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I know我想今天我們要修的這個法是跟烤雞有關因為我自己過去也曾經在中央研究院是有烤雞制度的機構工作了六七年深深的了解這個烤雞制度其實影響大家同仁的關係跟士氣很大但是能改革非常的不容易所以肯定你們有這個勇氣來突破"},{"start":43.621,"end":60.443,"text":"那當然就是改革的好跟壞那有非常多的細節要討論那我今天只針對就是我特別關心的公務員的家庭照顧的這個部分那來跟你們做討論那首先我也先肯定就是全序部"},{"start":61.384,"end":80.547,"text":"這次修法中有延續同樣的精神因為之前在去年十月的時候那我獨家爭取了請育嬰價不應該再扣考積那謝謝考試院跟全序部的支持那當時有通過讓考積制度可以對育嬰留庭更友善"},{"start":81.212,"end":95.557,"text":"對沒錯我們有如果合併兩個另一考級就可以當一個年終考級因為現在勞動部也在推動全國的這個育嬰留庭的彈性制度那公務員如果可以請但是會影響"},{"start":96.697,"end":122.782,"text":"升等的資格跟考積的話那形同是一個懲罰所以我想公務員能夠家庭友善那育嬰留庭更友善的話這部分先肯定你們那我想這一次你們改的是甲乙丙丁四等次變成優秀良好跟未達良好那怎麼樣會被打未達良好那我仔細來看這個部分那請扣除縫星"},{"start":123.622,"end":137.773,"text":"幾支試駕超過30日會變成未達良好那我想請問部長如果是請家庭照顧駕跟身心調試駕會不會受到影響不會 這個都是本來在原來的那個駕裡面"},{"start":140.845,"end":168.182,"text":"好 那這部分的確是如同您所說的你們的考機法修正草案第八條有明確講到就是請扣除奉新給之試駕超過30日這個部分也就是說不會計入第九款的試駕日數這樣解讀沒錯吧沒錯所以這部分我們肯定你們有處理到家庭照顧駕身心調試駕不影響考機"},{"start":170.863,"end":186.93,"text":"因為我個人認為其實照顧家庭個人當然就是家庭的基本先有自己所以就是等於是保障有這些家庭照顧的人可以安心請假這樣解讀沒錯的話可是還是想跟您討論"},{"start":188.351,"end":213.648,"text":"一個不同的部分因為我們去了解了公務員的狀況非常多的公務員反應他還是不敢照需求請假第一個理由是說不影響考積但還是會扣薪我們來看一下相關的規定公務員請試駕每年可以準7日請家庭照顧假及身心調試駕之日數會併入試駕計算"},{"start":216.65,"end":228.383,"text":"也就是說這三種價別合計超過了七天七天內基本上就是不會扣薪可是超過七天仍然會扣薪這樣沒錯吧 部長沒錯"},{"start":231.312,"end":253.162,"text":"我不知道部長有沒有研究過日本的經驗我們辦公室去研究跟了解日本其實在1999年的時候就修法他們有一個育兒戒護修業法它是不只是對勞工對公務員都有提供獨立知心的家庭照顧假"},{"start":254.482,"end":270.247,"text":"而且這個時間還並不短那我們看到的這個數字那當然就是如果全市部有更好的資料也希望你們可以進一步了解他們1999年通過這個法是提供93天67%薪資的家庭照顧假"},{"start":275.202,"end":296.789,"text":"那我們回來看台灣的情況那根據政府的主計處的相關的調查我國有45歲以上的國人近四成有家庭照顧的需求那因為照顧老人而離職者是因為照顧小孩而離職者的2.4倍這個部長您有看過這個數字嗎主計總處的這個資料"},{"start":300.933,"end":308.714,"text":"沒有現在看到好那日本這個經驗您有聽過嗎日本這個勞工公務員都有獨立之心的家庭照顧假"},{"start":309.54,"end":337.033,"text":"我沒有真正了解但是有聽過國外有類似這種家庭照顧假什麼之類的而且就是我這邊查到的資料他是93天67%的薪資那您可以再了解一下那我想這邊要跟部長講的事情就是這裡面我當然說家庭照顧假第一個就先照顧自己那政府的身心調適假是好的因為公務員真的承受不少身心壓力"},{"start":337.833,"end":361.015,"text":"而且如果把工作的壓力再加家庭的壓力加起來你可以看到這一兩年我們查到的新聞就是桃園市政府的不幸的案件他傳簡訊跟親友說壓力很大還有新莊也傳公務員的悲劇當然就是他除了工作壓力之外就是家中也都有壓力是多重的壓力"},{"start":361.696,"end":383.886,"text":"所以職場的身心安全調適這個部分的確相當的重要因為我們也不希望長期訓練的公務員因為這些事情壓垮了所以想問部長有沒有可能考慮把家庭照顧假跟身心調適假如同日本設為獨立的價別"},{"start":387.472,"end":411.221,"text":"跟委員報告我想任何新的價別當然都同時在平衡一個是需求者一個是機關的業務跟用人那以這個部分我想特別是台灣有時候也要同時考慮勞動部門跟政府部門之間的動態的一個平衡所以這個事情我覺得"},{"start":412.361,"end":423.06,"text":"目前我們的看法還是應該是要跟勞動部門的這邊一起大家來充分再討論即使說可以有獨立價別又涉及到說到底應該給"},{"start":425.21,"end":443.635,"text":"給幾天的假 這個假是不是應該是給薪不給薪我想那是一個很複雜的議題 我只是跟委員報告說目前我們在我們的考試規則裡面確實是基本上都還是用給薪的試假來處理這個事情那勞動部門其實試假是不給薪的 您應該知道這個事情"},{"start":444.855,"end":471.167,"text":"謝謝部長那至少您願意跟勞動部一起討論因為勞動部長其實我們最近在審那個性別工作平等法的時候也有蠻多跨黨派的立委那本黨立委也都有提出希望勞動部考慮這個家庭照顧假就如同日本的經驗那部長也是承諾他會回去研議跟了解那這一波先以育嬰的留庭的彈性使用為主那未來會考慮這個家庭照顧假會去研議"},{"start":473.928,"end":498.143,"text":"所以我想既然勞動部已經動起來了我們這邊是希望同步就如同你講的公務員跟勞工可以一起對齊這個部分可以同步去研議那另外我也想跟您討論就是剛剛所講的就是你們這個身心調試架是用意良好那可是有非常多像我們辦公室找到的這個截圖"},{"start":498.843,"end":527.102,"text":"他上面說公務員並沒有多三天身心調試假只是試假多了一種名目而已實際上沒什麼人敢請因為絕對影響烤雞望周知所以如何確保負責烤雞的長官他能夠平常心平等看待請家庭照顧假身心調試假的同仁這方面全序部有沒有什麼具體的做法"},{"start":527.881,"end":555.731,"text":"我跟委員報告這部裡面主管的是制度跟法規啦那我們制度法規當然說可以容許你請身心調四駕三人併入四駕至於機關怎麼樣去執行這樣一個一個措施或者在執行過程的認知是什麼我覺得這還是需要更多的這個溝通啦這個也許是我們人事機關人事部門也可以把這個我們當初設定這個駕的背後的一個"},{"start":557.284,"end":578.866,"text":"那個想法什麼都跟這個機關做宣導我們部裡面大概比較偏向是做制度面的一個說明我想制度在那可是如何宣導跟教育也很重要我剛講的如同我過去在中央研究院的經驗其實長官跟資深的就是公務員的影響的權力很大"},{"start":579.566,"end":597.415,"text":"那之前的或者烤雞就是不如意者就是會覺得非常的不公平那我們怎麼樣讓這些東西能夠盡可能讓大家覺得不是因為就是法律上說可以可是長官就是會留下不好的印象能夠平等的對待還蠻重要的"},{"start":598.015,"end":612.93,"text":"好那最後我也還是剩一點時間那跟您討論就是公務員的視清留庭因為主計總處真的統計照顧長輩失業者逐年攀升照顧老人離職者是照顧小孩的2.4倍"},{"start":614.771,"end":638.384,"text":"如果長照需求以民間團體加總的研究很多其實是管理階層有些在公務體系也有在私人體系所以我們從公務體系的人才庫來講真的有人因為長照離職的話會是巨大的損失勞動部就像我剛講的已經在研議彈性有新的長照安排價"},{"start":639.184,"end":662.031,"text":"那這邊細節我就不講了就是民間團體的倡議那這邊您有需要的話我們都可以提供給您包含日本的經驗所以最後我就是請全序部第一個您剛剛有提到如何讓長官可以尊重你們通過的法令他真的能夠執行而不是主觀上就把相關的家庭照顧"},{"start":663.491,"end":685.865,"text":"暈流停的人考機打得不好希望能夠承諾加強教育訓練那23就是希望參著日本或其他國家的經驗研議家庭照顧價這些照顧的價成為獨立價別那有沒有可能有經濟保障的可能性那這三點那個部長可以來逐步努力嗎"},{"start":686.547,"end":702.577,"text":"好 我們來參考委員的意見看看也多方了解勞動部那邊的現在的可能一些相關的資訊好 就跟勞動部多溝通討論一下我們來多多來想想這件事情那可以多久之內給我一個初步的書面的報告好嗎"},{"start":704.7,"end":731.186,"text":"我覺得這個真的涉及到制度很大的如果真的要做是一個很嚴肅的課題是不是委員當我們覺得比較有成熟的時候再跟委員也許在辦公室跟你辦公室你會跟你大概先私下溝通會比較好大概那個三個月會不會成熟還是要更長的時間半年我覺得三個月對我來講真的是有點那半年好了我們先約半年好嗎先約半年我跟委員做這個說明謝謝謝謝部長謝謝"},{"start":734.93,"end":734.951,"text":"好"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}