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我們一定是先立足台灣才有佈局全球"},{"start":96.397,"end":113.825,"text":"那所以你的紅線呢經濟部的紅線以台積電來講的話他一定是在當地他台灣現在台灣還是他最賺錢的生產基地而且最先進的技術也都有在台灣研發中心也都在台灣所以台灣會持續的壯大"},{"start":114.966,"end":139.006,"text":"那全球布局他當然有他這個策略上的一些考量因為他如果不去美國的話那英特爾可能會壯大起來那對他也是可能很大的威脅所以他有必要去那邊做布局那我們也支持他這樣的一個做法可是總不能夠是整個供應鏈都到美國那當然不可能啦是不是所以經濟部有沒有什麼紅線"},{"start":141.083,"end":169.623,"text":"在實務上也做不到從廠商的商業利益策略規劃來講也不可能做到這樣的所以你們沒有設定一個界限因為產業如果對外投資的話一定金額以上都要經過我們這個投審師的審查就是投審會的審查我們當然會思考就是說這樣的投資會不會涉及幾個國家安全或整體的產業利益我們會通盤來考量"},{"start":170.845,"end":198.812,"text":"那他們有沒有可能透過晶片法案就是說把它提到這個ARC裡面或者是未來台美在貿易上面相關的各項的協商裡面他有沒有可能利用他們的晶片法案來降低我們台美之間就是晶片世代的差距呢"},{"start":199.813,"end":226.499,"text":"包委員因為主要過去的晶片法案是拜登政府時代提出來的那主要是補助國外的廠商或是他國內廠商對美國的這個投資嘛但是川普總統現在已經他不補助啦可是他直接他就是直接要求你要按照這個框架然後呢直接縮減了就是晶片世代的差距啊會不會"},{"start":228.323,"end":241.624,"text":"晶片世代的差距還是要看它基本上的競爭跟良率那台積電現在的良率還是最好的其他的公司應該還是沒有辦法跟台積電來做這個良率上的一些競爭"},{"start":242.782,"end":262.588,"text":"那我是說當然台積電的量是最好當然現在有一些就是說好像這個Intel會有一些拿到一些訂單嘛不過你也看到一些相關的報導包括華爾街他們報導他說那個量也很少事實上不具有對台積電的威脅性"},{"start":263.388,"end":282.775,"text":"所以就是說台積電現在領先全球的這樣子的一個先進的技術製程是沒有辦法被取代的再來就是你認為我們不可能就是整個供應鏈都移到美國去是嗎"},{"start":283.955,"end":306.854,"text":"當然不可能 我剛剛提到的那會多少立足台灣是根本對 那會多少那那個只是一個它策略上的一些佈局那會多少那策略上的佈局當然我剛剛提到的就是說我們是被動的廠商他有那樣的意願有那樣的需求的時候我們被動的審查他會不會有國安的疑慮或者是對我們整個產業上的衝擊我們做這樣的審查 對那"},{"start":311.792,"end":328.102,"text":"你認為會多少呢?會多少?多少這個當然要台積電他自己決定啊所以也不確定?對,因為他提出來我們才能夠判斷說他這樣的狀況是不是對我們國家會有這個不利的衝擊這樣的情況是會超過3000億嗎?"},{"start":334.815,"end":360.56,"text":"這個台積電沒有公布我們也沒有辦法去知道這件事情我們還尊重它尊重台積電現在還沒有辦法確定嗎因為現在台積電公布的就是1650億美金那會不會超過3000億這個我沒有辦法回答我沒有辦法幫台積電回答所以你也沒有辦法確定而且我也不是董事"},{"start":362.431,"end":378.19,"text":"所以要問國發會 葉主委你那天跟他去美國你沒問他 他不敢跟你講他可能也不便回答因為台積電他有專任的發言人制度"},{"start":380.216,"end":408.092,"text":"好那再來就是喔我們知道說就是台糖喔他的這個蘭花是要在美國設立生產接力生產嗎那是因應農業部的農業部他們的相關計畫是不是那信保基金有要協助嗎目前我們台糖是沒有跟這接觸因為那個"},{"start":409.265,"end":427.091,"text":"融為部他是想就是說跟那個南華協會他們一個資產基地之類的信保基金他所開放的這個海外投資申請裡面當然除了傳產以外有沒有包含這個部分"},{"start":427.901,"end":454.301,"text":"因為這個有點像農業又有點像產業這算不算報告委員 這個我們不想因為台糖目前都沒有跟這些貸款要去做事因為目前都是用自由的資金而且這個是藍花協會他們組一個公司要去那邊做那個生產的那如果中小型的呢中小型的藍花業者他們想要到海外進行接地生產這算不算 部長這算嗎"},{"start":458.419,"end":472.537,"text":"因為農業部應該有相關的計畫在支持他們海外布局的一些相關的政策所以信保基金部因為農業它本身有信用保證的機制農業部本來就有"},{"start":474.899,"end":494.965,"text":"所以台糖沒有跟信訪基金申請那未來就是說關於就是蘭花的部分進到美國去的這個生產基地那也算在農業部裡面不算在經濟部裡面因為台糖他只是提供那個場域啦提供那個場域給這個蘭花協會他們"},{"start":496.765,"end":524.797,"text":"就是你租給他們因為這涉及到未來你看在那個特別預算裡面有一些在關稅的那個補貼裡面有沒有因為這涉及到兩邊的到底是算在哪一個部分那個是應該是農業部的算在農業部的是不是主要是以南瓜的企業為主嘛好那如果早期發電呢早期發電我想要請問的台湯是不是有早期發電"},{"start":526.419,"end":551.984,"text":"那你們轉系發電做得怎麼樣我們最典型的是那個屏東東海峰的那個矽石廠裡面那這個得到英國認證的前世界第一個被認證是非常ok的當然因為我們那邊的養豬的數量還不是那麼多那要一定的量才會balance那目前還是處於虧損狀況但是你有沒有偷牌"},{"start":553.524,"end":553.544,"text":"好 謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:13.090000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:13.371000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:13.991000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:14.953000+08:00","text":"我想要請龔部長。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:14.953000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:14.973000+08:00","text":"請龔部長。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:14.973000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:25.121000+08:00","text":"謝委員好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:25.121000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:25.261000+08:00","text":"龔部長早安。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:26.142000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:51.260000+08:00","text":"我想請教一下，美國川普總統他有公開的講，他說臺灣偷走了美國的晶片產業，而且要求所有在臺灣做晶片的人都要搬到美國，你認為他的目標是多少的半導體產業？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:53.564000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:47:57.548000+08:00","text":"臺灣的半導體是經過四十年來的努力，我們憑的是實力。","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:47:59.210000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:00.651000+08:00","text":"可是他想要我們搬到那裡啊！","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:01.692000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:02.293000+08:00","text":"他有沒有跟你談？","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:02.293000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:03.293000+08:00","text":"You are running Taiwan.","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:03.293000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:04.293000+08:00","text":"他沒有跟我談。","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:04.293000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:05.293000+08:00","text":"This is one of the……他有沒有跟你談？","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:02.293000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:06.177000+08:00","text":"他沒有跟我談，他都在媒體上講。","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:14.441000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:27.246000+08:00","text":"他沒有跟你談，所以你也不曉得到底美國政府確切的目標是多少，希望臺灣的半導體業能夠整個搬到美國去。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:27.346000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:30.467000+08:00","text":"我們不可能，我們一定是先立足臺灣才有布局全球。","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:31.597000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:34.819000+08:00","text":"所以經濟部的紅線呢？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:34.819000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:48:48.805000+08:00","text":"以台積電來講的話，它一定是在當地，現在臺灣還是它最賺錢的生產基地，而且最先進的技術也都留在臺灣，研發中心也都在臺灣，所以臺灣會持續地壯大。","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:48:50.306000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:05.679000+08:00","text":"針對全球布局，它當然有它策略上的一些考量，因為它如果不去美國的話，英特爾可能會壯大起來，那對它可能也是很大的威脅，所以它有必要去那邊布局，我們也支持它這樣的做法。","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:06.660000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:10.303000+08:00","text":"可是總不能夠是整個供應鏈都到美國，是不是？","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:10.303000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:11.184000+08:00","text":"那當然不可能，實務上就是做不到。","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:12.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:14.006000+08:00","text":"所以經濟部有沒有什麼紅線？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:16.544000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:21.807000+08:00","text":"沒有，這實務上也做不到，從廠商的商業利益、策略規劃來講，也不可能做到這樣。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:22.248000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:23.829000+08:00","text":"所以你們沒有設定一個界線？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:26.711000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:49:44.603000+08:00","text":"產業如果對外投資的話，一定金額以上都要經過我們投審司的審查，就是投審會的審查，我們當然會思考這樣的投資會不會涉及國家安全或整體的產業利益，我們會通盤來考量。","quality":0.986},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:49:45.925000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:50:13.792000+08:00","text":"他們有沒有可能透過晶片法案，就是把它提到ART裡面，或者是在未來臺美貿易各項相關協商裡面，他有沒有可能利用他們的晶片法案來降低臺美之間晶片世代的差距呢？","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:50:15.033000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:50:28.376000+08:00","text":"報告委員，因為過去的晶片法案是拜登政府時代提出來的，主要是補助國外的廠商或者是他們國內的廠商對美國的投資，但是川普總統現在不補助了。","quality":0.855},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:50:29.696000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:50:30.236000+08:00","text":"他不補助了啊！","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:50:32.097000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:50:41.499000+08:00","text":"他就是直接要求你要按照這個框架，然後直接縮減了晶片世代的差距，會不會是這樣？","quality":0.914},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:50:43.323000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:50:56.624000+08:00","text":"晶片世代的差距還是要看它基本上的競爭跟良率，台積電現在的良率還是最好，其他的公司應該還是沒有辦法跟台積電來做良率上的競爭。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:50:59.222000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:00.243000+08:00","text":"當然台積電的良率是最好的。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:04.004000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:17.568000+08:00","text":"好像英特爾會拿到一些訂單，不過你也可以看到相關的報導，包括華爾街的報導，他們說那個量很少，事實上對台積電不具威脅性。","quality":0.792},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:18.388000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:30.192000+08:00","text":"所以台積電現在領先全球的先進技術與製程是沒有辦法被取代的？對。","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:30.772000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:37.775000+08:00","text":"再來，你認為我們不可能把整個供應鏈都移到美國去是嗎？","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:38.955000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:40.156000+08:00","text":"當然不可能，我剛才提到的……","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:41.017000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:41.497000+08:00","text":"那會是多少？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:42.038000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:47.462000+08:00","text":"立足臺灣是根本，那只是它策略上的一些布局。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:47.783000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:51:48.143000+08:00","text":"那會是多少？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:51:48.183000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:01.814000+08:00","text":"關於策略上的布局，我剛剛提到我們是被動的，廠商有那樣的意願、有那樣的需求的時候，我們被動的審查，它會不會有國安的疑慮或者是對整個產業上的衝擊，我們做這樣的審查。","quality":0.945},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:01.834000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:07.753000+08:00","text":"那你認為會是多少呢？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:10.254000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:12.716000+08:00","text":"這個要台積電自己決定啊！","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:14.216000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:15.057000+08:00","text":"所以也不確定？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:16.398000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:22.821000+08:00","text":"對，因為它提出來，我們才能判斷它這樣的狀況是不是對我們的國家會有不利的衝擊。","quality":0.914},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:22.821000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:23.821000+08:00","text":"所以超過3,000億嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:22.881000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:23.102000+08:00","text":"是會超過3,000億嗎？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:29.815000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:37.517000+08:00","text":"這個台積電沒有公布，我們也沒有辦法得知這件事情，我們還是要尊重台積電的決定。","quality":0.771},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:37.517000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:39.837000+08:00","text":"現在還沒有辦法確定嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:39.837000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:42.517000+08:00","text":"因為現在台積電公布的就是1,650億美金，目前來講是這樣。","quality":0.609},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:44.258000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:46.938000+08:00","text":"那會不會超過3,000億？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:46.938000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:47.938000+08:00","text":"整個供應鏈……","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:46.938000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:50.719000+08:00","text":"這個我沒有辦法回答，我沒有辦法幫台積電回答。","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:51.219000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:53.139000+08:00","text":"所以你也沒有辦法確定？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:54.380000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:55.540000+08:00","text":"因為我已經……而且我也不是董事了。","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:57.431000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:52:59.534000+08:00","text":"所以要問國發會囉！","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:52:59.534000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:03.458000+08:00","text":"葉主委，你那天跟他去美國，你沒問他？","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:04.399000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:07.123000+08:00","text":"他不敢跟你講？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:07.123000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:08.404000+08:00","text":"他可能也不便回答。","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:08.404000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:10.226000+08:00","text":"他不便回答？","quality":0},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:10.226000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:13.170000+08:00","text":"因為台積電有專任的發言人制度嘛！","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:13.170000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:18.278000+08:00","text":"所以還是……好。","quality":0.2},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:18.278000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:29.084000+08:00","text":"我們知道台糖的蘭花要在美國設立接力生產是不是？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:30.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:34.367000+08:00","text":"對，它是因應農業部的相關計畫。","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:36.088000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:39.330000+08:00","text":"信保基金有要協助嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:39.330000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:53:52.208000+08:00","text":"目前台糖並沒有跟這部分接觸，因為農業部跟蘭花協會是想要設立生產基地等等之類的……","quality":0.541},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:53:53.568000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:02.071000+08:00","text":"在信保基金所開放的海外投資申請裡面，除了傳產以外，有沒有包含這個部分？","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:02.901000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:06.704000+08:00","text":"因為這個有點像農業，又有點像產業，這算不算？","quality":1},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:07.685000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:22.616000+08:00","text":"報告委員，這個我們不曉得，台糖目前都沒有跟這些貸款接觸，因為我們都是用自有的資金，而且這個是蘭花協會組一個公司要去那邊做生產的步驟。","quality":0.82},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:22.856000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:23.977000+08:00","text":"如果是中小型的呢？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:24.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:28.981000+08:00","text":"中小型的蘭花業者想要到海外進行接力生產，這算不算？","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:29.181000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:29.301000+08:00","text":"請問部長這算嗎？","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:34.400000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:39.747000+08:00","text":"農業部應該有相關的計畫在支持他們海外布局的一些相關政策。","quality":1},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:39.927000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:40.728000+08:00","text":"所以信保基金……","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:42.310000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:54:47.517000+08:00","text":"因為農業部本身有信用保證的機制，農業部本來就有信用保證機制。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:54:49.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:04.603000+08:00","text":"所以台糖沒有跟信保基金申請，關於未來蘭花進到美國的生產基地，那也算在農業部裡面，而不是算在經濟部裡面？","quality":0.872},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:04.863000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:13.926000+08:00","text":"因為台糖只是提供那個場域給蘭花協會，就等於租給他們。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:13.926000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:25.011000+08:00","text":"因為這涉及到未來……你看在特別預算裡面有一些關稅的補貼，因為這涉及到兩邊的部分，到底是算在哪一個部分？","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:25.151000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:26.371000+08:00","text":"那個應該是農業部的，因為蘭花協會……","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:27.051000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:28.792000+08:00","text":"算在農業部的是不是？","quality":1},{"speaker":"龔部長明鑫","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:28.872000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:31.613000+08:00","text":"因為主要是以蘭花的企業為主嘛！","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:32.374000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:34.855000+08:00","text":"好，如果是沼氣發電呢？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:36.715000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:39.797000+08:00","text":"我想請問台糖是不是有沼氣發電？有。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:41.419000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:55:44.340000+08:00","text":"那你們沼氣發電做得怎麼樣？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2026-05-20T10:55:44.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:06.024000+08:00","text":"最典型的是屏東東海豐畜殖場，這個得到英國認證，它是全世界第一個被認證是非常OK的，不過因為那邊養豬的數量還不是那麼多，必須達到一定的量才會balance，所以目前還是處於虧損狀態，但是……","quality":0.791},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:06.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:06.744000+08:00","text":"你有沒有偷排？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:06.744000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:07.744000+08:00","text":"台糖不敢偷排，偷排不得了啊！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:07.744000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:08.744000+08:00","text":"我們是一個國營企業……","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:08.744000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:09.744000+08:00","text":"所以你知道你們有沒有偷排是不是？","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:09.744000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:10.744000+08:00","text":"我們要去檢查喔！","quality":0},{"speaker":"吳董事長明昌","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:10.744000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:11.744000+08:00","text":"好，OK，目前所知是沒有人敢偷排，因為偷排被抓到的話，他工作都沒有了，包括退休金什麼都沒有，我想沒有一個人敢承擔這樣的情況，這是天大地大的事情，謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"謝委員衣鳯","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:08.524000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:08.544000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:09.044000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:11.044000+08:00","text":"謝謝謝衣鳯委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:11.344000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:15.915429+08:00","text":"待會鄭天財委員質詢完畢後，休息8分鐘。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-20T10:56:16.215429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-20T10:56:19.644000+08:00","text":"接下來有請鄭天財委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}