{"error":false,"id":["170020"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":170020,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170020","日期":"2026-06-17","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-36-19","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第19次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":19,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[36],"委員會代碼:str":["司法及法制委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第19次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-06-17T10:44:20+08:00","結束時間":"2026-06-17T10:56:10+08:00","影片長度":"00:11:50","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d79496a9ef369d5f36262ec3ff3856d0ff6f11fc4da20edf06bfb484b39de060deae64beff7db0ff5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"許宇甄","委員發言時間":"10:44:20 - 10:56:10","會議時間":"2026-06-17T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期司法及法制委員會第19次全體委員會議（事由：一、併案審查\n（一）委員賴士葆等27人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一、第三十五條之二及第三十五條之三條文草案」案。\n（二）委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n（三）委員羅廷瑋等21人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n（四）委員廖偉翔等18人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n（五）委員王鴻薇等17人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n（六）委員李柏毅等19人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一及第三十五條之二條文草案」案。\n（七）委員楊瓊瓔等28人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n（八）委員邱鎮軍等21人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一及第三十五條之二條文草案」案。\n（九）委員林思銘等17人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n（十）委員林倩綺等17人擬具「律師法增訂第三十五條之一條文草案」案。\n二、併案審查\n（一）行政院函請審議「律師法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（二）委員王鴻薇等18人擬具「律師法第七條及第七十四條條文修正草案」案。\n（三）委員陳素月等18人擬具「律師法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（四）委員郭昱晴等17人擬具「律師法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（五）委員吳沛憶等17人擬具「律師法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（六）委員沈發惠等17人擬具「律師法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（七）委員羅智強等17人擬具「律師法第七條、第七十四條及第七十六條條文修正草案」案。\n（八）委員莊瑞雄等16人擬具「律師法部分條文修正草案」案。\n【本次會議僅進行詢答】\n【6月17日及18日兩天一次會】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":2.14034375,"end":2.57909375,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":5.599718750000001,"end":8.67096875,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":11.742218750000003,"end":15.218468750000003,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":15.235343750000002,"end":15.353468750000001,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":15.353468750000001,"end":17.715968750000002,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":22.01909375,"end":67.61534375000001,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":67.85159375,"end":103.64346875000001,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":80.03534375000001,"end":80.06909375000001,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":80.06909375000001,"end":80.32221875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":80.32221875,"end":80.42346875,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":93.01221875,"end":94.39596875000001,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":102.68159375,"end":105.49971875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":104.50409375000001,"end":107.30534375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":107.08596875,"end":178.33221875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":110.54534375,"end":110.89971875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":111.54096875,"end":112.01346875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":112.01346875,"end":112.04721875000001,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":115.87784375000001,"end":116.94096875000001,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":178.75409375,"end":212.08221875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":188.30534375000002,"end":188.81159375000001,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":191.69721875000002,"end":192.15284375000002,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":202.85159375,"end":203.56034375000002,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":203.94846875000002,"end":204.25221875000003,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":212.31846875000002,"end":221.75159375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"范委員雲","start":212.68971875000003,"end":212.74034375000002,"speaker_score":0.771},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":222.30846875,"end":223.43909375,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":223.00034375,"end":243.72284375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":224.41784375,"end":224.97471875000002,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":244.43159375000002,"end":245.42721875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":245.78159375,"end":246.49034375000002,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":247.14846875,"end":247.51971875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":249.20721875,"end":255.82221875000002,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":253.93221875,"end":254.03346875000003,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":255.61971875,"end":266.43659375000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":266.74034375,"end":323.18721875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"馮次長成","start":322.96784375000004,"end":348.49971875,"speaker_score":0.977},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"許委員宇甄","start":341.3784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像詐騙對 這很嚴重的部分所以我們用現在的修過來用整體刑度上就是故意犯罪這種本刑五年以上有期徒刑的部分那這樣就能夠涵蓋了處罰嗎對 這我剛剛講的那些部分就可以涵蓋進來"},{"start":107.165,"end":122.995,"text":"因為你現在講說是因為原來有劣局貪污行會侵佔假期被信這個部分那現在這樣子的處理的話就變成可以涵蓋的範圍更廣那請問一下我們現在看到的就是說要最重本行五年以上的有期徒刑"},{"start":123.735,"end":141.389,"text":"那我們覺得就是應該我們在針對尤其現在詐騙集團非常猖獗然後尤其也很多跟我們看到很多案例就是跟律師這邊可能有一些藏匿這個刑事的證據還有洩露偵查的內容跟協助犯人逃避這個追問已經嚴重的這個破壞了我們這個偵查的一個程序跟社會對律師的一個信賴"},{"start":147.253,"end":165.293,"text":"所以判斷我們認為判斷一個律師是否適合繼續執業不能只看他罪名的這個法定型的高低也應該是要考量到他是不是有利用律師身份犯罪然後侵害當事人的權益或妨礙司法的程序所以法務部因為針對這樣子的話我們還是覺得"},{"start":167.455,"end":178.141,"text":"真的會有掛一漏萬之嫌所以法務部是否同意甄列就是犯罪情節足以損害律師信譽或執法公正的補充要件"},{"start":179.103,"end":203.243,"text":"根文委員報告我們除了這樣的一個第七條的這樣的一個修正其實我們後面還有一個74條部分就是說有第七條第一項的狀況律師懲戒委員會去做命他停止這個職務的一個部分因為目前上面來講就是說我知道其實剛剛委員講就完全講到本部的一個重點一個我們要保護然後我們對壞的律師我們也要做一個一個人懲戒"},{"start":204.404,"end":221.212,"text":"那所以說那個精神上是在於說對於不肖律師但是我們也很慎重因為畢竟他是起訴起訴之後就是說如果對他有一些部分的話我們還是希望能夠交由律師懲戒委員會來做一個判斷那這樣子會比較就是說"},{"start":223.933,"end":243.271,"text":"因為有幾個委員都有提到這個律師懲戒委員會這個他們在這個做成停止職業決定前原則上就可以我們的律師就可以繼續接案嗎那剛剛也我想也特別想請教您就是說事實上從移送到決定停職平均需要多久的時間我們"},{"start":249.444,"end":265.091,"text":"這個部分的數據我可能再提供給委員因為我們目前上我們手邊沒有說他的平均大概有多對因為剛剛聽起來的話很多都可能就是在律師懲戒委員會送到律師懲戒委員會之後但是一直都沒有下文那可能這樣子也會造成就是說"},{"start":266.912,"end":275.837,"text":"就疑似違法的律師可是他就可以一直的執業那我們也避免就涉案的律師在審議拖延時間繼續執業那我們也希望說這個部分我們是不是雖然說剛剛聽起來好像法務部跟這個司法院都認為不是這個司法懲教委員會是個獨立的機關你們沒有辦不是屬於你們這個兩個不管是法務部或司法院的這個職權"},{"start":292.307,"end":317.505,"text":"但這樣聽起來的話就變律師懲戒委員會就感覺上好像就是一個沒有人可以管的單位那他到底在這邊做成一個審判之前停職處分之前的話感覺他可以無限的拖延那也會讓人家覺得說律師跟律師之間會不會有這樣子的一個互相的一個保護的一個這樣的舉止所以這個部分我覺得可能要請我們次長"},{"start":320.288,"end":342.606,"text":"針對這部分我們可能也要來好好的了解一下回去我們會再了解啦因為其實因為律懲會我們也要因為他很獨立然後他是包含的成員當然有法官檢察官律師跟學者那我們之前是沒有聽到說有這個拖延審查期間的這樣的一個情形那今天因為那個我們剛剛范議員有提醒這件事情"},{"start":343.206,"end":368.834,"text":"那我們回去會針對這一件瞭解看看狀況到底出在哪裡這個部分我想應該絕對不會只有這一件啦我們還是要我想主動的去了解跟關心好嗎是不是有拖延分案又或者說分案之後有什麼我們這個部分上我們會再去了解那請這個會後再請次長把相關的資料也給跟我們司法法治委員會我們會跟那個律師懲戒委員會這邊詢問然後看資料"},{"start":371.095,"end":398.285,"text":"另外呢就是說針對剛剛還講一個就是要保護我們的律師因為近年我想最近也發生很多律師因為承辦案件被這個恐嚇甚至暴力攻擊的案件那所以我們有很多委員也提出35條之一的修正草案就是應該就是要有我們明確的規範處罰方式跟公權力介入機制那目前請問一下法務部針對這個修法你們的意見是什麼"},{"start":399.701,"end":421.613,"text":"我們其實對於律師的一個職業的一個尊嚴還有他在職業上就是因為是要確保我們的憲法上訴訟權跟整個程序上的一個正當跟實現個案的正義其實這個部分我們是非常重視的所以我們在這個部分上有仿照這個醫療法的一個體系還有社會工作執法所以也是支持這樣子的一個法案的修正"},{"start":422.333,"end":450.012,"text":"預告的條文是三十五條之一是針對於他執行職務上對於有強暴寫破口或其他非法方法 反害執行律務一樣那個刑度都是三年以下然後得病科新台幣三十萬以下的罰金那後面第二項的部分是屬於加重結果犯就是說如果他造成了律師的一個致死跟這個重傷的話分別致死的話是無期徒刑跟七年以上有期徒刑所以這是現在目前法務部有一個修法的一個重點"},{"start":450.672,"end":458.437,"text":"那也是跟我們很多委員的版本其實一樣嘛所以表示我們法務部也認為這樣的修法是應該要保護啦 要保護但是針對還有一個版本就是說你將適用範圍限於律師與司法人員執行職務時對律師以強暴 脅迫 恐嚇或其他方式"},{"start":471.506,"end":485.669,"text":"這個非法的方式妨礙其執行律師的業務可是呢那如果是在法院之外呢比如說他在事務所或他在調解或是強制執行的一個現場遭受到攻擊呢是不是就不適用這樣子的一個新規定那限縮的範圍"},{"start":487.57,"end":508.835,"text":"對 剛剛委員報告其實這一個主要是說在當時在討論的時候認為說律師他跟前面兩個醫療法跟社工司法的一個執行業務上他的一個執行的業務的態樣上律師明顯是非常的多元他跟那個那另外兩個職業上的這樣執行職務上的公益性其實我們強調不是單純保護職業"},{"start":512.216,"end":540.213,"text":"對就是我像你們的報告我有看到就是說他可以自由選擇他要不要接案嘛可是那如果是法服咧醫護辨護或指定辨護咧所以委員會我們也他就沒有辦法自己決定了我們剛剛也有提到嘛因為我們這是草案的一個預告就是說我們到7月20號我們會廣納各界的一個聲音然後我們再去做一個寬窄的一個判斷事實上來講我也認同說律師的一個那個職業上的一個保障就是說我們還是要周延"},{"start":540.493,"end":568.152,"text":"對 因為本席認為就是他自主接受委任跟國家是不是應該保障他執法的安全好像沒有相關性吧委員的寶貴的意見我們也會納進來我們會一併思考看看怎麼樣做出一個更合適的方式是的 我想既然要修法我們就把它修得事實上是真正能夠保護我們的律師那當然如果說現在這個狀況的話就是法務部認為就是警察法院跟檢察署本來就有安全維護的責任"},{"start":571.073,"end":590.184,"text":"這個律師是不是可以在這個增訂就是律師因執行職務遭受跟踪滋擾恐嚇或暴力威脅使相關機構應該立即介入排除制止並啟動通報跟保護措施呢"},{"start":590.804,"end":620.019,"text":"這個因為我們也有詢問過我們警政署這邊的一個意見啦因為事實上現行的法條的部分依照我們警方這邊的一個意見就是足夠啦只要說通知警察都會立即來做一個排除不過當天的那個案件在台中的律師這個案件並其實法警也在現場嘛但是也沒有其他的其實以當天的律師的那個案子就理事長那個案子他其實並不是受委任對 他不是受委任所以他即便照我們目前的這個狀況可能也不適用"},{"start":620.82,"end":635.867,"text":"對那這樣子針對不是受委任這樣一個狀況的話那是另外一個狀況了那就是說可能他只是在那地方遇到那是屬於機關安全上跟通報當然這也是我要請教你的問題相對這樣子的一個案例的話那我們在法律上有怎麼樣可以保障他呢"},{"start":636.407,"end":664.414,"text":"我們目前就是說事實上檢查機關我們有去這個發函就是說我們有去跟各檢查機關講就是說我們盤點一個強化安全管理的機制然後也要提升機關內部的一個風險的一個區別能力那就是說落實保障安全事實上在地檢署或在法院這個機關之中如果有遭受到人身的一個恐嚇或威脅那這是對也算是說對機關上來講是一個非常的一個"},{"start":665.094,"end":683.332,"text":"所以我們在這部分上我想無論是那個法院或者是地檢署我們都在重視這個部分我想針對本席認為說針對他不是委任律師但是在法院上他確實遭受到攻擊這樣這個律師的人身安全我們應該也要給予他保障其實在跟委員報告"},{"start":683.892,"end":705.728,"text":"補充一句其實像當時那個律師公會那理事長我印象中台中地檢有立刻做強烈的我們的一個表達我們的一個支持律師的一個態度就是我們有去申請紀念但現場的狀況不是這樣嗎他就是遭受到傷害了好嗎所以針對 既然我講要修法我們就可以把這個部分也能夠修進去真正來保障律師的人身安全好嗎謝謝委員好 那個 OK"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:20.830000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:44:20.930000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:21.371000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:44:23.353000+08:00","text":"請馮次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:23.353000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:44:25.616000+08:00","text":"請次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:42.062000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:44:42.282000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:43.343000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:44:43.343000+08:00","text":"次長好。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:44.284000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:44:55.654000+08:00","text":"我們今天審查律師法，這些法案原則上有兩個重點，一個是保護依法執業的律師，另外一個就是嚴懲違規失職的律師，大概就是這兩個重點。","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:44:55.714000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:45:08.883000+08:00","text":"我想對於法務部的原則來說，一定跟我們一樣，就是希望不是只有管理律師，也要保護律師，所以有這兩個修法重點。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:45:09.284000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:45:21.952000+08:00","text":"依據院版，現在有提出來修正第七條，即故意犯最重本刑五年以上有期徒刑之罪經檢察官起訴作為限制的門檻。","quality":0.891},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:45:22.252000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:45:27.316000+08:00","text":"請問一下，你們把現行條文修改成以上文字的修法重點是什麼？","quality":0.846},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:45:28.577000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:45:54.842000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，原本的條文內容是說最重本刑五年以上之貪污、行賄、侵占、詐欺、背信或最輕本刑一年以上有期徒刑之罪，但因為條文有列舉一些罪名，等於有一些罪名沒有列舉到，又因為我們採罪刑法定原則，就會沒有辦法適用進來，包括可能現在很多像是洗錢或者參與組織犯罪……詐騙。","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:45:54.842000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:46:01.944000+08:00","text":"對，這些很嚴重的部分，所以我們現在修法，用整體刑度上即故意犯最重本刑五年以上有期徒刑之罪，把它整個框進來。","quality":0.708},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:46:03.084000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:46:04.784000+08:00","text":"這樣就能夠涵蓋全部嗎？","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:46:04.784000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:46:06.565000+08:00","text":"對，我剛剛講的部分就可以涵蓋進來。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:46:07.165000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:46:16.951000+08:00","text":"因為你現在是說因為原來有列舉貪污、行賄、侵占、詐欺、背信，現在這樣處理的話，就變成可以涵蓋的範圍更廣。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:46:16.951000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-17T10:46:17.951000+08:00","text":"對，可以涵蓋進來。","quality":0},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:46:17.351000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:46:41.389000+08:00","text":"請問一下，我們現在看到就是要最重本刑五年以上有期徒刑之罪，我覺得應該要針對尤其現在詐騙集團非常猖獗，我們看到有很多案例是跟律師這邊可能有一些藏匿刑事證據、洩漏偵查內容跟協助犯人逃避追問，這已經嚴重破壞了偵查程序跟社會對律師的信賴。","quality":0.936},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:46:47.253000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:47:03.631000+08:00","text":"所以我們認為判斷一個律師是否適合繼續執業，不能只看罪名的法定刑高低，也應該要考量到他是不是有利用律師身分犯罪，然後侵害當事人權益或妨礙司法程序。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:47:05.012000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:47:18.121000+08:00","text":"這樣子的話，我們還是覺得會有掛一漏萬之虞，所以法務部是否同意增列犯罪情節足以損害律師信譽或執法公正的補充要件？","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:47:19.484000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:47:32.735000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們除了第七條的修正，其實後面還有第七十四條，就是律師有第七條第一項的狀況，律師懲戒委員會得命其停止職務的部分。","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:47:34.056000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:48:01.192000+08:00","text":"目前來講，其實剛剛委員完全講到本部的重點，一個是我們要保護，然後我們對壞的律師要懲戒，所以精神上是在於對於不肖律師的處置，但是我們也要很慎重，因為畢竟是起訴，起訴之後如果對他有一些懲戒部分的話，我們還是希望能夠交由律師懲戒委員會來做判斷，這樣子會比較……就是界限上不會太廣。","quality":0.888},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:48:03.933000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:48:23.251000+08:00","text":"剛剛因為有幾個委員都有提到律師懲戒委員會，他們在作成停止執業決定前，原則上律師可以繼續接案，剛剛也想特別請教您，事實上從移送到決定停職，平均需要多久的時間？","quality":0.944},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:48:29.444000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:48:35.507000+08:00","text":"這個部分的數據我可能再提供給委員，因為目前上我們手邊沒有平均大概要多久時間的數據。","quality":0.821},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:48:36.407000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:48:52.375000+08:00","text":"對，因為剛剛聽起來，很多案子都可能送到律師懲戒委員會之後，但是一直都沒有下文，這樣子可能也會造成疑似違法的律師，卻可以一直執業，我們也要避免涉案律師透過再審議來拖延時間繼續執業。","quality":0.878},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:48:52.395000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:49:33.382000+08:00","text":"我們希望這個部分，雖然剛剛聽起來，好像法務部跟司法院都認為懲戒委員會是獨立機關，不屬於你們這兩邊，不管是法務部或司法院的職權，但這樣聽起來的話，就變成律師懲戒委員會好像是一個沒有人可以管的單位，在做成停職處分之前，感覺他可以無限地拖延，也會讓人家覺得律師跟律師之間會不會有這樣子的互相保護機制。","quality":0.956},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:49:36.104000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:49:42.449000+08:00","text":"我覺得針對這部分，可能請次長也要來好好的了解一下。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:49:44.031000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:49:45.752000+08:00","text":"我們回去會再了解。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:49:47.053000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:07.167000+08:00","text":"其實因為律懲會很獨立，它包含的成員當然有法官、檢察官、律師跟學者，我們之前是沒有聽到有拖延審查期間的情形，今天因為剛剛范雲委員有提醒這件事情，我們回去會針對這件來了解，看看狀況出在哪裡，這個部分我們會注意。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:08.008000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:14.250000+08:00","text":"我想應該、絕對不會只有這一件，還是要主動地去了解跟關心好嗎？","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:14.250000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:18.091000+08:00","text":"是不是有拖延分案，或者是分案之後有什麼問題？","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:18.471000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:20.512000+08:00","text":"這個部分我們會再去了解。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:22.372000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:26.514000+08:00","text":"再請次長會後把相關資料給我們司法及法制委員會。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:26.514000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:28.814000+08:00","text":"我們會跟律師懲戒委員會這邊詢問，然後看資料。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:31.095000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:35.237000+08:00","text":"另外，剛剛還講到一個重點，就是要保護律師。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:35.237000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:52.563000+08:00","text":"因為近年來也發生很多律師因為承辦案件被恐嚇，甚至被暴力攻擊的案件，所以我們有很多委員也提出第三十五條之一的修正草案，就是要明確規範處罰方式跟公權力介入機制。","quality":0.919},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:54.623000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:50:58.285000+08:00","text":"請問一下，目前法務部針對這一個修法，你們的意見是什麼？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:50:59.701000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:18.671000+08:00","text":"我們其實對於律師執業的尊嚴，還有律師執業是要確保我們在憲法上的訴訟權，跟整個程序上的正當與實現個案正義，這個部分我們非常重視，所以在此部分我們有仿照醫療法體系，還有社會工作師……","quality":0.854},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:18.911000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:21.593000+08:00","text":"所以也是支持這樣子的一個法案修正。","quality":1},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:22.333000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:35.222000+08:00","text":"我們預告的條文是第三十五條之一，針對他執行職務上，對於有強暴、脅迫、恐嚇或其他非法方法妨害其執行律務，刑度一樣是三年以下，然後得併科新臺幣三十萬以下罰金。","quality":0.829},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:35.842000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:46.529000+08:00","text":"後面第二項的部分是屬於加重結果犯，就是如果他造成律師致死跟致重傷的話，致死是無期徒刑或七年以上有期徒刑。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:46.709000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:50.012000+08:00","text":"所以這是目前法務部的修法重點。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:50.012000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:51.012000+08:00","text":"對，我們預告的條文。","quality":0},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:50.812000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:53.014000+08:00","text":"也是跟我們很多委員的版本一樣嘛。","quality":1},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:53.014000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:54.014000+08:00","text":"幾乎是很接近。","quality":0},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:53.834000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:55.395000+08:00","text":"表示法務部也認為這樣的修法應該支持。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:55.395000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:51:55.535000+08:00","text":"要保護。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:51:55.816000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:52:14.691000+08:00","text":"還有一個版本就是，將適用範圍限於律師與司法人員執行職務時，對律師以強暴、脅迫、恐嚇或其他非法之方式，妨害其執行律師業務。","quality":0.963},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:52:14.691000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:52:24.747000+08:00","text":"可是如果是在法院之外，譬如說，他在事務所或他在調解時或是強制執行的現場遭受攻擊，是不是就不適用這樣子的新規定？","quality":0.961},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:52:25.288000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:52:25.669000+08:00","text":"限縮範圍的理由為何？","quality":0.444},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:52:27.570000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:52:44.394000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，主要是當時在討論的時候，認為律師跟前面提到的醫療法跟社會工作師法的執行業務態樣上，律師明顯是非常多元。","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:52:44.774000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:52:52.336000+08:00","text":"他跟另外兩個職業的執行職務公益性，其實我們強調不是單純保護職業，是公益性。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:52:52.857000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:00.661000+08:00","text":"你的報告我有看到，就是他可以自由選擇要不要接案嘛，可是如果是法扶、義務辯護或指定辯護呢？","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:02.803000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:04.063000+08:00","text":"他就沒辦法自己決定了，是嗎？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:04.083000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:14.389000+08:00","text":"所以我們剛剛也有提到這是草案的預告，到7月20日前我們會廣納各界聲音，然後再去做寬窄的判斷。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:14.389000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:20.193000+08:00","text":"事實上來講，我也認同律師執業上的保障，我們還是要周延。","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:20.493000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:28.118000+08:00","text":"因為本席認為律師自主接受委任，跟國家是不是應該保障其執業安全，好像沒有相關性？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:28.899000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:34.663000+08:00","text":"委員的寶貴意見，我們也會納進來一併思考，看看怎麼樣做出一個更合適的方式。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:34.683000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:53:40.346000+08:00","text":"是的，既然要修法，我們就把它修到事實上能夠真正保護律師。","quality":0.88},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:53:40.747000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:10.164000+08:00","text":"當然如果現在這個狀況，法務部認為警察、法院跟檢察署本來就有安全維護的責任，是不是可以再增訂律師因執行職務遭受跟蹤、滋擾、恐嚇或暴力威脅時，相關機構應該立即介入排除、制止，並啟動通報跟保護措施呢？","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:10.804000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:24.211000+08:00","text":"因為我們也有詢問過警政署的意見，事實上就現行法條部分，依照警方這邊的意見也是足夠了，只要通知警察都會立即來做排除。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:24.351000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:30.774000+08:00","text":"不過，臺中律師這個案件其實當天法警也在現場，但是也都沒有其他的……","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:31.034000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:35.176000+08:00","text":"以當天理事長那個案子，他其實並不是受委任。","quality":1},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:36.217000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:36.877000+08:00","text":"對，他不是受委任。","quality":1},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:37.017000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:39.999000+08:00","text":"所以即便照我們目前的這個狀況，他可能也不適用。","quality":0.952},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:42.081000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:43.141000+08:00","text":"針對不是受委任的狀況，會怎麼樣？","quality":0.643},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:43.161000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:49.424000+08:00","text":"那是另外一個狀況了，可能他只是在那地方遇到，這屬於機關安全跟通報部分。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:49.424000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:54:55.847000+08:00","text":"當然這也是我要請教你的問題，對於這樣子的案例，我們在法律上可以怎麼樣來保障他呢？","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:54:57.947000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:55:13.291000+08:00","text":"事實上我們有發函給檢察機關，去跟各檢察機關講，我們盤點一個強化安全管理的機制，然後也要提升機關內部的風險區辨能力，就是落實保障安全。","quality":0.885},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:55:14.431000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:55:24.234000+08:00","text":"在地檢署或在法院的機關之中，如果律師有遭受到人身的恐嚇或威脅，對機關上來講，這也算是非常的不尊重。是的。","quality":0.766},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:55:25.094000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:55:31.600000+08:00","text":"所以在這部分，我想無論是法院或者是地檢署，我們都重視此部分並且去做。","quality":0.839},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:55:33.783000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:55:41.910000+08:00","text":"本席認為針對不是委任律師，但是在法律上他確實遭受到攻擊，這樣子的律師人身安全，我們應該也要給予保障。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:55:43.112000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:55:54.120000+08:00","text":"再跟委員補充，其實像當時的律師公會理事長事件，我印象中臺中地檢有立刻強烈表達支持律師的態度，亦即我們有聲請羈押。","quality":0.827},{"speaker":"許委員宇甄","start":"2026-06-17T10:55:54.280000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:56:05.028000+08:00","text":"但現場的狀況不是這樣，他就是遭受到傷害了，既然要修法，我們可以把這個部分修進去，真正來保障律師的人身安全。","quality":1},{"speaker":"馮次長成","start":"2026-06-17T10:56:05.428000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-17T10:56:05.448000+08:00","text":"是，感謝委員。謝謝。","quality":0.429},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-17T10:56:05.948000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-17T10:56:07.090857+08:00","text":"次長請回。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-17T10:56:07.390857+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-17T10:56:09.676571+08:00","text":"請楊瓊瓔委員質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}