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謝謝委員替監察院在這方面做清楚的一個陳述我們的委員確實都是錄製成功啦"},{"start":105.971,"end":131.552,"text":"那當然也都是針對很多不同的人民的陳情的案件極盡所能的希望能夠平反包括剛剛提到的蔡園這個案子他這個已經也非常明確的說他的槍傷絕非制裁就是T65K2步槍不是用T65K2步槍制裁已經排除了"},{"start":131.832,"end":136.089,"text":"所以應該會有一個非常新的一個查證的方向會進行"},{"start":138.001,"end":161.383,"text":"我想因為過去我們這邊其實跟監察委員也都有一些陳情案包括不管是台大女生涉及案或者是之前台東的幼稚園的問題那其實都非常感謝監察院提出一個非常完整的報告讓我們在這個制度上面讓這些人民還有力量持續在前進持續在捍衛自己的權利所以這部分也是要表達監察院的努力跟感謝謝謝"},{"start":162.284,"end":180.196,"text":"那接下來我想要邀請我們的這個秘書長是不是有機會來看這部電影《詩樂園》上個禮拜這個《詩樂園》的導演其實就是之前拍攝《火神的眼淚》的這個蔡迎娟導演她花費了非常多的時間重新收集了資料做了很多的填調"},{"start":181.477,"end":210.276,"text":"來拍了這一部有關於安置機構兒少的狀況的一部電影叫做失樂園那其實呢我認為這裡面呢有一個有句話讓我非常的印象深刻這個裡面因為他們是一個安置機構嘛所以安置機構主任呢對他離院的孩子說因為他們在安置機構18歲就要離院了他對這個18歲的孩子說我希望我能夠活到來你是你來參加我的喪禮而不是我去參加你的喪禮"},{"start":212.017,"end":233.343,"text":"這句話代表是什麼意思是其實因為很多的安置兒少在18歲以後他離院之後這個制度沒有人再協助他沒有人接住他了所以很多的兒少在18歲以後都沒有一個很完善的人生所以我是希望說我們是不是可以在這個今天接下來就是要來跟秘書長來討論有關於安置機構的問題所以秘書長會去看這部電影嗎"},{"start":238.046,"end":256.935,"text":"委員的推薦我會去看好啊我覺得您的推薦剛才也讓我非常有興趣我覺得這也是一個我們未來在兒少相關議題上面很重要的一個紀錄片這是值得看的一部電影好啊 謝謝那接下來就是說因為其實我們不管是從第一次2017年的國際審查也好"},{"start":257.655,"end":282.733,"text":"在第二次的國際審查也好其實他們都一直不停的強調一個清楚的原則就是安置機構安置是一個最後手段孩子不應該優先送到機構裡應該是留在家庭或是類家庭的環境那同時他們也有提到說是不是可以有兒童監察室我想監察院都非常清楚因為民間也是一直有這樣子的呼籲跟倡議所以我想請教就是說我們在"},{"start":285.295,"end":303.63,"text":"剛剛講就是希望他們盡量減少在安置機構裡因為我們從2013年到2017年其實我們在南投的安置機構發生了21起的性侵案件那在長期未通報未查核甚至還有未立案的安置地點其實對於兒少的身心其實產生了非常大的一個影響"},{"start":304.731,"end":327.318,"text":"甚至後來我們還是出現了不管是台東台北在2024年我們也調查了有關於成人機構安置身心障礙兒少的這個問題但是我認為我們可以從這一系列的個案裡面我認為是說我們一再的糾正可是還是會有失靈的狀態那我不曉得說監察院會認為這是屬於個案還是制度上的失靈呢"},{"start":328.018,"end":347.864,"text":"我不敢講叫做制度上的失靈但是在制度上確實對於安置家庭或是安置機構有一個見解上的衝突很多時候因為家庭安置的不足等等這些問題所以最後很多的報告還是建議要強化這個機構的量能也有這樣的一個報告"},{"start":349.124,"end":375.672,"text":"當然我們也有一個身心障礙福利服務去機構化之配套措施的研究本院也有開始進入的相關的研究也提出給相關的機關做參考好喔 那秘書長我不知道這邊可以請教一下因為我們之前雖然可以看到這張表上面就有講到我們現在其實2024年有調查這個成人機構嘛那我們在2018年也有調查這個人力的問題我們因為可是問題是個案持續的在發生嘛我們是不是可以"},{"start":376.492,"end":396.346,"text":"針對安置兒少的機構做一個通案性的調查有的 剛才我念給你聽的那個就是可是那個是身心障礙不是嗎對 當然這也是所屬於身心障礙但是我們講的不是只有身心障礙是通案 安置兒少因為安置兒少的類型非常多元嘛是 這是我們的起步這是等於是建設案的第一步我們未來當然還是會針對我們會把委員的意見提回去"},{"start":400.729,"end":426.053,"text":"院裡面針對相關的這個兒少的安置是否是跟機構跟家庭的之間的這些相關的議題來做一個比較這個我覺得委員的提醒我們監察院會拿回去做研究那另外一個部分就是說關於兒童監察室或是獨立兒童權利監督機制那我不曉得監察院的看法是什麼"},{"start":426.613,"end":447.249,"text":"是監察室我們已經上次的委員的執行在范雲委員有提出那我們也答應他兩個月兩個月兩個月提出研究報告好的一定謝謝你一定好那再來還有另外一個就是說我不曉得說秘書長最近有沒有看到我們有關於遊蕩犬跟人之間的衝突案件頻繁從去年的九"},{"start":448.15,"end":475.617,"text":"應該是暑假吧高雄永安漁港有一位老翁去游泳的時候被遊蕩犬咬死嘛然後另外還有今年大概是三月左右有彰化的婦人去菜園種田的時候被遊蕩犬攻擊了兩百多個傷口然後最近也還有遊蕩犬追逐小朋友結果小朋友摔到水溝裡去等等的這個問題那我是希望說可不可以請監察院一起來調查一下我們現在這個機制上面是不是有問題"},{"start":476.337,"end":483.485,"text":"因為你可以看到這張圖我們的預算一直在增加已經突破兩億元了可是我們的遊蕩圈的樂區化設也持續在增加而我們也發現說這個重疊性很高就是說112年的時候"},{"start":492.834,"end":509.538,"text":"從這個遊蕩犬樂區到113年還是遊蕩犬樂區到114年還是遊蕩犬樂區那到底這個政策下去有沒有辦法解決人民的問題是不是有效的這個東西我們是不是可以來檢討農業部的這個制度因為過去其實田丘景委員也有關心過這件事情但是當時應該是兩三年前了吧對不對我們確實有針對個案來做過研究也對地方政府提出相關的參考意見"},{"start":521.301,"end":533.896,"text":"但是我們查過了我們對於這整個遊蕩犬的通案並沒有做通案研究是不是委員的建議我們帶回去給檢察院應該是做一個通案型的思維那我們來回報到院裡去"},{"start":535.666,"end":551.433,"text":"好 了解喔 謝謝喔那再接下來就是說我想因為我的時間有限啦我就先來講我們的預算的部分因為接下來就要進入審查了嘛那我發現說我們現在呢我們的115年的一個預算呢我們比之前增加了0.57億可是我們的業務反而減少了"},{"start":555.235,"end":574.116,"text":"這個0.08億元吼那其實國家人權業務佔了非常非常大的一部分吼那當然我知道我不太確定吼但是這個想要跟您釐清的就是說因為其實我們今年吼有這個國際審查CRC國際審查那接下來還有CDO吼還有不同的這個CRPD也都要審查了那我不曉得說是因為這個"},{"start":575.658,"end":592.138,"text":"這個編列的原因是因為我們要對應這些國際審查而產生出來的業務費用那我也必須說我是百分之百支持的喔最重要的是說我們必須要跟國際接軌那這個就是一個非常重要的任務所以是不是可以簡單說明一下為什麼會有這樣子的一個編列的方式"},{"start":592.739,"end":596.74,"text":"每年的編列根據一個國際審查報告大概總額會用到將近525萬其中第100萬是我們在寫這個所謂的人權公約的國家審查的時候需要100萬跟外界做溝通互動"},{"start":610.964,"end":623.513,"text":"整個台灣的狀況這100萬是這樣接著270萬是要做因應的工作以及所謂的我們無障礙的就是說所有人都可以看得到大概150萬是要拿來跟國際做溝通最後拿來做最後的修訂版本所以總額大概每一個這樣子國際公約的相關的國家審查大概花到525萬左右"},{"start":636.482,"end":651.137,"text":"因為我時間差不多了所以我想我就簡單提出幾個重點那我希望監察院要提出這些的說明完整的說明報告到我們的委員會因為接下來要做審查了那最主要還有一個東西就是我有發現說我們在這個"},{"start":654.719,"end":657.7,"text":"職業安全衛生的角度的話我們其實在115年度也有8億8852萬是用在機關的運作上面那同樣的我們的資訊安全也有6102萬元因為你們是屬於A級資安機關"},{"start":671.284,"end":692.817,"text":"你們有很多國家的機敏資料所以這個出現資安漏洞的話對於國家來說是有非常大的影響所以這個部分我希望到時候在報告上面都要完整的說明它的重要性在哪裡再來還有一個是新建消防系統工程3600萬最重要就是因為我們的消防設備是76年的時候建制了"},{"start":693.797,"end":721.095,"text":"非常老舊防火功能不足那我還是要強調因為上次其實我就有關注這一題因為我認為我們在裡面工作的每一個公務員都非常重要因為他們的不管是性命也好或是他們的資歷也好這些公務員都是國家的保障所以我認為這個部分一定要好好的守護大家的安全因為如果沒有守護的話我們不僅是可能有風險存在還要受刑罰的一個刑責跟罰款對不對"},{"start":722.156,"end":743.938,"text":"是 所以期待大院審查後通過相關的預算對 好 那就是說因為其實我們去年呢被刪了很多啦 被刪了非常非常多那甚至像人權業務的預算幾乎是完整的被刪除所以今天我問的這些問題就希望你們一定要提供一個完整的說明報告給我們司法法制所有的委員好嗎 謝謝謝謝 謝謝委員指教"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:24.647000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.027000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，有請秘書長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.047000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.187000+08:00","text":"有請秘書長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.187000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.207000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.227000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.327000+08:00","text":"秘書長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:25.347000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:26.888000+08:00","text":"我想先請教一個問題，因為我剛剛聽到召委問了一個問題，就是有關於國家人權委員會，他認為這有點疊床架屋，但我確認過資料，這好像是在2019年通過三讀的對嗎？","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:26.888000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:46.844000+08:00","text":"我這樣的理解是正確的嗎？是的。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:47.224000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:50.386000+08:00","text":"所以這其實是當時政黨的共識，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:50.386000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:39:58.291000+08:00","text":"包括國民黨還有當時的時代力量、親民黨跟民進黨，是我們所有人的共識，所以在共識之下依法成立的組織，對嗎？是的。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:39:59.131000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:40:01.213000+08:00","text":"好，那我了解，我想這邊也是做一個澄清。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:40:02.993000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:40:17.218000+08:00","text":"還有另外一個部分我也有提到，我們現在的監察委員裡面，基本上有很多其實是我過去的民間夥伴、民間團體的夥伴，但我們的副院長李鴻鈞過去其實也曾經擔任過親民黨秘書長，對不對？是。","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:40:18.739000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:40:24.721000+08:00","text":"對嘛，所以我想從這個名單看起來，其實還是有來自於不同領域的人士，對吧？是的。好。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:40:25.821000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:40:37.810000+08:00","text":"所以我希望大家在看這個名單的時候，不要因為民進黨執政、民進黨提名，就代表這些人都是非常偏向民進黨的，因為我認為現在監察委員真的非常辛苦，所以我還是要替他們說一句話。","quality":0.974},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:40:38.830000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:40:54.384000+08:00","text":"當他很勤勞的時候，又說他是我們的打手，當大家好像覺得他沒有在做事的時候，又覺得他是個「廢」，所以我覺得不管怎麼樣都動輒得咎，我覺得還是要回到看他們做出來的成果報告，這是可受公評的，我想監察院態度應該是這樣吧？","quality":0.904},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:40:54.604000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:41:08.877000+08:00","text":"是，謝謝委員替監察院在這方面做更清楚的陳述，我們的委員確實都是戮力從公啦，當然也都是針對很多不同人民陳情的案件，極盡所能的希望能夠平反。","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:41:10.618000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:41:32.069000+08:00","text":"包括剛才提到的蔡員這個案子，因為調查也已經非常明確他的槍傷絕非自裁，不是用T65K2步槍自裁、已經排除了，所以應該會有一個非常新的查證方向會進行。","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:41:32.069000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:41:34.001000+08:00","text":"了解，好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:41:34.001000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:41:57.383000+08:00","text":"我想過去我們跟監察委員也都有一些陳情案，包括不管是臺大女生舍監案，或者是之前臺東幼稚園的問題，其實都非常感謝監察院提出了一個非常完整的報告，讓我們在這個制度上面，讓這些人民還有力量持續在前進，持續在捍衛自己的權利，所以這部分也是要表達我對監察院的努力跟感謝。謝謝。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:41:58.404000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:42:05.489000+08:00","text":"接下來，我想要邀請我們秘書長，是不是有機會請你來看這部電影「失樂園」？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:42:07.110000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:42:23.421000+08:00","text":"失樂園的導演其實就是之前拍攝「火神的眼淚」的蔡銀娟導演，他花費了非常多的時間重新蒐集了資料、做了很多的田調，拍了這一部有關於安置機構兒少狀況的電影「失樂園」。","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:42:23.601000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:42:46.276000+08:00","text":"其實我認為這裡面有一句話讓我非常的印象深刻，因為他們是一個安置機構，孩子們在18歲就要離開安置機構了，所以機構主任對離院的孩子說：我希望我能夠活到是你來參加我的喪禮，而不是我去參加你的喪禮。","quality":0.839},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:42:48.017000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:42:49.057000+08:00","text":"這句話代表什麼意思？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:42:49.738000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:02.301000+08:00","text":"其實是因為很多的安置兒少在18歲離院之後，這個制度沒有人再協助他，沒有人接住他了，所以很多的兒少在18歲以後都沒有一個很完善的人生。","quality":0.983},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:06.302000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:09.343000+08:00","text":"今天接下來就是要來跟秘書長討論有關於安置機構的問題，所以秘書長會去看這部電影嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:14.046000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:15.307000+08:00","text":"委員的推薦，我會去看。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:16.187000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:27.412000+08:00","text":"我覺得剛才您的推薦也讓我非常有興趣，我覺得這也是我們未來在兒少相關議題上面很重要的一個紀錄片，是值得看的一部電影。","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:27.752000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:28.473000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:29.993000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:46.904000+08:00","text":"我們不管是從第一次2017年的國際審查，或第二次的國際審查，其實他們都一直不停地強調一個清楚的原則，就是機構安置是一個最後手段，孩子不應該優先送到機構裡，應該是留在家庭或是類家庭的環境。","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:47.445000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:50.787000+08:00","text":"同時他們也有提到是不是可以有兒童監察使？","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:51.448000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:43:55.491000+08:00","text":"我想監察院都非常清楚，因為民間也是一直有這樣子的呼籲跟倡議。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:43:55.491000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:44:30.434000+08:00","text":"所以我想請教，剛剛講我們希望他們儘量減少在安置機構裡，因為從2013年到2017年，我們在南投的安置機構發生了21起的性侵案件，在長期未通報、未查核，甚至還有未立案的安置地點，其實對於兒少的身心產生了非常大的影響，甚至後來還是出現了，不管是臺東、臺北，在2024年我們也調查了有關於成人機構安置身心障礙兒少的這個問題。","quality":0.977},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:44:30.434000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:44:43.298000+08:00","text":"但是我認為我們可以從這一系列的個案裡面，我們一再地糾正，可是還是會有失靈的狀態，我不曉得監察院會認為這是屬於個案，還是制度上的失靈呢？","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:44:44.018000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:03.844000+08:00","text":"我不敢講制度上失靈，但是在制度上確實對於安置家庭或是安置機構的見解有所衝突，很多時候因為家庭安置不足等等這些問題，所以最後很多的報告還是建議要強化機構的量能，也有這樣的報告。","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:05.124000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:17.048000+08:00","text":"當然，我們也有一個身心障礙福利服務去機構化之配套措施的研究，本院也有開始進入相關的研究，也提出給相關的機關做參考。好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:18.048000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:35.855000+08:00","text":"秘書長，我能不能請教一下，你可以看到這張表上面就有講到其實在2024年有調查成人機構，在2018年也有調查人力的問題，問題是個案持續地在發生，我們是不是可以針對安置兒少的機構，做一個通案性的調查？","quality":0.94},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:36.275000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:38.516000+08:00","text":"有的，剛才我唸給你聽的就是……","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:38.677000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:41.899000+08:00","text":"可是那個是身心障礙，不是嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:41.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:43+08:00","text":"對，當然這也是屬於身心障礙。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:43+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:48.263000+08:00","text":"但是我們講的不只有身心障礙，是通案安置兒少，因為安置兒少的類型非常多元嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:48.724000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:45:51.445000+08:00","text":"當然，是，這是我們的起步，等於是監察院的第一步。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:45:51.846000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:12.964000+08:00","text":"我們會把委員的意見提回去請院裡面研究，未來針對相關兒少的安置，是否把機構跟家庭之間相關的議題來做比較，委員的提醒，監察院會拿回去做研究。","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:12.964000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:13.964000+08:00","text":"好，沒關係，我們事後再約時間聊好了，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:13.964000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:14.964000+08:00","text":"我們再約，再約來聊細節。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:14.964000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:15.964000+08:00","text":"好的，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:13.525000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:22.053000+08:00","text":"另外一個部分，關於兒童監察使或是獨立兒童權力監督機制，我不曉得監察院的看法是什麼？","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:23.234000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:33.782000+08:00","text":"關於監察使，上次在范雲委員質詢時有提出，我們也答應他兩個月提出研究報告。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:33.782000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:34.782000+08:00","text":"兩個月是嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:34.782000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:35.782000+08:00","text":"這個報告一併送給我，好不好？","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:34.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:35.023000+08:00","text":"好的，一定。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:35.263000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:35.263000+08:00","text":"謝謝你。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:36.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:46:42.309000+08:00","text":"再來，我不曉得秘書長最近有沒有看到關於遊蕩犬跟人之間的衝突案件頻繁？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:46:44.150000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:47:05.615000+08:00","text":"應該是去年暑假，高雄永安漁港有一位老翁去游泳的時候被遊蕩犬咬死；另外，今年大概3月，彰化的婦人去菜園種田的時候被遊蕩犬攻擊了兩百多個傷口；最近也還有遊蕩犬追逐小朋友，結果小朋友摔進水溝等等的問題。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:47:06.095000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:47:11.617000+08:00","text":"我希望請監察院一起來調查，我們現在這個機制是不是有問題？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:47:12.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:47:37.316000+08:00","text":"因為你可以看到這張圖，我們的預算一直在增加，已經突破兩億元了，可是我們的遊蕩犬的熱區劃設也持續在增加，我們也發現重疊性很高，即112年的遊蕩犬熱區、到113年還是遊蕩犬熱區、到114年還是遊蕩犬熱區，到底這個政策下去有沒有辦法解決人民的問題？","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:47:37.316000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:47:38.216000+08:00","text":"是不是有效的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:47:38.816000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:47:40.877000+08:00","text":"這個東西我們是不是可以來檢討農業部的制度？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:47:40.997000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:47:44.197000+08:00","text":"因為過去其實田秋堇委員也有關心過這件事情，應該是兩年前了吧，對不對？","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:47:44.197000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:02.087000+08:00","text":"我們確實有針對個案做過研究，也對地方政府提出相關的參考意見，但是我們查過了，對於整個遊蕩犬的並沒有做通案研究。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:03.649000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:09.876000+08:00","text":"我們把委員的建議帶回去給監察院，應該要做通案型思維，然後回報到院裡去。","quality":0.781},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:11.666000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:12.546000+08:00","text":"好，了解，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:12.947000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:19.370000+08:00","text":"接下來，因為我的時間有限，我就先來講預算的部分，因為接下來就要進入審查了嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:20.130000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:36.741000+08:00","text":"我發現我們115年的預算比之前增加了0.57億，可是業務費總額反而減少了0.08億元，其中國家人權業務占了非常非常大的一部分。","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:37.402000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:55.843000+08:00","text":"當然我不太確定，想要跟您釐清，因為我們今年有CRC國際審查，接下來還有CEDAW，還有不同的CRPD也都要審查了，我不曉得編列的原因是因為我們要對應這些國際審查而產生出來的業務費用嗎？當然。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:56.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:58.346000+08:00","text":"我也必須說我是百分之百支持的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:58.346000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:48:59.467000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:48:59.467000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:04.293000+08:00","text":"最重要是我們必須要跟國際接軌，這個是一個非常重要的任務。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:04.293000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:08.118000+08:00","text":"所以是不是可以簡單說明一下，為什麼會有這樣子的編列方式？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:08.739000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:30.386000+08:00","text":"我們每年的編列，根據每個國際審查報告，大概總額會用到將近525萬，其中第100萬是我們在寫國際人權公約國家審查的時候需要有100萬跟外界做溝通互動，了解整個臺灣的狀況，這100萬是這樣。","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:30.386000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:31.386000+08:00","text":"了解，我懂。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:30.386000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:37.051000+08:00","text":"接著270萬是要做英譯的工作，以及所謂無障礙的環境讓所有的人都可以看得到。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:37.051000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:38.051000+08:00","text":"了解，沒問題，我懂。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:38.051000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:39.051000+08:00","text":"所以基本上就是做前沿性研究就對了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:37.391000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:49:39.493000+08:00","text":"再來150萬是要拿來跟國際做溝通，然後再做最後修訂的版本，所以每一個國際公約相關的國家審查，總額大概會花到525萬左右。","quality":0.84},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:49:52.482000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:02.632000+08:00","text":"好，因為我時間差不多了，所以我就簡單提出幾個重點，我希望監察院要提出完整的說明報告到我們的委員會……","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:02.632000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:03.632000+08:00","text":"是，好的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:02.632000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:04.354000+08:00","text":"因為接下來要做審查了。是。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:05.615000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:34.268000+08:00","text":"最主要我還有發現在職業安全衛生的角度，其實在115年度也有8億8,852萬是用在機關運作上面，資訊安全也有6,102萬元，因為你們是屬於A級資安機關，你們有很多國家機敏資料，所以出現資安漏洞的話，對於國家來說有非常大的影響……沒錯。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:34.268000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:40.192000+08:00","text":"所以這個部分，我希望到時候在報告上都要完整說明它的重要性在哪裡。","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:40.192000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:41.192000+08:00","text":"是，好的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:40.192000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:48.336000+08:00","text":"再來還有一個是新建消防系統工程3,600萬，最重要就是因為我們的消防設備是76年的時候建置……","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:48.336000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:50:49.797000+08:00","text":"沒錯、沒錯。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:50:49.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:09.710000+08:00","text":"已經非常老舊、防火功能不足，我還是要強調，因為上次其實我就有關注這一題，我認為在裡面工作的每一個公務員都非常重要，不管是他們的性命也好，或是他們的資歷也好，這些公務員都是國家的寶藏，所以我認為這個部分一定要好好地守護大家的安全……一定。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:09.951000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:17.095000+08:00","text":"因為如果沒有守護的話，不僅可能有風險存在，還要受刑責跟罰鍰，對不對？","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:18.156000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:23.041000+08:00","text":"是，所以也期待大院審查後通過相關預算。對。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"張委員雅琳","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:24.082000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:39.557000+08:00","text":"因為其實去年被刪得很多，被刪得非常非常多，甚至像人權業務預算幾乎是完整被刪除，所以今天我問了這些問題，就希望你們一定要提供一個完整的說明報告給我們司法及法制所有的委員，好嗎？謝謝。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"黃秘書長適卓","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:39.557000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:39.918000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員指教。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:40.418000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:41.846571+08:00","text":"謝謝張委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:42.146571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:47.575143+08:00","text":"接下來是沈發惠委員、沈發惠，沈發惠委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:47.875143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:52.732286+08:00","text":"鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員，鍾佳濱委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:53.032286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:51:57.889429+08:00","text":"蘇清泉委員、蘇清泉委員，蘇清泉委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T09:51:58.189429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T09:52:01.332286+08:00","text":"接下來我們有請范雲委員。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}