{"error":false,"id":["169765"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":169765,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/169765","日期":"2026-06-03","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-19-16","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第16次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":16,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[19],"委員會代碼:str":["經濟委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第16次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-06-03T10:36:12+08:00","結束時間":"2026-06-03T10:42:23+08:00","影片長度":"00:06:11","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5329b193fad041258ab6470d609c9df91daf08b7e9b1ad74585712d3831fe5f0dd317367dc2c47e45ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe","委員發言時間":"10:36:12 - 10:42:23","會議時間":"2026-06-03T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：一、\t繼續審查：\n(一)\t本院委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等17人擬具「土石採取法第三條條文修正草案」案。\n(二)\t本院委員黃仁等36人擬具「土石採取法第三條及第十四條條文修正草案」案。\n(三)\t本院委員邱議瑩等21人擬具「土石採取法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(四)\t本院委員賴瑞隆等19人擬具「土石採取法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(五)\t本院委員許智傑等31人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(六)\t本院委員柯志恩等19人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(七)\t本院委員邱鎮軍等24人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條、第三十八條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n(八)\t本院委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(九)\t本院委員丁學忠等16人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十)\t本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「土石採取法第三十六條、第三十八條及第四十一條條文修正草案」案。\n二、\t審查：\n(十一)\t行政院函請審議「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十二)\t本院委員林倩綺等17人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條、第三十八條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n(十三)\t本院委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等16人擬具「土石採取法第三條及第十四條條文修正草案」案。\n(十四)\t本院委員徐巧芯等16人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十五)\t本院委員王鴻薇等19人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(十六)\t本院委員廖偉翔等21人擬具「土石採取法第三十六條條文修正草案」案。\n(第十五及第十六案如未接獲院會交付審查之議事處來文，則不予審查) (詢答及處理)\n【6月3日及6月4日二天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"賴次長建信","start":0.45284375,"end":2.8997187500000003,"speaker_score":0.962},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"伍麗華Saidhai 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種植一些農作但是因為就緊鄰我們的河川所以一年一年它的農田幾乎已經全部消失但事實上有一些河川"},{"start":107.111,"end":135.394,"text":"他要去做標售土石的時候 零元啊你零元也標不出去 沒有人要啊但是部落的人就覺得說難道我不能夠去把那些堆積疏菌的砂石拿來填補我損失的農田嗎但是與法不合所以我在這個地方就是要特別表達其實在原積法對於非營利自用的部分是有保障的"},{"start":136.667,"end":152.322,"text":"可是我們也礙於一些母法 它的法令的強度所以我們一直不知道要怎麼辦在時間賽跑之下 很多的東西就失去了那我在上一屆呢 其實有提出土石採取法修法版本"},{"start":153.163,"end":157.705,"text":"可是沒有機會見天日那這一次很開心因為我們的趙偉特別排審了土石採取法我們也是搭其他事件的便車所以有機會在這個地方重見天日所以我就是特別在這個地方讓大家了解為什麼我們要修這個法我們希望就是土石採取法它不要變成我們的文化保存的絆腳石"},{"start":182.652,"end":206.653,"text":"所以在這裡我特別提原基法剛才的原基法提到第19條其實對於獵捕野生動物採集野生植物菌類採取礦物土石利用水資源其實原基法第19條是有提到只要是基於非營利傳統文化既以自用原住民是有這樣的一個豁免"},{"start":208.615,"end":222.79,"text":"那因此我自己也在112年6月在之前的洪聖翰委員我們一同努力下也把在礦業法裡面這個部分有做修訂那訂定了一個新的原住民基於非營利目的採取礦物免申辦"},{"start":225.692,"end":252.227,"text":"礦業全辦法那現在我們就是比照希望在土石採取法這個地方呢也能夠去做這樣的一個修訂所以特別在土石採取法的第三條第一項的789款特別呢去增加了就是希望針對土石的部分如果是自用即移傳統灌輸我們可以免申請那另外呢基於公共的"},{"start":252.967,"end":268.483,"text":"建設的需求或者是修建傳統的建物還有第九項就是防災的需求美化的需求我們是希望說可以免金申請所以在這邊就是簡單的請教一下次長您的意見"},{"start":270.612,"end":296.49,"text":"謝謝 在過去諸多跟委員在現場會堪那委員剛剛所點出的一個議題非常感謝委員很早就提出了土石採取法的這個修正草案剛剛委員所提到的一個事情 踐行原住民基本法我們希望在這個土石採取法裡面更把它明確出來除了剛剛委員所講的一些需要之外我們認為只要在這個部落裡面"},{"start":297.65,"end":324.075,"text":"他去建築所需要的这些的土石的话都可以透过此次的修正来予以落实那在执行上面的话更加的顺遂而不只限于原住民基本法所载列的文化记忆或是自用非灵异的行为我们在魔法里面把它定定起来比如说委员很知道现在汛期将近很多人要使用土石"},{"start":324.796,"end":341.494,"text":"來去做一些防汛的準備那這個部分的話經濟部會支持各委員所提出來的立場那我們希望說待會在討論的時候也各位聽聽經濟部的意見跟委員剛剛的心聲我們盡早完成這個法規的修正"},{"start":343.415,"end":367.648,"text":"謝謝經濟部的一個支持那我也希望在審查的過程中大家能夠一同的支持那在這邊就是代替原住民族人來謝謝因為2005年原基法三讀通過之後留住這樣的條文但是直到現在我們必須在各個的法律裡面去做一個修正那在這邊希望我們大家一同支持謝謝次長也謝謝主席"},{"start":371.651,"end":371.671,"text":"好"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:36:13.582000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:36:14.302000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，有請賴次長。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-03T10:36:14.302000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:36:14.482000+08:00","text":"有請賴次長。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-06-03T10:36:14.482000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-03T10:36:37.430000+08:00","text":"委員你好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:36:37.430000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:36:37.430000+08:00","text":"次長好。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:36:38.770000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:36:43.233000+08:00","text":"請您看一下這個圖片，我為什麼要秀這張圖片？","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:36:44.353000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:37:02.588000+08:00","text":"我們先看那個非常美麗的石板屋，它座落在現代建築物的中間，這個是在高雄的多納，多納是一個古老的部落，聽說至少有300年都沒有遷移。","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:37:04.849000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:37:31.018000+08:00","text":"其實在大概50年前，如果你到多納，你會發現全部落大概90%以上都是這樣的建物，可是因為它是違建、不合法，又加上在面臨修繕的時候土石採取不易，所以我們看到慢慢減少，這大概已經是部落裡面僅存的兩三間之一，非常的可惜。","quality":0.914},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:37:32.342000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:37:54.710000+08:00","text":"我們再看另外一張圖片，這是我們在勘災做現勘的時候經常可以看到的畫面，就是部落民眾種植芒果、種植一些農作，但是因為就緊鄰著河川，所以一年一年下來，農田幾乎已經全部消失。","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:37:55.950000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:38:04.836000+08:00","text":"事實上，有一些河川要標售土石的時候，就算是零元也標不出去，都沒有人要啊！","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:38:06.057000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:38:16.525000+08:00","text":"部落的人就覺得：難道我不能夠去把那些堆積、需要疏浚的沙石拿來填補我損失的農田嗎？","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:38:16.525000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:38:17.566000+08:00","text":"但是這於法不合。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:38:19.027000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:38:38.797000+08:00","text":"所以我在這個地方就是要特別表達，其實原基法對於非營利自用的部分是有保障的，可是我們也礙於母法一些規定的強度，所以我們一直不知道要怎麼辦，在跟時間賽跑之下，很多的東西就失去了！","quality":0.926},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:38:39.758000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:38:48.605000+08:00","text":"我在上一屆其實有提出土石採取法的修法版本，可是沒有機會見天日，這一次很開心，因為召委特別排審土石採取法，我們也是搭其他事件的便車，才有機會重見天日，所以我特別在這個地方讓大家了解，為什麼我們要修這個法。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:38:48.745000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:39:17.034000+08:00","text":"我們希望土石採取法不要變成我們文化保存的絆腳石，所以我在這裡特別提原基法。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:39:17.895000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:39:38.633000+08:00","text":"剛才提到原基法第十九條，對於獵捕野生動物、採集野生植物及菌類、採取礦物或土石、利用水資源，其實依原基法第十九條規定，只要是非營利、傳統文化、祭儀、自用，原住民是有受到這樣的豁免。","quality":0.808},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:39:41.155000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:40:21.965000+08:00","text":"在112年6月我自己也和之前的洪申翰委員一同努力對礦業法裡面的這個部分做了修訂，訂定了一個新的規定，就是原住民基於非營利目的採取礦物免申辦礦業權，現在我們希望比照在土石採取法也能夠做這樣的修訂，所以特別在土石採取法第三條第一項第七款、第八款、第九款增加針對土石的部分，如果是自用、祭儀、傳統慣俗，我們可以免申請。","quality":0.809},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:40:22.146000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:40:40.483000+08:00","text":"另外基於公共建設的需求或者是修建傳統建物，還有第九項防災需求、美化需求，我們希望可以免經申請，所以我在這邊簡單請教一下次長的意見？","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-06-03T10:40:42.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:41:02.706000+08:00","text":"謝謝，過去諸多機會跟委員在現場會勘，委員剛剛所點出的議題，也非常感謝委員很早就提出土石採取法修正草案，剛剛委員所提到的踐行原住民基本法，我們希望在土石採取法裡面更把它明確出來。","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-06-03T10:41:02.706000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:41:31.434000+08:00","text":"除了剛剛委員所講的一些需要之外，我們認為只要在部落裡面建築所需要的這些土石，都可以透過此次的修正來予以落實，在執行上面的話更加順遂，而不是只限於原住民基本法所載列的文化、祭儀或自用等非營利行為，我們在母法裡面把它訂定起來。","quality":0.798},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-06-03T10:41:32.014000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:41:44.304000+08:00","text":"比如，委員也知道現在汛期將屆，很多人要使用土石去做一些防汛準備，這個部分經濟部會支持各委員所提出來的立場。","quality":0.898},{"speaker":"賴次長建信","start":"2026-06-03T10:41:44.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:41:53.473000+08:00","text":"我們希望待會在討論的時候，各位也聽聽經濟部的意見，跟委員剛剛的心聲，我們儘早完成這個法規的修正。","quality":0.955},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:41:55.415000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:42:00.938000+08:00","text":"謝謝經濟部的支持，我也希望在審查的過程中，大家能夠一同支持。","quality":1},{"speaker":"伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員","start":"2026-06-03T10:42:01.698000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-03T10:42:19.628000+08:00","text":"在這邊代替原住民族人謝謝，因為2005年原基法三讀通過之後，留下這樣的條文，但是直到現在，我們必須在各個法律裡面去做修正，在這邊希望我們大家一同支持，謝謝次長，也謝謝主席。","quality":0.986},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-03T10:42:20.128000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-03T10:42:22.128000+08:00","text":"謝謝伍麗華委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-03T10:42:22.428000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-03T10:42:27.285143+08:00","text":"待會邱志偉委員質詢完畢之後，休息8分鐘。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-03T10:42:27.585143+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-03T10:42:31.299429+08:00","text":"林倩綺、林倩綺、林倩綺委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-03T10:42:31.599429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-03T10:42:34.742286+08:00","text":"接下來請邱志偉召委質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}