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三位次長好雖然我今天的標題是無農用事實 灌排 勾取 速診制 維生管一些盤點並訂立太尖利我還是要從我們今天的主題就是我們的特別預算的執行狀況來我們看一下好像這個委員會好像是由我們工程會的陳政委擔任執行秘書有三位副執秘 其中我們來看一下"},{"start":65.398,"end":80.975,"text":"來,這次我們看到就在上週花蓮光悟香午後強降與造成淹水那麼副執密呢,就是這個委員會的副執密呢李孟彥先生說,飛馬太安溪倒灌那麼就很好奇啦他說這次淹水不是倒灌喔,是什麼"},{"start":81.876,"end":94.561,"text":"阿陶墨是縣府的馬達納西的備水提供城施工的防護範圍不足導致的那佛祖接著是因為淤土堵塞排水溝我們查了一下我們執行的預算"},{"start":96.594,"end":118.439,"text":"達成率零啊兩個工程都誰做的花蓮縣政府的水利科下水道科啊啊然後呢唯一有進度的是什麼雨水下河清淨工程是內政部國土署做的做了三分之二了那這應該是不是請教於我們的陳副主委說這個工程會在列管嘛是不是那這個情況到底是我們沒有編預算給他還是編了預算地方會有不執行"},{"start":121.175,"end":139.395,"text":"跟委員報告那上週五的那個造成的那些積煙水的問題大概分享大塊剛剛我也有提到好那這個是因為四條是那個所謂的限排的限排嘛海水系統然後它接到那個花蓮溪是"},{"start":139.795,"end":164.413,"text":"那因為可是這個計畫其實都已經先核定給 對由縣政府來執行 是那因為我們也知道說可能沒有辦法在那個這次汛期前來臨前先完工所以之前我們從1月開始所以簡單講是哪一部分出的狀況我們就是執行縣政府就是說在這個汛期來之前要加強質疑 先將鋼板裝先把它打起來OK好 那縣政部你們的部分這樣算不算有達標二公委員報告我想那個這個"},{"start":170.482,"end":194.24,"text":"黃遠先生如果還沒有執行 我們來催他啦好 謝謝兩位 請陳副主委跟吳次長先請回接下來請農業部長跟何次長來所以我們就知道啊 這些一個天然災害來了我們政府呢 通過了特別條例 也編了特別預算不管是中央跟地方都要認真執行 不執行有枉費嘛但是我們來看一下 有哪些跟天然災害每年都在遇到的問題呢 陳部長"},{"start":196.301,"end":210.679,"text":"無農用事實的灌溉溝渠的整治我在去年的8月我就問過了我說有沒有跟你反映過什麼問題呢現無農用事實而且地方財政困難無力負擔的灌溉溝渠如何處理什麼意思"},{"start":211.3,"end":235.091,"text":"就是這個灌溉溝渠呢是農用的但是已經沒有農地在使用它來做灌溉了但是卻需要它擔任排水的工作那農業部認為這個無農業事實啊無農用事實啊那這個排水啊應該地方政府負責疏通嘛對不對但是很多地方政府他編的預算遷域的工經費很少啊那怎麼辦你說這個部分呢我們都有跟經濟部在處理有沒有經濟部有沒有跟你們在處理"},{"start":235.931,"end":254.308,"text":"我想我們在四年一千一年的那個治水預算裡面就是有一些編列那這我要跟委員報告就是說我們這些無農用適時的灌排我們把使用權移交給地方政府那地方政府要做區排的時候那相關的這些縣市管河川的治理的部分我相信後續就會有經費去支持他們很好來來 何市長我來看一下 我就上次"},{"start":258.171,"end":284.578,"text":"上個月我們安排了一個經濟委員會的考察去這個酒爐鄉 鄉長很關心這個其實旁邊原來都是農田但是後來呢 這個大缸油它其實就是一個地方的區排可是呢 每次說到那裡 你看年久失修了嘛他會什麼 他沒有什麼灌溉過每次颱風來 好雨來 淹水淹到旁邊的田怎麼辦呢 就說要整修結果呢 經濟部說 這個縣管的啦"},{"start":287.655,"end":294.321,"text":"相關人說 老縣政府人 縣政府人做 都不急啦最後誰去做還不是找你經濟部 經濟部怎麼看待這個事情"},{"start":295.739,"end":317.914,"text":"我們應該可以納入到縣市管河川的這個計畫跟委員報告一下這條是這樣有期待了解那邊有一點殘啦那但是也是屬於那種排水那我是建議這樣子我們馬上來會勘一下因為這些東西可能涉及到農田也涉及到他的一些排水當然農業部長也在啊基地部長也在對我們馬上來會勘好謝謝署長"},{"start":319.995,"end":338.222,"text":"4年1千億連農業部跟我們都可以納進去所以我們可以全力來協助有提到的個案你們當然協助但是我要提到很多很多啊我們幫農業部長回顧一下當年地方的農田水利會呢他是在農田水利法時期呢他來建造的灌溉溝渠但是經過水利"},{"start":339.202,"end":361.887,"text":"改制之後 農水署成立了對於這些無農用事實 無灌溉需求的 他就怎樣他就交給地方 他也不執行清淤那地方這種財政困難啊 颱風來了 好雨來了 積水那後來水利署都找到水利署 用應急工程處理啦市長是不是這樣 署長是不是這樣子 是是這樣嘛 應急工程那應急工程 我打個比方啦 你看一下"},{"start":362.927,"end":380.179,"text":"以前比較有錢的朋友他買的車他都保全險 夾一瓶是他買最貴的平常看他開豪車可是有刮傷 有碰撞 他都沒有再處理等到出險的時候進車車廠 這會修理 反正保險工是出"},{"start":384.113,"end":408.924,"text":"我們剛剛講的災修工程 印尼工程就是這樣子地方政府很多的什麼很多的這些原來的灌溉工序現在沒有農用適時了他也沒有能力定期去更新改善阿你又說什麼 先來看啦冰箱是好雨有藥水來的 看好啦好啦天啊風太涼喔 有災修工程喔 我做一次給你做做的啦部長是不是這樣子 有沒有聽過 有沒有聽過這個說法"},{"start":413.138,"end":433.548,"text":"還是要請兩位署長代答一下有一部分是這樣子不過我要跟委員報告就是說其實院長在指示的四年一千億裡面其實有一部分就是要做系統性的治水是的就是不要說中央跟地方然後包括一些部分我想我們跟經濟部一定是一個整合的一個單位一起來協助"},{"start":435.129,"end":449.665,"text":"所以經濟部也是一樣 水利署也是一樣 對不對跟你們的垂直下去告知現在地方的民眾 地方的代表找我們去看他來看說這樣好不好 我們現在的溺斗有成沒成啦聽說風災過後 你們的補災消工程我們幫你做的 會利用二倍金嘛"},{"start":454.281,"end":471.909,"text":"可是這樣不是正辦啦 對不對所以我們希望說呢 不要等到淹水已經造成災損了再來修理 好 往下看來 這也是萬丹俊上次有一個感謝我們這個農水署的支持真的特別跟署長感謝但是喔 你要知道當地鄉親好說什麼我們萬丹農地中尉喔是民國70年的時候開始做的啦這是民國70年做的啦 現在幾年了"},{"start":479.454,"end":495.443,"text":"四十幾年耶結果這些呢我們的錢都是一段一段一百米 兩百米在維護啦你知道屏東單單是萬丹的農地沖化區欸就有將近多少 都說有好幾千條的這樣的灌溉溝水耶錢夠不夠 沒中 署長錢夠不夠"},{"start":499.463,"end":523.525,"text":"我想每一年都需要非常多的經費那當然也要希望立法院能夠支持我們當然支持啦過去的前瞻基礎建設我們要全力支持啦尤其是特別預算都絕不能砍啦那你剛剛講的那一條喔基本上他完成設計規劃大概下個月就會發報失踪啦我現在不是指單一個案我是舉例給你聽所以說四五十年需要欸要定期的台灣更新重點來了"},{"start":524.446,"end":539.111,"text":"所以我認為維生管線經濟部和市長你也可以聽一下維生管線應該盤點並訂定態件率包括什麼集水包括排水包括供電包括供氣這些管線都有它的年限你不要等到漏了"},{"start":539.611,"end":557.01,"text":"破了 壞了再來修 應該怎樣應該是有一個太監慮像包括這個排水來講好了 有農用適時的 有灌溉需求的這些灌溉的溝渠呢如果他是納入我們維生管線 定期的盤點然後編列預算 而且訂定太監慮你請喔 也要定期保用啊你如果說"},{"start":560.353,"end":577.008,"text":"所以現在部長我們兩位部長跟市長是不是共同承諾請農業部其實是經濟部為主啦因為經濟部大部分的這個管線呢維生管線你們在負責農業部因為你們很多的灌溉溝渠都要移給來做這個排水請研議盤點維生管線"},{"start":578.869,"end":602.367,"text":"包含無農用 限無農用事實的灌溉架構局訂定一個太監率及編列預算的因應對策不是要你扮武神喔 要扮武神要怎麼對策喔要把行政局拖擠 要把租界總署拖擠要把立法院拜託提出來一個 可以嗎 部長可以嗎應該可以吧可以啊 次長咧可以那兩位署長要拍拍手啊 這個對你們最有幫助啊好 謝謝部長 謝謝次長 謝謝 謝謝主席好 謝謝宗家"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:32:11.222000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:32:15.644000+08:00","text":"主席、在場委員先進、列席政府機關首長官員、會場工作夥伴、媒體記者女士、先生。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:32:16.884000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:32:24.248000+08:00","text":"依序有請工程會的李副主委、內政部的吳次長、經濟部的何次長和農業部的陳部長。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-21T11:32:27.967000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:32:28.449000+08:00","text":"好，請上述單位。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:32:38.756000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:32:39.837000+08:00","text":"部長好、三位次長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:32:40.558000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:32:51.007000+08:00","text":"雖然我今天的標題是無農用事實灌排溝渠速整治、維生管線盤點並訂定汰建率，但我還是要先從今天的主題，就是我們特別預算的執行狀況來談。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:32:54.130000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:13.951000+08:00","text":"首先，這個委員會好像是由工程會陳政委擔任執行秘書，有三位副執秘，上週花蓮光復鄉午後強降雨造成淹水，而這個委員會的副執秘李孟諺先生說，非馬太鞍溪倒灌。","quality":0.853},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:14.752000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:29.820000+08:00","text":"我們就很好奇，因為他說這次淹水不是倒灌，阿陶莫淹水是縣府瑪達娜溪背水堤工程施工防護範圍不足導致，佛祖街則是因為淤土阻塞排水溝。","quality":0.712},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:29.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:33.954000+08:00","text":"我們查了一下執行的預算，達成率為零！","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:35.574000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:36.375000+08:00","text":"兩個工程都是誰做的？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:36.995000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:42.096000+08:00","text":"花蓮縣政府的水利科、下水道科，然後唯一有進度的是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:42.096000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:50.878000+08:00","text":"雨水下水道清淤工程，這是內政部國土署做的，做了三分之二了，請教李副主委，這是工程會在列管的，是不是？","quality":0.841},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:51.778000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:33:55.419000+08:00","text":"這個情況到底是因為我們沒有編預算給他，還是編了預算但地方政府不執行？","quality":0.844},{"speaker":"李副主任委員怡德","start":"2026-05-21T11:33:58.175000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:34:29.524000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，上週五造成的積淹水問題，大概是分成兩大塊，四條是所謂縣排的排水系統，然後匯接到花蓮溪，可是這個計畫其實都已經先核定，由縣政府來執行，因為我們也知道可能沒有辦法在這次汛期來臨前先完工，所以之前我們從1月開始……","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:34:29.625000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:34:31.886000+08:00","text":"所以簡單講，是哪一部分出了狀況？","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"李副主任委員怡德","start":"2026-05-21T11:34:31.886000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:34:37.530000+08:00","text":"我們就是請縣政府在汛期來之前，要加強板樁，先將其打起來。","quality":0.84},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:34:38.491000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:34:40.913000+08:00","text":"內政部，就你們的部分，這樣算不算有達標？","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"吳次長堂安","start":"2026-05-21T11:34:41.013000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:34:49.123000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，如果花蓮縣政府還沒有執行，我們會來催他。","quality":0.696},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:34:49.544000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:34:52.866000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝兩位，李副主委跟吳次長先請回。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:34:53.527000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:11.200000+08:00","text":"接下來請農業部長跟何次長，所以我們就知道了，這些天然災害來了，我們政府通過了特別條例也編了特別預算，不管是中央跟地方都要認真執行，不執行就枉費了，但是我們來看一下有哪些是每年天然災害都會遇到的問題呢？","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:11.220000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:20.631000+08:00","text":"陳部長，無農用事實灌溉溝渠的整治，去年8月我就問過了，他們有沒有跟你反映過什麼問題呢？","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:21.732000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:26.998000+08:00","text":"現無農用事實，而且地方財政困難，無力負擔的灌溉溝渠如何處理？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:27.339000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:27.659000+08:00","text":"什麼意思呢？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:28.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:42.706000+08:00","text":"就是這個灌溉溝渠原來是農用的，但是已經沒有農地使用它來做灌溉了，但是卻需要它來擔任排水的工作，農業部認為這個無農用事實，而排水的部分，應該是地方政府負責疏通，對不對？","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:42.706000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:47.569000+08:00","text":"但是很多地方政府編的清淤預算金額很少，那怎麼辦？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:47.569000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:35:52.071000+08:00","text":"你說這個部分都有跟經濟部在處理，經濟部有沒有跟你們在處理？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-05-21T11:35:52.931000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:10.287000+08:00","text":"我們在4年1,000億的治水預算裡面是有一些編列，我要跟委員報告，這些無農用事實的灌排，我們把使用權移交給地方政府，地方政府要做區排的時候，相關這些縣市管河川治理的部分，我相信後續就會有經費去支持他們。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:10.287000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:10.307000+08:00","text":"很好、很好。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:10.327000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:39.417000+08:00","text":"何次長，上個月經濟委員會安排去九如鄉考察，而且鄉長很關心這個，其實那個地方旁邊原來都是農田，而大港洋是那個地方的區排，可是年久失修了，而且也沒有灌溉過，但每次颱風來、豪雨來，淹水就會淹到旁邊的田，怎麼辦呢？","quality":0.728},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:40.177000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:47.297000+08:00","text":"說要整修，結果經濟部說，這是縣管的；問縣政府，說沒錢啦！","quality":0.783},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:48.138000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:48.578000+08:00","text":"所以最後誰去做？","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:49.379000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:51.301000+08:00","text":"還不是要找經濟部，所以經濟部怎麼看待這個事情？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"何次長晉滄","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:52.739000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:36:56.302000+08:00","text":"我們應該可以納入到縣市管河川計畫裡。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"林署長元鵬","start":"2026-05-21T11:36:56.302000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:04.827000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們有去了解這一條的情形，在旁邊有一些田地，但是也是屬於那種排水。對啊！","quality":0.568},{"speaker":"林署長元鵬","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:05.828000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:12.953000+08:00","text":"我是這樣建議，就是我們馬上來會勘一下，因為其實這可能涉及到農田，也涉及到一些排水。","quality":0.838},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:13.173000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:14.073000+08:00","text":"剛好農業部長也在，經濟部次長……","quality":0.615},{"speaker":"林署長元鵬","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:14.494000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:14.674000+08:00","text":"對，我們馬上來會勘。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:14.894000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:14.914000+08:00","text":"謝謝署長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林署長元鵬","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:16.995000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:21.677000+08:00","text":"這個4年1,000億連農業部跟我們都可以納進去，所以我們會全力來協助，沒有問題。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:22.257000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:41.563000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝，對於有提到的個案，你們當然要協助，但是我要提到有很多很多，我們來幫農業部長回顧一下，當年在農田水利法時期是由地方的農田水利會來建造灌溉溝渠，但是在改制之後，農水署成立了，對於這些無農用事實、無灌溉需求的就怎麼樣？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:41.683000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:55.726000+08:00","text":"就交給地方，然後也不執行清淤，地方政府的財政困難，颱風、豪雨造成積水，後來水利署說要用應急工程處理，署長，是不是這樣子？是。","quality":0.811},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:55.846000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:56.026000+08:00","text":"是這樣嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:56.586000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:37:56.926000+08:00","text":"應急工程是什麼？","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:37:57.607000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:38:17.159000+08:00","text":"我打個比方，請你看下一頁，以前比較有錢的朋友買了車，他都保全險，甲、乙、丙式他買最貴的，平常看他開豪車，可是如果有刮傷、有碰撞，他都沒有在處理，他說等到出險的時候再叫車廠一起修理，反正是保險公司出錢。","quality":0.759},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:38:21.113000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:38:38.721000+08:00","text":"我們剛剛講的災修工程、應急工程就是這樣子，地方政府很多原來的灌溉溝渠現在沒有農用事實了，他們也沒有能力定期去更新、改善，平常下豪雨淹水了，就來看一下然後說：好啦！好啦！","quality":0.72},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:38:39.881000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:38:43.363000+08:00","text":"等到颱風之後有災修工程時再一次幫你做一做啦！","quality":0.476},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:38:44.483000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:38:45.224000+08:00","text":"部長，是不是這樣子？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:38:45.784000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:38:45.904000+08:00","text":"你有沒有聽過這個說法？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:38:50.138000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:38:51.539000+08:00","text":"還是要請兩位署長代答一下？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-05-21T11:38:52.039000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:01.944000+08:00","text":"有一部分是這樣子，不過我要跟委員報告，在院長所指示的這4年1,000億裡面，其實有一部分就是要做系統性的治水。是的。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:02.144000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:10.528000+08:00","text":"就是不要說中央推給地方，然後包括一些部分，我想我們跟經濟部一定是整合相關單位一起來協助。","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:12.129000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:15.092000+08:00","text":"所以經濟部水利署也是一樣，對不對？對。","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:15.273000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:23.462000+08:00","text":"你們就是垂直下去告知，現在地方的民眾、地方的代表找我們去看，他們來看了以後就說：這樣好不好？","quality":0.829},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:23.562000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:26.645000+08:00","text":"我們現在年度預算沒錢，等到颱風過後，你們就報災修工程，我們幫你做一做，反正是用二備金嘛！","quality":0.564},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:31.281000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:32.782000+08:00","text":"可是這樣不是正辦，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:32.782000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:36.623000+08:00","text":"所以我們希望不要等到淹水已經造成災損了再來修理。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:36.743000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:43.587000+08:00","text":"好，我們往下看，這是萬丹圳，我們也很感謝農水署的支持，真的要特別感謝署長。","quality":0.688},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:44.387000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:48.889000+08:00","text":"但是當地的鄉親跟我說我們萬丹農地重劃是在民國70年的時候開始做的，到現在幾年了？","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:56.454000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:39:56.934000+08:00","text":"已經四十幾年了！","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:39:58.355000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:03.078000+08:00","text":"結果我們都是一段、一段，只有100米、200米在進行維護啦！","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:03.658000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:11.423000+08:00","text":"你知道在屏東單單萬丹的農地重劃區就有好幾千條像這樣的灌溉溝渠嗎？","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:11.463000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:11.463000+08:00","text":"這樣錢夠用嗎？","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:11.683000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:12.443000+08:00","text":"部長、署長，錢夠不夠？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:16.463000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:22.008000+08:00","text":"我想每一年都需要非常多的經費，當然也希望立法院能夠支持。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:22.148000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:22.668000+08:00","text":"我們當然支持啊！","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:23.809000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:27.393000+08:00","text":"過去對前瞻基礎建設我們都全力支持，尤其是特別預算，都絕對不能砍，這是地方的需求嘛。","quality":0.703},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:27.893000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:33.799000+08:00","text":"你剛才講的那一條，基本上，它已經完成設計規劃，大概下個月就會發包施工了。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:33.999000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:40.505000+08:00","text":"我現在不是指單一個案，我是舉例給你聽，所以說四、五十年需要的要定期的汰換、更新，重點來了！","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:43.367000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:40:59.955000+08:00","text":"經濟部何次長也可以聽一下，我認為維生管線應該盤點並訂定汰建率，包括給水、排水、供電、供氣，這些管線都有一定的年限，你不要等到漏了、破了、壞了再來修，應該要怎麼樣？","quality":0.829},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:40:59.955000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:00.595000+08:00","text":"應該要有一個汰建率。","quality":0.556},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:02.177000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:14.010000+08:00","text":"以排水來講好了，無農用事實的、無灌溉需求的這些灌溉溝渠，如果它是納入我們的維生管線，要定期進行盤點、編列預算而且訂定汰建率，像車子也要定期保養，你不能說等到故障再來修理，對不對？","quality":0.625},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:17.353000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:23.939000+08:00","text":"所以部長跟次長是不是可以共同承諾？","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:24.299000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:45.657000+08:00","text":"其實是以經濟部為主，因為大部分的維生管線是經濟部在負責，農業部有很多的灌溉溝渠都要移來做排水，請你們研議盤點維生管線，包含現無農用事實的灌溉溝渠，訂定汰建率及編列預算的因應對策，我不是叫你編預算，而是研議要怎麼編預算的對策喔！","quality":0.752},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:46.157000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:51.521000+08:00","text":"要跟行政院要錢、要跟主計總處要錢、要跟立法院拜託，請你們提出來，可以嗎？","quality":0.548},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:51.521000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:53.723000+08:00","text":"部長，可以嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳部長駿季","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:53.723000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:53.903000+08:00","text":"應該可以吧！","quality":1},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:54.143000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:54.263000+08:00","text":"次長呢？可以。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:56.184000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:57.005000+08:00","text":"好，兩位署長要拍拍手啊！","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:57.425000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:57.986000+08:00","text":"因為這個對你們最有幫助。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"鍾委員佳濱","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:58.706000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-05-21T11:41:59.207000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝部長，謝謝次長，謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-21T11:41:59.707000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-21T11:42:03.135571+08:00","text":"好，謝謝鍾佳濱委員，謝謝部長。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-05-21T11:42:03.435571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-05-21T11:42:07.435571+08:00","text":"接下來我們有請呂玉玲委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}