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有請次長好 有請次長"},{"start":21.523,"end":39.556,"text":"委員好 次長好今天就要跟次長來探討所謂的校事會議引發了很多的一個問題那麼我們今天希望就用這樣的一個機會我們來看到問題然後能夠來解決問題"},{"start":41.417,"end":59.298,"text":"那整個學校的氛圍,我們說學校的氣候為什麼會烏煙瘴氣,那這個源頭呢就是校士會議那校士會議會有這麼多的一個爭議,問題是在於老師的一個受教權"},{"start":60.319,"end":84.042,"text":"因為老師的塑教錢被壓縮了管教錢所以老師在學校的一個服務變成沒有幸福感沒有成就感那我們現在其實事實上在教育基本法裡面就已經很明確的一個有提到"},{"start":84.562,"end":109.47,"text":"教師專業的一個自主權自主還有學生的潛力的一個保障必須並行那在這裡呢現在目前那個學校的一個核心問題不是老師沒有責任感也不是老師不認真而是呢教育部呢沒有貫徹制度上的一個給教師一個足夠的一個底氣跟保護"},{"start":110.919,"end":133.798,"text":"那在第31條的第6款那教師是教學對學生的一個輔導依法令還有那個學校的一個章責呢他是享有專業自主的所以呢我要請問次長那在整個一個校事會議的時候呢"},{"start":136.721,"end":146.348,"text":"那個申訴案案件過來的時候真的有把教室的一個住主權還有教室的管教權先做一個"},{"start":147.861,"end":171.335,"text":"一個防火牆有嗎?有給教師足夠的一個管教權嗎?好,謝謝瑋瑜的關心我想就是在教師會議我們那個新的制度上路之後那經過了113學年度114學年度之後我們也聽到了很多現場老師跟教師團體的反應所以我們也部長親自召開了很多這個座談會"},{"start":172.516,"end":194.883,"text":"我們部內也做積極研商跟各工協會來討論所以在今年的1月12號初步大概針對了一些包括爛樹的問題小案大辦的問題等等我們建立了分流的機制然後在前端進入消失會議之前我們就先去認定這個到底是屬於老師的"},{"start":195.863,"end":224.742,"text":"如果是屬於剛才那個林怡靜委員也有問到比如說校長在召開那個會議的時候他裡面呢他是不投票的因為也有老師說他如果被校長針對的時候他可能小事就進入校事會議了那一去就不回頭了那就折磨半年所以我們也是校長可以來主持那個會議但是他有教師代表有教長代表還有一個校外公正人士去看這個室友那我剛才也提過說如果他是屬於教師之教學對學生的輔導依法令的都是他的專業自主權的"},{"start":225.883,"end":251.057,"text":"他依照他的職權,他是不法的不法的時候,這時候校長或者是老師的代表可以在那個分流會議上面去提到這個問題如果說只是一個小瑕疵行為上,那就是進入一般考核就不進入了所以我們也公布了1到4月新制上入之後確實有一些分流的效果"},{"start":251.417,"end":276.272,"text":"然後呢也達到了這個數據剛剛你們的報告裡面都有提到因為我們時間有限那我要請教那個次長我們過去呢我們都有給學生的一個所謂的學生手冊這個學生手冊呢就是要告訴學生他到了學校呢他還是這個是義務教育嘛那學生來到學校呢他還是必須接受"},{"start":277.452,"end":305.291,"text":"學校一些管制嘛那我現在是在建議我們先看到問題我們來解決問題那我是覺得現在這個學生手冊呢現在沒有紙本嘛在這個網路上呢每個學校大概都有把這個學生手冊那個先布在那個網路上那我在這裡是要建議教育部你這一個學生手冊是不是能夠把它"},{"start":306.152,"end":334.077,"text":"印出來然後呢讓家長看過簽名那表示家長了解了學生呢到學校來應該要要有的一個潛力跟義務你覺得呢我想委員的建議也很好就是說不過這個這個每個學校因為他是依法授權他們各學校去訂定各學校的章責管教的措施辦法所以教育部可不可以這樣提醒我們可以在居住"},{"start":336.298,"end":363.154,"text":"對 其實如果公告在現在網路上也很方便啦就是說你學生有時候你發給他一本他要不要丟掉他也不看是 現在沒有說要印只是說你要讓那個學生回去告知家長每個家長要知道要了解甚至那個以前這個手冊沒有功能嘛因為學生拿了也不看嘛也丟了嘛家長也不知道啊那我們要讓家長我們也要來教育家長啦"},{"start":363.954,"end":382.362,"text":"讓他知道說學生來到學校學生應該要要付的什麼權利跟義務那老師有哪些前線老師有哪些的一個管教錢然後我們三方三方都來做一個教育知青師生啦三方的那個手冊其實我是覺得這蠻好的就是說學校在開學的時候"},{"start":382.862,"end":411.64,"text":"他也都會召開相關的一些親師座談等等其實可以利用我們也會跟學校講去多多利用那個機會來溝通譬如說現在教師現場上的一些一些遇到的一些問題我想學生需要鼓勵老師也需要鼓勵那校長在第一線他也比較好帶所以這個部分我們在7月的局處首長會議的時候我們特別來提醒這個地方首長能夠來落實這個部分"},{"start":412.84,"end":428.185,"text":"我們是希望說多畫面的一個輔導然後能夠減輕那個學校的一個壓力那在這裡我要請教因為最近那個鐵城教育在我們整個社會都發酵了那在這裡我要問那個次長"},{"start":433.367,"end":457.239,"text":"你對於那個韓國的這個大力推動教師合理的一個管教管教者的一個經驗你的看法呢當然是支持嘛 主要是合理管教權在我們的法令規定的譬如說我們現在的公布的那個注意事項裡面我們第24條裡面那個阻卻違法的那個我們已經都都已經函給地方"},{"start":457.859,"end":481.793,"text":"所以從韓國來看,他們在2024到2026年的時候他們就通過了一個正當的教師指導的免責那在這裡我們要引用教師法第31條的第8款剛剛我們林一錦委員也有提到"},{"start":482.253,"end":510.475,"text":"就是說如果老師有進入到司法訴訟的時候學校是有權要來聘請律師來幫他們一個辯護但是我是覺得還沒有進入之前這一個一定要強調為什麼要強調呢強調了以後校長會覺得說我想校長他本身他也不希望說這個老師進入司法那麼校長他就會努力的來協調"},{"start":514.659,"end":528.551,"text":"來協調然後來調整調解家長跟教師之間這樣的一個矛盾所以我覺得這一個地方我們要給學校就是一定要來執行這個訴訟必須要有律師 聘請律師相對的給校長一個潛力跟壓力"},{"start":533.315,"end":550.641,"text":"對我想委員關係的方向跟我們現在那天在座談會公聽會所聽到的就是這個提供除了提供老師在心理輔導智商輔導之外在法律資源上面免費的諮詢上面在法律支持上面我們也正在研議要怎麼樣來落實也要增加經費"},{"start":552.302,"end":571.138,"text":"那因為今天大家關心的焦點都差不多啦那剛剛秀寶委員呢也提到第三方的一個那個消失會議要第三方那在這裡呢我今天用那個韓國的一個叫教育廳統一受理投訴這個部分第三方我個人相當支持"},{"start":571.638,"end":599.647,"text":"因為你這個校事會議案件進到學校來我們一直在強調說行政減量行政減量這一個我們有一個校長說了現在不是在教學是在辦案不是在辦學是在辦案那可見學校校方他承受的壓力有多大那如果再有第三方或是有所謂什麼叫做教育廳先把這個案件先綁在校外"},{"start":600.327,"end":617.118,"text":"那這個案件擋在校外老師、校長都不知道都不知道說他被檢舉了這一個好處就是老師仍然還是可以安心的教學他不會因為這個事件的一個影響讓他情緒低落"},{"start":617.978,"end":633.673,"text":"老師的情緒低落對於學生本月受教程就會影響了我想委員的建議很好啦這個所有的建議我們其實也是會納入進一步我們在後續的在怎麼樣的優化來調整這整個制度的運作我們會來納入演繹"},{"start":635.545,"end":652.735,"text":"那當然這個過程裡面我們要給那個老師一個正當的一個管教我們當然也反對說有所謂的體法或者是人格的一個羞辱這個地方我們也相當支持那最後呢"},{"start":654.016,"end":676.289,"text":"我本人本席是支持說教師是依法輔導還有管教先生但是就是不能夠有不當的一個體罰跟人格的一個羞辱所以教師他採取必要的一個正當還有比例原則的一個維持秩序的一個同時教一部一定是要做他最後的一個後退"},{"start":677.83,"end":696.967,"text":"這個剛剛 謝委員其實在那個我們的教師那個解聘辦法解聘不續聘辦法裡面的第四條第四款裡面就有提到教師業務上之正當行為及為了維持教學秩序教育活動正常進行之必要的管教行為是不予處罰那現在我要跟次長講"},{"start":697.888,"end":715.959,"text":"我們這個校士會議在做的同時其實教育部把這個教師法那個教育基本法其實都要忘掉了所以才會那麼之前會有那麼多一千多件的一個校士會議進到學校來所以我們現在就要"},{"start":717.12,"end":738.074,"text":"嚴格來執行嘛來擋嘛所以呢我們要撐起老師就是撐起老師就是撐起台灣的教育好那第二題呢我要跟那個那個次長請教就是所謂教師教師的離線錢離線錢好那因為呢本辦呢有接受那個一些"},{"start":740.756,"end":763.006,"text":"就是我過去也是老師,回家以後常常也都接到很多家長來電那個時候寄來者不寄,來電就不寄但是現在的老師跟我們過去的老師不一樣因為過去沒有校事會議,現在有校事會議還有很多壓力,有很多學生的問題"},{"start":764.207,"end":782.949,"text":"那在這個地方是不是我們能不能不能夠來保障老師下班了以後有這麼全力說這個離縣的服務謝謝委員關心我們在6月17號的時候已經正式發函給各地方縣市政府有關老師的教師的離縣權"},{"start":784.11,"end":803.483,"text":"就是他跟教師的溝通傳簡訊的應該在上班時間我們已經明令就是地方政府能夠尊重那這個要不要就是你一定也辦完或是立法對我們將來在修那個依據那個職業安全衛生法來修教師的部分的時候我們也會把這個納進去"},{"start":805.124,"end":824.415,"text":"我們就是說在那個修法比較quantified的情況下我們先用這個函用函的方式請地方政府去落實那當然我們也知道說這也許不夠而且有的家長也不了解不過就是說學校行政機關要知道這個老師是有這個工作他的保障的如果是因為這樣被投訴他是不予追究的"},{"start":825.856,"end":831.781,"text":"因為很多老師沒有接電話然後學校以後就是免責了那個校長都有話說除非是那個緊急的校安事件這當然真的是例外"},{"start":846.894,"end":862.161,"text":"那在最後就是說那這一個因為老師都會跟家長都會有一個家長群的一個LINE嘛一個LINE嘛那在這裡是要建議說要不要用一個官方就是學校統一的一個LINE這樣的一個帳號這個好處是什麼這個好處能夠內建嘛"},{"start":866.483,"end":874.808,"text":"內建就是說這個時間到的時候呢那都會主動回覆說下班這是揮漁業時間或者是還可以設定幾個問題然後讓家長在這個關關的袋裡面得到一些信息"},{"start":885.666,"end":908.822,"text":"我想這個建議非常好,我們來跟地方政府演繹好不好來跟找看能不能有類似這樣子的一個措施讓每一個學校大概依這樣的方式會比較好希望就是說跟市長我們剛剛所談的都一定要嚴格的來執行不要口頭上這樣一來一往而已"},{"start":909.482,"end":925.572,"text":"那最後剛剛我還是要回應剛剛秀寶秀寶委員提到就是說現在氣候非常的炎熱那在這裡呢因為我過去我是體育老師我的課都是10點一直上到10點然後中間休息1點到12點12點休息到1點然後2點3點"},{"start":929.855,"end":952.108,"text":"每次在上課的時候學生興趣切滑因為太熱了他也不願意在那邊曬太陽運動雖然他們很喜歡運動但是因為天氣的關係所以這個排課的問題我希望教育部也要最後再做一個評量我們為了特別提醒各地方政府一定要以學童的安全為優先考慮"},{"start":954.789,"end":982.468,"text":"所以我剛剛有在跟次長講委員的關心都有關心到一點我們會朝這方面來努力所以我們希望今天這樣的一個質詢都能夠給全國的所有的對於基層的老師還有關心的家長一個明確的交代目前老師的士氣確實不高我們盡量來鼓勵然後在行政措施上我們給予支持剛才委員提到的法律上的我們也在研議中"},{"start":983.469,"end":1007.648,"text":"我們希望教育部能夠挽回過去所有的家長對於教育尤其是老師是非常非常的尊重那為什麼今天老師這麼沒有地位造成教師荒那今天的報紙也有說那個物理老師那個自然科的老師一聘就有了一聘就來了"},{"start":1008.448,"end":1030.919,"text":"然後呢 其他的老師的項目呢 招不到老師那因為 為什麼 因為很多那個比較好的這個 這些智能課的人他理念到科技公司啊 那不理念到學校啦所以我們要把整個校園的氣候把它 把它營造好嘛那我們共同來努力好 謝謝 謝謝委員 謝謝好 謝謝蔡村崇委員 請次長"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:07.647000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:09.690000+08:00","text":"主席好，有請次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:10.091000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:10.271000+08:00","text":"有請次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:16.523000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:16.783000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:17.504000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:17.784000+08:00","text":"次長好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:19.685000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:34.556000+08:00","text":"今天要跟次長探討校事會議引發了很多問題，希望藉用今天的機會，我們看到問題，能夠解決問題。好。","quality":0.878},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:36.978000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:43.365000+08:00","text":"我們說整個學校的氛圍為什麼會烏煙瘴氣？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:44.106000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:35:57.761000+08:00","text":"源頭就是校事會議，校事會議會有這麼多的爭議，問題是在於老師的受教權被壓縮了……","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:35:58.042000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:36:01.465000+08:00","text":"管教權。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:36:01.465000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:36:02.465000+08:00","text":"管教權，對，不好意思。","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:36:02.326000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:36:26.144000+08:00","text":"所以老師在學校的服務變成沒有幸福感、沒有成就感，我們在教育基本法裡面事實上就已經很明確提到教師的專業自主權，還有學生權益的保障必須並行。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:36:29.485000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:36:59.190000+08:00","text":"目前學校的核心問題不是老師沒有責任感，也不是老師不認真，而是教育部沒有貫徹制度上給教師足夠的底氣與保護，教師法第三十一條第六款規定，教師之教學及對學生之輔導依法令及學校章則享有專業自主。","quality":0.784},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:37:02.613000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:37:26.263000+08:00","text":"我要請問次長，在申訴案件進入校事會議的時候，真的有把教師的自主權還有管教權先做一道防火牆嗎？","quality":0.791},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:37:26.263000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:37:29.445000+08:00","text":"有給教師足夠的管教權嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:37:29.785000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:37:30.486000+08:00","text":"謝謝委員的關心。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:37:31.566000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:38:24.652000+08:00","text":"在校事會議新的制度上路之後，經過了113學年度、114學年度之後，我們也聽到了現場很多老師及教師團體的反映，所以部長也親自召開了很多座談會，部內也積極研商並與各公協會來討論，所以在今年1月12號初步大概針對了一些包括濫訴的問題、小案大辦的問題等等，我們建立了分流的機制，在前端進入校事會議之前，我們就先去認定這個到底是屬於老師的……剛才林宜瑾委員也有問到，比如說校長在召開會議的時候，他在裡面是不投票的，因為有老師說如果被校長針對的時候，他可能小事就進入校事會議，一去就不回頭，折磨半年。","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:38:26.574000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:38:32.658000+08:00","text":"校長是可以來主持會議，但是會有教師代表、家長代表，還有一個校外公正人士去看這個事由。","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:38:33.538000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:38:56.672000+08:00","text":"我剛才也提過，如果它是屬於教師之教學，對學生的輔導是依法令的都是他的專業自主權，依照他的職權，老師是不罰的，這時候校長或者是教師代表可以在分流會議上面去提到這個問題，他不罰，如果說只是一個行為上的小瑕疵，那就是進入一般考核。","quality":0.874},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:38:56.672000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:38:57.672000+08:00","text":"就是把他擋回去了嘛！","quality":0.111},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:38:57.472000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:38:59.593000+08:00","text":"就不進入了。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:38:59.593000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:39:00.593000+08:00","text":"不接受了嘛！","quality":0},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:38:59.893000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:39:07.678000+08:00","text":"所以我們也公布了1到4月新制上路之後，確實有一些分流的效果，也達到了初步……","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:39:08.518000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:39:11.500000+08:00","text":"好，剛剛你們的報告裡面都有提了，因為我們時間有限。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:39:11.500000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:39:12.500000+08:00","text":"對，有提到了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:39:12.381000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:40:14.414000+08:00","text":"我要請教次長，過去我們都有給學生學生手冊，學生手冊就是要告訴學生，他到了學校，這個是義務教育，學生來到學校還是必須接受學校一些管制，我現在是建議，我們先看到問題，我們來解決問題，我覺得學生手冊現在沒有紙本，每個學校大概都有把學生手冊公布在網站上，我在這裡要建議教育部，學生手冊是不是能夠把它印出來讓家長看過簽名，表示家長了解學生到學校應該要有的權利及義務，你覺得呢？","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:40:15.134000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:40:25.356000+08:00","text":"我想委員的建議很好，不過每個學校因為是依法授權各學校去訂定各學校的章則、管教的措施辦法……","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:40:25.736000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:40:27.257000+08:00","text":"是啊，現在就是教育部可不可以提醒……","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:40:27.917000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:40:37.622000+08:00","text":"我們可以在局處……其實如果有公告在網路上也很方便，學生有時候發給他一本，他就丟掉，他也不看。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:40:38.162000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:40:53.731000+08:00","text":"是，現在沒有說要印，只是你要讓學生回去告知家長，每個家長要知道、了解，甚至以前這個手冊沒有功能，因為學生拿了不看，也丟了嘛！","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:40:54.111000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:41:12.160000+08:00","text":"家長也不知道，我們也要教育家長，讓他知道學生來到學校應該要負什麼權利及義務、老師有哪些權限、老師有哪些管教權，我們三方都來做教育。","quality":0.915},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:41:12.740000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:41:14.681000+08:00","text":"就是親、師、生三方的手冊。對。","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:41:14.681000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:41:46.620000+08:00","text":"其實我是覺得這滿好的，學校在開學的時候也都會召開相關的一些親師座談等等，我們也會跟學校講多多利用那個機會來溝通，譬如說現在教師現場上遇到的一些問題，我想學生需要鼓勵，老師也是需要鼓勵，校長在第一線也比較好帶，所以這個部分，我們在7月的局處首長會議的時候，我們會特別來提醒地方首長能夠落實這個部分。","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:41:47.840000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:41:55.183000+08:00","text":"OK，我們是希望多方面的輔導，能夠減輕學校的壓力。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:41:56.723000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:42:17.192000+08:00","text":"我要請教，因為最近「鐵拳教育」在整個社會都發酵了，我要問次長，你對於韓國大力推動教師合理管教權的經驗，你的看法呢？","quality":0.96},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:42:17.592000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:42:32.219000+08:00","text":"當然是支持，合理管教權在我們的法令規定，譬如說我們現在公布的注意事項第二十四條的阻卻違法都已經函給地方。","quality":0.918},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:42:33.880000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:43:14.266000+08:00","text":"從韓國來看，他們在2024年到2026年的時候通過一個「正當教師指導免責」，我們要引用教師法第三十一條第八款，剛剛林宜瑾委員也有提到，如果老師依法執行職務進入司法訴訟的時候，學校有權聘請律師來幫他們辯護，但是我覺得還沒有進入之前，這個一定要強調，為什麼要強調呢？","quality":0.884},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:43:15.407000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:43:22.793000+08:00","text":"強調了以後，校長會覺得說……我想校長本身也不希望老師進入司法嘛！","quality":0.964},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:43:23.934000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:43:43.531000+08:00","text":"校長他就會努力協調、調解家長與教師之間的矛盾，所以我覺得這個地方一定要讓學校對於職務涉訟必須要有聘請律師，相對給校長權力及壓力。","quality":0.817},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:43:48.315000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:44:05.641000+08:00","text":"對，我想委員關心的方向跟我們那天在座談會、公聽會所聽到的，除了提供老師在心理輔導、諮商輔導之外，在法律免費諮詢上面、法律支持上面，我們也正在研議要怎麼樣來落實，也要增加經費。好。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:44:07.602000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:45:17.262000+08:00","text":"因為今天大家關心的焦點都差不多，剛剛秀寳委員也提到第三方的校事會議，我借用韓國的教育廳統一受理投訴這個部分，第三方我個人相當支持，因為校事會議有案件進到學校來，我們一直強調行政減量，我們有一個校長說現在不是在教學，是在辦案，不是在辦學，是在辦案，可見校方承受的壓力有多大，如果再有第三方或是有所謂的教育廳先把這個案件擋在校外，老師、校長都不知道他被檢舉了，這個好處就是老師仍然可以安心的教學，他不會受這個事件影響而情緒低落，老師情緒低落對學生的受教權就會受影響。","quality":0.949},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:45:18.103000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:45:27.272000+08:00","text":"委員的建議很好，所有的建議我們會納入研議，我們後續再看怎麼樣進一步優化、調整整個制度的運作。","quality":0.738},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:45:27.552000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:45:46.615000+08:00","text":"好，我們當然也反對體罰或者是人格的羞辱，但這個過程裡面我們要給老師正當的管教權，這個部分我也相當支持。","quality":0.617},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:45:47.415000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:46:12.830000+08:00","text":"最後，本席支持教師依法輔導還有管教學生，但不能有不當的體罰跟人格的羞辱，所以當教師採取必要、正當且合比例原則的措施維持秩序時，教育部一定要做他最後的後盾，這個剛剛……","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:46:12.830000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:46:31.267000+08:00","text":"是，謝謝委員，其實在我們高級中等以下學校教師解聘不續聘停聘或資遣辦法中第四條第四款就有提到：「教師業務上之正當行為，及為維持教學秩序與教育活動正常進行之必要管教行為，不予處罰。","quality":0.79},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:46:31.267000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:46:32.267000+08:00","text":"」這是明定的。","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:46:31.407000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:46:59.925000+08:00","text":"對，現在我要跟次長講，校事會議在進行的同時，其實教育部把教師法、教育基本法都忘掉了，所以之前才會有一千多件那麼多的校事會議進到學校來，我們現在就要嚴格執行、來擋，我們要撐起老師，撐起老師就是撐起臺灣的教育。","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:47:01.326000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:47:08.091000+08:00","text":"第二題我要跟次長請教的是教師的離線權。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:47:16.416000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:47:49.259000+08:00","text":"我過去也是老師，回家以後常常接到很多家長來電，那個時候是來者不拒，來電都不拒，但是現在的老師跟我們過去的老師不一樣，因為過去沒有校事會議，現在有校事會議，還有很多壓力、有很多學生的問題，我們能不能夠來保障老師下班了以後有離線權？","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:47:49.259000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:47:51.041000+08:00","text":"不一定要……","quality":0},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:47:51.041000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:08.076000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員的關心，我們在6月17號已經就教師的離線權正式發函給各地方縣市政府，跟教師的溝通、傳簡訊應該在上班時間，我們已經明令地方政府尊重……","quality":0.855},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:08.657000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:10.398000+08:00","text":"這個要不要擬定一個辦法或是立法？","quality":0.733},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:10.898000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:18.463000+08:00","text":"我們將來依據職業安全衛生法來修教師的部分時也會把這個部分納進去。好。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:20.645000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:39.395000+08:00","text":"在修法比較曠日廢時的情況下，我們先用函的方式請地方政府去落實，當然，我們也知道也許不夠，而且有的家長也不了解，不過學校作為行政機關要知道老師是有這個工作保障的，如果是因為這樣被投訴，它是不予追究的。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:39.395000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:40.395000+08:00","text":"對，就是不能追究。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:40.395000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:41.395000+08:00","text":"這都是很具體的，對，我們其實也檢討……","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:40.856000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:42.638000+08:00","text":"因為有很多老師沒有接電話……","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:42.638000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:43.638000+08:00","text":"就被投訴了。","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:42.918000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:43.038000+08:00","text":"對，學校……","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:43.158000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:43.759000+08:00","text":"以後這就是免責啦！","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:43.959000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:44.399000+08:00","text":"對，但校長都有話說。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:44.399000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:45.420000+08:00","text":"對，除非是緊急的校安事件。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:48:45.540000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:48:46.761000+08:00","text":"對，這個當然是例外。對。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:49:02.634000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:49:16.221000+08:00","text":"好，最後，因為老師跟家長都會有LINE家長群，我在這裡建議，要不要用一個官方LINE，就是學校統一的LINE帳號？","quality":0.824},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:49:16.221000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:49:16.821000+08:00","text":"這個好處是什麼？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:49:16.821000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:49:29.788000+08:00","text":"好處是能夠內建功能，時間到的時候會主動回復說下班了，現在是非營業時間，或者是還可以設定幾個問題，讓家長在這個官方的LINE裡面得到一些訊息。","quality":0.754},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:49:40.666000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:49:43.588000+08:00","text":"我想這個建議非常好，我們來跟地方政府研議，好不好？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:49:45.029000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:49:50.893000+08:00","text":"看能不能有類似這樣的措施，讓每一個學校依這樣的方式來做，會比較好。","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:49:52.794000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:03.802000+08:00","text":"次長，希望我們剛剛所談的都一定要嚴格來執行，不要就口頭上這樣一來一往而已。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:04.642000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:17.971000+08:00","text":"最後，我還是要回應剛剛秀寳委員提到的，現在氣候非常炎熱，我過去是體育老師，我的課都是10點一直上到……下午。","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:18.851000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:28.697000+08:00","text":"10點，中間12點休息到1點，接下來2點、3點，每一次在上課的時候學生都興致缺缺，因為太熱了。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:28.697000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:33.060000+08:00","text":"對，太熱了。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:33.060000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:41.805000+08:00","text":"雖然他們很喜歡運動，但是因為天氣的關係，他也不願意在那邊曬太陽運動，這個排課的問題，我希望教育部也要再做個評量。","quality":0.745},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:42.205000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:47.108000+08:00","text":"我們會特別提醒各地方政府一定要以學童的安全為優先考慮。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:49.789000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:52.671000+08:00","text":"好，所以我剛剛有再跟次長講……。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:52.671000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:50:55.793000+08:00","text":"委員都有關心到點，我們會朝這方面來努力。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:50:56.794000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:07.301000+08:00","text":"好，我希望今天的質詢能夠給全國所有的基層老師還有關心的家長一個明確的交代。","quality":0.971},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:08.562000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:17.448000+08:00","text":"對，我們一起來努力，目前老師的士氣確實不高，我們儘量來鼓勵，在行政措施上給予支持，剛才委員提到法律上的建議，我們也在研議中。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:18.469000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:22.232000+08:00","text":"我們希望教育部能夠挽回……","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:22.232000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:23.673000+08:00","text":"我們努力。","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:23.673000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:34.141000+08:00","text":"過去所有的家長對於教育，尤其對老師是非常非常地尊重，為什麼今天老師這麼沒有地位，還有教師荒？","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:35.022000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:48.611000+08:00","text":"今天的報紙也有說，物理老師、自然科的老師一應聘就錄取了，其他科目招不到老師，為什麼？","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:48.611000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:55.954000+08:00","text":"因為很多比較好的自然科人才，他寧願到科技公司也不願意到學校。","quality":0.679},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:55.954000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:51:56.954000+08:00","text":"這個有很多因素，當然這也是一個因素，職場吸引力的因素。","quality":0},{"speaker":"蔡委員春綢","start":"2026-06-24T10:51:56.835000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:52:05.039000+08:00","text":"對，所以我們要把整個校園的氣候營造好，我們共同努力。","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-06-24T10:52:05.439000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:52:05.639000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-24T10:52:05.639000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-06-24T10:52:05.919000+08:00","text":"謝謝蔡春綢委員，請次長回座。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-06-24T10:52:06.419000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-06-24T10:52:10.133286+08:00","text":"接下來請葉元之委員進行詢答。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":1485,"blocks":[["蔡委員春綢：（10時35分）主席好，有請次長。"],["主席：有請次長。"],["張廖次長萬堅：委員好。"],["蔡委員春綢：次長好。今天要跟次長探討校事會議引發了很多問題，希望藉用今天的機會，我們看到問題，能夠解決問題。"],["張廖次長萬堅：好。"],["蔡委員春綢：我們說整個學校的氛圍為什麼會烏煙瘴氣？源頭就是校事會議，校事會議會有這麼多的爭議，問題是在於老師的受教權被壓縮了……"],["張廖次長萬堅：管教權。"],["蔡委員春綢：管教權，對，不好意思。所以老師在學校的服務變成沒有幸福感、沒有成就感，我們在教育基本法裡面事實上就已經很明確提到教師的專業自主權，還有學生權益的保障必須並行。目前學校的核心問題不是老師沒有責任感，也不是老師不認真，而是教育部沒有貫徹制度上給教師足夠的底氣與保護，教師法第三十一條第六款規定，教師之教學及對學生之輔導依法令及學校章則享有專業自主。我要請問次長，在申訴案件進入校事會議的時候，真的有把教師的自主權還有管教權先做一道防火牆嗎？有給教師足夠的管教權嗎？"],["張廖次長萬堅：謝謝委員的關心。在校事會議新的制度上路之後，經過了113學年度、114學年度之後，我們也聽到了現場很多老師及教師團體的反映，所以部長也親自召開了很多座談會，部內也積極研商並與各公協會來討論，所以在今年1月12號初步大概針對了一些包括濫訴的問題、小案大辦的問題等等，我們建立了分流的機制，在前端進入校事會議之前，我們就先去認定這個到底是屬於老師的……剛才林宜瑾委員也有問到，比如說校長在召開會議的時候，他在裡面是不投票的，因為有老師說如果被校長針對的時候，他可能小事就進入校事會議，一去就不回頭，折磨半年。校長是可以來主持會議，但是會有教師代表、家長代表，還有一個校外公正人士去看這個事由。我剛才也提過，如果它是屬於教師之教學，對學生的輔導是依法令的都是他的專業自主權，依照他的職權，老師是不罰的，這時候校長或者是教師代表可以在分流會議上面去提到這個問題，他不罰，如果說只是一個行為上的小瑕疵，那就是進入一般考核。"],["蔡委員春綢：就是把他擋回去了嘛！"],["張廖次長萬堅：就不進入了。"],["蔡委員春綢：不接受了嘛！"],["張廖次長萬堅：所以我們也公布了1到4月新制上路之後，確實有一些分流的效果，也達到了初步……"],["蔡委員春綢：好，剛剛你們的報告裡面都有提了，因為我們時間有限。"],["張廖次長萬堅：對，有提到了。"],["蔡委員春綢：我要請教次長，過去我們都有給學生學生手冊，學生手冊就是要告訴學生，他到了學校，這個是義務教育，學生來到學校還是必須接受學校一些管制，我現在是建議，我們先看到問題，我們來解決問題，我覺得學生手冊現在沒有紙本，每個學校大概都有把學生手冊公布在網站上，我在這裡要建議教育部，學生手冊是不是能夠把它印出來讓家長看過簽名，表示家長了解學生到學校應該要有的權利及義務，你覺得呢？"],["張廖次長萬堅：我想委員的建議很好，不過每個學校因為是依法授權各學校去訂定各學校的章則、管教的措施辦法……"],["蔡委員春綢：是啊，現在就是教育部可不可以提醒……"],["張廖次長萬堅：我們可以在局處……其實如果有公告在網路上也很方便，學生有時候發給他一本，他就丟掉，他也不看。"],["蔡委員春綢：是，現在沒有說要印，只是你要讓學生回去告知家長，每個家長要知道、了解，甚至以前這個手冊沒有功能，因為學生拿了不看，也丟了嘛！家長也不知道，我們也要教育家長，讓他知道學生來到學校應該要負什麼權利及義務、老師有哪些權限、老師有哪些管教權，我們三方都來做教育。"],["張廖次長萬堅：就是親、師、生三方的手冊。"],["蔡委員春綢：對。"],["張廖次長萬堅：其實我是覺得這滿好的，學校在開學的時候也都會召開相關的一些親師座談等等，我們也會跟學校講多多利用那個機會來溝通，譬如說現在教師現場上遇到的一些問題，我想學生需要鼓勵，老師也是需要鼓勵，校長在第一線也比較好帶，所以這個部分，我們在7月的局處首長會議的時候，我們會特別來提醒地方首長能夠落實這個部分。"],["蔡委員春綢：OK，我們是希望多方面的輔導，能夠減輕學校的壓力。我要請教，因為最近「鐵拳教育」在整個社會都發酵了，我要問次長，你對於韓國大力推動教師合理管教權的經驗，你的看法呢？"],["張廖次長萬堅：當然是支持，合理管教權在我們的法令規定，譬如說我們現在公布的注意事項第二十四條的阻卻違法都已經函給地方。"],["蔡委員春綢：從韓國來看，他們在2024年到2026年的時候通過一個「正當教師指導免責」，我們要引用教師法第三十一條第八款，剛剛林宜瑾委員也有提到，如果老師依法執行職務進入司法訴訟的時候，學校有權聘請律師來幫他們辯護，但是我覺得還沒有進入之前，這個一定要強調，為什麼要強調呢？強調了以後，校長會覺得說……我想校長本身也不希望老師進入司法嘛！校長他就會努力協調、調解家長與教師之間的矛盾，所以我覺得這個地方一定要讓學校對於職務涉訟必須要有聘請律師，相對給校長權力及壓力。"],["張廖次長萬堅：對，我想委員關心的方向跟我們那天在座談會、公聽會所聽到的，除了提供老師在心理輔導、諮商輔導之外，在法律免費諮詢上面、法律支持上面，我們也正在研議要怎麼樣來落實，也要增加經費。"],["蔡委員春綢：好。因為今天大家關心的焦點都差不多，剛剛秀寳委員也提到第三方的校事會議，我借用韓國的教育廳統一受理投訴這個部分，第三方我個人相當支持，因為校事會議有案件進到學校來，我們一直強調行政減量，我們有一個校長說現在不是在教學，是在辦案，不是在辦學，是在辦案，可見校方承受的壓力有多大，如果再有第三方或是有所謂的教育廳先把這個案件擋在校外，老師、校長都不知道他被檢舉了，這個好處就是老師仍然可以安心的教學，他不會受這個事件影響而情緒低落，老師情緒低落對學生的受教權就會受影響。"],["張廖次長萬堅：委員的建議很好，所有的建議我們會納入研議，我們後續再看怎麼樣進一步優化、調整整個制度的運作。"],["蔡委員春綢：好，我們當然也反對體罰或者是人格的羞辱，但這個過程裡面我們要給老師正當的管教權，這個部分我也相當支持。最後，本席支持教師依法輔導還有管教學生，但不能有不當的體罰跟人格的羞辱，所以當教師採取必要、正當且合比例原則的措施維持秩序時，教育部一定要做他最後的後盾，這個剛剛……"],["張廖次長萬堅：是，謝謝委員，其實在我們高級中等以下學校教師解聘不續聘停聘或資遣辦法中第四條第四款就有提到：「教師業務上之正當行為，及為維持教學秩序與教育活動正常進行之必要管教行為，不予處罰。」這是明定的。"],["蔡委員春綢：對，現在我要跟次長講，校事會議在進行的同時，其實教育部把教師法、教育基本法都忘掉了，所以之前才會有一千多件那麼多的校事會議進到學校來，我們現在就要嚴格執行、來擋，我們要撐起老師，撐起老師就是撐起臺灣的教育。","第二題我要跟次長請教的是教師的離線權。我過去也是老師，回家以後常常接到很多家長來電，那個時候是來者不拒，來電都不拒，但是現在的老師跟我們過去的老師不一樣，因為過去沒有校事會議，現在有校事會議，還有很多壓力、有很多學生的問題，我們能不能夠來保障老師下班了以後有離線權？不一定要……"],["張廖次長萬堅：好，謝謝委員的關心，我們在6月17號已經就教師的離線權正式發函給各地方縣市政府，跟教師的溝通、傳簡訊應該在上班時間，我們已經明令地方政府尊重……"],["蔡委員春綢：這個要不要擬定一個辦法或是立法？"],["張廖次長萬堅：我們將來依據職業安全衛生法來修教師的部分時也會把這個部分納進去。"],["蔡委員春綢：好。"],["張廖次長萬堅：在修法比較曠日廢時的情況下，我們先用函的方式請地方政府去落實，當然，我們也知道也許不夠，而且有的家長也不了解，不過學校作為行政機關要知道老師是有這個工作保障的，如果是因為這樣被投訴，它是不予追究的。"],["蔡委員春綢：對，就是不能追究。"],["張廖次長萬堅：這都是很具體的，對，我們其實也檢討……"],["蔡委員春綢：因為有很多老師沒有接電話……"],["張廖次長萬堅：就被投訴了。"],["蔡委員春綢：對，學校……"],["張廖次長萬堅：以後這就是免責啦！"],["蔡委員春綢：對，但校長都有話說。"],["張廖次長萬堅：對，除非是緊急的校安事件。"],["蔡委員春綢：對，這個當然是例外。"],["張廖次長萬堅：對。"],["蔡委員春綢：好，最後，因為老師跟家長都會有LINE家長群，我在這裡建議，要不要用一個官方LINE，就是學校統一的LINE帳號？這個好處是什麼？好處是能夠內建功能，時間到的時候會主動回復說下班了，現在是非營業時間，或者是還可以設定幾個問題，讓家長在這個官方的LINE裡面得到一些訊息。"],["張廖次長萬堅：我想這個建議非常好，我們來跟地方政府研議，好不好？看能不能有類似這樣的措施，讓每一個學校依這樣的方式來做，會比較好。"],["蔡委員春綢：次長，希望我們剛剛所談的都一定要嚴格來執行，不要就口頭上這樣一來一往而已。","最後，我還是要回應剛剛秀寳委員提到的，現在氣候非常炎熱，我過去是體育老師，我的課都是10點一直上到……"],["張廖次長萬堅：下午。"],["蔡委員春綢：10點，中間12點休息到1點，接下來2點、3點，每一次在上課的時候學生都興致缺缺，因為太熱了。"],["張廖次長萬堅：對，太熱了。"],["蔡委員春綢：雖然他們很喜歡運動，但是因為天氣的關係，他也不願意在那邊曬太陽運動，這個排課的問題，我希望教育部也要再做個評量。"],["張廖次長萬堅：我們會特別提醒各地方政府一定要以學童的安全為優先考慮。"],["蔡委員春綢：好，所以我剛剛有再跟次長講……。"],["張廖次長萬堅：委員都有關心到點，我們會朝這方面來努力。"],["蔡委員春綢：好，我希望今天的質詢能夠給全國所有的基層老師還有關心的家長一個明確的交代。"],["張廖次長萬堅：對，我們一起來努力，目前老師的士氣確實不高，我們儘量來鼓勵，在行政措施上給予支持，剛才委員提到法律上的建議，我們也在研議中。"],["蔡委員春綢：我們希望教育部能夠挽回……"],["張廖次長萬堅：我們努力。"],["蔡委員春綢：過去所有的家長對於教育，尤其對老師是非常非常地尊重，為什麼今天老師這麼沒有地位，還有教師荒？今天的報紙也有說，物理老師、自然科的老師一應聘就錄取了，其他科目招不到老師，為什麼？因為很多比較好的自然科人才，他寧願到科技公司也不願意到學校。"],["張廖次長萬堅：這個有很多因素，當然這也是一個因素，職場吸引力的因素。"],["蔡委員春綢：對，所以我們要把整個校園的氣候營造好，我們共同努力。"],["張廖次長萬堅：好，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝蔡春綢委員，請次長回座。","接下來請葉元之委員進行詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":370,"meet_id":"委員會-11-5-22-17","speakers":["伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","陳培瑜","柯志恩","葛如鈞","陳秀寳","林宜瑾","蔡春綢","葉元之","吳思瑤","吳沛憶","范雲","張雅琳","洪孟楷","王安祥","羅廷瑋","羅智強","盧縣一","傅崐萁","徐欣瑩","何欣純","黃捷","林倩綺"],"page_start":195,"meetingDate":["2026-06-24"],"gazette_id":"1155302","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1155302_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第17次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部政務次長張廖萬堅列席就「校事會議暨教師輔導管教制度與兒少相關權益探討」進行\n專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1155302_00003"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}