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有請楊總裁還有包括我們財政部的部長請楊朗楊總裁 財政部莊部長"},{"start":14.755,"end":35.718,"text":"我先就教總裁郭委員早總裁我想剛剛幾位同仁也提到世代同堂的問題大家是擔心說會不會產生所謂的系統化的風險產生了未來的隱憂因為管理金融的穩定的單位是央行目前為止講了比較多房貸、車貸、信貸但是統一的單位在管理"},{"start":36.218,"end":57.553,"text":"他還可以查到一些相關的數據比如說那個銀行局的說法最高的部分小額信貸的部分也高達了9.4%參黨的速度算蠻快的但是我再讓你看一個數據政局局的說法就是在去年前四月的融資交易金額是283.2億但是今年的融資的部分是64"},{"start":60.055,"end":75.828,"text":"13億足足成長了3581億也就是成長了2.26倍也就是說確實透過融資的部分比例非常的高那再來說的話雖然不同的單位但是殊途同歸啦我們看到的這個"},{"start":77.43,"end":93.248,"text":"這個質押的部分大家想到的可能是股票的質押可是還有包括這個保單的質押都有可能拿到錢所以各種質押進去的時候你凸顯出一個數據你去思考一下為什麼在成交量最高的那一天的兩兆當中有一兆"},{"start":94.335,"end":120.17,"text":"是什麼是當沖所以這些人的資金基本上就是拿去玩股票了嘛所以很顯然這些的分析是有道理的那問題我們是最擔心的是有系統化的風險做一個央行一個高度這麼監理單位來說你有沒有可能去了解一下在不同的這種借貸行為當中有一個比較相關的跨商品的高槓桿的監測機制的一個成立有沒有可能"},{"start":121.588,"end":139.179,"text":"我跟委員報告事實上這個信用就股市的信用事實上金管會都在據我了解一部分啦但是以你的高度來說然後就中央銀行來講的話那當然就是說整個信用特別是因為信用的話是銀行"},{"start":142.441,"end":149.768,"text":"我知道那是銀行局 三個貸款都是銀行局那一部分是政企局 不同單位所以就整個總體的信用來看的話就誠如委員說的 他成長的速度快剛剛委員也有談到就是說 系統性的風險不過我跟委員報告"},{"start":165.223,"end":186.47,"text":"我覺得現在離那個系統性的風險應該還是還有一段距離還很遠主要說我們主管機關必須要在現在目前的情況之下必須要密切注意密切注意儘管一直還是儘管會要密切注意但是已經影響到你央行你知道嗎央行6月3號的時候飆售了1400億的364天的定存產生什麼現象"},{"start":192.972,"end":210.405,"text":"第一個四年來第一次賣不完第二個你的得標加權平均的利率是1.523是2008金融風暴以來最高那顯示銀行裡頭都沒有什麼錢錢都放出去"},{"start":212.13,"end":215.491,"text":"我跟委員報告 事實上我們的存單本來是1400億我說的是事實吧我說的這個現象是事實啊事實事實 委員當然講的是事實 但是我要跟委員報告就是說第一個是因為剛好現在五月六月剛好是角色以前沒有什麼會剛好有這種因素"},{"start":236.676,"end":241.039,"text":"所以說第一個就是繳稅的因素第二個是因為我們現在的AI是非常熱絡的所以AI的企業它對銀行的融資也增加了這個是第二點第三點就誠如剛剛委員所說的這樣"},{"start":259.648,"end":268.497,"text":"股票就是股票這三個意思最重要是股票啦我再跟你講說AI好了啦外傳銀行去跟台積電借錢你知不知道"},{"start":272.244,"end":280.889,"text":"怎麼借 我講給你聽銀行給台積電的存款利率還高過一天的放款利率這個我有聽過台積電在銀行裡頭存款大概是3兆元現在央行是台積電還是"},{"start":292.396,"end":295.518,"text":"委員你現在在講這個的時候我們同事也有我們也有討論到這件事我也覺得是很納悶看你是說因為台積電他的一個bugging power"},{"start":309.266,"end":315.514,"text":"在銀行裡面因為你也知道嘛你不要說說台積電在台灣是相當有名它在全球都那麼有名那當然銀行是存款算利差哪有負利差的哪有這種道理嘛因為它的那個北京Power比較大"},{"start":324.725,"end":338.755,"text":"對啊 你也不能這樣講啊 銀行是要我們欠錢 借錢處理你來欠 我借處理 那我賺錢 然後我存進來我還撩錢的 然後這種道理 這沒道理嘛所以他不能用央行的角色 除非央行有這個角色當然啦 如果說他這個Spray的 他如果輸的做一個善意提醒啦 這個是扭曲的現象嘛"},{"start":347.741,"end":364.25,"text":"一二三都是扭曲的現象世財同盤是扭曲的現象定存賣不出去扭曲的現象跟台積電借錢都是扭曲的現象嘛你站在央行的高度你要去想一想這是到底發生了什麼事情你不能能演旁觀啊沒有 不會啦 不會啦報告委員 不會啦我們不會能演旁觀我懷疑你也是能演旁觀啦 不會啦"},{"start":370.973,"end":390.362,"text":"你知道金管會做出一個錯誤的決定就是把電子支付開放給銀行以致電子支付現在十家當中只有一兩家在賺錢啊真的很可憐可是呢在法律上的電資之力當中呢有第三項可以辦理國外的這個小額匯兌法律開放了喔央行沒有開放有啊"},{"start":391.022,"end":395.346,"text":"有啦有啦你們到現在還在討論我們不是開放他們是說他來叫我們我們審查一下到現在還在討論我跟我們報告不會啦因為這個主管機關是那個金管會中央銀行基本上我們都會都跑到你們中央銀行卡在中央銀行"},{"start":416.425,"end":442.312,"text":"你一定會尊重為什麼卡在中央銀行因為裡頭有起錢房子的需求系統化安全的標準還有外匯申報的一個遵循這個東西業者都不曉得標準在哪裡啊不會啦央行搞了四年都還沒有講出來沒有啦而且你還要開放這個時候你還要小心這個事情我知道啦你知道分流的部分要管理好不能讓他們彼此打彼此"},{"start":443.612,"end":471.608,"text":"這個很關鍵這私底下再來講 是是是大家都要問辛辛安 我也問一下總裁前兩天我上次還問你說這個五年的寬限期可能會讓大家理財過於寬鬆現在六月底要確定之前現在聽起來都五年你剛剛說你也有討論這個過去的總體信用管制跟辛辛安的政策就左右互搏相互矛盾是不是"},{"start":472.867,"end":488.321,"text":"造成這種結果現在新興發案出來又一千萬變成一千五百萬以前就是說你八百變成一千達到變成新的地板價又拉上來變成一個定毛的效應第二個五年又變成期貨怎麼變成期貨拖了五年"},{"start":491.741,"end":506.11,"text":"房地合一歲就變20%再拖了第六年自住就變10%當作在管我跟委員報告現在團村五年你沒有意見嗎你開會的時候有表示嗎五年 事實上我上一次委員有提到這個問題我是說五年稍微有一點長事實上我那個時候是想就是說"},{"start":516.816,"end":541.862,"text":"五年的話就是說先三年給我們的那個貸款人然後呢如果說到第四年他沒辦法的話再給他一年沒辦法的話再給他一年三家一家三家一家但是呢但是呢主管機關認為他認為就是說事實上用到五年的第一個就是說銀行他自己會把關第二個呢他說認為用到五年的"},{"start":542.942,"end":566.39,"text":"那個比重不高 不高那為什麼要開放明明可以當期貨牌 我想部長講一下因為銀行本身他就會嚴格把關了嘛 這是第一個對 銀行直接把關好就講銀行好了 那個部長公股銀行在今年初的時候就提出三大建議喔矛頭就指向於這個利率補貼跟寬限期喔除其中第一點呢寬限期是公股喔 班哪個公股要上來講話"},{"start":567.93,"end":586.885,"text":"台銀 公股沒有來 好 我覺得公股的部分建議 銀行建議縮短為三年的寬限期喔這是第一線執行的 公股欸 那個台銀有沒有來台銀有來 台銀的董事長 林董事長 發揮一下你們是不是有做這個建議你們是第一線台銀的業務執行者啊那部長 部長先回答先回答 不要浪費時間"},{"start":588.8,"end":603.037,"text":"你們有看到這個建議我們都有聽取各方的建議包括空谷航庫不過也要跟委員報告新青安那個五年雖然說寬限期最長五年但是真正適用寬限期到五年只有23%大概是23%過去我們就是談10%"},{"start":609.184,"end":617.309,"text":"25%左右就是拿來可能在變形變用的草房的人嘛當初就是這25%那你乾脆斷絕他這25%來公股來講一下你為什麼建議成3年主席讓他講一下啦齁"},{"start":623.012,"end":638.847,"text":"阿委員好 這個新清安的這個到底如何延長還有內容為何呢其實財政部都有邀請我們所有的公股行庫來做一些討論你有沒有三年意見講上去你們建議三 財政部堅持五我就不曉得堅持什麼"},{"start":639.648,"end":644.354,"text":"我們當然就是會就食物的狀況來做一些比較合理性的建議你們食物的狀況都解在這邊了你們不能再重複一次嗎你們能再講一次嗎問題就出現在那23% 25%出現在那四分之一部長你要慎思六月底以前要考慮清楚好 謝謝謝謝郭國文委員"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:28.106000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:44:28.307000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:28.828000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:44:33.760000+08:00","text":"有請楊總裁，還有財政部部長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:33.760000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:44:34.883000+08:00","text":"請央行楊總裁、財政部莊部長。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:37.755000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:44:38.696000+08:00","text":"我先就教總裁。","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:39.637000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:44:40.098000+08:00","text":"郭委員早。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:40.598000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:44:50.389000+08:00","text":"總裁，我想剛剛幾位同仁也提到四貸同堂的問題，大家是擔心會不會產生所謂的系統化風險，產生未來這個隱憂。","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:44:50.389000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:45:00.659000+08:00","text":"因為管理金融穩定的單位是央行，目前為止講得比較多的，當然是房貸、車貸、信貸，但這是在統一的單位管理，還可以查到一些相關數據。","quality":0.873},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:45:02.821000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:45:08.825000+08:00","text":"也就是說，銀行局的說法，成長最高的部分是小額信貸，高達9.4%，成長速度算滿快的。","quality":0.735},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:45:09.465000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:45:32.603000+08:00","text":"但我再讓你看一個數據，證期局的說法是，去年前4月的融資交易金額是2,832億，但是今年的融資部分是6,413億，足足成長了3,581億，也就是成長了2.26倍，確實透過融資的比例非常高。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:45:33.844000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:45:47.178000+08:00","text":"再者，雖然是不同的單位，但是殊途同歸，我們看到質押的部分，大家想到的可能是股票質押，但其實還包括保單質押，都有可能拿到錢。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:45:48.740000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:45:58.576000+08:00","text":"各種質押進去的時候，凸顯出一個數據，請思考一下，為什麼在成交量最高的那一天2兆當中，有1兆是當沖？","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:45:58.576000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:06.340000+08:00","text":"所以這些人的資金基本上都是拿去玩股票了，顯然這些分析是有道理的。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:07.501000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:21.569000+08:00","text":"我們最擔心的是有系統化的風險，央行作為一個具有高度的監理單位，有沒有可能去了解一下，在不同的借貸行為當中，建立一個比較相關的跨商品、高槓桿的監測機制？","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:24.929000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:32.954000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，事實上股市的信用，據我瞭解金管會都有在……","quality":0.783},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:34.014000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:34.534000+08:00","text":"一部分啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:34.835000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:36.255000+08:00","text":"但是以你的高度來說……","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:36.976000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:42.159000+08:00","text":"就中央銀行來講，整個信用，特別因為信用的部分是銀行很大……","quality":0.84},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:45.441000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:50.086000+08:00","text":"我知道，那是銀行局，三個貸款都是銀行局，一部分是證期局，不同單位。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:50.106000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:51.447000+08:00","text":"是、是，所以就總體信用來看，誠如委員說的，它成長的速度快。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:51.547000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:46:52.748000+08:00","text":"剛剛委員也有談到系統性的風險，不過我跟委員報告……","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:46:52.748000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:08.223000+08:00","text":"不會擔心？","quality":0},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:08.223000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:13.385000+08:00","text":"我覺得現在離系統性的風險應該還……","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:13.985000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:15.005000+08:00","text":"還有一段距離？","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:15.005000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:15.145000+08:00","text":"還很遠啦！","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:15.145000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:16.206000+08:00","text":"好，你認為要不要建立這個機制？","quality":0.077},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:16.206000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:24.428000+08:00","text":"我們主管機關在目前的情況之下，必須密切注意。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:24.849000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:28.430000+08:00","text":"意思就是金管會要密切注意，但是這已經影響到你央行，你知道嗎？","quality":0.852},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:28.430000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:29.450000+08:00","text":"央行6月3號標售1,400億的364天期定期存單，產生什麼現象？","quality":0.762},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:35.972000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:48.962000+08:00","text":"第一個，4年來第一次賣不完；第二個，得標加權平均利率是1.523%，是2008年金融風暴以來最高。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:50.643000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:53.385000+08:00","text":"這顯示銀行裡頭都沒有什麼錢，錢都放出去啊！","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:55.130000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:55.950000+08:00","text":"我跟委員報告，事實上我們的存單本來是1,400億，到最後……","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:55.950000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:56.130000+08:00","text":"我說的是事實吧！","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:56.150000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:56.490000+08:00","text":"我說的這個現象是事實啊！","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:56.530000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:57.291000+08:00","text":"是事實，委員講的當然是事實，但我要跟委員報告，第一個，因為剛好5月、6月在繳稅……","quality":0.781},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:47:58.011000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:47:58.471000+08:00","text":"以前沒有，怎麼會剛好有這種因素？","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:19.816000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:42.808000+08:00","text":"不，我說第一個是繳稅的因素；第二個是因為現在AI非常熱絡，AI企業對銀行的融資也增加了；第三點就誠如剛剛委員所說的這樣。股票。","quality":0.965},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:43.389000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:43.809000+08:00","text":"就是股票。","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:44.190000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:45.531000+08:00","text":"這三個因素。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:45.991000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:46.692000+08:00","text":"其實最重要是股票。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:47.112000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:51.477000+08:00","text":"我再跟你講AI好了，外傳銀行去跟台積電借錢，你知不知道？","quality":0.96},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:51.477000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:55.244000+08:00","text":"這個我……","quality":0},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:55.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:55.524000+08:00","text":"怎麼借？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:55.944000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:56.985000+08:00","text":"我講給你聽。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:48:56.985000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:48:59.947000+08:00","text":"銀行給台積電的存款利率還高過它的放款利率。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:01.448000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:01.888000+08:00","text":"這個我有聽過，為什麼……","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:01.928000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:03.869000+08:00","text":"台積電在銀行裡頭的存款大概是3兆元，現在央行是台積電還是……你的頭路被搶啦！","quality":0.697},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:15.396000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:17.237000+08:00","text":"委員你現在講的，我們同事也有討論到這件事，我也覺得很納悶……","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:17.237000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:18.237000+08:00","text":"有人來搶生意……","quality":0},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:17.337000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:36.050000+08:00","text":"因為台積電的bargaining power在銀行裡面……你也知道，你不要說台積電在臺灣相當有名，它在全球都那麼有名……","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:36.311000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:37.612000+08:00","text":"殺頭生意沒人做，銀行是存款賺利差，哪還有負利差的？","quality":0.591},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:37.632000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:37.753000+08:00","text":"哪有這種道理嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:37.773000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:38.494000+08:00","text":"因為它的bargaining power比較大。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:48.145000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:57.532000+08:00","text":"但你也不能這樣講，銀行是別人存錢他借錢出去，你來存錢、它借錢出去，它是這樣賺錢，哪有別人存進來還虧錢的道理？","quality":0.542},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:57.792000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:58.313000+08:00","text":"這沒道理嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:49:58.893000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:49:59.974000+08:00","text":"所以它不能用央行的角色，只有央行才是這個角色。","quality":0.762},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:00.054000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:00.394000+08:00","text":"當然，如果它的spread……","quality":0.583},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:00.995000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:01.235000+08:00","text":"本席是做一個善意提醒啦！","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:01.415000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:17.625000+08:00","text":"這就扭曲的現象，一、二、三都是扭曲的現象，「四貸同堂」是扭曲的現象，定存賣不出去跟台積電借錢也都是扭曲的現象。","quality":0.872},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:18.625000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:24.708000+08:00","text":"你站在央行的高度，要去想一想這到底發生什麼事情，不能冷眼旁觀、若無其事。","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:24.728000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:26.169000+08:00","text":"沒有，不會啦，我們不會冷眼旁觀！","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:26.249000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:27.030000+08:00","text":"還有一件事情，也懷疑你冷眼旁觀。","quality":0.357},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:33.973000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:43.277000+08:00","text":"你知道金管會做出一個錯誤的決定，就是把電子支付開放給銀行，以致電子支付現在10家當中只有1、2家在賺錢，很可憐！","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:43.277000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:53.342000+08:00","text":"可是法律上電支條例第四條第一項第三款可以「辦理國內外小額匯兌」，法律開放了，央行卻沒有開放。有啊！哪有！","quality":0.689},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:54.022000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:54.202000+08:00","text":"有啦、有啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:54.603000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:54.823000+08:00","text":"你們還在討論啦！","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:54.823000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:55.823000+08:00","text":"你們到現在都還在討論……","quality":0},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:54.823000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:55.864000+08:00","text":"不，不是，我們不是開放……是他們來叫我們，我們審查一下……","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:55.944000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:56.064000+08:00","text":"到現在還在討論，討論了4年。","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:56.084000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:57.125000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，不會啦，這個主管機關是金管會……","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:57.745000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:50:57.946000+08:00","text":"我們問了金管會，都卡到你們中央銀行……","quality":0.688},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:50:58.226000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:20.505000+08:00","text":"中央銀行一定會尊重金管會的決策……","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:21.005000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:22.046000+08:00","text":"為什麼卡在中央銀行？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:22.306000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:30.568000+08:00","text":"因為裡頭有洗錢防制的需求、系統化安全及外匯申報遵循的標準，這些東西業者都不曉得標準在哪裡啊！","quality":0.814},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:31.028000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:31.248000+08:00","text":"不會啦。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:31.388000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:34.009000+08:00","text":"央行搞了4年都還沒有講出來……","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:34.009000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:34.249000+08:00","text":"沒有，委員，沒有啦！","quality":0.429},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:34.589000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:36.950000+08:00","text":"而且你們要開放的時候還要小心……","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:39.170000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:40.651000+08:00","text":"這個事情我知道。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:41.351000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:49.334000+08:00","text":"分流的部分要管理好，不能讓他們彼此打彼此，這個很關鍵，這私底下再來講。","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:49.334000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:49.514000+08:00","text":"是、是，好。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:49.874000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:51:51.955000+08:00","text":"最重要是新青安，大家都在問新青安，我也問一下。","quality":0.55},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:51:53.036000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:03.081000+08:00","text":"總裁，我上次問你，5年的寬限期可能會讓大家理財過於寬鬆。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:03.081000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:05.843000+08:00","text":"現在6月底要確定之前，聽起來都還是5年。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:06.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:14.588000+08:00","text":"你剛剛說也有討論，過去的總體信用管制跟新青安政策，這兩者左右互搏、相互矛盾，是不是？","quality":0.865},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:15.867000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:28.158000+08:00","text":"造成這種結果，現在新青安2.0方案出來，傳聞額度又從1,000萬變成1,500萬，以前是800萬變成1,000萬，達到新的地板價又拉上來，變成一個定錨效應。","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:28.158000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:30.360000+08:00","text":"第二個，5年又變成期貨，怎麼變成期貨？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:30.360000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:41.365000+08:00","text":"拖了5年，房地合一稅變成20%，再拖到第6年，自住就變成10%，都當作債管。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:43.586000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:45.027000+08:00","text":"現在傳出來5年，你沒有意見嗎？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:45.027000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:45.508000+08:00","text":"你開會有表示嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:45.528000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:52:48.089000+08:00","text":"關於5年寬限期的問題，上一次委員有提到，我是說5年稍微有一點長。","quality":0.704},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:52:48.089000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:11.479000+08:00","text":"事實上，我那時候是想，5年可以先給貸款人3年，如果到第4年他沒辦法的話，再給他1年；再沒辦法的話，再給他1年……3加1加1。","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:14.119000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:27.143000+08:00","text":"但是主管機關認為，事實上用到5年的比重不高，銀行本身都會自己把關。","quality":0.655},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:27.703000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:28.743000+08:00","text":"不高為什麼要開放？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:29.703000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:30.664000+08:00","text":"明明當作期貨擺在那邊。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:30.964000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:32.164000+08:00","text":"我請部長講一下，部長……","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"楊總裁金龍","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:32.304000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:36.526000+08:00","text":"因為銀行本身就會嚴格把關，這是第一個。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:36.526000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:38.286000+08:00","text":"銀行直接把關，就講銀行好了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:38.886000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:45.609000+08:00","text":"部長，公股銀行在今年初的時候就提出三大建議，矛頭指向利率補貼跟寬限期。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:46.409000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:49.390000+08:00","text":"其中第一點寬限期，哪個公股銀行要上臺講話？","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:51.490000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:53:52.011000+08:00","text":"公股銀行沒有來？好。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:53:52.731000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:00.297000+08:00","text":"公股銀行的部分，建議縮短為3年的寬限期，這是第一線執行的公股……臺銀有沒有來？","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:00.297000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:05.041000+08:00","text":"臺銀凌董事長發揮一下，你們是不是有做這樣的建議？","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:05.041000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:06.763000+08:00","text":"你們是第一線臺銀的業務執行者。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:07.803000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:13.502000+08:00","text":"部長先回答，不要浪費時間，有沒有看到這個建議？","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:13.502000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:17.307000+08:00","text":"我們都有聽取各方的建議，包括公股行庫。","quality":0.824},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:17.307000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:25.757000+08:00","text":"不過也要跟委員報告，新青安雖然寬限期最長5年，但真正適用寬限期到5年的只有約23%，26%是1到3年。","quality":0.872},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:25.857000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:38.508000+08:00","text":"過去我們談的25%可能就是拿來變相炒房的人，當初就是這25%，你乾脆斷絕這25%。","quality":0.844},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:38.508000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:39.729000+08:00","text":"請公股來講一下，你為什麼建議成3年？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:39.889000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:40.189000+08:00","text":"主席讓他講一下。","quality":1},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:46.192000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:46.573000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:47.553000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:55.441000+08:00","text":"關於新青安如何延長及內容為何，財政部都有邀請所有的公股行庫來討論。","quality":0.871},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:55.441000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:54:57.043000+08:00","text":"你有沒有把3年的意見講上去？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:54:59.265000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:01.847000+08:00","text":"央行也建議3年，你們也建議3年，但財政部堅持5年，不曉得在堅持什麼！","quality":0.593},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:02.648000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:03.790000+08:00","text":"我們當然會就實務的狀況做比較合理的建議……","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:03.790000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:04.931000+08:00","text":"你們的實務狀況都寫在這邊了，你們要再重複一次嗎？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:04.971000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:05.051000+08:00","text":"要再講一次嗎？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"凌董事長忠嫄","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:05.051000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:06.051000+08:00","text":"對，寬限期……","quality":0},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:05.051000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:06.433000+08:00","text":"問題就出在那25%，出在那四分之一！","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員國文","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:06.513000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:07.174000+08:00","text":"部長，你要慎思，要在6月底考慮清楚。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:07.194000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:07.214000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:07.214000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:07.354000+08:00","text":"謝謝郭國文委員的質詢。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-10T09:55:07.854000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-10T09:55:10.996857+08:00","text":"下一位質詢請林岱樺委員。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}