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新的主席有請國防部長"},{"start":3.24,"end":4.24,"text":"請部部長"},{"start":10.84,"end":12.16,"text":"是 黃偉宏"},{"start":12.44,"end":16.28,"text":"部長 部長 那個我們今天的題目是"},{"start":16.54,"end":20.5,"text":"就是在我們軍民採購的這些一些問題上"},{"start":20.5,"end":24.7,"text":"那講軍品的這個籌補跟一般的採購是不一樣的"},{"start":24.7,"end":27.72,"text":"因為它直接關係到是整個部隊的這個戰力"},{"start":27.919999999999998,"end":30.439999999999998,"text":"也關係到我們國家的這個防衛的韌性"},{"start":30.439999999999998,"end":33.76,"text":"那簡單的來說就是要能夠平時拿得到"},{"start":33.76,"end":37.66,"text":"暫時要用得上 而且要準時到位夠用"},{"start":37.66,"end":40.36,"text":"我想這個部長這點你們都有同意了齁"},{"start":41.08,"end":44.18,"text":"是 我們盡量能夠符合我們的作戰需求"},{"start":44.18,"end":46.92,"text":"好 可是部長 如果說我們採購一直延宕齁"},{"start":46.92,"end":50.019999999999996,"text":"然後這沒有過 然後旅約正義又拖很久"},{"start":50.019999999999996,"end":52.16,"text":"這問題就不是跟我們慢一點的問題"},{"start":52.16,"end":54.06,"text":"而是整個前線的部隊到底"},{"start":54.06,"end":56.82,"text":"它能不能夠準時的拿到戰力齁"},{"start":57.08,"end":59.88,"text":"那我們國防部在114年的11月3號"},{"start":59.88,"end":65.32,"text":"也曾經針對這個軍事工程落後軍商購這個案的延宕"},{"start":65.32,"end":66.42,"text":"提出專案的報告"},{"start":66.42,"end":71.42,"text":"當時國防部說要強化專責管理專業訓練契約管理"},{"start":71.42,"end":73.42,"text":"那我現在想要請教部長說"},{"start":73.42,"end":76.12,"text":"到今天為止那改成了多少"},{"start":76.12,"end":78.22,"text":"那延宕的案件有沒有變少"},{"start":78.22,"end":80.22,"text":"金額有沒有下降"},{"start":80.22,"end":83.62,"text":"那平均延宕的時間有沒有縮短"},{"start":83.62,"end":86.42,"text":"那請國防部這邊可以給我們具體的數字"},{"start":87.82,"end":89.82,"text":"郭委員我們每個案子啊"},{"start":89.82,"end":92.82,"text":"都有依據這個專案管理的機制"},{"start":92.82,"end":94.82,"text":"定期召開專案管理會議"},{"start":94.82,"end":97.82,"text":"也設定節點來管制這個執行進度"},{"start":97.82,"end":99.82,"text":"那有關於這個每個案子"},{"start":99.82,"end":103.02,"text":"後續我們可以提供這個書面資料跟委員"},{"start":103.02,"end":105.22,"text":"對啦 具體的數字就好了啦"},{"start":105.22,"end":107.72,"text":"因為我想要了解說具體的數字是多少"},{"start":107.72,"end":110.22,"text":"而不是這種原則性的說明這樣子 好不好"},{"start":111.72,"end":112.72,"text":"好 主任謝謝"},{"start":112.72,"end":114.02,"text":"那向委員報告"},{"start":114.02,"end":115.72,"text":"我們現在這個購案"},{"start":115.72,"end":118.12,"text":"我們近五年我們統計啊"},{"start":118.12,"end":119.12,"text":"有三萬多件"},{"start":119.12,"end":120.32,"text":"三萬一千件"},{"start":120.32,"end":121.32,"text":"招標的"},{"start":121.32,"end":124.32,"text":"然後但是產生履歷增益十件"},{"start":124.32,"end":127.32,"text":"那所以說基本上我們都有按照"},{"start":127.32,"end":130.12,"text":"原來都有按照這個都有設定管制節點"},{"start":130.12,"end":132.32,"text":"也有做專案管制的這個機制"},{"start":133.32,"end":135.32,"text":"所以在開完專案報告之後"},{"start":135.32,"end":137.12,"text":"有做哪些改善"},{"start":137.12,"end":138.12,"text":"每個案子是"},{"start":138.12,"end":140.12,"text":"就是我本席提到的那些"},{"start":140.12,"end":142.12,"text":"再報告給本席辦公室"},{"start":142.12,"end":142.62,"text":"是"},{"start":142.62,"end":143.32,"text":"因為我們會這樣講"},{"start":143.32,"end":145.12,"text":"是我們看到現在整個國際的情勢"},{"start":145.12,"end":146.52,"text":"從烏克蘭戰爭開始"},{"start":146.52,"end":147.52,"text":"然後總統衝突"},{"start":147.52,"end":151.52,"text":"都讓我們看到全球整個軍工的供應變得非常的緊張"},{"start":151.52,"end":153.52,"text":"那烏克蘭的戰爭也很清楚"},{"start":153.52,"end":155.52,"text":"你剛面對飛彈無人機的這樣子"},{"start":155.52,"end":156.52,"text":"連續的攻擊"},{"start":156.52,"end":159.02,"text":"你居然是再先進的防衛系統"},{"start":159.02,"end":162.02,"text":"攔截的彈藥也都可能會面臨到不夠用"},{"start":162.02,"end":164.52,"text":"那其他的區域的衝突也告訴我們說"},{"start":164.52,"end":166.02,"text":"你防一防未來"},{"start":166.02,"end":169.02,"text":"你要面對你的準備時間要更長"},{"start":169.02,"end":172.02,"text":"而且你還要面對更大規模的這些威脅"},{"start":172.02,"end":174.02,"text":"那現在我們每次的武器"},{"start":174.92000000000002,"end":175.92000000000002,"text":"交付研擋"},{"start":175.92000000000002,"end":178.92000000000002,"text":"各式的精準的彈藥籌補都在延長"},{"start":178.92000000000002,"end":181.92000000000002,"text":"那已經不是只有我們台灣遇到"},{"start":181.92000000000002,"end":183.92000000000002,"text":"現在是各國都在搶"},{"start":183.92000000000002,"end":186.92000000000002,"text":"那我們台灣就高度的仰賴對外的採購"},{"start":186.92000000000002,"end":188.92000000000002,"text":"那如果台海真的"},{"start":188.92000000000002,"end":190.92000000000002,"text":"有一天真的不幸發生了高強度的衝突"},{"start":190.92000000000002,"end":194.92000000000002,"text":"那美方的產能跟庫存會不會排擠我們的交貨的期程"},{"start":194.92000000000002,"end":196.92000000000002,"text":"我想要請教部長"},{"start":196.92000000000002,"end":198.92000000000002,"text":"我們軍工一算已經通"},{"start":198.92000000000002,"end":200.92000000000002,"text":"特別一算已經通過了"},{"start":200.92000000000002,"end":202.92000000000002,"text":"那按下給多數向美方來採購"},{"start":203.82,"end":205.82,"text":"那國防部有沒有建立這個"},{"start":205.82,"end":207.82,"text":"對美採購研擋的風險清單"},{"start":207.82,"end":209.82,"text":"哪一些項目是高風險"},{"start":209.82,"end":211.82,"text":"哪一些有沒有替代方案"},{"start":211.82,"end":213.82,"text":"那有沒有分散整個來源"},{"start":213.82,"end":215.82,"text":"那關鍵的零組件"},{"start":215.82,"end":217.82,"text":"有沒有規劃自主生產"},{"start":217.82,"end":219.82,"text":"或者是計轉"},{"start":219.82,"end":221.82,"text":"期程在哪裡"},{"start":221.82,"end":223.82,"text":"報告員我們先"},{"start":223.82,"end":225.82,"text":"你剛剛談到那個軍購案的這個部分"},{"start":225.82,"end":227.82,"text":"就是我們市長在"},{"start":227.82,"end":229.82,"text":"前年從前年開始"},{"start":229.82,"end":231.82,"text":"我們就已經開始針對我們軍購的這個部分"},{"start":232.72,"end":234.72,"text":"可能產生了潛在風險"},{"start":234.72,"end":236.72,"text":"去進行評估"},{"start":236.72,"end":238.72,"text":"在做特別預算的時候"},{"start":238.72,"end":240.72,"text":"我們也有跟大院這邊報告過"},{"start":240.72,"end":242.72,"text":"這些項目都是"},{"start":242.72,"end":244.72,"text":"已經經過跟美方"},{"start":244.72,"end":246.72,"text":"詳細的討論過交期數量"},{"start":246.72,"end":248.72,"text":"都沒有問題的"},{"start":248.72,"end":250.72,"text":"我們才會把它列入"},{"start":250.72,"end":252.72,"text":"我們的採購項目"},{"start":252.72,"end":254.72,"text":"那至於後面計轉的這個部分"},{"start":254.72,"end":256.71999999999997,"text":"我們"},{"start":256.71999999999997,"end":258.71999999999997,"text":"也有一些重點的項目"},{"start":258.71999999999997,"end":260.71999999999997,"text":"其中包含了"},{"start":261.62,"end":263.62,"text":"這個是未來我們爭取美方"},{"start":263.62,"end":265.62,"text":"計轉然後希望能夠在地生產"},{"start":265.62,"end":267.62,"text":"那當然還有一些其他的項目"},{"start":267.62,"end":269.62,"text":"可能會後再跟委員做說明"},{"start":269.62,"end":271.62,"text":"謝謝市長"},{"start":271.62,"end":273.62,"text":"市長其實本來要提醒的就是"},{"start":273.62,"end":275.62,"text":"全球性的這樣子的"},{"start":275.62,"end":277.62,"text":"軍工的緊張性"},{"start":277.62,"end":279.62,"text":"那這個也很難去"},{"start":279.62,"end":281.62,"text":"我們也很難"},{"start":281.62,"end":283.62,"text":"不擔心說"},{"start":283.62,"end":285.62,"text":"那未來其他的戰區如果有這個需求的時候"},{"start":285.62,"end":287.62,"text":"他整個資源線"},{"start":287.62,"end":289.62,"text":"採購以來那些遊行的時候"},{"start":289.62,"end":291.62,"text":"所以這個要先預防起來吧"},{"start":291.62,"end":293.62,"text":"是不是"},{"start":293.62,"end":295.62,"text":"對所以那個我們要擴充我們的"},{"start":295.62,"end":297.62,"text":"戰備的產線"},{"start":297.62,"end":299.62,"text":"我們有擺在這個特別條例"},{"start":299.62,"end":301.62,"text":"要納入特別預算"},{"start":301.62,"end":303.62,"text":"那因為這個特別條例也沒有通過"},{"start":303.62,"end":305.62,"text":"所以我們之後也會擺入"},{"start":305.62,"end":307.62,"text":"最佳預算跟公務預算裡面去"},{"start":307.62,"end":309.62,"text":"那事實上之前"},{"start":309.62,"end":311.62,"text":"也有跟"},{"start":311.62,"end":313.62,"text":"各位報告就是說"},{"start":313.62,"end":315.62,"text":"我們台美之間對15公里的"},{"start":315.62,"end":317.62,"text":"這個榴彈我們一定要"},{"start":317.62,"end":319.62,"text":"開始要共同合作這樣子"},{"start":319.62,"end":321.62,"text":"謝謝部長謝謝市長回應本期"},{"start":321.62,"end":323.62,"text":"提醒我們部裡面"},{"start":323.62,"end":325.62,"text":"確實這些部分要注意"},{"start":325.62,"end":327.62,"text":"那我們在因為時間也很長"},{"start":327.62,"end":329.62,"text":"我們再來談談反無人機系統"},{"start":329.62,"end":331.62,"text":"這個事情反無人機系統"},{"start":331.62,"end":333.62,"text":"我想很多人都提到"},{"start":333.62,"end":335.62,"text":"那之前我們的"},{"start":335.62,"end":337.62,"text":"入軍司令部有辦理"},{"start":337.62,"end":339.62,"text":"這個無人機反制的這個委託研究"},{"start":339.62,"end":341.62,"text":"那由這個創未來公司"},{"start":341.62,"end":343.62,"text":"獲評為優勝的這個整合廠商"},{"start":343.62,"end":345.62,"text":"那接著我們另外叫"},{"start":345.62,"end":347.62,"text":"這個正地式的無人機反制系統的"},{"start":347.62,"end":349.62,"text":"採購標案又是由"},{"start":349.62,"end":351.62,"text":"同一家公司得標那金額大概就是"},{"start":351.62,"end":353.62,"text":"9.8億那部長"},{"start":353.62,"end":355.62,"text":"這個會不會讓外界來質疑說"},{"start":355.62,"end":357.62,"text":"從研究到採購都是"},{"start":357.62,"end":359.62,"text":"由同一個廠商來承受"},{"start":359.62,"end":361.62,"text":"那規格有沒有被特定的廠商"},{"start":361.62,"end":363.62,"text":"綁住"},{"start":363.62,"end":365.62,"text":"那市場的競爭到底充不充分"},{"start":365.62,"end":367.62,"text":"相關的評選跟"},{"start":367.62,"end":369.62,"text":"採購的設計有沒有第三方"},{"start":369.62,"end":371.62,"text":"的緊合"},{"start":371.62,"end":373.62,"text":"那第二個就是說外界也會質疑說"},{"start":373.62,"end":375.62,"text":"那這套系統三次測驗都沒有達到"},{"start":375.62,"end":377.62,"text":"合格標準"},{"start":377.62,"end":379.62,"text":"甚至傳出說連那個商用的"},{"start":379.62,"end":381.62,"text":"無人機都可以穿越防線喔"},{"start":381.62,"end":383.62,"text":"那這個是我們國防部"},{"start":383.62,"end":385.62,"text":"一開始在設定需求"},{"start":385.62,"end":387.62,"text":"在測驗標準在風險"},{"start":387.62,"end":389.62,"text":"礦管上面是不是有問題"},{"start":389.62,"end":391.62,"text":"那我想問的"},{"start":391.62,"end":393.62,"text":"就是說我們如果測驗不合格"},{"start":393.62,"end":395.62,"text":"問題都要卡在哪裡是卡在偵測"},{"start":395.62,"end":397.62,"text":"識別還是干擾"},{"start":397.62,"end":399.62,"text":"還是攔阻還是整個系統"},{"start":399.62,"end":401.62,"text":"的整合那測驗的環境"},{"start":401.62,"end":403.62,"text":"我們沒有貼近實戰"},{"start":403.62,"end":405.62,"text":"那我們國防部是不是能夠在"},{"start":405.62,"end":407.62,"text":"涉及機密的情況之下"},{"start":407.62,"end":409.62,"text":"向立法院來說明提出整個完整的"},{"start":409.62,"end":411.62,"text":"這個報告"},{"start":411.62,"end":413.62,"text":"包圍針對您剛才的提詢"},{"start":413.62,"end":415.62,"text":"我就以下幾點的回覆"},{"start":415.62,"end":417.62,"text":"第一個委託研究案"},{"start":417.62,"end":419.62,"text":"跟這個26號的反制"},{"start":419.62,"end":421.62,"text":"系統它在"},{"start":421.62,"end":423.62,"text":"屬性上面跟適用的法規是"},{"start":423.62,"end":425.62,"text":"不一樣的那委託研究案"},{"start":425.62,"end":427.62,"text":"它最主要它是"},{"start":427.62,"end":429.62,"text":"不是一個正它不適用於政府"},{"start":429.62,"end":431.62,"text":"採購法它是依據我們的"},{"start":431.62,"end":433.62,"text":"需求那當初"},{"start":433.62,"end":435.62,"text":"是為了能夠快速獲得這個裝備"},{"start":435.62,"end":437.62,"text":"那當然"},{"start":437.62,"end":439.62,"text":"它的這個為什麼"},{"start":439.62,"end":441.62,"text":"是由創未來來組合"},{"start":441.62,"end":443.62,"text":"那個已經是到了整個委託研究"},{"start":443.62,"end":445.62,"text":"決議的末端它當"},{"start":445.62,"end":447.62,"text":"初是由四家事實上"},{"start":447.62,"end":449.62,"text":"是最後的一個"},{"start":449.62,"end":451.62,"text":"一個合議"},{"start":451.62,"end":453.62,"text":"的一個過程那當然"},{"start":453.62,"end":455.62,"text":"它的終止契約"},{"start":455.62,"end":457.62,"text":"也是起始於這個委託研究"},{"start":457.62,"end":459.62,"text":"精神它沒有跟另外一家"},{"start":459.62,"end":461.62,"text":"在應該在契約"},{"start":461.62,"end":463.62,"text":"精神裡面要求要完成"},{"start":463.62,"end":465.62,"text":"整合的因為大概"},{"start":465.62,"end":467.62,"text":"就不是大概就是兩家"},{"start":467.62,"end":469.62,"text":"的這個意向後面有一個"},{"start":469.62,"end":471.62,"text":"歧異沒有整合"},{"start":471.62,"end":473.62,"text":"那我們終止這個契約這是您"},{"start":473.62,"end":475.62,"text":"所提及的第一個叫委託研究案"},{"start":475.62,"end":477.62,"text":"那第二個在26號的"},{"start":477.62,"end":479.62,"text":"它就是一個純粹的採購案那事實上"},{"start":479.62,"end":481.62,"text":"它經過嚴整的公告招標"},{"start":481.62,"end":483.62,"text":"非常嚴謹的採購程序"},{"start":483.62,"end":485.62,"text":"那事實上也"},{"start":485.62,"end":487.62,"text":"它它它公告招標"},{"start":487.62,"end":489.62,"text":"之後也並不是只有一家"},{"start":489.62,"end":491.62,"text":"是唯一的廠商"},{"start":491.62,"end":493.62,"text":"然後在後面兩家"},{"start":493.62,"end":495.62,"text":"來共同評選的我們就有外聘"},{"start":495.62,"end":497.62,"text":"委員來共同的"},{"start":497.62,"end":499.62,"text":"領選那經過一個"},{"start":499.62,"end":501.62,"text":"實際的POC的驗測"},{"start":501.62,"end":503.62,"text":"那以及那POC"},{"start":503.62,"end":505.62,"text":"我們再加上整個的"},{"start":505.62,"end":507.62,"text":"資格的審認那"},{"start":507.62,"end":509.62,"text":"當然最後是由"},{"start":509.62,"end":511.62,"text":"評審委員依照整個結論"},{"start":511.62,"end":513.62,"text":"是由川偉來最高分有他來獲選"},{"start":513.62,"end":515.62,"text":"好 參謀長請教"},{"start":515.62,"end":517.62,"text":"那接下來測驗"},{"start":517.62,"end":519.62,"text":"最近還有要再繼續測驗嗎"},{"start":519.62,"end":521.62,"text":"依照這個契約它就是"},{"start":521.62,"end":523.62,"text":"一次交貨驗首兩次"},{"start":523.62,"end":525.62,"text":"複驗那這兩次複驗"},{"start":525.62,"end":527.62,"text":"已經結束了那接下來就是解約嗎"},{"start":527.62,"end":529.62,"text":"現在我們正在"},{"start":529.62,"end":531.62,"text":"按按程序來辦理"},{"start":531.62,"end":533.62,"text":"那我們解約之後我們目前要求償"},{"start":533.62,"end":535.62,"text":"多少我們要保固責任"},{"start":535.62,"end":537.62,"text":"然後委約的責任要怎麼算"},{"start":537.62,"end":539.62,"text":"那我們已經付出去的錢"},{"start":539.62,"end":541.62,"text":"有沒有確實的保存"},{"start":541.62,"end":543.62,"text":"剛剛採購室主任已經報告"},{"start":543.62,"end":545.62,"text":"這個不會付出任何一毛錢"},{"start":545.62,"end":547.62,"text":"那第二個當然它在整個"},{"start":547.62,"end":549.62,"text":"違約的部分也就是"},{"start":549.62,"end":551.62,"text":"九千多萬那另外"},{"start":551.62,"end":553.62,"text":"還有一個沒收履約保證金四千八百"},{"start":553.62,"end":555.62,"text":"多萬所以這"},{"start":555.62,"end":557.62,"text":"整個都是按照"},{"start":557.62,"end":559.62,"text":"這個案子我們會繼續再"},{"start":559.62,"end":561.62,"text":"推動嗎"},{"start":561.62,"end":563.62,"text":"剛剛部長也說過了"},{"start":563.62,"end":565.62,"text":"為了滿足我們實際上"},{"start":565.62,"end":567.62,"text":"本外島和這些"},{"start":567.62,"end":569.62,"text":"所謂重要防護目標需求"},{"start":569.62,"end":571.62,"text":"事實上在這個案子"},{"start":571.62,"end":573.62,"text":"正在進行當中因為這些"},{"start":573.62,"end":575.62,"text":"的科技的迭代"},{"start":575.62,"end":577.62,"text":"和需求是一直在滾動的"},{"start":577.62,"end":579.62,"text":"所以我們也完成了可惜是無人機的"},{"start":579.62,"end":581.62,"text":"這個建案座"},{"start":581.62,"end":583.62,"text":"的四階文件那只要"},{"start":583.62,"end":585.62,"text":"是預算獲付我們就可以來辦理招標"},{"start":585.62,"end":587.62,"text":"好謝謝陳部長的說明"},{"start":587.62,"end":589.62,"text":"讓時間關係做好講本席"},{"start":589.62,"end":591.62,"text":"要求國防部在一個月內"},{"start":591.62,"end":593.62,"text":"提供三項資料第一個就是"},{"start":593.62,"end":595.62,"text":"我們重大軍民採購"},{"start":595.62,"end":597.62,"text":"延宕案的清單還有改善"},{"start":597.62,"end":599.62,"text":"進度第二個就是"},{"start":599.62,"end":601.62,"text":"我們對美採購高風險的項目"},{"start":601.62,"end":603.62,"text":"一起替代或本土化"},{"start":603.62,"end":605.62,"text":"的方案第三個就是"},{"start":605.62,"end":607.62,"text":"我們反無人機系統的採購案"},{"start":607.62,"end":609.62,"text":"這個測驗結果"},{"start":609.62,"end":611.62,"text":"那旅約的爭議"},{"start":611.62,"end":613.62,"text":"還有全場進入戰略的規劃這些"},{"start":613.62,"end":615.62,"text":"資料我講這些在"},{"start":615.62,"end":617.62,"text":"這些資料就不要再用這個"},{"start":617.62,"end":619.62,"text":"依法辦理或持續進行"},{"start":619.62,"end":621.62,"text":"這些制度就明確的告訴"},{"start":621.62,"end":623.62,"text":"告訴我們讓我們也能夠"},{"start":623.62,"end":625.62,"text":"來瞭解好不好部長"},{"start":625.62,"end":627.62,"text":"剛剛那個旅約的後續處理"},{"start":627.62,"end":629.62,"text":"相關的違約"},{"start":629.62,"end":631.62,"text":"罰款的金額"},{"start":631.62,"end":633.62,"text":"我們當然就解約嘛解約當然就不用付"},{"start":633.62,"end":635.62,"text":"價金嘛另外還有一起罰款"},{"start":635.62,"end":637.62,"text":"還有旅約保證金等等這個我想"},{"start":637.62,"end":639.62,"text":"具體的金額都可以提供給"},{"start":639.62,"end":641.62,"text":"好謝謝部長謝謝市長謝謝許席"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:50:27.883636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:50:29.945455+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，有請國防部長。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T10:50:30.240000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:50:30.990000+08:00","text":"請顧部長。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"顧部長立雄","start":"2026-07-20T10:50:30.990000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T10:50:39.440000+08:00","text":"黃委員好。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:50:39.440000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:50:39.714286+08:00","text":"部長早。","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:50:41.085714+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:51:06.853750+08:00","text":"我們今天的題目是有關軍品採購的問題，我想軍品的籌補跟一般的採購是不一樣的，因為它直接關係到整個部隊的戰力，也關係到我們整個國家的防衛韌性，簡單來說，就是要能夠平時拿得到、戰時用得上，而且要準時、到位、夠用，部長，我想這點你們同意啦。","quality":0.894},{"speaker":"顧部長立雄","start":"2026-07-20T10:51:08.080000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:51:11.180000+08:00","text":"是，我們儘量能夠符合我們的作戰需求。好。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:51:11.502353+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:51:23.395385+08:00","text":"但是部長，如果採購一直延宕，然後測驗沒有過，履約爭議又拖很久，這問題就不是公文慢一點的問題，這是整個前線的部隊到底能不能夠準時拿到戰力。","quality":0.855},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:51:24.843636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:51:38.181905+08:00","text":"國防部在114年11月3號也曾經針對近年國軍各項軍事工程落後及軍、商購案延宕提出專案報告，當時國防部說要強化專責管理、專業訓練、契約管理。","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:51:38.601818+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:51:50.358462+08:00","text":"我現在想要請教部長，到今天為止改善了多少，延宕的案件有沒有變少、金額有沒有下降、平均延宕的時間有沒有縮短？","quality":0.979},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:51:50.784706+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:51:53.255294+08:00","text":"請國防部這邊給我們具體的數字。","quality":1},{"speaker":"趙主任亞平","start":"2026-07-20T10:51:55.020000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:52:09.831765+08:00","text":"報告委員，我們每個案子都有專案管理的機制，定期召開專案管理會議，也設定節點來管制執行進度，關於每個案子，後續我們可以提供書面資料跟委員做個……","quality":0.938},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:52:10.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:52:17.072941+08:00","text":"主任，給我具體的數字就好了，因為我想要了解具體的數字到底是多少，而不是這種原則性的說明，好不好？","quality":0.86},{"speaker":"趙主任亞平","start":"2026-07-20T10:52:20.153333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:52:39.136667+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們統計近五年的購案有三萬多件，招標的有3萬1,000件，產生履約爭議的有10件，所以原則上，我們都有設定管制節點，也有做專案管制的機制。","quality":0.721},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:52:40.320000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:52:43.820000+08:00","text":"所以在專案報告之後有做哪些改善？","quality":1},{"speaker":"趙主任亞平","start":"2026-07-20T10:52:44.120000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:52:44.720000+08:00","text":"每個案子都有管制。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:52:45.720000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:52:49.120000+08:00","text":"有關本席提到的那些，再報告給本席辦公室。是。","quality":0.895},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:52:49.795000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:53:18.832500+08:00","text":"我們會這樣講是因為我們看到現在整個國際的情勢，從烏俄戰爭開始到中東衝突，都讓我們看到全球整個軍工的供應鏈變得非常緊張，烏克蘭的戰爭也很清楚顯示，面對飛彈、無人機這樣連續的攻擊，就算是再先進的防衛系統，攔截彈藥的部分也都有可能會不夠用；其他區域的衝突也告訴我們，防禦方未來準備時間要更長，而且還要面對更大規模的威脅。","quality":0.884},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:53:19.220000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:53:41.738182+08:00","text":"現在每次武器的交付延宕，各式的精準彈藥籌補都在延長，已經不是只有我們臺灣遇到，現在變成是各國都在搶，我們臺灣又高度仰賴對外採購，如果臺海有一天真的不幸發生了高強度的衝突，美方的產能跟庫存會不會排擠到我們的交貨期程？","quality":0.93},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:53:41.920000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:53:54.638182+08:00","text":"我想要請教部長，軍購特別預算已經通過了，案項也多數向美方來採購，國防部有沒有建立對美採購延宕的風險清單？","quality":0.854},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:53:54.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:54:06.420000+08:00","text":"哪一些項目是高風險、哪一些有沒有替代方案、有沒有分散來源、關鍵零組件有沒有規劃自主生產或者是技轉？","quality":0.978},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:54:06.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:54:08.420000+08:00","text":"期程在哪裡？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃司長文啓","start":"2026-07-20T10:54:08.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:54:56.438182+08:00","text":"報告委員，你剛剛談到軍購案的部分，我們從前年開始，就已經開始針對我們軍購部分可能產生的潛在風險去進行評估，在做特別預算的時候，我們也有跟大院報告過，這些項目都是已經經過跟美方詳細地討論過交期、數量，都沒有問題的我們才會把它列入我們的採購項目；至於後面技轉的部分，我們也有一些重點的項目，其中包含了海馬士彈藥的部分，這是未來我們爭取美方技轉，然後希望能夠在地生產，當然還有一些其他的項目，可能會後再跟委員說明。","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:54:56.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:54:58.120000+08:00","text":"謝謝司長。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:54:58.786667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:55:19.953333+08:00","text":"司長，其實本席要提醒的是，針對全球性的軍工緊張性，我們也很難不擔心未來其他戰區如果有需求的時候，採購會以那邊為優先，屆時我們就會被delay，所以這個要先預防起來，是不是？","quality":0.744},{"speaker":"顧部長立雄","start":"2026-07-20T10:55:20.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:55:34.120000+08:00","text":"對，所以我們要擴充我們的戰備產線，這部分我們也擺進了特別條例，要納入特別預算，但因為特別條例還沒有通過，所以日後我們也會擺入追加預算跟公務預算裡。","quality":0.821},{"speaker":"顧部長立雄","start":"2026-07-20T10:55:34.953333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:55:45.820000+08:00","text":"事實上，之前也有跟各位報告過，臺美之間對155公厘的榴彈已經有開始要共同合作。","quality":0.848},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:55:46.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:55:52.397778+08:00","text":"謝謝部長、司長的回應，本席要提醒部裡面對這些部分要確實注意。","quality":0.741},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:55:53.347273+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:55:57.020000+08:00","text":"因為時間有限，我們再來談談反無人機系統的事。","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:55:57.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:56:19.020000+08:00","text":"針對反無人機系統，很多委員都有提到，之前陸軍司令部辦理無人機反制的委託研究，由創未來公司獲評為優勝的整合廠商，接著另外的陣地式無人機反制系統採購標案，又是由同一家公司得標，金額大概是9.8億。","quality":0.908},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:56:19.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:56:36.438182+08:00","text":"部長，從研究到採購都是由同一個廠商承作，外界會不會質疑規格有沒有被特定廠商綁住、市場競爭充不充分，以及相關評選跟採購設計有沒有第三方檢核？","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:56:38.762857+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:56:56.420000+08:00","text":"第二點，這套系統三次測驗都沒有達到合格標準，甚至傳出連商用無人機都可以穿越防線，國防部在一開始的需求設定、測驗標準及風險控管上，是不是有問題？","quality":0.892},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:56:59.453333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:57:01.696923+08:00","text":"如果測驗不合格，問題到底卡在哪裡？","quality":0.867},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:57:01.850769+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:57:07.064444+08:00","text":"是卡在偵測、識別、干擾、攔阻，還是整個系統的整合？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:57:08.175556+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:57:10.370000+08:00","text":"又相關環境有沒有貼近實戰？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:57:11.120000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:57:18.120000+08:00","text":"國防部在不涉及機密的情況之下，是不是可以向立法院說明，提出完整的報告？","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:57:19.020000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:57:22.175556+08:00","text":"報告委員，針對你剛才的提詢，我就以下幾點回復。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:57:22.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:58:22.466154+08:00","text":"第一，委託研究案跟26套的反制系統，在屬性上及適用法規是不一樣的，委託研究案最主要是不適用政府採購法，它是依據我們的需求而定，當初是為了能夠快速獲得裝備，至於為什麼是由創未來組合，那是已經到了整個委託研究決議的末端，事實上，當初是由4家最後的合議過程，當然，終止契約也是起始於這個委託研究的精神，因為他們沒有完成契約精神裡要求應該跟另外一家廠商完成整合，因為兩家的意向有一些歧異而沒有整合，所以我們就終止這個契約，這是你所提詢的第一個問題，即委託研究案部分。","quality":0.809},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:58:22.905714+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:00.466154+08:00","text":"第二，在26套的部分，這純粹就是一個採購案，事實上，是經過嚴整的公告招標、非常嚴謹的採購程序，而在公告招標之後，也並不是只有一家、唯一的廠商，後面是有兩家由我們外聘的委員來共同遴選，經過實績的POC驗測，再加上整個資格審認，當然，最後是由評選委員依照整個結論由創未來以最高分獲選，這是沒有疑義的。","quality":0.802},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:00.953333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:06.438182+08:00","text":"參謀長，接下來的測驗部分，我想請教，最近還會再繼續測驗嗎？","quality":0.68},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:06.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:13.048571+08:00","text":"依照這個契約，他就是一次交貨驗收、兩次複驗，因為這兩次複驗已經結束，所以不會再測。","quality":0.722},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:13.477143+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:14.477143+08:00","text":"都沒有過，接下來就是解約嗎？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:14.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:18.334286+08:00","text":"現在正在按照程序辦理。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:19.048571+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:20.842222+08:00","text":"解約之後，目前要求償多少？","quality":1},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:21.731111+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:22.397778+08:00","text":"有沒有保固責任？","quality":0.571},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:23.165455+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:24.438182+08:00","text":"違約的責任要怎麼算？","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:24.820000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:28.370000+08:00","text":"我們已經付出去的錢有沒有確實的保存？","quality":1},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:28.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:44.286667+08:00","text":"剛剛採購室主任已經報告過，這個不會付出任何一毛錢；第二，他們整個違約的部分是九千多萬，另外還有沒收履約保證金四千八百多萬，所以這整個都是按照契約……","quality":0.925},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:44.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:47.953333+08:00","text":"接下來這個案子我們會繼續再推動嗎？","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:47.953333+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T10:59:48.953333+08:00","text":"就是反制無人機系統的部分。","quality":0},{"speaker":"陳參謀長建義","start":"2026-07-20T10:59:48.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:00:12.486667+08:00","text":"剛剛部長也說過了，為了滿足我們實際上本外島和這些所謂重要防護目標的需求，事實上，在這個案子正在進行當中時，因為這些科技的迭代和需求是一直在滾動的，所以我們也完成了可攜式無人機建案的四階文件，只要預算獲付我們就可以辦理招標。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T11:00:12.842222+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:00:19.529091+08:00","text":"謝謝參謀長的說明，我想時間的關係，本席最後要求國防部在一個月內提供3項資料。","quality":0.794},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T11:00:19.710909+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:00:36.286667+08:00","text":"第一個就是重大軍品採購延宕案的清單還有改善進度；第二個就是對美採購高風險的項目以及替代或本土化的方案；第三個就是反無人機系統採購案的測驗結果。","quality":0.941},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T11:00:37.286667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:00:52.370000+08:00","text":"有關履約爭議還有這些進入戰力規劃的資料就不要再用什麼「依法辦理」或「持續精進」這些字眼呈現，請明確地告訴我們，讓我們也能了解，好不好，部長？","quality":0.721},{"speaker":"顧部長立雄","start":"2026-07-20T11:00:52.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:00.983636+08:00","text":"有關剛剛提到履約後續的處理，違約相關的罰款金額，我們當然就是解約，解約就不用付價金嘛！是。","quality":0.75},{"speaker":"顧部長立雄","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:01.165455+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:06.438182+08:00","text":"另外還有逾期罰款還有履約保證金等等，我想這個具體的金額都可以提供給委員。","quality":0.794},{"speaker":"黃委員建賓","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:06.620000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:08.158462+08:00","text":"好，謝謝部長、謝謝司長、謝謝主席。","quality":0.769},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:08.658462+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:10.944176+08:00","text":"我們現在休息5分鐘。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:11.244176+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:12.387033+08:00","text":"休息（11時1分）","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:12.687033+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:14.401319+08:00","text":"繼續開會（11時7分）","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:14.701319+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:16.415604+08:00","text":"我們繼續開會。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:01:16.715604+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:01:20.429890+08:00","text":"接下來請許忠信委員上台質詢。","quality":0.077}]},"gazette":{"lineno":358,"blocks":[["黃委員建賓：（10時50分）謝謝主席，有請國防部長。"],["主席：請顧部長。"],["顧部長立雄：黃委員好。"],["黃委員建賓：部長早。我們今天的題目是有關軍品採購的問題，我想軍品的籌補跟一般的採購是不一樣的，因為它直接關係到整個部隊的戰力，也關係到我們整個國家的防衛韌性，簡單來說，就是要能夠平時拿得到、戰時用得上，而且要準時、到位、夠用，部長，我想這點你們同意啦。"],["顧部長立雄：是，我們儘量能夠符合我們的作戰需求。"],["黃委員建賓：好。但是部長，如果採購一直延宕，然後測驗沒有過，履約爭議又拖很久，這問題就不是公文慢一點的問題，這是整個前線的部隊到底能不能夠準時拿到戰力。國防部在114年11月3號也曾經針對近年國軍各項軍事工程落後及軍、商購案延宕提出專案報告，當時國防部說要強化專責管理、專業訓練、契約管理。我現在想要請教部長，到今天為止改善了多少，延宕的案件有沒有變少、金額有沒有下降、平均延宕的時間有沒有縮短？請國防部這邊給我們具體的數字。"],["趙主任亞平：報告委員，我們每個案子都有專案管理的機制，定期召開專案管理會議，也設定節點來管制執行進度，關於每個案子，後續我們可以提供書面資料跟委員做個……"],["黃委員建賓：主任，給我具體的數字就好了，因為我想要了解具體的數字到底是多少，而不是這種原則性的說明，好不好？"],["趙主任亞平：跟委員報告，我們統計近五年的購案有三萬多件，招標的有3萬1,000件，產生履約爭議的有10件，所以原則上，我們都有設定管制節點，也有做專案管制的機制。"],["黃委員建賓：所以在專案報告之後有做哪些改善？"],["趙主任亞平：每個案子都有管制。"],["黃委員建賓：有關本席提到的那些，再報告給本席辦公室。"],["趙主任亞平：是。"],["黃委員建賓：我們會這樣講是因為我們看到現在整個國際的情勢，從烏俄戰爭開始到中東衝突，都讓我們看到全球整個軍工的供應鏈變得非常緊張，烏克蘭的戰爭也很清楚顯示，面對飛彈、無人機這樣連續的攻擊，就算是再先進的防衛系統，攔截彈藥的部分也都有可能會不夠用；其他區域的衝突也告訴我們，防禦方未來準備時間要更長，而且還要面對更大規模的威脅。現在每次武器的交付延宕，各式的精準彈藥籌補都在延長，已經不是只有我們臺灣遇到，現在變成是各國都在搶，我們臺灣又高度仰賴對外採購，如果臺海有一天真的不幸發生了高強度的衝突，美方的產能跟庫存會不會排擠到我們的交貨期程？","我想要請教部長，軍購特別預算已經通過了，案項也多數向美方來採購，國防部有沒有建立對美採購延宕的風險清單？哪一些項目是高風險、哪一些有沒有替代方案、有沒有分散來源、關鍵零組件有沒有規劃自主生產或者是技轉？期程在哪裡？"],["黃司長文啓：報告委員，你剛剛談到軍購案的部分，我們從前年開始，就已經開始針對我們軍購部分可能產生的潛在風險去進行評估，在做特別預算的時候，我們也有跟大院報告過，這些項目都是已經經過跟美方詳細地討論過交期、數量，都沒有問題的我們才會把它列入我們的採購項目；至於後面技轉的部分，我們也有一些重點的項目，其中包含了海馬士彈藥的部分，這是未來我們爭取美方技轉，然後希望能夠在地生產，當然還有一些其他的項目，可能會後再跟委員說明。"],["黃委員建賓：謝謝司長。司長，其實本席要提醒的是，針對全球性的軍工緊張性，我們也很難不擔心未來其他戰區如果有需求的時候，採購會以那邊為優先，屆時我們就會被delay，所以這個要先預防起來，是不是？"],["顧部長立雄：對，所以我們要擴充我們的戰備產線，這部分我們也擺進了特別條例，要納入特別預算，但因為特別條例還沒有通過，所以日後我們也會擺入追加預算跟公務預算裡。事實上，之前也有跟各位報告過，臺美之間對155公厘的榴彈已經有開始要共同合作。"],["黃委員建賓：謝謝部長、司長的回應，本席要提醒部裡面對這些部分要確實注意。因為時間有限，我們再來談談反無人機系統的事。針對反無人機系統，很多委員都有提到，之前陸軍司令部辦理無人機反制的委託研究，由創未來公司獲評為優勝的整合廠商，接著另外的陣地式無人機反制系統採購標案，又是由同一家公司得標，金額大概是9.8億。部長，從研究到採購都是由同一個廠商承作，外界會不會質疑規格有沒有被特定廠商綁住、市場競爭充不充分，以及相關評選跟採購設計有沒有第三方檢核？第二點，這套系統三次測驗都沒有達到合格標準，甚至傳出連商用無人機都可以穿越防線，國防部在一開始的需求設定、測驗標準及風險控管上，是不是有問題？如果測驗不合格，問題到底卡在哪裡？是卡在偵測、識別、干擾、攔阻，還是整個系統的整合？又相關環境有沒有貼近實戰？國防部在不涉及機密的情況之下，是不是可以向立法院說明，提出完整的報告？"],["陳參謀長建義：報告委員，針對你剛才的提詢，我就以下幾點回復。第一，委託研究案跟26套的反制系統，在屬性上及適用法規是不一樣的，委託研究案最主要是不適用政府採購法，它是依據我們的需求而定，當初是為了能夠快速獲得裝備，至於為什麼是由創未來組合，那是已經到了整個委託研究決議的末端，事實上，當初是由4家最後的合議過程，當然，終止契約也是起始於這個委託研究的精神，因為他們沒有完成契約精神裡要求應該跟另外一家廠商完成整合，因為兩家的意向有一些歧異而沒有整合，所以我們就終止這個契約，這是你所提詢的第一個問題，即委託研究案部分。","第二，在26套的部分，這純粹就是一個採購案，事實上，是經過嚴整的公告招標、非常嚴謹的採購程序，而在公告招標之後，也並不是只有一家、唯一的廠商，後面是有兩家由我們外聘的委員來共同遴選，經過實績的POC驗測，再加上整個資格審認，當然，最後是由評選委員依照整個結論由創未來以最高分獲選，這是沒有疑義的。"],["黃委員建賓：參謀長，接下來的測驗部分，我想請教，最近還會再繼續測驗嗎？"],["陳參謀長建義：依照這個契約，他就是一次交貨驗收、兩次複驗，因為這兩次複驗已經結束，所以不會再測。"],["黃委員建賓：都沒有過，接下來就是解約嗎？"],["陳參謀長建義：現在正在按照程序辦理。"],["黃委員建賓：解約之後，目前要求償多少？有沒有保固責任？違約的責任要怎麼算？我們已經付出去的錢有沒有確實的保存？"],["陳參謀長建義：剛剛採購室主任已經報告過，這個不會付出任何一毛錢；第二，他們整個違約的部分是九千多萬，另外還有沒收履約保證金四千八百多萬，所以這整個都是按照契約……"],["黃委員建賓：接下來這個案子我們會繼續再推動嗎？就是反制無人機系統的部分。"],["陳參謀長建義：剛剛部長也說過了，為了滿足我們實際上本外島和這些所謂重要防護目標的需求，事實上，在這個案子正在進行當中時，因為這些科技的迭代和需求是一直在滾動的，所以我們也完成了可攜式無人機建案的四階文件，只要預算獲付我們就可以辦理招標。"],["黃委員建賓：謝謝參謀長的說明，我想時間的關係，本席最後要求國防部在一個月內提供3項資料。第一個就是重大軍品採購延宕案的清單還有改善進度；第二個就是對美採購高風險的項目以及替代或本土化的方案；第三個就是反無人機系統採購案的測驗結果。","有關履約爭議還有這些進入戰力規劃的資料就不要再用什麼「依法辦理」或「持續精進」這些字眼呈現，請明確地告訴我們，讓我們也能了解，好不好，部長？"],["顧部長立雄：有關剛剛提到履約後續的處理，違約相關的罰款金額，我們當然就是解約，解約就不用付價金嘛！"],["黃委員建賓：是。"],["顧部長立雄：另外還有逾期罰款還有履約保證金等等，我想這個具體的金額都可以提供給委員。"],["黃委員建賓：好，謝謝部長、謝謝司長、謝謝主席。"],["主席：我們現在休息5分鐘。","休息（11時1分）","繼續開會（11時7分）"],["主席：我們繼續開會。","接下來請許忠信委員上台質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":386,"meet_id":"委員會-11-5-35-27","speakers":["馬文君","羅美玲","陳俊宇","陳永康","牛煦庭","王義川","林楚茵","沈伯洋","馬文君","王安祥","黃建賓","許忠信","謝龍介","郭昱晴","洪孟楷","洪毓祥","賴士葆","徐巧芯","王鴻薇","葉元之","陳冠廷","黃仁","王定宇"],"page_start":325,"meetingDate":["2026-07-20"],"gazette_id":"1156401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1156401_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第27次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請國防部部長顧立雄報告「國軍軍品採購履約爭議與違約致獲裝期程延宕採購策略精進作\n為」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1156401_00005"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}