{"error":false,"id":["169615"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":169615,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169615","日期":"2026-05-25","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-22-11","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第11次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":11,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[22],"委員會代碼:str":["教育及文化委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第11次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-05-25T11:12:57+08:00","結束時間":"2026-05-25T11:24:24+08:00","影片長度":"00:11:27","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/fad20b8d851f264d110c4f83ec3c4103c4e9f7a0e3ecb7b5af3d8c73d94143d9de7eaf727ba7c6f95ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"葉元之","委員發言時間":"11:12:57 - 11:24:24","會議時間":"2026-05-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第11次全體委員會議（事由：一、\t審查115年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會及所屬單位預算案。\n二、\t審查115年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預算案。\n三、\t審查115年度行政法人國家原子能科技研究院預算案。\n【進行詢答及處理；預算提案請於5月19日中午12時前提出】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":12.771593750000001,"end":15.488468750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":15.488468750000003,"end":16.58534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":23.200343750000002,"end":29.76471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":30.08534375,"end":47.38221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":32.009093750000005,"end":32.29596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":47.90534375,"end":51.314093750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":51.65159375,"end":105.07784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":105.33096875000001,"end":137.35971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":137.88284375,"end":139.85721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":140.00909375,"end":141.02159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":141.74721875,"end":142.32096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":142.81034375000002,"end":147.56909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":147.92346875,"end":154.57221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":155.51721875,"end":158.11596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":159.68534375000002,"end":165.87846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":167.36346875,"end":171.02534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":171.02534375000002,"end":171.71721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":171.71721875,"end":174.53534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":171.76784375,"end":173.28659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":174.19784375,"end":176.18909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":176.18909375,"end":177.11721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":177.89346875,"end":180.00284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":178.01159375,"end":178.36596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":179.37846875000002,"end":181.40346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":181.16721875000002,"end":184.76159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":184.89659375000002,"end":185.45346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":185.45346875,"end":185.50409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":185.50409375,"end":196.00034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":185.57159375,"end":188.00159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":196.52346875,"end":199.52721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":198.75096875000003,"end":210.96846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":210.20909375000002,"end":220.04721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":211.84596875000003,"end":212.97659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":219.03471875000002,"end":219.50721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":219.96284375000002,"end":253.47659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":253.91534375,"end":257.12159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":257.57721875000004,"end":274.35096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":275.02596875,"end":275.68409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":275.73471875,"end":277.96221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":278.55284375,"end":283.48034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":283.96971875,"end":304.27034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":300.54096875000005,"end":300.84471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":303.39284375,"end":312.33659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":313.12971875,"end":329.49846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":329.49846875000003,"end":334.39221875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":330.15659375,"end":330.30846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":335.10096875000005,"end":337.71659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":338.42534375,"end":344.02784375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":344.33159375,"end":344.85471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":345.25971875000005,"end":361.00409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":361.64534375,"end":369.67784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":370.43721875,"end":394.38284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":394.70346875,"end":397.36971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":397.53846875000005,"end":407.52846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":408.01784375000005,"end":410.88659375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":412.16909375,"end":417.55221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":419.32409375000003,"end":427.69409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":427.72784375000003,"end":431.62596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":432.16596875000005,"end":451.31909375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":451.36971875,"end":452.14596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":452.48346875000004,"end":475.68659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":475.99034375,"end":477.34034375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":477.47534375000004,"end":479.80409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":480.34409375,"end":480.93471875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":481.17096875000004,"end":486.63846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":487.44846875,"end":488.00534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":488.12346875000003,"end":489.01784375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":489.23721875,"end":490.06409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":490.45221875000004,"end":494.62034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":494.99159375000005,"end":495.91971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":496.18971875000005,"end":508.96409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":509.23409375000006,"end":514.8703437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":515.0559687499999,"end":535.7278437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":535.9640937500001,"end":543.79409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":544.18221875,"end":549.8015937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":549.8859687500001,"end":557.9015937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":558.0534687500001,"end":559.0490937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":559.5047187499999,"end":565.19159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":565.32659375,"end":574.28721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":574.4897187500001,"end":576.58221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":577.2234687499999,"end":577.6284687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":578.0165937500001,"end":579.7209687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":580.34534375,"end":582.6909687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":584.0578437500001,"end":584.83409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":585.7790937500001,"end":589.32284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":589.4578437499999,"end":591.2297187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":591.33096875,"end":594.6047187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":595.0434687500001,"end":595.4990937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":596.0222187500001,"end":596.64659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":597.8615937500001,"end":598.60409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":599.3803437500001,"end":600.02159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":600.1228437500001,"end":601.0847187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":601.9453437500001,"end":615.5634687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":615.76596875,"end":617.50409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":615.96846875,"end":620.6765937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":620.3390937500001,"end":620.57534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":620.6765937499999,"end":620.7609687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":620.7609687500001,"end":634.8515937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":635.4422187499999,"end":638.5134687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":639.2390937499999,"end":645.1453437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":646.02284375,"end":647.5247187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":647.11971875,"end":649.22909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":647.69346875,"end":650.4778437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":649.98846875,"end":661.32846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":658.51034375,"end":658.57784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":661.61534375,"end":662.2903437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":662.74596875,"end":665.1928437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":665.59784375,"end":666.12096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":666.3740937500002,"end":670.1540937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":670.8797187499999,"end":671.6728437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":672.19596875,"end":683.73846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":684.31221875,"end":685.96596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":685.96596875,"end":686.97846875}],"whisperx":[{"start":13.323,"end":15.349,"text":"主席好 麻煩請何安慧主委謝謝有請陳主委"},{"start":23.4,"end":46.557,"text":"主委好委員好我剛剛看到非常多的委員在針對就是核安會所舉辦的那個屏東的地方說明會給很多建議啦我看到主委也沒有辯駁啦主委感覺上好像都虛心的接受啦因為很多委員批評說流於形勢那我覺得我在乎的除了地方說明會之外其實核安會應該要到"},{"start":48.258,"end":63.633,"text":"應該要再加強對全國的宣傳因為現在感覺上賴總統已經要轉彎了嘛本來是黨核電在去年還叫大家投票不要投核三演義公投要叫大家投不同意票然後民進黨在修核管法的時候一直在亂罵"},{"start":64.614,"end":89.087,"text":"那現在大家也 我也沒有看到民進黨在亂罵了啦所謂顯然就是社會要朝向這個重啟河山的方向前進那可是重啟河山有一個很關鍵的就是賴總統設定的條件就是除了和安無與和廢有解之外還有一個社會共識但社會共識這件事情就是很抽象就什麼叫社會共識那它的指標是什麼 怎麼評判這要做民調嗎 還是要"},{"start":91.008,"end":107.594,"text":"是做用什麼方式 公聽會 然後做問卷還是怎麼樣什麼叫社會共識所以這個社會共識這四個是非常抽象那社會共識也有可能會成為未來核電可以重啟或不能重啟的關鍵因為這非常抽象 沒有一定的標準"},{"start":109.015,"end":134.574,"text":"所以我覺得無論如何 核安會還是要針對這個事情做準備那核安會如果覺得在主委的專業的判斷裡面你如果認為核電廠重啟是沒有問題的我認為核安會從現在開始除了去地方做說明會之外你要跟全國做說明那當然你去每一個縣市辦說明會是也許對你們來說負擔比較重但最起碼你可以加強媒體的宣傳或網路的宣傳"},{"start":135.734,"end":157.782,"text":"可是我看到這一塊我覺得是比較弱我特別去看了一下你們的臉書那臉書的第一個它的效果很差啦我不敢說有限 我都不想講有限很差 因為你可以去主委你平常會去你們自己的核安會臉書去看嗎你平常會看嗎你知道最近一篇發文是什麼嗎"},{"start":159.99,"end":176.505,"text":"報告委員我不知道所以這個網站的發文都是誰負責報告委員是我們同仁自己當小編小編直接發就是都不需要核安會的我們這個主管有看過主管最高層級是到哪裡到組長"},{"start":178.571,"end":195.81,"text":"就是我有看過所以你知道最新一篇是什麼嗎?他在講那個Alpha,Beta,Gamma他有一張圖我是不曉得為什麼政府機關政府機關對外溝通都要搞得好像學術發表一樣你的臉書是給專業人士看的嗎?還是希望給一般民眾看?"},{"start":196.787,"end":218.685,"text":"我們當然希望給一般民眾也能看得懂那問題是如果給一般民眾看的話你的用詞潛字這麼專業大家要怎麼看你當然要把它變成類似科普啊或是用比較白話的方式啊謝謝委員知道啦這個我們會繼續努力因為真的確實比較艱澀我們會盡量用白話的方式讓一般民眾都能夠接受"},{"start":219.445,"end":244.187,"text":"這我們會繼續努力第一個就是你寫作的方式我覺得有很大的改進的空間所以你的成效很差就是說比如說暗戰術甚至於它的觸及率、瀏覽數可能都不高第二個問題就是我剛剛講的像我自己就比較關心核電廠重啟社會共識的部分可是你們對於核電廠的部分其實著迫是很少的"},{"start":244.767,"end":273.749,"text":"像我是有看到比如說像你們4月8號有一個標題叫核電廠內政安全然後冒號科學實證專業監督然後寫了三個標準第一個標準叫做原始設計基準要讓它奠定穩固安全餘裕第二個地震危害評估要讓它滾動式科學再評估第三個整體安全強化要監督落實防護升級我不要講我覺得你們有寫跟沒寫一樣所以你們你是認為怎樣"},{"start":275.223,"end":283.282,"text":"現在你除了是布達說你會專業監督之外你想要表達什麼比如說在這篇文上面"},{"start":284.045,"end":311.271,"text":"是 跟委員報告一下因為這一陣子再運轉的議題很夯所以我們在4月10幾號那幾篇我們都會盡量用圖表的方式把我們的審查程序啊還有民眾關切的議題啊我們盡量用圖表的方式呈現他可能沒有這麼達到委員的邀請不是 有圖表啦但是大家不太知道你到底想要表達什麼嘛你是想要表達什麼你是想要跟大家解釋你們的這個"},{"start":313.611,"end":337.51,"text":"在運轉計畫的審查你們的標準還是你是想要告訴大家說其實是安全的耐震在這都OK你是想要表達什麼嗎就是像我去看我會不知道你想要跟社會當中講什麼我不知道跟委員報告一下我們那一篇主要是要表達說那些名詞到底是什麼然後第二個就是說我們的標準到底是要什麼"},{"start":338.462,"end":360.028,"text":"好 可以讓民眾放心啦這個如果文字寫得不夠理想 我們會再努力就是第一個我覺得訴求要明確啦就是你到底發這個文你到底是要講什麼事情這是第一件事情第二件事我覺得偏埔太少了還是要如果說要朝向社會共識這個角度其實你們可以多做一些啦當然那個"},{"start":361.704,"end":369.28,"text":"我知道你們又會扯到什麼預算什麼怎樣因為之前好像也有討論過這個議題但我也有跟大家跟你們建議過因為你這都要採取一種"},{"start":370.532,"end":393.867,"text":"打蛇隨棍上的方式因為現在社會很關注這個議題所以可以針對這個議題被討論的時候趕快利用話題然後去做宣傳那就可以吸引大家來看嘛上次不是有一個民進黨的青岩才俊現在要被民進黨提名選直轄市議員的他都不曉得啊他以為說好像把瓶裝水放到那個蘭嶼的低階核廢料的保管廠"},{"start":394.767,"end":417.342,"text":"然後就不能喝了有沒有然後後來還跑去國民黨踢館就被國民黨的青年軍一飲有盡他還嚇一跳啊原來可以喝喔你看一個要被提名直轄市議員的執政黨的青年才俊優秀青年他不曉得欸主委你不會覺得很誇張嗎你覺得那個瓶裝水放到蘭嶼可以喝嗎旁邊那出春場旁邊放一個晚上可不可以喝"},{"start":420.624,"end":446.057,"text":"這個應該沒問題啦沒問題可是執政黨的要選直轄市議員的人不曉得啊這就是一個很大的問題嘛那像出現這件事情的時候你就可以趁這個機會跟大家講說這個其實放在蘭嶼儲存場旁邊是OK的因為我們有什麼保護措施會讓那個低結核廢料輻射不至於跑出來或是輻射在一定的情況之下它是安全的你就利用這個機會跟大家解釋"},{"start":446.917,"end":451.697,"text":"跟大家 攸關大家的健康而且是熱門的話題大家就會去看啊不是嗎"},{"start":453.002,"end":479.481,"text":"類似這樣子是不是更可以達到宣傳的效果然後再來就是這兩天也有個議題啊要民進黨提名要選台北市長的沈博洋他說要幫他揮打解決電的問題其實揮打一開始他的執行長黃仁勳就一直在講說要用核電為什麼因為產業界最怕缺電那核電是最安全的大家都要買那種沒有碳的電"},{"start":480.402,"end":486.459,"text":"但是你不管是光電也好或者是風電也好它不是積載的嘛它供應不穩定但是"},{"start":487.489,"end":514.343,"text":"核電又不會有碳又很穩定所以產業界都很希望有核電這是回答黃恩勳講的然後沈博洋講說那個對台北市要幫我們解決電的問題那後來被人家罵嘛就說你不是反對核電嗎當時核管法你反對啊也在亂罵啊然後那時候民進黨都是因為我們通過核管法要罷免我們啊大罷免大成功啊我是不知道主委那時候在院會有沒有看到就是大罷免大成功結果現在用我們通過的法現在要重啟核電了"},{"start":515.163,"end":543.295,"text":"那當然人家批評他然後他就舉了個例子說什麼接水他說這個不同的層次問題啊他講的是變電所電網啊怎麼會跟核電有關呢就像接水管他叫人家接水管那你罵他反對水力發電這不一樣的問題啊你今天如果沒有源頭的電的話你就算有電網也沒用啊今天如果水資源不夠的話你接水管也不會有水啊所以當然我覺得是不同層次但是相關的議題嘛那所以比如說"},{"start":544.776,"end":564.412,"text":"這個主委假設你們核安會你們是當然是站在核安的角度在處理這事可是如果你認為你也是閣員的你也是政府的一體嘛你認為這個核電廠安全沒問題而且可以解決缺電的問題那你們也可以利用你們的網站或者是各方面宣傳管道告訴大家其實核電廠"},{"start":565.473,"end":582.222,"text":"是沒有大家想像這麼恐怖的不像那時候在討論核管法的時候那時候很多謠言然後讓大家恐核我覺得你們要適時的做一些利用這個機會做宣傳啊然後那你們今年的編的這個預算大概多少宣傳費有關於"},{"start":585.834,"end":596.51,"text":"有關於這個核子能安全管制廚藝核廢或科學推廣等相關政策業務的媒體宣傳製作拖撥刊登經費是是變多少28萬"},{"start":600.211,"end":616.417,"text":"28萬那大概是要做什麼跟委員報告因為只有28萬通常我們都會跟在一些看人廣告然後介紹核安會到底在做什麼讓人家能夠進一步認識核安會信任核安會因為預算只有28萬"},{"start":618.678,"end":644.747,"text":"怎麼宣傳給我一份報告好不好沒問題不是我來看一下你們的成效不是說雖然二十八案不多啦但也不是說有做就好感覺何寬玥不是很重視這一塊有做就好我有貼文就好但是有沒有看不是我的重點我覺得既然要做就要達到宣傳效果另外就是科展沒有辦那些科普的展嘛對不對效果怎麼樣因為我們是我們的同仁直接面對面跟民眾溝通每次的效果都還算不錯"},{"start":646.152,"end":669.84,"text":"不錯是怎麼判斷?不錯是荷恩會覺得不錯還是大家覺得不錯?不是,我們有請他填問卷調查然後我們也會回收,我們會統計分析然後當作下一次進行的參考整個看起來民眾的反應都還不錯科展可以辦啦,我沒有意見啦但是我剛剛講的針對廣大的社會大眾做選因為畢竟科展還是針對特定人"},{"start":670.936,"end":684.734,"text":"要加強好不好因為這馬上就要面對了如果你在運轉計畫比如說你們說最快是2028嘛那時候馬上就要面對社會有沒有共識的問題這過程當中我覺得就要加強了好 謝謝好 謝謝葉雲芝委員的資訊"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}