{"error":false,"id":["170932"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":170932,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/170932","日期":"2026-08-12","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"委員會-11-5-15-23","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期內政委員會第23次全體委員會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":23,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"委員會","委員會代碼":[15],"委員會代碼:str":["內政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期內政委員會第23次全體委員會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-08-12T09:57:40+08:00","結束時間":"2026-08-12T10:05:47+08:00","影片長度":"00:08:07","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/628bd009efdbf44b6764b965f6ac4ca92dd155ae7acf52ac73231451c13a983d3a4d20856f634afc5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"廖先翔","委員發言時間":"09:57:40 - 10:05:47","會議時間":"2026-08-12T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期內政委員會第23次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請內政部部長、國土管理署署長、財政部、金融監督管理委員會、中央銀行就「高房價環境下青年安心成家購屋優惠貸款3.0政策檢討：青年購屋門檻、首購資格認定、年齡限制、申貸年齡與核貸年限總合限制及政策上路對於落實居住正義、健全房市政策與配套措施」進行專題報告並備質詢。二、邀請內政部部長、國土管理署署長就「落實居住正義之困境與對策：十三萬戶社宅興辦檢討、都更社宅容獎制度失靈，暨行政院租賃市場修法三大方向(保障租期、限制漲幅、強化權益)之執行進度」進行專題報告並備質詢。）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":5.228468750000001,"end":6.66284375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":11.37096875,"end":12.214718750000003,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":12.501593750000001,"end":20.28096875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":20.70284375,"end":24.85409375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":25.49534375,"end":42.471593750000004,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":30.456593750000003,"end":30.50721875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":30.69284375,"end":31.58721875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":43.46721875,"end":61.77659375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":58.62096875,"end":68.10471875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":66.43409375,"end":69.13409375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":69.13409375,"end":76.71096875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":77.16659375,"end":78.98909375000001,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":79.41096875000001,"end":94.68284375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":94.95284375,"end":98.27721875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":98.91846875,"end":100.42034375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":101.39909375,"end":124.53471875000001,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":124.61909375,"end":129.79971875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":131.45346875,"end":131.92596875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":131.92596875,"end":133.39409375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":135.01409375,"end":135.67221875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":136.87034375000002,"end":139.09784375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":138.06846875000002,"end":138.08534375000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":138.15284375000002,"end":138.20346875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":138.27096875,"end":138.28784375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":139.35096875000002,"end":139.36784375000002,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":139.36784375000002,"end":139.60409375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":139.60409375,"end":139.68846875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":139.68846875,"end":139.70534375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":140.16096875,"end":144.14346875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":145.05471875,"end":150.03284375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":150.03284375,"end":151.02846875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":150.16784375,"end":150.89346875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":151.70346875,"end":155.11221875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":155.46659375000002,"end":156.91784375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":157.47471875000002,"end":158.75721875000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":158.97659375,"end":160.05659375000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":162.85784375,"end":163.29659375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":163.65096875,"end":166.04721875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":166.16534375,"end":169.28721875000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":166.97534375,"end":167.05971875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":167.07659375,"end":168.44346875000002,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":169.28721875000002,"end":169.32096875000002,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":169.32096875000002,"end":172.83096875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":169.38846875000002,"end":169.47284375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":173.37096875,"end":178.99034375000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":179.15909375,"end":179.47971875000002,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":179.73284375,"end":188.03534375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":188.13659375,"end":201.09659375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":201.36659375000002,"end":223.94534375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":224.53596875000002,"end":243.75659375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":243.87471875000003,"end":246.10221875000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":246.50721875000002,"end":247.41846875000002,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":247.80659375000002,"end":252.64971875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":252.95346875,"end":259.06221875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":259.23096875000005,"end":263.23034375000003,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":264.02346875,"end":264.29346875000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":264.54659375,"end":274.97534375000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":275.44784375,"end":276.56159375000004,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":276.76409375000003,"end":296.15346875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":287.91846875000005,"end":289.47096875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":296.33909375,"end":301.26659375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":301.46909375,"end":304.23659375,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":304.47284375000004,"end":311.15534375000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":311.79659375,"end":312.50534375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":313.60221875,"end":317.71971875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":317.92221875,"end":327.67596875000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":328.14846875,"end":329.97096875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":329.97096875,"end":339.50534375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":337.53096875,"end":338.29034375000003,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":339.04971875,"end":341.53034375000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":341.73284375000003,"end":346.20471875000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":346.33971875000003,"end":347.23409375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":347.57159375000003,"end":359.75534375,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":359.41784375000003,"end":365.86409375000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":366.01596875,"end":367.16346875000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":367.45034375,"end":373.74471875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":374.30159375000005,"end":379.24596875000003,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":379.43159375000005,"end":381.25409375000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":381.37221875,"end":402.51659375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":402.51659375,"end":407.29221875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":407.44409375000004,"end":411.46034375000005,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":410.56596875,"end":410.83596875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":411.46034375000005,"end":414.86909375000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"蔡署長長展","start":411.49409375000005,"end":411.61221875,"speaker_score":0.946},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":415.29096875000005,"end":417.45096875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":417.75471875000005,"end":419.61096875000004,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":419.71221875000003,"end":421.70346875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":422.04096875000005,"end":422.78346875000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":422.93534375,"end":424.01534375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":424.25159375000004,"end":430.29284375000003,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":430.34346875,"end":435.15284375000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":435.74346875000003,"end":440.46846875000006,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":440.70471875000004,"end":443.21909375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":446.13846875,"end":456.63471875000005,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":455.95971875000004,"end":457.47846875000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":457.15784375000004,"end":461.59596875000005,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":461.73096875000005,"end":462.89534375000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":464.24534375,"end":465.22409375,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":465.64596875,"end":465.94971875000005,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":466.21971875,"end":472.42971875,"speaker_score":0.947},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":471.33284375000005,"end":478.03221875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"廖委員先翔","start":478.40346875000006,"end":481.74471875,"speaker_score":0.975},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"劉部長世芳","start":483.82034375,"end":486.70596875,"speaker_score":0.947}],"whisperx":[{"start":0,"end":7,"text":"主席 請我們劉部長"},{"start":7,"end":12,"text":"周圍好"},{"start":12,"end":18,"text":"部長早安 這前一陣子媒體受訪 有一段話 它當然媒體在濃縮成這一句"},{"start":18,"end":25,"text":"就是找到空地就蓋 恐成空魚塢 大家有這樣子的一個言論發表沒錯嗎"},{"start":25,"end":30,"text":"我想不是這個意思 我覺得這個是有點掐頭掐尾"},{"start":30,"end":35,"text":"我的意思就是說 我們曾經在好多次的這個住宅的公聽會裡面有提到"},{"start":35,"end":42,"text":"目前對於社會住宅需求比較大的會集中在北北桃中這幾個土地稀缺的地方"},{"start":42,"end":48,"text":"那因為在蔡總統的任內 全台灣的22個縣市都已經蓋了這個社會住宅"},{"start":48,"end":52,"text":"那如果我們再繼續在比較偏鄉的地區 因為偏鄉地區要取得土地"},{"start":52,"end":57,"text":"或者變更成住宅用地比較方便 那你蓋了以後恐怕會變成另外一種"},{"start":57,"end":62,"text":"有可能造成沒有辦法完成社會住宅的主要用地"},{"start":62,"end":67,"text":"它不只是一個數量 它還考慮到了它的地點或其他的一些因素 需求"},{"start":67,"end":73,"text":"尤其是青年的部分 那我之前跟您討論一下 我選區的案子可能您印象也非常的深"},{"start":73,"end":78,"text":"就是汐止的白袍湖的社宅案 您應該有印象嘛"},{"start":78,"end":84,"text":"那在去年度的預算的時候 那我有針對連外道路去做一些刪減"},{"start":84,"end":89,"text":"那後來在追加預算的時候 我們內政部也把它包裹回去了"},{"start":89,"end":95,"text":"那也同意了 所以預算算是如數的交給內政部了"},{"start":95,"end":101,"text":"那但是這個案子它目前後來的一個狀況 是不是有取消的情形"},{"start":101,"end":108,"text":"報告委員 目前跟委員報告一下 114年度 就是上年度"},{"start":108,"end":112,"text":"預算在立法院刪減是0.21億元"},{"start":112,"end":118,"text":"然後115年度的話 我們在審查的時候就全數刪減2.47億元"},{"start":118,"end":124,"text":"所以現在這個計畫比較沒有辦法順利推動 那116年度我們也沒有把它編列進去"},{"start":124,"end":130,"text":"就是說在去年度刪減之後 那是不是有追加預算回來"},{"start":131,"end":135,"text":"沒有 沒有嗎 沒有 你們包進去了吧 沒有"},{"start":135,"end":140,"text":"你們包進去了 包到追加預算 這是一個公建計畫 是的"},{"start":140,"end":145,"text":"那我請我們的 我們請那個同仁跟您回應一下 好嗎 來"},{"start":145,"end":150,"text":"跟委員報告 這個部分 我們到國發會那邊沒有同意 所以沒有包進去"},{"start":150,"end":155,"text":"所以國發會沒有同意 好 所以你們有提 但是不是立法院組黨 是國發會沒有同意"},{"start":155,"end":160,"text":"那因此目前這個案子 你們目前有要取消興建嗎"},{"start":163,"end":166,"text":"跟委員報告 我們目前是取消興建"},{"start":166,"end":169,"text":"你們目前是取消興建 那目前的程序 報到行政院 報到行政院"},{"start":169,"end":177,"text":"也就是說我們內政部的程序已經走完了 我們決定在這個個案去取消興建設法一個計畫"},{"start":177,"end":180,"text":"那目前等待行政院核定 對"},{"start":180,"end":185,"text":"那我當然不是要批評這件事情 因為當初我有針對社宅 我就有立場 我就有我的立場"},{"start":185,"end":192,"text":"社宅不是只有追求數量 而是它的一個地點 或者是說它有一些設置的一些學理在"},{"start":192,"end":197,"text":"並不是說找到空地就蓋 如果說找到空地就蓋 那你要100萬戶社宅"},{"start":197,"end":203,"text":"那我想隨便一個人也都能夠蓋 那我想我今天這個 這個啦 我就自己做個計畫啦"},{"start":203,"end":209,"text":"畢竟可能當時候有對我許多的一些批評 或許我的講話的藝術沒有不長那麼高"},{"start":209,"end":214,"text":"沒有不長那麼高 類似的話 從部長講出來可能就沒人批評 或講出來的部分"},{"start":214,"end":221,"text":"那就指教的意見就比較多啦 那另外一個 同時我在同時間 我爭取另外一個社宅的計畫"},{"start":221,"end":229,"text":"在汐止的寶藏跟營區 那目前新北市政府之前就有提出都市計畫的變更"},{"start":229,"end":234,"text":"我支持這個案子的原因是因為它已經融入既有的一個生活圈跟市區"},{"start":234,"end":241,"text":"旁邊也是基隆捷運的預定地 它離現有的基隆無度火車站也是非常近的距離"},{"start":241,"end":249,"text":"它是一個很好的一個社宅地點 如同部長剛剛講的 它蓋好之後需求會非常的高"},{"start":249,"end":255,"text":"因為它的交通便利 那生活機能也非常的好 那我想確認一下 目前這個案子"},{"start":255,"end":261,"text":"就我的了解 應該是新北市政府正在進行都市計畫的一個變更 那也之前有送到內政部審議過啦"},{"start":261,"end":268,"text":"那可能針對一些國土署有一些意見 退回到地方 那目前地方應該也準備要再送回來了"},{"start":268,"end":275,"text":"那我想請問一下我們現在內政部或者是國土署或是住住中心對於這一塊地新建社宅的一個態度"},{"start":275,"end":283,"text":"報告委員 這塊地既然這個新北市政府有按照相關的都市計畫在進行 我們當然會來審議"},{"start":283,"end":289,"text":"那這個部分如果委員所指的是指這個寶藏坑營區 是的 營區國防部的那塊地"},{"start":289,"end":296,"text":"是 那如果你指的是寶藏坑營區的話呢 在115年6月18號的時候 新北市的都委會"},{"start":296,"end":304,"text":"有185次的會議決議通過 那現在由新北市政府在辦理補辦的公開展覽程序當中"},{"start":304,"end":310,"text":"是 那當然都市計畫的程序照走 但是這一塊地的條件 我想先請教我們內政部或相關單位"},{"start":310,"end":316,"text":"是不是支持的 是支持的嘛 那相關的前置作業是不是可以先行過"},{"start":316,"end":320,"text":"因為如果說都市計畫程序 我想我們這邊不討論太細啦 但是之前的一些問題"},{"start":320,"end":328,"text":"新北市政府應該都有依照國土署的意見 去針對林地一些破碎的機關用地去取得同意書了"},{"start":328,"end":333,"text":"那是不是前置作業可以先做 跟委員報告 我們其實每個地方政府報告的一些案件"},{"start":333,"end":338,"text":"我們都有一個城鄉分組在做專業評估 那這個確實這個案子是可行的 是可行的嘛"},{"start":338,"end":345,"text":"對 所以之前應該 剛剛請教的就是前置作業 能不能開始就開始做基地的一些規劃跟設計的"},{"start":345,"end":347,"text":"把這個分頭並行啦"},{"start":347,"end":355,"text":"這個還是要有它固定的程序啦 我們前面只是說確定可行 所以市政府它現在在做用地變更的程序"},{"start":355,"end":359,"text":"那後續我們會送來以後我們會加速 我們會加速來辦"},{"start":359,"end":365,"text":"我還是希望你們可以這個平行啦 就是很多事情在都市計畫的變更 土地的取得等等的"},{"start":365,"end":372,"text":"很多政府為了加快工程的進度都會分頭進行 譬如說綜合計畫報告 環評大家分步進行嘛"},{"start":372,"end":377,"text":"一樣我們都市計畫變更跟土地的設計 或許沒辦法做到細部設計"},{"start":377,"end":384,"text":"但是你一定是可以做一些比較大範圍的一些比較籠統的一些規劃等等"},{"start":384,"end":390,"text":"我會希望我們單位可以先來做一些評估啦 那加速 包括未來剛剛講的你們說"},{"start":390,"end":395,"text":"或許你剛剛講的三年後 我也說你們現在定案的就一千戶"},{"start":395,"end":399,"text":"說不定你現在趕快規劃 你就放到後年後 那這個數字就上來了"},{"start":399,"end":402,"text":"或許它就可以馬上呈現在數字上那面了嘛"},{"start":402,"end":407,"text":"對 跟我們報告其實這個東西就是未來我們跟地方政府確認完以後會再增加的"},{"start":407,"end":411,"text":"那前次座位的很多工作我們都已經做完了 這個案子"},{"start":411,"end":415,"text":"好 那所以我今天就最後一點時間再跟你們做確認"},{"start":415,"end":424,"text":"有關係的這兩個涉責案 白袍湖涉宅的一個興建 是我們這個內政部主動喊停的"},{"start":424,"end":430,"text":"那另外一個 包括內政部國發會不支持 所以沒有辦法繼續進行下去"},{"start":430,"end":435,"text":"那另外這個保償跟營區這個社會住宅 內政部是支持的會繼續進行下去"},{"start":435,"end":440,"text":"報告 昭偉 我想有關白袍湖的部分是我們沒有預算 不是我們主動喊停"},{"start":440,"end":443,"text":"所以是立法院不支持還是國發會不支持"},{"start":446,"end":453,"text":"從立法院在114年開始刪減這個0.21億開始 那這個當然是進入我們國發會的審查程序"},{"start":453,"end":456,"text":"一開始的時候如果立法院就刪除了"},{"start":456,"end":457,"text":"所以國發會不支持嗎 對不對"},{"start":457,"end":461,"text":"到目前為止 115年的年度預算的公建計畫裡面也沒有在裡面"},{"start":461,"end":466,"text":"所以就是國發會沒有支持嘛 對不對"},{"start":466,"end":472,"text":"報告委員 我想是這樣子 我們如果沒有預算 我們怎麼去開發任何運動休閒園區或是社會住宅"},{"start":472,"end":476,"text":"好啦 這案子沒關係 到這程序走完了之後 你們現在既然已經報行政院了"},{"start":476,"end":482,"text":"那後續有相關的確定了之後 再麻煩回覆相關資料 以上 謝謝"},{"start":483,"end":487,"text":"好 謝謝廖先生委員的指示"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:57:40+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:57:46.125000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席，麻煩請劉部長。","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T09:57:50.333333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:57:50.333333+08:00","text":"召委好。","quality":0.333},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:57:52+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:57:52.620690+08:00","text":"部長早安。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:57:53.034483+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:58:04.517241+08:00","text":"前一陣子您接受媒體訪問，有一段話媒體濃縮成這一句：「找到空地就蓋恐成空餘屋」，有這樣的言論發表，沒錯嘛？","quality":0.844},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T09:58:05+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:58:09.750000+08:00","text":"我想不是這個意思，我覺得這有點掐頭掐尾。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:58:09.750000+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-08-12T09:58:10.750000+08:00","text":"沒關係，你補充說明一下。","quality":0},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T09:58:10+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:58:41.250000+08:00","text":"我的意思是，我們曾經在好多次的住宅公聽會裡面有提到，目前對於社會住宅需求比較大的會集中在北北桃中這幾個土地稀缺的地方，因為在蔡總統的任內，全臺灣22個縣市都已經蓋了社會住宅，如果我們繼續在比較偏鄉的地區，因為偏鄉地區要取得土地或者變更成住宅用地比較方便，蓋了以後，恐怕有可能會沒有辦法達成作為社會住宅的主要目的。","quality":0.959},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:58:42+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:58:46.464286+08:00","text":"所以社會住宅有一個很重要的點，就是它不只是數量，還要考慮到地點或其他的因素等等。","quality":0.486},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T09:58:46.642857+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:58:48.235294+08:00","text":"對，需求，尤其是青年的部分。","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:58:48.588235+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:20.769231+08:00","text":"我之前有跟你討論我選區的案子，可能你印象也非常地深，就是汐止白匏湖的社宅案，你應該有印象，在去年度的預算，我有針對聯外道路做一些刪減，後來在追加預算的時候，內政部也把它再包裹回去了，也同意了，所以預算算是如數交給內政部了，但這個案子後來是不是有取消的情形？","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T09:59:23.100000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:43.812500+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，114年度（上年度）的預算立法院是刪減0.21億元，115年度的預算在審查的時候是全數刪減2.47億元，所以現在這個計畫比較沒有辦法順利推動，116年度我們也沒有把它編列進去。","quality":0.931},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:59:44+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:51.250000+08:00","text":"就是在去年度刪減之後，是不是有追加預算回來？沒有。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:59:51.500000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:52+08:00","text":"沒有嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:59:52.250000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:54.250000+08:00","text":"沒有你們包進去了吧？","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T09:59:55+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:56.136364+08:00","text":"你們包進去了。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T09:59:56.363636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T09:59:59.772727+08:00","text":"包到追加預算，這是一個公建計畫。是的。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:00.227273+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:04.545455+08:00","text":"我請同仁跟您回應一下，好嗎？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:05+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:09.821429+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，這個部分到國發會那邊沒有同意，所以沒有包進去。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:10+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:11.212121+08:00","text":"所以國發會沒有同意？對。","quality":0.9},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:11.363636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:14.848485+08:00","text":"好，所以你們有提，但不是立法院阻擋，是國發會沒有同意。","quality":0.913},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:16.250000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:19.750000+08:00","text":"針對這個案子，你們目前有要取消興建嗎？","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:23+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:25.785714+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，我們目前是取消興建。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:26+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:27.680000+08:00","text":"你們目前是取消興建，那目前的程序？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:27.800000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:28.880000+08:00","text":"報行政院。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:29+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:39.727273+08:00","text":"也就是說內政部的程序已經走完了，決定在這個個案取消興建社宅的計畫，目前正在等待行政院核定？對。好。","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:00:40.142857+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:00:59.181818+08:00","text":"我當然不是要批評這件事情，因為當初針對社宅，我就有我的立場，社宅不是只有追求數量，而是它的地點或是它有一些設置學理在，並不是找到空地就蓋，如果是找到空地就蓋，你要100萬戶社宅，我想隨便一個人也都能夠蓋。","quality":0.989},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:01:01.363636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:01:15.944444+08:00","text":"我就自己也做個計畫，因為當時對我有許多批評，或許我講話的藝術沒有部長那麼高，類似的話從部長口中講出來可能就沒人批評，我講出來的話，指教的意見就比較多。","quality":0.87},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:01:16.527778+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:01:52.290323+08:00","text":"另外，在同時間我有爭取另外一個社宅的計畫，在汐止的保長坑營區，新北市政府之前就有提出都市計畫的變更，我支持這個案子的原因是因為它已經融入既有的生活圈跟社區，旁邊也是基隆捷運的預定地，離現有的基隆五堵火車站也是非常近的距離，是一個很好的社宅地點，如同部長剛剛講的，蓋好之後，需求會非常地高，因為它的交通便利，生活機能也非常好。","quality":0.946},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:01:52.677419+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:14.829268+08:00","text":"我想確認一下，就我的了解，目前這個案子應該是新北市政府正在進行都市計畫的變更，之前有送到內政部審議過，國土署有一些意見，已退回到地方，目前地方應該也準備要再提送，我想請問一下現在內政部、國土署或是住都中心對於這一塊地用來興建社宅的態度。","quality":0.899},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:15+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:22.783784+08:00","text":"報告委員，這塊地既然新北市政府有按照相關都市計畫在進行，我們當然會來審議。","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:23.187500+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:26.750000+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，如果委員所指是保長坑營區……","quality":0.778},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:26.937500+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:28.812500+08:00","text":"是的，國防部營區的那塊地。","quality":0.818},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:32.733333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:43.750000+08:00","text":"在115年6月18日的時候，新北市都委會在第185次會議決議通過，現在由新北市政府在補辦公開展覽程序當中。","quality":0.927},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:44.324324+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:51.111111+08:00","text":"當然都市計畫的程序照走，但是這一塊地的條件，我想先請教內政部或相關單位，是不是支持的？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:51.555556+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:51.777778+08:00","text":"我們支持。","quality":0.5},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:52.666667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:55.555556+08:00","text":"相關的前置作業是不是可以先行規劃？","quality":0.875},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:56.250000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:02:58.750000+08:00","text":"如果就都市計畫程序，我想我們在這邊不討論太細啦！","quality":0.909},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:02:58.875000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:07.789474+08:00","text":"但對於是之前的問題，新北市政府應該都有依照國土署的意見，針對林地、破碎的機關用地已取得同意書了。","quality":0.932},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:08.147059+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:09.617647+08:00","text":"是不是前置作業可以先做？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:09.764706+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:17.117647+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，其實每個地方政府提報過來的案件，我們有城鄉分署在做專業評估，這個案子確實是可行的。","quality":0.86},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:17.264706+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:17.852941+08:00","text":"是可行的嘛？","quality":1},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:18+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:19.105263+08:00","text":"對，所以之前應該有做過評估。","quality":0.583},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:19.289474+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:26.500000+08:00","text":"就我剛剛請教的，前置作業能不能開始做基地的規劃及設計，也就是分頭併行？","quality":0.781},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:27+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:03:38.818182+08:00","text":"這還是要有固定的程序，我們前面只是確定可行，所以市政府現在在做用地變更的程序，後續送來以後，我們會加速來辦理。","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:03:39+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:04:21.666667+08:00","text":"我還是希望你們可以平行進行，就是很多事情包括都市計畫變更、用地取得等程序，政府為了加快工程的進度都會分頭進行，譬如綜合規劃報告或環評，大家可以分頭進行，因為都市計畫變更或土地的設計或許沒辦法做到細部設計，但是一定可以做比較大範圍、比較籠統的規劃等作業，我會希望你們可以先做一些評估，加速包括……或許你們剛剛講的未來3年後，現在你們定案的只有1,000戶，說不定你現在趕快規劃，這個數字到後年就上來了，或許就可以馬上呈現在數字上面了。","quality":0.82},{"speaker":"蔡署長長展","start":"2026-08-12T10:04:22.151515+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:04:31+08:00","text":"跟委員報告，其實這個東西是未來我們跟地方政府確認完以後會再增加的，這個案子前置作業的很多工作，我們都已經做完了。好。","quality":0.83},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:04:31.952381+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:04:54.833333+08:00","text":"今天最後一點時間再跟你們確認，關於這兩個社宅案，白匏湖社宅的興建是內政部主動喊停的，內政部及國發會都不支持，所以沒有辦法繼續進行下去；另外，保長坑營區的社會住宅，內政部是支持的，也會繼續進行下去。","quality":0.876},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:04:55+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:04:59.827586+08:00","text":"報告召委，有關白匏湖的部分是我們沒有預算，不是我們主動喊停。","quality":0.889},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:00+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:02.823529+08:00","text":"所以是立法院不支持還是國發會不支持？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:06+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:15.600000+08:00","text":"從立法院在114年刪減該案社宅0.21億補助經費開始，這個當然是進入國發會的審查程序，一開始的時候，如果立法院就刪除，到目前……","quality":0.712},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:16+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:16.916667+08:00","text":"所以國發會不支持嘛，對不對？","quality":0.917},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:17+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:19.666667+08:00","text":"到目前為止，也沒有在115年度預算的公建計畫裡。","quality":0.789},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:21+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:25.666667+08:00","text":"所以就是國發會沒有支持嘛，對不對？","quality":1},{"speaker":"劉部長世芳","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:26+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:32.133333+08:00","text":"報告委員，我想是這樣子，我們如果沒有預算，怎麼去開發任何運動休閒園區或是社會住宅？好啦！","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:32.266667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:32.933333+08:00","text":"針對這一個案子，沒關係！","quality":0.6},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:33.066667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:40.800000+08:00","text":"到時候程序走完了之後，你們現在既然已經報行政院了，後續確定了之後，再麻煩回復相關資料。","quality":0.923},{"speaker":"廖委員先翔","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:41.040000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:41.760000+08:00","text":"以上，謝謝。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:43.363636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:45.909091+08:00","text":"謝謝廖先翔委員的質詢。","quality":0.7},{"speaker":"主席（廖委員先翔）","start":"2026-08-12T10:05:46.409091+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-08-12T10:05:50.123377+08:00","text":"下一位請王鴻薇委員發言質詢。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}