{"error":false,"id":["168823"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":168823,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168823","日期":"2026-04-23","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-26-7","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":7,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-04-23T12:32:33+08:00","結束時間":"2026-04-23T12:38:46+08:00","影片長度":"00:06:13","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a0a6b12795be54425c7a10067ba2aaba6e07bf52eec0dd4908965b28c46199cc172f596e3a4508175ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳昭姿","委員發言時間":"12:32:33 - 12:38:46","會議時間":"2026-04-23T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：邀請衛生福利部部長、教育部、法務部就「脆弱家庭兒少支持服務及兒少保護個案處遇之跨體系協作與銜接機制檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【4月22日及23日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":0.08159375,"end":0.57096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":6.105968750000001,"end":7.709093750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":7.945343750000001,"end":8.83971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":13.075343750000002,"end":14.037218750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":13.53096875,"end":13.73346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":14.087843750000001,"end":70.48409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":30.70971875,"end":31.047218750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":41.32409375,"end":41.408468750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":70.93971875,"end":127.67346875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":73.53846875,"end":73.60596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":128.36534375,"end":128.63534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":128.63534375,"end":129.71534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":128.66909375,"end":156.66471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":156.10784375,"end":165.40596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":161.05221875,"end":161.62596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":162.50346875,"end":163.04346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":164.27534375000002,"end":164.59596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":165.08534375000002,"end":184.37346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":182.60159375,"end":188.52471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":185.87534375,"end":186.22971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":189.18284375000002,"end":190.19534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":189.77346875,"end":192.99659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":193.90784375,"end":196.03409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":196.20284375,"end":196.70909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":196.92846875,"end":202.76721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":198.12659375,"end":201.31596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":201.73784375000002,"end":204.50534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":204.64034375,"end":205.29846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":205.29846875,"end":206.37846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":206.37846875000002,"end":219.76034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":206.39534375000002,"end":206.73284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":220.19909375,"end":251.90721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":228.28221875000003,"end":228.50159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":239.75721875000002,"end":240.26346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":245.08971875,"end":245.89971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":248.58284375000002,"end":248.93721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":251.90721875000003,"end":252.16034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":252.53159375,"end":263.06159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":253.44284375,"end":254.77596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":256.14284375,"end":256.46346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":258.97784375000003,"end":259.16346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":259.39971875000003,"end":261.84659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":263.06159375000004,"end":263.55096875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":263.33159375,"end":265.42409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":263.55096875000004,"end":263.56784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":265.03596875,"end":273.84471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":271.98846875000004,"end":273.81096875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":273.84471875,"end":275.53221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":276.20721875000004,"end":281.43846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":276.96659375,"end":320.57159375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":285.55596875000003,"end":286.02846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":286.02846875,"end":291.04034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":320.74034375,"end":353.96721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":344.43284375,"end":344.56784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":349.22534375000004,"end":351.03096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":352.21221875000003,"end":363.73784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":362.38784375,"end":370.23471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":368.81721875000005,"end":371.09534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":371.09534375000004,"end":373.18784375}],"whisperx":[{"start":6.145,"end":7.348,"text":"好 謝謝主席 有請部長有請施部長"},{"start":13.503,"end":30.316,"text":"陳委員好部長好我今天跟您談這個收出養的問題對一個孩子來說他被出養大概對醫生是非常重大的一個影響或是改變但是就我個人的實務經驗來說其實收出養這個制度它影響的至少有三方面"},{"start":30.976,"end":52.137,"text":"一個是就是出養家庭所謂的原生家庭孩子本身當然有但是對於收養家庭其實也是都是一生非常長期而且不是很容易做的功課那部長這個經過凱凱案之後整個收養制度我國收出養制度依照現行的方式是由地方政府來負責出養的必要性評估"},{"start":55,"end":58.664,"text":"然後有民間媒合這個機構來負責這個收養家庭評估媒合還有兒童這個追蹤的這個發展等等等等但是問題我覺得不是有沒有分工而是說分工之後有沒有足夠的專業能力去接住這項高度專業的這個工作"},{"start":73.84,"end":79.003,"text":"那過去民間機構他是專責的但是現在地方政府他們是用第一線的社工來做這件事他等於是監辦然後還有案件的這個量重然後個案又分散老實說他們那個經驗的累積不容易所以事實上他的整個評估標準就是說"},{"start":93.632,"end":108.017,"text":"他自然會有落差這是我非常重視一件事情那利新基金會其實早在去年五月他就發文提醒了無論是社會局的家庭福利組的社工或是在全國各地社福中心基層的人員"},{"start":109.377,"end":124.803,"text":"他們本來的工作是聚焦在這個所謂的社區支持跟初期的預防那在出養必要性這個理解上他在理解上或許還不是很充足所以社家屬是不是可以讓我們了解說目前的狀況如何當把這個工作交給他們的時候"},{"start":128.684,"end":144.339,"text":"你們做了哪些努力跟委員說明大概現在統計大概一年大概差不多200案的收出養需求那我們是全國大概是建置156個社福中心所以以負荷來講這個到"},{"start":146.761,"end":159.605,"text":"倒不如其他其他的案量可能更多那再來就是這個收出養的這個媒合機構這個確實是一個重點我今天不好意思我現在談的就不是說那個量的問題我剛剛很強調一個專業嘛因為過去是專責但是可看到你們做的"},{"start":164.206,"end":187.538,"text":"不同的一些分工所以剛剛大概也有提到說那麼盡量把他的這個專業的這個能力提升所以也發展了那個叫收出養必要評估的報告的格式大概要評估哪一些東西然後再辦理這個教育訓練的課程我聽說現在有一些課程啊那請問社家屬這個課程你的師資夠嗎課程的我本來以為就是說你們會說現在對於這個"},{"start":193.993,"end":200.799,"text":"要了解這個出養的必要性這個 必要性評估嘛對 必要性評估 你們有相關的訓練嗎那個有開課 那個施肢夠嗎施肢應該沒有問題施肢的量能是夠的嗎 我覺得這個很重要啊那麼台灣親子共學教育促進會也有幾點聲明主張啦那我覺得其中最重要的一點就是訪視指引他應該根據風險的分層來修訂"},{"start":222.837,"end":251.357,"text":"威福部目前現行的指引並沒有依照個案的風險來做的差異所以來根據他這個來調整訪視的頻率或是協作的要求那部長您可不可以承諾或是您覺得認不認同未來高風險個案你知道高風險個案就是指譬如說出養前的站託像凱凱那初次收養的保姆或是說有特殊需求有特殊發展需求的孩子那要有更密集的多方的會商嗎"},{"start":253.463,"end":274.904,"text":"有關於風險分級就是讓他的訪視頻率不會大家都一樣要調整一下這目前有一些做法我是不是請署長說明一下簡單說明好嗎那現在已經是對於他在剛安置初期的部分他的訪視頻率會拉到比較高但你的指引還沒有改變嗎你的指引還沒有改變嗎"},{"start":276.26,"end":279.524,"text":"已經有修了然後不同的需求那我希望以後我能夠看到這個部分的報告一個月內的報告我稍微了解現在運作的一個情況"},{"start":291.8,"end":319.122,"text":"這個公私力協作本身是沒有問題的問題就是如果專業沒有到位的話你把風險是分散而不是降低我們目的是降低這個風險那受所長之助因為我們處理是最脆弱的孩子我們必須承認本來就不應該當作一般的行政業務來處理但我要強調這件事同樣不可以給第一線的社工做這個道德要求跟這個責任的轉嫁如果你沒有對他提供好的訓練跟支持也沒有給他這個"},{"start":321.184,"end":348.982,"text":"做明確的標準那在優秀之後他再努力他都可能沒有辦法做出一個穩定一致的判斷所以核心不是說社工努不努力而是你們要把這個制度設計好把專業的支持是到位的那這樣制度缺口就不會變成那個社工他本身的壓力來源你更不能讓孩子來承擔這個結果就我今天要強調的這一點那部長您剛剛提到的就是說那些相關的那個報告我也想要關心一下"},{"start":349.582,"end":369.022,"text":"因為我自己本身就是收養家庭嘛就是我們後來113年有修那個收出養的辦法還有相關的指引還有必要性的評估的那個form我們再提供給委員參考部長很多國家他收出養的這個管理這個法律都改了幾十版了就不斷的精進好謝謝部長謝謝主席好謝謝謝謝陳超之委員發言"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}