{"error":false,"id":["168986"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":168986,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/168986","日期":"2026-04-29","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-26-8","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":8,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-04-29T16:52:13+08:00","結束時間":"2026-04-29T17:01:36+08:00","影片長度":"00:09:23","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/6301273cb2dfee84352aed975cea711e84e55221ec8869c03db016e2cb5fd06f115c5ccd0058a55f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"盧縣一","委員發言時間":"16:52:13 - 17:01:36","會議時間":"2026-04-29T14:30:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議（事由：（下午2時30分起。若上午議程尚未結束，待結束後接續召開）\n一、繼續審查\n(一)委員柯志恩等17人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(二)委員林月琴等17人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(三)委員王育敏等16人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n......(因系統字數上限，詳見議事日程)\n二、審查\n(一)委員徐欣瑩等18人擬具「醫療法第二十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(二)委員洪申翰、賴惠員等17人擬具「醫療法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(三)委員盧縣一等16人擬具「醫療法第七十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(四)委員鍾佳濱等19人擬具「醫療法第八十四條條文修正草案」案。\n(五)委員王正旭等24人擬具「醫療法增訂第七十一條之一條文草案」案。\n(六)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「醫療法第一百零三條條文修正草案」案。\n(七)委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「醫療法第一百零三條條文修正草案」案。\n(八)委員盧縣一等17人擬具「醫療法第四十九條及第五十條條文修正草案」案。\n(九)委員蘇巧慧等19人擬具「醫療法增訂第二十二條之一條文草案」案。\n(十)委員賴惠員等20人擬具「醫療法第八十四條及第一百零四條條文修正草案」案。\n(十一)委員李彥秀等16人擬具「醫療法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(十二)委員陳瑩等16人擬具「醫療法第八十八條條文修正草案」案。\n(十三)委員劉建國等18人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十四)委員劉建國等16人擬具「醫療法第四十九條及第五十條條文修正草案」案。\n(十五)委員邱鎮軍等21人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十六)委員劉建國等16人擬具「醫療法增訂第九十八條之一條文草案」案。\n(十七)委員林思銘等23人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十八)委員羅智強等16人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十九)委員張嘉郡等17人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(二十)委員蘇清泉等22人擬具「醫療法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(二十一)委員羅明才等16人擬具「醫療法第十條、第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(二十二)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(二十三)委員許宇甄等21人擬具「醫療法第二十四條及第一百零六條條文修正草案」案。\n(二十四)委員廖偉翔等19人擬具「醫療法第一百零二條條文修正草案」案。\n【第二(二十四)案，如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書，則不予審查】\n【僅詢答，下午1時30分起辦理發言】\n【4月29日上午9時起及下午2時30分起為一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"王委員育敏","start":0.047843750000000004,"end":2.5959687500000004,"speaker_score":0.746},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":5.29596875,"end":7.287218750000001,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"王委員育敏","start":8.114093750000002,"end":9.66659375,"speaker_score":0.746},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"王委員育敏","start":10.94909375,"end":14.57721875,"speaker_score":0.746},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":12.400343750000001,"end":13.04159375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":13.04159375,"end":13.277843750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":21.765968750000003,"end":24.63471875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":24.719093750000003,"end":25.360343750000002,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":25.984718750000003,"end":35.16471875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"王委員育敏","start":26.32221875,"end":26.74409375,"speaker_score":0.746},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":35.721593750000004,"end":39.63659375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":39.822218750000005,"end":40.90221875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":41.205968750000004,"end":80.38971875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":80.57534375,"end":81.68909375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":82.14471875000001,"end":84.38909375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":84.97971875,"end":87.03846875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":87.52784375,"end":89.62034375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":90.48096875,"end":118.32471875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":118.61159375000001,"end":130.06971875000002,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":130.12034375000002,"end":130.74471875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":131.68971875,"end":141.30846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":135.97596875000002,"end":136.21221875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":141.59534375,"end":146.60721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":146.69159375,"end":149.81346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":149.88096875000002,"end":178.28159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":179.10846875000001,"end":207.50909375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":207.69471875000002,"end":214.20846875,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":215.15346875,"end":216.28409375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":217.31346875000003,"end":219.10221875000002,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":219.10221875000002,"end":230.57721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":230.84721875000002,"end":231.23534375000003,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":231.30284375000002,"end":233.31096875000003,"speaker_score":0.939},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":232.72034375,"end":232.83846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"王委員育敏","start":235.48784375000002,"end":236.14596875,"speaker_score":0.746},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"盧委員縣一","start":239.60534375,"end":239.87534375,"speaker_score":0.939},{"spe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能隨便的咆哮啊去攻打醫護人員應該是有一個嚇阻的作用在前面那至於他因為他是因為生病的關係因為他酒醉的關係還是怎麼樣後來不起訴我是覺得那個是後面的可是當下你要怎麼去把這個"},{"start":119.587,"end":130.477,"text":"這個情況控制我覺得那應該是我們要去無論是法務部這邊 水準檢察官這邊或者是我們衛福部這邊都共同商討的議題是不是"},{"start":132.899,"end":149.551,"text":"就是感謝委員對這個議題的關心我想以執法機關的一個這樣的角度來說確實是有應該說應該有責任說一起去共同維護防止這樣的一個現象那也跟委員報告因為"},{"start":150.371,"end":177.483,"text":"檢察官在這邊的話針對案件來說他是屬於一個執法的一個角色所以必須要針對確實有符合案件有應該說行為有符合構成要件涉及到違法的話檢察官在這邊才會有比較大的一個著力點那當然在積極面而言各地方的檢察機關也會與警政單位去做一個密切的一個合作那儘快的去因應這樣的一個暴力行為的處理"},{"start":180.162,"end":205.524,"text":"針對第24條跟106條防務的建議就是說文字上有法體性的問題要分析可以接受技術性的修正比如說違反第二線規定警察機關接後通報後應急派員排除或制止然後我是覺得這些所謂現行犯的這些當然都是屬於比較陌生的字眼我想說應該是先支持警察在醫療暴力現場立即排除危害這樣的一個"},{"start":206.464,"end":232.066,"text":"修法的一個心血條件讓這些事情可以在那個當下之下就可以被控制住你支持這樣的一個修法的一個未來的方向嗎針對說那個徵定警察機關街道通報街道通報應急派員赴現場這個部分那這邊是尊重委員的一個職權的處理OK好那就謝謝那麼請部長"},{"start":235.523,"end":236.013,"text":"好 全部整"},{"start":240.662,"end":264.828,"text":"對 剛才大家都提到了三方貨幣比這個今天公布的這個新聞可是我們之前接收到的一個訊息就是當然我們護理事公會對這個非常的要求可是還有一個是他們的待遇的問題剛才你都提到了可能一些醫院的一些層級或者說它的規模或者是它的收益可能沒有辦法去支撐它的所謂的"},{"start":266.568,"end":291.828,"text":"立即性的一個所謂的income可是我一直覺得是不是衛福部有一個公益算或者說特別的一個獎勵措施去留任或者說去補助這些偏鄉或者是比較醫療缺乏的地區因為他們總覺得說他們的待遇跟都會或者是說他們的所要花的這些三班的成本確實是比都會區還要大很多所以"},{"start":292.549,"end":315.349,"text":"我覺得在偏向這個護理人員的待遇我覺得你應該實際的去看他們在這個獎勵出示之後呢他們實際增加的這些福利到底是有多少好 當然這個跟委員說明我們現在的這個目前直接挹注給這個護理人員的大概是兩個一個是這個"},{"start":317.19,"end":339.931,"text":"夜班津貼 夜班津貼是不論層級不論在哪個區域大概都一樣那第二個是三班互併比獎勵那三班互併比獎勵它就會有這個偏遠地區比較高的比例不過是不是足夠這個我們會來研究也許未來我們如果要更積極的推動的時候我們再來爭取"},{"start":340.572,"end":364.167,"text":"希望給偏鄉的醫院能夠更多的資訊還是希望給我實際的數字偏鄉地區跟地匯區的差距我這邊有提到第49條跟第50條的放寬醫療社團法人這個醫療法規我們在辦公室也討論過那我還是要希望說當然得到的答案很清楚很擔心中資那到底這個中資的部分我們要怎麼去"},{"start":366.188,"end":374.995,"text":"怎麼講看手是經由還是控制權不透明我是不是覺得是不是要事前審查或者實質收容這個揭露是不是有這方面的一個事前的規範"},{"start":377.07,"end":397.447,"text":"跟委員說明當然剛剛這個劉建國委員質詢的時候我也提到那麼如何在這個鬆綁這個醫療社團法人的社員條件就是讓法人可以這個成為這個醫療社團法人的社員的同時那強化能夠維持他的公益本質啊"},{"start":398.208,"end":418.649,"text":"那所以在這個如果是要法人這個成為這個醫療社團法人的社員的時候可能要採事前審查跟自然人的方式會不一樣那我們會去審查他這個法人公司他的財務的健全性啊還有他的資金來源啊等等這些的條件來看資金來源的審查這是不是經濟部這邊可以幫忙"},{"start":422.092,"end":449.973,"text":"我們會請這個經濟部來協助那我常常聽到就是在我們部落的一些合作的醫院其實都是來自社團法人所以其實他們在偏鄉的一個付出我覺得他們已經超出我們所謂的財團法人我們在部落我們有幾屋台鄉嘛家鄉這些比較偏鄉從來沒有看過常跟來幫忙可是來幫忙都是我們剛才講的安泰醫院啊保健醫院這些社團法人醫院"},{"start":450.413,"end":470.835,"text":"所以其實他們在偏鄉的復出我相信大家是有目共睹所以我希望這個所謂我們把法人能夠變成他們的社員的時候可以增進我們一些企業的挹注讓我們偏鄉的醫療能夠更進步我覺得可以幫忙我們衛福部的一些缺口我覺得這是大家 導入一些社會的資本共同努力的方向"},{"start":471.556,"end":487.007,"text":"那個也是因為剛好近年這個ESG的精神很普及所以如果有一些企業願意投入到這個我們的醫療事業其實我們也是歡迎的好 謝謝那最後就是至於掛號費的問題我想知道我們部長的那個態度"},{"start":492.113,"end":520.849,"text":"因為有6萬名的基層醫師說應該不要設置上限應該不要針對掛號費這個部分有多少一些規範是不是應該採取自由的競爭的模式你覺得呢這樣我們會當然在掛號費我們過去是把它定位在它是一個行政費用不是醫療費用所以依法它不一定是要經過衛生局的核准"},{"start":521.429,"end":536.575,"text":"就可以收取但是呢畢竟我們這個是整個是健保的體系所以健保的體系必須考用到這個病人的就醫的障礙我們開辦健保的目的就是要去除掉就醫的經濟障礙"},{"start":537.935,"end":560.183,"text":"那麼因此也不應該有太過高的掛號費如果這是完全自費的機構我沒有意見但是只要是健保的特約機構它的任何的收費其實都需要被考量才不會造成另外一層的就醫障礙而喪失了我們健保開辦的本意好 那謝謝部長好 謝謝 謝謝委員"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:52:18.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:52:20.013000+08:00","text":"主席，有請主任檢察官。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T16:52:25.816000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:52:26.976000+08:00","text":"請陳照世主任檢察官。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"陳主任檢察官照世","start":"2026-04-29T16:52:27.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:52:27.276000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:52:27.296000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:52:27.576000+08:00","text":"好，我們讓部長休息一下。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:52:40.009000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:52:51.994000+08:00","text":"剛剛王育敏委員提及醫療暴力的問題，延續他的問題，我一直在想要怎麼檢討這件事情，其實應該要產生嚇阻的力量，那要怎麼產生嚇阻的力量？","quality":0.746},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:52:54.275000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:53:11.483000+08:00","text":"部長跟我同樣都是醫生，一定都待過急診室，在急診室那樣忙碌的氛圍裡面……甚至我看到法務部的報告裡面還說，如果是一般掛號人員還是其他基層行政人員，按照比例原則，他們並不受罪責相當性的約束。","quality":0.774},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:53:12.003000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:53:21.589000+08:00","text":"也就是說，在整個醫療環境壓力那麼高張的狀況之下，如果有一個人呈現暴力行為的時候，究竟應該怎麼樣產生嚇阻的力量，我覺得應該要思考這個問題。","quality":0.841},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:53:21.589000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:53:39.811000+08:00","text":"我們首先回想一下，之前有一位明星廣末涼子在東京對醫護人員做出暴力行為，雖然最後的結果是他沒有被起訴，不過當下他們做了什麼處置呢？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:53:40.633000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:53:42.377000+08:00","text":"日本的警方關了他八天。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:53:44.149000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:53:46.951000+08:00","text":"我們是不是應該要有一個相對應的機制？","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:53:47.091000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:53:53.595000+08:00","text":"也就是說，當下有人對醫護人員做出暴力行為的時候，是不是應該先強行做出適當的措施？","quality":0.649},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:53:54.776000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:54:25.999000+08:00","text":"讓很多人去醫院的時候，不能隨便咆哮或攻擊醫護人員，應該要有一個嚇阻的作用在前面，如果他是因為生病的關係、酒醉的關係還是怎麼樣，所以後來不起訴，我覺得那是後面的處置，可是當下要怎麼control這個情況，這應該是法務部和衛福部要共同商討的議題，是不是？","quality":0.835},{"speaker":"陳主任檢察官照世","start":"2026-04-29T16:54:26.779000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:54:28.681000+08:00","text":"感謝委員對這個議題的關心。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳主任檢察官照世","start":"2026-04-29T16:54:30.102000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:54:40.789000+08:00","text":"以執法機關的角度來說，確實有責任應該要共同防止這樣的現象發生。","quality":0.828},{"speaker":"陳主任檢察官照世","start":"2026-04-29T16:54:41.470000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:55:00.278000+08:00","text":"在此也跟委員報告，針對案件來說，檢察官是屬於執法的角色，所以必須是行為確實有符合構成要件、涉及到違法，檢察官才會有比較大的著力點。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"陳主任檢察官照世","start":"2026-04-29T16:55:00.378000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:55:10.463000+08:00","text":"當然在積極面而言，各地方的檢察機關也會與警政單位密切合作，儘快因應這種暴力行為的處理。","quality":0.975},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:55:13.162000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:55:53.316000+08:00","text":"針對第二十四條及第一百零六條，法務部的建議是文字上有法體性的問題，本席可以接受技術性的修正，比如違反第二項規定，警察機關接獲通報後應即派員排除或制止，所謂現行犯這些當然都是屬於比較陌生的字眼，應該是先支持警察在醫療暴力現場立即排除危害這樣的修法先決條件，讓這些事情在那個當下就可以被控制住，你支持未來這樣的修法方向嗎？","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"陳主任檢察官照世","start":"2026-04-29T16:55:53.316000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:56:03.404000+08:00","text":"針對增訂警察機關接到通報應即派員赴現場這個部分，我們尊重委員職權的處理。","quality":0.794},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:56:04.405000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:56:05.006000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:56:05.006000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T16:56:06.006000+08:00","text":"接下來請教部長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-29T16:56:05.046000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:56:05.066000+08:00","text":"請部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:56:05.066000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T16:56:13.662000+08:00","text":"盧委員好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:56:13.662000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:56:55.321000+08:00","text":"剛才大家都提到今天有關三班護病比的新聞，可是我們之前接收到的訊息是……當然護理師公會對這方面非常的要求，但還有一個是他們待遇的問題，剛才你都提到了，可能醫院的層級、規模或收益沒有辦法支撐立即性的income，可是我一直覺得衛福部是不是應該要有公務預算或是特別獎勵措施去留任，或者補助偏鄉及醫療比較缺乏的地區？","quality":0.84},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:56:55.321000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:57:15.698000+08:00","text":"因為他們總覺得他們的待遇跟都會區有落差，或者說他們所要花的上班成本確實比都會區還要大很多，所以針對偏鄉護理人員的待遇，應該要看在提出這些獎勵措施之後，他們實際增加的福利到底有多少。","quality":0.835},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:57:16.719000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:57:36.096000+08:00","text":"好，跟委員說明，我們目前直接挹注給護理人員的大概是兩個部分，一個是夜班津貼，夜班津貼是不論層級、不論在哪個區域，大家都一樣。","quality":0.945},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:57:36.256000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:57:44.604000+08:00","text":"第二個是三班護病比獎勵，三班護病比獎勵就會有偏遠地區比較高的比例。","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:57:46.325000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:57:56.954000+08:00","text":"至於是不是足夠，這個我們來研究，也許未來如果要更積極推動的時候，我們再來爭取給偏鄉醫院更周延的挹注。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:57:57.114000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:58:00.336000+08:00","text":"還是希望部長給我實際的數字，針對偏鄉地區跟都會區的差距。好。","quality":0.741},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:58:01.417000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:58:14.665000+08:00","text":"我有提到第四十九條及第五十條放寬醫療社團法人制度的醫療法規，我們在辦公室也討論過，我得到的答案是你們很擔心中資。","quality":0.774},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:58:15.766000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:58:25.793000+08:00","text":"針對中資的部分，我們要怎麼看守金流還是預防控制權不透明，是不是應該事前審查或者實質受益人揭露？","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:58:26.454000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:58:27.995000+08:00","text":"是不是有這方面的事前規範？","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:58:30.070000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:58:50.427000+08:00","text":"跟委員說明，剛剛劉建國委員質詢的時候，我也提到如何鬆綁醫療社團法人的社員條件，就是在讓法人可以成為醫療社團法人社員的同時，能夠強化並維持其公益本質。","quality":0.928},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:58:52.770000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:59:09.607000+08:00","text":"如果法人要成為醫療社團法人社員的時候，可能要採事前審查，跟自然人的方式不一樣，我們會去審查法人公司的財務健全性，還有他的資金來源等等這一些條件。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:59:10.067000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:59:11.629000+08:00","text":"針對資金來源的審查機制，經濟部是不是可以幫忙？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T16:59:15.092000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T16:59:17.694000+08:00","text":"我們會請經濟部來協助。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T16:59:19.115000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:00.612000+08:00","text":"我常常聽到與部落合作的醫院其實都是來自社團法人，他們在偏鄉的付出已經超出所謂的財團法人，尤其霧台鄉、瑪家鄉這些比較偏鄉的部落，從來沒有看過長庚來幫忙，每次來幫忙的都是我剛才講的安泰醫院、寶建醫院這些社團法人醫院，我相信他們在偏鄉的付出大家有目共睹，所以我希望當法人能夠變成社員的時候，可以增進一些企業的挹注，讓我們偏鄉的醫療能夠更進步，可以幫忙衛福部補一些缺口，我覺得這是大家共同努力的方向。","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:00.872000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:02.294000+08:00","text":"導入一些社會的資本協助。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:06.277000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:16.384000+08:00","text":"剛好近年ESG的精神很普及，所以如果有一些企業願意投入醫療事業，其實我們也是歡迎的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:16.624000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:17.425000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:17.565000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:19.987000+08:00","text":"最後，至於掛號費的問題，我想知道部長的態度。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:25.113000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:38.040000+08:00","text":"因為有6萬名基層醫師認為應該不要設置上限、不要針對掛號費這個部分多所規範，應該採取自由競爭的模式，你覺得呢？","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:42.423000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:00:55.089000+08:00","text":"當然，掛號費過去是定位為行政費用，不是醫療費用，所以依法不一定要經過衛生局的核准就可以收取。","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T17:00:55.670000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:01:15.157000+08:00","text":"但是畢竟這是健保的體系，必須考量到病人的就醫障礙，我們開辦健保的目的就是要去除就醫的經濟障礙，因此也不應該有過高的掛號費。","quality":0.982},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T17:01:15.157000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:01:30.882000+08:00","text":"如果這是完全自費的機構，我沒有意見，但是只要是健保的特約機構，任何收費都需要被考量，才不會造成另外一層的就醫障礙，喪失健保開辦的本意。","quality":1},{"speaker":"盧委員縣一","start":"2026-04-29T17:01:31.463000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:01:33.043000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"石部長崇良","start":"2026-04-29T17:01:33.163000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-29T17:01:33.183000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席（盧委員縣一）","start":"2026-04-29T17:01:33.683000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-29T17:01:36.254429+08:00","text":"現在請陳瑩委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}