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初仁早 局長早"},{"start":12.57,"end":32.452,"text":"今天的這個討論的題目我想就從國安層級來看目前看到的影響國家安全治安公共安全的衝擊社會資源還有健保的負擔青年世代剛才你也提到了如果這種不能控制的話是變成國力的衰退是一個很嚴肅的問題"},{"start":33.773,"end":43.44,"text":"那麼國境安全的壓力那我特別要從這個國內挑戰的部分來三個面向請局長做點回應在技術面法規面"},{"start":45.796,"end":68.112,"text":"這個戰情整合面那我們特別看那個紅字的部分我想就請局長就這個紅字的部分您做一個說明目前我們在如何強化因為剛剛已經在整合的問題上面填到了我們的能力但是長遠看量能需要有更大的投資跟整合跨部會我想您是不是就紅色部分您做一個回應"},{"start":69.152,"end":86.797,"text":"那在那個所謂技術面法規面跟戰情整合面那特別是在戰情整合面那怎麼樣除了從歷來查緝的個案當中去整理出他的犯罪的手法跟樣態這大概是國安局從國安情報的角度當中可以做一些貢獻的"},{"start":87.637,"end":109.187,"text":"那另外是在整體的區域的毒品的相關的一個傳散的一個流入那各個國家他們在分析這個毒品的流入過程當中有沒有看到一些新的趨勢那這部分我們會透過國際情報交流的方式來掌握相關的動態那再反過來跟我們國內的國安情報機關特別是有司法檢察權的國安情報機關來交換相關的意見"},{"start":112.688,"end":128.198,"text":"那在技術面剛剛也跟羅美玲委員有稍微說明一下科技徵收手段不管在暗網的徵收或是其他的反毒包括無人機的一個運用那這部分也是我們在努力的一個重點那大概簡要的跟委員做以上的說明"},{"start":128.878,"end":146.991,"text":"提出一个补充建议因为从技术面看因为很多我们需要跟地方的医学中心做合作事实上每一个大的医学院医学中心他们有一个很好的资料库你可以了解到医院里面不同等级的"},{"start":147.751,"end":177.277,"text":"主治医师主任大夫或者是甚至是护理人员他根据他的个人的安全和合定的层级他可以进到去看病例去看他的背景看资料这个部分是不是我们将来在这方面需要跟这个医学院强化一些合作因为完全仰赖我们这个警检的中心或者做调查里面对这些毒品的专业分析有些实际上是超过我们的人力负荷"},{"start":177.717,"end":197.316,"text":"好,謝謝委員提醒,所以我們也來注意一下醫療中心裡面對於相關這些數據案例的整體的分析好,謝謝那下面一個是不是我們請這個調查局的連副局長請調查局副局長"},{"start":206.192,"end":219.643,"text":"我還是同樣提出就是說我們在做這個反毒的情境狀況下我們有官方甚至跟對岸的有在這個反毒的上面還是要有合作的空間一方面我們又"},{"start":221.121,"end":244.791,"text":"要顾虑到对方面用毒品的渗透这是一个大面向但是另外就是小面向的执法上面你又跟对方还要有合作还是要在边境在小山通你要出去做集合司法跟情资上我们有落差这个部分您可不可以做一个解释就是像我们第二条的红字部分"},{"start":247.843,"end":263.157,"text":"跟委員報告,就是有關兩岸的這個情資往來部分其實我們只要有發現案件的情資有涉及到大陸的部分的話我們都會積極的就是透過我們的管道傳送到大陸去,請他們來協助來協辦"},{"start":265.899,"end":294.256,"text":"那如果在管轄权跟法规上有落差那在互相的沟通过程中会不会有解读这个双方意识不能够达到一种共识这个方法那我们的发现有一些从大陆渗透小三通带这个毒品过来但是我们回应到对方时候对方没有在他启动就是说反国之前就做集合那我们是被动接招这种方法有没有强化的空间"},{"start":295.798,"end":307.833,"text":"跟委員報告目前我們情資往來部分其實我們有很多情資到大陸去之後那目前大陸都沒有積極的回應所以我們也是希望透過各種管道來共同來打擊這個毒品犯罪"},{"start":310.137,"end":326.718,"text":"我想在引渡或共同审判面临政治上跟法律的双重考验一方面它是否定你的存在二方面但是我们也有些情知证明它内部也有一些贩毒的问题我们也可以做一个回溯在这个方面是不是可以点强化的空间"},{"start":327.358,"end":350.212,"text":"是,委員所建議的這部分,我們回去會請法務部這邊來積極的跟委員回應因為我們調查局主要是針對這個打擊毒品犯罪為主,謝謝是,我想今天的問題主要是以國安的角度,從政策面大的格局來看這個問題它並不只單止於就是說我們每年激獲多少量這個一二三等"},{"start":351.132,"end":368.885,"text":"各種級的最主要就是要強化我們內部不能夠再被毒品的滲透我想在這個理念上面我們大家有共同努力合作的空間那最後是不是請局長再做一個總結就是對我們今天這個議題上面強化這個合作的空間跨部會合作的空間"},{"start":369.745,"end":389.054,"text":"我想反毒的問題他已經慢慢的從這種個案的司法案件的偵辦變成是一個社會治安社會安全那再提升到國家安全的一個層級那當然到這部分他可能還有涉及到除了有一些相關樣態的掌握以外資源的投入也會非常的重要"},{"start":390.154,"end":416.454,"text":"我們有一些因應那個新的一些販毒的手法跟網絡那你要有更多的資源跟更多的人力的投入才有辦法能夠形成一個我們國內的一個反毒的一個防線所以這部分我想行政院在之前也有宣布一些比較具體的措施那這部分假如有需要我們國安單位來做配合我們會全力的支援用情報來支援我們的司法的查查以及用情報來支援我們反毒系統的一個建置"},{"start":418.072,"end":433.568,"text":"今天这个议题是需要我们全国同胞共同努力,不能再让这种毒品在国内消耗我们的民心士气,迫害社会团结,尤其是像这毒价造成的结果,对民心的伤害太大,我们要共同努力。"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:52:42.730000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:52:45.694000+08:00","text":"主席，有請國安局蔡局長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T09:52:45.694000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:52:51.862000+08:00","text":"請蔡局長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:52:51.862000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:52:52.423000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，陳委員早。","quality":0.625},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:52:52.743000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:52:52.884000+08:00","text":"局長早。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:52:54.570000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:53:17.515000+08:00","text":"今天討論的題目就從國安層級來看，目前看到影響國家安全包括治安與公共安全的衝擊、社會資源與健保的負擔，還有青年世代，剛才你也提到了，如果這個問題不能控制的話會造成國力的衰退，是一個很嚴肅的問題，以及對國境安全的壓力。","quality":0.859},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:53:18.495000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:53:28.397000+08:00","text":"我特別從國內挑戰的三個面向請局長作回應，包括技術面、法規面及戰情整合面。","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:53:29.598000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:53:38.003000+08:00","text":"我們特別看簡報紅字的部分，請局長就紅字的部分說明目前我們要如何強化。","quality":0.906},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:53:38.464000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:53:50.112000+08:00","text":"因為剛剛已經在整合的問題上面談到我們的能力，但是長遠來看，量能需要有更大的投資及跨部會整合，您是不是就紅色部分作回應？","quality":0.891},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:53:51.472000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:54:08.777000+08:00","text":"好，在所謂技術面、法規面及戰情整合面，特別針對戰情整合面，主要是如何從歷來查緝的個案當中整理出它的犯罪手法及樣態，這大概是國安局從國安情報的角度當中可以做一些貢獻的。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:54:09.797000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:54:31.187000+08:00","text":"另外在整體、區域的毒品相關的傳散與流入，各個國家在分析毒品的流入過程當中有沒有看到一些新的趨勢，這部分我們會透過國際情報交流的方式掌握相關的動態，再反過來跟我們國內的國安情報機關、特別是有司法警察權的國安情報機關交換相關的意見。","quality":0.981},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:54:34.828000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:54:50.178000+08:00","text":"在技術面，剛剛也跟羅美玲委員有稍微說明一下科技偵蒐手段，不管在暗網的偵蒐或是其他的反毒包括無人機的運用，這部分也是我們在努力的重點，大概簡要的跟委員做以上的說明。","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:54:50.878000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:54:58.303000+08:00","text":"提出一個補充建議，因為從技術面看，很多需要跟地方的醫學中心合作。對。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:54:59.364000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:55:27.455000+08:00","text":"事實上每一個大的醫學院、醫學中心，都有一個很好的資料庫，你可以了解到，醫院裡面不同等級的主治醫師、主任甚至是護理人員，根據他個人的安全核定層級，他可以去看病歷、背景、資料，我們將來是不是在這方面需要跟醫學院強化合作？","quality":0.66},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:55:28.155000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:55:39.257000+08:00","text":"因為完全仰賴警檢的中心調查，對這些毒品的專業分析，有些實際上是超過我們的人力負荷。","quality":0.658},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:55:39.717000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:55:48.605000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員提醒，這我們也來注意一下醫療中心對於相關案例數據的整體分析。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:55:49.486000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:55:51.328000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:55:52.229000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:55:58.335000+08:00","text":"接下來請調查局的連副局長。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T09:55:58.335000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:55:59.316000+08:00","text":"請調查局副局長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"連副局長震宗","start":"2026-07-06T09:55:59.316000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:56:03.754000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:56:03.754000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:56:08.192000+08:00","text":"副局長，你好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:56:08.192000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:56:44.290000+08:00","text":"我還是同樣提出，在反毒的情境狀況下，我們官方跟對岸在反毒上面還是要有合作的空間，一方面我們要顧慮對方用毒品滲透，這是一個大面向，但是另外在小面向的執法上，你又要跟對方合作，還是要在邊境、在小三通去做稽核，那司法跟情資上我們有落差，這個部分您可不可以做一個解釋？","quality":0.815},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:56:44.670000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:56:46.771000+08:00","text":"就是像第二條的紅字部分。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"連副局長震宗","start":"2026-07-06T09:56:49.843000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:57:05.157000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，有關兩岸的情資往來，其實我們只要有發現案件的情資涉及到大陸的部分，我們都會積極的透過管道傳真到大陸去，請他們來協助、來協辦。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:57:08.339000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:57:18.625000+08:00","text":"如果在管轄權跟法規上有落差，在互相的溝通過程中會不會有解讀雙方意思不能夠達到共識的情形？","quality":0.643},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:57:20.907000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:57:36.056000+08:00","text":"我們發現有一些從大陸滲透、從小三通帶毒品過來，但是我們回應給對方時，對方沒有在他返國之前就做稽核，我們是被動接招，這種方法有沒有強化的空間？","quality":0.562},{"speaker":"連副局長震宗","start":"2026-07-06T09:57:37.798000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:57:49.813000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，目前情資往來部分，其實我們有很多情資到大陸去之後，大陸都沒有積極的回應，所以我們也希望透過各種管道來共同打擊毒品犯罪。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:57:52.137000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:58:08.538000+08:00","text":"我想在引渡或共同審判面臨政治上跟法律上的雙重考驗，一方面他否定你的存在，二方面我們也有些情資證明他內部也有一些販毒的問題，我們也可以做一個回溯，在這方面是不是可以有一點強化的空間？","quality":0.741},{"speaker":"連副局長震宗","start":"2026-07-06T09:58:09.358000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:58:20.605000+08:00","text":"是，委員所建議的這部分，我們回去會請法務部來積極的跟委員回應，因為我們調查局主要是針對打擊毒品犯罪，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:58:20.785000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:58:43.079000+08:00","text":"我想今天的問題，主要是以國安的角度，從政策面大的格局來看這個問題，它並不單止於我們每年緝獲多少一、二、三各級的毒品，最主要就是要強化我們內部，不能夠再被毒品滲透，我想在這個理念上面，我們大家有共同努力合作的空間。","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:58:43.239000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:58:50.885000+08:00","text":"最後是不是請局長再做一個總結，就是對我們今天這個議題強化跨部會合作的空間？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:58:51.745000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:59:38.434000+08:00","text":"對，我想反毒的問題已經慢慢的從個案的司法案件的偵辦變成社會治安、社會安全，再提升到國家安全的層級，當然在這部分除了相關樣態的掌握以外，資源的投入也會非常的重要，為了因應新的販毒手法跟網絡，必須要有更多的資源跟更多人力的投入，才有辦法形成國內反毒的防線，這部分行政院在之前也有宣布一些比較具體的措施，假如有需要我們國安單位來配合之處，我們會全力的支援，用情報來支援我們司法的查察，以及用情報來支援我們反毒系統的建置。","quality":0.953},{"speaker":"陳委員永康","start":"2026-07-06T09:59:40.072000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:59:55.548000+08:00","text":"今天這個議題需要我們全國同胞共同努力，不能再讓毒品在國內消耗我們的民心士氣、破壞社會團結，尤其是像毒駕造成的結果對民心的傷害太大，我們要共同努力。","quality":0.691},{"speaker":"蔡局長明彥","start":"2026-07-06T09:59:56.048000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:59:58.619429+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。謝謝。謝謝。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T09:59:58.919429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:00:02.633714+08:00","text":"接下來請林楚茵委員上臺質詢。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":158,"blocks":[["陳委員永康：（9時52分）主席，有請國安局蔡局長。"],["主席：請蔡局長。"],["蔡局長明彥：謝謝主席，陳委員早。"],["陳委員永康：局長早。今天討論的題目就從國安層級來看，目前看到影響國家安全包括治安與公共安全的衝擊、社會資源與健保的負擔，還有青年世代，剛才你也提到了，如果這個問題不能控制的話會造成國力的衰退，是一個很嚴肅的問題，以及對國境安全的壓力。我特別從國內挑戰的三個面向請局長作回應，包括技術面、法規面及戰情整合面。我們特別看簡報紅字的部分，請局長就紅字的部分說明目前我們要如何強化。因為剛剛已經在整合的問題上面談到我們的能力，但是長遠來看，量能需要有更大的投資及跨部會整合，您是不是就紅色部分作回應？"],["蔡局長明彥：好，在所謂技術面、法規面及戰情整合面，特別針對戰情整合面，主要是如何從歷來查緝的個案當中整理出它的犯罪手法及樣態，這大概是國安局從國安情報的角度當中可以做一些貢獻的。另外在整體、區域的毒品相關的傳散與流入，各個國家在分析毒品的流入過程當中有沒有看到一些新的趨勢，這部分我們會透過國際情報交流的方式掌握相關的動態，再反過來跟我們國內的國安情報機關、特別是有司法警察權的國安情報機關交換相關的意見。","在技術面，剛剛也跟羅美玲委員有稍微說明一下科技偵蒐手段，不管在暗網的偵蒐或是其他的反毒包括無人機的運用，這部分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