Right this moment"},{"start":258.691,"end":278.298,"text":"網友都很關心你應該要記在心中吧我沒有連線我那個腦子沒有連那個internet所以這個可能要查APP我們是不是請那個任信司司長好 那任信司司長趕快回答25條裡面現在有哪幾條有幾條是斷線或部分斷線報委員這應該每天每分鐘都要關心的嘛編那麼多預算來 多少"},{"start":278.778,"end":299.971,"text":"基本上國際海嵐總共是15條國內海嵐是10條所以跟你們報告那昨天我看到資料是7條海嵐現在有故障那其中一個故障的地方是很偏遠在馬來西亞那一段更不在台灣這一段但是我們還是把它統計出來沒關係啦 斷網率多少%28%啦其中斷線最久的多少時間你知道嗎"},{"start":301.232,"end":320.924,"text":"包委員 兩百四十四天包委員 我們平均在沒關係啊 你不要說什麼我們海嵐怎麼樣28%的海嵐是有問題的然後你說有的很遠我們沒辦法處理沒關係 韌性很重要嘛國防部印製的小局書就講了大規模的網路癱瘓多數海嵐遭破壞 這非常危險"},{"start":321.744,"end":349.753,"text":"台灣在非戰時期我們就已經有28%的海瀾網路那如果緊急狀態不是更可怕嗎我想速發部主責的通訊人員不是要讓我們遇到這樣的狀況嗎跟委員說明一下那個的確這個我們非常關心但是所謂的那個28%有故障所謂故障並不是全段很多海瀾因為海瀾你們每一條海瀾裡面都有很多條心不好意思部長我沒有提問啦你不用在這裡替海瀾全段那怎麼樣半段90分段"},{"start":350.913,"end":371.725,"text":"99分段我們都不要派船那你們預算要不要再重新來討論一下我想不是文字遊戲好不好我想我們有共同的意識把台灣阻礙國際的衛星業者提供服務的法規限制拿掉讓台灣在通訊更多元更廣冒這有其必要性我是在找我們的共通性"},{"start":372.885,"end":399.162,"text":"非常同意謝謝委員理解我會給你時間就給你時間因為我這個時間很有限那部長本席真的要再次強調衛星通訊服務的市場本來就是一個雙向的選擇我們今天要先把法規的門打開我們不能說美國要叫我們修美國對我們法規有沒有意見我們怎麼可以叫美國對我們的法規有意見呢如果真的有這樣的會議提供資料但沒有關係我想我們是有共識的"},{"start":399.642,"end":417.263,"text":"提高國外衛星通訊服務來台的意願這一點本來就是我們的責任增加台灣衛星通訊選擇的多元性對於強化台灣的通訊韌性有正面積極的幫助尤其剛剛提到的一些廠商像STARLINK已經開始運行二代衛星"},{"start":418.124,"end":444.943,"text":"這是目前最先進的通訊網路裡面一定也很多台灣的晶片結果呢 我們目前您提到的一些簽約的衛星服務商沒有辦法採用 也還沒採用我們不應該 也不能用法規來限制住國人使用最新衛星通訊科技的權利我們希望朝野共同支持啦我們剛剛也感謝非常多的委員也都共同跨黨派來支持所以也希望部長 我相信我們一起來具體認識一起來往前 可以嗎"},{"start":445.703,"end":469.569,"text":"非常感謝委員長那我想接下來還有一個細節因為這個影響到民眾的權益加一點點時間就是說部長我要來跟你討論速發布的打詐業務本席FB帳號就在前幾天被詐騙集團仿造了一個1比1的帳號來進行詐騙假帳號一字不漏的轉貼我發布的文章極可亂真主動就發邀請給我的朋友還邀請他們加入"},{"start":470.289,"end":489.158,"text":"這個我啦 這個假的我啦所創立的LINE投資群組還要先謝謝他一直支持我的法案耶說話一起建立富裕的社會免費加入投資群組然後呢 我趕快高速的飛奔到一個地方叫做打炸通茶網 為什麼"},{"start":490.339,"end":506.866,"text":"我們也花了預算結果我有用手機認證才能投案對不對其實你知道我是誰結果完成通報程序以後啪一聲在0.1毫秒的情況之下運作非常順暢的跳出這是低風險的案件還強調會優先處理高風險案件"},{"start":510.368,"end":522.764,"text":"請中低風險案件要耐心等候每一分每一秒我的朋友都在收到這些詐騙訊息叫他要去加入部長本席當時非常確定自己遭到詐騙集團假設帳號結果訴發部的通報啊卻判定低風險案件請問訴發部"},{"start":526.849,"end":548.56,"text":"通報的標準是什麼跟委員解釋一下因為這個也是之前有那個立法委員要求我們就是說必須利用AI的技術進行出判有要求很好啊因為這個是AI進行出判那依照我們的系統就是說接下來就會應該跟那個委員的辦公室聯絡然後只要委員這邊那個確定以後那我們後續就可以馬上處理了"},{"start":549.801,"end":573.682,"text":"您回去聽一下你的直播啦我想黃仁勳被騙要打給黃仁勳葛如君被騙要打給葛如君我都已經報案者是本人我已經提供我的手機了我甚至已經知道你是我知道我是誰了我想這裡有精進的空間AI模型不要自己立刻亂用完全同意AI模型有精進的空間不事情就算了還告訴民眾詐騙案件是屬於低風險"},{"start":574.262,"end":591.602,"text":"沒有這個就是AI我原講的完全沒錯就是因為AI的模型的判斷一定會有一些誤差所以我們還是需要人工來判斷這一點是我們都同意的會做事的人找辦法不會做事的人找理由找理由就說AI有問題完全同意我想不是這樣我們現在耐心處理"},{"start":592.663,"end":611.954,"text":"那結果現在如果很多人都遇到這樣的問題持續的造成損失我的朋友說不定都加入這些群組啊只要委員趕快回覆說這個是真的是詐騙那這個就是我已經報案了我已經報了什麼叫做我回覆你仔細說清楚什麼叫做我回覆你這個APP還有額外回覆功能嗎"},{"start":613.359,"end":642.285,"text":"就是有人報案以後我們會跟那個當事人做確認嘛對不對那如果是這樣的話那會後我們再把那個委員再加入我先跟部長講啦沒有什麼回不回覆所以這個AI要提升好不好所以我們跟部長是完全同意我也是這個意思本席被創立假帳號的案件因為向訴發部求助無效啦我沒有無效啦我現在你現在跟我求助我現在馬上就處理我是國會議員我可以在這裡向你求助"},{"start":642.665,"end":650.591,"text":"台灣千千百百萬個受到這個問題的人怎麼辦網站通報查詢網就被你弄到低風險不要再玩文字遊戲了每一分每一秒上三月份的詐騙金額是多少一個月詐騙金額是多少你有沒有刻在心裡嘛"},{"start":664.758,"end":689.205,"text":"有沒有刻在心裡49億台幣啊對 因為整個一點多隻獨角獸每一個月所以不要在這裡玩我們已經討論了將近兩年了對嘛 那有沒有改進當然有改進啊這個我之前有報告有報告啦沒有關係 我再問請教部長你認為政府官網上是不是應該存在下列內容色情文字與圖片 彰化"},{"start":691.345,"end":706.957,"text":"詐騙集團的LINE ID廣告文件文字民眾被盜的身份證民眾的個資這些應不應該出現應不應該出現不應該出現是很遺憾喔部長我們從第一天來到這裡跟您講"},{"start":708.39,"end":723.398,"text":"網詐通查網要好好的請部長通查一下這是網詐通查網的圖片我不好意思唸出來啦你要不要唸出來網詐通查政府部門的官方網站喔這是不是掛在Moda的官網底下是不是"},{"start":724.485,"end":733.389,"text":"部長回答是不是跟委員報告一下網站通報查詢網的網頁是不是在部會的官網底下是還是不是這個是網站通報查詢網的網頁內容沒有錯啊對嘛所以你要不要"},{"start":743.593,"end":763.624,"text":"我們不要念字了啦 這個字有點小啦因為在這個會席有其他委員跟部門的問題就是說為什麼我們把這個訊息 提醒民眾知道說有這個風險不堪入目的文字 我真的不好意思念出來字有點小 我這不念出來啦 大家看網路的直播啦"},{"start":764.864,"end":792.733,"text":"LINE ID詐騙集團LINE ID在剛剛網站上對還是不對我們就是告訴我們這個網頁的目的就是要告訴民眾這是不對的這是詐騙那幹嘛要秀出ID我們就要告訴人家說這個ID是有問題的啊不然呢那我剛剛已經問您了嘛那好啊那把詐騙集團的廣告文字全部放上來廣告詐騙集團的資料好那各自呢各自呢"},{"start":793.874,"end":800.702,"text":"假冒民眾的身份證 各自所以不要 真的不要再這個我想我們是一模一樣"},{"start":802.284,"end":824.221,"text":"我們還把他各自的人全部都在網站通查網該打蒙的圖面就打蒙該去除的文字內容就去除我已經講了 您剛剛也講了我現在講的所有內容我都是一年前都提出過模糊處理很難嗎 有沒有這個技術這需要AI嗎"},{"start":827.247,"end":838.961,"text":"不需要嘛所以沒關係啦維持網路安全的環境我們一起由速發部做起所以部長您剛剛也同你承諾打炸通茶網何時可以完成改善"},{"start":839.813,"end":860.995,"text":"我們一直在改善那你如果說要定一個時間改善那是不是那個時間之後我就不改善了嗎不是吧我是持續在改善啊我一直要改善如果說定了一個期限反而變成說我那個期限之後我就要再持續改善您回憶一下您剛剛講的這句話您給全國的師生做了最壞的示範你叫我交作業"},{"start":862.416,"end":884.085,"text":"那我現在如果教我告訴你我什麼時候教了我以後就不用教作業了嗎我完全原話喔所以我們不要玩文字遊戲我們都當過學生也當過老師所以什麼時候可以提出嘛什麼時候可以我還尊重您耶什麼時候可以提出改善我每個月都要提出改善如果要的話那我剛剛提出的問題您也說不應該存在的問題什麼時候會改善"},{"start":890.714,"end":904.893,"text":"我想委員你也是AI的專家AI一定有False Positive跟False Negative的問題我剛剛講的不雅的文字不雅的不對的爛ID有問題的圖片色情的東西這個不用AI喔"},{"start":905.954,"end":932.498,"text":"對 但是我們這個量這麼大你知道我們委員我們每天接收到多少的量如果說每一件我們都是用人工去檢查的話那你這樣會累死我們的人而且會讓我們整個打詐的系統癱瘓掉所以我們為什麼要用AI就是為什麼要用自動化方式處理就是因為我們要避免我們的打詐的系統被人家癱瘓因為這個詐騙集團他們也知道這個事情事實上所有的犯罪都是會用這一招想辦法"},{"start":932.898,"end":947.561,"text":"部長 主席已經站起來了我們都是技術人Line ID可不可以用RECX來處理是對嘛 圖片有不雅的 有人臉的我可不可以打懵這需要什麼很高強的AI嗎"},{"start":949.468,"end":966.284,"text":"好 各位我們好不好所以我想部長我們互相尊重我們也尊重我們也尊重昭偉好不好您現在沒有辦法答應時間我再給您最後一句話的回覆有沒有辦法三個月內半年我們剛剛提了三個月內我們一定會有一些改善很好是好 謝謝我們謝謝部長永遠認識謝謝昭偉謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}