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Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:30:57.920000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:30:58.670000+08:00","text":"恭喜、恭喜。","quality":1},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:31:01.168182+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:31:11.875882+08:00","text":"今天是中研院的業務報告，特別請中研院及所有中研院所屬相關單位列席。","quality":0.613},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:31:14.070000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:31:21.036667+08:00","text":"中研院很重要，我看了你的報告，寫得非常多也很詳細。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:31:22.780000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:31:38.485556+08:00","text":"我們來看簡報上這段文字，有關「執行《日治時期臺灣人類學與民族學史》」這方面的研究，針對日治時期的部分，我們等一下也可以談。","quality":0.717},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:31:40.075714+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:33:08.345714+08:00","text":"日治時期之前，臺灣原住民族所碰到很多的這些歷程或是歷史，到目前為止，因為史料不完整，無論是中研院或是國史館，對於原住民族不管是日治時期，或者是日治時期之前都不夠完整，所以我們政府機關所捐助成立的譬如公共電視，它所開發製作的一部電影「斯卡羅」，公共電視花費政府的錢、人民的錢去製作的，結果對原住民傷害非常非常大，編劇、導演就僅根據一本小說，因為我們自己沒有寫出來，他們就只有根據一位小說家寫的小說來製作這部電影，對原住民的傷害非常非常地大。","quality":0.735},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:33:10.440000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:33:27.560000+08:00","text":"當時屏東瑪家鄉涼山部落的女頭目蔡衣珊，也是屏東國小老師，她就做了一個很沉重的說明及呼籲。","quality":0.732},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:33:30.480000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:33:58.730000+08:00","text":"而我們自己國家有中研院、有國史館，但到現在都沒有針對當時斯卡羅事件所發生的前因後果，或是相關這些史實來探究，這就是我們要期勉中研院怎麼樣與國史館共同的來推動。","quality":0.824},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:34:00.793636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:34:29.666667+08:00","text":"在這樣的情形之下，我就不多說，我就講這部「斯卡羅」電影裡被捧得很高的叫李仙得，他是美國人，被捧得高高的，但是對我們原住民來說，他是一位對我們傷害非常大的人物，大家可能還不知道為什麼傷害很大？","quality":0.812},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:34:31+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:34:53.610000+08:00","text":"因為李仙得在斯卡羅事件結束之後，跑到日本去推動「番地無主論」，進而發生牡丹社事件，李仙得提倡了什麼呢？","quality":0.667},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:34:57.010000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:34:58.885000+08:00","text":"日本為什麼會主張「生番地為無主之地」？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:35:00.670000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:35:04.098571+08:00","text":"就是李仙得在日本推動的。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:35:06.570000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:35:27.086667+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，我要特別讓院長知道，在你當副總統的時候，我們蔡總統說，有一本書叫「臺灣通史」，它的序言第一段提到「臺灣固無史也。","quality":0.833},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:35:27.670000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:35:30.920000+08:00","text":"荷人啟之，鄭氏作之，清代營之。","quality":0.583},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:35:32.310000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:35:40.827778+08:00","text":"」當然就是沒有把臺灣原住民放在裡面，所以要去處理，結果到現在還是沒有。","quality":0.935},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:35:41.050000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:36:07.106667+08:00","text":"我用這個來勉勵中研院，包括我們的南島也是一樣，臺灣是南島民族的發源地，我們現在只能引用國外學者的資料，我們自己的呢？","quality":0.868},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:36:07.660000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:36:19.020000+08:00","text":"所以針對這個部分，請中研院及國史館共同來整合這些資源，可以嗎？院長。好。","quality":0.742},{"speaker":"陳院長建仁","start":"2026-07-20T11:36:19.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:36:49.170000+08:00","text":"其實中研院在原住民族的文化、知識及傳統的研究也不少，像剛才伍召委也提到我們跟部落共作的這個部分也有在進行，當然您剛才提到那一本書裡的內容，確實是一本小說，沒有很完整史實的參考。","quality":0.817},{"speaker":"陳院長建仁","start":"2026-07-20T11:36:49.642222+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:36:59.170000+08:00","text":"中研院這邊會鼓勵我們的同仁對這一些以往原住民相關史料，作更深入的探討。","quality":0.879},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:36:59.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:00.220000+08:00","text":"要與國史館共同去推動。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"陳院長建仁","start":"2026-07-20T11:37:00.220000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:01.420000+08:00","text":"當然這個部分……","quality":0},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:37:01.420000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:18.406154+08:00","text":"像那個部落歷史，我過去在原民會當副主委的時候，就協調國史館開始推動部落歷史，整個所有部落的歷史都完整的話，就是整個臺灣原住民族的歷史。對。","quality":0.921},{"speaker":"陳院長建仁","start":"2026-07-20T11:37:18.560000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:26.060000+08:00","text":"所以我們也會與原民會及文化部一起合作來討論。","quality":0.476},{"speaker":"鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員","start":"2026-07-20T11:37:26.560000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:26.760000+08:00","text":"好，謝謝。謝謝。","quality":0.4},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:37:27.260000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:31.831429+08:00","text":"謝謝鄭天財委員的質詢，也請院長回座。","quality":0.25},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-07-20T11:37:32.131429+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-07-20T11:37:38.702857+08:00","text":"下一位也是今天的最後一位，有請葉元之委員進行詢答。","quality":0}]},"gazette":{"lineno":747,"blocks":[["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：（11時30分）主席、各位委員。有請院長。"],["主席：好，有請院長。"],["陳院長建仁：鄭委員好。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：院長好，好久不見。"],["陳院長建仁：好久不見。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：恭喜、恭喜。今天是中研院的業務報告，特別請中研院及所有中研院所屬相關單位列席。中研院很重要，我看了你的報告，寫得非常多也很詳細。我們來看簡報上這段文字，有關「執行《日治時期臺灣人類學與民族學史》」這方面的研究，針對日治時期的部分，我們等一下也可以談。日治時期之前，臺灣原住民族所碰到很多的這些歷程或是歷史，到目前為止，因為史料不完整，無論是中研院或是國史館，對於原住民族不管是日治時期，或者是日治時期之前都不夠完整，所以我們政府機關所捐助成立的譬如公共電視，它所開發製作的一部電影「斯卡羅」，公共電視花費政府的錢、人民的錢去製作的，結果對原住民傷害非常非常大，編劇、導演就僅根據一本小說，因為我們自己沒有寫出來，他們就只有根據一位小說家寫的小說來製作這部電影，對原住民的傷害非常非常地大。當時屏東瑪家鄉涼山部落的女頭目蔡衣珊，也是屏東國小老師，她就做了一個很沉重的說明及呼籲。而我們自己國家有中研院、有國史館，但到現在都沒有針對當時斯卡羅事件所發生的前因後果，或是相關這些史實來探究，這就是我們要期勉中研院怎麼樣與國史館共同的來推動。","在這樣的情形之下，我就不多說，我就講這部「斯卡羅」電影裡被捧得很高的叫李仙得，他是美國人，被捧得高高的，但是對我們原住民來說，他是一位對我們傷害非常大的人物，大家可能還不知道為什麼傷害很大？因為李仙得在斯卡羅事件結束之後，跑到日本去推動「番地無主論」，進而發生牡丹社事件，李仙得提倡了什麼呢？日本為什麼會主張「生番地為無主之地」？就是李仙得在日本推動的。針對這個部分，我要特別讓院長知道，在你當副總統的時候，我們蔡總統說，有一本書叫「臺灣通史」，它的序言第一段提到「臺灣固無史也。荷人啟之，鄭氏作之，清代營之。」當然就是沒有把臺灣原住民放在裡面，所以要去處理，結果到現在還是沒有。我用這個來勉勵中研院，包括我們的南島也是一樣，臺灣是南島民族的發源地，我們現在只能引用國外學者的資料，我們自己的呢？所以針對這個部分，請中研院及國史館共同來整合這些資源，可以嗎？院長。"],["陳院長建仁：好。其實中研院在原住民族的文化、知識及傳統的研究也不少，像剛才伍召委也提到我們跟部落共作的這個部分也有在進行，當然您剛才提到那一本書裡的內容，確實是一本小說，沒有很完整史實的參考。中研院這邊會鼓勵我們的同仁對這一些以往原住民相關史料，作更深入的探討。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：要與國史館共同去推動。"],["陳院長建仁：當然這個部分……"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：像那個部落歷史，我過去在原民會當副主委的時候，就協調國史館開始推動部落歷史，整個所有部落的歷史都完整的話，就是整個臺灣原住民族的歷史。"],["陳院長建仁：對。所以我們也會與原民會及文化部一起合作來討論。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：好，謝謝。"],["陳院長建仁：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝鄭天財委員的質詢，也請院長回座。","下一位也是今天的最後一位，有請葉元之委員進行詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":226,"meet_id":"委員會-11-5-22-21","speakers":["伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","柯志恩","羅廷瑋","葛如鈞","陳秀寳","蔡春綢","郭昱晴","謝龍介","陳培瑜","吳思瑤","羅智強","吳沛憶","洪孟楷","許忠信","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","葉元之","林宜瑾","傅崐萁","吳宗憲"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2026-07-20"],"gazette_id":"1156501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1156501_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化委員會第21次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請中央研究院院長陳建仁列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1156501_00001"}}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}