{"error":false,"id":["169588"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":169588,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169588","日期":"2026-05-25","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-35-18","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第18次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":18,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[35],"委員會代碼:str":["外交及國防委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第18次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-05-25T09:39:07+08:00","結束時間":"2026-05-25T09:47:35+08:00","影片長度":"00:08:28","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/fad20b8d851f264d36279fcc623b729e6c3057ea1a5ec31efdcc00de8abda21b6175e7c94f56e9555ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳俊宇","委員發言時間":"09:39:07 - 09:47:35","會議時間":"2026-05-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第18次全體委員會議（事由：邀請外交部部長林佳龍、國家安全局局長蔡明彥報告「美中元首峰會後地緣政治新局對我國外交及總體國家安全之衝擊評估與因應」，併請大陸委員會列席，並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":0.03096875,"end":3.8953437500000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":4.13159375,"end":12.552218750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":12.94034375,"end":19.77471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":20.449718750000002,"end":21.44534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":22.086593750000002,"end":24.48284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":24.78659375,"end":27.58784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":27.95909375,"end":31.13159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":31.55346875,"end":45.67784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":46.16721875,"end":50.453468750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":50.74034375,"end":52.275968750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":52.697843750000004,"end":60.595343750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":60.797843750000006,"end":66.36659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":66.45096875,"end":75.59721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":66.85596875,"end":66.87284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":75.83346875000001,"end":80.94659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":81.33471875000001,"end":87.81471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":88.33784375,"end":89.73846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":90.17721875000001,"end":92.25284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":92.96159375,"end":107.05221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":107.33909375,"end":114.27471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":114.52784375,"end":115.47284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":115.70909375000001,"end":116.78909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":117.43034375,"end":118.42596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":118.71284375,"end":137.15721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":137.46096875,"end":139.53659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":140.34659375,"end":143.08034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":143.40096875,"end":148.29471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":148.76721875,"end":151.83846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":152.04096875000002,"end":161.92971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":162.25034375,"end":172.76346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":173.42159375,"end":175.80096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":176.32409375,"end":178.29846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":178.88909375,"end":182.01096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":182.36534375000002,"end":183.25971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":183.39471875,"end":184.86284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":185.25096875,"end":186.14534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":186.41534375,"end":188.18721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":188.52471875,"end":191.66346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":191.86596875,"end":219.72659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":219.84471875000003,"end":230.69534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":230.86409375000002,"end":232.36596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":232.58534375000002,"end":233.15909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":234.34034375000002,"end":235.08284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":235.99409375000002,"end":236.02784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":236.58471875,"end":236.87159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":237.22596875000002,"end":239.20034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":239.58846875,"end":276.96659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":276.47721875,"end":297.95909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":282.02909375,"end":282.40034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":282.61971875,"end":282.65346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":294.11159375,"end":294.19596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":298.21221875000003,"end":301.97534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":302.16096875,"end":304.64159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":305.08034375,"end":314.41221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":314.63159375000004,"end":315.44159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":316.47096875,"end":317.07846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":317.48346875000004,"end":318.44534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":318.95159375000003,"end":320.52096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":320.92596875000004,"end":330.37596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":330.62909375000004,"end":332.50221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":332.97471875,"end":342.79596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":342.89721875000004,"end":344.75346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":344.87159375000005,"end":352.06034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":352.26284375,"end":352.41471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":352.68471875,"end":390.67034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":391.19346875,"end":397.67346875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":399.36096875000004,"end":416.97846875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":417.28221875,"end":436.65471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":436.82346875,"end":438.42659375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":437.07659375000003,"end":437.12721875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":439.25346875,"end":441.85221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":442.13909375000003,"end":456.31409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":456.66846875000005,"end":459.04784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":459.28409375,"end":486.01409375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":487.11096875000004,"end":487.22909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":487.49909375000004,"end":492.05534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":492.25784375,"end":506.21346875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":506.61846875000003,"end":507.68159375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":507.68159375000005,"end":508.96409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":508.44096875,"end":509.08221875000004}],"whisperx":[{"start":0.97,"end":19.426,"text":"企圖不斷的改變現狀包括要突破第一島鏈能夠在太平洋成為跟美國抗衡的強權就像美國他們的國防或安全報告提到是步步進逼的威脅"},{"start":20.512,"end":39.382,"text":"那RuPaul這個國務卿也提到其實中共的對外擴張不是只有針對台灣是真的全球性的在擴張所以企圖把這個美中的關係好像定位是台灣是一個要被談的問題其實這是錯的其實是中國"},{"start":40.963,"end":65.974,"text":"因為要改變現狀甚至是以武力跟脅迫的方式所以在全世界尤其包括美國跟他的友盟怎麼樣共同來管理威權擴張的中國問題是這個樣子不要用稻草人假議題把它變成任何其他的什麼論我覺得回過頭來看美中所謂的戰略穩定關係是要穩定中國這個不穩定的因素"},{"start":66.914,"end":92.091,"text":"那可是還是一個戰略競爭的關係而且是根本上所謂的步步進逼的威脅這個層次的問題是全球性當然台海的和平穩定很重要不要成為讓中共找到藉口去用武力來改變現狀所以這個才會得出說和平要靠實力而實力必須靠嚇阻嚇阻不得必須要打敗中共"},{"start":93.072,"end":116.401,"text":"的威權擴張 這邏輯是這個樣子啊當然因為元首外交嘛 總是要禮尚往來嘛又面子問題嘛 又有各取所需可是我們在看這個事情不能陷入到見數不見理大的格局我們要了解 那台美的關係是建立在制度性的基礎上包括台灣關係法 六項保證 以及我們"},{"start":117.481,"end":138.987,"text":"得到了美國包括行政國會部門還有跨黨派的支持所以我們是說要關心但不用過度擔心而這個事情因為還在發展中因為涉及到美國對台軍售其實美國的對台軍售是以台灣關係法為基礎而台灣關係法的基礎是以和平的手段解決爭議"},{"start":140.367,"end":161.862,"text":"那要維持台海的這個和平也就是要維護現狀是因為現狀在被中共武力跟脅迫來迫害所以我們大家必須來共同管理中國所以這個所謂的穩定所謂的美中關係不是說要建立一個建設性的戰略關係是要用建設性方法來穩定中國這個要改變現狀的一個Troublemaker說實在的就是這樣"},{"start":165.845,"end":170.975,"text":"所以我是覺得大家在談的時候不要陷入到細節而且即使陷入到所謂川普總統的談判風格"},{"start":174.019,"end":196.784,"text":"但是他很清楚講對台政策不變那麼這一個反對以武力或脅迫的方式去改變現狀那至於說台灣關係法的規定裡面對台的軍售這有它法律跟政策還有它的憲政運作的基礎在那裡那我們當然對美的工作不管外交或國安部門我們都是做好"},{"start":197.404,"end":215.586,"text":"事前的各種的預防,發生一些可能有傷害我們國家的一些結果但是然後在市中密切的觀察,然後更因應而在事後,因為它還在持續發展中,尤其是對台軍售的問題"},{"start":216.987,"end":231.402,"text":"這個也會牽動出來大家去更關心台灣在這裡面台海和平穩定靠的是美國對台的一個承諾事實上也是對他自己國家利益的一個立場"},{"start":237.287,"end":258.76,"text":"另外就是大家所關注的,川普總統也釋出說有可能會跟賴總統來談論相關的對台軍售的議題雖然顯示台美之間的溝通管道算是暢通,但是由川普所主導的這場對話可能也會充滿許多的挑戰,我們必須做好相關的充分的準備"},{"start":259.56,"end":281.811,"text":"那我想就中國外交部已經一如既往的表達嚴正的反對我們也研判中方可能會採取什麼樣的一個手段依據什麼樣的一個理由來阻止台美官方之間的這個接觸這個部分部長就您所知道首先就像我們賴總統有表達當然是我們是歡迎"},{"start":284.632,"end":304.265,"text":"台美的國家元首能夠就關切的問題來討論因為中共長期就是要矮化台灣它對於台灣跟全世界來往它就是阻止但你也看到其實在川習會的時候中國也有求於美國在談很多跟對海軍售的問題"},{"start":305.506,"end":332.02,"text":"所以他企圖把台海的問題內政化可是現在也逐漸的國際化這個是有兩面的發展對他也是有好有壞那麼對於說有關於後續電話的問題我們當然是做好準備我也相信中共會施壓這也創造出另外一個議題"},{"start":333.521,"end":350.406,"text":"這個也就是川普總統的特殊風格那這時候這個其實在對台軍售的這個問題上面其實又多出了一個變數這個是我想影響是雙方面的甚至是多方面的我們也是要很密切的關注跟非常謹慎的來因應"},{"start":352.767,"end":365.857,"text":"那我們也知道說這個往後的在今年的部分,川習會應該還有三次見面的機會就包括這個九月的習近平在回訪華府,那還有十一月的APEC會議,還有十二月的G20的這幾個時間點"},{"start":368.138,"end":396.481,"text":"那我想請教部長就研判後續這三次的會晤鋪陳的主軸會是什麼那外交部又會採取什麼樣具體主動的這個作為來確保我們台灣的主權這個主體性的利益那另外我們賴總統是否有可能在九月前我們出訪中南美洲並過境美國或是部長您是否有規劃近期會親自這個訪問美國像美方的這個國安及國會高層來進行相關的溝通"},{"start":399.9,"end":425.083,"text":"當然如果川習再會 這個我們元首的高峰會我們都是覺得影響是會很重大一定是要做好各種的準備跟因應不過我想這個持續這個所謂的川習不管是另外三次的會面那美中和美中自己的問題要解決"},{"start":426.104,"end":438.241,"text":"那這個陳儒美國在台協會這個鼓勵人處長講其實穩定的美中關係和強健的這一個美台夥伴關係並不衝突這個也就是我們不希望"},{"start":439.284,"end":458.872,"text":"美台的關係都是被中國所制約美中跟美台是可以平行發展關係那這個就是我們這幾年努力的結果也是希望繼續能夠確保那至於說在談判的時候我想美國是基於自己的國家利益出發我們跟他的利益如果高度一致犧牲台灣也是犧牲美國的利益啦"},{"start":459.392,"end":461.593,"text":"其實這是最根本外交上我想我們跟美國要成為一個就是說在不管價值上或者是說這個利益上的一個一種同盟或者是一種夥伴的關係那至於說出訪這個友邦或過境美國這個都是行之有年那我想這個也是很自然會發展的事情"},{"start":487.588,"end":508.284,"text":"那不管我們美中、我們美台的相關關係未來的走向是什麼樣的一個挑戰我也請我們外交部持續的來觀測讓我們國家的相關利益不被損壞我想這是我們大家所期待的一個目標對,我們一起來努力謝謝,謝謝部長"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}