{"error":false,"id":["170251"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":170251,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170251","日期":"2026-07-02","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-26-17","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":17,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[26],"委員會代碼:str":["社會福利及衛生環境委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-07-02T10:03:28+08:00","結束時間":"2026-07-02T10:18:07+08:00","影片長度":"00:14:39","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/cc5c88b044d5f1e07bf0056374c83aacc206a561727bd8a3e0219f54a37cabceb066f83588e7a26e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"王育敏","委員發言時間":"10:03:28 - 10:18:07","會議時間":"2026-07-02T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議（事由：審查\n一、委員徐巧芯等19人擬具「菸害防制法第二十六條條文修正草案」案。\n二、委員黃健豪等17人擬具「菸害防制法第三十七條條文修正草案」案。\n三、委員羅智強等17人擬具「菸害防制法第二十六條條文修正草案」案。\n四、委員羅智強等17人擬具「菸害防制法第四十條條文修正草案」案。\n五、委員吳宗憲等17人擬具「菸害防制法第四條條文修正草案」案。\n六、委員陳秀寳等20人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n七、委員林月琴等22人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n八、委員王育敏等20人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n九、委員呂玉玲等16人擬具「菸害防制法增訂第七條之一條文草案」案。\n十、委員邱若華等17人擬具「菸害防制法第三條及第十五條條文修正草案」案。\n十一、委員陳超明等31人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十二、委員王義川等17人擬具「菸害防制法第三十二條及第四十條條文修正草案」案。\n十三、委員林倩綺等22人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十四、委員陳菁徽等21人擬具「菸害防制法第十五條條文修正草案」案。\n十五、委員林思銘等20人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十六、委員邱鎮軍等20人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十七、委員賴瑞隆等17人擬具「菸害防制法部分條文修正草案」案。\n【僅詢答】【第十二至十七案，如經復議則不予審查】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":2.71409375,"end":6.98346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":7.152218750000001,"end":7.16909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":7.16909375,"end":9.31221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":12.383468750000002,"end":13.193468750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":13.716593750000001,"end":30.27096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":30.55784375,"end":48.479093750000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":48.900968750000004,"end":71.26034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":71.93534375,"end":79.05659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":79.12409375,"end":79.29284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":79.29284375,"end":81.21659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":81.52034375000001,"end":84.10221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":84.42284375,"end":88.86096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":89.21534375,"end":94.76721875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":96.15096875,"end":108.99284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":102.85034375000001,"end":103.32284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":106.59659375000001,"end":106.96784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":107.94659375,"end":109.98846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":110.10659375,"end":113.86971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":112.80659375,"end":117.86909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":115.64159375000001,"end":116.04659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":118.22346875000001,"end":118.24034375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":118.24034375000001,"end":118.83096875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":118.25721875,"end":123.15096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":122.99909375000001,"end":131.36909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":131.36909375000002,"end":141.67971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":138.55784375000002,"end":140.71784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":142.00034375,"end":181.30221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":163.09409375,"end":163.14471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":163.21221875,"end":163.41471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":181.38659375,"end":181.62284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":181.97721875000002,"end":187.76534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":188.03534375,"end":190.02659375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":190.16159375,"end":198.36284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":194.41409375,"end":194.85284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":198.44721875000002,"end":198.90284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":198.73409375,"end":204.64034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":200.55659375000002,"end":200.91096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":201.68721875,"end":202.22721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":204.57284375,"end":204.92721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":205.12971875000002,"end":215.89596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":215.86221875,"end":216.06471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":216.06471875000003,"end":238.10346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":216.08159375000002,"end":216.16596875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":236.01096875000002,"end":236.78721875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":238.30596875,"end":256.41284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":238.35659375,"end":240.17909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":242.20409375000003,"end":242.81159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":256.64909375,"end":260.24346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":260.00721875,"end":268.66409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":268.66409375,"end":284.13846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":284.79659375,"end":286.90596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":286.90596875,"end":331.65846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":296.33909375,"end":296.74409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":307.35846875000004,"end":307.83096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":310.85159375,"end":312.70784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":313.07909375,"end":313.31534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":316.01534375,"end":316.08284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":320.62221875,"end":321.01034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":321.31409375000004,"end":323.20409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":324.06471875,"end":324.73971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":325.88721875000005,"end":373.72784375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","st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我們有請那個石部長跟江署長好 有請石部長 江署長好 歐安人早部長好 這個昨天爆發了非常重大的食安事件中原油脂 它在4月份出口出產的一批油脂呢出現了一級致癌物本田脾 超標4倍"},{"start":30.638,"end":46.554,"text":"那這件事情我覺得非常的嚴重主要是它的量非常的大因為它這個有1300公噸1300公噸是什麼概念呢如果我們是一個瓶裝有是一公斤的話這等於是130萬桶"},{"start":48.976,"end":71.093,"text":"非常非常的龐大而這一家廠商呢他每日加工可以高達3000公噸的這個黃豆每日精煉600公噸的油品連產量是21萬公噸這個是網路上資料所顯現所以他是國內非常大的一間的這個生產油脂的廠商喔"},{"start":71.954,"end":94.526,"text":"那在這樣的情況底下爆發這麼重大的事件這個是4月份他所生產的油4月4號製造4月8號10號出貨是6月30號通報我要問這個部長跟署長到目前為止他這1300公噸的油已經有多少被使用多少下架"},{"start":96.492,"end":117.447,"text":"下架的部分我們現在已經全面啟動下架那因為他這個日期比較早他的那個這個製造日期是4月4號就是今年115年會不會多數已經被使用完畢了應該都已經賣出了啦所以我們現在所以現在下架量是多少到目前為止還有存量有下架的有嗎"},{"start":118.448,"end":140.877,"text":"沒有幾乎都是在市面上要去回收了變成要去回收我說那個量你們現在掌握到市面上的量還剩多少還是其實已經使用完畢因為是四月份到現在已經快三個月那因為我們是昨天7月1號發布那個批次跟日期所以我們還要再統計你們現在還沒有掌握到多少數量還沒有多少回來這樣"},{"start":142.037,"end":162.954,"text":"好這個是非常的重大如果是它的這等於是130萬桶這種一公斤裝的話那它輻射的範圍我想每一個縣市大概都有了那其實讓大家最擔心的是這樣的一個有問題的油品它如果流入了校園在我們的營養午餐很多孩子其實也都吃下肚了"},{"start":163.434,"end":187.309,"text":"所以這麼重大的這樣的一個食安我們要關注的是第一個它的污染來源到底來自於哪裡這麼大的油品廠基本上它的應該它的品管要做到非常的嚴格才對因為你一爆發這個就是輻射出去範圍非常的廣啊那目前為止你們掌握到的第一個我要問的是它的污染來源是什麼為什麼會超標四倍這麼多好"},{"start":188.71,"end":204.427,"text":"跟委員說明這個事件我們已經先初步掌握到的是說它在4月的第一批它其實它是有驗的它有驗那個大豆原料跟它的油品當時候的檢驗報告是合格的"},{"start":205.228,"end":220.615,"text":"那是事後呢有下游他出貨給他的下游是有下游通報說他驗出的好像是草標所以才回頭再回來再去檢驗他第一批"},{"start":221.516,"end":236.332,"text":"剩餘的那些原料再去驗然後再驗出時間又過了一段時間了所以現在到底是因為時間的關係還是製程上面哪邊出了什麼問題現在正在釐清當中"},{"start":238.394,"end":255.579,"text":"所以它這個過程應該是溫度啦因為這個產生跟溫度有關係所以我們尋常也是會跟大家教育就是說你在用油品的時候那個溫度不要過熱 過高因為都有可能會產生"},{"start":256.724,"end":283.758,"text":"所以不是中煉油脂自己發現的是它下油的廠商對 因為它自己的因為我們有三級品管嘛它自己驗 它有驗它的那個報告第一次是合格的符合標準的好 真正它發生的原因我要求這個食藥署你們要好好去查明原因是什麼因為如果你不找出真正的原因那聽起來很可怕它稍微一個品管不慎你輻射下去都是這一種"},{"start":284.878,"end":313.608,"text":"上千公噸的油品的污染對 我也是要求說一定要找到這個原因在哪裡才能夠避免同樣的類似的事情發生這個我們一定會把它因為我們也在找食藥署也已經在找這些相關的油品的專家在研究到底是這個製程的哪一段出了什麼問題它應該這個不是污染這個不是污染是製程是方法出現的問題那是哪一段"},{"start":314.128,"end":331.196,"text":"因為這個過程也蠻長的嘛那我們一定會把它弄清楚然後發佈這個結果然後要求其他的業者也同樣的要注意這樣類似的因為這個是涉及到油脂大家每天都會吃到的它的那個食安"},{"start":331.736,"end":351.03,"text":"品質的把關要特別的嚴格第二個我要講的就是業者自稱說他這個是符合規定的因為只要半年齁這個驗一次就沒有問題他昨天自己發出來的聲明他說他是有符合規定半年驗一次就可以但是我今天就要跟這個部長跟署長討論我們的食安法第七條我們第七條其實是有授權你們"},{"start":356.034,"end":370.222,"text":"就是再去定一個辦法就是他們到底要怎麼自行的監測然後自行或委外的檢驗但是現在在你們食藥署的這個QA裡面呢你們是說使用油脂最低檢驗週期每半年或每批至少一次那這個業者是說他"},{"start":374.944,"end":383.988,"text":"有做到每半年一次他說他自己還提升到每季一次但是還出了這麼嚴重的問題那我的意思是說像這樣子一個大規模的一個油脂生產商你們在相關辦法裡面你們並沒有去分就是說這一個業者他的規模的大小還有就是他供應量的大小你們去加嚴或者是要求他自己那個抽驗的頻率那這個是事後"},{"start":402.296,"end":420.991,"text":"事後都已經賣出血大吃下肚了才發現那是不是應該要改成每一個批次他這麼大量在某一個情況的底下他這麼大量的油脂應該是每批次要送驗而且送驗之後合格再出貨才不會像這次這麼我覺得他影響範圍太大了"},{"start":423.345,"end":451.361,"text":"是不是應該要檢討跟委員報告委員非常專業的說明裡面其實每一批次這個是剛好批次是合規的出去的那出去因為業者對於裡面的標準呢非常非常在意所以下油的要用他的油的人自己也在驗了一次才會知道知道之後呢回饋回來他很責負責任的又去把自己的剩下的油再驗所以我們評估起來的確是製程上面因為長期的製程都沒有問題也沒有修改"},{"start":451.921,"end":465.837,"text":"所以他們自己覺得說怎麼會有這種的現象出來所以有提到說會不會哪一個環節裡面的溫度控制的不夠好或者是連續製造裡面的某些製程的某一小段所以他們為了這件事情呢會做的事情是在"},{"start":467.078,"end":487.515,"text":"關鍵的時刻就會把現在試紙的方式及早的去做自我的檢測所以我們看到的是我們對於有品的要求非常嚴格之下業者也非常警醒的前端驗合格放出去後端使用端持續在承接要有品的時候也再次驗亦有異常回饋"},{"start":488.195,"end":503.277,"text":"回饋再確定確定異常就通報所以我們看起來是通報是這樣的結果之下我們現在要做的事情是要把整體現在的擴及的面因為油品的源頭有點點異常不符合雖然說這個是慢性致癌的風險"},{"start":504.158,"end":521.273,"text":"他的風險在我們管理上面只要超過我們不希望我們的民眾長期是這樣的風險因此只要超過就要把它回收回來是我們的責任那我們會把後續要如何把相關的回收的狀況以及製程上面異常也會都會來做最後期的報告"},{"start":521.914,"end":538.757,"text":"我覺得我跟委員說明這個委員剛剛提到說是不是對於這個生產量大的竹坯檢驗這個我們可以來研議但是我是覺得先去釐清這一次的問題在哪裡免得說其實它有驗但是卻後面還是發生問題所以到底是哪一個環節出了問題在哪裡來補強這個等我們都調查清楚之後我們再來我要求這兩項"},{"start":551.439,"end":565.385,"text":"第一個就是這一次出問題的原因那個整個製程就是一定要找出真正的原因到底發生在哪裡第二個是這個也是業者自己講的他自己這個之後他說以後我要每批驗我驗完之後沒問題我才要出貨"},{"start":567.106,"end":578.479,"text":"所以代表他自己也有看到這樣的一個疏漏那因為你們現在寫得非常的鬆我要求你們要去研定一個辦法就是說找原因是一個但是另外針對這一種你是上游的原料供應商量很大的我覺得你們不要有那個模糊的空間你們現在是每半年或每批都可以那當然"},{"start":588.09,"end":606.843,"text":"就是自我標準比較鬆的它每半年我符合你規定啊它沒有違法它完全沒有違法但是這個是在管理上面我覺得你應該要分它影響的範圍的大小去加嚴它的相關的措施真的這種量這麼大的就是每批你不應該是每半年我覺得這樣子我們才能真正從源頭把關嘛"},{"start":609.445,"end":627.372,"text":"要不然這個如果再發生一次重大食安事件是那種源頭他又管理不好他說我辦年宴啦那貨已經出啦那如果這種怎麼辦因為你在法令上你是沒有明定的喔所以我要求部長跟署長你們回去要在這相關辦法裡面你們再去定一個更仔細的這樣的一個把關標準"},{"start":628.052,"end":643.781,"text":"跟委員說我們會並這個事件的調查結果一併來檢討這個後續的管理措施那接下來就是這次的那個電子菸的部分我特別要講一次性電子菸的問題我不知道這個部長你了解多少"},{"start":644.501,"end":659.337,"text":"一次性電子菸這個是對於我們未成年強害最大的那2025呢有一個研究重點發現這種一次性電子菸呢它因為低價比較容易入手它是幾百塊然後"},{"start":659.858,"end":682.145,"text":"它這個又像玩具然後呢它免沖油免換彈使用門檻低所以在校園裡面是很容易去分享的但是這樣的一個一次性電子煙它比比較貴的那個電子煙它的危害性更大它重金屬更高所以這個調查報告裡面它就說它這種一次性電子煙"},{"start":683.018,"end":706.326,"text":"一天的這個簽釋放量高於這種傳統止煙20包的這個止煙的量還要高還有它有的裝置它的鎳超過致癌這個風險的限值有的T超過致癌風險的限值那你們現在查到的電子煙裡面我想問國健署一次性電子煙佔的比例有多高你們現在即查到了電子煙"},{"start":707.266,"end":725.638,"text":"這個我們再進一步去了解因為這個是衛生局這邊查可能沒有過去的統計去區分它是這個disposable這個就是所謂disposable一次要完丟的這一種跟那個refuel的那種的分別我們再來看看能不能分得出來"},{"start":726.258,"end":748.995,"text":"這一個部分真的危害很大所以你們絕對是要加強查救最後一個問題就是網路的部分剛剛也有委員提到嘛你們說下架率很高但是我要告訴部長是他上架率也很高就是抓不勝抓你一屏蔽之後他馬上又來那所以這件事情我們這次除了修法之外你看我們截到的土這個都是在電子煙商城裡面"},{"start":749.835,"end":772.702,"text":"隨便解就都有啊所以你雖然說你下價率高但是他這個上價率也很高啊他幾乎是現在業者現在業者在這部分的把關坦白講他也沒有那麼嚴格他比較是被動式的就是說這個有來檢舉那我就屏蔽但是如果沒有情況底下你要上就隨便你上所以才會產生這樣的情況你根本沒有阻斷"},{"start":773.582,"end":790.739,"text":"所以我覺得這次的這個修法我希望你們跟書發部要研究一個在更進一步可以加嚴跟阻斷的方法要不然你們沉溺於說哎呀我們這下加率很高我要告訴部長這上加率也很高啊你現在隨便上去看也都還存在啊那這個怎麼辦"},{"start":793.045,"end":820.953,"text":"我們這一次修法裡面也是在強化這個平台業者的責任這個我們會來書發部有來來書發部講一下你們應該道高於恥謀高於仗你們書發部存在就是要比業者更厲害啊是謝謝委員知道那我們也關心這個議題所以我們在前幾天已經找Google來討論了是那Google已經禁止所有的電子鹽來買廣告是那第二個如果有看到它會快速配合我們下架"},{"start":821.613,"end":836.567,"text":"所以Coco願意主動的主動的去做這個是在廣告的部分他絕對不會接受電子電的廣告是那在商城販賣呢那販賣的部分他會願意來配合快速下架最後一個是他比較正向的他希望"},{"start":837.408,"end":851.164,"text":"協助我們政府的網站教育性的網站能往前提升讓你如果查電子院其實出現的前面的第一頁通通是正向的電子院防治廣告防治的一些網站所以這三點我們已經跟Google談了他已經承諾了"},{"start":852.665,"end":874.682,"text":"我希望這個書發布你們積極一點這個數位科技我們絕對要用最大的力量去攔截因為這一些都是跟我們的未成年人在鬥手那我前面已經講對未成年人健康的危害這些重金屬的危害是很大的所以一定要用最霹靂的手段來阻斷不要讓他在網路上面春風吹又生好不好好謝謝委員謝謝好謝謝王玉明委員接下來請邱委員"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}