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11:17:19","會議時間":"2026-04-30T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期交通委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於行政院公共工程委員會單位預算。二、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部單位預算。三、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部中央氣象署單位預算。四、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部觀光署及所屬單位預算。五、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部運輸研究所單位預算。六、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部公路局及所屬單位預算。七、審查115年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部航港局單位預算。八、審查115年度中央政府總預算案直轄市及縣市政府一般性補助款-交通部主管第1目交通部、第2目公路局及所屬、第3目航港局及第4目觀光署及所屬。九、審查115年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務股份有限公司營業預算。十、審查115年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管交通作業基金─國道公路建設管理基金分預算。十一、審查115年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管交通作業基金─觀光發展基金分預算。十二、審查115年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管航港建設基金非營業預算。十三、處理114年度中央政府總預算附屬單位預算關於交通部主管預算凍結案計48案。【開會事由一至十二僅進行詢答；交通部（含一般性補助款-交通部主管第1目）預算提案截止收件時間：5月6日下午2時；行政院公共工程委員會、中央氣象署、觀光署及所屬（含一般性補助款-交通部主管第4目）、運輸研究所預算提案截止收件時間：5月19日下午2時；公路局及所屬（含一般性補助款-交通部主管第2目）、航港局（含一般性補助款-交通部主管第3目）預算提案截止收件時間：5月21日下午2時】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":0.97596875,"end":7.25346875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":14.189093750000001,"end":72.08721875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":14.62784375,"end":14.813468750000002,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":72.69471875,"end":75.34409375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":75.36096875,"end":90.21096875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":90.31221875,"end":92.77596875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":93.33284375000001,"end":105.01034375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":105.01034375,"end":111.94596875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":111.92909375,"end":117.41346875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":117.95346875000001,"end":123.25221875000001,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":123.50534375000001,"end":138.82784375,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":139.65471875,"end":194.22846875000002,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"陳主任委員金德","start":196.21971875,"end":196.92846875,"speaker_score":0.963},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":201.46784375000001,"end":201.50159375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":201.50159375,"end":201.85596875000002,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":202.04159375,"end":202.05846875,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":202.05846875,"end":202.83471875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":202.93596875,"end":250.45596875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":250.55721875,"end":264.02346875,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":264.02346875,"end":278.63721875000005,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":279.41346875,"end":279.97034375000004,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":279.97034375000004,"end":280.07159375000003,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":280.07159375000003,"end":280.24034375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":280.24034375,"end":288.15471875000003,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":288.15471875000003,"end":295.37721875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":296.30534375,"end":297.58784375000005,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"陳部長世凱","start":297.70596875,"end":297.73971875,"speaker_score":0.953},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":297.73971875,"end":298.02659375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"何局長淑萍","start":298.53284375000004,"end":310.22721875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"何局長淑萍","start":310.29471875,"end":315.15471875000003,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"何局長淑萍","start":315.50909375000003,"end":316.67346875000004,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":316.31909375000004,"end":321.01034375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"何局長淑萍","start":321.73596875000004,"end":323.86221875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":323.65971875,"end":323.69346875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":323.86221875,"end":325.73534375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"何局長淑萍","start":325.88721875000005,"end":339.50534375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","speaker_name":"游委員顥","start":339.7247187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主委好那因為今天我要相關單位的就是業務很多啊所以我簡單的直接就叫工程會的陳主委就是有關於目前的這些預算的部分都有清楚的看過但是實際上他的現在"},{"start":32.839,"end":52.105,"text":"預算的變略增長幅度達到11.81%可是工地的這個死亡人數跟職災人數並沒有下降那在相關的這個職災的類型啊那主要常見的還是未追防護措施施工價位固定工區防護不足所以還是持續佔有一個高的一個公安的一個"},{"start":52.845,"end":71.772,"text":"死亡率跟這種傷害的程度那想直接就教一下主委在目前在導入職在資料庫的整合配合工程會配合勞動部的部分那這個部分要如何改善以及AIA的風險預警機制因為預算書上面都有寫那如何能夠實際導入運用在救命跟保護公安的部分"},{"start":72.945,"end":91.895,"text":"跟委員報告預算增加的部分分成三大部分一個是薪資第二個就是工程訓練的在花東舉辦的這個工程訓練的學問班第三個是相關AI的相關的預算"},{"start":93.396,"end":116.243,"text":"本會預算相當少會增加是因為這些新增的新增的項目那至於勞安的部分主要是跟勞動部也相關來配合要配合的話如何能夠讓工程會目前的這種就是重大的這種死亡人數能夠下降我們工程會採取的當然是固定的這個查核另外關於這個"},{"start":118.785,"end":137.099,"text":"這個評選的方式啦 金子獎的評選等等都很重視這個承攬商是不是有曾經發生過這樣的職災或者是死亡的這種職災啦所以那個分數扣得非常重 這樣來提醒這樣承攬公務工程的廠商必須特別重視這個職安的問題"},{"start":139.71,"end":162.059,"text":"那我本身還是在這裡建議就是說如果只有透過查核的部分其實還是不夠那相關資料庫的導入跟勞動部的一個會議的這種溝通的這種整合數據以及包括如何在這種訓練上還能夠讓重大的工程能夠被宣導落實我覺得這個是有精進的空間"},{"start":162.659,"end":190.831,"text":"那再來AI的預警機制的這個部分現在大家各部會都在講AI那但是AI不應該只呈現在書面之上那應該是在實際上的部分其實有些部會他們在AI的部分的協助上是有一些具體的執行或改良的一個結果啦那所以我是還是建議這部分到時候也是給我們大家更多的一個說明好不好那這個部分不用特別那個那我們就請交通部好了好不好"},{"start":191.431,"end":196.654,"text":"好 謝謝那有請部長請陳部長部長好部長今天您許多的單位其實都有相關的業務但是我就因為時間有限許多的局長署長他們都做得非常不錯那在這裡我直接先問一下14題"},{"start":217.268,"end":235.615,"text":"就是兩岸擴大直航的這個部分那在珍喜會之後在會台10點的一個措施那其實有6成5以上的民眾其實都非常期待將來的話都能夠在不管是和平也好或者是有很多的更多繁榮的機會也好"},{"start":236.155,"end":264.349,"text":"那在這個他們現在會台10點也有提到一個就是擴大航點擴大直航那我想請問一下部長對於這樣子的一個措施來講應該也是表達正向支持嗎像委員報告其實如果有這個需求的話我們當然會盡量來協助因為站在民航的立場我們希望我們不管是通商或者是旅遊的民眾那能夠方便好這個部分我們會來思考好那目前來講在"},{"start":266.17,"end":295.169,"text":"今年度有沒有跟航空業者還有曾經討論過在兩岸之間尤其是大陸地區的一些城市那有沒有哪些地方是可以來開放新的直航的航電還有開過幾次會議向委員報告這個部分如果業者有需求會主動來跟民航局來提出那目前沒有業者來跟我們提出這方面的需求那部內這邊或是局內這邊有沒有主動來詢問大家對於這個部分有沒有相關的需求"},{"start":296.448,"end":320.72,"text":"我請局長回答好不好可以基本上因為我們有420班那大陸的業者有197班他已經用了197那我們國籍的業者已經用了110幾班大概55%那國籍業者的部分並沒有特別提出來充分的需要再增加的部分那有沒有找他們曾經詢問過或是聊過在今年度的時候"},{"start":322.236,"end":337.371,"text":"沒有特別的正式會議那去年度的時候有沒有大部分我們不會針對這個部分去做正式會議因為在這個各國的行權都一樣就是說各國的行權如果業者有提出需求他們認為也要增班不是在這個計畫內的我們會再來做評估"},{"start":339.793,"end":365.951,"text":"那再來過去在馬英九執政時期的時候馬總統執政時期的時候這樣子的一個航運量啊就是直航的這樣子航運量載客量那跟現在比起來的話其實短少許多這個也是沒錯的嘛那因為時間有限啊那在商業總會他也呼籲了其實不管是小兩會洽談能夠擴大航線及航點還打破目前兩岸直航僵局啊"},{"start":366.391,"end":388.396,"text":"那所以本席還是在這裡因為時間有限也希望部長這邊跟局長這邊能夠來積極協助不管是那個航空業者的一個詢問或者是包括商業總會他們也提出了這樣子的需求那能夠盡量的來協助因為不管是國際也好兩岸也好我相信整個全球的市場都是我們台灣人的市場"},{"start":388.976,"end":417.325,"text":"所以說在這樣子的一個一個契機的打開希望也能夠換著一個心態能夠部長還能夠主動的來協助相關的業者還能夠讓台灣人不管是在全球的國際或是兩岸的部分都能夠有更多的一個機會我相信這樣子會是更好的一個方向是好如果國籍的業者有提出來我會盡量來協助好我們感謝油耗委員"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:10:22.981000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:10:22.981000+08:00","text":"謝謝召委。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:10:23.041000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:10:23.221000+08:00","text":"先請工程會陳金德主委。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-30T11:10:23.221000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:10:23.401000+08:00","text":"請陳主委。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-30T11:10:36.469000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:10:36.709000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:10:37.350000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:10:37.550000+08:00","text":"主委好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:10:38.530000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:11:16.506000+08:00","text":"因為今天相關單位的業務很多，所以我簡單的直接就教工程會陳主委，目前這些預算都有清楚的看過，但是實際上現在預算的編列成長幅度達11.81%，可是工地的死亡人數和職災人數並沒有下降，相關的職災類型，主要常見的缺失還是未做防墜措施、施工架未固定、工區安全防護不足，所以還是持續占有高的工安死亡率跟這種傷害的程度。","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:11:17.326000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:11:28.230000+08:00","text":"想直接就教主委，目前在導入職災資料庫的整合，工程會配合勞動部的這個部分要如何改善以及導入AI的風險預警機制？","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:11:28.590000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:11:39.267000+08:00","text":"因為預算書上面都有寫，如何能夠實際導入，運用在救命跟保護工安的部分？","quality":0.968},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德：跟委員報告，預算增加的部分分成三大部分","start":"2026-04-30T11:11:39.428000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:11:53.875000+08:00","text":"一個是薪資；第二個就是在花東舉辦工程訓練的學分班；第三個是AI的相關預算。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德：跟委員報告，預算增加的部分分成三大部分","start":"2026-04-30T11:11:55.396000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:12:00.578000+08:00","text":"所以本會預算相當少，會增加是因為這些新增的項目。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德：跟委員報告，預算增加的部分分成三大部分","start":"2026-04-30T11:12:01.718000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:12:06.420000+08:00","text":"至於勞安的部分，主要是跟勞動部來配合。","quality":1},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:12:07.180000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:12:13.782000+08:00","text":"配合的話，如何讓工程會目前這種重大的死亡人數能夠下降？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳主任委員金德","start":"2026-04-30T11:12:13.982000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:12:39.099000+08:00","text":"我們工程會採取的當然是固定的查核，因為關於評選的方式、金質獎的評選等等，都很重視承攬商是不是有曾經發生過這樣的職災或者死亡的這種職災，所以那個分數扣得非常重，以此來提醒承攬公共工程的廠商必須特別重視職安的問題。","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:12:42.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:13:04.059000+08:00","text":"本席還是在這裡建議，如果只有透過查核，其實還是不夠，相關資料庫的導入跟勞動部會議溝通的整合數據，以及包括如何在訓練上能夠讓重大的工程被宣導、落實，我覺得這個是有精進的空間。","quality":0.987},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:13:04.799000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:13:28.909000+08:00","text":"再來AI的預警機制這個部分，現在各部會大家都在講AI，但是AI不應該只呈現在書面上，應該是在實際上的部分，其實有些部會在AI部分的協助上是有一些具體的執行或改良的結果，所以還是建議這部分到時候也是給我們更多的說明，好不好？","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:13:29.870000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.591000+08:00","text":"這個部分不用特別……我們就請交通部好了，謝謝，有請部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.591000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.611000+08:00","text":"請陳部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.611000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-30T11:13:34.611000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.611000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.631000+08:00","text":"部長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:13:33.691000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:14:32.042000+08:00","text":"今天許多的單位其實都有相關的業務，但是因為時間有限，許多的局長、署長他們都做得非常不錯，在這裡我直接先問一下時事題，就是兩岸擴大直航這個部分，在鄭習會之後有惠臺十點的措施，其實有六成五以上的民眾都非常期待，將來都能夠在不管是和平也好，或者是有更多繁榮的機會也好，現在他們的惠臺十點也有提到一個就是擴大航點、擴大直航，我想請問一下部長，對於這樣子的一個措施來講，應該也是表達正向支持吧？","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-04-30T11:14:32.962000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:14:44.969000+08:00","text":"向委員報告，如果有這個需求的話，我們當然會儘量來協助，因為站在民航的立場，我們希望不管是通商或者是旅遊的民眾都能夠方便，這個部分我們會來思考。","quality":0.954},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:14:45.509000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:00.158000+08:00","text":"好，目前來講，在今年度有沒有跟航空業者討論過在兩岸之間，尤其是大陸地區的一些城市，有沒有哪些地方是可以來開放新的直航航點？","quality":0.982},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:01.599000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:03.120000+08:00","text":"有開過幾次會議？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:03.120000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:09.924000+08:00","text":"向委員報告，這個部分如果業者有需求會主動跟民航局提出，目前沒有業者來跟我們提出這方面的需求。","quality":1},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:11.405000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:17.149000+08:00","text":"部內或是局內這邊有沒有主動來詢問大家對於這個部分有沒有相關的需求？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:18.448000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:19.969000+08:00","text":"我請局長回答，好不好？可以。","quality":1},{"speaker":"何局長淑萍","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:20.869000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:38.358000+08:00","text":"基本上，因為我們有420班，大陸的業者有197班，它已經用了197班，我們國籍業者已經用了一百一十幾班，大概百分之五十五，國籍業者的部分並沒有特別提出需要再增加的部分。","quality":0.824},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:38.738000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:41.879000+08:00","text":"在今年度有沒有找他們曾經詢問過或是聊過？","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"何局長淑萍","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:44.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:45.977000+08:00","text":"沒有特別的正式會議。","quality":1},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:46.338000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:47.519000+08:00","text":"去年度的時候有沒有？","quality":1},{"speaker":"何局長淑萍","start":"2026-04-30T11:15:48.159000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:15:59.351000+08:00","text":"大部分我們不會針對這個部分去召開正式會議，因為各國的航權都一樣，就是說各國的航權如果業者有提出需求，他們認為有要增班，不是在這個計畫內的，我們會再來做評估。","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:16:02.133000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:17:12.323000+08:00","text":"再來，過去在馬英九總統執政的時候，這樣子的一個航運量，就是直航的航運量、載客量跟現在比起來的話其實短少許多，這個也是沒錯的，因為時間有限，商業總會也呼籲了，小兩會洽談能夠擴大航線及航點來打破目前兩岸直航僵局，因為時間有限，所以本席在這裡，也希望部長跟局長這邊能夠來積極協助，不管是航空業者的詢問或者是包括商業總會也提出了這樣子的需求，能夠儘量地來協助，因為不管是國際也好、兩岸也好，我相信整個全球市場都是我們臺灣人的市場，所以將這樣子的一個契機打開，希望也能夠換一個心態，部長能夠主動地來協助相關的業者，讓臺灣人不管是在國際或是兩岸的部分都能夠有更多的機會，我相信這樣子會是更好的一個方向。","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"陳部長世凱","start":"2026-04-30T11:17:12.823000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:17:15.664000+08:00","text":"好，如果國籍業者有提出來，我們會儘量來協助。","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"游委員顥","start":"2026-04-30T11:17:15.664000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-30T11:17:18.205000+08:00","text":"好，OK，謝謝。","quality":0.2},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-30T11:17:18.205000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-04-30T11:17:19.325000+08:00","text":"好，我們感謝游顥委員。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-04-30T11:17:19.825000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-04-30T11:17:23.825000+08:00","text":"接下來我們邀請徐富癸委員發言。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}