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我們請部長還有台鐵總經理好 請陳部長我們請方總經理委員好部長我是有一個有關台鐵的問題但是等一下細節可以請總經理回答但是請部長表達一個態度好 沒問題因為最主要現在就是我們已經進入高齡化社會了所以各縣政府都有推那個敬老卡像台北 新北在7月1號開始都把敬老卡"},{"start":32.685,"end":52.517,"text":"提高了像我們新北市變600點 本來是480點那這個敬老卡當初最主要的用途是鼓勵長輩出門當然一部分是敬老那出門就要搭車嘛以我們新北來講一開始是主要是坐捷運公車後來大概在幾年前也開放給台鐵使用可是台鐵有一項措施對長輩是非常不友善"},{"start":55.339,"end":81.279,"text":"部長聽聽看台鐵有一個措施是對長輩非常不友善在使用敬老卡的部分因為敬老卡通常它是有結合悠遊卡的功能台鐵只有在進出的閘口有設悠遊卡功能所以他們可以刷進跟刷出可是他們不能夠到櫃台去買對號的車所以自強號的話他們即便是坐火車都要站有時候要擠"},{"start":83.36,"end":106.758,"text":"被趕來趕去那我覺得這對長輩來說是非常不友善而且這個也會減少讓長輩使用的動機為什麼呢因為如果會坐到台鐵的話通常都是比較長程嘛那如果長程不讓他買對號的車子的話沒有座位坐的話他們乾脆就不坐台鐵我覺得也讓這個美意大打折扣那我是不曉得為什麼台鐵一直不願意在"},{"start":108.339,"end":128.132,"text":"櫃檯裝設可以讓讓長輩可以讓悠遊卡買對號列車我不懂因為據我的了解好像以前縣市政府就有反應過那這其實就是只要裝你就可以解決很多長輩搭車不便的問題那在這樣的一個敬老的社會是不是先請台鐵回答一下好不好等一下再部長表達一個態度啦好不好"},{"start":129.37,"end":154.327,"text":"委員好確實各縣市政府有部分的縣市政府也有反應是不是他們的敬老卡社福卡可以使用台鐵那目前搭乘我們的區間車都沒有問題我們結合T-pass也都可以不用講我剛剛沒有問的問題就針對問題回答好不好那我們現在委員提的問題主要是這個裁員是地方政府的裁員他們是給老人點數"},{"start":155.788,"end":177.572,"text":"那這個點數必須要透過我們的票務系統去換算成這個錢我們還要跟地方政府來做申請款項所以剛剛委員講說不是我們裝了我們的票務系統裝了一個設備就地方的這個監牢卡就可以使用必須要得到地方政府的同意不是本來人家就等一下等一下總經理你再給我隨便亂講我剛剛已經說了嘛你們的閘門是可以的嘛"},{"start":182.173,"end":207.818,"text":"那咱們也有跟地方政府轉換點數變現金的問題啊現在的問題是買票的時候沒有辦法刷嘛你去跟我扯別的幹嘛不好意思我問的問題我都很直接而且我也希望你針對我的問題回答不要繞圈圈如果繞圈圈就顯示心虛而且地方政府是希望台鐵可以幫忙去設那個設備嘛所以你不用什麼事都在那邊扯好不好我就討厭官員在這個國會殿堂胡說八道浪費時間你可不可以針對問題回答"},{"start":209.838,"end":236.277,"text":"瓜葦委員現在關鍵就是如果要增加那個設備我們在六月下旬就會請各地方政府來協調第一個所有的地方政府大家要協調要同意第二個是增加這個設備的費用必須要大家一起來分攤那個設備費用那裝置裝上去以後這我們的這個老人他才可以用他的各縣市發的這個社福卡來使用我們的票務系統"},{"start":237.614,"end":252.851,"text":"第一個 第一個比如說啦 在板橋站你在板橋站的櫃檯那邊去設一個可以去刷悠遊卡去買對號路坐車你可以就針對板橋站啊這個為什麼需要全國的各縣市通通都同意的"},{"start":255.133,"end":269.068,"text":"關鍵在於這個財源是地方政府編列所以地方政府編列嘛所以比如說我長輩他使用他買200塊錢的票那這200塊錢的票的車價當然你去跟地方政府算沒錯啊沒有錯嘛然後第二個"},{"start":270.109,"end":289.294,"text":"你本來你算是提供服務嘛對不對就像有一些店家他會提供刷卡機對不對那他為什麼要提供刷卡機因為如果有刷卡機的話人家買東西會刺激人家買東西嘛因為我今天去買一件衣服一萬塊錢比如說啦那我沒有那麼多現金你有刷卡我這一萬塊我就付了啊但你沒有刷卡機不好意思我可能就不來買啦"},{"start":290.094,"end":318.353,"text":"所以店家他為了要刺激自己的營業額他會去裝刷卡機你現在的講法很奇怪你的意思是說如果我在櫃台去設那個可以使用優惠卡的設備的話那這個錢不應該我來負擔因為地方政府一起來付這個裝置的錢不是啊你如果有這個裝置你同樣的可以讓那些長輩願意多搭台鐵也可以增加你的營收嘛我不太懂為什麼台鐵你對於做這麼簡單的事情你理由那麼多你對長輩好一點是會怎麼樣"},{"start":320.154,"end":335.286,"text":"你民進黨政府都不希望敬老嗎你包括你們民進黨政府裡面很多立委現在選市長都說要提高敬老卡你說要提高敬老卡的金額但你不願意讓人家更方便使用講那麼一大堆理由沒有一個我聽得下去的部長"},{"start":336.121,"end":355.061,"text":"你跟那個榮進講一下好不好他講的沒有一個理由是我聽得下去的民進黨政府相當敬老齁這個部分要跟他講一套要做一套要講到要做到啦連一個在櫃台設一個裝置都不願意我這樣聽起來其實事情蠻簡單對是不是您在要求說這件事要趕快做"},{"start":355.541,"end":378.227,"text":"那台鐵公司也有在演繹也有在找地方政府在討論這件事不是沒有你怎麼知道有他剛剛他才在那邊講六月底那麼剛好喔沒問就沒有你們剛剛已經建議好幾年了他剛剛已經有說了他有說已經在找地方政府開會大家看這個系統請問一下是幾月幾號開會所以需要時間幾月幾號開會我們六月底前六月底以前不要隨便信口開河你現在如果說六月底開會你有個時間嘛請問是幾月幾號"},{"start":380.968,"end":389.492,"text":"你不要隨便講因為我現在問了就六月底今天是六月了就六月底你現在應該有具體的時間了請問是幾月幾號請問是幾月幾號你也有具體時間幾月幾號開會之前也跟各縣市都詢問過沒有"},{"start":396.215,"end":419.729,"text":"有有沒有怎麼問我們有發函給各地市不是嘛今天第一個部長部長我覺得部長部長今天其實我我認為這個事情你不會知道了部長我認為您不會知道了但是今天為什麼會在這個地方您在前面問他因為在你的高度你應該覺得這個是很容易辦到的事情那剛剛台鐵總經理講的所有的理由我覺得沒有一個成立的"},{"start":420.049,"end":435.866,"text":"還有說那個裝你在櫃台設一個刷卡的設備還要地方政府同意喔這是多難的高科技啊這個就是你賣衣服的店家去跟銀行生一個刷卡設備這麼簡單而已還要去找地方政府開會這你要不要做的問題嘛部長"},{"start":438.149,"end":450.144,"text":"這個你自己判斷一下只是設一個刷卡的機器而已讓大家可以刷悠遊卡扣敬老卡點數就這麼簡單喔不要搞得好像驚天地氣鬼神的多大工程一樣"},{"start":451.574,"end":472.876,"text":"你說的公道話好不好這個我相信你之前不知道啦這件事已經在做了那您再說沒有開會我可以請他們把會議的資料提供給你他剛剛講了一堆不能做的理由我都聽不下去你聽得下去嗎他剛剛講了一大堆不能做的理由你聽得下去嗎結論很簡單第一我們會做第二我們會加速好什麼時候"},{"start":474.498,"end":497.335,"text":"我們會加速但必須要跟地方政府開會這個不用跟地方政府開會啦設一個刷卡機也要開會我們要裝VISA的刷卡機也要VISA公司同意啊大家講好時間啊地方政府都是還發文給台鐵希望他裝人家都拜託台鐵裝了你還要問台鐵你還要問地方政府同不同意"},{"start":498.536,"end":505.914,"text":"你們這個邏輯大家聽得懂嗎好沒關係部長如果你覺得可以做的話你給個時間嘛好不好這個我們都會做啊然後大概什麼時候"},{"start":507.046,"end":528.828,"text":"需要時間去跟大概什麼時候嗎牛年馬月還是怎麼樣我們已經講了六月底之前會六月底以前會定案是不是會開會六月底會開會然後大概這個應該不難嗎大概什麼時候可以報告委員如果我們說六月底開會我要求七月一號要開始但地方政府不同意我怎麼辦我沒有要求你我可以自己開始嗎那如果地方政府同意的話大概什麼時候可以嗎"},{"start":528.968,"end":550.977,"text":"同意就會有結論所以目前還沒開會不會有結論啊現在要推給地方政府那假設地方因為我知道地方政府因為我知道地方政府希望敬老給長輩其實我們大家都是希望長輩可以去做那個台訓這個方向我們是同意但是呢我不知道這個東西為什麼那麼困難無法回答還要推給地方政府"},{"start":551.377,"end":564.926,"text":"沒有人沒有正在做啦其實剛剛他六月底是隨便講的啦委員不然是哪幾月幾號回憶資料都可以提供給你啦六月底好幾月幾號你現在有講啊幾月幾號開會啊我們這個會我們還要縣市政府的時間大家要都能夠出席啊"},{"start":565.928,"end":592.685,"text":"我們要約他們他們要同意啊你約他他不同意你這種話你講的你自己聽得懂嗎?委員現場可能你聽不懂但其他人或許聽得懂聽得懂嗎?你約他他要同意你現在意思是說你們台鐵想要裝但是地方政府不想裝所以你約他他可能不來但我的了解是地方都很希望台鐵裝你故意把它扭曲成說是地方政府好像找地方政府同意很困難"},{"start":593.545,"end":621.372,"text":"我覺得大家解決問題不要用這種話術的方式不是每一個縣市都願意這麼做那有縣市願意你就先做啊只是裝個刷卡機而已啊我們要整體去討論而且你們閘門就有嘛你們現在只是說在買票的櫃台偵測一個嘛你閘門就有嘛所以大家都是願意的嘛好啦 沒關係啊你既然你承諾六月底開會我也不想吵這個東西啦那就往前走好然後另外安全的問題我請教一下再給我兩分鐘"},{"start":623.42,"end":644.567,"text":"這個3月27號三家那時候電車有一個發生一個事故就是因為他的那個集電供有把那個電線扯斷那我是有看到好像上個禮拜你們有懲處五個人懲處五個人那這個集電供可能疑似是維修你們認為是可能沒有確實維修所以有去處罰了檢修員"},{"start":646.187,"end":675.347,"text":"然後他不知道是不是螺絲沒鎖好還是那個集電工舊了所以導致這個狀況可是除了三家之外其實最近集電工發生故障或事故其實蠻多起的包括一兩個禮拜前在台東也有一起然後在清明年假那時候4月5號的時候在宜蘭也有一起反正就陸陸續續我們都可以在新聞看到因為集電工的問題導致於這個車子出現故障然後延誤三家那次是最嚴重的因為延誤到大概"},{"start":676.187,"end":695.632,"text":"延誤了非常久那我想問一下那這個是一個都是個案嗎還是說他是在維修上面SOP有問題還是其實人力有台鐵現在人力有出現斷層是哪一個包委這集電工3加3月27號集電工是因為集電工的原來設計不良造成"},{"start":696.152,"end":722.642,"text":"那我們在四月底所有的集電工都換成一體成型的集電工那所以這一個未來這個集電工900型的集電工不會再發生同樣的問題了這我們已經解決那委員剛才有提到說在其他的這個宜蘭或台東它那個是吊掛線電競設備的吊掛線鏽蝕造成的那集電工去勾到吊掛線所以這個部分我們也全線的在做整個特檢"},{"start":723.382,"end":743.977,"text":"那在像台東到花蓮我們就是八月底會完全全部特檢那宜蘭縣的部分我們在這個七月的七月份我們會完成全部的特檢南回五月二十九號我們已經全部特檢完了所以我們透過這全面的特檢更換希望這個能夠有效的降低這個電力設備發生同樣問題的一個風險好謝謝好謝謝委員好謝謝葉遠之委員謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}