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其實我們講作業值中心因為他的名目非常非常的多如果是跟醫療費用有關 結果是怎樣就是如果跟醫療費用生育費有關的我們本來就不會讓他扣如果他是譬如營養品啊我舉個例子 營養品啊又來了"},{"start":193.173,"end":201.918,"text":"對 坐月子的你婦人是不是更需要營養補償我們政府怎麼計較這一點點呢這一筆費用是醫療的這個才給這個是保健的是營養品的這個就不能我跟你講你這樣嚴厲評估這個還不行你先請回那個部長這個議題"},{"start":217.646,"end":237.526,"text":"再給你一個月的時間 你給我答覆好不好現在少子化已經是國安問題我們台灣現在是全世界 部長記得喔不是全亞洲 全世界生育率最低的國家那我們國家在跟他們計較這一點點坐月子中心的小錢嗎"},{"start":239.108,"end":254.659,"text":"富人同胞生育小孩以後更需要把身體保養好這樣人家才敢生他也才有辦法再回到職場不是嗎所以我覺得你現在我回去評估清楚了我現在在講說有錢人啊"},{"start":258.075,"end":276.73,"text":"在我看 我們2300萬人就分兩種人一個有錢人 一個就生斗小民好 那這兩種我們重要的兩種分類裡面負者越負啦部長我相信你知道嘛我們股票從不到2萬點現在到4萬5千點啦房價更是房價的那個暴漲"},{"start":284.844,"end":286.765,"text":"這幾年來從2020年到2024年這四年時間全台灣七大都會區的漲幅是53.2"},{"start":301.516,"end":320.672,"text":"全台灣房價漲幅53.2好啦 擁有房子炒股票的負責月付但是我們對他們的遺產稅的部分我就舉去年為例去年啊 試用20%最高級距的有733位那麼他們總資產達到2600億"},{"start":328.752,"end":341.263,"text":"也就是說平均一位是3.65億比前一年度平均每一件又增加了0.35億我們從這遺產裡面就可以看清楚確實富者越富"},{"start":345.839,"end":363.745,"text":"那 好啦 結果我們現在評估說那 這個免稅額不管是有錢人的或者我們生斗小民的你們都用CPI的指數來評估欸 奇怪 CPI是通膨指數為數眾多的生斗小民物價通膨越痛苦"},{"start":375.462,"end":384.33,"text":"結果反而造就有錢人他們的免稅積聚更減少免稅金額更擴大我就舉你現在列的那個免稅的積聚來講你對有錢人的部分你們打算從這個免稅金額"},{"start":404.729,"end":428.027,"text":"這個遺產稅從一千三百三十三萬要調高到一千四百六十萬也就是說通膨之下你們一下子就給一百四十萬的免稅空間馬上一年之內就增加那你對生土小民呢對生土小民有啦 你們有調"},{"start":430.466,"end":435.468,"text":"調我舉106年到115年 總共調了三次每一次啊 4000塊有一次得證5000塊再來馬上115年這一次 要降到4000塊對有錢人 一條一免稅146萬高達1460萬"},{"start":458.519,"end":478.475,"text":"那一般生土小民 嘿 你的免稅額薪資免稅額好啦 小調個四千一整年物價漲那麼多你免稅額調個四千這就是我們政府的態度嗎對生土小民就這麼嚴苛嗎社會富裕的成果生土小民沒辦法去分時到"},{"start":488.479,"end":511.664,"text":"股票的紅利房價上漲的紅利那至少你讓我們在辛苦所得的薪資上能夠更大的空間去免稅這才是正確的嘛這才是大有為政府應該做的嘛不是嗎所以這一點我希望部長你回去想想你的看法呢跟委員報告在薪資所得的特別扣除額裡面"},{"start":518.352,"end":541.848,"text":"法律規定就是3%如果CPI跟上一次調整有累積到3%那就按照實際的CPI調整指數調整那遺產稅遺證稅的部分是要累積到10%以上的時候來做調整所以兩者還是有差距所以在調整的頻率上所得稅還是比較頻率就很快就調整的紀律或時間會比較接近只有這個標準有差部長我就知道你會這麼說"},{"start":549.953,"end":574.245,"text":"你們總是有辦法幫這些超級富豪啊就想到 欸 怎麼樣欸 就有這一句話可以脫掉對啦是10%但是 欸 部長但是CPI這個10%對富有的人你像對郭台銘 對他們這些人而言那10%"},{"start":576.67,"end":601.267,"text":"一百趴他也沒差他物價 每一樣的物價都兩倍 他沒差啦他開不用怕啦但是對生頭小民那三趴不得了耶那不得了耶所以我認為來到三趴對生頭小民是痛苦的極限痛苦的極限所以我認為說這個"},{"start":606.127,"end":632.037,"text":"免稅的金額要再擴大這一點你再回去考慮好不好一樣一個月的時間給我答覆好不好好的 給您書面報告 謝謝好 你要書面給我那是最好那我再來要提到的就是說要預防說我們台灣喔不要到時候變成就是說只有富人活得起的地方這個有名的經濟學雜誌Nambio這個裡面統計"},{"start":634.958,"end":642.953,"text":"我就講台北就好啦 其他地方不講我們大台北區的生活成本指數已經超過日本東京了"},{"start":644.147,"end":663.732,"text":"日本東京是全世界有名 雄霸全世界各大都會區首屈一指的物價指數 生活指數結果我們台北竟然超越了它我們的生活城市指數54.7"},{"start":666.759,"end":693.054,"text":"東京才54.1所以部長我提醒我們大家共同努力的目標就是要讓我們社會能夠朝均富如果大家成不了富沒辦法均富但至少大家要過著像樣一點的生活不要為生活所苦不要每天就是窮忙忙完了你是窮"},{"start":696.294,"end":718.523,"text":"那一天到晚就在窮忙中打滾一天到晚辛苦的過生活這一點是我希望我們部長後好好把這句話聲勢我們一起來努力好不好好 謝謝委員那個報告給我們三個月時間把它整理出來給您好 但是坐月子中心一個月喔坐月子中心一個月喔好 謝謝"},{"start":725.967,"end":727.908,"text":"好,我们结束王世坚委员"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:51:47+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T11:51:55.206000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，我請財政部莊部長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席（李委員彥秀）","start":"2026-06-15T11:51:55.206000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T11:52:03.412000+08:00","text":"請莊部長。","quality":0},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T11:52:03.412000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:52:03.412000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:52:03.412000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T11:52:16.588000+08:00","text":"部長，你辛苦了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:52:16.588000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:52:28.512000+08:00","text":"你剛才講的沒錯，健保本來就沒有列入扣除額的範圍，不過現在列舉扣除額已經夠不公平了，怎麼說呢？","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:52:29.792000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:53:07.657000+08:00","text":"雖然沒有把健保列入，但是把勞保費跟一般的商業保險列在一起，勞保費是強制的社會保險，是正確的，但是你把它一起列進列舉扣除額裡面，列舉扣除額的總額才2萬4,000元，我們如果以平均薪資4萬7,000元的受薪階級來講，每個月勞保費1,145元，1年就1萬3,740元。","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:53:08.718000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:53:19.486000+08:00","text":"請問2萬4,000元的列舉扣除額，扣除掉1萬3,740元以後不是所剩無幾嗎？","quality":0.808},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:53:19.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:53:33.395000+08:00","text":"才剩1萬260元可以讓他去保民間的商業保險，但是他未來退休以後可以真正受益的很大部分卻是這個部分。","quality":0.814},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:53:34.355000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:53:47.411000+08:00","text":"我請問一年稅額只能夠列1萬260元，能夠買什麼樣的商業保險或人壽保險？","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:53:47.411000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:53:51.551000+08:00","text":"現在利率又這麼低，那是聊勝於無。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:53:53.792000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:54:13.354000+08:00","text":"剛才彥秀委員提到的軍公教議題很對，我今天用另外一個名詞──升斗小民，就是包括軍公教跟所有受薪階層，他們在稅制上是受到如何的不公平。","quality":0.803},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:54:14.455000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:54:34.083000+08:00","text":"我先問一下坐月子中心的部分，部長，你上回有答應要請賦稅署研議及評估，就是要把它納入醫藥及生育費的列舉扣除額，不曉得有沒有評估了？","quality":0.898},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T11:54:34.083000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T11:54:38.905000+08:00","text":"上次有請我們提報告。","quality":0},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-06-15T11:54:38.905000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:54:47.428000+08:00","text":"報告委員，其實我們講的坐月子中心，因為他的名目非常非常的多，如果是跟醫療部分有關係……","quality":0.816},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:54:47.428000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:54:48.068000+08:00","text":"你跟我講結論，你評估的結果是怎麼樣？","quality":0.312},{"speaker":"宋署長秀玲","start":"2026-06-15T11:54:48.389000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:54:57.392000+08:00","text":"如果跟醫藥及生育費有關的，我們本來就會讓他扣，如果是營養品，我們舉個例子：營養品、伙食費……","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:54:57.812000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:55:04.676000+08:00","text":"又來了，坐月子的婦人是不是更需要補充營養？","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:55:04.676000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:55:05.996000+08:00","text":"我們政府怎麼計較這一丁點呢？","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:55:06.236000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:55:07.617000+08:00","text":"這一筆費用是醫藥的才給；這筆是保健、營養品就不能給。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:55:07.637000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:55:27.889000+08:00","text":"我跟你講，這樣的研議評估還不行，你先請回，這個議題請部長再研議，再給你1個月時間給我答復，好不好？好。","quality":0.744},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:55:28.690000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:55:44.526000+08:00","text":"現在少子化已經是國安問題，我們臺灣現在是全世界……請部長記得，不是全亞洲，是全世界生育率最低的國家，我們國家還在跟他們計較這一點點坐月子中心的小錢嗎？","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:55:46.328000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:55:57.876000+08:00","text":"婦人同胞生育小孩以後更需要把身體保養好，這樣人家才敢生，他也才有辦法再回到職場，不是嗎？","quality":0.975},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:55:57.876000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:56:00.979000+08:00","text":"所以請你再回去評估清楚。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:56:01.319000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:56:17.905000+08:00","text":"我現在講有錢人，依我看2,300萬人就分兩種人，一種是有錢人，另一種就是升斗小民，在這重要的兩種分類裡面，富者愈富。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:56:20.027000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:56:51.519000+08:00","text":"我相信部長知道，我們股票從不到2萬點現在漲到4萬5,000點，這幾年來的房價更是暴漲，從2020年到2024年，這4年的時間，全臺灣七大都會區的漲幅是53.2%，全臺灣房價的漲幅53.2%。","quality":0.806},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:56:52.659000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:57:28.243000+08:00","text":"現在擁有房子、炒股票的人富者愈富，但是我們對遺產稅的部分，我舉去年為例，去年適用20%最高級距的有733位，他們的總資產達到2,600億，也就是平均每位是3.65億，比前一年度每一件平均又增加了0.35億，我們從這些遺產就可以看到確實是富者愈富。","quality":0.828},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:57:34.560000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:57:45.884000+08:00","text":"結果現在針對免稅額的評估，不管是有錢人或者升斗小民都用CPI指數評估。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:57:46.044000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:58:08.948000+08:00","text":"奇怪了，CPI是通膨指數，為數眾多的升斗小民在物價通膨時越痛苦，結果反而造就了有錢人的免稅級距更減少、免稅金額更擴大。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:58:09.088000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:58:51.044000+08:00","text":"我就舉現在列的免稅級距來講，對於有錢人的部分，你們打算將遺產稅的免稅金額從1,333萬調高到1,460萬，也就是在通膨之下，一下子就要給140萬的免稅空間，馬上在一年之內就增加，而你對升斗小民呢？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:58:52.265000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:58:55.027000+08:00","text":"對升斗小民有啦，你們有調薪資免稅額。","quality":0.562},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:58:57.466000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:59:43.093000+08:00","text":"我舉106年到115年，總共調了3次，每一次4,000塊，有一次德政調5,000塊，再來馬上115年這一次又降到4,000塊，對有錢人的免稅額一次調一百多萬，高達1,460萬，對一般升斗小民的薪資免稅額小調個4,000元，一整年的物價漲那麼多，免稅額調個4,000元，這就是我們政府的態度嗎？","quality":0.693},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:59:43.093000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T11:59:44.474000+08:00","text":"對升斗小民就這麼嚴苛嗎？","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T11:59:44.474000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:00:14.423000+08:00","text":"對於社會富裕的成果，升斗小民辦法去分食到股票的紅利、房價上漲的紅利，至少讓我們在辛苦所得的薪資上能夠有更大的免稅空間，這才是正確的，這才是大有為政府應該做的，不是嗎？","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:00:14.423000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:00:16.403000+08:00","text":"所以關於這一點，我希望部長回去想想。","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:00:16.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:00:16.583000+08:00","text":"你的看法呢？","quality":1},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T12:00:16.603000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:00:48.348000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，薪資所得特別扣除額的法律規定就是CPI較上一次調整累積到3%，就按照實際的CPI指數調整，遺贈稅的部分是要累積到10%以上才調整，所以兩者還是有差距，在調整的頻率上，所得稅調整的紀律或時間會比較接近。對啦！","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:00:48.368000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:00:48.528000+08:00","text":"只有這個標準有差。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:00:48.548000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:01:05.777000+08:00","text":"部長，我就知道你會這麼說，你們總是有辦法幫這些超級富豪去想到怎麼樣用這句話可以逃脫掉。","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T12:01:07.258000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:01:09.279000+08:00","text":"不會啦！對啦！是10%。","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:01:10.339000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:01:56.208000+08:00","text":"部長，但是CPI對富有的人，像對郭台銘這些人而言，是10%或100%對他來講沒差，每一樣的物價都達到兩倍他沒差，因為他花錢不用怕，但是對升斗小民來講3%就不得了，我認為來到3%對升斗小民是痛苦的極限，所以我認為免稅的金額要再擴大。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:01:57.409000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:02:01.710000+08:00","text":"這一點你帶回去考慮，一樣一個月的時間給我答復，好不好？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T12:02:01.890000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:02:03.911000+08:00","text":"好的，給您書面報告，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:02:03.911000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:02:06.032000+08:00","text":"好，你要書面給我是最好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:02:08.093000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:02:54.980000+08:00","text":"再來，我要提到的是，要預防我們臺灣不要到時候變成只有富人活得起的地方，據有名的經濟學雜誌Numbeo統計，我就講臺北就好，其他地方不講，我們大臺北區的生活成本指數已經超過日本東京，日本東京是全世界有名、雄霸全世界各大都會區，首屈一指的物價指數、生活指數，結果我們臺北竟然超越東京，我們的生活成本指數54.7，東京才54.1。","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:02:54.980000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:29.136000+08:00","text":"所以我要提醒部長，我們大家共同努力的目標就是要讓社會能夠朝向均富，如果大家成不了富、沒辦法均富，至少大家要過著像樣一點的生活，不要為生活所苦，不要每天就是窮忙，忙完了也是窮，一天到晚就在窮、忙中打滾，一天到晚辛苦的過生活。","quality":0.94},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:31.037000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:36.940000+08:00","text":"我希望部長好好深思這一句話，我們一起來努力，好不好？","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:37.240000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:37.600000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:37.600000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:38.600000+08:00","text":"我等你的報告。","quality":0},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:37.600000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:41.441000+08:00","text":"那個報告給我們三個月時間把它整理出來給您。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員世堅","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:41.641000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:43.222000+08:00","text":"好，但是坐月子中心是一個月。","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"莊部長翠雲","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:45.503000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:45.523000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:53.190000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:54.766000+08:00","text":"我們結束王世堅委員的質詢。","quality":0.417},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-15T12:03:55.266000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T12:03:59.837429+08:00","text":"接下來鍾佳濱、鍾佳濱，鍾佳濱委員不在。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-15T12:04:00.137429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T12:04:13.566000+08:00","text":"說明及詢答完畢，委員質詢未及答復或請補充資訊，請相關部會於一週內以書面答復，委員另要求期限者，從其所定。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-15T12:04:13.866000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T12:04:23.580286+08:00","text":"委員羅明才、鍾佳濱所提書面質詢均列入紀錄，刊登公報，並請相關部會以書面答復。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-15T12:04:23.880286+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T12:04:33.594571+08:00","text":"所得稅法修正草案等28案，均另擇期繼續審查，請問各位委員，對以上決議有沒有異議？","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-15T12:04:33.894571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-15T12:04:46.466000+08:00","text":"本日會議議程已進行完畢，倘有不在場委員補提書面質詢，一併列入紀錄，刊登公報，並請議事人員協助處理。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}