{"error":false,"id":["170823"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":170823,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170823","日期":"2026-08-05","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-35-29","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第29次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":29,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[35],"委員會代碼:str":["外交及國防委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第29次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-08-05T10:41:15+08:00","結束時間":"2026-08-05T10:54:41+08:00","影片長度":"00:13:26","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d053bb9b075f6aea8cd997278ab55cdf958b713431805b223b469cab67bfcba1eb3679e204ee1bbe5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"馬文君","委員發言時間":"10:41:15 - 10:54:41","會議時間":"2026-08-05T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期外交及國防委員會第29次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國防部部長顧立雄報告「因應敵情與灰色地帶威脅升高，國軍如何強化官兵精神戰力建構及心理韌性作為」，並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":0.92534375,"end":3.1697187500000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":3.2372187500000003,"end":4.3678437500000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":10.13909375,"end":10.172843750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":10.172843750000002,"end":109.71846875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":10.746593750000002,"end":10.93221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":109.76909375000001,"end":121.98659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":122.52659375,"end":123.01596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":123.60659375,"end":205.61909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":206.32784375,"end":299.66346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":299.89971875000003,"end":300.62534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":301.16534375000003,"end":306.37971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":307.13909375000003,"end":320.36909375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":321.34784375000004,"end":342.50909375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":343.20096875,"end":352.48221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":353.25846875,"end":354.59159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":354.65909375,"end":372.02346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":373.17096875000004,"end":376.91721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":377.91284375000004,"end":380.74784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":380.20784375000005,"end":389.82659375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":389.82659375000003,"end":391.36221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":391.85159375,"end":416.72534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":416.97846875000005,"end":421.19721875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":422.15909375,"end":430.78221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":431.18721875,"end":435.40596875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":435.97971875,"end":445.64909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":446.00346875,"end":476.76659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":447.82596875,"end":447.91034375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":473.29034375000003,"end":473.74596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":477.55971875000006,"end":581.88096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":582.18471875,"end":587.0109687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":587.51721875,"end":597.77721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":598.24971875,"end":603.16034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":603.6328437500001,"end":610.41659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":610.9397187500001,"end":652.33409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":653.09346875,"end":656.40096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":656.7553437500001,"end":702.3684687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":703.0434687500001,"end":739.0209687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":740.1684687500001,"end":773.31096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":773.7834687500001,"end":774.30659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":775.0828437499999,"end":799.9734687500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":800.86784375,"end":801.00284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":801.00284375,"end":801.0365937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":802.0322187500001,"end":803.23034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":803.7703437500002,"end":804.63096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":804.78284375,"end":804.79971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":804.79971875,"end":805.10346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":806.35221875,"end":806.9765937500001}],"whisperx":[{"start":0,"end":3.24,"text":"好 謝謝主席 麻煩請顧部長"},{"start":3.24,"end":5.24,"text":"好 有請顧部長"},{"start":10,"end":11,"text":"是 馬偉永"},{"start":11,"end":12.280000000000001,"text":"部長好 部長"},{"start":12.280000000000001,"end":16.28,"text":"我們今年的漢光演習由本日開始"},{"start":16.28,"end":19.8,"text":"那本席也觀察到了今年跟往年比較不一樣的地方"},{"start":19.8,"end":21.68,"text":"在漢光演習之前"},{"start":21.68,"end":27.2,"text":"國防部除了延續往例的電腦輔助指揮所的演習以外"},{"start":27.2,"end":30.04,"text":"另外也安插了立即備戰操演"},{"start":30.04,"end":32.24,"text":"還有聯合防禦操演"},{"start":32.24,"end":34,"text":"也就是六到八月份"},{"start":34,"end":38,"text":"我們都舉行一連串的操演訓練"},{"start":38,"end":40.28,"text":"那最近氣候非常的炎熱"},{"start":40.28,"end":42.2,"text":"國軍弟兄也非常的辛苦"},{"start":42.2,"end":44.480000000000004,"text":"我們在很多在馬路上"},{"start":44.480000000000004,"end":48.8,"text":"像我們前天到南部去的時候"},{"start":48.8,"end":51.8,"text":"其實在路上也看到有非常多的"},{"start":51.8,"end":57.4,"text":"我們軍用車輛其實也都在路上穿梭"},{"start":57.4,"end":63.8,"text":"那我們在這個時候其實也在此表達問候之意"},{"start":63.8,"end":67.2,"text":"那因為近年兩岸敵情也非常嚴峻"},{"start":67.2,"end":70.88,"text":"中共對台灣的灰色地帶威脅也不斷的升高"},{"start":70.88,"end":73.88,"text":"也由金門、馬祖等外島地區"},{"start":73.88,"end":77.47999999999999,"text":"在台灣的西部擴展到東部的海域"},{"start":77.47999999999999,"end":80.47999999999999,"text":"所以國軍當然在改變演訓方式"},{"start":80.48,"end":83.56,"text":"還有採購各類新式武器裝備"},{"start":83.56,"end":85.76,"text":"來因應解放軍的威脅"},{"start":85.76,"end":88.76,"text":"更重要的我們國軍九訓未戰"},{"start":88.76,"end":90.56,"text":"面對人數也好"},{"start":90.56,"end":95.96000000000001,"text":"武器裝備還有它的可能軍力的投資"},{"start":95.96000000000001,"end":99.36,"text":"其實都背負於國軍的情況之下"},{"start":99.36,"end":101.36,"text":"這樣的威脅要怎麼強化"},{"start":101.36,"end":104.36,"text":"我們官兵敵我意識的精神戰力"},{"start":104.36,"end":106.36,"text":"還有培養戰場抗壓性"},{"start":106.36,"end":109.96000000000001,"text":"這是今天我們安排專報很重要的原因"},{"start":109.96,"end":113.96,"text":"所以我們也希望國防部也可以在這個部分"},{"start":113.96,"end":118.44,"text":"可以更落實的去考量或者去強化"},{"start":118.44,"end":126.44,"text":"不過在這之前也要有兩個問題要請教部長"},{"start":126.44,"end":130.44,"text":"就是說像我們剛剛其實有很多的委員"},{"start":130.44,"end":134.44,"text":"一直都提到我們現在有很多的預算"},{"start":134.44,"end":139.44,"text":"好像是在野黨還沒有同意通過"},{"start":139.44,"end":142.92,"text":"可是我們聽到最近大家討論最多的"},{"start":142.92,"end":143.92,"text":"大概就是無人機"},{"start":143.92,"end":144.92,"text":"剛剛也有委員提到"},{"start":144.92,"end":147.92,"text":"不過提到無人機的這個部分"},{"start":147.92,"end":152.92,"text":"我們可以從國防部最早開始投入的"},{"start":152.92,"end":154.92,"text":"發芽研發的階段"},{"start":154.92,"end":157.92,"text":"最早可以追溯到民國83年"},{"start":157.92,"end":159.92,"text":"1994年的時候"},{"start":159.92,"end":163.92,"text":"那時候經濟部支持中山科學研究院"},{"start":163.92,"end":168.92,"text":"來執行發展飛控還有自動駕駛"},{"start":168.92,"end":170.39999999999998,"text":"等關鍵技術"},{"start":170.39999999999998,"end":174.39999999999998,"text":"後來中科院選擇以無人機作為技術驗證的平台"},{"start":174.39999999999998,"end":177.39999999999998,"text":"發展出中翔二號無人機"},{"start":177.39999999999998,"end":179.39999999999998,"text":"這個是在三十幾年前"},{"start":179.39999999999998,"end":184.39999999999998,"text":"其實政府國防部已經投入了相當的預算跟資源"},{"start":184.39999999999998,"end":186.39999999999998,"text":"那我們也開始起步"},{"start":186.39999999999998,"end":189.39999999999998,"text":"在這個過程當中三十幾年來"},{"start":189.39999999999998,"end":192.39999999999998,"text":"其實我們也看到我們在很多的預算上"},{"start":192.39999999999998,"end":195.39999999999998,"text":"不管是從小到大的無人機"},{"start":195.88,"end":198.88,"text":"不管是兼徵型的不管是攻擊型的"},{"start":198.88,"end":201.88,"text":"或者其他的反制的無人機"},{"start":201.88,"end":205.88,"text":"其實中科院也有投入科研"},{"start":205.88,"end":209.88,"text":"像紅雀兼兵還有瑞淵"},{"start":209.88,"end":212.88,"text":"還有晉峰你們之前說的巡飛彈"},{"start":212.88,"end":216.88,"text":"還有像建翔還有像騰雲"},{"start":216.88,"end":220.88,"text":"其實很多而且我們投入的經費也不少"},{"start":220.88,"end":222.88,"text":"所以我們也希望"},{"start":223.35999999999999,"end":226.35999999999999,"text":"不管國防部或者執政黨的委員"},{"start":226.35999999999999,"end":230.35999999999999,"text":"在爭取這樣相關預算的時候不要把它一刀切"},{"start":230.35999999999999,"end":234.35999999999999,"text":"因為從三十幾年前我們其實就投入了相當的預算"},{"start":234.35999999999999,"end":237.35999999999999,"text":"在執行這些而且努力到現在"},{"start":237.35999999999999,"end":241.35999999999999,"text":"我們現在看到這麼多暴增的預算"},{"start":241.35999999999999,"end":245.35999999999999,"text":"我們想要的是第一要驗證過去"},{"start":245.35999999999999,"end":248.35999999999999,"text":"我們從小到大的無人機都做過"},{"start":248.35999999999999,"end":249.35999999999999,"text":"也都有研發"},{"start":249.35999999999999,"end":252.35999999999999,"text":"當時也都跟我們說非常的成功"},{"start":252.84,"end":253.84,"text":"那你在這個成功之餘"},{"start":253.84,"end":256.84000000000003,"text":"你可以投入到現在無人載具的發展上面"},{"start":256.84000000000003,"end":259.84000000000003,"text":"可以做什麼樣的一個挹注"},{"start":259.84000000000003,"end":261.84000000000003,"text":"沒有說得很清楚"},{"start":261.84000000000003,"end":264.84000000000003,"text":"那另外在這麼高的預算底下"},{"start":264.84000000000003,"end":267.84000000000003,"text":"我們也看到我們從過去驗證"},{"start":267.84000000000003,"end":269.84000000000003,"text":"我們希望可以驗證過去"},{"start":269.84000000000003,"end":271.84000000000003,"text":"然後你才去投資未來"},{"start":271.84000000000003,"end":274.84000000000003,"text":"我們看到的如果你覺得過去這個是不夠好的"},{"start":274.84000000000003,"end":276.84000000000003,"text":"我們到底不足在哪裡"},{"start":276.84000000000003,"end":278.84000000000003,"text":"需要什麼樣外部的關鍵技術"},{"start":278.84000000000003,"end":280.84000000000003,"text":"也沒有說明清楚"},{"start":281.32,"end":284.32,"text":"那你一下子就說要幾千億幾千億的預算"},{"start":284.32,"end":289.32,"text":"我們不知道要如何讓大家放心的去通過這麼高的預算"},{"start":289.32,"end":293.32,"text":"所以就這個部分我們也請大家不要說"},{"start":293.32,"end":297.32,"text":"一直認為說這是沒有預算的原因"},{"start":297.32,"end":299.32,"text":"那講到這個部分"},{"start":299.32,"end":303.32,"text":"我們以一個最近的例子來看"},{"start":303.32,"end":309.32,"text":"因為以目前賴政府上任兩年多以來"},{"start":309.8,"end":313.8,"text":"我們的國防預算從過去我們已經講過很多次"},{"start":313.8,"end":318.8,"text":"從三千億四千億到六我們蔡英文總統"},{"start":318.8,"end":323.8,"text":"蔡政府的六千億到現在的九千多億以外"},{"start":323.8,"end":328.8,"text":"我們通過了國防的國土認清預算一千多億"},{"start":328.8,"end":330.8,"text":"我們通過了七千八百億"},{"start":330.8,"end":333.8,"text":"我們的對美的軍購"},{"start":333.8,"end":336.8,"text":"我們現在又提出兩千一百億"},{"start":337.28000000000003,"end":339.28000000000003,"text":"還加上我們自己公務預算"},{"start":339.28000000000003,"end":342.28000000000003,"text":"其實已經高達兩兆"},{"start":342.28000000000003,"end":346.28000000000003,"text":"今年又提出很高額的國防預算"},{"start":346.28000000000003,"end":350.28000000000003,"text":"我們來看看今天有一個例子我想請教一下"},{"start":350.28000000000003,"end":352.28000000000003,"text":"這個惠敏營區"},{"start":352.28000000000003,"end":354.28000000000003,"text":"這個部分"},{"start":354.28000000000003,"end":356.28000000000003,"text":"剛剛招標了一個"},{"start":356.28000000000003,"end":359.28000000000003,"text":"在採購網上面可以查詢到"},{"start":359.28000000000003,"end":362.28000000000003,"text":"剛剛決標辦理室內教室"},{"start":362.28000000000003,"end":364.28000000000003,"text":"教育中心大樓"},{"start":364.76,"end":367.76,"text":"室外訓場以及庫儲設施"},{"start":367.76,"end":371.76,"text":"等四個工程的規劃設計及建造委託技術服務案"},{"start":371.76,"end":376.76,"text":"這個預算是在我們認清預算裡面來的對不對"},{"start":376.76,"end":379.76,"text":"跟委員報告我是憲兵參謀長"},{"start":379.76,"end":381.76,"text":"沒關係簡單回應就好"},{"start":381.76,"end":383.76,"text":"那其實這四個案子"},{"start":383.76,"end":385.76,"text":"他在工程執行的部分"},{"start":385.76,"end":389.76,"text":"其實高達將近五億的金額"},{"start":389.76,"end":391.76,"text":"是四億五千多萬"},{"start":392.24,"end":395.24,"text":"其實已經非常高的金額"},{"start":395.24,"end":397.24,"text":"所以兩年內就要執行完成"},{"start":397.24,"end":400.24,"text":"因為他是在認清預算裡面編出來的"},{"start":400.24,"end":404.24,"text":"那這惠敏營區他都是在同一個營區"},{"start":404.24,"end":406.24,"text":"我們有四個案子"},{"start":406.24,"end":410.24,"text":"這四個案子為什麼要把它拆成四案下去招標"},{"start":410.24,"end":413.24,"text":"因為我們現在決標的部分是"},{"start":413.24,"end":416.24,"text":"規劃設計及建造委託的部分"},{"start":416.24,"end":419.24,"text":"那這麼高的金額"},{"start":419.24,"end":421.24,"text":"我們為什麼把它拆成四個案子"},{"start":421.72,"end":423.72,"text":"跟委員報告"},{"start":423.72,"end":425.72,"text":"我們當初是的確是有考慮到"},{"start":425.72,"end":427.72,"text":"可能考慮不周"},{"start":427.72,"end":428.72,"text":"然後把它拆成四個案"},{"start":428.72,"end":430.72,"text":"因為一月兩年期怕來不及"},{"start":430.72,"end":432.72,"text":"那後續下去也會針對這個案子"},{"start":432.72,"end":435.72,"text":"做一個全班的了解跟檢討"},{"start":435.72,"end":438.72,"text":"那後續我們會在計伏那部分"},{"start":438.72,"end":441.72,"text":"會掌握到按照期程強化"},{"start":441.72,"end":443.72,"text":"旅約督導的評事"},{"start":443.72,"end":445.72,"text":"那如期如此讓他完成"},{"start":445.72,"end":447.72,"text":"本席今天先填出來"},{"start":447.72,"end":449.72,"text":"就是說他不合理的地方"},{"start":450.20000000000005,"end":452.20000000000005,"text":"現在要請國防部注意的是"},{"start":452.20000000000005,"end":454.20000000000005,"text":"因為部長也在"},{"start":454.20000000000005,"end":456.20000000000005,"text":"對於法律相關的問題"},{"start":456.20000000000005,"end":457.20000000000005,"text":"尤其採購法"},{"start":457.20000000000005,"end":459.20000000000005,"text":"這是可以這樣拆的嗎"},{"start":459.20000000000005,"end":460.20000000000005,"text":"這是第一點"},{"start":460.20000000000005,"end":462.20000000000005,"text":"因為他在同一個營區"},{"start":462.20000000000005,"end":463.20000000000005,"text":"在同一個時段"},{"start":463.20000000000005,"end":465.20000000000005,"text":"他的預算來源其實都是一樣的"},{"start":465.20000000000005,"end":467.20000000000005,"text":"然後像這些相關的"},{"start":467.20000000000005,"end":469.20000000000005,"text":"你把它拆成四個案子"},{"start":469.20000000000005,"end":471.20000000000005,"text":"而且都是每一個案子"},{"start":471.20000000000005,"end":473.20000000000005,"text":"都是999萬"},{"start":473.20000000000005,"end":476.20000000000005,"text":"然後由同一個建築師得標"},{"start":476.20000000000005,"end":478.20000000000005,"text":"同一天招標"},{"start":478.68,"end":480.68,"text":"所以像這樣子的一個狀況"},{"start":480.68,"end":482.68,"text":"這是非常不合理的"},{"start":482.68,"end":484.68,"text":"因為剛剛我們擔心說"},{"start":484.68,"end":486.68,"text":"這麼高額4億多的工程"},{"start":486.68,"end":488.68,"text":"然後我們招標出去"},{"start":488.68,"end":490.68,"text":"是怕我們沒有辦法完成"},{"start":490.68,"end":493.68,"text":"可是你同一個建築師得標以後"},{"start":493.68,"end":495.68,"text":"他要設計四個案子"},{"start":495.68,"end":497.68,"text":"那你在這麼短只剩一年多"},{"start":497.68,"end":499.68,"text":"因為你的旅約的時間"},{"start":499.68,"end":503.68,"text":"從115年3月5號到116年12月31號"},{"start":503.68,"end":505.68,"text":"這個只有一年多的時間"},{"start":505.68,"end":507.68,"text":"你必須要執行4億多的工程"},{"start":508.16,"end":510.16,"text":"預算以外"},{"start":510.16,"end":512.16,"text":"包括他的設計"},{"start":512.16,"end":514.16,"text":"因為你裡面還有訊場"},{"start":514.16,"end":516.16,"text":"像這樣的一個東西"},{"start":516.16,"end":518.16,"text":"其實他都必須要經過審核"},{"start":518.16,"end":520.16,"text":"他才可以通過的"},{"start":520.16,"end":522.16,"text":"那你過去像我們"},{"start":522.16,"end":524.16,"text":"在前身像我們的堅實營區"},{"start":524.16,"end":526.16,"text":"其實他都是憲兵的嘛"},{"start":526.16,"end":528.16,"text":"堅實營區部長也有去檢查"},{"start":528.16,"end":530.16,"text":"那個光是他的工程"},{"start":530.16,"end":532.16,"text":"才2億多"},{"start":532.16,"end":534.16,"text":"他都要做四五年以上"},{"start":534.16,"end":536.16,"text":"那你這個4億多的工程"},{"start":536.64,"end":538.64,"text":"你可以一年多就把它執行完成"},{"start":538.64,"end":540.64,"text":"而且只有一家"},{"start":540.64,"end":542.64,"text":"你剛剛說怕執行不來"},{"start":542.64,"end":544.64,"text":"所以把它拆成四個案子"},{"start":544.64,"end":546.64,"text":"這是很矛盾邏輯不通的"},{"start":546.64,"end":548.64,"text":"你拆成四個結果有一家得標"},{"start":548.64,"end":550.64,"text":"那這一家他必須要設計四個案子以外"},{"start":550.64,"end":552.64,"text":"才去配合一些工程的廠商"},{"start":552.64,"end":554.64,"text":"這一個部分我們現在先點出來"},{"start":554.64,"end":556.64,"text":"希望先去查查清楚以後"},{"start":556.64,"end":558.64,"text":"後續應該要怎麼樣做處置"},{"start":558.64,"end":560.64,"text":"如果他沒有辦法符合我們"},{"start":560.64,"end":562.64,"text":"因為我們看到我們過去"},{"start":562.64,"end":564.64,"text":"我們不管長安營區"},{"start":565.12,"end":567.12,"text":"我們的所有坑子口"},{"start":567.12,"end":569.12,"text":"我們的軍博館"},{"start":569.12,"end":571.12,"text":"還有我們所有的訓場"},{"start":571.12,"end":573.12,"text":"動輒都好幾年"},{"start":573.12,"end":575.12,"text":"甚至都有延長工期"},{"start":575.12,"end":577.12,"text":"那你居然可以這麼高的預算"},{"start":577.12,"end":579.12,"text":"可以在這麼短的時間執行"},{"start":579.12,"end":581.12,"text":"那這個部分"},{"start":581.12,"end":583.12,"text":"第一為什麼拆"},{"start":583.12,"end":585.12,"text":"為什麼只有一家投標"},{"start":585.12,"end":587.12,"text":"我們還可以讓他通過"},{"start":587.12,"end":589.12,"text":"而且他是同一天照標的"},{"start":589.12,"end":591.12,"text":"這些希望可以後續把它"},{"start":591.12,"end":593.12,"text":"理清楚以後"},{"start":593.6,"end":595.6,"text":"那我今天特別提到這個案子"},{"start":595.6,"end":597.6,"text":"主要的目的是因為"},{"start":597.6,"end":599.6,"text":"我剛剛念了一堆"},{"start":599.6,"end":601.6,"text":"很多的預算"},{"start":601.6,"end":603.6,"text":"我們現在說"},{"start":603.6,"end":605.6,"text":"我們吃東西重不重要"},{"start":605.6,"end":607.6,"text":"在我們桌上擺滿了"},{"start":607.6,"end":609.6,"text":"食物"},{"start":609.6,"end":611.6,"text":"今天如果說你一次"},{"start":611.6,"end":613.6,"text":"只能吃多少量"},{"start":613.6,"end":615.6,"text":"你只能吞多少東西"},{"start":615.6,"end":617.6,"text":"每一個都很營養沒有錯"},{"start":617.6,"end":619.6,"text":"可是你在短期之內"},{"start":619.6,"end":621.6,"text":"你就是吞不了你就是吃不下"},{"start":622.08,"end":624.08,"text":"所以我們希望在我們"},{"start":624.08,"end":626.08,"text":"所有的預算的運用上面"},{"start":626.08,"end":628.08,"text":"因為這個都是大家"},{"start":628.08,"end":630.08,"text":"的血汗錢"},{"start":630.08,"end":632.08,"text":"大家要怎麼樣去運用這些錢"},{"start":632.08,"end":634.08,"text":"你編了這麼多你根本就"},{"start":634.08,"end":636.08,"text":"沒有辦法執行包括我們的"},{"start":636.08,"end":638.08,"text":"反制無人機的系統"},{"start":638.08,"end":640.08,"text":"已經三年了你連九億"},{"start":640.08,"end":642.08,"text":"多都標不出去你現在"},{"start":642.08,"end":644.08,"text":"又要幾千億幾千億的編"},{"start":644.08,"end":646.08,"text":"我們不知道要如何去"},{"start":646.08,"end":648.08,"text":"驗證這個過去的"},{"start":648.08,"end":650.08,"text":"時機讓我們可以相信"},{"start":650.5600000000001,"end":652.5600000000001,"text":"本席舉這個例子就是說你"},{"start":652.5600000000001,"end":654.5600000000001,"text":"為什麼"},{"start":654.5600000000001,"end":656.5600000000001,"text":"他就是倉促"},{"start":656.5600000000001,"end":658.5600000000001,"text":"提出來的你兩年"},{"start":658.5600000000001,"end":660.5600000000001,"text":"要去蓋這些這幾個東西"},{"start":660.5600000000001,"end":662.5600000000001,"text":"不管是整修案還是"},{"start":662.5600000000001,"end":664.5600000000001,"text":"什麼你過去有很多"},{"start":664.5600000000001,"end":666.5600000000001,"text":"都說要經過很多的驗測"},{"start":666.5600000000001,"end":668.5600000000001,"text":"還有很多的報告一拖"},{"start":668.5600000000001,"end":670.5600000000001,"text":"光是你的"},{"start":670.5600000000001,"end":672.5600000000001,"text":"那個專案設計其實都"},{"start":672.5600000000001,"end":674.5600000000001,"text":"要拖很長的時間所以你"},{"start":674.5600000000001,"end":676.5600000000001,"text":"現在短短六十天要把它做出來"},{"start":676.5600000000001,"end":678.5600000000001,"text":"我覺得非常不可思議"},{"start":678.56,"end":680.56,"text":"所以這個吃金龍花腕"},{"start":680.56,"end":682.56,"text":"這可能會拒絕"},{"start":682.56,"end":684.56,"text":"所以不要只是要錢"},{"start":684.56,"end":686.56,"text":"不要只是說預算要馬上"},{"start":686.56,"end":688.56,"text":"到手先回頭看看"},{"start":688.56,"end":690.56,"text":"過去我們所有的時機"},{"start":690.56,"end":692.56,"text":"我們說三十幾年來"},{"start":692.56,"end":694.56,"text":"我們的無人機不是今天"},{"start":694.56,"end":696.56,"text":"才要做不是今天才要"},{"start":696.56,"end":698.56,"text":"買不是今天才有預算"},{"start":698.56,"end":700.56,"text":"你過去花掉的"},{"start":700.56,"end":702.56,"text":"到底有什麼樣的成果"},{"start":702.56,"end":704.56,"text":"先讓我們所有的國人"},{"start":704.56,"end":706.56,"text":"清楚的看到這樣我們才知道"},{"start":706.56,"end":708.56,"text":"在戰場上它能不能"},{"start":708.56,"end":710.56,"text":"發揮作用所以"},{"start":710.56,"end":712.56,"text":"它不是錢一次到位或者"},{"start":712.56,"end":714.56,"text":"一次要過多少而是"},{"start":714.56,"end":716.56,"text":"先讓大家知道你們要怎麼執行"},{"start":716.56,"end":718.56,"text":"我們現在還擔心的一部分"},{"start":718.56,"end":720.56,"text":"就是我們花了這麼多"},{"start":720.56,"end":722.56,"text":"的錢編了這麼多的預算"},{"start":722.56,"end":724.56,"text":"你的人到底在哪裡"},{"start":724.56,"end":726.56,"text":"因為我們所有的武器裝備我們"},{"start":726.56,"end":728.56,"text":"所有的這些"},{"start":728.56,"end":730.56,"text":"需要你花掉的這些"},{"start":730.56,"end":732.56,"text":"預算它都需要人"},{"start":732.56,"end":734.56,"text":"去執行我們現在最大的"},{"start":734.56,"end":736.56,"text":"問題包括我們的飛行員"},{"start":736.56,"end":738.56,"text":"都不足這是美軍"},{"start":738.56,"end":740.56,"text":"說的所以"},{"start":740.56,"end":742.56,"text":"如果你買了一堆"},{"start":742.56,"end":744.56,"text":"然後我們沒有人應該要怎麼辦"},{"start":744.56,"end":746.56,"text":"這也不是單獨漢光演習"},{"start":746.56,"end":748.56,"text":"的時間而是它現在"},{"start":748.56,"end":750.56,"text":"確實就是存在的"},{"start":750.56,"end":752.56,"text":"問題我們希望大家"},{"start":752.56,"end":754.56,"text":"好好的去釐清這一些以後"},{"start":754.56,"end":756.56,"text":"才來告訴我們的國人"},{"start":756.56,"end":758.56,"text":"當我要花掉你幾千億幾千"},{"start":758.56,"end":760.56,"text":"億的國防預算的時候"},{"start":760.56,"end":762.56,"text":"大家可以給國軍信心"},{"start":762.56,"end":764.56,"text":"因為國軍在過去採購的過程當中"},{"start":764.56,"end":766.56,"text":"也應該要給國人信心"},{"start":766.56,"end":768.56,"text":"不然我們怕"},{"start":768.56,"end":770.56,"text":"買來的東西在戰場上"},{"start":770.56,"end":772.56,"text":"如果不能用"},{"start":772.56,"end":774.56,"text":"或者不好用或者"},{"start":774.56,"end":776.56,"text":"他根本不能打"},{"start":776.56,"end":778.56,"text":"其實這才是最大的問題"},{"start":778.56,"end":780.56,"text":"所以今天我們特別提出來"},{"start":780.56,"end":782.56,"text":"剛剛我提到的這個案子"},{"start":782.56,"end":784.56,"text":"今天沒有很多的時間"},{"start":784.56,"end":786.56,"text":"去說明可是我們請部長"},{"start":786.56,"end":788.56,"text":"還有我們憲兵"},{"start":788.56,"end":790.56,"text":"參謀長就這個部分"},{"start":790.56,"end":792.56,"text":"請問部長要清楚後續的作為"},{"start":792.56,"end":794.56,"text":"還要怎麼去執行"},{"start":794.56,"end":796.56,"text":"請給出一個說明"},{"start":796.56,"end":798.56,"text":"還有詳細的一個"},{"start":798.56,"end":800.56,"text":"後續的作為好不好"},{"start":800.56,"end":802.56,"text":"好"},{"start":802.56,"end":804.56,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":804.56,"end":806.56,"text":"部長要說明嗎"},{"start":806.56,"end":808.56,"text":"好謝謝"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}