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包括學術單位 中正大學跟警察大學我們大概7月份左右 整個的資料 各種要件都會出來那現行如果研究還沒出來的時候 到底要依什麼標準"},{"start":199.4,"end":216.001,"text":"那這個現在的標準是更燒的這些過程要件剛剛我所提的第一個東勢仁報案圍繞他的醫院我們發現大概有兩次以上的這種情形反覆那心理有畏懼那這個的狀況大概就是所以原件都知道嗎"},{"start":216.762,"end":236.648,"text":"應該都會知道所以這個部分我們在教育訓練大概都是對於這個初判的過程要見我們不會讓它落盡對於未來研究案能夠落實的要求就是我認為關鍵事實上是保護的缺口跟燒行為不是小事"},{"start":237.668,"end":260.121,"text":"你看研究也指出25%到35%跟騷案件最終發展成身體暴力然後76%呢遭親密伴侶呢殺害的女性呢生前事實上是遭受過跟騷的那所以我想問一下就是說這四年來明明有跟蹤守候尾隨連續那個騷擾可是最後就是不符合性與性別相關要件的案件"},{"start":260.661,"end":279.847,"text":"所以這些到底有哪些樣態我想這個樣態應該是非常多這個應該是要從實務不管是在我們警察機關移送到地檢署甚至到法院這個結果所以我們不會讓他落街就是我們的案件來之後我們判斷這個就是跟性與性別有關我們就是會做這個核發書面的這個告誡"},{"start":282.128,"end":308.093,"text":"可是現在你在實務上這些案件都是用社會法第89條還是刑法的強制跟防害自由處理如果社會有89條這個不應該是只有第一次啦第一次 就是說他的跟騷沒有跟性與性賠沒有關係所以這比例有多少 所以是不是麻煩會後是不是可以提供相關的因為我認為跟騷法最重要的發揮是預防介入的功能盡可能讓大部分跟騷受害人都可以"},{"start":308.713,"end":328.608,"text":"及時啟動宿命告誡保護令的措施避免釀成更嚴重的傷害國外的做法也是這樣子所以我希望這邊是不是具體的承諾部長這邊能不能7月份產出的研究案不是只有文獻整理更不能完成後放在抽屜我覺得研究完成之後"},{"start":330.345,"end":358.019,"text":"內政部立刻提供給我們本辦還有在一個月內邀集我們的婦女團體被害人保護團體第一線員警共同研議能不能做到部長這邊好那跟委員報告就是說我們是對於食物機關的相關聯繫跟委外的這個我們7月份那把這樣的這個指引把它把它做一個更明確的一個這樣的一個指引好再麻煩因為我覺得除了根梢案件以外最近"},{"start":359.56,"end":381.759,"text":"連鎖醫美診所的整間的偷拍事件也引起社會非常大的一個震撼所以如果今天事實上是性影像的受害人我要先向警方報案然後配合偵查影像流通到網路我要向衛福部申請協助下架然後我需要心理支持我要找不同的單位那想問明明同一個案件為什麼要重複一直不斷"},{"start":382.199,"end":402.422,"text":"委員如果說有類似這一個我們大概都站立創國會跟其他部會會去做會議 因為韓國的數位性比較像性侮辱罪我們這些警察知道了他要下架我們大概就會給衛務部對性侮辱罪會去做下架不用他再要到跟衛務部去報案啦"},{"start":403.824,"end":418.538,"text":"韓國的數位性犯罪被害人支援中心他除了協助性影像下架他把案件的管理 平台的聯繫法律的協助跟心理支持的都整合起來所以未來是不是可以朝向這樣子走"},{"start":426.746,"end":448.657,"text":"對 那牽涉到如果當事人對於性影像部我們知道了要對於這個當事人說要求下架我們馬上會聯繫六部會做下架的這樣的一個最後一個就是說我們的兒少的性影像我們也一直很關心是你們已經有數位監視資料庫了那也透過轉為雜咒值以匿名方式來比對同一個影像"},{"start":449.517,"end":471.211,"text":"那我們也覺得這事實上是當初也是我在法裡面有要求的所以我不知道內政部有沒有評估過將那個性影像的數位鑑識資料擴及到成人因為有些成人也是被迫不得已去委員這個部分因為是在衛福部這個已經衛福部依據這個性侵害防治法裡面"},{"start":472.071,"end":487.481,"text":"就有已經在 姓李上司在衛福部已經有成立了這個可能會製作重點 怎麼來做精進啊這個在衛福部這邊已經有成立的這個東西了是不是可以去做 考慮跟衛福部去做溝通不好意思主席再給我一點時間 因為這個很重要"},{"start":487.941,"end":507.254,"text":"部長我也聽過第一線員警反應因為擔心證據遺失有時候會先把性影像存在自己辦案的電腦裡邊這樣做恐怕有那個資安的疑慮也可能增加性影像外流的一個風險為不現在就有性影像處理中心會協助被害人保全證據下架移除那法律"},{"start":507.614,"end":535.06,"text":"法院的卷宗也有保存的年限期限內也會去銷毀有法定的程序想問一下為什麼第一線還是會把新影像存在個人的電腦的這種狀況是警政署對於新影像那個證物呢還沒有整個明確的流程嗎還是流程有了沒有落實到第一線我們有流程了就是依照兒少信報的這個處理中心大概形式有這個那我們的同仁承辦就會上傳到"},{"start":535.7,"end":563.704,"text":"你們有很明確的規定說不能夠存在個人電腦如果可以的話條件不實的話那不可以的話那當然啦你的證據上傳之後你的頭顱那邊就不能保存你的那個東西啦因為我們很怕這個東西是透過某一個法定的人士他拿到他好像目前看起來合法最後是傳出去那是違法的這頭顱這樣是違法的啊是啊可是如果拿到你最後查所以我們有一定的SOP他上傳之後他自己不能留底啊"},{"start":564.344,"end":583.295,"text":"那邊就不能留了所以另外一個我就要問有沒有定期查核確認性影像不會留存在遠景個人電腦隨身碟外接硬碟或其他設備當中查核頻率查核方式是什麼每個月都會查核再麻煩我們多加來保護我們的受害謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:19:13.129000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:19:23.175000+08:00","text":"主席，麻煩請部長。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-07-06T09:19:23.175000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:19:24.175000+08:00","text":"委員早。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:19:24.175000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:19:25.175000+08:00","text":"部長早。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:19:23.175000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:19:42.338000+08:00","text":"我們先來看一個具體的例子，有一名葉姓男子，多次挑A女下班時間到他工作的地方等他，甚至一路尾隨回家，他還把機車放在A的旁邊，多次撫摸他的機車坐墊。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:19:42.458000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:20:02.544000+08:00","text":"部長，我認為等他下班尾隨回家及撫摸機車坐墊就是跟騷，而且這是社會通念，可是一審法官判定無罪，雖然檢察官跟二審法官都認定是符合跟騷法，這也代表符合社會通念的案件在司法的見解上差異極大。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:20:03.424000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:20:24.864000+08:00","text":"現在第一線的困難就是「與性或性別相關」到底怎麼認定，標準不清楚，所以部長，在跟騷案件當中，類似上述的案件，就您能掌握的，因為「與性或性別相關」的認定標準不一，導致法律見解跟受害者感受的落差，這種狀況你知道嗎？","quality":0.945},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-07-06T09:20:24.864000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:20:35.711000+08:00","text":"報告委員，我想我們不宜針對個案來做處理，因此要把它通案化，所以我是不是請警政署還有請司法院的代表來回應剛剛委員的提問？好。","quality":0.946},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:20:37.632000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:20:58.820000+08:00","text":"報告委員，現在顯然看起來即行為人有重複多次的狀況，今天如果行為人違反被跟騷的被害人的意願，行為人有多次這樣的行為，讓被害人心裡產生畏懼，這樣的行為就是……","quality":0.657},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:20:58.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:20:59.820000+08:00","text":"可是兩次……","quality":0},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:20:59.820000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:21:00.820000+08:00","text":"男的跟女的這個狀況，我們初步判斷就是違反跟騷及性與性別……","quality":0.038},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:21:00.200000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:21:27.993000+08:00","text":"署長，不好意思，因為時間的關係，我還是要好好問，我在去年底召開跟騷法修法公聽會時，就已經要求警政署要召集法務部、司法院，針對「與性或性別有關」要件提出一致的解釋，也要透過教育訓練跟委外研究，全面盤點實務問題。","quality":0.739},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:21:27.993000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:21:38.139000+08:00","text":"可是我要先問清楚，因為那時候你們也承諾要做研究，第一個我要問，現在關於研究的執行狀況到底是什麼？","quality":0.795},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:21:38.139000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:21:38.599000+08:00","text":"到什麼地步了？","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:21:39.640000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:21:44.501000+08:00","text":"本來是6月底要結案的，現在研究案的時間點到底是什麼？","quality":0.826},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:21:44.501000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:21:54.683000+08:00","text":"還有研究案完成之前要修法來落實的話，針對現在正在發生的案件，第一線警員到底要依什麼標準來受理、判斷跟處理？","quality":0.939},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:21:55.244000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:00.245000+08:00","text":"內政部有沒有先提出來一個暫行指引、案例說明或教育訓練更新？","quality":0.926},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:00.545000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:05.946000+08:00","text":"有沒有跟法務部、司法院先討論一致性的標準到底在哪邊？署長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:12.303000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:19.747000+08:00","text":"好，跟委員報告，除了我們實務單位以外，包括學術單位的中正大學跟警察大學……","quality":0.719},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:19.747000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:21.569000+08:00","text":"我先問，就是到底……","quality":0.143},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:21.569000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:27.432000+08:00","text":"我們大概在7月份左右，整個的資料、構成要件的指引都會出來。","quality":0.72},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:27.432000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:28.432000+08:00","text":"這些東西都會出來。對。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:27.792000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:31.214000+08:00","text":"如果現行的研究還沒出來，到底要依什麼標準？","quality":0.842},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:33.562000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:47.760000+08:00","text":"現在的標準是跟騷的這些構成要件，就是剛剛我所提的，第一個當事人報案表示違反他的意願，我們發現大概有兩次以上反覆的這種情形，而當事人心理有畏懼，這個狀況大概就是……","quality":0.716},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:48.140000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:49.001000+08:00","text":"所以員警都知道嗎？","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:49.762000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:51.663000+08:00","text":"應該都會知道。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:52.763000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:22:58.445000+08:00","text":"所以這個部分我們在教育訓練時，對於這個初判的構成要件，我們不會讓它漏接，也跟……","quality":0.771},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:22:58.865000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:23:03.586000+08:00","text":"我接著要提出你們對於未來研究案能夠落實的要求……對。","quality":0.609},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:23:04.106000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:23:35.922000+08:00","text":"我認為關鍵是保護的缺口，跟騷行為不是小事，研究也指出25%到35%跟騷案件最終發展為身體暴力，76%遭親密伴侶殺害的女性，生前是遭受過跟騷的，所以我想問一下，這四年來明明有跟蹤、守候、尾隨的連續騷擾，可是最後就是不符合「與性或性別有關」要件，這些案件到底有哪些樣態？","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:23:35.922000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:23:45.925000+08:00","text":"我想這個樣態應該是非常多，應該要從實務，不管是在我們警察機關移送到地檢署，甚至到了法院，我們都不會讓它漏接。","quality":0.898},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:23:46.545000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:23:52.847000+08:00","text":"就是我們的案件來了之後，我們會判斷是否與性或性別有關，然後核發書面告誡……","quality":0.788},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:23:55.128000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:02.829000+08:00","text":"可是現在在實務上，這些案件都是用社維法第八十九條，還是刑法的恐嚇強制罪跟妨害自由罪處理？","quality":0.78},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:02.909000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:08.911000+08:00","text":"如果是社維法第八十九條的部分，應該只有第一次，就是他的跟騷與性或性別沒有關係。","quality":0.639},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:09.511000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:10.011000+08:00","text":"這個比例有多少？","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:10.471000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:29.479000+08:00","text":"是不是麻煩會後提供相關的……因為我認為跟騷法最重要的是發揮預防及介入的功能，儘可能讓大部分跟騷受害人，都可以即時啟動書面告誡、保護令的措施，避免釀成更嚴重的傷害，國外的做法也是這樣子。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:29.999000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:33.962000+08:00","text":"所以我希望是不是可以有具體的承諾……","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:33.962000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:35.784000+08:00","text":"我跟委員……","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:35.784000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:24:53.370000+08:00","text":"7月份產出的研究案不是只有文獻整理，更不能完成後放到抽屜，我覺得研究完成之後，請內政部立刻提供給本辦，還有在一個月內邀集婦女團體、被害人保護團體、第一線員警共同研議，部長能不能做到？","quality":0.951},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:24:56.432000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:08.458000+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，對於實務機關的相關聯繫跟委外的部分，我們在7月分會做一個更明確的指引。","quality":0.811},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:08.618000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:09.198000+08:00","text":"好，再麻煩了。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:09.758000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:17.824000+08:00","text":"除了跟騷案件以外，最近連鎖醫美診所的診間偷拍事件，也引起社會非常大的震撼。","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:19.426000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:31.836000+08:00","text":"事實上，性影像的受害人要先向警方報案並配合偵查，而影像方面要向衛福部申請協助下架，若需要心理支持，又要找不同的單位。","quality":0.887},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:32.937000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:34.759000+08:00","text":"明明是同一個案件，為什麼要一直重複、不斷地讓受害人說明？","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:35.199000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:40.165000+08:00","text":"委員，如果有類似的情形，我們大概會以單一窗口跟其他部會去做移轉……","quality":0.655},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:42.367000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:44.109000+08:00","text":"是不是可以跟其他部會……因為韓國的數位性犯罪……","quality":0.45},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:44.630000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:55.242000+08:00","text":"比如性影像處理中心，我們警察知道它要下架，就會通知衛福部性影像處理中心去做下架，不用他再跟衛福部報案。","quality":0.617},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:55.242000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:56.242000+08:00","text":"相關的協調單位，只要我們受理了監攝……","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:56.242000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:57.242000+08:00","text":"所以你們會去串接嗎？","quality":0},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:57.242000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:25:58.242000+08:00","text":"會串接。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:25:56.824000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:10.297000+08:00","text":"因為韓國的數位性犯罪被害人支援中心，除了協助性影像下架外，把案件的管理、平臺的聯繫、法律的協助跟心理支持部分，都整合起來。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:10.297000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:11.297000+08:00","text":"因為性影像處理中心是衛福部成立的，這個資料就是整個……","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:10.297000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:11.518000+08:00","text":"所以未來是不是可以朝向這樣子走？","quality":1},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:19.746000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:28.370000+08:00","text":"對，如果牽涉當事人性影像的部分，我們知道當事人要求下架時，會馬上聯繫衛福部下架……","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:29.511000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:41.637000+08:00","text":"不好意思，最後一個是關於兒少的性影像，我們也一直很關心，你們已經有數位鑑識資料庫，也透過轉換為雜湊值，以匿名方式來比對同一個影像。","quality":0.831},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:43.858000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:46.580000+08:00","text":"事實上這是當初我在法裡面要求的……","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:46.580000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:49.181000+08:00","text":"對，在兒少性剝削……","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:49.181000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:26:58.867000+08:00","text":"內政部有沒有評估過，將性影像的數位鑑識資料擴及成人，因為有些成人也是被迫不得已去……","quality":1},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:26:58.967000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:11.875000+08:00","text":"委員，因為這個部分是在衛福部……衛福部依據性侵害犯罪防治法，已經成立了性影像處理中心，所以這個部分可能會有所重疊，我們再來看怎麼做精進。","quality":0.623},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:14.617000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:20.461000+08:00","text":"是不是可以考慮跟衛福部溝通……不好意思，主席，再給我一點時間，因為這個部分很重要。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:20.941000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:34.230000+08:00","text":"部長，我也聽過第一線員警反映，因為擔心證據遺失，有時候會先把性影像存在自己辦案的電腦裡，這樣做恐怕有資安的疑慮，也可能增加性影像外流的風險。","quality":0.984},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:34.690000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:45.455000+08:00","text":"衛福部現在就有性影像處理中心，會協助被害人保全證據及下架移除；法院的卷宗也有保存的年限，依法定的程序，在期限內會銷毀。","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:45.955000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:51.696000+08:00","text":"想問一下，為什麼第一線人員還是會有把性影像存在個人電腦的狀況？","quality":0.862},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:51.696000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:57.258000+08:00","text":"是警政署對於性影像證物還沒有明確的流程嗎？","quality":0.95},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:57.258000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:27:59.058000+08:00","text":"還是流程有了，但沒有落實到第一線？","quality":0.933},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:27:59.058000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:08.040000+08:00","text":"我們有流程了，就是依照兒少性剝削……這個處理中心，大概刑事局有……我們的同仁、承辦人就會上傳到……","quality":0.825},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:08.700000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:12.023000+08:00","text":"你們有沒有明確地規定不能存在個人電腦？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:12.023000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:12.844000+08:00","text":"如果可以的話，條件是什麼？","quality":0.727},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:12.844000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:14.445000+08:00","text":"有、有，有明確規定。","quality":0},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:14.445000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:14.885000+08:00","text":"如果不可以的話，為什麼會存在那裡？","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:16.687000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:19.869000+08:00","text":"證據上傳之後，同仁就不能保存你的東西。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:20.510000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:27.876000+08:00","text":"因為我們也很怕這個東西是透過某一個法定人士拿到，目前看起來好像是合法，但最後是被傳出去。","quality":0.854},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:28.136000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:28.577000+08:00","text":"同仁這樣的行為就是違法的！","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:30.238000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:31.859000+08:00","text":"是啊，可是如果拿到……你最後查了，這些受害人會是……","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:32.460000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:36.583000+08:00","text":"所以我們有一定的SOP，他上傳之後，他自己不能留底。","quality":1},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:37.624000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:47.830000+08:00","text":"我就要問另外一個問題，有沒有定期查核，確認性影像不會留存在員警的個人電腦、隨身碟、外接硬碟或其他設備當中？","quality":0.854},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:48.010000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:49.751000+08:00","text":"查核頻率、查核方式是怎麼樣？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:49.751000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:51.492000+08:00","text":"委員，我們每個月都會查核。","quality":0.636},{"speaker":"林委員月琴","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:53.733000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:56.295000+08:00","text":"好，麻煩了，再多加保護我們的受害人，謝謝。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:56.795000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:28:58.223571+08:00","text":"好，謝謝委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T09:28:58.523571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:29:00.523571+08:00","text":"謝謝林月琴委員。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T09:29:00.823571+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T09:29:03.966429+08:00","text":"接下來請張智倫委員詢答。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":157,"blocks":[["林委員月琴：（9時19分）主席，麻煩請部長。"],["劉部長世芳：委員早。"],["林委員月琴：部長早。我們先來看一個具體的例子，有一名葉姓男子，多次挑A女下班時間到他工作的地方等他，甚至一路尾隨回家，他還把機車放在A的旁邊，多次撫摸他的機車坐墊。部長，我認為等他下班尾隨回家及撫摸機車坐墊就是跟騷，而且這是社會通念，可是一審法官判定無罪，雖然檢察官跟二審法官都認定是符合跟騷法，這也代表符合社會通念的案件在司法的見解上差異極大。現在第一線的困難就是「與性或性別相關」到底怎麼認定，標準不清楚，所以部長，在跟騷案件當中，類似上述的案件，就您能掌握的，因為「與性或性別相關」的認定標準不一，導致法律見解跟受害者感受的落差，這種狀況你知道嗎？"],["劉部長世芳：報告委員，我想我們不宜針對個案來做處理，因此要把它通案化，所以我是不是請警政署還有請司法院的代表來回應剛剛委員的提問？"],["林委員月琴：好。"],["張署長榮興：報告委員，現在顯然看起來即行為人有重複多次的狀況，今天如果行為人違反被跟騷的被害人的意願，行為人有多次這樣的行為，讓被害人心裡產生畏懼，這樣的行為就是……"],["林委員月琴：可是兩次……"],["張署長榮興：男的跟女的這個狀況，我們初步判斷就是違反跟騷及性與性別……"],["林委員月琴：署長，不好意思，因為時間的關係，我還是要好好問，我在去年底召開跟騷法修法公聽會時，就已經要求警政署要召集法務部、司法院，針對「與性或性別有關」要件提出一致的解釋，也要透過教育訓練跟委外研究，全面盤點實務問題。可是我要先問清楚，因為那時候你們也承諾要做研究，第一個我要問，現在關於研究的執行狀況到底是什麼？到什麼地步了？本來是6月底要結案的，現在研究案的時間點到底是什麼？還有研究案完成之前要修法來落實的話，針對現在正在發生的案件，第一線警員到底要依什麼標準來受理、判斷跟處理？內政部有沒有先提出來一個暫行指引、案例說明或教育訓練更新？有沒有跟法務部、司法院先討論一致性的標準到底在哪邊？署長。"],["張署長榮興：好，跟委員報告，除了我們實務單位以外，包括學術單位的中正大學跟警察大學……"],["林委員月琴：我先問，就是到底……"],["張署長榮興：我們大概在7月份左右，整個的資料、構成要件的指引都會出來。"],["林委員月琴：這些東西都會出來。"],["張署長榮興：對。"],["林委員月琴：如果現行的研究還沒出來，到底要依什麼標準？"],["張署長榮興：現在的標準是跟騷的這些構成要件，就是剛剛我所提的，第一個當事人報案表示違反他的意願，我們發現大概有兩次以上反覆的這種情形，而當事人心理有畏懼，這個狀況大概就是……"],["林委員月琴：所以員警都知道嗎？"],["張署長榮興：應該都會知道。所以這個部分我們在教育訓練時，對於這個初判的構成要件，我們不會讓它漏接，也跟……"],["林委員月琴：我接著要提出你們對於未來研究案能夠落實的要求……"],["張署長榮興：對。"],["林委員月琴：我認為關鍵是保護的缺口，跟騷行為不是小事，研究也指出25%到35%跟騷案件最終發展為身體暴力，76%遭親密伴侶殺害的女性，生前是遭受過跟騷的，所以我想問一下，這四年來明明有跟蹤、守候、尾隨的連續騷擾，可是最後就是不符合「與性或性別有關」要件，這些案件到底有哪些樣態？"],["張署長榮興：我想這個樣態應該是非常多，應該要從實務，不管是在我們警察機關移送到地檢署，甚至到了法院，我們都不會讓它漏接。就是我們的案件來了之後，我們會判斷是否與性或性別有關，然後核發書面告誡……"],["林委員月琴：可是現在在實務上，這些案件都是用社維法第八十九條，還是刑法的恐嚇強制罪跟妨害自由罪處理？"],["張署長榮興：如果是社維法第八十九條的部分，應該只有第一次，就是他的跟騷與性或性別沒有關係。"],["林委員月琴：這個比例有多少？是不是麻煩會後提供相關的……因為我認為跟騷法最重要的是發揮預防及介入的功能，儘可能讓大部分跟騷受害人，都可以即時啟動書面告誡、保護令的措施，避免釀成更嚴重的傷害，國外的做法也是這樣子。所以我希望是不是可以有具體的承諾……"],["張署長榮興：我跟委員……"],["林委員月琴：7月份產出的研究案不是只有文獻整理，更不能完成後放到抽屜，我覺得研究完成之後，請內政部立刻提供給本辦，還有在一個月內邀集婦女團體、被害人保護團體、第一線員警共同研議，部長能不能做到？"],["張署長榮興：跟委員報告，對於實務機關的相關聯繫跟委外的部分，我們在7月分會做一個更明確的指引。"],["林委員月琴：好，再麻煩了。除了跟騷案件以外，最近連鎖醫美診所的診間偷拍事件，也引起社會非常大的震撼。事實上，性影像的受害人要先向警方報案並配合偵查，而影像方面要向衛福部申請協助下架，若需要心理支持，又要找不同的單位。明明是同一個案件，為什麼要一直重複、不斷地讓受害人說明？"],["張署長榮興：委員，如果有類似的情形，我們大概會以單一窗口跟其他部會去做移轉……"],["林委員月琴：是不是可以跟其他部會……因為韓國的數位性犯罪……"],["張署長榮興：比如性影像處理中心，我們警察知道它要下架，就會通知衛福部性影像處理中心去做下架，不用他再跟衛福部報案。相關的協調單位，只要我們受理了監攝……"],["林委員月琴：所以你們會去串接嗎？"],["張署長榮興：會串接。"],["林委員月琴：因為韓國的數位性犯罪被害人支援中心，除了協助性影像下架外，把案件的管理、平臺的聯繫、法律的協助跟心理支持部分，都整合起來。"],["張署長榮興：因為性影像處理中心是衛福部成立的，這個資料就是整個……"],["林委員月琴：所以未來是不是可以朝向這樣子走？"],["張署長榮興：對，如果牽涉當事人性影像的部分，我們知道當事人要求下架時，會馬上聯繫衛福部下架……"],["林委員月琴：不好意思，最後一個是關於兒少的性影像，我們也一直很關心，你們已經有數位鑑識資料庫，也透過轉換為雜湊值，以匿名方式來比對同一個影像。事實上這是當初我在法裡面要求的……"],["張署長榮興：對，在兒少性剝削……"],["林委員月琴：內政部有沒有評估過，將性影像的數位鑑識資料擴及成人，因為有些成人也是被迫不得已去……"],["張署長榮興：委員，因為這個部分是在衛福部……衛福部依據性侵害犯罪防治法，已經成立了性影像處理中心，所以這個部分可能會有所重疊，我們再來看怎麼做精進。"],["林委員月琴：是不是可以考慮跟衛福部溝通……不好意思，主席，再給我一點時間，因為這個部分很重要。部長，我也聽過第一線員警反映，因為擔心證據遺失，有時候會先把性影像存在自己辦案的電腦裡，這樣做恐怕有資安的疑慮，也可能增加性影像外流的風險。衛福部現在就有性影像處理中心，會協助被害人保全證據及下架移除；法院的卷宗也有保存的年限，依法定的程序，在期限內會銷毀。想問一下，為什麼第一線人員還是會有把性影像存在個人電腦的狀況？是警政署對於性影像證物還沒有明確的流程嗎？還是流程有了，但沒有落實到第一線？"],["張署長榮興：我們有流程了，就是依照兒少性剝削……這個處理中心，大概刑事局有……我們的同仁、承辦人就會上傳到……"],["林委員月琴：你們有沒有明確地規定不能存在個人電腦？如果可以的話，條件是什麼？"],["張署長榮興：有、有，有明確規定。"],["林委員月琴：如果不可以的話，為什麼會存在那裡？"],["張署長榮興：證據上傳之後，同仁就不能保存你的東西。"],["林委員月琴：因為我們也很怕這個東西是透過某一個法定人士拿到，目前看起來好像是合法，但最後是被傳出去。"],["張署長榮興：同仁這樣的行為就是違法的！"],["林委員月琴：是啊，可是如果拿到……你最後查了，這些受害人會是……"],["張署長榮興：所以我們有一定的SOP，他上傳之後，他自己不能留底。"],["林委員月琴：我就要問另外一個問題，有沒有定期查核，確認性影像不會留存在員警的個人電腦、隨身碟、外接硬碟或其他設備當中？查核頻率、查核方式是怎麼樣？"],["張署長榮興：委員，我們每個月都會查核。"],["林委員月琴：好，麻煩了，再多加保護我們的受害人，謝謝。"],["張署長榮興：好，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝林月琴委員。","接下來請張智倫委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":66,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-5-15,26-1","speakers":["李柏毅","林月琴","王育敏","張智倫","王美惠","張宏陸","黃捷","廖先翔","王鴻薇","黃秀芳","劉建國","吳琪銘","徐欣瑩","蘇巧慧","高金素梅","許忠信","陳菁徽","張雅琳","王正旭","廖偉翔","林淑芬"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2026-07-06"],"gazette_id":"1155801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1155801_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第5會期內政、社會福利及衛生環境委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"一、審查委員林月琴等21人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法部分條文修正草案」案；二、審查委員王育敏\n等16人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法部分條文修正草案」案；三、審查委員莊瑞雄等16人擬具「跟蹤騷\n擾防制法第二條及第四條條文修正草案」案；四、審查委員羅明才等18人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法\n第十二條條文修正草案」案；五、審查委員羅廷瑋等16人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第十二條條文修\n正草案」案；六、審查委員翁曉玲等23 人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第十二條條文修正草案」案；\n七、審查委員蘇清泉等29人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第十二條條文修正草案」案；八、審查委員廖\n先翔等22人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第三條、第四條及第九條條文修正草案」案；九、審查台灣民\n眾黨黨團擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第二條、第五條及第十二條條文修正草案」案；十、審查委員林\n宜瑾等18 人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第五條條文修正草案」案；十一、審查委員陳瑩等 19 人擬具\n「跟蹤騷擾防制法第五條條文修正草案」案（詢答）","agenda_id":"1155801_00001"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}