{"error":false,"id":["170872"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":170872,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170872","日期":"2026-08-10","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-19-25","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第25次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":25,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[19],"委員會代碼:str":["經濟委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第25次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-08-10T09:52:47+08:00","結束時間":"2026-08-10T10:07:16+08:00","影片長度":"00:14:29","支援功能":["ai-transcript"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/11f3ac9a4aee4d25deeb23567ccd557240bd953ec8f8f090df1af9cfe84b6b7a8d2e5e7e7ae529c45ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"鍾佳濱","委員發言時間":"09:52:47 - 10:07:16","會議時間":"2026-08-10T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期經濟委員會第25次全體委員會議（事由：邀請經濟部部長率台灣糖業股份有限公司董事長、法務部首長、衛生福利部首長及審計部首長就「台灣糖業股份有限公司經營治理及風險控管之檢討—中聯油脂事件、台糖售地案等重大債權追償暨審計部114年度決算審核意見改善情形」進行報告，並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":0.06471875,"end":2.5959687500000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":2.5959687500000004,"end":2.61284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":11.556593750000001,"end":11.978468750000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":12.19784375,"end":13.075343750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":13.125968750000002,"end":16.230968750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":16.63596875,"end":18.289718750000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":18.69471875,"end":20.21346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":20.348468750000002,"end":21.68159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":22.32284375,"end":25.68096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":26.11971875,"end":27.31784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":27.402218750000003,"end":29.562218750000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":28.90409375,"end":28.92096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":30.01784375,"end":37.915343750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":38.252843750000004,"end":38.64096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":39.16409375,"end":39.53534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":40.07534375,"end":41.54346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":42.01596875,"end":44.73284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":45.01971875,"end":46.06596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":46.52159375,"end":47.60159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":50.28471875,"end":52.478468750000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":50.38596875,"end":50.40284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":52.95096875,"end":53.98034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":54.385343750000004,"end":55.34721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":55.90409375,"end":56.98409375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":56.95034375,"end":59.835968750000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":60.30846875,"end":60.96659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":62.24909375,"end":67.24409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":66.80534375,"end":71.02409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":71.15909375000001,"end":73.11659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":73.47096875,"end":74.33159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":74.43284375,"end":76.20471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":75.78284375,"end":77.41971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":77.70659375000001,"end":85.63784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":86.41409375,"end":88.52346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":88.74284375,"end":89.77221875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":89.90721875,"end":91.07159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":91.71284375,"end":93.33284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":93.92346875000001,"end":95.96534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":96.43784375,"end":97.36596875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":98.31096875,"end":98.63159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":99.22221875000001,"end":100.43721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":101.01096875,"end":102.71534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":103.69409375000001,"end":104.70659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":104.94284375000001,"end":106.22534375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":106.61346875000001,"end":108.31784375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":108.90846875000001,"end":109.65096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":110.25846875,"end":110.49471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":111.33846875,"end":112.16534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":112.84034375,"end":113.66721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":113.85284375,"end":116.41784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":117.02534375,"end":119.26971875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":119.64096875000001,"end":120.77159375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":121.44659375,"end":122.30721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":123.08346875000001,"end":125.61471875000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":126.07034375,"end":128.85471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":129.44534375,"end":129.54659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":129.90096875,"end":130.69409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":131.13284375,"end":132.85409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":133.96784375000001,"end":136.11096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":136.19534375,"end":137.44409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":138.38909375,"end":139.82346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":140.16096875,"end":141.22409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":141.84846875,"end":143.55284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":143.92409375,"end":145.00409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":145.47659375,"end":148.32846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":148.53096875,"end":150.84284375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":151.99034375000002,"end":152.73284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":154.20096875000002,"end":154.28534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":154.28534375,"end":154.87596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":154.87596875,"end":159.38159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":157.03596875000002,"end":158.40284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":158.92596875,"end":159.93846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":160.47846875000002,"end":164.15721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":165.16971875000002,"end":167.75159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":167.86971875,"end":169.45596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":169.55721875,"end":175.02471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":175.73346875000001,"end":178.07909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":178.43346875,"end":179.85096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":180.45846875,"end":182.98971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":183.31034375000002,"end":185.99346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":186.58409375000002,"end":187.90034375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":189.35159375,"end":190.00971875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":191.78159375,"end":192.08534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":192.18659375000001,"end":195.08909375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":194.92034375,"end":197.95784375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","start":198.44721875000002,"end":202.53096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":198.48096875000002,"end":199.39221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":202.53096875,"end":203.71221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":204.28596875000002,"end":207.49221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":207.72846875000002,"end":209.58471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":211.05284375000002,"end":214.44471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":214.47846875000002,"end":214.83284375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":214.88346875000002,"end":215.32221875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":215.76096875000002,"end":216.57096875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":217.66784375,"end":219.18659375000001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":220.11471875,"end":220.82346875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":220.97534375,"end":221.86971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":222.24096875,"end":225.31221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":226.29096875000002,"end":227.84346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":228.11346875,"end":232.31534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":232.93971875000003,"end":235.50471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":237.09096875,"end":238.72784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":239.26784375000003,"end":240.02721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":240.29721875,"end":241.68096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":241.95096875000002,"end":243.43596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":243.70596875,"end":246.06846875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":246.59159375000002,"end":247.43534375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":248.16096875000002,"end":250.03409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":250.38846875000002,"end":251.16471875000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":251.26596875,"end":252.21096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":252.76784375000003,"end":254.15159375000002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":254.45534375000003,"end":255.67034375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":256.04159375,"end":256.88534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":257.45909375,"end":259.73721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":260.10846875000004,"end":262.36971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":263.26409375000003,"end":264.02346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":264.88409375000003,"end":265.30596875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":265.37346875000003,"end":266.68971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":268.12409375000004,"end":271.09409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":271.44846875,"end":273.42284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":273.54096875,"end":277.15221875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":277.55721875,"end":279.70034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":281.64096875,"end":282.07971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":282.48471875,"end":282.92346875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":283.34534375000004,"end":285.75846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":285.79221875,"end":287.09159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":287.59784375000004,"end":287.98596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":288.37409375000004,"end":288.96471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":289.28534375000004,"end":290.58471875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":291.36096875000004,"end":291.98534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":292.60971875,"end":294.33096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":295.07346875,"end":297.23346875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":297.41909375,"end":299.00534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":299.57909375,"end":300.47346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":301.03034375000004,"end":302.16096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":302.88659375000003,"end":307.25721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":307.78034375000004,"end":308.75909375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":311.29034375000003,"end":315.42471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":315.12096875000003,"end":322.54596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":315.49221875,"end":315.54284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":321.63471875000005,"end":323.03534375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":323.03534375000004,"end":324.08159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":323.69346875,"end":323.74409375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":324.43596875000003,"end":325.93784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":326.10659375,"end":327.25409375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":327.38909375000003,"end":329.93721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":330.64596875,"end":333.07596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":333.44721875000005,"end":336.46784375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":336.60284375000003,"end":339.26909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":339.64034375,"end":340.68659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":342.13784375,"end":344.61846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":345.69846875,"end":347.25096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":347.75721875000005,"end":350.38971875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":351.16596875000005,"end":352.17846875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":352.48221875,"end":354.50721875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":354.84471875,"end":356.44784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":356.88659375000003,"end":358.03409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":358.37159375000005,"end":361.96596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":362.67471875,"end":364.04159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":364.04159375,"end":364.05846875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":364.42971875,"end":365.96534375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":365.96534375000005,"end":374.82471875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":369.93096875000003,"end":370.52159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":372.93471875,"end":375.12846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":375.53346875,"end":376.30971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":376.79909375,"end":380.07284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":380.73096875000005,"end":382.24971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":384.37596875,"end":385.43909375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":385.74284375,"end":387.09284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":387.56534375,"end":388.71284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":389.62409375000004,"end":390.83909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":391.29471875,"end":392.12159375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":392.59409375,"end":393.70784375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":394.48409375,"end":398.01096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":398.36534375,"end":401.23409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":401.80784375,"end":403.88346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":404.42346875000004,"end":405.90846875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":406.41471875,"end":407.81534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":408.47346875000005,"end":408.77721875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":408.77721875000003,"end":408.79409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":408.87846875,"end":409.24971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":409.62096875000003,"end":410.85284375000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":411.91596875000005,"end":412.87784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":413.31659375000004,"end":414.63284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":414.68346875000003,"end":417.38346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":417.88971875000004,"end":419.83034375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":420.01596875,"end":420.03284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":420.04971875,"end":421.68659375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":422.42909375000005,"end":423.94784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":424.13346875,"end":425.06159375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":425.48346875000004,"end":426.78284375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":426.93471875,"end":427.84596875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":428.35221875,"end":428.99346875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":429.65159375,"end":429.98909375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":430.27596875,"end":431.40659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":431.96346875,"end":433.65096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":434.32596875,"end":437.54909375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":438.57846875,"end":439.75971875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":440.62034375,"end":442.42596875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":442.81409375000004,"end":443.47221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":444.14721875000004,"end":445.14284375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":446.30721875,"end":446.81346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":447.30284375,"end":448.90596875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":449.32784375000006,"end":449.76659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":450.54284375000003,"end":452.07846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":452.38221875000005,"end":454.08659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":454.59284375000004,"end":455.30159375000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":456.70221875000004,"end":458.79471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":461.07284375,"end":461.08971875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":461.08971875000003,"end":461.76471875000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":461.76471875000004,"end":462.79409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":463.06409375000004,"end":465.94971875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":466.43909375000004,"end":467.04659375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":467.29971875,"end":469.20659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":469.37534375,"end":471.09659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":471.46784375000004,"end":472.53096875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":473.03721875,"end":477.84659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":478.18409375000005,"end":479.01096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":479.92221875,"end":479.93909375000004},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":479.93909375000004,"end":495.24471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","start":482.48721875,"end":482.52096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":482.52096875,"end":483.63471875000005},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":492.35909375000006,"end":499.32846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":496.42596875000004,"end":496.89846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":499.58159375,"end":500.98221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":501.38721875000005,"end":503.29409375000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":503.66534375000003,"end":505.77471875000003},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":505.84221875000003,"end":507.02346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":507.49596875000003,"end":508.81221875000006},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":509.31846875,"end":511.46159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":511.91721875,"end":512.84534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":513.2334687499999,"end":514.56659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":514.56659375,"end":514.5834687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":515.22471875,"end":515.96721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":515.96721875,"end":523.54409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":517.46909375,"end":518.51534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":523.5947187500001,"end":524.7590937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":525.3328437499999,"end":526.6997187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":526.8178437500001,"end":535.66034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":531.0703437500001,"end":531.40784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":533.24721875,"end":533.9053437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":534.63096875,"end":539.30534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":539.74409375,"end":541.7690937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":542.35971875,"end":546.44346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":547.0847187500001,"end":548.7553437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":548.9409687500001,"end":550.6284687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":551.8603437500001,"end":552.8559687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":552.9740937500001,"end":555.1172187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":555.4209687499999,"end":556.61909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":557.58096875,"end":559.1840937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":559.7240937500001,"end":560.83784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":561.37784375,"end":563.79096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":564.3815937500001,"end":565.1072187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":565.3603437500001,"end":567.70596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":568.22909375,"end":568.65096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":569.1909687500001,"end":572.61659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":573.2409687500001,"end":575.58659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":576.0759687500001,"end":583.3659687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":583.60221875,"end":586.28534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":586.38659375,"end":587.66909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":588.05721875,"end":589.5590937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":590.04846875,"end":590.45346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":591.3815937500001,"end":594.38534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":594.7397187500001,"end":596.8659687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":597.25409375,"end":598.24971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":599.0090937500001,"end":600.03846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":600.44346875,"end":603.14346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":603.39659375,"end":604.9153437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":605.50596875,"end":606.8390937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":607.1259687500001,"end":608.9484687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":609.5222187500001,"end":611.9522187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":612.44159375,"end":615.3272187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":615.4622187500001,"end":616.32284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":616.77846875,"end":617.21721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":617.6897187500001,"end":618.87096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":619.3603437500001,"end":621.03096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":623.2922187500001,"end":623.98409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":623.98409375,"end":624.0009687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":624.2709687500001,"end":624.94596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":625.36784375,"end":625.9753437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":625.9753437500001,"end":626.21159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":626.4140937500001,"end":626.4309687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":626.4309687500001,"end":626.44784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":626.44784375,"end":630.7847187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":630.97034375,"end":637.01159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":635.77971875,"end":639.30659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":639.5090937500001,"end":641.7703437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":642.64784375,"end":643.5928437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":643.91346875,"end":646.17471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":646.5459687499999,"end":649.43159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":650.41034375,"end":651.96284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":652.63784375,"end":654.91596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":655.43909375,"end":656.2153437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":657.7847187500001,"end":659.69159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":660.5859687500001,"end":663.04971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":663.35346875,"end":665.3615937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":666.44159375,"end":667.57221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":669.0403437500001,"end":669.5972187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":669.8840937500001,"end":673.47846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":673.8159687500001,"end":675.55409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":676.1784687500001,"end":680.1440937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":680.5828437499999,"end":681.07221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":681.49409375,"end":685.7465937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":685.96596875,"end":689.9653437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":690.33659375,"end":692.27721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":692.3615937500001,"end":694.65659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":694.79159375,"end":695.8715937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":696.20909375,"end":696.6140937499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":697.06971875,"end":697.6772187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":697.9640937500001,"end":700.2253437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":700.9509687500001,"end":703.9040937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":703.97159375,"end":704.7478437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":705.8615937500001,"end":706.7053437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":707.5322187500001,"end":710.0634687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":710.55284375,"end":715.49721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":714.0459687500002,"end":718.06221875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":718.3659687500001,"end":719.3953437499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":720.40784375,"end":738.73409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":739.15596875,"end":742.49721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":742.93596875,"end":749.93909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":750.39471875,"end":751.94721875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":752.60534375,"end":754.34346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":754.9172187500001,"end":756.7397187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":757.12784375,"end":758.6128437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":759.1697187500001,"end":760.3172187499999},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":760.7053437500001,"end":762.2578437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":762.59534375,"end":763.05096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":763.6584687500001,"end":764.72159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":765.00846875,"end":765.68346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":766.15596875,"end":766.54409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":766.66221875,"end":768.5522187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":768.82221875,"end":770.6953437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":770.8472187500001,"end":772.70346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":773.17596875,"end":773.8003437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":773.8172187499999,"end":774.4753437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":775.3528437500001,"end":776.1797187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":776.7703437499999,"end":778.79534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":779.2509687500001,"end":781.15784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":781.29284375,"end":782.55846875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":782.84534375,"end":783.38534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":784.0434687500001,"end":785.07284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":786.0009687500001,"end":787.78971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":788.2453437500001,"end":788.9878437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":789.2578437500001,"end":791.68784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":792.26159375,"end":793.42596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":794.38784375,"end":796.64909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":797.0034687500001,"end":798.1172187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":799.43346875,"end":801.42471875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":801.94784375,"end":803.1797187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":803.97284375,"end":804.4284687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":804.7153437500001,"end":806.36909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":806.6728437500001,"end":810.72284375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":810.87471875,"end":812.4778437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":812.96721875,"end":813.7265937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":814.1147187500001,"end":818.58659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":818.83971875,"end":820.0209687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":820.37534375,"end":822.63659375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":822.95721875,"end":824.47596875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":824.79659375,"end":825.8428437500002},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":826.0790937500001,"end":827.6147187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":827.68221875,"end":828.98159375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":829.09971875,"end":830.36534375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":830.50034375,"end":832.0022187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":832.37346875,"end":834.04409375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":834.43221875,"end":834.7865937500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":835.02284375,"end":835.42784375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":835.69784375,"end":838.4653437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":838.80284375,"end":844.9622187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":845.85659375,"end":849.94034375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":850.36221875,"end":851.61096875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":851.91471875,"end":852.0834687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":852.0834687500001,"end":853.9228437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":854.15909375,"end":856.85909375},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":857.0109687500001,"end":859.10346875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":859.1540937500001,"end":862.1072187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":862.4953437500001,"end":864.1997187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":864.55409375,"end":866.0053437500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":866.08971875,"end":866.5959687500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":867.11909375,"end":868.1147187500001},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_03","start":869.46471875,"end":869.86971875},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","start":869.9709687500001,"end":870.9328437500001}],"whisperx":[{"start":0,"end":2.8000000000000003,"text":"我們請宗嘉賓委員諮詢 謝謝"},{"start":11.52,"end":16.44,"text":"主席 在黨委員先進 列席的政府經濟部長官員 會長 公眾夥伴 媒體記者 林先生"},{"start":16.44,"end":27.400000000000002,"text":"有請經濟部 拱部長 法務部 法律司 謝市長 衛武部 江署長 以及審計部的林副審計長"},{"start":27.400000000000002,"end":28.6,"text":"祝我早安"},{"start":28.6,"end":29.6,"text":"請審計部"},{"start":30.1,"end":37.6,"text":"也給主席建議 我們時間尊重主席的控制 但是如果一直跳針 我看我想主席應該適時的來我們調整一下"},{"start":37.6,"end":41.6,"text":"好 來 叫 裝睡的人叫不行啊"},{"start":42.1,"end":47.6,"text":"剛剛有人問部長 蔡市長買菜 我問一下部長 你有沒有收過未超"},{"start":50.3,"end":51.6,"text":"沒有 好像沒有"},{"start":51.6,"end":55.6,"text":"來 副審計長 可能比較有這個經驗 有沒有收過未超"},{"start":55.6,"end":57.6,"text":"我本人是沒有 沒有"},{"start":57.6,"end":61.6,"text":"如果在蔡市長 你覺得有蔡飯收到未超 要不要通報"},{"start":61.6,"end":66.6,"text":"如果是蔡飯 我想他小品記 他拿到一張未超 他一定會去"},{"start":66.6,"end":74.6,"text":"對嘛 還是說如果這個蔡飯說 我收到未超了 下一個顧客不曉得 我把他找回去 你覺得這樣可以嗎"},{"start":74.6,"end":75.6,"text":"我覺得這樣應該不道德 應該不道德"},{"start":75.6,"end":82.6,"text":"不對 不只不道德還違法 未超是通用的法幣 對不對 未超不是通用的法幣"},{"start":82.6,"end":88.6,"text":"所以呢 他如果冒用通用的法幣 知道的人有責任通報 對不對"},{"start":88.6,"end":93.6,"text":"而且也不能把未照法幣的未超繼續流通 對不對"},{"start":93.6,"end":98.6,"text":"好 來 我們向那個謝市長 來"},{"start":98.6,"end":102.6,"text":"那未超有法律規定 那黃金有沒有法律規定"},{"start":102.6,"end":109.6,"text":"黃金的橙色 9999還是9989 法律有沒有規定"},{"start":109.6,"end":116.6,"text":"我去銀樓 假設有人 銀樓說有人拿未超來 通報嘛"},{"start":116.6,"end":122.6,"text":"有人拿黃金來說 我這個要跟你賣給你啦"},{"start":122.6,"end":128.6,"text":"那銀樓說你這個橙色不足啦 我只收橙色組的 9999的"},{"start":128.6,"end":133.6,"text":"銀樓不收 也沒有去通報 你覺得銀樓有沒有責任"},{"start":133.6,"end":136.6,"text":"一般按照我們的工作經驗這邊是沒有責任"},{"start":136.6,"end":141.6,"text":"對嘛 所以出油就是什麼 就是金塊嘛"},{"start":141.6,"end":146.6,"text":"台糖訂了一批出油 橙色不足 要賣給台糖 台糖不收嘛"},{"start":146.6,"end":151.6,"text":"說你可以等他啦 我要的是純9999的啦"},{"start":151.6,"end":154.6,"text":"有沒有違法"},{"start":154.6,"end":158.6,"text":"就沒有通報這件事情是 以銀樓的例子來講是這樣"},{"start":158.6,"end":164.6,"text":"部長知道沒有 白白菜市場買菜 你用未超跟金塊人家就聽懂了啦"},{"start":164.6,"end":169.6,"text":"未超是貿用法定貨幣 食品有食品安全"},{"start":169.6,"end":172.6,"text":"我買了這家的合格食品 我再賣給別人"},{"start":172.6,"end":175.6,"text":"因為我確認他是合格的 我轉賣可以嘛 對不對"},{"start":175.6,"end":180.6,"text":"如果拿到一個不合格的食品 我還轉賣 我就不對嘛 是不是"},{"start":180.6,"end":185.6,"text":"我去進黃金 我去進原料 原料的橙色不合我的要求"},{"start":185.6,"end":189.6,"text":"我不收 有沒有必要回報"},{"start":189.6,"end":191.6,"text":"市長要不要"},{"start":191.6,"end":194.6,"text":"委員這題因為涉及到食安法的解讀"},{"start":194.6,"end":199.6,"text":"我只是問你啊 如果你收到金塊橙色不足你會不會回報 不收就對了嘛"},{"start":199.6,"end":202.6,"text":"如果以一般消費者的角度來講的話 就是拒絕交易"},{"start":202.6,"end":207.6,"text":"對嘛 部長 那台糖拒絕交易 拒絕收那批不合格的出油"},{"start":207.6,"end":210.6,"text":"你覺得台糖有沒有違失"},{"start":210.6,"end":214.6,"text":"他拒絕 這個本來就是他們的SOC"},{"start":214.6,"end":223.6,"text":"但是 所以說 胃超跟金塊 出油跟食品 出油不等於食品啦"},{"start":223.6,"end":227.6,"text":"好 我現在進入正題了 來 我們來看一看 我再問一下"},{"start":227.6,"end":232.6,"text":"剛剛好像那個署長沒有人請教你 署長是科學家 來醫師請教一下"},{"start":232.6,"end":236.6,"text":"太空站的太空人啊 他喝的水是什麼水"},{"start":236.6,"end":238.6,"text":"應該是循環的水"},{"start":238.6,"end":244.6,"text":"太空人 他呼出來的水氣 他的排尿 他的漢液 通通收集起來"},{"start":244.6,"end":247.6,"text":"經過再生後 他就給他喝啊"},{"start":247.6,"end":249.6,"text":"署長 如果你是太空人 你敢喝嗎"},{"start":249.6,"end":250.6,"text":"我會喝"},{"start":250.6,"end":253.6,"text":"你會喝嗎 因為 這個完全處理合格的嘛"},{"start":253.6,"end":256.6,"text":"金塊是你排出來的 你還是敢喝嘛"},{"start":256.6,"end":259.6,"text":"你隔壁的太空人排出來的 你也敢喝嘛"},{"start":259.6,"end":262.6,"text":"對的 經過處理啦 不能直接喝啦"},{"start":262.6,"end":264.6,"text":"好 往下看"},{"start":264.6,"end":267.6,"text":"來 游泳池有沒有訂標準"},{"start":267.6,"end":270.6,"text":"游泳池有規定嘛 生菌數多少嘛 對不對"},{"start":270.6,"end":276.6,"text":"不能要低於500CFU嘛 大腸桿菌你100公戳要少於1CFU嘛"},{"start":276.6,"end":280.6,"text":"如果合乎標準的游泳池 你敢下水嗎"},{"start":280.6,"end":282.6,"text":"敢嘛 對不對"},{"start":282.6,"end":286.6,"text":"除非有小朋友在你旁邊偷偷做什麼不應該做的事嘛 對不對"},{"start":286.6,"end":291.6,"text":"好 但是如果你這樣的馬桶 拿了水"},{"start":291.6,"end":294.6,"text":"它是超過1CPU的"},{"start":294.6,"end":296.6,"text":"結果呢 我幫它稀釋 稀釋掉"},{"start":296.6,"end":300.6,"text":"跟游泳池的標準一樣 有兩杯水"},{"start":300.6,"end":302.6,"text":"一杯是游泳池的"},{"start":302.6,"end":304.6,"text":"一杯是你家馬桶拿出來的"},{"start":304.6,"end":307.6,"text":"但是稀釋之後呢 標準跟游泳池一樣"},{"start":307.6,"end":309.6,"text":"請問你要喝哪一杯"},{"start":310.6,"end":313.6,"text":"因為兩杯都沒有在喝 不會喝游泳池的水"},{"start":313.6,"end":314.6,"text":"除非嗆到才會"},{"start":314.6,"end":317.6,"text":"對啦 你嗆到了 你希望是嗆到游泳池的水"},{"start":317.6,"end":319.6,"text":"還是嗆到那個馬桶裡的水"},{"start":319.6,"end":321.6,"text":"因為不會去馬桶裡面游泳"},{"start":321.6,"end":323.6,"text":"是啦 所以應該在游泳池會嗆到"},{"start":323.6,"end":325.6,"text":"很好 但是呢 在科學上"},{"start":325.6,"end":329.6,"text":"一般人直覺說 如果兩杯水的標準是一模一樣"},{"start":329.6,"end":332.6,"text":"他會覺得在游泳池裡面嗆到水比較安心"},{"start":332.6,"end":335.6,"text":"我告訴他說 我這杯水跟游泳池的品質一樣"},{"start":335.6,"end":338.6,"text":"但是是從你家的馬桶咬出來稀釋過的"},{"start":338.6,"end":340.6,"text":"你覺得他會接受嗎"},{"start":340.6,"end":342.6,"text":"比較困難接受"},{"start":342.6,"end":344.6,"text":"心理上不會接受 很奇怪呢"},{"start":344.6,"end":348.6,"text":"你如果在太空人 你自己的排尿"},{"start":348.6,"end":350.6,"text":"經過處理後的水你都敢喝"},{"start":350.6,"end":353.6,"text":"到游泳池裡面 你不曉得隔壁的小朋友"},{"start":353.6,"end":356.6,"text":"有沒有怎麼樣 你嗆到水你還是無所謂"},{"start":356.6,"end":359.6,"text":"但是如果告訴你 我現在給你喝的這杯水"},{"start":359.6,"end":362.6,"text":"是從你家馬桶撈出來的 稀釋過"},{"start":362.6,"end":366.6,"text":"完全合乎標準 你還是有心理障礙嘛 對不對"},{"start":366.6,"end":370.6,"text":"委員這邊提到的就是在食品安全的安全跟安心這兩個"},{"start":370.6,"end":372.6,"text":"是的 其實要照顧到民眾的心裡面"},{"start":372.6,"end":375.6,"text":"沒有錯 這就是來 我今天要講的"},{"start":375.6,"end":378.6,"text":"今天的板偏皮 這個字呢"},{"start":378.6,"end":380.6,"text":"我現在全國人民都會念了"},{"start":380.6,"end":382.6,"text":"中聯的標準是10ppb"},{"start":384.6,"end":387.6,"text":"中聯有指他去進的黃豆"},{"start":387.6,"end":389.6,"text":"過去都是賣中國的"},{"start":389.6,"end":391.6,"text":"巴西的黃豆"},{"start":391.6,"end":394.6,"text":"它本來的熱損率就比較高"},{"start":394.6,"end":398.6,"text":"所以中聯過去都不是跟 它是跟美國進"},{"start":398.6,"end":401.6,"text":"它現在改跟巴西進 熱損率提高到它照收"},{"start":401.6,"end":404.6,"text":"如果這批黃豆送到中國去"},{"start":404.6,"end":406.6,"text":"出來的是8ppb"},{"start":406.6,"end":408.6,"text":"我們有沒有違反中聯的標準"},{"start":408.6,"end":409.6,"text":"沒有"},{"start":409.6,"end":411.6,"text":"但是它的標準多少"},{"start":411.6,"end":413.6,"text":"2ppb嘛"},{"start":413.6,"end":414.6,"text":"他們是10 我們是2"},{"start":414.6,"end":415.6,"text":"他們是10 我們是2嘛 對不對"},{"start":415.6,"end":417.6,"text":"台灣是2 他們是10嘛"},{"start":417.6,"end":419.6,"text":"所以如果中聯不買美國的黃豆"},{"start":419.6,"end":421.6,"text":"改進巴西的黃豆"},{"start":421.6,"end":424.6,"text":"創造中國去提煉合乎中聯的標準"},{"start":424.6,"end":427.6,"text":"但是呢 到台灣來就超標了嘛"},{"start":427.6,"end":429.6,"text":"是不是這樣子"},{"start":429.6,"end":431.6,"text":"好 那現在大家來談啊"},{"start":431.6,"end":433.6,"text":"20%的標準是怎麼來的"},{"start":433.6,"end":435.6,"text":"今天中流的問題油品"},{"start":435.6,"end":437.6,"text":"它是8.1ppb"},{"start":437.6,"end":439.6,"text":"我是油品加工廠"},{"start":439.6,"end":441.6,"text":"我不曉得這批油有超標"},{"start":441.6,"end":444.6,"text":"我用了 我有沒有可能超標"},{"start":444.6,"end":446.6,"text":"有沒有可能"},{"start":446.6,"end":447.6,"text":"我是夏爾的食品加工廠"},{"start":447.6,"end":448.6,"text":"會不會有可能"},{"start":448.6,"end":449.6,"text":"有嘛"},{"start":449.6,"end":451.6,"text":"那如果我經過西市"},{"start":451.6,"end":455.6,"text":"我沒有全部用 我只用兩成"},{"start":455.6,"end":459.6,"text":"8.1ppb的兩成是多少"},{"start":459.6,"end":461.6,"text":"1.6左右"},{"start":461.6,"end":462.6,"text":"就是西市了嘛"},{"start":462.6,"end":465.6,"text":"我沒有用 我沒有全部都用中聯的油脂"},{"start":465.6,"end":466.6,"text":"我只用兩成"},{"start":466.6,"end":470.6,"text":"結果呢 它從8.1ppb變成了1.6ppb"},{"start":470.6,"end":472.6,"text":"請問站在食安法"},{"start":472.6,"end":474.6,"text":"我是食品夏爾的加工廠"},{"start":474.6,"end":477.6,"text":"我的油是1.6本便比 1.6ppb"},{"start":477.6,"end":478.6,"text":"有沒有超標"},{"start":478.6,"end":482.6,"text":"報告委員 這個部分是符合衛生安全標準"},{"start":482.6,"end":483.6,"text":"是的嘛"},{"start":483.6,"end":485.6,"text":"回到7月4號做這個決議的時候"},{"start":485.6,"end":486.6,"text":"只有一批"},{"start":486.6,"end":489.6,"text":"也不知道這些廠商是這麼遏制的"},{"start":489.6,"end":491.6,"text":"去延遲通報 隱匿通報"},{"start":491.6,"end":492.6,"text":"我現在沒有問題"},{"start":492.6,"end":494.6,"text":"所以這個沒有西市的問題"},{"start":494.6,"end":495.6,"text":"我只是個不知情的食品加工廠"},{"start":495.6,"end":498.6,"text":"我進了一批有問題的油 超標"},{"start":498.6,"end":500.6,"text":"結果我在製程當中"},{"start":500.6,"end":502.6,"text":"我因為很多家一起用嘛"},{"start":502.6,"end":505.6,"text":"所以我這一家有問題的油用不到兩成"},{"start":505.6,"end":506.6,"text":"所以我的製程品"},{"start":506.6,"end":511.6,"text":"它只有合乎小於2ppb的1.6ppb"},{"start":511.6,"end":512.6,"text":"那食安法"},{"start":512.6,"end":514.6,"text":"它算不算一個合格的產品"},{"start":514.6,"end":516.6,"text":"報告委員 它是合格的"},{"start":516.6,"end":517.6,"text":"它是合格的嘛"},{"start":517.6,"end":520.6,"text":"這個階段其實我們的想法做法"},{"start":520.6,"end":522.6,"text":"跟韓國 歐盟一致的"},{"start":522.6,"end":525.6,"text":"對於這種的比較濃度會下降"},{"start":525.6,"end":528.6,"text":"理論上是如果知道它是惡性的"},{"start":528.6,"end":530.6,"text":"是不可以西市的"},{"start":530.6,"end":531.6,"text":"但是我們是不知道的"},{"start":531.6,"end":533.6,"text":"所以訂出這樣標準的情形"},{"start":533.6,"end":534.6,"text":"是有太多嫌疑的"},{"start":534.6,"end":536.6,"text":"就像說 如果我是太空人"},{"start":536.6,"end":537.6,"text":"我知道我喝的水"},{"start":537.6,"end":540.6,"text":"是從我的尿液重新提煉全文化給我喝的"},{"start":540.6,"end":541.6,"text":"我敢喝"},{"start":541.6,"end":543.6,"text":"今天我去游泳池"},{"start":543.6,"end":545.6,"text":"我知道游泳池檢驗過了合格"},{"start":545.6,"end":546.6,"text":"我敢下水"},{"start":546.6,"end":548.6,"text":"但是就算你拿一杯水給我"},{"start":548.6,"end":550.6,"text":"它完全跟游泳池錘一模一樣"},{"start":551.6,"end":552.6,"text":"但是你告訴我說"},{"start":552.6,"end":554.6,"text":"這時候從我家馬桶裡面來稀釋過的"},{"start":554.6,"end":556.6,"text":"我就不敢喝嘛"},{"start":557.6,"end":559.6,"text":"完全合乎科學標準"},{"start":559.6,"end":560.6,"text":"完全合乎食安"},{"start":560.6,"end":563.6,"text":"但是不符合我們心理的安心嘛"},{"start":563.6,"end":564.6,"text":"所以後來"},{"start":564.6,"end":566.6,"text":"後來為什麼我們還是覺得"},{"start":566.6,"end":567.6,"text":"要讓它下降"},{"start":567.6,"end":568.6,"text":"對不對"},{"start":568.6,"end":569.6,"text":"是這樣嘛"},{"start":569.6,"end":570.6,"text":"是的"},{"start":570.6,"end":572.6,"text":"所以當時是根據科學證據來的嘛"},{"start":572.6,"end":575.6,"text":"不要盡快為超傻傻分不清"},{"start":575.6,"end":577.6,"text":"不要把下游的加工廠"},{"start":577.6,"end":580.6,"text":"它完全符合食安標準的法規的產品"},{"start":580.6,"end":581.6,"text":"硬要人家下架"},{"start":581.6,"end":582.6,"text":"它是合法的"},{"start":582.6,"end":585.6,"text":"但是基於消費者的心理的感受"},{"start":585.6,"end":587.6,"text":"明明可以喝的"},{"start":587.6,"end":589.6,"text":"太空人敢喝的自己的水"},{"start":589.6,"end":591.6,"text":"我們到了我們台灣"},{"start":591.6,"end":592.6,"text":"到我們的地面"},{"start":592.6,"end":593.6,"text":"到我們的地球"},{"start":593.6,"end":595.6,"text":"只要這杯水完全合標"},{"start":595.6,"end":597.6,"text":"我告訴你跟你家馬桶舀出來的"},{"start":597.6,"end":599.6,"text":"你碰都不敢碰啦"},{"start":599.6,"end":601.6,"text":"這就是消費者心理的要求"},{"start":601.6,"end":602.6,"text":"好往下看"},{"start":602.6,"end":604.6,"text":"所以我們現在看到這個問題了"},{"start":604.6,"end":606.6,"text":"如果是這樣子的話"},{"start":606.6,"end":608.6,"text":"這些下游的食品廠是不是無辜的"},{"start":608.6,"end":609.6,"text":"我進了游"},{"start":609.6,"end":611.6,"text":"我以為它是合標的"},{"start":611.6,"end":613.6,"text":"我生產完了"},{"start":613.6,"end":614.6,"text":"我要出廠前"},{"start":614.6,"end":615.6,"text":"我驗了"},{"start":615.6,"end":616.6,"text":"也是合標的"},{"start":616.6,"end":617.6,"text":"請問"},{"start":617.6,"end":618.6,"text":"為什麼政府要叫我下架"},{"start":618.6,"end":620.6,"text":"我下架後的損失誰來補償我"},{"start":622.6,"end":623.6,"text":"部長"},{"start":623.6,"end":624.6,"text":"你們怎麼做"},{"start":624.6,"end":625.6,"text":"是不是修食安法"},{"start":625.6,"end":627.6,"text":"針對食安法"},{"start":627.6,"end":629.6,"text":"面對我們配合"},{"start":629.6,"end":633.6,"text":"所謂的預防性下架的業者"},{"start":633.6,"end":634.6,"text":"我們目前積極在修法"},{"start":635.6,"end":637.6,"text":"就是你們現在情深院版的"},{"start":637.6,"end":639.6,"text":"增列第二條第五款對不對"},{"start":639.6,"end":642.6,"text":"可是我們的食安基金目前只有10億"},{"start":642.6,"end":643.6,"text":"我們的食品業"},{"start":643.6,"end":645.6,"text":"佔我們國家的產值多少"},{"start":645.6,"end":646.6,"text":"部長你知道嗎"},{"start":646.6,"end":648.6,"text":"我們國家的食品加工業者"},{"start":648.6,"end":650.6,"text":"我們有多少"},{"start":650.6,"end":652.6,"text":"是一個百億還是一個千億"},{"start":652.6,"end":654.6,"text":"部長你估一下大概是多少"},{"start":654.6,"end":655.6,"text":"食品加工業"},{"start":655.6,"end":656.6,"text":"它的產值"},{"start":656.6,"end":658.6,"text":"應該有好幾百億"},{"start":658.6,"end":660.6,"text":"應該上千億"},{"start":660.6,"end":663.6,"text":"那上千億如果按照這個方式下架的話"},{"start":663.6,"end":665.6,"text":"就損的風險有沒有可能超過10億"},{"start":665.6,"end":667.6,"text":"那食安基金夠嗎"},{"start":667.6,"end":669.6,"text":"不夠"},{"start":669.6,"end":671.6,"text":"好所以來部長你現在仔細聽"},{"start":671.6,"end":673.6,"text":"來我的修法"},{"start":673.6,"end":675.6,"text":"我在7月14號我就問了"},{"start":675.6,"end":677.6,"text":"我說可不可以請經濟部研擬"},{"start":677.6,"end":679.6,"text":"食品產銷風險管理基金"},{"start":679.6,"end":681.6,"text":"為什麼"},{"start":681.6,"end":683.6,"text":"這些不知情的並沒有違法的業者"},{"start":683.6,"end":685.6,"text":"因為剛剛那樣的心理因素"},{"start":685.6,"end":687.6,"text":"可能政府要求他配合"},{"start":687.6,"end":689.6,"text":"把他合格的食品下架"},{"start":689.6,"end":691.6,"text":"這樣的一個經濟損失"},{"start":691.6,"end":693.6,"text":"我們弄一個風險管理基金"},{"start":693.6,"end":695.6,"text":"來處理"},{"start":695.6,"end":697.6,"text":"部長那個時候"},{"start":697.6,"end":699.6,"text":"是次長在陪"},{"start":699.6,"end":701.6,"text":"那時候你出國嘛"},{"start":701.6,"end":703.6,"text":"院長說這個可以來研究一下"},{"start":703.6,"end":705.6,"text":"部長研究了沒有"},{"start":705.6,"end":707.6,"text":"部長有沒有研究"},{"start":707.6,"end":709.6,"text":"食品產銷風險管理基金"},{"start":709.6,"end":711.6,"text":"有沒有研究"},{"start":711.6,"end":713.6,"text":"對但是我個人來講是還滿贊成這樣的"},{"start":713.6,"end":715.6,"text":"很好謝謝這句話就夠了"},{"start":715.6,"end":717.6,"text":"你很贊成因為我給你一個機會"},{"start":717.6,"end":719.6,"text":"來接下來本席的版本"},{"start":719.6,"end":721.6,"text":"我就這次"},{"start":721.6,"end":723.6,"text":"從行政院版當中"},{"start":723.6,"end":725.6,"text":"我就寫為確保違規食品"},{"start":725.6,"end":727.6,"text":"業者依指揮中心指示或中央"},{"start":727.6,"end":729.6,"text":"主管機關依第四條第五項"},{"start":729.6,"end":731.6,"text":"就是要求下架的公告辦理"},{"start":731.6,"end":733.6,"text":"得設立食品產銷風險"},{"start":733.6,"end":735.6,"text":"管理基金秉持著"},{"start":735.6,"end":737.6,"text":"同一個互助的原則"},{"start":737.6,"end":739.6,"text":"給予必要的補助"},{"start":739.6,"end":741.6,"text":"得委託其他機關"},{"start":741.6,"end":743.6,"text":"法人或團體辦理"},{"start":743.6,"end":745.6,"text":"前項基金依個別食品原料"},{"start":745.6,"end":747.6,"text":"業者的銷售金額付別列帳"},{"start":747.6,"end":749.6,"text":"你市占率越高的你就繳越多"},{"start":749.6,"end":751.6,"text":"那費率怎麼算"},{"start":751.6,"end":753.6,"text":"這個是有類似的"},{"start":753.6,"end":755.6,"text":"我們的汽車"},{"start":755.6,"end":757.6,"text":"強制責任險有一個特別"},{"start":757.6,"end":759.6,"text":"補償基金"},{"start":759.6,"end":761.6,"text":"強保險很重要"},{"start":761.6,"end":763.6,"text":"強保險我今天問一下車撞了"},{"start":763.6,"end":765.6,"text":"萬一他是一個無照的"},{"start":765.6,"end":767.6,"text":"他是一個沒有經濟能力的"},{"start":767.6,"end":769.6,"text":"我不要撞我倒楣"},{"start":769.6,"end":771.6,"text":"好在有汽車強制責任險"},{"start":771.6,"end":773.6,"text":"我被撞了我可以跟誰求償"},{"start":773.6,"end":775.6,"text":"我可以跟我們的"},{"start":775.6,"end":777.6,"text":"那香保基金誰出"},{"start":777.6,"end":779.6,"text":"我用保險"},{"start":779.6,"end":781.6,"text":"但是我們在其他的地方"},{"start":781.6,"end":783.6,"text":"有同業來做"},{"start":783.6,"end":785.6,"text":"叫什麼平保協會"},{"start":785.6,"end":787.6,"text":"我們的旅遊品質保險"},{"start":787.6,"end":789.6,"text":"一個基金"},{"start":789.6,"end":791.6,"text":"萬一我的旅營倒了我在國外回不來"},{"start":791.6,"end":793.6,"text":"飯店上面有結"},{"start":793.6,"end":795.6,"text":"就會從同業的"},{"start":795.6,"end":797.6,"text":"這個基金幫我把旅館錢"},{"start":797.6,"end":799.6,"text":"巧了我可以回國來"},{"start":799.6,"end":801.6,"text":"部長有沒有聽過"},{"start":801.6,"end":803.6,"text":"這樣的機制"},{"start":803.6,"end":805.6,"text":"有嗎"},{"start":805.6,"end":807.6,"text":"第一項基金的來源"},{"start":807.6,"end":809.6,"text":"包括食品原料業者依前項角度"},{"start":809.6,"end":811.6,"text":"的費用及資息收入及起步"},{"start":811.6,"end":813.6,"text":"的支出餘額"},{"start":813.6,"end":815.6,"text":"這些就是讓食品業者"},{"start":815.6,"end":817.6,"text":"他們透過自己"},{"start":817.6,"end":819.6,"text":"供基金的方式遇到有"},{"start":819.6,"end":821.6,"text":"同業老鼠屎"},{"start":821.6,"end":823.6,"text":"壞了一鍋粥的時候"},{"start":823.6,"end":825.6,"text":"同業至少可以怎麼樣透過這個"},{"start":825.6,"end":827.6,"text":"基金把守法的業者"},{"start":827.6,"end":829.6,"text":"因為這樣的一個不必要"},{"start":829.6,"end":831.6,"text":"的損失得以救濟得以"},{"start":831.6,"end":833.6,"text":"補償"},{"start":833.6,"end":835.6,"text":"部長是不是支持這樣的構想"},{"start":835.6,"end":837.6,"text":"所以後面我就不再講了"},{"start":837.6,"end":839.6,"text":"我們看結論往下看"},{"start":839.6,"end":841.6,"text":"所以請經濟部協助業者"},{"start":841.6,"end":843.6,"text":"成立食品產銷風險管理基金的肯行性"},{"start":843.6,"end":845.6,"text":"並提出順便報告好不好"},{"start":845.6,"end":847.6,"text":"所以以後"},{"start":847.6,"end":849.6,"text":"去市場講買位"},{"start":849.6,"end":851.6,"text":"不能用位抄"},{"start":851.6,"end":853.6,"text":"不要講買刀攤拆業"},{"start":853.6,"end":855.6,"text":"那至於處長你要說的就是說"},{"start":855.6,"end":857.6,"text":"為什麼20%那時候你們認為"},{"start":857.6,"end":859.6,"text":"原料有占不到20%就不用下架"},{"start":859.6,"end":861.6,"text":"法規的標準科學正確一模一樣"},{"start":861.6,"end":863.6,"text":"但是為什麼後來你們改變了"},{"start":863.6,"end":865.6,"text":"因為民眾心不安"},{"start":865.6,"end":867.6,"text":"好不好"},{"start":867.6,"end":869.6,"text":"謝謝部長謝謝署長"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}