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可以打電話給任何人對啊對啊對啊那因為一開始的時候外面不確定那個人指的是誰嘛可是後來因為比較清楚了那當然我想總統府方面也有回應那我們外交部當然也有跟美方都有溝通我沒覺得很清楚所以你理解到的清楚是怎樣的清楚"},{"start":104.195,"end":120.786,"text":"怎樣?就怎樣清楚?因為你剛剛說現在比較清楚方向跟確定的這個打電話的人了那是誰啊?那是川普總統有講啊對對對 你在幫我們因為你是外交部長嘛所以你講出來這個我們比較了解說政府部門是如何看待這件事情的"},{"start":121.286,"end":140.764,"text":"我們正面看待而且就要做好準備所以我是說你剛剛說比較清楚是哪一方面比較清楚就是川普總統說他可以打電話給任何人當然也包括我們賴總統而且國際政治上因為川普總統的功格你也知道他都是直接進行高層直接的溝通的所以是包括在裡面嗎"},{"start":141.545,"end":155.591,"text":"那在這個路透社的報導裡面他其實就有講到就是說呢這個市民這當然你也可以認為說這個報導是他沒有這個消息來源是錯誤的你也可以這樣想或只是拿路透社的報導來詢問您他的說法您怎麼看"},{"start":158.732,"end":165.76,"text":"就像他提到了有四位知情人士提到說美台之間尚未就兩國總統之間的會談制定具體的計畫也就是說呢到目前為止似乎是雖然公開講說有可能有電話但是呢也沒有講說要跟誰來打這個電話"},{"start":178.493,"end":195.716,"text":"而在路透社5月22號的報導裡面呢提到的是說我們雙方之間並沒有制定相關對應的計畫那我想請問一下這個部長這個新聞的報導是屬實呢還是你覺得有偏誤的地方那如果有的話是哪一個部分有所偏誤啊"},{"start":196.38,"end":218.392,"text":"因為這沒有具名我比較沒辦法直接評論不過這個主動求是在川普總統要不要打這個電話他說他可以打給任何人你打電話之前你們應該有就是會有雙方會有一些先前的幕僚之間的作業所以不太可能就是說突然來了一個電話你把號碼接起來他說我是川普你就相信了"},{"start":219.132,"end":233.864,"text":"所以這個報導主要是在講說目前為止並沒有相關的準備工作那我想詢問一下這個報導的內容在您看來的話是確實是如他所述還是其實是一個錯誤的報導"},{"start":236.355,"end":255.964,"text":"這個因為主動權在川普總統我們就做好準備 他正面看待但是如果他要打因為以前也有通過電話嘛跟蔡英文總統嘛所以這並不是沒有潛力所以你的意思是說目前確實有相關的計畫了只是主動權要打或不打是在川普總統的手上是嗎"},{"start":256.784,"end":285.56,"text":"你們雙方有計畫我們當然外交國安部門我們都應該去做好各種可能的發展的規劃但是因為是川普總統講他可以打電話給任何一個包括在總統這個時候只要進入到執行的時候你會主動權還是在川普總統所以我的問題是你沒有聽懂我的理由我是說如果假設這個電話要打那雙方一定會先有一些磋商那我們現在是否有相關的磋商"},{"start":286.38,"end":312.859,"text":"如果沒有的話或許只是還沒有也不見得未來沒有我並沒有要否定這件事情但是我是要問說就目前來講的話雙方是否已經針對川普總統會來電這件事情展開磋商規劃嗎並沒有進入到雙邊在磋商規劃的這些要我了解當然我們也期待後續有任何的一個外交突破那接下來我要問一下有關於川普總統在5月16號接受福斯新聞專訪的時候"},{"start":314.38,"end":330.696,"text":"那他就談到有關於晶片有關於晶片他認為你可以說明一下就是說您對於川普總統他談到的這個對台晶片的這個部分那外交部的看法是什麼"},{"start":332.076,"end":348.884,"text":"報告委員其實如果您了解他的脈絡或川普總統講的是他在對比他之前的總統這是第一點第二點就是說不是喔不是喔你要不要念一下他上面這麼講的這是他的原話我們不看中文你看英文就好他怎麼說的你可以敘述一下這個重點"},{"start":349.924,"end":362.111,"text":"因為他的脈絡就是他在講如果他當時是做總統不會讓這個事情發生雖然這個事情發生與事實有出入因為這個沒有誰偷誰的問題還是靠自己的實力發展出來我們的半導體產業市長我提出的段落不是你剛剛講的這一段你可以看一下他在這一段裡面他的重點並不在於"},{"start":373.657,"end":387.029,"text":"這個是後面這一段才有有關於拜登總統他認為說如果可以像他一樣課徵關稅的話那可能他們就不會失去晶片產業但我想問一下他在這一段的開頭他是怎麼說明有關於台灣晶片的"},{"start":389.594,"end":411.79,"text":"川普有川普總統的說法,我們有我們的說法,我們說法不要跟他一樣,但我們要持續去解釋說,其實台灣發展半導體產業是靠自己的實力,而且我們在國際收、供應業上是不可或缺的。I said that for years, they stole our chip industry,那我請問一下,他這裡的they,指的是誰啊?"},{"start":414.005,"end":442.407,"text":"反正川普總統就只好在他們經濟會有更好的發展那這個都是過去事啦沒有啊不是不是播出上一次是16號再講在這個月你講的好像是幾年前一樣不不不他有沒有講到如果我問的是說他在專訪裡面而且是很多次的這只是其中一次我待會還會拿其他次數給你看就是他說They stole our chief industry那這個they是誰呢"},{"start":443.34,"end":467.322,"text":"我報告委員 即使這個說法 所謂要科百貨的關稅台灣還是會在半導體發展起來這個投資美國是進入台灣的國家利益啦也不是說誰能夠逼誰 也不是誰能夠偷誰這個全球化的半導體的供應鏈是彼此不可或缺的川普總統呢 5月20號他還在講這不是很久以前的事情 16號 20號哪一次更久之前他都不斷地在講"},{"start":468.547,"end":493.799,"text":"你可以談一下他怎麼說的他在這個演講裡面這都是公開的演講你認為他的這個說法公道嗎他的表達是什麼你所接收到的訊息以及我們是怎麼看待這樣的一個說法的就台灣方面怎麼看待報告委員這是他的說法我們尊重因為其實按照你怎麼尊重呢這是錯誤的嘛對 這個陳委員講的這個計算方法是有錯誤的美國 對嘛"},{"start":494.799,"end":500.163,"text":"我們講我們的啊他講他的啊哪有這樣子的那事實就是事實我們就要講事實哪有說他的啊我們講的就是事實啊他講的是錯的那當然要告訴大家說他講的是錯的川普總統在上一任他離開的時候他們有50%的晶片生意嗎有嗎每個人有嗎這50%關鍵在分母怎麼計算啊"},{"start":516.775,"end":533.226,"text":"那怎麼計算?你覺得你怎麼計算的?你怎麼計算?他有他的分母,我們用我們的分母全世界的半導體的產業的分工不是短時間內可以所以你認同他用他的計算方式在川普的第一任期美國有50%的晶片"},{"start":535.127,"end":547.713,"text":"你要看那個分母是什麼?是先進晶片加成熟晶片?還是幾奈米的晶片?還是美國需要的晶片裡面有多少比例?你要看他整個講嘛他說什麼呢?他說他離開之前美國有50%的晶片生意嘛但是It was taken by other placesIt was taken by Taiwan他的意思是說他的任內"},{"start":560.978,"end":584.245,"text":"他第一個論旗結束以後的晶片被台灣給拿走了,有發生這樣的事情嗎?如果沒有的話,欸,連曹新成都認為,連曹新成都認為我們應該政府要在這樣的議題上面大力的表達我們的態度跟回擊,那你可不可以說一下,那你可不可以完整的論述一下,這樣的說法對台灣哪裡不公平不公允,替台灣發聲?"},{"start":585.385,"end":610.536,"text":"這是站在他美國的立場去講那我要講說這個要怎麼計算他因為要講一個他可以就是覺得說相對前面總統不一樣的一個結果那我們很清楚台灣的半導體的投資包括台積電投資在台灣的是等比例大於在投資美國所以雖然美國有增加投資台灣增加了更多如果你看未來的佈局也是這個趨勢這不是誰可以"},{"start":613.717,"end":624.484,"text":"單方面在短時間內去改變的我們是彼此不可或缺的一個公義面關係你還是沒有回答問題嘛我們台灣跟他在社博記社會上批判為晶片小偷這件事情是對我們的一種污名化嘛是對我們那種不公道嘛這種不公平的說法你為什麼身為外交部長沒有辦法大力的替台灣發聲呢我已經發聲了這是不公平的說法"},{"start":640.755,"end":659.791,"text":"這個也是我們要澄清的我剛剛給你一個時間就是以整個完整的段落從你外交部長的角度提出對這樣說法不公允的批判那你講了又講你也沒真的提到啊因為彼此是不可落絕的因為是一個共生夥伴關係其實我們不要去陷入誰偷誰 誰傷誰"},{"start":661.372,"end":668.441,"text":"因為這個是必會雙贏的關係啊而且我們台灣好市在供應業裡面佔有最重要的角色他從來沒有少講過台灣是金片少偷好 因為時間不夠所以我在這裡不是不承認 是我們反對而且我們認為這樣的說法對台灣不公允"},{"start":680.996,"end":687.684,"text":"不公平不是事實我希望因為我時間也不夠了我也不想在這邊有太多的爭執因為我不覺得我們台灣社會在這樣的一個立場上面應該有任何的差異所以我要再強調一次縱使台美關係要保持我們希望能夠很好"},{"start":700.259,"end":727.081,"text":"但是在川普總統他一再的說台灣偷走美國的晶片台灣是晶片小偷台灣把美國應該要我的晶片拿走的時候這並不符合中華民國的利益也並不是屬於中華民國的事實我們沒有做這樣的事情我們就是好好認真的在做我們的商業好好在做我們的貿易我們沒有我們不是晶片小偷我覺得這樣的一個立場應該是"},{"start":728.522,"end":735.447,"text":"整個中華民國無論從官員到民代大家是能夠統一口徑的好嗎我認為這個說法既不公平也不正確我們的立場應該是一致的"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}