{"error":false,"id":["171027"],"data":{"IVOD_ID":171027,"IVOD_URL":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/171027","日期":"2026-08-19","會議資料":{"會議代碼":"聯席會議-11-5-22,15-1","會議代碼:str":"第11屆第5會期教育及文化、內政委員會第1次聯席會議","屆":11,"會期":5,"會次":1,"臨時會會次":null,"種類":"聯席會議","委員會代碼":[22,15],"委員會代碼:str":["教育及文化委員會","內政委員會"],"標題":"第11屆第5會期教育及文化、內政委員會第1次聯席會議"},"影片種類":"Clip","開始時間":"2026-08-19T09:11:16+08:00","結束時間":"2026-08-19T09:21:26+08:00","影片長度":"00:10:10","支援功能":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/0db75461a96d9b807bee68c4ec8eb6dbc288d97a61ada355271709ee836f68b7046b0eefe8e5e5315ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"郭昱晴","委員發言時間":"09:11:16 - 09:21:26","會議時間":"2026-08-19T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第5會期教育及文化、內政委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：審查\r\n(一) 委員黃仁等17人擬具「原住民族學校法草案」案。\r\n(二) 委員高金素梅等24人擬具「原住民族學校法草案」案。\r\n(三) 委員伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe等17人擬具「原住民族學校法草案」案。\r\n(四) 委員林倩綺等16人擬具「原住民族學校法草案」案。\r\n(五) 委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等17人擬具「原住民族學校法草案」案。\r\n(六) 委員伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe等16人擬具「原住民族學校法草案」案。\r\n【僅進行詢答】）","transcript":{"pyannote":[{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":6.7134687500000005,"end":10.645343750000002,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":11.286593750000002,"end":12.41721875,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":13.09221875,"end":14.189093750000001,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":17.074718750000002,"end":17.766593750000002,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":17.766593750000002,"end":17.78346875,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":18.15471875,"end":25.74846875,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":23.16659375,"end":23.43659375,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":26.01846875,"end":39.77159375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":40.024718750000005,"end":118.30784375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":118.44284375000001,"end":206.36159375000003,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":125.27721875,"end":125.96909375000001,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":164.96721875,"end":164.98409375,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":165.01784375,"end":165.11909375000002,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":165.11909375000002,"end":165.13596875000002,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":165.13596875000002,"end":165.18659375000001,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":206.27721875,"end":210.10784375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":208.21784375000001,"end":209.44971875000002,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":209.93909375,"end":217.44846875000002,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":217.44846875000002,"end":217.48221875000002,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":217.48221875000002,"end":217.51596875,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":217.98846875,"end":218.00534375,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":218.00534375,"end":275.93721875,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":276.24096875000004,"end":281.01659375,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":280.51034375,"end":287.71596875,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":287.71596875,"end":288.17159375,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":288.17159375,"end":288.20534375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":288.42471875,"end":294.78659375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":294.88784375,"end":389.20221875000004,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_02","speaker_name":"廖司長高賢","start":296.50784375,"end":296.79471875,"speaker_score":0.909},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":337.34534375000004,"end":337.76721875000004,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":389.26971875000004,"end":462.27096875,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":462.38909375000003,"end":476.17596875000004,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":469.79721875,"end":471.16409375,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":472.02471875000003,"end":472.66596875000005,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":475.33221875000004,"end":478.52159375,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":476.68221875,"end":476.80034375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":478.42034375000003,"end":492.78096875000006,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":493.00034375,"end":530.4965937500001,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":528.7922187500001,"end":528.99471875,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_01","speaker_name":"張廖次長萬堅","start":530.3784687500001,"end":581.2397187500001,"speaker_score":0.931},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":573.8147187500001,"end":574.2703437499999,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start":580.6997187500001,"end":580.78409375,"speaker_score":0.903},{"speaker":"SPEAKER_00","speaker_name":"郭委員昱晴","start"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謝謝主席 那今天有請次長"},{"start":10.8,"end":12.3,"text":"請次長好了"},{"start":12.3,"end":14.3,"text":"有請次長"},{"start":14.3,"end":18.3,"text":"來 委員好"},{"start":18.3,"end":19.3,"text":"好 次長早安"},{"start":19.3,"end":23.3,"text":"我想今天其實我們要討論的是原住民族的學校法"},{"start":23.3,"end":27.8,"text":"那過去呢 其實我們的原住民族的一個教育"},{"start":27.8,"end":31.3,"text":"其實從過去以前的這個普充式的一個教育"},{"start":31.3,"end":34.8,"text":"現在已經走向所謂的這個文化主體性的一個方向"},{"start":34.8,"end":39.8,"text":"那我們也看到有不少的原住民族的這個實驗學校正在運作"},{"start":39.8,"end":43.8,"text":"那我們如果真的希望這個部落成為這個教育的一個本體"},{"start":43.8,"end":47.8,"text":"所以更應該要建立一套完整而且有自主性的"},{"start":47.8,"end":51.8,"text":"讓它可以在這個永續發展的一個教育的體系"},{"start":51.8,"end":56.8,"text":"那這個部份我想請教一下這個教育部這兩個核心的一個問題"},{"start":56.8,"end":58.3,"text":"我們的師資的部份"},{"start":58.3,"end":62.8,"text":"那麼第一我相信現在有很多的老師他有所謂的這個教師證"},{"start":62.8,"end":69.3,"text":"但是他不一定具備有足夠的所謂的這個民族文化的一個這樣子的一個教養的部份"},{"start":69.3,"end":74.8,"text":"那我想有沒有專門規劃培訓或者是認證的機制"},{"start":74.8,"end":80.3,"text":"讓老師不只只是會教而且他是真正的懂原住民族的一個文化"},{"start":80.3,"end":81.3,"text":"這是第一個問題"},{"start":81.3,"end":84.3,"text":"第二個問題我的升學應該要怎麼銜接"},{"start":84.3,"end":89.3,"text":"在升學的時候其實我們大部分還是看傳統的這個學科的一個成績"},{"start":89.3,"end":92.3,"text":"那當然這個實驗教育的一個部份"},{"start":92.3,"end":94.3,"text":"那很多的家長可能就會問"},{"start":94.3,"end":99.8,"text":"如果既然要讓孩子選擇升學那要看的是傳統的這個學科的成績"},{"start":99.8,"end":103.3,"text":"那接著下來我為什麼要選擇這樣子的一個教育"},{"start":103.3,"end":106.3,"text":"所以我們這個教育部是不是有跟這個原民會"},{"start":106.3,"end":110.3,"text":"或者是我們其他的一些大專院校有一起來共同的思考"},{"start":110.3,"end":118.3,"text":"那我想請教你怎麼樣來建立這個原住民族的一個教育特色的一個升學銜接的選材的一個機制這個部份想請教"},{"start":118.3,"end":125.3,"text":"好我想第一個有關這個原住民族的這個相關的那個師資的問題"},{"start":125.3,"end":127.3,"text":"就說具有他的文化特色"},{"start":127.3,"end":130.3,"text":"那我們現在呢有關那個私培的部份"},{"start":130.3,"end":139.3,"text":"我們是透過赤磚場的這個師資的培育的方式來增加對原民文化的一個認識跟這個教學"},{"start":139.3,"end":145.3,"text":"那麼在115年度我們累計也核定了培育的學校有9所學校有16組"},{"start":145.3,"end":149.3,"text":"那取得這個赤磚場證書的也已經達到89位"},{"start":149.3,"end":157.3,"text":"那110年到115學年度呢原住民的功費升也累計核定了406人"},{"start":157.3,"end":164.3,"text":"那114年度的私培大學開設有關原住民族教育相關的議題課程呢有43所學校"},{"start":164.3,"end":168.3,"text":"那休息過的人次也達到了13643"},{"start":168.3,"end":171.3,"text":"那這部份我們會繼續跟原民會來合作"},{"start":171.3,"end":177.3,"text":"就辦理原住民族教育師資休息原住民族文化及多元文化的教育課程"},{"start":177.3,"end":182.3,"text":"來讓那個輔導這個原住民族學校啦或是重點學校"},{"start":182.3,"end":187.3,"text":"或者是原住民的教育專班的專任老師啦族羽教學資源工作人員啦"},{"start":187.3,"end":191.3,"text":"以及擔任6個月以上的代理代課及終點教室呢"},{"start":191.3,"end":195.3,"text":"都應該要分別休息36小時以及8小時的課程"},{"start":195.3,"end":201.3,"text":"預計在115年7月底的完成課程者會有1萬2191人次"},{"start":201.3,"end":205.3,"text":"這部份我們是情緒再增加"},{"start":205.3,"end":210.3,"text":"再麻煩把這些比較詳細的一個說明的資料再提供給我"},{"start":210.3,"end":216.3,"text":"那有關那個大學行街是不是用特殊選材或其他的方式"},{"start":216.3,"end":218.3,"text":"我們是不是請那個司長來說"},{"start":218.3,"end":219.3,"text":"委員好"},{"start":219.3,"end":222.3,"text":"那有關於我們原住民學生的一個就學權利"},{"start":222.3,"end":224.3,"text":"除了加分優待的這個部份呢"},{"start":224.3,"end":227.3,"text":"有參酌他的族羽認證之外"},{"start":227.3,"end":230.3,"text":"那我們在分發入學管道以外呢"},{"start":230.3,"end":233.3,"text":"如果他是參加其他的一個招生管道的話"},{"start":233.3,"end":240.3,"text":"我們原則上是會著重在他文化學習跟多元表現的一個成果"},{"start":240.3,"end":243.3,"text":"來那個予以審查他的經歷"},{"start":243.3,"end":247.3,"text":"所以說如果原民生他在申請入學的時候呢"},{"start":247.3,"end":251.3,"text":"我們會就是說加強學校在族群文化學習成果"},{"start":251.3,"end":254.3,"text":"納入他的一個加分的一個項目"},{"start":254.3,"end":257.3,"text":"那同時呢我們在大學招生專業化的時候"},{"start":257.3,"end":259.3,"text":"這個計畫裡頭"},{"start":259.3,"end":263.3,"text":"也會將這個所謂的文化多元的這樣的一個審查呢"},{"start":263.3,"end":265.3,"text":"列為此規"},{"start":265.3,"end":268.3,"text":"那尤其是針對原住民學生的時候呢"},{"start":268.3,"end":271.3,"text":"作為他整個申請入學的一個發展的一個參考"},{"start":271.3,"end":273.3,"text":"所以這整個文化知識體系"},{"start":273.3,"end":278.3,"text":"如何進入所謂的專課以上的這個申請"},{"start":278.3,"end":280.3,"text":"其實我們有相關的一個配套"},{"start":280.3,"end":281.3,"text":"好我想在高教的部分"},{"start":281.3,"end":285.3,"text":"如果之後其實還有一些比方說這一類的一個成果的一個盤點"},{"start":285.3,"end":287.3,"text":"到時候再提供給我"},{"start":287.3,"end":289.3,"text":"好那時間關係"},{"start":289.3,"end":293.3,"text":"今天第二個問題我想請教一下這個次長的部分"},{"start":293.3,"end":296.3,"text":"是關於我們雙語教育的部分"},{"start":296.3,"end":298.3,"text":"那我想現在大家都在談"},{"start":298.3,"end":302.3,"text":"這個最近在修正的這個外國教師聘僱管理規定"},{"start":302.3,"end":306.3,"text":"我想開放這個外師教授藝文或者是體育等"},{"start":306.3,"end":309.3,"text":"非語言領域的一些課程"},{"start":309.3,"end":313.3,"text":"當然我們是希望能夠創造一些比較生活化的一個英語的環境"},{"start":313.3,"end":315.3,"text":"那當然這個方向其實我們是支持"},{"start":315.3,"end":319.3,"text":"但是我再次說明這個雙語教育不能只看KPI"},{"start":319.3,"end":320.3,"text":"好不能只看KPI"},{"start":320.3,"end":325.3,"text":"我們更不能把其他的學科變成英文學習的一個工具"},{"start":325.3,"end":328.3,"text":"那我想這個教師公會跟第一線的老師"},{"start":328.3,"end":334.3,"text":"其實他們也都對這樣子的一個方向表達出他們的一些聲音跟一些疑慮"},{"start":334.3,"end":337.3,"text":"那我想這個教育部可能真的要正視"},{"start":337.3,"end":341.3,"text":"就是說外師的學科專業到底是由誰來認定"},{"start":341.3,"end":344.3,"text":"那麼當然除了現在我們講到體育藝文"},{"start":344.3,"end":345.3,"text":"這個除了英文能力之外"},{"start":345.3,"end":349.3,"text":"他的體育的專科還有藝術的專業是由誰來認定"},{"start":349.3,"end":350.3,"text":"第一個問題"},{"start":350.3,"end":354.3,"text":"第二個問題我怎麼確保這個學科的內容不會被稀釋"},{"start":354.3,"end":356.3,"text":"也就是說因為我們講的體育課"},{"start":356.3,"end":360.3,"text":"當然我們包含運動的技能安全還有我們的這個健康"},{"start":360.3,"end":364.3,"text":"那藝術的課程其實包含美感然後創作文化等等"},{"start":364.3,"end":368.3,"text":"但是如果最後為了因應學生的英文程度"},{"start":368.3,"end":375.3,"text":"我們老師在這兩門學科當中可能會把所有的教學的內容不斷的簡化"},{"start":375.3,"end":382.3,"text":"那變成是一個用英文來上一堂簡單的體育課或上一堂簡單的所謂的這個藝文課"},{"start":382.3,"end":388.3,"text":"那這個時候到底我們是在做雙語教育還是在犧牲學科的一個教育這個部分請教"},{"start":388.3,"end":390.3,"text":"好我想簡單來回答"},{"start":390.3,"end":396.3,"text":"就是這個之前可能媒體的報導可能有一些誤解"},{"start":396.3,"end":400.3,"text":"第一個就是說教育部是配合外國專業人才研覽及僱用法的修法"},{"start":400.3,"end":406.3,"text":"我們才去修正各級學校申請外國教師聘僱許可及管理辦法"},{"start":406.3,"end":415.3,"text":"才會去增列就是說高中以下學校得聘外國專業人才擔任語言及語言以外之藝能及活動相關領域或科目"},{"start":415.3,"end":422.3,"text":"但是就像委員剛才提的外師的學科專業資格是由本部來審查認定"},{"start":422.3,"end":429.3,"text":"那他的這個認定就跟我們本國的老師他要去認這個課程"},{"start":429.3,"end":433.3,"text":"他的角色也不是他是以外師目前外師為主"},{"start":433.3,"end":438.3,"text":"那他如果有這個相關的背景呢他是協同教學他也不佔原來的名額"},{"start":438.3,"end":443.3,"text":"所以外界會誤認說我們要聘外師來教體育或健康"},{"start":443.3,"end":447.3,"text":"然後好像是排擠了本國的這個是一種錯誤的解讀"},{"start":447.3,"end":451.3,"text":"我們已經發布了新聞稿的成心"},{"start":451.3,"end":457.3,"text":"那即使外師有擔任他如果真的要去認專任的這個相關的學科的課程"},{"start":457.3,"end":459.3,"text":"他一定是依照我們的程序來提出"},{"start":459.3,"end":461.3,"text":"那個是相當嚴謹也不容易取得"},{"start":462.3,"end":467.3,"text":"我想我們再次的表達就是支持這個國際化也希望這個孩子能夠學好英文"},{"start":467.3,"end":470.3,"text":"但是是個雙語教育的前提其實不能犧牲學科"},{"start":470.3,"end":471.3,"text":"沒有沒有沒有"},{"start":471.3,"end":472.3,"text":"沒有犧牲學科"},{"start":472.3,"end":475.3,"text":"再來就是我們更怕的是造成城鄉差距"},{"start":475.3,"end":478.3,"text":"他是以雙語學習為主啦他是協同教學"},{"start":478.3,"end":480.3,"text":"最後給我一點點時間最後一個問題"},{"start":480.3,"end":483.3,"text":"我想這個最近雲林就前一陣子有一個案例"},{"start":483.3,"end":487.3,"text":"就是一所國小在短短兩年之內他竟然要承辦農園"},{"start":487.3,"end":492.3,"text":"還有所謂的這個運動公園橄欖球場游泳池等大型的工程採購"},{"start":492.3,"end":494.3,"text":"那這個是非常荒謬的一件事情"},{"start":494.3,"end":500.3,"text":"我想這些工程他原本應該跟學校的本身其實根本沒有直接的關係"},{"start":500.3,"end":503.3,"text":"學校也不具備所謂的相關的工程的一個專業"},{"start":503.3,"end":509.3,"text":"但是一個沒有游泳池的國小他為什麼要去負責所謂的游泳池的設計跟發包"},{"start":509.3,"end":512.3,"text":"那麼依照我們政府採購法第四條"},{"start":512.3,"end":518.3,"text":"這個代辦採購就應該要請所謂的這個具有專業能力的一個機關"},{"start":518.3,"end":520.3,"text":"但是這個地方政府他自己沒有能力"},{"start":520.3,"end":524.3,"text":"他本來應該就應該要找所謂的專業工程的一個單位"},{"start":524.3,"end":527.3,"text":"不是把這個發包的工作其實丟給學校"},{"start":527.3,"end":530.3,"text":"這個部分我想我們教育部有沒有跟工程會來做了解"},{"start":530.3,"end":532.3,"text":"我想我們這部分都會提醒"},{"start":532.3,"end":535.3,"text":"因為那個國中小的地方知識由地方縣市政府負責"},{"start":535.3,"end":537.3,"text":"那我們有提醒他們就是說"},{"start":537.3,"end":542.3,"text":"其實學校裡面他如果你要委託學校去代辦全縣的類似的工程"},{"start":542.3,"end":546.3,"text":"你要注意到那個學校有沒有專業的一些工程的人才"},{"start":546.3,"end":549.3,"text":"如果沒有的話其實我們在地方也待過"},{"start":549.3,"end":554.3,"text":"就很多學校的工程甚至是委託縣府的專業發包機構來"},{"start":554.3,"end":557.3,"text":"就是建管機構來執行"},{"start":557.3,"end":561.3,"text":"所以如果是各級縣我們有會再提醒"},{"start":561.3,"end":565.3,"text":"各級縣市政府要去委託學校去辦理"},{"start":565.3,"end":567.3,"text":"縣市政府的一般性採購"},{"start":567.3,"end":570.3,"text":"那如果涉及到委員所提的"},{"start":570.3,"end":573.3,"text":"他裡面的工程人才並沒有相關的這些人才"},{"start":573.3,"end":578.3,"text":"那他來代辦的話那個專業性跟他的這個事格是不是合宜"},{"start":578.3,"end":580.3,"text":"這個我們會再提醒地方縣市政府"},{"start":580.3,"end":583.3,"text":"而且更重要的一點其實我們一直不斷的在講"},{"start":583.3,"end":586.3,"text":"就是學校已經面臨教師跟行政人力的一個不足"},{"start":586.3,"end":591.3,"text":"這個時候其實又要承擔這個上千萬甚至上億的校外的工程"},{"start":591.3,"end":593.3,"text":"跟我學校其實是無關的"},{"start":593.3,"end":599.3,"text":"那學校反而沒有把所謂的這些資源投入在我在教學的一個部分"},{"start":599.3,"end":602.3,"text":"還要替政府部門來做這樣子的一個工程"},{"start":602.3,"end":606.3,"text":"我想這個本部導致的這個部分可能請教育部可能還是要稍微延遲"},{"start":606.3,"end":607.3,"text":"我們會跟地方政府再提醒一下"},{"start":607.3,"end":609.3,"text":"好謝謝市長謝謝主席"},{"start":609.3,"end":611.3,"text":"好謝謝"}],"gazette":[{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:11:16.900000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:11:19.600000+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:11:23.200000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:11:25.900000+08:00","text":"有請次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-08-19T09:11:28.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:11:29.800000+08:00","text":"有請次長。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:11:31.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:11:34.300000+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:11:34.500000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:11:35.100000+08:00","text":"次長早安。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:11:35.680952+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:12:07.589474+08:00","text":"今天我們要討論的是原住民族學校法，我們的原住民族教育從過去的補充式教育，到現在已經走向所謂文化主體性的方向，我們也看到有不少的原住民族實驗學校正在運作，如果真的希望部落成為教育的本體，那就更應該要建立一套完整而且有自主性，可以永續發展的教育體系。","quality":0.966},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:12:07.992308+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:12:37.157143+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，我想請教教育部兩個最核心的問題就是師資的部分：第一，我相信現在很多老師有教師證，但是卻不一定具備足夠的民族文化教養，我想知道有沒有專門規劃培訓或者認證的機制，讓老師不止會教，而且他是真正懂原住民族文化，這是第一個問題。","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:12:37.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:12:40.112500+08:00","text":"第二個問題，升學應該要怎麼銜接？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:12:40.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:12:59.125000+08:00","text":"在升學的時候，其實我們大部分還是看傳統學科的成績，針對實驗教育的部分，很多家長可能就會問，如果要讓孩子選擇升學，要看的就是傳統學科的成績，為什麼要選擇這樣子的教育？","quality":0.947},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:13:00.247368+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:13:12.938298+08:00","text":"教育部是不是有跟原民會，或者是其他一些大專院校一起共同思考，怎麼樣建立具有原住民族教育特色的升學銜接選才機制？","quality":0.942},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:13:13.108511+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:13:14.129787+08:00","text":"這個部分想請教。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:13:15.077778+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:13:35.056757+08:00","text":"第一個，有關原住民族相關的師資問題，具有文化特色的部分，現在有關師培的部分，我們是透過次專長師資培育的方式來增加對原民文化的認識跟教學。","quality":0.873},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:13:35.800000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:14:31.064706+08:00","text":"在115年度我們累計核定培育有9所學校、有16組，取得次專長證書的也已經達到89位，110年到115學年度原住民公費生也累計核定了406人，114年度的師培大學開設有關原住民族教育相關議題課程有43所學校，修習過的人次也達到了1萬3,643人，這部分我們會繼續跟原民會合作，辦理原住民族教育師資修習原住民族文化及多元文化教育課程，輔導原住民族學校或是重點學校，或者是原住民教育專班的專任老師、族語教學支援工作人員，以及擔任6個月以上的代理代課及重點教師，都應該要分別修習36小時以及8小時的課程。","quality":0.897},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:14:31.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:14:40.936364+08:00","text":"預計在115年7月底完成課程者會有1萬2,191人次，這部分我們是循序增加。","quality":0.852},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:14:41.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:14:46.082609+08:00","text":"好，再麻煩把這些比較詳細的書面資料提供給我。","quality":0.85},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:14:46.082609+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-08-19T09:14:47.082609+08:00","text":"好，我們會後再提供。","quality":0},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:14:46.560870+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:14:54.133333+08:00","text":"有關大學銜接是不是用特殊選才或是其他方式，是不是請司長說明？可以。","quality":0.767},{"speaker":"廖司長高賢","start":"2026-08-19T09:14:54.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:14:54.966667+08:00","text":"委員好。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖司長高賢","start":"2026-08-19T09:14:55.466667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:15:19.027273+08:00","text":"有關原住民學生的就學權利，除了加分優待的部分有參酌族語認證之外，在分發入學管道以外，如果是參加其他招生管道的話，我們原則上會著重在文化學習跟多元表現成果予以審查其經歷。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"廖司長高賢","start":"2026-08-19T09:15:19.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:15:30.069231+08:00","text":"所以如果原民生在申請入學的時候，我們會加強學校在族群文化學習成果納入加分項目。","quality":1},{"speaker":"廖司長高賢","start":"2026-08-19T09:15:30.476471+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:15:47.142105+08:00","text":"同時我們在大學招生專業化的計畫裡，也會將文化多元審查列為尺規，尤其是針對原住民學生做為整個申請入學發展的參考。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"廖司長高賢","start":"2026-08-19T09:15:47.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:15:56.300000+08:00","text":"所以這整個文化知識體系如何進入專科以上的申請，其實我們有相關的配套。好。","quality":0.97},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:15:56.411111+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:16:03.050000+08:00","text":"我想在高教的部分，如果之後還有這類成果的盤點，到時候再提供給我。是。","quality":0.967},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:16:03.966667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:16:12.050000+08:00","text":"時間關係，今天第二個問題我想請教次長的是關於雙語教育的部分。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:16:12.900000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:16:31.157143+08:00","text":"現在大家都在談最近在修正的外國教師聘僱管理規定，開放外師教授藝文或者是體育等非語言領域課程，當然我們是希望能夠創造一些比較生活化的英語環境，這個方向我們是支持的。","quality":0.987},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:16:31.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:16:53.100000+08:00","text":"但是我再次說明，雙語教育不能只看KPI，我們更不能把其他學科變成英文學習的工具，教師公會跟第一線老師都對這樣子的方向表達出他們的一些聲音跟疑慮，我想教育部可能真的要正視。","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:16:53.966667+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:16:57.077778+08:00","text":"外師的學科專業到底是由誰來認定？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:16:58.050000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:17:05.100000+08:00","text":"除了現在我們講到體育、藝文，除了英文能力之外，他的體育專科還有藝術的專業是由誰來認定？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:17:05.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:17:06.100000+08:00","text":"這是第一個問題。","quality":0.714},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:17:06.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:17:10.118182+08:00","text":"第二個問題，我怎麼確保學科的內容不會被稀釋？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:17:11.838462+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:17:43.064706+08:00","text":"體育課當然包含運動的技能、安全、健康，而藝術的課程其實包含美感、創作、文化等等，如果最後為了因應學生的英文程度，老師在這兩門學科當中可能會把所有教學內容不斷簡化，變成是用英文來上一堂簡單的體育課，或上一堂簡單的藝文課，這個時候到底我們是在做雙語教育，還是在犧牲學科的教育？","quality":0.992},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:17:43.241176+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:17:44.123529+08:00","text":"這個部分請教。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:17:44.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:17:46.050000+08:00","text":"好，我想簡單回答。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:17:47.500000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:18:11.095455+08:00","text":"之前媒體的報導可能有一些誤解，第一個，教育部是配合外國專業人才延攬及僱用法的修法，我們才去修正各級學校申請外國教師聘僱許可及管理辦法，增列高中以下學校得聘外國專業人才擔任語言及語言以外之藝能及活動相關領域或科目。","quality":0.98},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:18:11.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:18:34.121429+08:00","text":"但是就像委員剛才提的，外師的學科專業資格是由本部審查認定，而這個認定就跟本國老師要任這個課程，他的角色……目前是以外師為主，但他如果有相關背景則是協同教學，也不占原來的名額。","quality":0.911},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:18:34.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:18:46.069231+08:00","text":"所以外界會誤認為我們要聘外師來教體育或健康，好像排擠了本國的師資，這是一個錯誤的解讀，我們已經發布新聞稿澄清。","quality":0.882},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:18:47.920690+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:18:57.146154+08:00","text":"如果外師真的要任專任的相關學科課程，就一定是依照我們的程序來提出，那是相當嚴謹，也不容易取得。","quality":0.907},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:18:58.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:19:06.466667+08:00","text":"好，我想我們再次表達支持國際化，也希望孩子能夠學好英文，但是雙語教育的前提不能犧牲學科。沒有。","quality":0.976},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:19:07.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:19:08.133333+08:00","text":"好，沒有犧牲學科。","quality":0.857},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:19:08.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:19:11.112500+08:00","text":"再來就是我們更怕的是造成城鄉差距。","quality":1},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:19:11.487500+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:19:14.112500+08:00","text":"它還是以雙語學習為主，就是協同教學。好。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:19:14.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:19:45.112500+08:00","text":"最後給我一點點時間，最後一個問題，雲林前一陣子有一個案例，一所國小在短短2年之內竟然要承辦農園、運動公園、橄欖球場、游泳池等大型工程採購，這是非常荒謬的一件事情，我想這些工程原本應該跟學校本身根本沒有直接關係，學校也不具備相關的工程專業，但是一個沒有游泳池的國小為什麼要去負責游泳池的設計跟發包？","quality":1},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:19:45.728571+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:20:06.163636+08:00","text":"依照政府採購法第四十條，代辦採購應該要請具有專業能力的機關來辦理，但是地方政府自己沒有能力，它本來就應該要找專業工程單位，而不是把發包的工作直接丟給學校，教育部有沒有跟工程會了解這個部分？","quality":0.864},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:20:06.663636+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:20:11.157143+08:00","text":"針對這個部分，我們都會提醒，因為國中、小是地方自治，由地方縣市政府主責。","quality":0.677},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:20:11.481818+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:20:32.966667+08:00","text":"我們有提醒他們，如果要委託學校代辦類似的工程，要注意到學校有沒有專業的工程人才；如果沒有的話，其實我們在地方也待過，很多學校工程甚至是委託縣府專業的建管機構來執行發包。","quality":0.962},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:20:35.433333+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:20:56.157143+08:00","text":"我們會再提醒各級縣市政府要委託學校辦理縣市政府的一般性採購，如果涉及到委員所提的，學校裡面並沒有相關的工程人才，由它來代辦的話，專業性跟適格性是不是合宜，我們會再提醒地方縣市政府。","quality":0.905},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:20:56.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:18.871429+08:00","text":"而且更重要的一點是，我們一直不斷地在講，學校已經面臨教師跟行政人力不足，這個時候又要承擔上千萬，甚至上億的校外工程，跟學校其實是無關的，學校反而沒有把資源投入在教學上，還要替政府部門來做這樣的工程，我想這是本末倒置。","quality":0.929},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:19.585714+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:21.871429+08:00","text":"這個部分可能還是要請教育部稍微嚴加……","quality":0.706},{"speaker":"張廖次長萬堅","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:22.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:23.223077+08:00","text":"好，我們會跟地方政府再來提醒一下，謝謝。","quality":0.765},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:23.300000+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:24.188889+08:00","text":"好，謝謝次長。","quality":0.8},{"speaker":"郭委員昱晴","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:24.411111+08:00","guessed":false,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:25.077778+08:00","text":"謝謝主席。","quality":1},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:25.577778+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:28.434921+08:00","text":"謝謝郭昱晴委員的質詢。","quality":0.2},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:28.734921+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:30.163492+08:00","text":"請次長回座。","quality":0},{"speaker":"主席","start":"2026-08-19T09:21:30.463492+08:00","guessed":true,"end":"2026-08-19T09:21:34.463492+08:00","text":"下一位有請陳秀寳委員進行詢答。","quality":0}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}