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謝謝主席 那請我們彭部長有請彭部長部長 我們今天也是針對我們空污防治法那目的當然是為了維持我們的空氣品質維護國人的健康跟生活環境那我們台灣也在希望在2050年進行排放"},{"start":32.563,"end":58.812,"text":"那當然最主要我們現在要做的都是減碳嘛那針對目前來講部長對於2050淨零排放有信心嗎很挑戰啊非常挑戰因為這個現在可能現在的工具都沒有辦法達到淨零碳排需要未來這幾年有新的突破所以我目前看好像很多各項的進度並沒有按照那個時程去走所以2050其實就像部長講的"},{"start":60.287,"end":85.241,"text":"不是很挑戰 幾乎我看是不太容易因為它是一個還有25年要達到的目標那我們只能說現在2030、2035我們可以達到的原來設定的目標趕快往那個地方衝那我也必須說2030、2035那個目標都是登月計畫這麼的難可是我們現在如果2050年我們不下一個重視要往前做的話那現在2030、2035根本達不到"},{"start":87.222,"end":101.842,"text":"對啊 所以我覺得我們在各項還是要朝著目標來前進像這個本席之前也有質詢過像我們整個環境部針對裡面我覺得我們碳排最高目前最需要改善的而且"},{"start":102.382,"end":127.44,"text":"不單是碳排高而且它這個也對我們民眾的健康有很大的關係那就是我們每天在路上跑的這個柴油垃圾車我們現在知道我們下垃圾車啊都是柴油在路上跑那它本身它這個高碳排而且又是柴油所以它你看我們每公升柴油可以產生2.5到2.6公斤的二氧化碳"},{"start":128.16,"end":147.528,"text":"那相當於我們發兩度電或者燃燒0.5公斤的垃圾所產生的碳排所以這個垃圾車跟資源回收車它又是整天在我們大街小巷穿梭而且又是怠速所以那這一部分到底有沒有納入我們淨零排放的"},{"start":149.007,"end":170.305,"text":"規劃裡面包委員這個我們只有提到部分的事辦例如說未來電動車的比例要到多少因為現在未來財化法過後這些的工作是在地方政府垃圾車的購買是地方政府要負擔做這個事那我們前幾個禮拜我有聽我同仁跟我報告就是說未來對電動垃圾車的規劃那目前的確是第一個費用太高"},{"start":170.805,"end":196.338,"text":"然後我們也用了各種減碳或是增量抵換的方式算進去還是有一段的差距所以我們還在算這個到底它的財務狀況是怎麼樣我們當然是希望說如果老舊的新購的垃圾車就可以買一些新的例如說電動的或是比較更環保的一個車那目前我們一直在收集全世界到底有沒有這個案例不過目前也跟委員坦承還不多但是我們現在會要努力來做"},{"start":196.678,"end":208.148,"text":"所以我們之前才用垃圾車後來好像就是為了減碳有做這個低碳垃圾車那它就是改善它的電動壓縮艙還有主要讓這個垃圾車能夠氫化"},{"start":212.492,"end":232.646,"text":"但是重點它還是柴油車所以還是會排放二氧化碳所以這對於我們全面淨零其實還有一大段的目標那尤其我們看我們目標2030市區公車要全面電動化2040小客車機車全面電動化那到現在其實據我們了解從2016到2026其實我們"},{"start":241.055,"end":263.573,"text":"看到我們在推廣這個電動車還沒有電動車好像只是幾台在試辦試用那我們現在主要在改善是低碳的垃圾車那從2016到2026我們看全國好像也只有1864輛那大概也直到我們"},{"start":264.173,"end":280.737,"text":"全國的三成所以連低碳垃圾車我們離目標都還很遠現在大概是我們台灣到處在跑的這個垃圾車有七成還是最原始的才有垃圾車所以照我們這樣來講不單2050淨零排放很遠連這個低碳垃圾車都還很遙遠"},{"start":286.898,"end":302.234,"text":"包委員因為這個低碳垃圾車它比電動公車還距離有一段差距因為它的重量比較多然後它每天要跑大概100公里左右所以我們的確有算過目前還是關鍵在於這個裁員上面"},{"start":302.754,"end":323.617,"text":"因為目前呢包含了這個交通部現在的裁員上也遇到很大的壓力例如說公車全面電動化也遇到很大的挑戰因為現在的這個價格跟原來的燒柴油的其實是有一段的價差那這個通常過去都是用補貼的方式所以未來如果說要照委員的建議納入多元垃圾處理的計畫第三期的話"},{"start":324.398,"end":349.715,"text":"我們可以來想辦法但是這個預算的爭取現在遇到一些很大的挑戰當然我們心裡面是期待有這樣的做法所以目前我知道說可能很難做得到所以一直不斷的跟同仁討論有沒有一些租賃的新的一個做法能夠來達成這樣的目標好那剛剛我們有講到我們這10年全國低氮垃圾車只有1800多台然後後來我們去環管署的網站我們去了解了一下它這個數據很奇怪"},{"start":352.537,"end":369.651,"text":"113年8月底,環管署的業務上面就寫全國第一攤垃圾車有1864輛,那比例是23.6%結果在9月多,他的新聞稿又說截至8月底第一攤垃圾車只有1550輛,可是他比例變成28%"},{"start":374.314,"end":396.127,"text":"數量減少結果比例變大這環廣署這網站這到底發生什麼問題啊這個我們要去瞭解一下因為這個他的第一單垃圾車應該指的是那個壓縮機或是他的輕斗在處理的過程當中是用電池喔不是用這個燒柴油來去做處理我猜他的定義是這樣"},{"start":397.848,"end":409.642,"text":"還是要注意一下這公布的網站這個車輛減少結果比例增加然後一樣我們也看了一下113年8月底說累計節省了1102萬公升的油耗然後減少31700公噸的排碳"},{"start":418.072,"end":432.842,"text":"結果九月新聞稿在發的時候又變成節省530萬公升的油耗減少14700公噸的排碳我不知道這個都是我們同單位出來的自己前後矛盾這個"},{"start":434.483,"end":450.107,"text":"叫大家到底看哪一個數據才是對的這個我會回去瞭解一下再給委員正確的答案對啊 希望這個部長跟環管署這部分也多加注意一下好 謝謝委員那我們現在多元垃圾處理計畫第二期有編列換購低碳垃圾車400輛總經費16億"},{"start":454.068,"end":480.461,"text":"那這16億都有花到買這低碳垃圾車上面嗎他們就是所謂的這個這個壓縮還有這個漏斗這樣輕導著這個功能是屬於電池的所以不是用一直在柴油在運轉的因為等於不用整個柴油嘛就是它的壓縮艙的部分把它做成電動這樣子至少減少柴油的用量那這部分"},{"start":481.661,"end":504.078,"text":"這經費有全部用在這一方面上面嗎應該是都用在這個部分啦因為我們希望我們還是要逐步去做啦尤其針對這個垃圾車在大街小巷跑不單是清潔隊員民眾常常跟在垃圾車旁邊這個碳排這麼高對民眾的健康真的很大的疑慮"},{"start":508.644,"end":528.435,"text":"還有我們看了一下我們市面上其實電動垃圾車的廠商其實我們看就不只一家可是我不瞭解為什麼我們環境部只有找一家特定廠商的車款在做示範連這計畫書裡面也都只有針對這一家"},{"start":531.517,"end":551.685,"text":"那這個並沒有辦法去做多元而且我看它都是做6立方米我們現在市面上幾乎都是8立方米那為什麼做6立方米而且那麼多廠家為什麼只做那一家那你只做那一家它的各方面的數據是不是就變得比較狹隘那數據未必能夠完整"},{"start":552.045,"end":581.036,"text":"好謝謝我的建議因為其實前幾個禮拜我有聽他們跟我做簡報有談到這個問題那我也有下了一個指示希望說他們可以公開的讓大家提出更好的方案那如果方案對的話政府可以有一些補助來研發加速這個狀況進行因為現在的情況是我同仁報給我的數字其實電動的全面電動化的車跟這個傳統的車大概價錢大概多了一倍所以這個財務模式沒有辦法起來所以我要他們想辦法把這個差距可以縮到最小"},{"start":581.556,"end":608.811,"text":"所以我們希望他可以更開放的讓大家能夠進來甚至也不必限制說只有國內的國外的如果好的也可以拿來做使用對啊因為據我們了解現在國外很多都是全電動的熱車已經有了然後我們那時候問我們環境部好像說什麼對電動熱車什麼價格太高啦還有一方面什麼他的跑這個里程能夠跑多遠等等我後來聽了好幾家"},{"start":610.012,"end":636.46,"text":"外面也看了很多廠商他說這些方面他們基本上都克服並不是像環境部講的那麼的困難是委員的話我也跟我同仁講過就是說外面的這個房車電動車都比油車便宜了所以你不該給我看到一個數字這個電動的垃圾車比油車貴一倍所以我認為這個不應該這樣所以我請他們再調查所以我們擔心就是你像那麼多廠商結果我們只找一家那"},{"start":639.701,"end":665.962,"text":"這個國際國外電動垃圾車早就已經他們都已經試營運這麼久很多早就正式上路那連我們國內據我們了解他說這些問題都可以克服結果我擔心環境部只有得到這一家的訊息那你去做試驗也只做這一家只有這一家的數據那其他的廠家都說這些都可以克服啊包含價格等等所以我希望環境部應該要"},{"start":666.963,"end":691.283,"text":"多元去找更多的廠家來去試驗然後去找這些數據包含價格啦還有它的功能性能等等是不是應該多元化不應該想要我看只有一家二維我們是開放的讓多元的來解決這個問題就很像說電動車一定要有一個市場的機制讓多元的進來才可以把價格降下來我們才可以普及來做使用"},{"start":691.863,"end":706.553,"text":"好那希望部長我們針對這個部分我們找更多的規格然後延期工作報告來也希望能夠盡快朝這個目標來邁進可以可以謝謝委員的建議謝謝好謝謝部長謝謝謝謝投薪局委員的質詢"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:33:53.898000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:33:56.280000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝主席，那請我們彭部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T12:33:56.461000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:34:02.407000+08:00","text":"請部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:34:02.407000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T12:34:03.407000+08:00","text":"涂委員好。好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:34:02.407000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:34:28.246000+08:00","text":"部長，我們今天也是針對空污防制法，目的當然是為了維持我們的空氣品質，維護國人的健康跟生活環境，我們臺灣也希望在2050年達成淨零排放，當然我們現在最主要做的都是減碳，針對目前來講，部長，對於2050淨零排放有信心嗎？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:34:28.246000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:34:35.589000+08:00","text":"很挑戰，非常挑戰，因為以現在的工具可能沒有辦法達到淨零碳排，需要未來這幾年有新的突破。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:34:37.409000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:34:49.209000+08:00","text":"目前看來好像各項進度並沒有按照那個時程去走，所以2050年要達成目標，其實就像部長講的，不只是很挑戰，我看幾乎是不太容易。","quality":0.808},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:34:49.889000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:35:11.221000+08:00","text":"因為它是一個還有25年要達到的目標，那我們只能說，原來設定的在2030年、2035年達到的目標，現在我們可以達到的，就趕快往那個地方衝，那我也必須說，2030年、2035年的目標都是像登月計畫這麼難，可是我們現在如果不針對2050年的目標下一個重誓的話，現在要達到2030年、2035年的目標根本達不到。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:35:13.222000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:35:17.508000+08:00","text":"對啊，所以我覺得我們在各項還是要朝著目標來前進。是。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:35:18.429000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:36:15.007000+08:00","text":"本席之前也有質詢過，我覺得我們碳排最高，目前最需要改善的，而且不單是碳排高，對我們民眾的健康有很大的關係，那就是我們每天在路上跑的柴油垃圾車，我們知道，現在垃圾車都是柴油車在路上跑，它本身是高碳排，而且又是用柴油，每公升柴油可以產生2.5到2.6公斤的二氧化碳，相當於發2度電或燃燒0.5公斤的垃圾所產生的碳排，而垃圾車跟資源回收車又是整天在大街小巷穿梭，而且又是怠速，這一部分到底有沒有納入我們淨零排放的規劃裡面？","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:36:15.568000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:36:20.832000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們只有提到部分的試辦，例如說，未來電動車的比例要到多少。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:36:20.992000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:36:55.094000+08:00","text":"因為未來財劃法過後，這些工作是在地方政府，垃圾車的購買是地方政府要負擔做這個事，前幾個禮拜我有請同仁跟我報告，就是未來對於電動圾垃車的規劃，第一個，費用太高，然後我們也用了各種減碳或是增量抵換的方式算進去，還是有一段差距，所以我們還在算到底這部分的財務狀況是怎麼樣，我們當然是希望，如果老舊的垃圾車要換新，新購的垃圾車就可以買一些電動的或是更環保的車。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:36:55.234000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:37:02.318000+08:00","text":"目前我們一直在收集全世界到底有沒有這樣一個案例，不過也跟委員坦承，目前還不多，所以我們現在要努力來做。","quality":0.872},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:37:03.118000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:37:11.146000+08:00","text":"我們之前都用柴油垃圾車，後來好像就是為了減碳，有購置低碳垃圾車。是。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:37:11.826000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:37:26.558000+08:00","text":"就是改善垃圾車的電動壓縮艙，還有主要讓垃圾車能夠輕化，但是重點是它還是柴油車，還是會排放二氧化碳，所以對於我們達成全面淨零碳排的目標，其實還有一大段差距。","quality":0.803},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:37:28.319000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:38:26.737000+08:00","text":"尤其我們看，我們的目標之一是2030年市區公車要全面電動化，2040年小客車、機車全面電動化，到現在據我們了解，從2016年到2026年，我們在推廣電動車，但是電動車好像只是幾台在試辦、試用，我們現在主要在改善低碳垃圾車，從2016年到2026年，我們看全國好像也只有1,864輛，只到全國的三成，所以連低碳垃圾車這個目標，我們都離得很遠，現在我們臺灣到處在跑的垃圾車，有七成還是最原始的柴油垃圾車，所以照這樣來講，不單離2050淨零排放的目標很遠，連達到低碳垃圾車這個目標都還很遙遠。","quality":0.827},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:38:33.078000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:39:14.161000+08:00","text":"報告委員，低碳垃圾車比電動公車這個目標還有一段差距，因為它的重量比較多，然後每天要跑大概100公里左右，我們的確有算過，目前關鍵在於財源上面，因為目前包含交通部在內，現在財源上遇到很大的壓力，例如公車全面電動化也遇到很大的挑戰，因為現在的價格跟原來燒柴油的其實是有一段的價差，那這個通常過去都是用補貼的方式，所以未來如果要照委員的建議，納入多元垃圾處理的計畫第三期的話，我們可以來想辦法，但是這個預算的爭取現在遇到一些很大的挑戰。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:39:14.161000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:39:24.908000+08:00","text":"當然我們心裡面是期待有這樣的做法，所以目前我知道可能很難做得到，所以一直不斷地跟同仁討論，有沒有一些租賃的新的做法能夠來達成這樣的目標？","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:39:24.908000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:39:55.651000+08:00","text":"好，剛剛我們有講到，這十年全國低碳垃圾車只有一千八百多輛，後來我們到環管署的網站去瞭解一下，這個數據很奇怪，113年8月底，環管署的業務上面寫全國低碳垃圾車有1,864輛，比例是23.6%，結果在9月多，他們的新聞稿又說，截至8月底，低碳垃圾車只有1,550輛，可是比例變成28%。","quality":0.853},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:40:00.314000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:40:08.379000+08:00","text":"數量減少，結果比例變大，環管署網站是不是發生了什麼問題？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:40:09.280000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:40:22.127000+08:00","text":"這個我們要去瞭解一下，這個低碳垃圾車應該指的是壓縮機或是傾斗在處理的過程當中是用電池，不是用燒柴油來做處理，我猜它的定義不是這樣。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:40:23.848000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:40:30.116000+08:00","text":"還是要注意一下，公布的網站怎麼會車輛減少而比例增加？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:40:31.818000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:40:58.822000+08:00","text":"另外我們也看到，113年8月底累計節省了1,102萬公升的油耗，減少3萬1,700公噸的排碳，結果9月發的新聞稿又變成節省530萬公升的油耗，減少1萬4,700公噸的排碳，我不知道為什麼都是同單位出來的數據卻會前後矛盾？","quality":0.793},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:00.483000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:02.604000+08:00","text":"叫大家到底看哪一個數據才是對的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:02.704000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:05.904000+08:00","text":"這個我會回去瞭解一下，再給委員正確的答案。","quality":1},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:06.184000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:10.446000+08:00","text":"對啊，希望部長跟環管署對這部分多加注意一下。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:10.766000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:11.366000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:12.046000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:24.750000+08:00","text":"現在多元垃圾處理計畫第二期有編列換購低碳垃圾車400輛，總經費16億，這16億都有花到買低碳垃圾車上面嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:24.750000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:35.095000+08:00","text":"他們就是所謂壓縮還有漏斗的傾倒功能是屬於電池的，不是一直用柴油在運轉。","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:36.496000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:37.997000+08:00","text":"對，等於不用整個柴油嘛。對、對。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:38.517000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:49.943000+08:00","text":"就是壓縮艙的部分做成電動，這樣至少減少柴油的用量，這部分經費有全部用在這方面上面嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:49.943000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:41:51.104000+08:00","text":"應該是都用在這個部分。","quality":1},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:41:53.766000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:42:09.898000+08:00","text":"希望我們還是要逐步去做，尤其垃圾車在大街小巷跑，不單是清潔隊員，民眾常常跟在垃圾車旁邊，碳排這麼高，對民眾的健康真的有很大的影響。是。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:42:14.904000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:42:46.280000+08:00","text":"另外，我們看了一下，市面上電動垃圾車的廠商其實不只一家，可是我不瞭解為什麼環境部只有找一家特定廠商的車款在做示範，連這計畫書裡面也都只有針對這一家，這個並沒有辦法去做多元，而且我看都是做六立方米，我們現在市面上幾乎都是八立方米，為什麼做六立方米？","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:42:46.481000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:42:49.262000+08:00","text":"而且那麼多廠家為什麼只做那一家？","quality":1},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:42:50.242000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:42:55.784000+08:00","text":"你只做那一家，它的各方面的數據是不是就變得比較狹隘？","quality":1},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:42:56.825000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:42:57.665000+08:00","text":"數據未必能夠完整。","quality":1},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:42:58.625000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:43:35.561000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員的建議，前幾個禮拜我有聽他們跟我做簡報，有談到這個問題，我也有下了一個指示，希望他們可以公開地讓大家提出更好的方案，如果方案對的話，政府可以有一些補助來研發，加速這個狀況進行，因為現在情況是，就同仁報給我的數字，其實全面電動化的車跟傳統的車相比，價錢大概多了一倍，所以這個財務模式沒有辦法起來，所以我要他們想辦法把這個差距縮到最小，所以我們希望可以更開放地讓大家能夠進來，甚至也不必限制只有國內的，國外如果好的也可以拿來做使用。","quality":0.965},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:43:36.201000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:43:40.463000+08:00","text":"對啊，據我們瞭解，現在國外很多都是全電動的垃圾車。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:43:40.463000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:43:40.884000+08:00","text":"是，已經有了。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:43:42.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:44:03.174000+08:00","text":"那時候問環境部，回答好像是說電動垃圾車什麼價格太高啦，還有一方面是它的里程能夠跑多遠等等，我後來聽了好幾家，外面也看了很多廠商，他們說對於這些方面基本上都能夠克服，並不是像環境部講的那麼的困難。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:44:03.174000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:44:16.918000+08:00","text":"是，委員的話，我也跟我同仁講過，就是外面的房車、電動車都比油車便宜了，所以不該給我看到一個數字，即電動的垃圾車比油車貴一倍，我認為不應該這樣，所以我請他們再調查。","quality":0.986},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:44:17.058000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:44:50.281000+08:00","text":"所以我們擔心，像有那麼多廠商，結果我們只找一家，事實上國外用電動垃圾車早就已經試營運很久，很多早就正式上路，而連我們國內的情況，據我們瞭解是這些問題都可以克服，結果我擔心環境部只有得到這一家的訊息，你去做試驗也只做這一家，只有這一家的數據，事實上是其他廠家都說這些他們都可以克服，包含價格等等。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:44:50.841000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:04.853000+08:00","text":"所以我希望環境部應該要多元去找更多的廠家來試驗，然後去找這些數據，包含價格、功能、性能等等，是不是應該多元化，不應該狹隘，因為我看是只有一家。","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:45:05.914000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:17.263000+08:00","text":"委員，我們是開放的，讓多元的來解決這個問題，就很像電動車一定要有市場的機制，讓多元的進來才可以把價格降下來，我們才可以普及使用。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:45:17.863000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:27.870000+08:00","text":"好，部長，針對這個部分，希望能夠找更多的規格來研析工作報告，也希望能夠儘快朝這個目標邁進。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"彭部長啓明","start":"2026-04-29T12:45:28.170000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:29.811000+08:00","text":"可以，謝謝委員的建議，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"涂委員權吉","start":"2026-04-29T12:45:30.351000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:32.012000+08:00","text":"謝謝部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T12:45:32.012000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:32.553000+08:00","text":"謝謝涂權吉委員質詢。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T12:45:33.053000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T12:45:35.910143+08:00","text":"接下來請王正旭員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}