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譬如講有一陣子大家會比較關心的就是狗仔的跟蹤狗仔跟蹤那當然也是構成跟騷啊那它無關於性或性別嘛"},{"start":142.15,"end":146.872,"text":"那你就說這個有社會秩序維護法來規範就有其他法來規範好那譬如講說討債也是討債也是那或者是說剛才廖學祥委員講到的可能徵信社也是"},{"start":158.337,"end":176.482,"text":"那你就說有其他的法律去規範但是呢因為我們今天為什麼要有跟騷這個防治法那也就是讓一些民眾可以讓他覺得他可以來得到來自於警方跟法院的支持跟協助"},{"start":177.822,"end":206.479,"text":"所以我們今天如果把性或性別有關拿掉我承認可能會造成警發更多的情惡問題他可能受理那可能受理的件數更多非常有可能可是剛才我舉的那個例子你說他是跟性或性別無關嗎而且我也要提醒其實這種被跟騷的不單純只是女性而已我就知道有一位廣播節目主持人他是男性"},{"start":207.759,"end":235.305,"text":"他每天就是因為這個網絡節目都是有固定啊這個節目反正就有人在那個他們的公司固定在等他等他下節目這是男性啊所以也有這樣的狀況所以我希望說能夠就這個性或性別有關的部分你們能夠再做一些研究不要一下子就認為NO NO NO反正說有其他的這個法令相關可是"},{"start":236.545,"end":253.473,"text":"有一些的這個跟騷啊他其實名為是其他的理由或藉口但是他恐怕還是跟性或性別有關好另外一個啊剛才為什麼黃婕委員對剛才對那個署長的這個回答會有一些不高興"},{"start":255.253,"end":279.507,"text":"在整個的跟搜的報案當中很多的女性認為受到歧視認為受到歧視就像如果講說你案情講得不清楚而且不可避免的我們在現在還是以男性的遠景居多男性的遠景居多所以當他去報案的時候他恐怕就會面臨到"},{"start":280.687,"end":303.198,"text":"你這樣講的是對的嗎這也是在監察院他在訪談的過程裡面有很多的女性報案還有報案但是他有非常不舒服的感覺甚至他去告警察他就是認為說他被歧視第一個他可能覺得這個恐怕就是我們可以改進的地方"},{"start":304.738,"end":327.34,"text":"他認為他沒有一個私密的空間讓他去敘述這個事情因為就可能我覺得在說啊你來報案我來報案反正一堆人啊那他可能要講的一個就是他覺得可能難以啟齒或他非常擔心他甚至怕被報復他甚至怕被報復尤其地方上搞不好警察就已經很認識那個常常去跟監他的人啊"},{"start":328.722,"end":354.559,"text":"那他就已經很緊張了可是他沒有一些私密的空間這是其一第二個就是可能男性遠景比較多一點男性遠景可能講話很大剌剌的真的嗎真的有這種事嗎會讓他有被歧視的感覺甚至他因此而不敢就乾脆算了或者他覺得他沒有辦法這很清楚的"},{"start":355.439,"end":379.991,"text":"去詳述他所受到的待遇所以我想這一個部分是不是也可以就是這個在我們第一線這不需要修法啦對不對這可能在員警的訓練的時候教育的時候碰到這種跟騷案件第一個能夠給這個當事人多一點隱密性的空間"},{"start":381.092,"end":382.592,"text":"法官好請法官法官好"},{"start":411.836,"end":430.176,"text":"這個部分就是說你們在核發這個保護令保護令其實你的內容其實是很多的比如說你核發保護令大半就是說絕大多數就是禁止監視行為這是大概是最多禁止監視"},{"start":431.485,"end":451.281,"text":"禁止你跟他打電話對不對然後你不要去盯梢他住的場所他辦公的場所這個都很正常所以這個你一旦發保護令的時候你這些都很多但是齁老實講啊我個人認為很多一直去跟殺人家的我覺得他應該受到輔導啊他的心理應該受到輔導啊"},{"start":455.99,"end":475.699,"text":"是不是 同意吧一直去跟著人家追求不成或者你明明已經離婚了當然你說有那種暴力行為我們之前發生的明明就已經那個保護令下去然後還給當街殺了他的這個前妻跟他的小姨子這個是很嚴重的暴力犯罪"},{"start":476.579,"end":499.073,"text":"但是很多跑去跟騷的跑去破壞的跑去一直什麼打電話的人家發一個限動你就要跑去說我馬上來什麼等等之類我都覺得他的心理問題應該是要被輔導的可是在我們法院合法的這些跟騷保護令裡面我剛才講"},{"start":500.33,"end":516.185,"text":"禁止監視禁止打電話什麼禁止你到人家的住所什麼這些比較多但是要求他去做治療性處遇的非常非常的少那我們法院其實有工具這他們要去進行一下輔導"},{"start":526.887,"end":533.136,"text":"讓他們去上課或者是那個什麼接受心理輔導怎麼會一直不停的去騷擾人家"},{"start":534.842,"end":557.692,"text":"對不對我覺得我們法院其實是有很多的工具我們今天大部分討論就是說希望法院能夠加快這個保護令我們警察單位能夠加快這個強制的這個警戒的處分但是我覺得另外一方面對於這些一直去跟騷騷擾人家的人我覺得也要讓他"},{"start":559.585,"end":585.258,"text":"我覺得他是不是時間就太多啦閒著沒事做一直去跟騷人家是幹嘛讓他去上課啊讓他去看一下醫生啊可不可以像這一部分也可以做一些加強好 感謝委員垂詢那委員這部分的意見其實我們非常認同那但是 誠如剛才警政署也有跟那個其他委員報告過就是目前我們的治療性處於計畫它有一些困難就是在於"},{"start":585.938,"end":604.309,"text":"這個部分首先必須要加害人配合前往鑑定再來就是鑑定的費用依照現行法制的話是被害人必須要負擔那所以這個部分警政署剛剛有回應說這邊他們會做修法的行為那至於這個認知教育輔導的部分這個部分其實也已經有法院裁定合法這一類的保護令了"},{"start":605.39,"end":628.541,"text":"那這一部分是因為他在執行的層面這個部分到底是屬於警政署或者是衛福部的職權他們可能彼此之間有一些稍微不同的想法可能必須要在這部分可能就是要讓主管機關這邊再來處理那如果這一個部分的問題得到解決之後相信法院這邊是樂於配合的對我認為啊就讓他們要去上上課看看他的這個心理啊"},{"start":630.128,"end":639.069,"text":"那個這樣子的話才會慢慢慢慢可不可以就是不是只是就是應該從根本去解決他的問題好不好好謝謝謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:30:48+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:30:49+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:30:49+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:30:50+08:00","text":"部長和署長還在臺上。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T10:30:50+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:30:51+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:30:49.791000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:31:05.327000+08:00","text":"署長、部長，今天看起來大家都聚焦在，你們同不同意在修法過程裡面把「與性或性別有關」的描述給取消掉，剛才也提到因為跟騷的態樣非常、非常多，為什麼很多委員都提到應該把「性或性別」取消？","quality":0.937},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:31:05.427000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:31:36.035000+08:00","text":"部長、署長從今天早上談到現在，我都覺得有點是警察機關嫌麻煩，因為跟騷的態樣實在太多，如果把「性或性別」拿掉了之後，可能有各式各樣的跟騷，你們通通都要處理。","quality":0.853},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:31:36.836000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:32:16.066000+08:00","text":"沒有錯，我們了解現在基層員警人力不足，勤務也非常繁忙，但是像剛才特別提到的，監察院所調查的其中一個案例是同事原來熱烈地追求他，但他就拒絕，拒絕之後，同事說他欠錢就去跟騷他，當他跟警局報案的時候，警方不受理，警方為什麼不受理呢？","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:32:16.606000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:32:39.980000+08:00","text":"警方說這跟性或性別無關，是欠錢的問題，等於只採信了下半段，而前半段是同事曾經熱烈地追求他，所以從熱烈追求他，然後轉換成以他欠錢繼續地跟騷，而警方卻不受理。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:32:40.881000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:32:52.586000+08:00","text":"這也就是為什麼今天有這麼多委員提出這樣的修法，我還是希望內政部跟警政署能夠多多再研究。","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:32:55.649000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:33:08.869000+08:00","text":"譬如有一陣子大家比較關心狗仔跟蹤，狗仔跟蹤當然也是構成跟騷，但無關於性或性別。","quality":0.972},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T10:33:08.869000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:33:10.330000+08:00","text":"那是社秩法有規範。","quality":0.125},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:33:10.330000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:33:13.412000+08:00","text":"你說這個有社會秩序維護法來規範，就是有其他法來規範。","quality":0.958},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:33:13.612000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:33:14.852000+08:00","text":"譬如討債也是，或者剛才廖先翔委員講到的，可能徵信社也是。","quality":0.92},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:33:26.477000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:33:34.019000+08:00","text":"雖然你說有其他的法律去規範，但是為什麼要有跟騷防制法？","quality":0.88},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:33:34.739000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:33:57.889000+08:00","text":"也就是讓一些民眾覺得可以得到來自於警方跟法院的支持與協助，所以我們今天如果把「性或性別有關」拿掉，我承認可能會造成警方勤務上有更多的問題，非常有可能讓受理件數變更多。","quality":0.792},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:33:58.690000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:34:05.033000+08:00","text":"可是剛才我舉的那個例子，你說它是跟性或性別無關嗎？","quality":0.957},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:34:05.033000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:34:54.190000+08:00","text":"而且我也要提醒，其實會被跟騷的不單純只是女性而已，我知道有一位廣播節目主持人，他是男性，因為廣播節目都是每天固定的，就有人固定在他的公司等他下節目，所以男性也有這樣的狀況，我希望你們能夠就性或性別有關的部分再做一些研究，不要一下子就認為No，說反正有其他相關的法令，可是有一些跟騷名為其他的理由或藉口，但恐怕還是跟性或性別有關。","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:34:54.370000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:35:01.473000+08:00","text":"另外，為什麼剛才黃捷委員對署長的回答會有一些不高興？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:35:03.253000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:35:31.328000+08:00","text":"在整個跟騷的報案當中，很多女性認為受到歧視，譬如說你案情講得不清楚，而且不可避免的，現在員警還是以男性居多，所以當他去報案的時候，恐怕就會面臨到被質疑：你這樣講是對的嗎？","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:35:31.328000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:35:47.056000+08:00","text":"這也是監察院在訪談的過程裡面發覺的，很多女性報案有非常不舒服的感覺，甚至去告警察，因為他認為被歧視。","quality":0.891},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:35:47.056000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:02.348000+08:00","text":"第一個、他可能覺得可怕，而這個可怕就是你們可以改進的地方，他認為沒有私密的空間，可以讓他去敘述這個事情，因為派出所就是你來報案、我來報案，反正一堆人。","quality":0.836},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:03.489000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:21.124000+08:00","text":"他要講的可能讓他覺得難以啟齒或他非常擔心，甚至怕被報復，尤其在地方上，搞不好警察就已經很認識那個常常跟騷他的人，他已經很緊張了，可是沒有私密的空間，這是其一。","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:21.905000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:28.849000+08:00","text":"第二個、可能男性員警比較多一點，男性員警可能講話很大剌剌的，質疑這是真的嗎？","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:28.849000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:32.052000+08:00","text":"真的有這種事嗎？是嗎？","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:32.052000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:45.380000+08:00","text":"會讓他有被歧視的感覺，甚至他因此而不敢報案，乾脆就算了，或者他覺得沒有辦法很清楚地詳述他所受到的待遇。","quality":0.915},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:46.801000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:49.282000+08:00","text":"這個部分是不是也可以改善？","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:49.802000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:51.623000+08:00","text":"這是在第一線，不需要修法，對不對？對。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:51.623000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:52.623000+08:00","text":"署長同意嘛？","quality":0},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:52.623000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:36:53.623000+08:00","text":"這個是實務上的，同意。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:36:51.623000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:07.991000+08:00","text":"這不需要修法，可能在員警訓練的時候、教育的時候要求，碰到這種跟騷案件，第一個、能夠給當事人多一點隱密性的空間，好不好？","quality":0.904},{"speaker":"張署長榮興","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:07.991000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:08.991000+08:00","text":"好，可以，沒問題。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:08.991000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:09.991000+08:00","text":"對，也比較多一點……讓他們不要覺得受到歧視，因為他本來就很害怕，我想這兩點很重要。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:09.991000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:10.991000+08:00","text":"還剩下一點時間，請司法院的法官。","quality":0},{"speaker":"楊法官舒嵐","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:10.991000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:11.991000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":0},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:09.092000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:09.872000+08:00","text":"法官好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:41.098000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:37:57.415000+08:00","text":"有關你們核發保護令，內容其實是很多的，比方核發保護令絕大多數是禁止監視行為，這大概是最多的。","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:37:57.976000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:38:02.367000+08:00","text":"禁止監視、禁止你打電話給他，對不對？","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:38:02.367000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:38:10.454000+08:00","text":"然後你不要盯梢他住的場所、辦公的場所，這些都很正常，一旦發保護令的時候，這些都很多。","quality":0.973},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:38:11.315000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:38:24.210000+08:00","text":"但是老實講我個人認為很多一直跟騷人家的，他的心理應該受到輔導，是不是？","quality":0.969},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:38:24.830000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:38:25.151000+08:00","text":"同意吧？","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:38:27.492000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:38:59.649000+08:00","text":"追求不成卻一直跟騷人家，或者明明已經離婚了，之前有發生暴力行為，明明就已經發保護令下去，然後還當街殺了前妻跟小姨子，這是很嚴重的暴力犯罪，但是很多跑去跟騷的、跑去破壞的、一直打電話的，人家發一個限動，他就要跑去、說馬上來之類的，我都覺得他的心理問題應該是要被輔導的。","quality":0.883},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:39:00.569000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:39:23.425000+08:00","text":"可是在法院核發的跟騷保護令裡面，我剛才講的禁止監視、禁止打電話、禁止到人家的住所等比較多，但是要求他進行治療性處遇的非常、非常的少！","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:39:23.605000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:39:41.116000+08:00","text":"法院其實有工具，應該叫他們進行一下輔導，讓他們去上課或者接受心理輔導，怎麼會一直不停地去騷擾人家？","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:39:43.262000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:40:08.846000+08:00","text":"我覺得法院其實有很多工具，我們今天大部分討論的就是希望法院能夠加快核發保護令，警察單位能夠加快告誡及強制處分，但是另外一方面，這些一直去跟騷、騷擾人家的人是不是時間太多了？","quality":0.912},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:40:10.226000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:40:12.227000+08:00","text":"閒著沒事做，一直跟騷人家，幹嘛？","quality":1},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:40:13.188000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:40:19.491000+08:00","text":"讓他去上課，讓他去看一下醫生，像這部分是不是也可以做一些加強？","quality":0.893},{"speaker":"楊法官舒嵐","start":"2026-07-06T10:40:21.212000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:40:22.332000+08:00","text":"感謝委員垂詢。","quality":1},{"speaker":"楊法官舒嵐","start":"2026-07-06T10:40:22.492000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:40:45.805000+08:00","text":"委員針對這部分的意見，其實我們非常認同，誠如剛才警政署也有跟其他委員報告過的，目前治療性處遇計畫有一些困難在於，首先必須要加害人配合前往鑑定，再來就是鑑定的費用依照現行法制是被害人必須要負擔，所以警政署剛剛有回應，他們會對這個部分配合修法。","quality":0.902},{"speaker":"楊法官舒嵐","start":"2026-07-06T10:40:47.186000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:40:52.229000+08:00","text":"至於認知教育輔導的部分，其實已經有法院裁定核發這一類保護令。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"楊法官舒嵐","start":"2026-07-06T10:40:53.650000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:41:12.099000+08:00","text":"因為這個部分在執行的層面到底是屬於警政署或者衛福部的職權，他們彼此之間可能有一些稍微不同的想法，這部分可能要讓主管機關來處理，如果這部分的問題得到解決之後，相信法院這邊是樂於配合的。","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"王委員鴻薇","start":"2026-07-06T10:41:13.359000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-06T10:41:27.069000+08:00","text":"對，我認為要讓他們去上課，看看他的心理，應該要從根本去解決他的問題，好不好？謝謝。","quality":0.943},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T10:41:27.569000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:41:29.569000+08:00","text":"謝謝王鴻薇委員。","quality":0.286},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-06T10:41:29.869000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-06T10:41:33.583286+08:00","text":"接下來我們請黃秀芳委員詢答。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":560,"blocks":[["王委員鴻薇：（10時30分）謝謝主席。部長和署長還在臺上。"],["張署長榮興：委員好。"],["王委員鴻薇：署長、部長，今天看起來大家都聚焦在，你們同不同意在修法過程裡面把「與性或性別有關」的描述給取消掉，剛才也提到因為跟騷的態樣非常、非常多，為什麼很多委員都提到應該把「性或性別」取消？部長、署長從今天早上談到現在，我都覺得有點是警察機關嫌麻煩，因為跟騷的態樣實在太多，如果把「性或性別」拿掉了之後，可能有各式各樣的跟騷，你們通通都要處理。沒有錯，我們了解現在基層員警人力不足，勤務也非常繁忙，但是像剛才特別提到的，監察院所調查的其中一個案例是同事原來熱烈地追求他，但他就拒絕，拒絕之後，同事說他欠錢就去跟騷他，當他跟警局報案的時候，警方不受理，警方為什麼不受理呢？警方說這跟性或性別無關，是欠錢的問題，等於只採信了下半段，而前半段是同事曾經熱烈地追求他，所以從熱烈追求他，然後轉換成以他欠錢繼續地跟騷，而警方卻不受理。這也就是為什麼今天有這麼多委員提出這樣的修法，我還是希望內政部跟警政署能夠多多再研究。譬如有一陣子大家比較關心狗仔跟蹤，狗仔跟蹤當然也是構成跟騷，但無關於性或性別。"],["張署長榮興：那是社秩法有規範。"],["王委員鴻薇：你說這個有社會秩序維護法來規範，就是有其他法來規範。譬如討債也是，或者剛才廖先翔委員講到的，可能徵信社也是。雖然你說有其他的法律去規範，但是為什麼要有跟騷防制法？也就是讓一些民眾覺得可以得到來自於警方跟法院的支持與協助，所以我們今天如果把「性或性別有關」拿掉，我承認可能會造成警方勤務上有更多的問題，非常有可能讓受理件數變更多。可是剛才我舉的那個例子，你說它是跟性或性別無關嗎？而且我也要提醒，其實會被跟騷的不單純只是女性而已，我知道有一位廣播節目主持人，他是男性，因為廣播節目都是每天固定的，就有人固定在他的公司等他下節目，所以男性也有這樣的狀況，我希望你們能夠就性或性別有關的部分再做一些研究，不要一下子就認為No，說反正有其他相關的法令，可是有一些跟騷名為其他的理由或藉口，但恐怕還是跟性或性別有關。","另外，為什麼剛才黃捷委員對署長的回答會有一些不高興？在整個跟騷的報案當中，很多女性認為受到歧視，譬如說你案情講得不清楚，而且不可避免的，現在員警還是以男性居多，所以當他去報案的時候，恐怕就會面臨到被質疑：你這樣講是對的嗎？這也是監察院在訪談的過程裡面發覺的，很多女性報案有非常不舒服的感覺，甚至去告警察，因為他認為被歧視。第一個、他可能覺得可怕，而這個可怕就是你們可以改進的地方，他認為沒有私密的空間，可以讓他去敘述這個事情，因為派出所就是你來報案、我來報案，反正一堆人。他要講的可能讓他覺得難以啟齒或他非常擔心，甚至怕被報復，尤其在地方上，搞不好警察就已經很認識那個常常跟騷他的人，他已經很緊張了，可是沒有私密的空間，這是其一。第二個、可能男性員警比較多一點，男性員警可能講話很大剌剌的，質疑這是真的嗎？真的有這種事嗎？是嗎？會讓他有被歧視的感覺，甚至他因此而不敢報案，乾脆就算了，或者他覺得沒有辦法很清楚地詳述他所受到的待遇。這個部分是不是也可以改善？這是在第一線，不需要修法，對不對？"],["張署長榮興：對。"],["王委員鴻薇：署長同意嘛？"],["張署長榮興：這個是實務上的，同意。"],["王委員鴻薇：這不需要修法，可能在員警訓練的時候、教育的時候要求，碰到這種跟騷案件，第一個、能夠給當事人多一點隱密性的空間，好不好？"],["張署長榮興：好，可以，沒問題。"],["王委員鴻薇：對，也比較多一點……讓他們不要覺得受到歧視，因為他本來就很害怕，我想這兩點很重要。還剩下一點時間，請司法院的法官。"],["楊法官舒嵐：委員好。"],["王委員鴻薇：法官好。有關你們核發保護令，內容其實是很多的，比方核發保護令絕大多數是禁止監視行為，這大概是最多的。禁止監視、禁止你打電話給他，對不對？然後你不要盯梢他住的場所、辦公的場所，這些都很正常，一旦發保護令的時候，這些都很多。但是老實講我個人認為很多一直跟騷人家的，他的心理應該受到輔導，是不是？同意吧？追求不成卻一直跟騷人家，或者明明已經離婚了，之前有發生暴力行為，明明就已經發保護令下去，然後還當街殺了前妻跟小姨子，這是很嚴重的暴力犯罪，但是很多跑去跟騷的、跑去破壞的、一直打電話的，人家發一個限動，他就要跑去、說馬上來之類的，我都覺得他的心理問題應該是要被輔導的。可是在法院核發的跟騷保護令裡面，我剛才講的禁止監視、禁止打電話、禁止到人家的住所等比較多，但是要求他進行治療性處遇的非常、非常的少！法院其實有工具，應該叫他們進行一下輔導，讓他們去上課或者接受心理輔導，怎麼會一直不停地去騷擾人家？我覺得法院其實有很多工具，我們今天大部分討論的就是希望法院能夠加快核發保護令，警察單位能夠加快告誡及強制處分，但是另外一方面，這些一直去跟騷、騷擾人家的人是不是時間太多了？閒著沒事做，一直跟騷人家，幹嘛？讓他去上課，讓他去看一下醫生，像這部分是不是也可以做一些加強？"],["楊法官舒嵐：感謝委員垂詢。委員針對這部分的意見，其實我們非常認同，誠如剛才警政署也有跟其他委員報告過的，目前治療性處遇計畫有一些困難在於，首先必須要加害人配合前往鑑定，再來就是鑑定的費用依照現行法制是被害人必須要負擔，所以警政署剛剛有回應，他們會對這個部分配合修法。至於認知教育輔導的部分，其實已經有法院裁定核發這一類保護令。因為這個部分在執行的層面到底是屬於警政署或者衛福部的職權，他們彼此之間可能有一些稍微不同的想法，這部分可能要讓主管機關來處理，如果這部分的問題得到解決之後，相信法院這邊是樂於配合的。"],["王委員鴻薇：對，我認為要讓他們去上課，看看他的心理，應該要從根本去解決他的問題，好不好？謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝王鴻薇委員。","接下來我們請黃秀芳委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":66,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-5-15,26-1","speakers":["李柏毅","林月琴","王育敏","張智倫","王美惠","張宏陸","黃捷","廖先翔","王鴻薇","黃秀芳","劉建國","吳琪銘","徐欣瑩","蘇巧慧","高金素梅","許忠信","陳菁徽","張雅琳","王正旭","廖偉翔","林淑芬"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2026-07-06"],"gazette_id":"1155801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1155801_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第5會期內政、社會福利及衛生環境委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"一、審查委員林月琴等21人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法部分條文修正草案」案；二、審查委員王育敏\n等16人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法部分條文修正草案」案；三、審查委員莊瑞雄等16人擬具「跟蹤騷\n擾防制法第二條及第四條條文修正草案」案；四、審查委員羅明才等18人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法\n第十二條條文修正草案」案；五、審查委員羅廷瑋等16人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第十二條條文修\n正草案」案；六、審查委員翁曉玲等23 人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第十二條條文修正草案」案；\n七、審查委員蘇清泉等29人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第十二條條文修正草案」案；八、審查委員廖\n先翔等22人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第三條、第四條及第九條條文修正草案」案；九、審查台灣民\n眾黨黨團擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第二條、第五條及第十二條條文修正草案」案；十、審查委員林\n宜瑾等18 人擬具「跟蹤騷擾防制法第五條條文修正草案」案；十一、審查委員陳瑩等 19 人擬具\n「跟蹤騷擾防制法第五條條文修正草案」案（詢答）","agenda_id":"1155801_00001"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}