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卓院長 曾副院長 各位國務院長早安報告院會我們繼續開會對行政院長施政方針及施政報告繼續諮詢進行諮詢之前請民進黨報告部會首長請假請行報告院會行政院來函外交部林部長佳龍本日下午因公請假由陳市長明旗代表列席文化部李部長元本日因病請假由李市長敬會代表列席農業部陳部長俊記本日"},{"start":1655.007,"end":1662.891,"text":"應公請假 由胡市長終於代表列席 報告完畢我們現在接下來請莊瑞雄委員執行 王紅薇委員請準備謝謝主席 我有請我們行政院卓院長麻煩請卓院長備選"},{"start":1682.093,"end":1685.135,"text":"我們運動部啊 里昂部長運動部長備詢中委好 議長好院長先請教你 上禮拜"},{"start":1703.164,"end":1714.836,"text":"他跑去日本看球嘛他看棒球在跑到日本去看這場棒球的時候不曉得你的心情是怎麼樣看起來很爽"},{"start":1718.649,"end":1747.521,"text":"假日時間跟國人一樣關心Team Taiwan我們的國家棒球隊能不能在緊要的關頭也提高士氣所以假日時間我利用這個假日私人的活動到東京巨蛋球場觀看了一場非常振奮人心的比賽你說的是說振奮啦照我的看法那個是看那個贏球那一定是非常爽的一件事情但是問題就是說"},{"start":1749.994,"end":1757.601,"text":"看到我們台灣的球隊到日本去打這一場的一個經典賽你前陣子已經輸嘛 輸澳洲 輸日本再來贏 一定會覺得很高興可是國內又不爽"},{"start":1764.985,"end":1777.199,"text":"國內馬上有人不爽可是我也覺得好奇怪就是說院長怎麼突然因為我記得在前兩天我還跟院長有建議說我們可能就開刀啊還有人在大廈啊我們來做一個轉播大家借酒來看酒一定會很開心"},{"start":1782.657,"end":1805.253,"text":"有人建議說 那錢很多 很多的細節要安排我沒有想到說 欸 其實跑到日本東京去了這個是第一個 國人一定會感覺這是一件很振奮的一件事情這個是台日整個外交的一個重大的一個突破又碰到我們台灣隊在日本 又打贏啦但是呢"},{"start":1806.292,"end":1833.73,"text":"國民黨跟民眾黨這個腦袋瓜就長得跟國人不太一樣第一個的想法就是說 你這樣給我開多少錢你是怎麼會出現在日本 出現在東京這個地方不過我對院長的回答 在野黨的講法是說你說這個是私人行程 這個我聽起來合理但是你說這個私人行程的安排 你說又自廢我第一個想法就是說 天啊 我們有這麼高的行政意囊"},{"start":1835.049,"end":1835.79,"text":"部長是先去的 他沒有跟我一起"},{"start":1851.735,"end":1863.809,"text":"你不覺得站在院長的旁邊很難過嗎院長我跟你報告我跟我去年有機會跟韓院長我們一起到日本去喔我以為對處一定會很爽"},{"start":1867.286,"end":1895.161,"text":"瀟瀟整天一直拜訪一直拜訪一直拜訪一直拜訪我以為我也認為說那個是已經很輕鬆的一個拜訪的一個行程啊可是一跟了跟你們這種大咖的出門沒有一件輕鬆的啦但是本席一直認為說你雖然是私人行程啊但是按照憲法的規定啊行政院長是國家最高行政首長啊你去到哪裡有什麼你哪怕你是私人行程你維安的一個安排"},{"start":1896.141,"end":1905.603,"text":"你剛才說什麼要叫你改天改晚這個國家是一個制度啊那你說交通的一個安排你改天出錢那也都是一個制度啊"},{"start":1906.856,"end":1928.458,"text":"馬前總統他卸任了以後啊 我在國體我賺了他很多錢出門國安也是一堆啊 他是一個卸任的元首嘛他的安全你必須要去給他維護嘛哪怕是不同的黨的 你也不可以說 哇那在野黨他落下之後什麼人卸我去也能夠擦到 那也不得了的一件事情啊所以維安的安排"},{"start":1929.807,"end":1943.957,"text":"馬英九去到你什麼地方沒有一件卸任沒有一件事公務行程都是私人違安的安排沒有自費的啦搞通你借高鐵你建屋也要幫忙嗎所以我現在就搞不懂院長 為什麼你會用自費"},{"start":1944.938,"end":1972.963,"text":"我除了去看國家隊的比賽之外其實我當天決定我決定去之後我最想要做的一件事情我想看看我們台灣隊長陳傑憲他首當的傷勢因為我知道他第一場受傷就不能再下場但是我去到現場礙於整個他們還是在默契上的訓練我沒有去打擾他們但是我確實是這是我一個很大的一個期待能夠去"},{"start":1974.133,"end":2002.091,"text":"慰問我們的台灣隊長那這個已經過去了那至於您說為什麼一個私人的行程我要用自費在立法院還沒有通過行政院的預算的時候立法院去年大幅刪除行政院預算的時候我如果用公費今天的問題會更大他會說沒有這個預算沒有通過刪除了為什麼用公費去走一個私人的行程是不是"},{"start":2003.141,"end":2030.285,"text":"會不會有這種質疑當然會有這種質疑所以我一開始設定我如果可以想行經過一般的程序申請我一定要自費前往我不想讓立法院的委員們來對行政院挑這個毛病所以我完全自費所有單據都在我手上我一塊錢都沒有報工費連我去到當地坐遊覽車的錢也是我自費的"},{"start":2032.144,"end":2047.101,"text":"連門票所有的門票我都是一張一張跟棒協去買下來的請他們代買的沒有任何的事安全人員當然跟我去我只有三個隨身的隨戶跟我去其他都是其他工作人員連隨戶的"},{"start":2049.195,"end":2064.759,"text":"的費用也都是我出的這是沒有錯的 所有都在裡面這個我佩服啦但我都覺得你跟人家破壞了一個原來原來的慣例所以也不太好我就是在一個被破壞的預算體制下做這些事情這樣也是要給你按讚但是問題就是說行政首長出門比較有溝通給他出錢出門維安你要給他倒出錢我覺得這個"},{"start":2078.342,"end":2101.608,"text":"但是本席表達這一次啊你這樣的一個動作我還是佩服接下來第二個問題啊我這條算不好意思給你吐息啦不然我整條天都要夢了但是我還是覺得很怪的一點就是說你要去我都認為這是為什麼說是一個重大的外交突破你不可能 外交部長請上來一下我覺得這很奇怪 院長請外交部部長"},{"start":2103.336,"end":2104.197,"text":"所以我為什麼覺得是一個重大的外交突破"},{"start":2125.302,"end":2147.501,"text":"林部長 剛才你頭前偷偷地在那偷偷摸摸就要部署了就是說這個日本一定要重大外交突破 有沒有報告委員長已經有說明 這個性質是私人形成當然我想政治人物在國際上外面都會有一定的解讀 我們也予以尊重"},{"start":2150.75,"end":2174.25,"text":"這是都是一般的申請程序沒有任何特殊什麼樣的人做什麼大力的協助我們就是一般的申請一般的包機 一般的行程這樣一天來回很單純的私人的活動跟行程這樣一定要 我們職人我們比較怕病的兩座職人 到年底的時候 我們性質怕到好外國比賽的時候 你們頭頭來看一看"},{"start":2176.637,"end":2192.065,"text":"時間暫停 外交部長跟運動部長請回時間暫停 兩位部長請回是不是請我們交通部部長麻煩請交通部長備選我們海委會主委麻煩請海委會主委管主委備選我接下來要繼續就教院長的就是說"},{"start":2200.094,"end":2208.838,"text":"我們立法院的前同事就國民黨的委員 許育仁委員在美國的國會他去作證他去作證他認為說我們台灣整個"},{"start":2213.66,"end":2239.99,"text":"海嵐的韌性他認為他也感到非常的一個擔心就是說台灣的海嵐包含我們99%通訊設備還有整個的金融交易雲端運算國防系統跟跨國資料流動的一個命脈目前台灣有投誠跟淡水"},{"start":2240.916,"end":2248.524,"text":"巴黎跟仿山金門五個國際海欄的一個登陸站還有連接15條這樣的一個國際海欄他的傳輸寬頻我聽他在作證 我走一走說是衛星的一百萬倍"},{"start":2257.352,"end":2283.381,"text":"那他在作證的時候他也很擔心啦很擔心就是說以台灣我們現在來看的話海嵐的一個維修船隻跟耗材的一個來源那是說這個風險審查的一個控制我們現在政府做這件事情我們增加部件的密度跟後援的部門看要怎麼去確保他的一個韌性甚至於"},{"start":2284.321,"end":2303.837,"text":"我們在立法院裡面我們行政院也在2025年就去年完成所謂的海嵐七法的修正將海底的通訊、電力、電纜、天然氣跟自來水這些設施都納入保護這個並提高刑責這個都值得來肯定行政院但是他也去講到說台灣萬一萬一我們的纜線遭到破壞的時候"},{"start":2310.405,"end":2334.753,"text":"國際上的船的調度要32天那我們台灣要一百十天平常時間那個是颱風來那個是修復的問題可是如果是一種灰色作戰地帶的話灰色的衝突的話那就麻煩了會衍生重大的一個國安危機外面的交通部長我們的交通部的看法是怎麼樣"},{"start":2335.903,"end":2353.167,"text":"報告委員這個部分其實院長在去年的七月也有指示要進行修法那跟交通部相關的就是氣象法跟船舶法還有商港法這個部分的修法也都已經完成那最近對於這個海嵐的保護的相關的法令完備之後其實我們看到的現象是"},{"start":2353.927,"end":2380.607,"text":"對於三五的船隻我們的管理也落實了還有黑五旗的船隻我們的管理也落實了所以這個現象已經開始在減少海巡這邊也相當的幫忙只要遇到這方面的狀況海巡會馬上到現場去例如說這幾天就有發生一個海嵐疑似被勾斷的現象我們跟海巡這邊的合作也相當的密切目前這艘船隻也在外海滯留目前10點就要進台北港"},{"start":2382.492,"end":2404.909,"text":"接受我們的這個檢查跟詢問我的意思是說海南線的建置那麼長那麼長台灣是一個海島型國家別的國家你像歐盟那些國家其他都是陸地嘛它有很多的一個電纜可以用那台灣因為是海島我們去用破海你像譬如說監察院的報告裡面他就講得很清楚"},{"start":2405.849,"end":2429.391,"text":"檢察院提出一個示警就是說那些暗船我們現在海巡署還有我們現在國家對這些暗船的比對它叫做暗船就是那組那組的處理料ASS給你關掉雷達上看得到一艘船在那個地方它到底是誰我們全部都不知道那一些暗船如果對我們海嵐的一個破壞的話"},{"start":2431.458,"end":2460.133,"text":"我們只有國際上調度大概要32天我們自己修理要8天我今天要講的就是說一架船我們自己政府去評估海底纜線的修復我們自己去造要3到40億那我們如果說那個一年的維修費用要8億這要怎麼讓人維修一年才1億到民間企業誰要投入不會啊"},{"start":2460.695,"end":2478.81,"text":"我的意思就是說我為什麼說他是一個國安的一個餘率軍艦你不會去講成本多貴你都會去買飛彈保護國家多貴你也要去買這個海染涉及到整個國家的一個國安的一個餘率他萬一被那些"},{"start":2479.926,"end":2503.24,"text":"暗船就是一種灰色的衝突沒有開戰 可是我用這些把你騷擾甚至切斷你的一個海欄你只穿國際調度32天我們自己要拔一天這段時間如果這些那麼多的一個暗船來給你做破壞這樣我們自己國安的一個韌性我不知道你們有什麼樣的"},{"start":2504.79,"end":2522.574,"text":"方法沒有啦 是要籌備自治的維護能力還是 再這樣全世界去跟人家搶這樣到時候如果不是成平時期 成平時期還好喔如果比較緊張的時候 本席表達非常嚴重的一個關心啦 院長是 你要怎麼做 跟委員報"},{"start":2531.063,"end":2557.046,"text":"海巡的這個部分我們就負責在事前和航港局密切的合作其實我們的海纜目前中華電信跟航港局都有自動警示系統還有自動廣播系統那海巡也透過我們的雷達的監控對於海纜區域範圍之內如果有異常滯留或者是異常航行的船隻我們都會監控"},{"start":2558.587,"end":2574.501,"text":"那另外跟奧委員所關心的岸船或者是剛剛部長所說的有一些黑名單我們也都建立了一個非常完整的黑名單而且我們還分級把它的風險跟威脅程度有分級在守護那事後像剛剛部長所說的這幾天斷纜的事件"},{"start":2580.005,"end":2598.826,"text":"事後我們對於有可能有可能有嫌疑當然現在證據還不明確不一定確定是他但是只要是有嫌疑的船有時候我們一個案我們就會追兩三艘這樣子我們的海欄經常被灰色地帶的侵擾或是有意無意的破壞"},{"start":2599.867,"end":2618.575,"text":"為了加強這樣的防範我們確實我們已經加入了國際維修船區有兩個船隊一個是橫濱一個是東南亞印度洋的兩個船隊這裡面有多少的船非中國籍的船包括日本韓國新加坡印尼等等都跟我們是一個team可以共同來除了我們海巡局加強地區我們其實也要跟漁民一起來"},{"start":2628.131,"end":2648.36,"text":"我們的政府不應該針對這一些我們整個通信的一個韌性涉及到整個國安運動我們應該要有一個自主的 本土的一個團隊不然出事 收費完 國際調整什麼東西我們自己在社會上來幹什麼雖然一年才了不起七八次 最高到十二次"},{"start":2663.948,"end":2667.71,"text":"區域衝突的一個升高的時候這個國安的一個韌性通訊的韌性的一個提升值得我們行政院展示國際上的合作我們再來加強衝突的力量好 謝謝院長 加油好 謝謝卓榮銓委員資訊謝謝卓院長各相關部會首長備詢 謝謝"},{"start":2679.019,"end":2681.541,"text":"黃委員好委員昨天說我貪賭百萬我希望你今天有一個澄清的說法"},{"start":2709.67,"end":2736.371,"text":"就要看你來澄清 你要澄清 不是我要澄清我還沒開始問你 你在反質詢什麼啦我請問你現在是不是自己理虧 然後現在就開始自己來攻擊立法委員你只要修正昨天講吧院長 請你有風度一點你剛回答的問題 照時回答就好好不好你是不是自己在膽小啊 你在膽小什麼你在心虛什麼"},{"start":2737.981,"end":2754.799,"text":"妳拿得出證據嗎 立刻拿出證據啊拿出來妳怎麼辦沒有啊 妳就渡幽幽之口啊拿出來妳怎麼辦 妳昨天說我貪賭百萬沒有 我說如果妳拿不出證據 妳就涉及貪賭那今天要不要學生也教她妳去看清楚 妳拿出證據啊"},{"start":2755.96,"end":2777.629,"text":"你趕快拿出證據啊我拿得出來你怎麼辦你不要跟我囉嗦這些嘛你立刻拿出來啊我請問你啊我請問你為什麼昨天華航不說明限女儀不義是不是所以我想請問你說你是自費行程那請問一下院長你已經支付了嗎是"},{"start":2779.529,"end":2798.839,"text":"那請問一下你支付的金額是多少是用一個一個位置的錢 費用還是整個包機費用整個包機費用金額多少華航告訴我這還有商業上的顧慮但是就是合於一般的行情今天報紙也都說了這就是差不多那個價錢"},{"start":2800.595,"end":2822.598,"text":"哪個價錢哪個價錢你不是說要拿出證據來嗎昨天說的一千萬到今天的一百五十萬這件事最簡單的事情這件事最簡單的事情單據都在這裡那你就趕快拿出來啊你請行政院趕快公布這個單據我覺得才能夠渡悠悠之口"},{"start":2824.559,"end":2838.885,"text":"大家都在質疑的事情是院長有沒有公器私用的問題院長如果要澄清就拿出證據來隔天行政院有一整天"},{"start":2839.605,"end":2864.611,"text":"超过了现在从星期六到今天已经超过了76小时你可以拿出证据来你竟可以来渡外界的悠悠之口但是院长始终只是让行政院来发一个新闻稿而华航又不愿意证实当然会坐实了外界对这件事情的疑虑"},{"start":2865.171,"end":2884.747,"text":"私人的費用為什麼要向委員提供證據華航每一件包機都要向委員提供證據嗎你不是要澄清外界對你的質疑嗎你不是要澄清外界對你的質疑你還拿出一個這個牛皮子彈可以把它拿出來請行政院來公布我如果這裡面是真的委員要不要負責我沒有X光眼"},{"start":2888.53,"end":2906.315,"text":"我沒有辦法透視你告訴我我如果是真的你怎麼辦這是你對大家的負責不是我對委員你對社會個人的負責你坐飛機你有沒有付錢為什麼變娃娃娃娃替你負責笑死人了我坐飛機我自己負責你有沒有付錢你有沒有用特權你有沒有公器私用為什麼變娃娃娃娃替你負責"},{"start":2911.357,"end":2940.652,"text":"我是你的長官嗎?我是你的接護人嗎?自己的責任自己負啦你昨天為什麼說我貪圖百萬?你昨天為什麼說我貪圖百萬?我已經講過了如果你提不出證據就有涉及貪圖的事情對不對?如果提得出呢?那你趕快把證據提出來啊不要在那邊囉嗦廢話你廢話什麼啊?你一向用這個血口噴人的方式太久了太多次了會有太多人了"},{"start":2941.572,"end":2964.041,"text":"我要代表行政部門向你提出這樣的抗議不能再隨便你這樣學考騙人你抗議什麼啊 你不要惱羞成怒啊幹嘛惱羞成怒呢 請問一下部長 院長我再繼續請教好來我請教部長 國防部長來你不敢問了嗎因為這件事情 這大概是跟你有關啊來 我請教一下部長"},{"start":2964.921,"end":2981.334,"text":"因為這件事情還有一個大家質疑的地方因為院長一直強調這是私人行程好一直強調這是私人行程好那他用的是專機那顯然不是行政專機對不對因為私人行程就不能用行政專機嘛我是包機不是專機那我就問嘛"},{"start":2991.534,"end":3006.929,"text":"就我的了解應該這是華航的班機這次私人包機私人包機是吧我想我們的他就不是行政專機嘛我的了解這是處於中華航空的"},{"start":3007.866,"end":3026.587,"text":"那我請問一下因為是從松子部起飛那請問一下松子部它是軍用機場今天也有民眾打電話問松子部說我們包機就是民眾包機可不可以使用松子部"},{"start":3027.228,"end":3054.274,"text":"就松子部的回覆說不要亂問這個新聞你們都不能相信說就是松子部沒有辦法提供私人的包機所以我想請問一下為什麼這次可以讓使用松子部就是一般私人的包機可以使用軍用機場嗎按照我們跟民航局相關的這個協議可以"},{"start":3056.484,"end":3066.753,"text":"因為松山機場就是一個軍民通合用的一個機場所以我們台北的航空站因為停機位置的一個規劃"},{"start":3067.898,"end":3096.741,"text":"那依照民航局使用我們這個基地的協議書的規定他都可以向中心部來商界停機坪同樣相對的我們的軍機西腰山洞譬如說我們也會商界他們的停機坪這只有松山機場才有這種事情嗎可以用民航機可以使用我們的居用機場嗎只有松山機場可以這樣嗎因為松山機場就是一個居民合用的機場"},{"start":3099.237,"end":3117.913,"text":"不過跟委員說明就是說他這個航班的這個這個相關的管制的權責都是屬於台北航空站所以是完全由民航軍民合用機場除了松山機場之外水南機場也是在台中也是軍民合用機場所以松山機場 水南機場的這個軍用機場都可以"},{"start":3122.13,"end":3149.589,"text":"接受民航站的調度然後一般的私人飛機可以使用居庸機場是這個意思嗎對 民航局認為有需要的時候就可以來要求我們提供相關的那我請問我們現在如果說一般的其實包機還有這些私人飛機 但是這樣的作業都還是民航局在負責的委員你已經聽到答案了但是我要告訴委員去到日本這一趟"},{"start":3150.589,"end":3168.817,"text":"事先是多麼的小心謹慎雖然是私人的行程還是不想生出其他的節外的生枝節外生枝結出來所以一切都非常的審慎在進行如果看到今天事後這樣的一個現象"},{"start":3170.165,"end":3188.171,"text":"大家在這裡找這樣的問題的時候我更證明我請求這個中指部是對的因為我只要經過中山家長我只要新聞被播出來我可能整形都有問題"},{"start":3189.687,"end":3209.692,"text":"你不認為嗎而且我認為我們那麼早的飛機我都不想去影響其他正常航班你這一趟引起了外界這麼多質疑你有責任對外界來解釋外界的質疑對不對有 對只有中國共產黨跟你們在生氣"},{"start":3211.392,"end":3226,"text":"你看 我就知道 你就想要什麼中國不共產黨請問一下 我們為納稅人把關我們為社會的局域來詢問你有何不可 如果今天我們對你有沒有公器私用你又要把它講成說我們是中共的同路人物嗎"},{"start":3234.845,"end":3242.43,"text":"所以我還是希望說如果你覺得你問心無愧你就把這些所有的資料把它公開出來另外 其實院長我已經跟你講了"},{"start":3260.697,"end":3275.821,"text":"我為什麼要為你的行為負責啊?你不附屬,你有沒有問過我啊?你不附屬行為,你有問過我嗎?我為你說的事情負責嗎?你到底是什麼人啊?我為你負責啊?你真的是莫名其妙啊?什麼重大事情,你要問什麼意思啊?你不要讓所有的官員貪得百萬你過去的歷史就是這個樣子"},{"start":3289.663,"end":3308.582,"text":"韓院長你可以忍受一個人說你貪圖百萬嗎容我跟王委員還有卓院長說明一下我們整個總諮詢都是吸引委員所提問的請院長閣員就諮詢的範圍來答覆大家一定要相互尊重理性的溝通"},{"start":3319.888,"end":3335.296,"text":"謝謝院長我還是非常希望行政院對於我們的秩序有基本的尊重其實你剛剛可以看得非常清楚是我們卓院長自己心虛先攻擊另外我想請教非常重大的問題"},{"start":3336.477,"end":3350.222,"text":"今天呢其實各大報的頭版幾乎都是能源問題就是我們的油價已經標國際油價標破100美元之多我不曉得卓院長你還笑得出來喔"},{"start":3351.824,"end":3379.961,"text":"昨天早上還能笑得出來啊你要講的能源你要講的油價我可以清楚的回答你降到90塊了我現在跟你講嘛另外呢就是昨天整個國際的股市暴跌但是今天確實今天有回升因為川普講說這個戰爭快要打完了所以我想請教一下我想請教一下我本來就說這兩天其實都非常關鍵"},{"start":3381.802,"end":3395.919,"text":"剛才我講說院長說私人行程這是你的休假時間老師說啦高市長苗有休假嗎李在民有休假嗎 沒有他們都在召開緊急會議如何回應能源問題啊"},{"start":3397.26,"end":3405.09,"text":"他們不敢休假啦好 請問一下來來來 部長請問一下部長請教一下我們現在 因為你昨天說我們現在呢已經調度了20艘船因為我們大概有22艘的LNG的船"},{"start":3415.461,"end":3432.349,"text":"這個需求現在已經調度到20艘所以這三四月的天然氣目前現在看起來暫時沒有斷氣危機這是你昨天的說明這是只有三四月以後也不會因為"},{"start":3433.59,"end":3454.597,"text":"距離我們只有百分之三十而已其他百分之七十才是所以你這邊在這邊保證因為你本來說如果沒有辦法調度成功可能四月份的就要全部採用燃煤來發電所以你在這邊可以保證我來請教你你可以保證在這一次的中東地區的戰爭不管他什麼時候結束"},{"start":3459.739,"end":3475.95,"text":"我們絕對沒有斷氣危機絕對不會全部採用燃煤發電你可以保證嗎我有這樣的信心那如果不行的話怎麼辦看你怎麼辦我就怎麼辦所以你們永遠都是這樣為什麼如果這樣的話我去當經濟部長"},{"start":3489.936,"end":3502.929,"text":"該我負責的責任我來當經濟部長我就會跟大家講說如果我今天講完全我們不會我們不會全部採用燃煤來發電的話我做不到我就下台"},{"start":3503.61,"end":3518.272,"text":"因為對我是經濟部長但是為什麼我不是經濟部長我為什麼要為卓榮泰院長的事情來負責我為什麼為你的事情來負責好那另外請教一下就是我們有沒有可能釋出我們的戰略出遊"},{"start":3519.076,"end":3541.808,"text":"因為現在全世界都在討論這個事情比如說韓國有這樣的考慮而且他要做一個所謂的油價上限就是他要設一個油價上限我們其實在星期六也就是院長去看球的當天我們其實做了一件事情我是覺得很不錯的"},{"start":3542.688,"end":3554.893,"text":"就是讓中油提前宣布下週的油價因為那是很特殊的一般禮拜一的油價是禮拜天才宣布那天就是跟院長有討論院長那天在日本我想請問一下因為"},{"start":3559.995,"end":3584.853,"text":"在這個時候最容易有預期漲價的心理因為這幾天呢我們可以看到就是在尤其星期五星期六都大排長龍尤其那種小客車就是營業小客車因為對他們來講會是很大的成本所以請問一下部長我們會不會釋出我們的戰略出油"},{"start":3586.287,"end":3611.713,"text":"幫委員因為我們是平穩汽油價格所以每個禮拜我們現在在院長的指示下大概禮拜六禮拜天我們就會決定下禮拜而且原則上來講都會按照這個原則所以你目前沒有計劃釋出戰略儲油是不是因為我們現在我們現在的這個油法律上規定是要60天但是我們現在的儲備有150幾天"},{"start":3614.173,"end":3628.749,"text":"所以那個空間蠻大的好所以目前沒有那另外請教一下因為有可能因為國際油價仍然蠢蠢欲動那在上個禮拜其實有一個問題就是很多的因為這個"},{"start":3631.323,"end":3648.791,"text":"石油價格跟天然氣價格你們可以宣布但是呢統裝瓦斯統裝瓦斯是一個地方就是很多自己瓦斯行會決定所以現在有傳出別說南部的瓦斯行有加20塊一桶瓦斯已經漲價20塊"},{"start":3650.552,"end":3670.297,"text":"那也有北部的網社好像說你叫下一桶的時候呢你的價格呢可能就還要增加到多少錢就一定漲價所以對於很多的小吃店餐飲業他們就很害怕所以我在這邊請教部長第一個我們天然氣價格暫時是不是繼續動漲是不是繼續動漲"},{"start":3672.776,"end":3689.401,"text":"天然氣的部分現在目前目前是沒有那請問一下那麼瓦斯所以瓦斯的價格也應該是屬於動漲的狀況因為我知道台塑化已經漲價了總裝瓦斯中油本來就沒有要漲因為你剛才講20塊那個是台塑台塑我們"},{"start":3690.801,"end":3711.445,"text":"你們在協調對我們盡量去協調好了因為他是民間的為什麼我們在這邊總質詢那麼重要我們就是來問很多民眾的質疑或者他們的問題所以我想請問一下有一下待會我問你天然企業涉及統裝瓦斯我們動漲到什麼時候我們目前預計動漲到什麼時候"},{"start":3714.403,"end":3742.279,"text":"沒有我們會看情況不過基本上還是以穩定物價為主那三月底之前有沒有可能我們當然要看世界的情況各個油價的漲幅的程度還有機動的調整現在就講說到幾月那就是不精確的講法沒有經濟部長會這麼做基本上三月因為我剛才為什麼問這個問題我的意思就是說因為其實預期漲價的心理有時候是很可怕的"},{"start":3743.379,"end":3767.95,"text":"所以我剛剛講啊我支持你們星期六就宣布那個油價讓大家不要再繼續一直排一直排一直排然後我也支持因為打起來它的波動就會非常非常大所以也暫時的動漲天然氣的價格對不對好那另外請教一下時間暫停一下我請我們財政部時間暫停麻煩請財政部長備詢"},{"start":3784.859,"end":3806.051,"text":"財政部一個問題就是最近這個台股在今天當然我剛剛沒有再繼續看因為我知道就是一開盤漲了1000點左右那麼我們國安基金因為前陣子宣布退場所以國安基金在這一波的波動中我們國安基金是不是會進場來穩定市場"},{"start":3810.201,"end":3822.805,"text":"這一次的波動是因為中東的戰事以及油價可能會上漲這些因素的影響那財政部會密切的關注整個股市的一個情況國安基金會不會在這邊step by這個進場要經過國安基金委員會來決議"},{"start":3828.191,"end":3849.738,"text":"所以我們這個部分我們會持續的關注如果有必要的時候才會再招待所以部長不排除因為這次還是因為我們不曉得什麼時候結束這個股市的動態不排除國安基金會伺機進場謝謝部長另外再請教院長和那個經濟部長這個其實有很多人非常關心"},{"start":3850.731,"end":3874.527,"text":"院長在去年五月份的時候宣布了我們核電走入歷史因為核三廠完全的都除役了去年五月十七號核三廠二號機然後在今年的二月十號你又公開說全面接受新式核能技術就重新擁抱了核電要重新擁抱核電"},{"start":3875.347,"end":3882.672,"text":"那我想請問一下院長你所謂的新式核能你的規劃是什麼準備什麼時候啟動委員要先了解什麼叫新式的核能現在包括SMR包括核融合都是一個新的技術在討論他什麼時候可以商轉全世界許多國家都還在做很多的努力當中很多的國際性的組合包括ITER等等"},{"start":3904.605,"end":3927.738,"text":"做了一個新型的托克馬克的一個發電機組也都在延期當中所以現在聽起來你還是屬於一個這個認數的階段而已這是研發的過程怎麼叫認數另外我請教我另外請教比較實質具體的因為最近台電也好經濟部也好都有特別提到核二廠"},{"start":3928.658,"end":3954.932,"text":"跟河山厂河山现在就说跟原厂在做规划而且说准备把这个计划书在三月份就是再运转计划准备三月底前送河安会所以我想请问河山厂如果你们的评估是安全无虞的话有没有可能在今年底之前"},{"start":3956.513,"end":3972.602,"text":"開始做這個整個的啟動的計劃從時程上看起來是比較困難那大概要到什麼時候呢市主安全檢查要一段時間那我們當然是跟這個原廠有西屋公司就盡快那已經簽約了"},{"start":3973.803,"end":3989.43,"text":"那已經開始來檢查這個老化的狀況就是機具你用久了總是會老化需不需要更替更換所以部長我在問你時程的問題在核管法修法之後我們還是謹守原來的三個原則就是核安要沒有疑慮"},{"start":3990.05,"end":4012.1,"text":"核廢一定要有一個助理因為大家社會上有高度的共識所以還沒有時間表的意思時間表就是3月份台電會提出再運轉計畫隨後會提出一個自主安全檢查這個時程過了如果可行有必要做任何的更換器材設備等等都完成了以後那麼才看看社會有沒有高度的共識"},{"start":4013.14,"end":4040.615,"text":"核二廠我也是有點驚訝核二廠現在你們開始也跟奇異公司在洽談中是嗎是好那跟奇異公司在所以也也是準備開始整個核二廠的一個重啟的計畫嗎是的因為他比較複雜因為他的那個燃料爐裡面還有我們的燃料棒所以那個要清出來以後才可以部長院長請問一下"},{"start":4042.665,"end":4056.777,"text":"如果河二廠 河三廠要重啟研議的話要花多少錢那看這個自主安全檢查要更換多少節目要花多少錢 你不能完全沒有概念啊我們從來沒有經驗過 我們沒有辦法在這裡說從來不規劃 從來沒有去評估多少還是跟原廠有做一個討論好 那我提供這個金額 這金額呢"},{"start":4065.925,"end":4075.363,"text":"也是當時呢一些的這個環保團體啊跟台電一起共同評估啊那時候之前的評估你們現在當然不敢講還有一場150億和三場300億"},{"start":4078.882,"end":4097.382,"text":"這是當時就說為什麼核二廠也要讓他研議啊核三廠也要研議啊如果要重新讓他除役啊如果要讓他研議的話我們要花150億我們要花300億結果我們現在開始做從前計畫要不要花錢要不要花到這個規模的錢除役是法律的規定"},{"start":4105.605,"end":4128.831,"text":"當時包含卓業長也上街頭說我是人我反核好像如果你不反核你就不是人那個是核四 核四公投沒有過不就是反核嗎核四公投那時候是反核四公投這是當年很更早的時候不是在核四公投好我要講的就是我們錯誤的能源政策"},{"start":4129.751,"end":4156.558,"text":"所謂的非核家園政策已經讓我們看到現在整個我們的能源界各如此的脆弱我們大部分的發電大幅的倚賴火力發電所以這次中東這樣的地區的危機我想部長這幾天應該你沒有休假我有說過如果你休假你要打屁股你應該怎麼想說我們要怎麼去調度因為我們太倚賴天然氣了"},{"start":4157.358,"end":4181.147,"text":"我們太依賴火力發電我們整個的能源發電結構極為脆弱現在呢 我們現在要重新反核這個反呢 是反回來加一個走字邊所以錯誤的所以三四月沒有問題就是很努力調度也調度的相當有相當的進展這個委員應該肯定"},{"start":4182.848,"end":4203.887,"text":"我肯定他 我沒有肯定 我跟你講嘛部長說這幾天都在 我想他都在加班怎麼樣去調整不只一個部長 所有的部位都在動我要講 俗令自知啊今天我們過去 大家說破嘴了說破嘴說 大家一定不能完全的放棄核電核市場是誰封存的啊"},{"start":4205.625,"end":4209.746,"text":"當時何市長是誰封存的所以是誰封存的哪一個總統封存的不是啊何市長是誰封存這個是誰封存你說的氣氛就是有一個非核家原種嗎"},{"start":4226.872,"end":4253.663,"text":"你只剩10年沒有責任嗎所以我要講的就是錯誤的能源政策比貪污更可怕錯誤的政策比貪污更可怕今天就是因為非核家園造成台灣現在整個能源的脆弱今天在講任性安全任性 國防任性 台灣任性結果能源沒有任性胡亂的指責比無知更無知"},{"start":4255.049,"end":4274.257,"text":"你們最無知啊對啊 胡亂的指責是誰啊你們最無知啊我可不可以講一分鐘今天如果不是你無知請問一下你跟西屋簽什麼約啊你跟西屋簽什麼約 你跟奇藝簽什麼約啊非核家園啊 繼續抱住你的反核神主牌啊經過40年廚藝之後要重啟不要簽約嗎經過40年廚藝要重啟不用簽約嗎強詞奪理 這就是民進黨自己的政策是錯誤的 還要強詞奪理"},{"start":4282.921,"end":4288.748,"text":"我回答就是說強者奪理不回答就是黑箱這就是你們的作風我再來請問一下時間暫停一下請一下張中部部長"},{"start":4297.096,"end":4317.521,"text":"麻煩請交通部長備詢這時候我可以講一下嗎現在時間暫停暫停我可以講一下嗎你講你講這一次的戰爭的發生不管你有沒有可能都遭遇到下時間暫停不能占用我的時間好吧不要占用我的時間因為你講話就不能就不能計時時間繼續好請問一下部長在去年去年"},{"start":4325.302,"end":4354.141,"text":"你上任之後大家一直談到就是我們的觀光觀光很慘然後我們每一年的來台旅客人總數一直沒有辦法達到我們的目標然後我們的國旅元年也破功了整個提振觀光每次都說觀光國家對然後你說要爭取高端客等等之類的但是我們看不到我們觀光人數的增加"},{"start":4355.562,"end":4364.989,"text":"因為我自己所在的選區有很多的觀光產業所以我想請問我想請問你們就沒有到你們的那個什麼目標嘛每一次都是票票等一下好來來來好部長我給你一點一分鐘我給你一分鐘時間你講你觀光做得多好好所以你觀光做得好棒棒你講讓我們所有的觀光業者來聽看看"},{"start":4385.379,"end":4390.546,"text":"你講不出來了所以我在這邊要特別的利用我總質詢的時間提醒部長觀光真的要實作不要用什麼就是"},{"start":4402.4,"end":4427.833,"text":"這個通訊啊什麼我們手機啊然後這個東西就說有觀光人數增加不要做這種虛視虛假掩飾太平正視我們現在的觀光問題好不好我為什麼利用我的總諮詢時間拜託我們能夠正視我們現在的觀光產業我們現在很多的我們現在很多的景點數字增加有沒有增加是有依據的"},{"start":4428.933,"end":4453.265,"text":"高雄的五星級飯店都關門了院長請你們有一點側影之心請你們有一點能夠關心大家整體的住宿率是提高的民宿也增加了接近三分之一的數量相當多所以我們的供給量增加了不少在供給量增加的狀況底下我們的住宿率還是往上提升"},{"start":4454.546,"end":4472.403,"text":"再來您剛所說的公安課的部分我要跟副長看院長在疫情之後每一年增加去年增加幾十萬前年增加上百萬而且我們現在在歐美的旅客包含菲律賓的旅客來台灣都增加雙位數以上都超過疫情之前"},{"start":4473.044,"end":4491.323,"text":"我們東南亞觀光的旅客在駕降中我給你們一個數字喔在去年我們的觀光人數也好 金額也好都是逆差的狀況對不對包國雲 您知道美國跟中國 加拿大 澳洲都是逆差的嗎"},{"start":4492.708,"end":4509.4,"text":"我請問一下 台灣不是希望觀光立國嗎你偏偏在比爛喔 你要比爛嗎所以我要講的就是喔如果你們還是不能夠去正視你們的問題你先等一下喔另外 我要跟"},{"start":4511.317,"end":4532.97,"text":"就是院長反映的一點因為當然這個部分很多是司法院的部分但是我覺得這涉及社會觀感當時我也有問過院長就是太子集團的詐騙集團當時有一個就參效交保就是他的特助參效交保你當時說你也很生氣"},{"start":4533.951,"end":4551.527,"text":"好我現在告訴你太子集團現在九個高級幹部全部交保全部都交保在台灣洗錢107億元其中一個幹部他交保的他的那個理由是什麼他說他要回家照顧他們家的烏龜啊"},{"start":4553.228,"end":4569.775,"text":"如果烏龜沒有他照顧會死掉啊這樣的理由也可以說得出來太子集團根本就是我們打詐不利一個整個詐騙洗錢的一個大家深惡痛絕結果全部幹部全部交保"},{"start":4571.051,"end":4594.389,"text":"過去我們在政治的案件裡面 壓了多少人是不是 現在有沒有法國部長自己跑出來了好再來 我們一直在講說要抓共諜抓共諜當時有很多的民進黨的黨工或者是曾經在我們像我們的國安會也好或外交部也好"},{"start":4595.009,"end":4601.668,"text":"结果最近包含在国安会和外交部的和人节还有一个秋市"},{"start":4606.834,"end":4624.827,"text":"太子職業教法是法律我們起訴每一個職業的法律教法這個教法在過後我想每一個人都要考慮考慮看好因為看好這個職業在另外一個職業在那裡"},{"start":4626.188,"end":4643.679,"text":"太難看了啦所以我剛有講確實是司法院的問題但是我們要有作為而且你們現在難道司法院沒有大法官都幫你們的啊是不是所以你要幫他們"},{"start":4658.166,"end":4670.357,"text":"在我們國務院任期所有的幹部全部交保竟然還說要回家養不歸就讓他交保太可笑了太可笑了好 謝謝王宏威委員的質詢謝謝總院長 相關部委所長備詢 謝謝"},{"start":4679.756,"end":4692.37,"text":"我們休息十分鐘謝謝吳佩儀委員 丁學中委員 王育民委員洪宇湘委員 還有邱規祿委員來陪同我們參加總質詢休息十分鐘"},{"start":5370.222,"end":5393.919,"text":"好 不然我們繼續開會 接下來我們請邱惠如委員會諮詢李昆成委員請準備有請院長有請衛福部部長麻煩請衛福部長備詢"},{"start":5402.901,"end":5416.036,"text":"邱委員好 院長好委員長 部長好我今天站在質詢台上是肩負著互理同仁的期盼"},{"start":5417.267,"end":5442.063,"text":"然後希望在質詢台上能夠向我們有為有首的官員來請命希望我們有為有首的政府能夠儘早趕快的終結我們護理人員血汗的勞動困境好 那我這邊想請教部長 請問一下部長有掌握我國取得護理人員證書的人數有多少嗎"},{"start":5442.928,"end":5468.988,"text":"到目前為止是超過19萬19萬多許得證書是30萬不是 現在直登中的直登中的19萬多那是我第二個問題母數是30萬 直登是19萬謝謝部長已經把我的第二個問題回答出來那我現在想請教部長一個簡單的數學問題就是直登率是多少直登率大概我們從過去看起來average大概在六成到六成五之間"},{"start":5469.939,"end":5493.711,"text":"我們的直燈率就如同部長所言就大概是在六成上下那這個直燈率部長你覺得高嗎當然我們還有很多的空間啦就是很多的場域還是需要護理人員的加入那當然我們也在擴大這個可以直燈的這個場域所以這個直燈客觀上來說其實是不高的是低的"},{"start":5494.971,"end":5515.356,"text":"羅馬不是一天造成的值登率低也不是一天造成的是從過去今年累月累積到今天我們看到這個63的數字其實是非常的低那我想值登率會低是因為離職率高值登率會低是因為護理系學生的註冊率也低"},{"start":5516.857,"end":5538.775,"text":"所以我們的立法院預算中心其實他就有指出說即使衛福部通過了12項護理人力的整備計畫但是護理人力還是沒有有效的提升讓我們來看圖說故事這副圖的意境是在一條充滿毒物的河流當中"},{"start":5539.776,"end":5562.361,"text":"於而自身其中受不了毒物的侵襲所以逃離了這條河那我覺得我們護理職場的困境跟這一個圖的意境也非常的接近就是我們護理人員自身在充滿毒物的護理環境因為受不了被這些毒物所侵襲所以離開了職場紛紛的離開職場那我這邊想請教部長"},{"start":5566.002,"end":5593.97,"text":"你覺得護理職場的毒物是什麼為什麼會讓護理人員紛紛的想逃離好 跟委員說明一下那這個過去在從2020開始的這一個全球的這個疫情啊那麼帶來很大的衝擊那我們護理人員確實是非常的辛苦那也因為呢護理人員的投入才能夠讓全球的疫情走出不過呢從全球的報告也看得出來這個長期這個"},{"start":5596.19,"end":5605.364,"text":"長達二到三年的這種疫情也造成了臨床上非常的burn out所以在這個疫情過後全球都發生"},{"start":5605.97,"end":5633.809,"text":"人力短缺特別是護理人力的短缺部長我知道影響歸咎於COVID-19的問題我想這是一個毋庸置疑的原因但是還有其他的原因當然也會牽涉到我列舉三大毒物在護理職場這條河流當中第一個就是護病比高第二個就是低薪第三個就是勞動條件差那請問一下部長您怎麼看當然從這個我們"},{"start":5635.56,"end":5662.628,"text":"疫情之後也提出了這個改善這個護理人力的12項策略就是從這三個方向來著手第一個就是人才培育第二個就是正向的職場第三個就是薪資的改善所以我們就從這三個方向提出了12項策略那慢慢慢慢的我們也看到了一些成果出來我滾瓜爛手非常了如指掌那12項策略其實裡頭並沒有"},{"start":5664.848,"end":5689.055,"text":"低薪的提升當然有提到夜班津貼但那不是一個整體薪資的提升有有有 薪資的提升有在裡頭跟委員說明我們投入了除了剛剛您提到的夜班津貼還有這個三班戶比比獎勵之外我們在這個健保的部分也在做調整像我們去年就調整了這個護理費的部分"},{"start":5690.536,"end":5703.471,"text":"25億 那麼就投入未來4年那它就要轉換到然後我們各項的調整我等一下會呈現護理界的第二個度性物質低薪的問題我們等一下在那邊提到那當然謝謝部長您的補充"},{"start":5704.392,"end":5717.147,"text":"那我這邊提一下就是您提到12項整備計劃其實在我一個護理法律學者來看我覺得12項整備計劃完全沒有提到勞動條件的改善那這一點我們也等一下在第三個執行務"},{"start":5719.569,"end":5738.778,"text":"也有所謂的友善職場的典範推動這個也有在裡面沒關係我們等到第三部分再來慢慢的細說這些我們很關切的主題那也因為我們護理職場這條河充滿毒性物質所以護理的缺口就是始終補不起來"},{"start":5739.958,"end":5759.272,"text":"去年衛福部提出關於物理人力的高推估是21萬那低推估是20萬8千可是真正投入職場卻只有19萬那這個缺口我想是持續的存在甚至到了2030年也就是民國119年這個缺口就變更大因為當時"},{"start":5760.633,"end":5773.965,"text":"衛福部所提出來的一個評估的結果護理人力需要的人數是24到26萬那看起來人力的缺口會有5到7萬那請問一下這麼大的一個人力缺口請問衛福部要怎麼因應"},{"start":5775.34,"end":5797.381,"text":"跟委員說明確實在人力上我們有缺口不過現在也慢慢看到已經在回流當中那麼以現在今年跟去年同期比已經增加4700多人慢慢在回流那另一方面我們要從另外兩個部分一個就是負荷的減輕剛剛提到的我們也導入了所謂的住院整合性照護把這個"},{"start":5799.068,"end":5818.939,"text":"這個護理的助手 照護員把他引入我知道 你在講12項整備計畫的內容那我當然覺得那些是重要但不是最重要的導入智慧照護我們透過科技的協助那麼也來簡化 優化這個護理的作業我知道 部長非常急於想要跟我分享你如何改善護理的困境"},{"start":5819.859,"end":5834.938,"text":"我們先從第一個毒性物質開始來說題好不好就是高護病比那我想請教一下部長你應該知道現行的法律秩序就是以全日平均護病比來規範護理人員的人力那這裡有三個數字分別是92跟15請問一下部長對這組數字滿意嗎"},{"start":5840.178,"end":5865.265,"text":"這個是在設置標準裡頭但是我們在113年有開始設定了三班互併比的目標那才會導入這個三班互併比的獎勵計畫就講到我們護理人員胸口永遠的痛因為三班互併比從你剛有講三個數字那三個數字 抱歉三班互併比有九個數字這九個數字部長你還記得是什麼時候公告的嗎"},{"start":5866.125,"end":5879.212,"text":"這個是在113年大家討論出來啦作為一個目標作為我們這個叫做三班互併比獎勵達標的這個標準啦三班互併比有九個數字這九個數字是在2025年"},{"start":5881.913,"end":5903.679,"text":"2024年1月26號公告的對就是如同你說的113年但是這個三班護病比公告至今已經超過兩年了但是都還沒有入法所以我才剛說這是我們護理人員胸口永遠的痛因為一直在期待我們大有為的政府有為有守的衛福部能夠趕快加緊的幫我們推出三班護病比入法結果沒有看到"},{"start":5904.099,"end":5920.241,"text":"有為的政府幫我們推動反而是我們台灣民眾黨完全已經等不及了在去年12月12號的時候就把三百五病病護法的條文禁付惡毒他的這個達標率已經在提升了在113年起始的時候那麼醫學中心能夠達標的大概只有26%"},{"start":5922.063,"end":5948.365,"text":"那現在已經到70%可以達標所以其實在醫學中心如果達標的數字是由醫院自填的請問你覺得會不會失真而欠缺公信力好那我現在請問一下部長顯然你對這組數字九十二十六是不滿意的所以你才提到三班戶病比的九個數字那我們先解決現行的法律秩序我們再展望未來我們護理人員最引頸期班的三班戶病比"},{"start":5949.045,"end":5970.515,"text":"那請問一下部長有掌握醫院違反全日平均護病比的開罰資料嗎我們過去這個三班護病比是這樣一方面是設置標準的要求那個是全日護病比那三班護病比呢我們是按照這個目標來做獎勵那但是事實上部長我是在講全日平均護病比"},{"start":5970.675,"end":5972.355,"text":"那我這邊就想請教卓院長在這邊嘛卓院長不是"},{"start":5992.26,"end":6019.769,"text":"號稱說他手下都是行動內閣那怎麼我們會要一個資料感覺需要曠日廢時的等待等待五個禮拜有一點被拖拖拉拉的感覺那如果你這樣的一個拖拖拉拉的動作其實是有一點小打臉你的長官他是行動內閣你展現出來的是烏龜內閣 螞蟻內閣 蝸牛內閣我覺得這樣可能會對卓院長很難交代吧好 那全日平均護病比沒關係因為你們要提供資料五個禮拜3月25號也眼見的"},{"start":6021.089,"end":6042.24,"text":"跟委員說明因為這個全日戶病比他是設在設置標準那麼他的處分單位是在地方政府所以可能我們是需要衛生局要去收集其實如果今天身為一個有監督角色的衛福部你早就應該採用這些資料了我請同仁來加速"},{"start":6042.66,"end":6070.152,"text":"那麼請這個衛生局趕快提供因為不是立法委員問你你才掌握這些資料應該這些資料你早就應該掌握然後掌握了之後你要思考如何加以改善好那說起這個全日平均護病比的數字呢我想衛福部每個月都有定期公告那這些公告的數字哪裡來的就如同我剛剛說的是醫院自填的請問一下醫院自填會不會有失真欠缺公信力的問題所以這邊我們想要請部長可不可以建立一個查核"},{"start":6070.832,"end":6096.662,"text":"醫院所填報過來的護病筆的資料我們現在已經有這個機制啦一個就是在那個護理那個爭議平台他可以來提我們也會處理這個就是第一個這個是屬於比較被動式的第二個呢我們有主動式的因為我們有三班護病筆的獎勵所以我們就會去查核他是不是真的有這樣的達標的情形所以那個我們有查核的機制"},{"start":6097.362,"end":6114.293,"text":"你們的查核機制其實都是來自於醫院的自填我現在是希望能夠有一個客觀不施政具有公信力的我們來講毒核的第二個毒性物質高護病比請問一下三班護病比什麼時候要入法"},{"start":6114.873,"end":6137.182,"text":"我們會朝這個方向努力我們不期待現在立刻馬上我們台灣民眾黨的版本已經進入進步二讀在去年12月12號我們不期待現在立刻馬上但我們期待的是給壓一個日期讓我們護理人員能夠望梅止渴有一個繼續往前動的一個動力也不要讓職場人力越流失越多"},{"start":6139.198,"end":6167.56,"text":"我記得那個賴清德總統在總統大選之前曾經說三班互併比兩年入法當時的時間點是2023年9月現在兩年已經過去顯然這張支票已經跳票了當時時任的衛福部部長也就是薛瑞元部長他也在總統大選前說互併比兩年會入法但選後再去問他他就說沒有規劃那這感覺就很像在欺騙護理人員的感情選前山盟海誓選後誤會一場"},{"start":6169.298,"end":6180.426,"text":"委員 容許我一小段跟你回應很感謝也很尊敬委員對護理人員這樣的一個在專業上給他們很多的建議給我們很多的指導從2008年開始"},{"start":6183.866,"end":6200.826,"text":"藍丁格爾獎的舉辦就是我參與那個慈悅基金會的藍丁格爾獎所以我跟你們是一樣的我現在跟大家講的是說我們這個三班互併比我們現在做的先把護理人員他的職登率把它提高提高其中還有一個方法我們希望考用的時候能夠比較合於實際"},{"start":6203.369,"end":6222.129,"text":"讓考試之後的人能夠增加我需要一個具體時間不用現在立刻馬上望梅止渴壓一個日期喔那部長不好意思因為你們都文質彬彬語速太慢我只剩下17分鐘後面還有一個豐富的一個困境的展現要呈現在大家眼裡"},{"start":6224.491,"end":6240.309,"text":"我想推動的過程就是先把職登人員再往大提高惠福部或者是行政院對三班戶並比的態度就是延逸延逸再延逸我們護理人員就是等待等待再等待確實有獎勵的方式出來了在這種情況之下真的是橫批是不是要"},{"start":6241.41,"end":6259.901,"text":"寫個衛福部無能四個字這才能反映出我們護理人員已經獎勵的方式出來了現在把人數提高一定的程度獎勵是一個方式但不是最好的方式最好的方式是要開罰又或者是說要雙管齊下那我們台灣民眾黨剛剛已經提出來三班戶病比我們有"},{"start":6260.742,"end":6260.922,"text":"這個我剛剛提過啦"},{"start":6281.243,"end":6292.268,"text":"要這個入法之前應該先把怎麼入法要把它先理清楚那麼我們的回珠全世界很難有一個固定的固定的數字來做處分"},{"start":6300.572,"end":6325.951,"text":"因為所有的醫院的屬性照護的強度是不一樣的所以要入法要處分他必須要一個明確的法律所以我們進入護理職場這條獨核的第二個獨姓戶只好低薪請問一下部長你知道我們的總統有曾經說過護理人員的心境護士的薪水有五萬請問你覺得心境護士的薪水有五萬嗎"},{"start":6328.524,"end":6350.446,"text":"應該要看各個層級跟場域不同我想這個薪水大概只有夢里才有夢里才有五萬這個林靜儀部長次長林靜儀次長又說你們醫事人員不能做夢現在可能連夢里五萬也沒有了這個五萬的說法完全是被審計部的一個決算報告所打臉"},{"start":6350.947,"end":6377.526,"text":"因為審計部的決算報告提出來說護理人員新進的他們的月頭保薪資只有3.8萬所以打臉了你的學長邱太元部長說護理人員的薪水有7萬請問一下部長護理人員的薪水有7萬嗎你的版本是什麼我們看到5萬7萬數字眼花繚亂數字看起來很嚮往很羨慕總統還說很羨慕醫護人員那知道我們局內人其實是苦不堪言"},{"start":6379.051,"end":6386.948,"text":"跟委員說明您的這個檢報裡面出現的這個數字主要是來自於在醫院我們這個部裡面有一個平台"},{"start":6388.203,"end":6413.556,"text":"讓這個醫院他要求職的時候他要招募這個護理人員的時候他會把他的薪資條件PO在上面大家看到這個數字對不對我們不要一個會道歉的衛福部我們要一個會做事的衛福部好那我們來討論低薪的問題如何解決剛剛部長您有提到護理費護理費有兩個問題第一個問題就是太低第二個問題呢就是"},{"start":6414.176,"end":6432.049,"text":"健保署給付護理費給醫院醫院有沒有把護理費的點值回饋到護理人員的身上這個無從得知所以我們在這邊想要請部長能夠建立一個監督醫院有把護理費回饋到護理人員薪水上的一個制度部長請問可以嗎"},{"start":6432.329,"end":6459.145,"text":"有去年就開始做了去年我們在調升這個護理費的時候就有個條件他的這個護理人員的薪資的薪籍頭髮薪資要提升所以這個我們已經建立這個機制公開透明因為我們護理界19萬大軍完全都覺得薪水的發放是一個黑箱所以可能要公開透明要揭示要公告要做好這個教育的宣導去年開始調的這個護理費的部分包含在"},{"start":6459.925,"end":6486.858,"text":"急診的護理會你現在在講數字過低數字過低當然我有看到衛福部這幾年的努力數字確實有微幅的調整但是再講護理費回饋到護理人員的身上有沒有公開透明的機制再來當然我也有看到這裡要肯定一下衛福部就是說有看到對於低薪這個問題今年有發一些獎勵金獎勵金大致有三個一個就是三標護病比達標的獎勵金一個就是夜班津貼"},{"start":6487.518,"end":6514.42,"text":"一個就是春節獎勵金但是其實這些獎勵金有幾個缺點第一個缺點杯水車型第二個缺點延遲發放第三個缺點呢一樣如同我剛剛對護理費所提出來的一個批評指教就是說發放的方式不公開透明那當然我知道三班戶病比編列預算去年是16億那第一年發出是5.2億那事實上後來的資料慢慢的揭曉其實有些醫院拿到三班戶病比的一個達標的金額"},{"start":6516.041,"end":6536.05,"text":"有些只拿到這個有五千多塊一千多塊八百多塊還有一百九十五塊請問你發給醫院三班戶病名達標的獎勵金只有一百九十五塊可能連買一個便當都買不起請問這如何能夠達到一個獎勵的效果呢跟委員說明這個是一個奇怪的這個outlier啦應該這麼講因為我們有兩筆錢"},{"start":6538.496,"end":6559.034,"text":"一筆是夜班津貼一般津貼是按據上班就有所以它不會出現這個數字我當然我講的是三班戶病筆的獎勵金三班戶病筆它的獎勵是根據你的收治病人的人數天數去乘以一個百分比出來所以這幾家醫院我都看過特別去查過它可能就一床"},{"start":6559.414,"end":6585.063,"text":"你們這些資料都是來自於病人所以他加成之後的百分比只能這樣所以我們現在已經重新檢討所以現在我們進入第二個題目第二個題目就是關於獎勵金有延遲發放的問題去年十一十二月應該發的到現在還沒有發放已經進入三月進入四月了所以請衛福部在獎勵金的發放上能夠快一點那至於你說的夜班津貼"},{"start":6585.703,"end":6606.64,"text":"是在次次月的時候發放你發給醫院醫院再發給護理人員護理人員會經過一個還蠻漫長的等待所以衛福部這邊能不能夠監督把這個夜班獎勵金能夠加強因為跟委員說明他現在已經變成是一個常規都是在次月的20號呢連同在健保申報的時候他會一起申報上來"},{"start":6607.821,"end":6633.148,"text":"但是你發給醫院醫院什麼時候發給護理人員這一段再請衛福部能夠來監督那好接下來蔣麗菁有一些黑歷史以前的蔣麗菁創造黑歷史讓人家現在聽到蔣麗菁三個字就這個敬而未知怎麼說敬而未知呢蔣麗菁沒有專款專用拿去什麼買便當啊做護士服聚餐啊買辦公室的設備所以如果衛福部要發放蔣麗菁的話"},{"start":6635.629,"end":6659.623,"text":"請要有一個公開透明的機制機制建立出來讓我們知道獎勵金的流向可能護理人員才能夠安心也能夠取信於護理人員用途的部分我們是絕配都是用在護理人員身上所以請委員放心你們就是發問卷問醫院你們用到哪邊去那答案也是來自於醫院那我們就是質疑說醫院會不會有失真欠缺控信利的回答"},{"start":6660.603,"end":6681.393,"text":"那請問一下這個請問一下部長怎麼看待因為去年健保署有發出一個風向就是醫事人員的月頭保薪資在醫院不能夠低於兩倍然後在診所不能夠低於1.5倍低於最低工資這樣的數字那如果低於就不能夠作為健保特約醫院的續約的要件這樣子那請問您是時任的"},{"start":6683.195,"end":6708.275,"text":"當時的這個署長所以這個就是您當初署放出來的風向那當然引起基層很大的喝采那我給你一個讚那我知道你可能也有承受來自醫院的壓力所以這個就無疾而終了那現在您從署長提升到這個部長的位置請問有換了位置換了腦袋嗎現在還是有想要主張這樣的一個想法嗎我們還是希望朝這個方向來努力保障這個"},{"start":6709.356,"end":6720.966,"text":"我們這個護理人員的最基本的信息我知道但是具體的方案要出來否則再多的承諾聽起來都是空話護理人員聽起來完全都是到最後發現夢醒時分完全就是一場遊戲一場夢的感覺我們會持續來溝通啦"},{"start":6724.429,"end":6751.528,"text":"當然高薪需要經費的來源財源很重要那財源當然有來自於健保來自於公務預算來自於基金就這樣那我曾經寫過那衛福部下面有很多投書那我曾經寫過一個這個投書衛福部下面很多基金很多基金我也曾經寫過一個投書就是衛護理這個設基金來籌措人力的這個完整性那長照的這個人力也是用基金的方式來支應"},{"start":6752.409,"end":6763.324,"text":"那所以我們有沒有可能來設置一個這個護理人力的基金待會去思考不用現在回答我我們現在進入毒核的第三項毒性物質有請勞動部長 洪森翰請勞動部長"},{"start":6768.677,"end":6794.908,"text":"好那我們呢護理人員勞動條件非常的差那勞動條件差的太陽部長請慢走沒關係我先鋪陳一下劇情因為時間真的非常有限那勞動條件差呢總共我自己羅列八大罪狀但是不只這八大因為時間有限我只羅列八大罪狀所以我想請問勞動那個勞動部長你對於護理人員勞動困境的情形有掌握嗎我先給你一個"},{"start":6796.949,"end":6811.866,"text":"這個提示啦先給你一個提示就是護理人員有超時工作的現象你應該比比皆是你應該了解嘛那超時工作又沒有拿到加班費你應該有掌握嘛那請問一下那個部長有掌握護理界所謂隱形工時的問題嗎"},{"start":6816.354,"end":6830.721,"text":"因為我們也有跟一些醫療業跟護理的工會有蠻多的互動那你有聽他們說明那請問一下可不可以把隱形公食列為公食以行政函式的方式把隱形公食列為公食"},{"start":6832.128,"end":6849.796,"text":"這部分我們可能要可以來找這個醫療界來討論一下來演繹一下好 謝謝部長願意討論好那除此之外呢就是我這邊肯定勞動部跟衛福部去年的時候有把護理人員參加繼續教育積分的課程上課的時間列為公式有用韓式的方式來處理那護理人員"},{"start":6850.436,"end":6868.468,"text":"非常的肯定那但是呢就是有些醫院並沒有按照這個韓式的方式去處理就是當護理人員他們想要把這段時間列為這個工時或者想請工假的時候醫院並沒有並沒有主動的來協助或接受所以勞動部是不是針對這一點能夠納入勞檢的項目"},{"start":6872.248,"end":6881.802,"text":"跟委員說明其實我們在去年那其實也針對這個醫院有一些違反勞基法的狀況那其實我們有修了這個勞基法的這個通用我們的"},{"start":6888.231,"end":6917.871,"text":"的有些加重處分的部分其實有把醫療中心跟去醫院其實都放進去所以我想該處罰的該檢查的我想我們都願意來處理OK好謝謝那個部長知道我們護理人員整天工作下來勞動條件差中午想吃飯休息時間30分鐘想享受都享受不到那想吃飯都吃不到只能夠喝珍珠奶茶那官員喝的是有為有所的珍珠奶茶我們護理皆喝的是有苦有酸的珍珠奶茶"},{"start":6918.371,"end":6934.009,"text":"喝的是辛酸吃的是苦楚那請問一下這個休息時間看得到吃不到這個問題部長有打算怎麼處理嗎委員妳在講的是因為勞基法有規定那工作4小時要休息30分鐘妳講的是這個部分嘛對不對"},{"start":6936.391,"end":6964.077,"text":"那護理人員會覺得說在這休息30分鐘他們其實還是一個stand by的狀況所以沒有辦法真的全心放鬆的休息那的確這個部分是在母法裡面是勞心母法裡面訂的所以就是加強取締加強取締可以答應我加強取締有人可以聽我說明就是說但是我只剩4分鐘的確針對工作4小時要休息30分鐘的規定在不同的業別會有不太一樣的情境的需求"},{"start":6964.837,"end":6979.065,"text":"比方說在護理業大家會覺得說這休息30分鐘會覺得說其實無法真的全新的休息可是在某一些其他的業別沒有問題法律既然已經有規定了就加強取締那我們護理界還有所謂花花班的問題換班的間隔少於11個小時"},{"start":6982.046,"end":7002.239,"text":"除此之外護理人員醫院僱主為了彈性運用人力所以想了一些光怪陸離的方式分別是待命、戒休跟華科調動那我這邊想請問一下可不可以出一個函式把在家待命的時間在醫院待命的時間列為公時因為沒有列為公時護理人員就是在那邊苦等"},{"start":7002.919,"end":7020.013,"text":"再來另外一個關懷錄理的手段就是戒休所謂的戒休就是護理人員從早8點上班到4點可能中午12點就會被請回家說你先回家休息了因為我們沒病人了這個叫做戒休這個時間不是護理人員平白享受日後護理人員要把戒休這4小時還給醫院請問一下這個有沒有違反勞基法"},{"start":7024.483,"end":7037.8,"text":"我跟委員說明其實委員你現在提到的不管是一些工時的問題跟休息的問題我認為我們其實都願意包括在今天質詢之後來跟我們護理界來做一點討論就是說目前遇到哪些樣態那我先把我的第八罪狀講完"},{"start":7042.205,"end":7069.308,"text":"我們的護理界有一個這個陋習叫做跨科調動因為護理人力缺乏所以A單位缺人就調B單位去我們護理界曾經發生一個悲劇就是在2011年的時候有個護理師在他任職的八天以內新到任八天以內被A單位調到B單位B單位調到C單位最後不堪壓力燒炭自殺這是我們護理界的悲劇也是我們胸口的痛那請問一下跨科調動這件事衛福部勞動部有沒有掌握開罰的數據"},{"start":7072.146,"end":7076.972,"text":"數據我可能還要再調一下數據但是那我跟部長講你永遠調不到數據因為跨科調動是一個違法的事那沒有罰則所以請部長這邊能夠來協助推動違法跨科調動的罰則"},{"start":7088.087,"end":7097.353,"text":"那最後呢我覺得我們會需要跟衛福部這邊討論一下因為關於這個護理業內有一些專業的型態的樣態這的確會需要跟衛福部討論剛剛部長一直提到一個通報平台這個通報平台上去申訴的人有4000違反勞基法的有2000最後開罰的是500件裁罰率是16%當然勞動部這邊有一些裁罰的統計那目前查到有"},{"start":7113.622,"end":7137.165,"text":"過去5年有600多件那我想這是冰山一角可能也只是黑素那也有望也期待部長這邊能夠再盡量的在勞檢的時候能夠再雷力風行然後能夠加強取定那所以我們這邊請問除了說專案勞檢之外能不能再擴大醫院的專案勞檢這是我們的訴求那我最後總結一下就是說請衛福部"},{"start":7139.286,"end":7160.902,"text":"這個林靜儀市長就說你們這些醫事人員小腦袋我們按了按鈕問題就能夠全部解決了嗎那我覺得衛福部沒有按按鈕而是按兵不動對護理勞動權益的改善按兵不動我這邊有四顆按鈕大膽按下去我想問題是可以獲得某個程度的緩解第一個是提供資料第二個是建立機制第三個是"},{"start":7161.702,"end":7180.948,"text":"給行政函式第四個是擴大勞檢那提供資料的部分就是勞動部跟衛福部勞動衛福部的部分請給我們全日平均戶並比的開發資料還有呢可不可以給我們月頭保薪資作為依據的護理人員的平均薪資因為我們想知道護理的薪水到底多少是五萬嗎七萬嗎還是其他的數字"},{"start":7183.169,"end":7206.496,"text":"建立機制就是護病比查核的機制不要讓醫院水口說了算護理費獎勵金的公開透明機制請建立起來行政函式請針對隱形公司還有在家待命在醫院待命的公司都把它列為真正可以拿到薪水的公司最後就是我剛剛跟部長所說的擴大專案勞檢以上 質詢 謝謝謝謝邱委員的質詢也謝謝主委長 相關部會所長貝勳 謝謝"},{"start":7215.307,"end":7221.313,"text":"接下來我們請李坤城委員質詢 丁薛忠委員請準備"},{"start":7245.66,"end":7251.724,"text":"好 謝謝院長我們請卓院長還有李陽部長麻煩再請卓院長 體育部長備詢地委好來 院長好這個今天其實我們就是要挺台灣We are 挺台灣不論是挺外交 挺國防 挺台灣我們就是要一起來挺台灣"},{"start":7275.816,"end":7290.685,"text":"那其實這一次台灣代表隊在經典賽雖然是兩勝兩敗沒有辦法進入這一個最後的決賽但是我覺得也打出了一場好球啦14比0完封捷克然後5比4擊敗這個韓國我想擊敗韓國那一剎那這個全部的東京巨蛋"},{"start":7296.848,"end":7312.075,"text":"歡聲雷動把東京巨蛋變成台北的大巨蛋我想不論是在2023年的十二強還有剛剛結束的經典賽台灣隊的表現都凝聚了我們台灣人共同的意識"},{"start":7313.305,"end":7340.021,"text":"那除了這個棒球之外呢 這個部長也有好消息啦我們這個林俊逸 全英網這個羽球的公開賽拿到冠軍然後呢 這個葉宏慧 詹佑珍呢是這個混雙的這個冠軍 這個全英的羽球賽然後唐家宏呢 這個是單槓奪冠所以都有好事情 也表示說我們這個政府在投資在運動這個項目也慢慢看出了成績"},{"start":7340.962,"end":7359.12,"text":"那所以呢棒球啊不是只有比賽棒球也是一個國家意志的展現那我這邊就要請教一下我們卓院長因為其實在3月7號台灣對捷克的那一場我跟院長還有部長我們是在同一個球場我們都在東京巨蛋"},{"start":7359.961,"end":7375.842,"text":"所以那時候我當我聽到說這個院長到東京巨蛋的時候我心裡想說這是一件好事情台日關係又再突破了現任的行政院院長可以到日本東京巨蛋看球"},{"start":7377.083,"end":7394.978,"text":"這就是財政關係的突破啊這是一件好事情啊那結果沒想到我看國民黨他們就在講說院長為什麼可以這個什麼私人包機去東京巨蛋看球啊一直在糾結院長的私人行程包機的費用"},{"start":7395.879,"end":7413.827,"text":"但是他們沒有想到說一個現任的行政院院長如何在現在台灣受到外交的這個壓迫打壓在中國打壓之下能夠到日本東京去看球這是一項外交上面非常了不起的一件事情啊那所以我要請教一下院長"},{"start":7414.767,"end":7433.419,"text":"就是說第一個分享一下當時候台灣捷克你也在現場我也在現場部長也在現場當時候的心情怎麼樣因為當時候我們其實前兩場打得很悶第三場當時捷克當然打出來了士氣如虹請問一下院長當時候的心情怎麼樣"},{"start":7434.261,"end":7450.878,"text":"委員很抱歉我要跟所有的委員抱歉行前我們都沒有任何的透露因為我們知道這是一個必須非常謹慎而走的雖然是私人的行程但是還是要非常的謹慎你如果在松山機場你就飛走了跟你講馬上這個新聞就會出來了"},{"start":7451.67,"end":7474.656,"text":"所以我一直到落地以後上了遊覽車快進到球場的時候我覺得說我真的來了那很振奮人心的是當我們跟捷克的比賽第一局我們就得到了兩分尤其是第二局的那一次滿貫全壘打全場的人都跳了起來本來我一直做的沒有很大的動作但是到了全壘打的時候我也跟著"},{"start":7475.276,"end":7495.782,"text":"旁邊的蔡吉昌會長還有我們的大使我們都跳得起來了代表台灣在那一刻是絕對的團結的我們團結不只在那個球場上我們團結在整個國內跟國外是連在一起的也因此我們覺得這一次能夠到日本去雖然是一個短暫的一天來回我唯一的突破是什麼"},{"start":7497.631,"end":7513.053,"text":"是台灣隊突破了捷克的防線突破了他的投手突破到第七局結束的時候我們達到了第14分領先而結束那我也為了不要跟人群在一起我是提早就離開現場"},{"start":7514.315,"end":7537.191,"text":"怕的就是說很多人聚集的時候又引起大家互相的一些打招呼等等我們是盡量在以一個私人的行為不妨礙到現場那麼也遵照所有的申請程序這樣來進行那院長其實你本身在東京G-LAND球場出現我認為就是一個外交上面一個突破了"},{"start":7537.751,"end":7566.123,"text":"只是突破了捷克的防線而已不然你怎麼如果沒有跟日本日方有默契的話怎麼可能通過他的海關我們這次是經過一個很平常的申請的管道跟手續沒有特別拜託什麼樣來協助真的是沒有拜託但是我們內部有內部航班使用地點的這個申請那對方也有他內部的手續但是我們沒有去做任何特殊的管道所以你這個私人行程我認為第一個"},{"start":7567.449,"end":7591.58,"text":"台日的默契啦 我認為台日的默契第二個 你也不要讓中共那方面有藉口 有理由要講說台灣又怎麼樣 日本又怎麼樣我覺得這個方向是正確的但是我沒有想到說為什麼除了中國共產黨連中國國民黨也這麼生氣一直在糾結你的費用的一個問題這方面是不是再請院長再答覆一下"},{"start":7592,"end":7617.155,"text":"我就說我到日本我看棒球比賽為國家隊加油還有我自費哪一樣錯了委員我請教哪一樣錯了因為我們現在總預算也還沒過嘛對啊我如果我剛說我如果用公費的話我今天在這裡是受到另外一種更直接的批評預算沒有你怎麼可以去對啊私人行為行人行人怎麼可以用公費"},{"start":7618.363,"end":7625.657,"text":"總統的批評都會來所以我一開始就設定是自費自費的行程那如果委員有意見我明天可以報公費要不要"},{"start":7627.623,"end":7649.189,"text":"那所以你也都有相關的你的私人自費的所有的收據單據就對了都在但是私人的支出不需要向大家來提出意見但是是不是私人的自費去查一下立法院查一下行政院有沒有報一塊錢的工賬有沒有報一塊錢的工賬"},{"start":7649.409,"end":7674.707,"text":"因為我們立委也不可能去調說所有的私人你飛去日本花多少錢要多少單據 不可能嘛那既然院長已經說這個是私人自費的行程那我們就認為說這部分在外交上面我個人認為我作為一個國會議員當時我聽到 我知道院長在現場的時候我就覺得說很棒除了台灣營捷克之外另外一個我認為是一個外交上非常大的一個突破"},{"start":7675.592,"end":7686.484,"text":"那這個問一下這個李昂部長你當時也在現場那你那時候不過另外一個台安大賽你也有過去看嗎"},{"start":7688.185,"end":7712.802,"text":"台灣隊韓國?有,我當時也在現場那時候你有做出一個特別的手勢那有特別象徵什麼樣的意義嗎?因為過往我在當老師的時候我們在這個全大運的比賽的時候然後用了這個手勢我們隊伍是最後取得了勝利那當時想說仿效一下那時候的自己那很高興最後韓國隊擊出了一個高飛球被截殺了"},{"start":7713.562,"end":7731.807,"text":"所以你作為首次的時候台灣是領先還是那時候落後有平手也有領先的時候因為其實那時候我們是有領先有落後再逆轉這就是台灣的精神那我再請教一下院長那其實我看日本的報導也都相當的正面"},{"start":7732.887,"end":7757.347,"text":"你說啊 這個NHK 他說這是斷交後首度有現任的葛奎訪日 意義重大朝日新聞說 台日沒有邦交 葛奎訪日呢 極其罕見特別講說 葛奎是除了總統 副總統之外 第三號人物然後呢 日本時報也寫說呢日本政界無懼北京的壓力堅持深化台日的準安全同盟關係日本的報導都很正面啊"},{"start":7759.137,"end":7775.503,"text":"只有這個國民黨跟共產黨兩個黨都不開心啊謝謝委員讓我看到這些日本的媒體日本的媒體我沒有辦法去做任何的評論啊但是就我而言這純粹就是一天來回私人的活動沒有任何其他的評論"},{"start":7776.428,"end":7799.13,"text":"好 那因為是我也在現場然後隔天我也看到這個日本的評論都相當的正面我認為啦這個是台日關係的一個提升如果沒有這個台日關係的提升的話我想現任的行政院院長要到日本東京巨蛋去看球不是一件容易的事那所以你看"},{"start":7801.066,"end":7820.965,"text":"這個國民黨糾結占你的費用那你有說你有單據嗎那共產黨也是啊 哇這個他們的副外長啊馬上致電他們的這個日本駐日大使表達不滿然後呢還說你怎麼可以打擦邊球搞突破所以啊讓共產黨生氣就表示我們做對了我的邏輯像是如此啦"},{"start":7821.857,"end":7847.814,"text":"也不一定要故意惹他生氣啦我們只做我們該做的事情但是我看到他們官員公開的講話有學者批評非常的粗俗啊非常的低俗啊那我覺得我如果沒有辦法跟我們國內的國人跟委員來說明的話我們如何去對抗中共呢所以我覺得他再粗俗都沒有關係但國內一定要了解這個行程就是我個人的行程"},{"start":7849.677,"end":7861.416,"text":"錢的問題不要在這裡這樣的在意討論我已經說明了沒有一塊錢報工費在當下整個一天的行程當中就是一個很單純的看棒球的行動這個其實"},{"start":7865.883,"end":7882.693,"text":"這個日本的這個媒體他這樣子報導我認為對台灣還有對您過去這個日本這個東京巨蛋來看球其實都是相當的正面但是我是覺得我剛就講到說台灣的棒球能夠凝聚我們台灣的所有的國民的意志所以你看"},{"start":7884.234,"end":7910.053,"text":"這個除了他們這個官方很不爽之外連這個經典賽他們都要認知作戰還說什麼我們丟了一大堆垃圾等等之類的那後來這個日本媒體都已經說這個是假訊息這個是認知作戰那所以這方面你就知道說他們中國是非常不願意看到台灣在棒球上面有傑出的表現因為我們每次有傑出的表現台灣的所有的這個"},{"start":7911.555,"end":7920.617,"text":"國民意志我們有這個生命共同體的展現這是中國所不容易看到的啦這更是一個活生生的例子一方面對我們的球迷"},{"start":7921.96,"end":7943.548,"text":"做這樣的污衊但是卻用盡方法要把我們的球員帶到中國去打棒球我覺得我們應該自己心裡要有個底氣台灣就是台灣的英雄就是台灣的國人那麼這樣子來污衊我們卻要我們的人去踢在那邊打棒球這兩個天平是永遠不對稱的我們應該自我警惕"},{"start":7945.249,"end":7959.948,"text":"那李昂部長先請回我現在講到說因為現在就是美國打一場這件事情大家都很關心那現在就是說我剛提到的認知作戰其實現在假訊息也出來了那經濟部那工部長也請上台"},{"start":7961.087,"end":7982.74,"text":"他們認識之後就說3月15號馬上要斷氣了那斷氣之後就開始會斷電這個假訊息馬上就出來了那這幾天我認為啦如果形勢還沒有穩定的話類似這種假訊息都會出來那經濟部也馬上有做了一個澄清跟說明就是說我們"},{"start":7984.022,"end":7994.058,"text":"這個3月份我們12艘船這個已經完成調度了然後4月份呢有8艘已經完成調度了那剩下2艘哪時候可以完成"},{"start":7994.775,"end":8021.33,"text":"我們盡快很快因為我們過去的幾天當中就已經調度了十幾艘了所以這兩艘應該會很快可以調度其實大家都會搶因為其實日本 韓國他們也都是靠這邊的這個出口所以其實這也要花一些時間因為我們調度的對象大部分都是主要是澳洲澳洲跟我們關係也很好還有美國澳洲三分之一 美國才十幾趴對不對"},{"start":8022.885,"end":8050.175,"text":"我們跟調度的那個就是船的部分額外增加的部分我們是額外跟他們做調度就是要提醒卓院長還有我們經濟部類似這種假訊息馬上就會出來那當然這個經濟部有馬上在做澄清卓天部長馬上有清楚的說明接下來我請那個財政部我們莊部長因為當然這幾天台股市急漲又急跌"},{"start":8052.429,"end":8066.828,"text":"其實大家就會關心說我們國安基金是不是可以要召開臨時會我看我們國安基金他會觀察四個指標一個是亞股的差距一個是國際的情勢一個是油價還有股會市的波動"},{"start":8067.401,"end":8080.326,"text":"那其實國際情勢目前仍然不穩油價也一直在高漲那股市波動這兩天其實波動的幅度還蠻大的那我請下一家部長我們國安基金有可能會隨時召開臨時會嗎"},{"start":8084.308,"end":8107.166,"text":"根本委員報告我們會持續關注這個股市的一個動向那如果有符合國安基金那個設置條例第八條相關的一個條件的話我剛剛講到四個指標了嘛這也是你們自己這個市長講的四個指標啊我們會召開這個臨時會然後請國安基金委員來做一個決議是否要進場付盤這個部分我們會持續的關注"},{"start":8107.97,"end":8132.927,"text":"院長還是要多注意一下我們每天都很關注每天都很關注 即使假日院內的會議都還持續在開因為其實就是大家關心這個第一個是油價那當然也很關心這個股會市的波動那我希望說這個政府在適時在必要的時候還是要出來信心喊話接下來我要請中部長請回我們請國防部的顧部長"},{"start":8134.657,"end":8156.742,"text":"時間有限那因為我們這個發架書到這個3月15號有三項到期投射飛彈這個標籤飛彈M109A74走炮那我請教一下這一個部長那3月15號就這個禮拜了那其實要看說這個在海島有沒有打假球就是看是不是這個禮拜授權書是不是可以讓你先簽"},{"start":8159.02,"end":8164.846,"text":"剛剛委員報告,事實上我們第四項的發家書也拿到了,就是海馬寺海馬寺我知道,到3月26號"},{"start":8184.565,"end":8192.791,"text":"如果這個招牌因為我們明天尋找的12號最快招牌這個委員會那最快12號你可以授權給國防部來簽名12號平朝財務委員會"},{"start":8223.458,"end":8227.202,"text":"好 謝謝好 謝謝李昆哲委員質詢謝謝卓院長 相關部會社長備詢 謝謝"},{"start":8234.881,"end":8239.225,"text":"接下來我們請丁學忠委員質詢 劉書斌委員請準備感謝韓院長我們請卓院長跟我們經濟部掛掉跟我們的農業部長麻煩再請卓院長經濟部農業部備詢"},{"start":8264.372,"end":8273.379,"text":"今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林今天去雲林"},{"start":8292.81,"end":8301.635,"text":"但是我今天有一個問題 我要向你們請教一下就是這個台美關稅了後 我們農業關稅後續輔導轉型的方案我們美國總統在簽這個協議的時候 還說我們台灣淘汰美國的晶片產業這樣講法 甚至台灣人聽了以後說很討厭到這時候 我覺得我們政府要有印象"},{"start":8323.344,"end":8334.993,"text":"請你答應報告委員我剛才有說過我們的晶片的製造是90年來我們的工程師跟所有的商業人員很認真研究發展出來我們絕對是我們自己的實力我們如果有什麼違法全世界不會來買我們違法的晶片所以這個部分"},{"start":8349.165,"end":8358.052,"text":"我希望說,我們要有...不好意思,要有我們的台獨當然當然要有我們的台獨,我們不可以讓世界公開指令說你台灣是瘦肉連鎖共產黨絕對不是絕對不是我們常常...對不對?這真的40多年來,我們台灣是用全國的資源用著全國的能力,我們來靠近這個台積電來升陸起來是是是結果,現在所有...為了...他們那些貿易比較高的台港銀行要用"},{"start":8378.667,"end":8384.57,"text":"還要用稍微做得好一點做得好一點 說什麼我們把它拆掉這對我們來說沒有問題啦其實我們也一直在升級現在我們這個最精密的先進的製程都當時我們自己種種就好在這裡我請阿龍也說我們這個美術的關稅跟土地的三頁的整個配套啦那個美國地"},{"start":8408.325,"end":8419.754,"text":"我們現在已經用科技來玩這個關稅政府加深供給我們這個VD的關稅這對我們的分裂對外的生意的衝擊是很大的你知道嗎這目前齁 目前我們跟美國談的這個雙方的這個協定目前還沒開始實施啦還沒開始實施啦因為現在 現在它對全世界都用15%用15% 再加那個"},{"start":8436.434,"end":8443.119,"text":"最惠國的關稅所以現在關稅比較多關稅比較多要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然要不然"},{"start":8450.802,"end":8456.147,"text":"所以我們國土去確定說他的關稅到底是要怎麼給我們設所以我們自己要做好準備對地龍三鴨在我們台灣是非常大的一個三鴨尤其在我們婦人館我們這裡的地龍大多數年生地龍每隻吃到漂亮漂亮的是"},{"start":8469.597,"end":8477.982,"text":"對 臺灣我們現在都一樣我也很關心我們都站在說要怎麼保護農民的官業要怎麼讓我們的商業有競爭力要怎麼讓我們的外銷可以擴大我們都一直站在這裡跟農民社會跟我們農業官 大家都一樣的努力我們需要整個三百億的基金有啦對 好 來現在拜託市長市長我們分林大金市長這個"},{"start":8499.929,"end":8503.073,"text":"更新這個國土紀委我一定會去,因為也聽說有跟我們的農業局長有請教過"},{"start":8511.802,"end":8532.73,"text":"那時候有給我們答應一個九億、一個三億的款,都總共十二億,跟那時候國際的野党也不一樣,但是我們分林管政府,實際上有夠認真、有夠認真,跟那時候我們的人道屠宰系統已經起了,中間都要完成,還有這個兩鏈系統,"},{"start":8536.513,"end":8543.877,"text":"要把我們中央愛情挖到地上結果他連去都挖不到去我們已經空了一條三十一起來在那邊等這段過去蘇貞昌一定會開罪他已經開罪了"},{"start":8552.591,"end":8558.574,"text":"已經扣分在那裡 結果我們臨床去 臨床就給我們這個國分你是不是可以給我們扣分這很抱歉 這請委員 你已經給我們有選項 讓我們可以拖延我們已經把車子拉到街尾起來 已經讓你們把車子拉到街尾"},{"start":8568.599,"end":8571.262,"text":"我們是需要讓國民吃到健康的地、安全的地有可能未來我們這個人道土宅跟人力系統做好有可能未來我們台灣在出國"},{"start":8588.527,"end":8600.411,"text":"可以說醫院訓練有教訓可以說醫院的訓練有教訓我也是真的希望我們台灣的地可以擴大出口因為像譬如說我們現在的口袋已經沒有了我們的肥皂低溫已經讓我們省給世界的這個我們修復了才好這個都有問題所以這個大家共同的合作再來就是蒜頭的問題是"},{"start":8615.015,"end":8623.722,"text":"我第一次來大國開會議會的時間我一份婚禮,大國都讓我那些農民死大智慧到早上聽到,蒜頭清明才有收成現在我講我婚禮我講我婚禮,現在有蒜香去收到多少你知道,開21天"},{"start":8640.154,"end":8641.238,"text":"最好啦 還是我們這幾年來 健康過千多年"},{"start":8647.383,"end":8660.286,"text":"沒有啦 那是阿根廷阿根廷4千7百90 埃及2千9百13其他的2百93 都中 要到8千了那是去年的啦 阿根廷現在6千控91噸啦再來喔 市長還有講喔5台5市有什麼進走運作的建制"},{"start":8677.54,"end":8689.045,"text":"這個因為介紹好,所以會讓農民增加今年比肯的計畫是247公頃但是我現在跟委員報告就是說,這個247公頃,事實上我們現在算算的叫國外進口因為現在全世界有兩個國家在進,一個是阿根廷阿根廷已經5年10月開始,進到現在已經沒有火灘了"},{"start":8703.932,"end":8706.915,"text":"所以我們這個政靠量我們來觀控你看現在我們阮府內的蒜頭存21坑 農民要賺什麼農民要賺什麼我還在這裡 我請市長"},{"start":8726.773,"end":8732.017,"text":"那個院長拜託你再給我們做一個 給我們農民那裡做一個看可以用高價收購 我們持久休息我們如果付到27塊好嗎因為現在今年我們的蒜頭分離的蒜頭開始要休息 要生殖進行"},{"start":8749.191,"end":8764.295,"text":"結果南吹南風 南風吹一會兒 稍微變成 稍微去休眠期 稍微去稍微洗澡 又中邪啦 瘦病啦 還是紫斑病你看我們這裡都暈六公里所以今年 雖然整個240公頃 但是減少 減少兩三成所以減少了21公里 實際上這沒天用還有一個問題 還有一個問題現在我實際上聽市長講 這裡的土地外人"},{"start":8779.025,"end":8792.071,"text":"去看房子 是 要介紹 旁邊的現金 請那個算帳 之前的料好 跟後面的說好介紹 旁邊的現金處理 他們已經拿到我家了這個介紹之後 也有可能這樣去持續"},{"start":8799.125,"end":8811.796,"text":"你認為今年的量 雖然民族證據 但是量的量量的量絕對不會比去年還要多所以這個我們來請教所以這個國分都要靠我們農業國 不會這樣拉折我們來請 蒜頭我們有做策略聯盟策略聯盟有幾個合作小團我們來跟他們說 想做想做 用這個好意想聽他們的意見 老實說我們蒜頭 他們想要靠的"},{"start":8826.988,"end":8828.009,"text":"我們現在婚姻的麻困,他們現在遇到一個困難,就是多少的市場減少,這麼多婚姻的麻痺"},{"start":8846.927,"end":8847.828,"text":"因為我們的技術好,我們用的新軍管,我們用的新軍管,介紹可能就更好"},{"start":8868.288,"end":8877.574,"text":"人家就比較不愛跟人家賣再來就是我們台灣人平常是吃飯又唱日軍那裡有行大國分的人都偶爾吃像我 我也是偶爾吃偶爾有吃到所以我們過來的市場又不算大了當這個文化遺産業更多 介紹更多有時候又欠費 介紹又香又給你吃完用一口真的有夠"},{"start":8897.932,"end":8904.637,"text":"有些預測會逗留,加工的情況又不足,很多的我們這個馬只有月關兩如果做加工時間或出口的時間,可能會比較好賺,在國情要顧到保险,這個部分可能還是我們來補充這幾年的馬的收容有比較正確"},{"start":8922.58,"end":8928.869,"text":"所以國際的技巧比較赤 比較適合這樣市民因為今年抓到的麻災比較多"},{"start":8932.319,"end":8937.803,"text":"所以韓日本也一樣 韓國也一樣 中國也一樣所以這個國際介紹稍微遲了我們來 甚至我們國內來使農教育因為這沒有進步這個國分可能就要靠我們農業局來倒三缸來給他們做一個看要怎麼三銷 要怎麼高漲就他們的款項好 感謝國長 感謝市長現在我請我們這個經濟部長"},{"start":8962.526,"end":8982.88,"text":"我們從沙雕崙的海堤整個可以來到我們是看比較遠出來的高雄我們海堤最重要的功能是保護民眾的信仰財產安全我們要抵禦這個海浪的侵蝕這個部分我們肯定應該有同意我們看這個"},{"start":8987.984,"end":8988.606,"text":"像這個綠色的果粉這是一個"},{"start":8995.441,"end":9001.083,"text":"一個簡易海堤綠色的這個是簡易海堤我們現在水利署幾個月要改建的海堤是從內陸這個納水的這條從內陸納水這條後來我們前陣子這裡有我們建設在那裡灌汙納在那裡汲分油汲額"},{"start":9021.932,"end":9024.037,"text":"我們把海豐收起來,結果我們沒有在外面,來保障他們這裡的財產的安全,我們這樣去,一定是對的"},{"start":9033.683,"end":9053.653,"text":"這個事情我來瞭解一下這個事情我好像第一次聽到了但是我來瞭解一下看看是不是有安全上的考量還是怎麼樣因為就像委員講的主要是 除了我有收集起來我告訴你 人民的安全緊急我們這個水利署提出的憨花訪會會有一個講話就是當這個三條輪海堤"},{"start":9063.648,"end":9071.614,"text":"這個整建的過分喔他把我們這個土地建議的土地他把整個做成事業事業附體設施他把整個事業附體設施他已經說事業附體設施我們明明這是一個建議的土地我們看一看上去他已經拗到挪到擴到"},{"start":9092.862,"end":9100.623,"text":"我們鄉民已經老到老了這次有辦法繼續保障人民的財產的安全所以我們想要把這個海豐的國分照這個主席的建立土地之下我們又一樣的進修可以讓它來保護到我們到外來這裡的樹葉樹葉鐵的實心像這樣"},{"start":9120.809,"end":9135.426,"text":"我來瞭解一下 假如說這個剛剛委員提到的這個部分有損壞的要維修的 或者是說怎麼樣再做重新規劃我們現在看到這相片這是恆主席的 這是恆主席的相片 恆主席的相片是這樣"},{"start":9138.61,"end":9154.375,"text":"記者 拜託 保證這件事要跟我們邀請這是財產跟人員的一個安全的過分好 感謝 感謝咱們部長我現在請咱們交通部長麻煩請交通部長 拜託旅行部長要起來等一下聊一下"},{"start":9165.834,"end":9169.116,"text":"你是我們這次競選賽的吉祥物領球的最大功臣國中你好我相信國中還會記得南方澳東京的產區"},{"start":9186.465,"end":9193.048,"text":"我們原來海上有這麼多鳥鳥當期都被海風侵蝕 檢測出來有幾十多座的圍牆要趕快來維修其中有11座是隨時會出事的U421啦 那一座圍牆當9年以後我和我們高中高我們軍神已經有去回覆過了 過了九九啦當這當中"},{"start":9216.799,"end":9221.766,"text":"只有一條海鮮橋有國祖給我們再來 其他我們水若靠岸大小便會有其他綠色的圍牆有的已經登記 現在可以走遍道我們國祖的經費跟這尊要有看"},{"start":9233.174,"end":9236.957,"text":"這個郭文聖要請郭董隆重職 要申請委員這些圍僑其實在我們的各個縣市跟各個鄉鎮裡面其實有不少也很感謝地方政府願意這樣去做檢測"},{"start":9249.028,"end":9268.686,"text":"那不過這個經費的部分主要還是由地方政府來負責所以我也是期待說管政府或是說鄉鎮公所可以改變經費但中央可以幫忙也是可以我們有這個生活圈道路計畫的這個計劃在內不過我們這個議程已經贏得差不多了坦白講這個議程已經贏得差不多了"},{"start":9274.767,"end":9288.5,"text":"這個部分是111年到116年的整體計畫那這個部分因為前幾年各個地方在爭取的這個預算蠻多的所以這個部分已經分配完畢了一直到116年的執行但是之前都已經被匡列所以這個部分"},{"start":9290.902,"end":9314.518,"text":"地方政府也是要先想辦法去編列衣裳因為現在裁劃法過了以後地方政府會有辦法解釋人家不要說裁劃法的事情但是這是地方的道路跟橋樑我們還是期待說地方政府優先編列因為確實我們有看到危險你也要幫我們倒三天你不可以叫人家說叫我們優先編列之前不去廢坑你們是在廢坑我們怎麼樣"},{"start":9318.08,"end":9335.132,"text":"跟委員報告我們還會有一個修正計畫就是我剛剛講的那個計畫有新增一個50億那目前還沒有通過如果通過的話我們再想辦法那是新興計畫嘛對啦 今年新興計畫嘛所以目前就沒有剩對啊 今年新興計畫要申請出來申請你們怎麼會沒有這可以建設地方 可以推動三條的工廠工廠我們這個六四團體你們請他們過來"},{"start":9348.049,"end":9351.35,"text":"委員我們查一下七八十八個裡面好像沒辦法一條我感覺你的溝通靈力好,你跟我們韓院長繼續溝通一下你跟我們院長繼續溝通一下我來這裡是要替地方做事情,我不是來這裡要跟人家商量我是來把地方的事情反映給你們知道,讓你們來把我們地方倒三天"},{"start":9372.659,"end":9391.142,"text":"我會紀念起來 平時也是希望透過委員了解地方 大家互相合作 把地方的事情做好事我會紀念是這樣 拜託國長院長你再幫我們做一個好啊 我們的努力 大家共同發表 祝福一下 幫我們倒灑一下好 這樣國長請謝謝我直接 梁副長 感謝你你的福氣 讓我們這次的軍電賽"},{"start":9402.159,"end":9424.485,"text":"可以打出我們中華隊的驕傲我有聽說你當比賽前你會去乖乖對你說有比賽的選擇會出現嗎對有後製還是怎樣沒有啦不是我 後製不是我不是你 我是比賽的你是這個你不是說有去乖乖的比賽會出現那不是我只要我們一家的台灣人"},{"start":9430.849,"end":9446.059,"text":"國家隊有出力比賽你就要盡量去救因為你過去是看出我們中華民國的驕傲現在由你斷念的運動我希望這個驕傲可以繼續燃燒下去,這樣好不好?謝謝委員,會議好,你幾歲開始練羽毛球?幾歲開始練羽毛球?"},{"start":9455.137,"end":9459.06,"text":"所以基層的運動真的很重要我們現在運動部是關於社區運動設施的"},{"start":9472.857,"end":9476.578,"text":"你來,請你要多多關心,我們有很多社區運動,像羽毛球是很多羽毛球是非常多人在運動的運動"},{"start":9486.92,"end":9497.984,"text":"我們要常務這個運動,我們要了解這個運動的軌跡我之前也很愛看英國球,但是我剛開始不知道單數得分在哪一邊開球雙數得分在哪一邊開球,過去我都知道那是外球比較強,在看比較會知道,像這就是運動軌跡我們運動國也有這個要推廣的東西,像卡瑞球"},{"start":9516.155,"end":9520.88,"text":"那一站起來就是一號一號的兩號球如果攻這塊球定於三層這就是運動的軌跡這我們也是要提供給大家所以我們一些單項運動像這些比較流行的氣球球但是這個中華民國氣球球的協會因為他們有三軍"},{"start":9537.213,"end":9537.413,"text":"所以這個國運圈 我們運動國運要加強一下"},{"start":9551.86,"end":9580.128,"text":"各單項的運動規則,我們可以在這裡宣導,這樣好不好好,沒問題議員我拜託,柏中跟你打一個切磋球擊好,羽毛球我是一定會打的,我們兩個來MU打啦跟你請教一下我的專長是MU打啦羽毛球我是我打啦你可以,我們比較好玩的打你一個比較好玩的,你知道嗎好,柏中你請休息我請教育部長麻煩請教育部長"},{"start":9597.352,"end":9608.103,"text":"股長剛才我們的里昂股長他是10歲開始練羽毛球所以到他這個年紀來有這麼好的星期這麼好的一個星期所以我也是希望說我們婦人館有這麼多個好好他們的運動實施已經"},{"start":9617.771,"end":9623.133,"text":"受到風災災害或是這個已經時間久已經受到恢復我們也希望說可以有好的信心來過往比較好的這個運動選秀未來可以替我們國家來過江發熱所以我們很多這個運動信心好好的這個食品都過起來我們"},{"start":9643.493,"end":9645.096,"text":"我現在有聽說一天 現在運動過後 心理療養我們吃了藥物 回來在我們高雄吃更像說 一罐錢 只可以幫我們做一安寧是這樣喔"},{"start":9657.462,"end":9668.049,"text":"應該跟委員報告運動部成立有比較專業的我剛才有說他們是社會社區但是學校運動專修也是在學校在栽培所以學校這裡是我們跟不上運動部的合作看地方 我們中央跟地方看要不要合作來改善給我們一些專門運動或是學校的運動設施可以有一個比較好的"},{"start":9685.823,"end":9692.246,"text":"會品質給我們的孩子運動的安全第一,他的成績在正常的老師的調查裡面可以進步還可以為我們國家來證出我們比較好的成績我想我們的奉祥及委員都心疼國中你們知道我們婚姻雖然是一個政客館但是我們婚姻孩子大家對於一件事他們只要運動都非常大就是因為"},{"start":9716.212,"end":9725.263,"text":"面對的挑戰 因為都非常勇敢來面對當感染的訊息裡面 他們還有辦法提到好選項這是我們想要的"},{"start":9730.046,"end":9735.55,"text":"有啦 有人出很多結束了運動選手我們要來跟運動部 跟李部長來看要怎麼來共同跟地方來合作 來看要怎麼來改善好 這個過分喔 我是希望說我們李部長一生對運動生非常專業非常專業 我們教育局如果可以合法配合可以落實照顧我們技術我們這個運動選手"},{"start":9757.81,"end":9761.375,"text":"給他們一個好的債券的一個風雲我相信我們未來國家不要說那天這樣只看到有些人說有些人省錢有些人省錢"},{"start":9774.464,"end":9778.345,"text":"國家隊是全國在支持這個對澳洲的比賽不曾分成這樣 不曾說成這樣 我覺得對我們運動人來說 我們覺得會比較開心"},{"start":9790.186,"end":9809.21,"text":"這樣啦好不好所以我們只要國家開除以外 局官選舉賽我們就是認真支持啊不管你用什麼方式 局官怎樣你思考 純粹未來 未來就都一定會勝純粹未來都會贏了所以要當這個所在大家就是"},{"start":9815.911,"end":9827.986,"text":"跟地方的事情跟我們訴求說清楚我要去印度跟澳洲稍微讓他知道我聽主席要稍微先處理想說後天輪到我又不敢處理"},{"start":9831.503,"end":9847.117,"text":"這樣好嗎委員不好意思,可以幫你補充一下嗎我覺得委員您剛剛說得非常好就是我覺得在身為運動員或是在那幾天的比賽其實能感受在現場的所有台灣人我看電視我就感受到真的非常感動其實不管是在開賽前的這個"},{"start":9849.299,"end":9874.25,"text":"唱國旗歌的部分其實我覺得那一刻真的運動可以讓整體的台灣人民可以一起凝聚在一起真的是非常感動的一件事情我昨天早上看完就轉過我又開始去買那城市去看那轉過了那第一次的溫柔、運動、自由所以我們台灣的只要我們國家對處理比賽我們一定是都很關心我們一定都很關心我們用家鄉的方式去看待"},{"start":9879.013,"end":9895.371,"text":"跟委員您補充所以我覺得這一部分當然我相信那一刻台灣人民不管用非常多的方法比如說我會去祈福那我相信最重要的當然是選手覺得站在球場上那一刻他絕對會為我們台灣拼盡全力台灣已經懂靠你了 加油謝謝委員"},{"start":9901.39,"end":9907.815,"text":"謝謝丁薛忠委員質詢 謝謝卓院長各部位首長的備詢 謝謝接下來我們請劉書斌委員質詢賴瑞榮委員請準備好 謝謝院長 謝謝主席有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢"},{"start":9935.199,"end":9936.64,"text":"我沒有看到遙控器劉委員請掌握時間謝謝劉委員好院長辛苦了我今天就是在看到今天早上的時候已經有很多委員問過了您的在3月7號的在"},{"start":9958.736,"end":9979.865,"text":"東京大巨蛋的觀賞台階大戰的經過這過程當中其實有很多的民眾是有關心因為你也說過這就是一個私人的行程這個是華航包機但是他也說了他在松鼠部停機坪在起飛然後花了多少錢你就說看報導"},{"start":9981.526,"end":9982.847,"text":"我自己一個人默默的去風波是你們造成的"},{"start":9997.737,"end":10012.136,"text":"沒有 很多人在關心是你們一直在問這種問題才造成風波的我去跟回來您知道嗎您要知道 我跟大家問一下 您是公眾人物那這個事情報道出來之後就必須要有人要去"},{"start":10012.697,"end":10034.304,"text":"了解說到底是不是用公帑到底是不是用到空紙布的這樣子的一個評級比所以去了解不過你就說你現在是要有你在反問我在這個情況說是我們造成的可是要是不是你是公布人物可能就沒有人要去注意到的不過你已經回答我們就繼續往下看這次這個位置到議題到這個為止那我們繼續往下看呢再看到呢因為這次的戰爭"},{"start":10036.024,"end":10056.293,"text":"美伊戰爭的問題我們看到是說在台灣因為能源的部分它的燃氣目前發電的比例是到達50%但是我國液化天然氣99%是仰賴國外的進口隨著台海局勢的升溫如果運輸交通"},{"start":10058.354,"end":10076.52,"text":"被封鎖的話呢電力無法維持的到12天那發電燃氣的這樣部分會引起到的是國家的能源的韌性的可能是最脆弱的一環那這個部分呢請問院長如何維持到我國的能源的韌性"},{"start":10078.188,"end":10097.157,"text":"我們這一次中東的情勢從二二八開始當天我們就掌握所有的狀況我們包括在那邊的國人包括能源包括我們在國內跟國人怎麼聯繫我們都做了整盤的規定的延期從外交部到交通部到經濟部到金管會到財政部"},{"start":10098.621,"end":10116.363,"text":"是這次而已 院長你所說是這一次而已喔未來的情況之下我們現在等一下繼續再問下去就是說如果會發生到說這個部分影響到四月你說也四月可能沒有問題可是影響到五月的部分尤其是現在還不只是因為塔達的因素如果是中國"},{"start":10118.366,"end":10133.917,"text":"來做封鎖的情況之下你不知道什麼時間會萬一他真的封鎖起來超過12天的話怎麼辦所以趕快把我們的能量創大起來啊如果我們有更強的國防體系的話那我們可以更及早建造更安全的國家"},{"start":10134.994,"end":10152.17,"text":"那現在就是希望 我們已經看到啦看到有這種狀況 所以我們趕快今天不開始 明天就會來不及今天趕快開始 就永遠可以有進步到我們必須安全保障自己的那一邊人員任性啊 沒有一個國家 人員任性應該是多元的 現在只是要持久戰術人員跟"},{"start":10154.292,"end":10180.689,"text":"剛剛跟您說的3月4月都沒問題,就是任性結果之來我現在說的還包括是被封鎖,台海被封鎖,這是最重要的問題看起來是沒有回答,還在用塔達的問題來處理那更重要的問題是因為台灣的問題,包括是美國的智庫CSIS在去年在8月份的時候,它的最新的兵推報告都顯示出來了模擬共軍對台海實施封鎖的時候,顯示台灣在10天會耗盡"},{"start":10181.69,"end":10203.409,"text":"天然氣的儲量 那煤跟石油呢分別是在7週跟20週要耗盡台灣總發電量只剩下封鎖前的20%屆時所有的製造業都會停擺那才問得到說因為美國的海軍情報呢指揮官他也說呢這個Mike Stanton他也提到的說在聽證會上他說呢至少台灣要有一"},{"start":10204.25,"end":10230.912,"text":"一座的核能電廠才能夠減輕能源被供應切斷的這樣的一個危機那這樣的情況我們是不是考慮到台灣有沒有考慮到說把核能的針對暫時封鎖的情境把核能作為一個穩定發展的一個來源有這個考慮到嗎因為現在核能的部分我們核三廠已經開始啟動這個自主安全檢查那三月份就會送出再運轉計畫"},{"start":10232.213,"end":10239.699,"text":"那就是儘快的因為在法律的授權之下像我現在看到這個情況是儘快的是不是在2028年因為我們跟這個西屋公司已經簽約了那儘快的要看他這個機組的老化情況要汰換的這些設備是多還少如果這個汰換的設備都很好不用汰換太多那時間就可以縮短"},{"start":10261.374,"end":10282.045,"text":"所以有機會會在平均大概兩年的時間之前會把它結束我們就會盡快另外一個重要的問題是在於非碳電力的問題因為我們的經濟部、能源局這邊、能源署這邊它還一直堅守的是一個RE100用百分之百再生能源來講"},{"start":10284.666,"end":10306.531,"text":"現在國際的科技企業界他們所採用的是24小時7天的無碳電力法規上沒有R100但是R100是廠商他自主的承諾現在是我現在跟國際間已經出現到這邊因為我們等一下就講到是目前我們再生能源的部分現在到2025年只有378億度的電"},{"start":10311.212,"end":10332.944,"text":"378億度的電但是呢未來的需求呢如果說現在的依照每年還需要2.5%的能源成長的話預計到2030年是將近到要有大概900億度的電900億度的電900億度電是再生能源喔但是如果就全部是3000億度的電3000億度電是不是30%要再生能源是吧"},{"start":10333.764,"end":10348.895,"text":"我們現在還是照我們的預估的啦就是20%的目標往前進就完成那我是算出來因為我們這幾天一直在問能源署的官員們結果幾天都沒有下來這個因為都是用的是"},{"start":10349.716,"end":10373.982,"text":"所謂的往再生能源的佔比去加那我們就在推啊因為我們這2.5%的一個成長率嘛到2030年預計就會有3000億度的電要出現那30%裡面就是900億度可是現在呢2025年的時候呢就只有378億度電我們預計啦因為現在的再生能源只有已經跳票了預計說今年要20%事實上呢只有13到16點多%都自己都跳票了"},{"start":10376.903,"end":10387.506,"text":"沒有 現在事實上看到的就是最多到16%而已對 15點多那你現在已經跳票20%你預計還要2030年現在只剩下4年時間4年時間你要成長從378億度電變成900億度電我預計大概成長一倍的話大概就是700億度可能有200億度的缺的部分"},{"start":10403.211,"end":10408.637,"text":"那你如果還是沒有辦法用RE100的情況你這缺的200億度要從哪裡來"},{"start":10409.691,"end":10433.237,"text":"八五元不是所有的企業他都承諾R100啦有一些公司他有承諾現在大概三十幾家在台灣來講我們現在不只台灣喔我們輝達也要進來對不對還有美光也要進來對不對這些都是國際大廠200億度電而且你事實上就跳票了嘛300%的再生能源的電力就是沒有達到嘛就是這樣子所以"},{"start":10434.313,"end":10449.535,"text":"真的要請政府好好去考慮到需要用到非碳的電力不然的話你2030年已經票票的部分已經回報達成了推動工作還是持續進行而且就像委員講我們要努力"},{"start":10450.737,"end":10467.274,"text":"這部分我會影響到我國吸引外資跟維持出口競爭力喔這地方請卓政府一定要好好去了解到這個地方但是現在外資對台灣的投資環境非常滿意昨天ENGINE來拜訪我他說百分之九十幾的廠商會持續投資台灣"},{"start":10468.544,"end":10492.497,"text":"但是現在的中資包括像輝達、電力中心包括我們是AI的部分曾文森的董事長他說的全球競爭利益的部分就是需要有A幹電力從現在看起來經濟部跟左任府您事實上忽略到我們台灣對於全球的淨零碳排的一個目標的需求我沒有忽略剛剛部長都講得很清楚"},{"start":10493.577,"end":10513.134,"text":"2050年我們還是世界大廠是必須要一步一步的你2030年也沒有達到竟然可以跳到這是太誇張了這是一步一步一年一年的往上追趕目標不過我們再講您有提到如果是在非碳建立當中你說剛才也有講到預計核三廠是現在已經提出來的一個自主安全報告送到核安衛隊去對不對"},{"start":10517.697,"end":10543.529,"text":"那預計剛才有提到的是可能預計是2028現在可能會提早嘛提早會可能如果安全設施都無意見設備都安全的話可能就會提早這營運嘛那現在的還有一個問題是因為卓院長你一直在提到的是如果還核能的部分再一個可能就是新式的核能機組對不對或是所謂的核融合的技術那現在有一個問題是在於核融合的技術啊"},{"start":10544.758,"end":10564.189,"text":"您剛才應該也問了別的人,那是為了變成委員我們都知道,核融活動技術展現在還在開發的階段研發階段,那到2030年才具備最快最快到2030年中才具備商轉的可能性那這個部分我剛才只強調的所有的數據到2030年的時候就已經可能會跳票"},{"start":10565.99,"end":10587.772,"text":"那現在的情況那你現在的核電廠的部分核三廠的他現在跟他說缺200億度電如果核三廠的168億度電用的話其實可以在兩年之後也可以補上這個缺口就是一個很大的幫助點可是剛才說的SMR這部分看起來政府對於SMR的這個考量並沒有想說這是好像畫一個大餅在未來因為2030年"},{"start":10588.993,"end":10614.759,"text":"等於說你到2030年中才會出現那你2030年到2030年中間之後的這個部分呢可能有5年之間是沒有辦法有再生能源的這個部分的這個這樣子的一個我們還是繼續推動二次能源轉型除了多元發展綠能之外我們的深度的節能 科技的儲能這個都會全面展開另外電廣的韌性也會加強這個都是在強化整個供電的系統"},{"start":10615.839,"end":10632.865,"text":"所以是多元的離岸風電還是持續的在推廣當中這個部分我大概幾多個有算過因為你們30%那重點是我昨天講你說的這些部分都是該做的可是一個國家最重要的部分就是在多元的能源的開源是多元的所以確實請你要注意到這部分"},{"start":10636.588,"end":10651.199,"text":"除了這些節能都應該做,這邊我們再繼續往下看還有想要說一個議題,拖吊蟑螂跟你分享一個新聞就是看到初六機車拖了兩公里,竟然鎖價是五萬一千元"},{"start":10652.32,"end":10669.657,"text":"這個部分到底是行情還是在搶劫問題可能是在制度很失靈我們看到是交通部我們上週原本黨團也有開了一個協調會裡面談到說交通部他只管國道跟快速道路的拖吊業半夜把它當作特許的行業但是由高工局來去管理"},{"start":10670.157,"end":10683.112,"text":"但是一般的道路市區道路拖吊業卻要交由地方政府去進行拖吊業並沒有納入到公路法的管理當中導致大量的拖吊的詐欺事件都是以消費爭議來處理而且還曠日廢食民怨四起"},{"start":10687.657,"end":10710.556,"text":"數據顯示說這兩三年來陳貝的申訴案件就這樣出現了警察還說他民事糾紛他不敢介入中央要退地方地方要給消保官行政制度跟從我想要問的是院長這邊由於我們看到檢視的問題很大在於說公路法這裡公路法當中的並沒有把拖吊業者納管"},{"start":10711.414,"end":10728.909,"text":"好那如果沒有納管的話他根本就沒有辦法去做管理甚至我們當初問交通部的一個專員他是說到底現在在一般的道路上面到底有多少的業者大的小的他都說不清楚因為沒有辦法管我們重點現在想問的是說公路法修法有沒有把要把拖掉業者要納入到公路法當中修法"},{"start":10730.495,"end":10757.723,"text":"是 跟委員先報告 等一下請部長說明因為我們也跟委員一樣非常重視一些年節的時候這種拖吊 交通的拖吊會發生一個亂象雖然中央地方各有管轄的不同的路域但是我們希望能夠有一個比較強大的一個管理的規則一定要把這些業者納進來管理因為他現在他沒有辦法納進來管理他不是公路法上面所稱的所謂運輸業所以他沒有納出來那我們要想辦法把他納進來管理"},{"start":10758.863,"end":10776.21,"text":"對 可是公路法當中在車子為什麼把它當作運輸業這就是應該是修法作為立法委員我們就在反映這樣的民意因為公路法並不是管的是運輸嘛公路法關的是所有上面的在車子在道路上面行駛都可能尤其尤其你車子部分沒有這種的一個"},{"start":10777.43,"end":10795.465,"text":"拖掉你拋錨的這每個都遇到的部分你現在這個缺管是必須要把它納入的那部長你的看法呢現在其實不是沒有法可以管我們現在消費者保護的這個法令都可以管得到只是說執行上要怎麼執行那但委員我知道您的質疑"},{"start":10795.885,"end":10824.1,"text":"所以我們現在正在努力就是說我們現在您剛有提到我們在公路就是省道或者是高速公路我們其實管理的不錯那我們會以那個經驗來制定一個協助制定一個所謂的定型化契約透過這樣子的定型化契約來協助各個地方都有這樣定型化契約出來之後如果有遇到消費上面的糾紛我們就可以依照這個定型化契約來處理我們希望在今年年底之前可以完成這樣子的努力"},{"start":10825.041,"end":10839.777,"text":"請部長說明目前這個偵辦的狀況那個跟委員報告那個春節期間有拖掉蟑螂這個橫行的這部分台北地檢署跟新北地檢署都有分擔在偵辦中好這部分因為謝謝鄭部長但是我重點是"},{"start":10841.721,"end":10866.914,"text":"卓院長陳部長您的問題沒有看到重點您受限於沒錯你如果變成就是消費者的部分像觀光業啊甚至補銷業把他當做定型化契約去管理那個是我們在規定是你這字本身是變字節啊最本的問題是他本身就應該放在交通的公路法當中或是相關的要法有法源基礎啊去進行"},{"start":10867.694,"end":10882.995,"text":"如果沒有這個部分去處理甚至這個部分還涉及到的是你對於一般的公路的上面的拖吊業者他甚至剛才說的引起到的是刑事的犯罪有詐欺等等的這個出現重點是我要知道是這個部分是非常重要的"},{"start":10883.536,"end":10901.606,"text":"竟然沒有法源基礎你現在被他用消保法這個是直接啦一般的市區道路裡面本來他的管理規則就不太一樣例如說我舉個例客運公車他是運輸業當然我們的公路法也好或者是交通部當然也會納管但在地方上的管理還是由地方政府來執行"},{"start":10902.466,"end":10915.555,"text":"所以現在最關鍵的是因為22縣市通通都有這個問題的時候為什麼中央沒有辦法統一的一個我們現在就是要來協助地方來做定型化契約我們希望每一個地方都有自己的定型化契約能夠做得出來"},{"start":10917.628,"end":10933.744,"text":"這個在我們看起來它其實是字末節的問題因為你拖掉車業是一個很重要的部分在必須要拿到公路法上看起來是並沒有那個支持的態度啦好沒關係線是我管的道路上面發生的問題"},{"start":10934.705,"end":10962.86,"text":"有部分它就是屬於地方自治事項這個就是中央地方的成績那每個地方都有問題的時候我們會想辦法設一個法令讓大家能夠共同遵守但是地方也可以自己有一個自治的法規那這個都是要城市來做的那我們看到的這個亂象剛剛部長也說過了正在準備要做這個強力來納管的過程你怎麼會說他不能準備呢我們現在在召集各個縣市大家一起來共領一個方案但我們先優先的是"},{"start":10964.581,"end":10975.991,"text":"從高速公路跟省道他們管理的經驗他們的定型化契約先訂出來作為一個範本讓所有的地方可以來作為一個參考"},{"start":10976.95,"end":10994.463,"text":"我們希望未來在修法制的時候朝野雙方能夠多一點溝通看怎麼樣的朝野最能夠治本的方式去助理我們繼續往下看另外一個問題是測速照相機看到的是一個測速照相機本來是應該要去降低的事故"},{"start":10994.963,"end":11020.436,"text":"可是事實上看到的是台灣的測速照相機的密度是日本的300多倍罰單數量是日本的3倍但是交通死亡率卻是日本的5倍全台有超過2500支的測速桿可是我們看到如果說測速高速是發生死亡車禍裡面最大的原因可是我們看到的是最重要的是因為駕駛人的疏忽等等的"},{"start":11021.076,"end":11042.536,"text":"並沒有對症下藥啊因為看到的從台北市的數據來看看等等包括是在車道變化不當啊還有就是駕駛的疏忽等等的那請問這個院長或部長看到的說超速並非是交通事故的主因的時候目前廣設這樣子的一個測速照相桿是什麼樣的一個意義啊到底是在拼營收嗎 還在救命啊"},{"start":11042.936,"end":11069.135,"text":"跟委員報告您的這個數據跟我們這邊所掌握真正有去延期之後的數據是不太一樣的因為在車禍發生的第一時間當然我們就是這樣登錄沒有任何一個駕駛會承認自己是超速所以在裡面大部分都不會說大部分的人都會說我是恍神我是不小心所以第一時間的登錄是這樣但如果真正做整個車禍的測量或者是延期之後我們有發現"},{"start":11070.797,"end":11090.619,"text":"車禍因為車速過快造成的車禍高達四成到五成左右各國的數據其實都差不多那也跟委員報告一件事就是說您說台灣有兩千多隻的車速照相但我們的這個死亡率卻沒有像日本這麼低我要跟委員報告其實車禍的事故有很多的樣態"},{"start":11091.926,"end":11120.318,"text":"那測速照相跟車禍不一定有必然關係坦白這樣講那日本他們有沒有比較守法有沒有超速的比較少應該是有那也跟委員報告台灣的密度其實也沒有特別高您剛剛所提到的台灣有兩千多隻的測速照相機但是我要跟委員報告的是光是韓國韓國在這幾年的交通改革非常成功所以他們的死亡率降非常快但我也要跟委員報告的是他光是首爾市測速照相機超過兩千隻"},{"start":11121.778,"end":11150.231,"text":"超過2000隻也就是說大家依照速度管理下去很合法合規的駕駛這是很正常的也應該要做的這個對交通管理絕對是有幫助的如果是這樣子的話那請跟廣為跟民眾要說清楚那這部分的報告是不是也給本席要有一份這個沒有問題好 那另外我們想要看的是可是我們想說這個尤其測速照相機的設置跟改善交通的效益這個部分的效果你們有做報告嗎你們有做研究嗎"},{"start":11151.107,"end":11176.477,"text":"我跟委員報告大部分的測速照相機都是地方政府包含那個罰款我自己當過台中市議員我很清楚我在審預算的時候發現台中市政府一年可以編二十幾億的這個罰款收入這些收入都在地方政府不是中央要去設置的但我只是跟委員報告說速度管理對於整個交通管理來講降低死亡絕對是有幫助的"},{"start":11177.383,"end":11206.943,"text":"好 我們就希望說看到這邊的這個報告看到是不是從地方政府拿到的這樣的報告繼續往下看的是這個口袋的部分就是錢收了大概有前年就有300億元的這個部分那現在的它的根據道交條例跟它的道路交通違規罰還收入分配跟運用辦法可以看到說這邊的錢呢基本上呢如果以直轄市來講的話呢75%給各縣市然後其中12%才是改善的交通設施"},{"start":11207.623,"end":11225.612,"text":"那63%是被到一般地方政府去運用的那如果在交通部的內政部警政署這邊有17萬有國安交通的這個管理基金啦重點是想說這些的收到的錢啊能不能夠是把它用在所謂的改善道路交通而不變成是財政的地方的收入啊"},{"start":11226.613,"end":11253.187,"text":"大高委員這個部分我相當支持因為我們是用這個違規的收入違規為什麼要罰是因為希望交通更安全那所以應該罰款的收入應該要來改善交通整體的交通的安全狀況才是正道那目前我確實有看到一個現象就是說很多的地方政府把它變成是一個小金庫在使用並不是真正把它拿來道路改善或者是安全改善我是希望這個比例可以增加"},{"start":11253.707,"end":11268.497,"text":"那我也請我們部內開始在研析這個問題但這也涉及到整個財政收支的一些問題包含這個財政紀律的問題在之前有些法令上面的限制那我們希望能夠推這方面的改革那也希望我們的改革必須有一個實現"},{"start":11269.398,"end":11283.886,"text":"年底的選舉又快到了我們年底之前能夠提出交通部的期待的方案跟法案但這也需要立法院這邊大家一起來幫忙因為那個之前所設定的法令限制其實蠻多的我們要一起來解套"},{"start":11284.386,"end":11308.251,"text":"好那另外的好謝謝陳部長那現在要請的是一個關於義男的體位區分標準的修正的部分這個草案的說明我們看到這次在國防部跟內政部他們所提出來的合期但是以國防部為主的有180種的這次的體位區分標準的修正是有180種的身心的疾患然後他把免疫變成了個徵章標準比南韓還要嚴"},{"start":11311.092,"end":11336.963,"text":"那這個問題就想要問的是第一個他在做這個行政的函釋的時候呢一般呢要說公告有相關法令的需要用到60天這是只有到45天而且聽到的是沒有開公聽會那這部分哪一個院長你是不是請看誰要去報告說為什麼這部分都違反到原來的這樣子的公告公告要做溝通跟說明跟公聽會蓄積到政黨的意見這問題"},{"start":11341.441,"end":11361.113,"text":"有關於體位區分標準的修正其實我們在一月底的時候剛剛預告結束我們在體位區分標準的過程當中除了內政部國防部還有跟衛福部一起來商量跟討論那預告結束之後確實有些團體有不同的意見所以我們會把這個意見全部收整之後才做公告"},{"start":11361.613,"end":11389.068,"text":"那為什麼要做體位區分標準的部分是這樣子就是說有關於這個替代疫的部分我們如果跟其他國家相比我們的免疫標準是16%那這包括南韓或其他的只有3%到6%而已所以我們覺得說有些人是為了逃避這個兵疫所以我們以修正這個體位區分標準來處理那同時也因應我們現在的兵疫制度是從四個月延長到一年的期間所以會有加嚴的這個標準"},{"start":11390.349,"end":11411.507,"text":"但是現在很重要的是包括的是你們現在把一些尤其是有些心理的狀況的部分我特別要講到的是說包括A、B的體位到底怎麼區分他們怎麼樣訓練因為都要進入到成功你做一個新兵的一個基礎的一個體位基礎的一個訓練我們可以看到是說特別是針對有時候跨性別者"},{"start":11412.208,"end":11439.087,"text":"他們目前的草案是說把免疫改為替代育的A級替代育採取的方式怎麼樣採取集體的住宿而且用男性化管理的模式而且剪了很極短的團法集體寢室跟公寓的安排這對於有些接受到荷爾蒙治療的跨性別女性而言確實會表達很驚恐的性別跟否定的身體暴露面對這個情形的話"},{"start":11440.479,"end":11468.531,"text":"這部分有更進步的就是有沒有把這意見再納進來去修訂是謝謝委員的關心有關於性別心理的特殊狀況的部分我們衛福部跟相關的這個專業的精神這個醫學會有達到一定的程度的共識也就是說我們希望採取一年當中用持續追蹤的方式來了解他是否適合服替代役那另外一個在我們替代役所訓練的這個中心以這個成功率為主的話"},{"start":11469.111,"end":11486.957,"text":"我們在所謂的跨性別友善的住宿環境會來做改善那這個部分我們有持續跟公民團體的保證可是一般集體住宿這種情況這種制度可以報告委員我想您大概知道以目前服兵役來看連我們的這個常備兵對不起就是專業的這個服兵役也有女兵"},{"start":11487.817,"end":11502.306,"text":"所以事實上在性別友善的這個空間裡面怎麼做比較好的修正我覺得說按照兵役法因為服兵役是台灣國民的義務我們也應該朝著這方面來處理但是我們現在有給這個所謂的性別心理狀態"},{"start":11503.446,"end":11518.442,"text":"比較特殊的這些人在申請的期間會用一年的時間採取每一個月或每兩個月到一個專業的精神醫師這邊做身心診斷的狀況來做追蹤辦理看他是不是符合免疫的標準"},{"start":11519.683,"end":11546.284,"text":"這邊你們會繼續再去追蹤就對了那另外的關於說不堪服病疫者本來以前是當作免疫的現在把它當作是行動不便者也需要他人去照顧的線索是這樣那只要是一般視之健全的啦但是他如果有心臟病啊器官移植等等的這些僵直性脊椎炎的他沒有身障證明好像還是繼續在裡面作息就是可以變成到一個替代又會被徵召等等"},{"start":11547.165,"end":11559.075,"text":"我們過去看到一些退代役的部分有些追監牌突出的異難陳俊明都還發生入伍後就救急復發還被認為說是裝病結果後來就失去了生命這個問題上面是不是能夠針對"},{"start":11560.839,"end":11577.272,"text":"成功領當中的這個長期醫療資源一年的這個不足的部分要去做修訂報告委員我們這次的修訂範圍非常的廣193項修訂了180項次但是大家都知道扶替代役呢跟一般到國防部的那個單位去服役是不太一樣的"},{"start":11577.952,"end":11604.205,"text":"譬如說我們這個有嘉陰替代役也有產業替代役有社會替代役也就是說他在成功嶺服26天的這樣子的一個體能訓練部長我剛才就是問成功嶺的問題那個替代役的藝男陳俊明就是在入伍後就是好那如果說在成功嶺裡面有這樣子一個不健全或者是說有受到這個不安全的狀況之下呢請來告訴我們我們來做一下檢討跟修正"},{"start":11604.878,"end":11614.211,"text":"好最後一個問題就想到的是一個我們這次看到的是這兩位部長請回那關於在卓院長你在這次的"},{"start":11618.36,"end":11636.134,"text":"報告當中時政報公有特別提到是說有一個兒少的發展專戶這個帳戶這樣從弱勢就是原來從107年所說的部分他就要把它的有要擴大的意思但我們看到說您有這樣我就用心了但是兒少帳戶這個帳戶適用對象是有預計要從弱勢團弱勢額頭要擴展到全部的兒少嗎"},{"start":11643.8,"end":11662.447,"text":"或是新生兒嗎因為我們從國民年金老農津貼一直到最近討論的六大生活補助我們認為應該更完善的一個整個對青少年朋友們整套的從生育養育到教育整套的計畫所以過去的兒少專戶他面對的是低收中低收入戶"},{"start":11663.107,"end":11684.313,"text":"所以這個執行的成果是有限的那麼我們如果要擴大的話要普遍化的話那能不能在財政考量之下做一個更普遍性周圍性把對象擴大金額合理讓他能夠在人生的不同階段他就可以有自己可以自主性的一筆一開始的一個小小的裁員"},{"start":11685.444,"end":11699.885,"text":"主任長你在你的施政報告中就講說第一筆如果新生兒出現的話就是一次就10萬我們現在已經做到了就是補到10萬元未來我們隨著各種條件我們還可以增加我要說的是人生的第一桶金好這部分跟我們"},{"start":11700.706,"end":11721.28,"text":"在野黨在一月份所提出來的台灣未來賬戶事實上是蠻有相近的意圖在大家要考慮到國家財政的能力所以我反正到時候都已經排進來審嘛對不對那我想說是不是大家有共識就往在這邊為我們的下一代尤其新生兒的出生率發展繼續再做努力好的OK好就這樣謝謝謝謝劉書斌委員的質詢謝謝卓院長 相關部會首長的備詢 謝謝"},{"start":11727.332,"end":11742.144,"text":"委員會我們在議場二樓旁聽來自林倩琦委員嘉義縣的親友團掌聲歡迎大家我們接下來再請今天上午最後一位質詢的委員賴銳龍委請質詢好謝謝韓院長請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢"},{"start":11761.277,"end":11789.806,"text":"主席好 辛苦了我先請教一下這兩天大家討論很多的現任的行政院長到日本去這絕對是台日關係的一大突破也是台灣全體人民感到非常的興奮跟高興的那我不知道院長怎麼看為什麼好像有在野黨立委是感到不高興的因為這是我私人的行程也不需要得到太多的關注但是"},{"start":11791.041,"end":11819.277,"text":"假日私人自費一個行程為我們的國家隊加油很多人都想這麼做啦那我當然是假日有個機會這麼做我想大家應該是朝好的方向想比較好院長無論是自費的或公費的現任的行政院長能夠到日本去這就是一個台日關係上很重大的突破我相信院長很清楚啦這個如果沒有得到日本高層的同意的話這不可能成行的我們都很清楚"},{"start":11820.157,"end":11833.653,"text":"表示說台日的關係是得到了一個很好的一個進展院長應該同意這樣的看法我還是要說明我內部的航班等等的我們到一般的程序來申請那日方我們也依照一般的程序來申請我們沒有特別"},{"start":11834.451,"end":11853.016,"text":"有特別的什麼關係或是了解到它內部有什麼特別的程序但是也很感謝日方所有的相關的能夠給予我們這一次因為我想日本方面也對我們的國家隊也相當的尊敬所以當我們提出要去對國家隊加油的時候大家是大概有共同的興趣之所在吧"},{"start":11853.436,"end":11881.876,"text":"院長 現任的行政院長能夠到日本去這就是一件不容易的事情當然我知道院長必須保持低調也必須保持跟日本大家的默契跟關係但是我還是要強調台灣利益應該是整體一體的當我們跟日本的關係如此的友好我們的現任的行政院長可以到日本的時候這應該是舉國大家都要感到振奮也許大家要保持低調但是這絕對是一個外交上的重大的成果我認為其實朝野各政黨應該要一起來支持"},{"start":11882.696,"end":11907.066,"text":"自費是絕對是一個很特殊的考量下的思考但是無論如何行政院長現任的行政院長院長如果你現在不是院長的話我相信你會為台灣任何一個政黨包括國民黨的行政院長能夠到日本去我也認為您會感到驕傲的也會感到振奮院長同意這樣的看法嗎我不僅希望代表中華民國政府的高層的人員能夠去國外做正式的訪問"},{"start":11907.864,"end":11935.362,"text":"我們更歡迎其他各國的重要的政治領導人也能夠到台灣來看看台灣民主自由進步發展的情形這個就是應該是我們台灣走向全世界最正向最好的一個做法了所以我想這樣的事情其實在野黨不應該糾結在所謂這些細節上面這樣的糾結很容易讓大家覺得你跟中共是站在同一個陣線這件事情最生氣的是中共他不希望台日關係升溫不希望台日關係變好"},{"start":11936.283,"end":11960.2,"text":"但是反倒連在野黨都還跟中共站在同一個陣線在挑那些小毛病在挑很多默契下不能做的事情的時候我認為其實這是傷害整個台灣的國家整體利益的我們希望在野黨應該支持自己的行為應該要約束自己的行為應該以國家利益為重沒有任何一個行政院長如果他現任他能夠到日本去的話還必須要用自費還必須要用各種方式"},{"start":11961.14,"end":11980.512,"text":"這只是為了希望能夠走出更多台灣這個外交的一個道路這樣的苦心跟用心我覺得應該是要得到全體國民的支持跟我相信我說明之後大家都能夠理解就好像開一場比賽贏的這一方會很高興輸的那一方會跳腳我就不曉得我們哪裡輸掉了"},{"start":11981.152,"end":11997.429,"text":"台灣是贏的啊 台灣在外交上是贏的啊為什麼有人這麼跳腳 他們認為輸在哪裡我們應該是高興我們的隊伍贏了除非他們不是聽台灣 除非他們跟台灣不同隊如果他們心不在台灣這邊 這會讓大家非常的失望所以我還是堅決的支持啦 以肯定"},{"start":11997.95,"end":12023.181,"text":"院長不管你是用什麼樣的方式現任的行政院長能夠到日本去能夠去觀看球賽絕對是因為日本的高層也有給予相當高的一個支持跟協助而這就是台日關係最好的一個證明我們絕對堅決的支持院長這樣一個做法我們希望未來有更多這樣的機會能夠突破出去謝謝院長 謝謝委員好 接下來我想請教一下勞保的行政事務費的部分過去其實我們"},{"start":12025.489,"end":12049.355,"text":"這個執行黨對於勞工有很多的照顧但是我們其實高雄的職業團體是全台灣的職業公共最多635家全台之冠會員37萬人也是全台灣第二了齁但是其實這幾年不管是物價不管是社會低工作我們都提升了但是我們在這個每人每月14元的補助其實是不太夠的院長能不能調到至少每人每月16元以上"},{"start":12050.442,"end":12066.324,"text":"歷史上來看從108年開始從原來的10元調到12.5元再來114年又調到14元那我們想看看因為預算的問題我還是要跟勞動部再確認一次"},{"start":12066.718,"end":12091.435,"text":"到底有沒有支持往上調嗎你支持嗎我是覺得現在我們對勞工農漁民的朋友還有社會比較弱勢的族群當國家財政經濟狀況好的底下我們應該用更大的力量來支持對 給予比較方向是OK的給予更多需要照顧的族群更多的支持這是政府可以在我們財政允許在我們的經濟狀況不錯的狀況下最好的做法每一項社會福利的討論或是這種"},{"start":12094.538,"end":12103.211,"text":"這個家庭支持的討論我們都要先設想到我們的財政能力我們預算程序是不是有能力有完備所以要請部長來說明一下"},{"start":12104.83,"end":12134.296,"text":"那個很謝謝賴元其實一直對於這個勞工朋友其實非常非常的支持跟關心喔那尤其高雄的工會其實非常非常多而且這些工會其實也幫助政府推動其實很多重要的這個保險相關的事務所以今天當然也謝謝委員來反映工會們的期待那的確我們其實也有看到其實工會這幾年在承辦一些相關業務的時候他的行政成本其實也是有增加所以我想我們願意來朝向"},{"start":12135.467,"end":12145.36,"text":"這個增加這個事務費的方向來規劃方案然後來爭取行政院的支持那我想這個我們也希望能夠給"},{"start":12146.764,"end":12161.335,"text":"勞工給工會有更多的協助因為政府跟工會我想在很多勞工事務上面我們一定是要互挺的部長16元這樣的方向有機會來完成嗎就是從14條到16元我們朝這個方向來規劃對我們朝這個方向來規劃我們看看看工會來辦這些勞健保業務他的負擔降低了以及我們剛剛說過兼顧到政府的財政的情況幾下那麼勞動部如果能夠在"},{"start":12173.011,"end":12197.828,"text":"經費上預算上能夠合理的把它找出來這個預算不會排擠到其他的那只要他提出來我們認真討論我想這個是對勞動部可以可以可以謝謝院長謝謝謝謝部長謝謝其實要請教一下其實財務法整個修法之後對高雄南台灣不只高雄傷害很大台南高雄屏東幾乎都是重災區那裡面其實讓高雄實質損失了174億包括"},{"start":12200.35,"end":12227.449,"text":"捷運台北很多都已經完成了而高雄這幾年包括黃線包括紅線南沿紅線北沿都快速在興建當中但是少了這些中央的支持的經費今年會少掉了103億這個部分院長能不能給予高雄更多的支持就是一方面當然財務法我們應該盡速來通過院版一方面也希望在財政上面能夠給予現在很努力在推動的中南部的縣市給予更多經費上的支持院長可以嗎"},{"start":12228.551,"end":12244.081,"text":"從這麼多年以來從各個大縣市來興辦捷運都得到中央很多的協助其實捷運是一個地方應辦的事項但是因為考量到地方的財政能力所以中央都大幅度的來做一些補助支持地方"},{"start":12244.801,"end":12271.28,"text":"但是財化法這一次財化法的修訂卻讓中央失去了這樣一個調節的能力那我認為這個對於已經捷運發展的城市是好的但還沒有發展的城市會變成不公平已經發展的其實是台北市嘛那還沒有發展的城市那就沒有辦法跟過去一樣得到中央這麼大的協助完全要靠地方那就只有兩個情況一個就是時間拉長一個就是"},{"start":12272.34,"end":12286.992,"text":"計畫改變那這個都對地方傷害蠻大的這個對中南部也非常的不公平所以可以拜託院長還有很多已經在計畫中的還沒有展開的計畫中設計中的那現在都有一點停頓是不是請部長說明"},{"start":12288.553,"end":12309.465,"text":"未來確實因為財化法的分配的狀況改變所以未來中央跟地方之間的能夠補助給地方的捷運的款項當然會減低但院長有指示我們針對過去補助比較少的縣市我們會有一些加碼的方案比例上會拉高過去已經補助很多的縣市舉例來講就是例如說台北市"},{"start":12310.265,"end":12327.984,"text":"那新北市也相對是捷運相對完整的地方這個補助的比例相對就會低一點所以不只是考慮到財政狀況也考慮到說我們都市跟都市之間的競爭跟發展的過程當中捷運相對落後而且現在正在進行努力當中過去補助比較少的縣市我們會來加碼補助"},{"start":12328.965,"end":12345.314,"text":"院長我們希望院版採訪法盡快來通過通過之後這是一個比較相對公平合理的一個採訪法另外一方面在還沒有這個處理完之前的時候在院裡面可調控的範圍內對於中南部的縣市還是必須給予多一些支持因為南北之間還是存在那個差異的那北部"},{"start":12345.894,"end":12371.941,"text":"台北新北大多數都完成了也都補助了但是中南部現在從高雄到台南到台中都急需掉這些捷運的時候而卻這些款項少了我希望能夠利用現在剩有的一些補助款來做一些調節希望給中南部更多支持院長可以嗎 請您多幫忙可以嗎是剛剛部長也說過我們的想法就是過去還沒有發展捷運的地方軌道建設比較欠缺比較晚發展的我們可以多一點的補助"},{"start":12372.501,"end":12386.53,"text":"那已經完備的那當然他就已經享受了但是這個還是要看院版財發法如果能夠及時的讓他在明年能夠展開的話那我想這個整個對地方的補助不只這一點其他的都能夠這兩個方向我們一起來努力啦謝謝院長"},{"start":12387.611,"end":12414.023,"text":"再來我請教一下因為亞洲新灣區在高雄快速的發展205冰工廠其實58公頃是重中之重那過去包括南澤中央廠的經驗因為交由地方來做污染整治跟開發之後很快台積電也進去了那205冰工廠能不能也委由市政府來做土屋的整治跟開發加快整個亞洲新灣區的發展速度這對於高雄對於整個南台灣都是一個重中之重可以嗎 院長冰工廠的開"},{"start":12417.267,"end":12439.795,"text":"跟地方政府的合作部長看看這個兵工廠現在的現在當然是由兵工廠軍備局這邊但如果他由國防部來開發開發這個絕對不是他的強項土整治也不是他強項開發不是強項但是如果交由市政府的話比照像中油的這個男子廠的經驗交由市政府來做的話像現在台積電已經進駐市政從17年拉到了2.5年這一個案子他當時"},{"start":12444.877,"end":12472.602,"text":"本來就是由市政府以區段徵收先見後遷的方式來要求我們遷徵至大樹北跟高屋營區那就這個土地的這個撥交的部分大概已經不好了現在是屬於土地污染的處理的問題那這個部分本來也是由高雄市政府來處理好那這是不是就院長跟部長我們就再跟市府來協調是不是就讓市府來加速完成這整件工作了好這個既然已經計畫中是中央地方合作那以後我們就"},{"start":12473.502,"end":12502.307,"text":"跟委員一起合作好 謝謝院長那接下來我請教一下上次其實包括陳吉邁市長包括我們也提到了24小時的南興新機場的一個計畫這個部分當然不會很快啦它一定是需要10年20年還要填海造陸還要但是這個啟動要先進行就是北台灣有一個桃園機場除了松山桃園機場24小時起降南台灣如果能夠有一個24小時的機場對南台灣會有相當大的注意院長可以來思考跟啟動嗎這樣的一個方向"},{"start":12503.147,"end":12520.757,"text":"我們目前南北雙空港是以桃園跟小港機場但我知道小港機場的受限很多所以我們一直在尋找在南部有一個更適合而且南部未來的這個產業開發非常非常重要那這個部分交通部院長是不是拜託院長啟動24小時的一個新機場企劃本來就是這個方向所以院長這個會來啟動評估"},{"start":12528.937,"end":12544.442,"text":"跟委員報告我們交通部一直都在評估因為院長上次也有到小港機場去看過那大家都有建議就是南部一定要有一個24小時的空港那這個部分交通部已經在研究當中了什麼時候可以有個初步的一個研究跟方案或者是規劃出來"},{"start":12545.362,"end":12572.259,"text":"因為目前其實評估啦從過去到現在評估過很多的地點那我們就現在的狀況再重新評估一次我們希望各位請院長、各部長在一個月內給我一個你們的時程表啦好不好就至少一個初步你們的規劃不管他是十年或是北朝鮮都可以但是至少有一個初步的規劃出來我們知道政府有朝這個方向在前進好不好好謝謝那再來再請教國道7號也謝謝院長的大力支持這國道7號對高雄發展很重要"},{"start":12572.799,"end":12595.474,"text":"但是現在國道西岸只從小港到仁武而已但是在往北的時候其實就沒有了那其實它變成要匯集回到國一那現在國一的岡山段到台南段非常的擁捨幾乎上加班大塞車能不能請院長跟部長也提早來規劃北沿到台南讓台南高雄兩個的這個兩個雙城市之間的連結能夠更加的便利"},{"start":12596.886,"end":12612.107,"text":"好 報告委員目前國道1號的這個拓寬跟改善您也應該知道因為確實台南跟高雄跟岡山之間的這一段車流量相當相當的大所以我們在國道1號有在做拓寬的計畫那國道7號我們也準備要動工了"},{"start":12612.628,"end":12634.404,"text":"那委員看得更前瞻就是說未來在國道7號往南蓋好之後有沒有可能再往北延我覺得這個對整個台南跟高雄的都市的整體發展來講是有需要的那我們也來做這方面的研析再跟委員報告因為這個也跟院長跟部長講過很多次其實從北高雄到台南之間其實用色的非常厲害從南池到岡山"},{"start":12635.685,"end":12659.485,"text":"橋頭、岡山一路幾乎是長塞車、大塞車的那萬一發生了重大事件因為它南北向少掉一個連結那我們當時也希望高架那高架有它一些徵收上的困難所以目前大家評估上比較可行是有國七往北延伸到台南那這樣就會有台六十一、國一、國七、國三這樣的方向的話讓台南跟高雄兩大都會間更加的便利也希望院長跟部長來大力支持啦好不好盡速來評估、盡速來規劃"},{"start":12661.294,"end":12685.696,"text":"好的 我請交通部馬上來評估後續的可能性好 謝謝賴瑞榮委員的質詢謝謝 左院長 各相關部會首長 貝馨謝謝方院會我們上午的質詢到此為止另外依照黨團共識本次會議不再處理臨時提案下午2點30分繼續開會進行質詢謝謝 王玉民委員陪同我們一起參與今天的質詢我們先來休息"},{"start":21416.681,"end":21426.092,"text":"好 周院長 曾副院長各位閣議員午安我們接下來繼續開會進行諮詢接下來我們請羅明財委員諮詢陳冠廷委員請準備"},{"start":21448.883,"end":21476.758,"text":"韓院長這座卓院長以及所有的行政團隊韓院長可不可以請卓院長麻煩請卓院長備選現在全世界的經濟發展或者是區域間的和平或者是"},{"start":21478.795,"end":21499.847,"text":"這個衝突可以說是令人掌控不住變化多端台灣是一個島嶼型我們全部都仰賴國外的進口的一些原料最近美伊戰爭什麼時候會結束什麼時候會結束"},{"start":21507.723,"end":21530.277,"text":"這個問題現在好像應該沒有答案雖然川普總統說他說很快會結束好那我們也沒有做沙盤推演當然有我們推演不是推演戰爭結束是說在戰爭期段當中我們怎麼每一天了解什麼狀況需要應變什麼事情是因為國人最擔心的就是油電水氣飆漲"},{"start":21532.588,"end":21558.521,"text":"大家人心惶惶優價漲破100塊以上的話我們國內的消費者物價指數CPI大概會漲到多少我們還是盡量啟動各種的機制希望能夠維持在CPI2%以下希望能夠維持這個目標現在大概多少現在都是1.6幾左右吧那這樣的情況還可控嗎"},{"start":21559.617,"end":21570.224,"text":"我們盡量啟動所有的工具前瞻性的部署當然都有上有下有人說油價如果漲到150美金那台灣的經濟就"},{"start":21571.604,"end":21590.305,"text":"那也是一種推估的可能前天股市一天可以跌超過近2000點1489點1400一盤鐘啦後來有再回過來今天稍微有一點起來但是力道還要再加強是剛剛回答那個CPI的問題是拱部長你要說明嗎"},{"start":21591.165,"end":21619.125,"text":"CPI的問題現在一二月份還好他的平均大概也是一點多啦那二月份稍微高一點點1.7左右那也是正常反應因為二月份是過年嘛所以那個消費指數往上升是有一點算是正常所以拜託院長苦民所苦不用拜託這是我們的職責那油電水氣可不可以動漲現在油的部分已經是緩漲機制起動緩漲機制我們吸收"},{"start":21621.848,"end":21645.148,"text":"亞林最低價以後我們再吸收60%那所以說本來要漲這個像上禮拜本來總共要漲5塊多的我們只是漲1塊5而已如果扣掉亞林最低價3塊7我們漲1塊5而已所以大部分是我們來吸收那其他的部分就是暫時穩定平穩物價所以剛出了油之外水"},{"start":21648.712,"end":21669.208,"text":"電 氣 會不會影響對 一樣 那個都沒有調整都不會漲 所以現在都不會漲我們希望苦民所苦因為現在地方的基層苦哈哈雖然我們的經濟成長率去年本來預估3.4%後來有到7.45%左右"},{"start":21671.869,"end":21700.448,"text":"但是8點多今年的預估是多少今天是7.7億可是他有很大的一部分是集中在半導體以及AI的周邊ICT產業面對各行百工百業事實上有很多很辛苦包委員不過那個傳統產業在一二月份的時候出口也是恢復比較好的一個成績了出口狀況都還不錯"},{"start":21701.567,"end":21726.132,"text":"那有關關稅戰的部分我們跟美國都已經談好了嗎?不可以再爭取到更好的條件我們原來的MOU跟ART談的內容我想委員你也清楚包括國內甚至包括國外在觀測我們的也認為我們談了一個相當好的結果美國在到最高法院判決之後當然有回復到一些現在跟世界"},{"start":21726.932,"end":21749.221,"text":"跟其他國家相比較起來我們沒有原來的R的那個那麼樣的優惠不過我們現在努力的過程跟結果就希望跟美國確認我們原來所談的MOU當然是繼續生效的我們的R的部分在美國確認而且確保會繼續讓我們維持這樣的最惠待遇那我們就能夠保持跟過去一樣的這個競爭力相對的優勢"},{"start":21752.51,"end":21768.07,"text":"希望院長能多保持一點彈性這個副院長是非常辛苦的他一定會秉持這樣的原則再繼續向美國爭取最惠的待遇因為感覺一日數變說好的結果又變說好的又再變"},{"start":21769.144,"end":21797.243,"text":"所以很多的中小企業企業界苦哈因為今年的這個暫時性關稅是10%加NFN那比起去年是20%加NFN事實上也算是改善我們有沒有牽涉到退稅的問題我們今天應該是今天一早我們請了美國律師在線上來跟就是台灣的企業如果有興趣關心這個議題那也可以"},{"start":21798.996,"end":21826.593,"text":"來聽取甚至以QA那當然美國因為他這個要退稅的話基本上是要打官司的所以要訴訟的所以說當然這個訴訟大部分是以進口商為主因為是他們繳的關稅但是我們繳給我們貨是繳給進口商到時候這些進口商怎麼樣跟我們的生產商有一個怎麼樣來協商就是說當初"},{"start":21828.564,"end":21853.377,"text":"20%可能大家講好是各分擔10%那退稅以後有沒有可能這樣子這個可能還是要透過一些negotiate我們希望說在這方面的沙盤推演可以多多的落實並讓所有的國內的民眾來知道究竟怎麼談未來怎麼因應政府怎麼支持我們就盡量"},{"start":21855.367,"end":21879.6,"text":"副院長談到一個段落的時候基本上都有召開記者會讓大家知道那也盡量的那我們跟院長跟總統基本上也都有下鄉事實上是跟企業界來舉行座談會那面對現在國內很多的企業對外的投資越來越多我們看到數字顯示跟去年跟前年比"},{"start":21880.575,"end":21909.79,"text":"很多的企業的資本支出都往外移這會不會影響到台灣未來經濟發展沒有多啦 實際上台灣的投資還是比出去的要多很多就是在台灣本地的投資在台灣有什麼經濟的亮點呢比如說半導體大家關心的部分台積電來講的話他就有11條產線在台灣同時要開工了馬上要往前走了類似這樣的情況"},{"start":21910.583,"end":21939.045,"text":"其他的產業也是一樣比如說您剛才提到的AI Server的產業事實上很多的國際廠商或國際的買主他還指定說最好在台灣生產因為台灣的效率真的是比較好我們除了希望產業繼續加強在台灣任何的投資跟流台灣之外我們在跟美方的談判當中也有很重要的一點就是雙向投資我們到美方去投資但美國的世界大廠也會到台灣來投資"},{"start":21940.286,"end":21965.227,"text":"這代表對雙方都很有信心把彼此列為一個重要的民主戰略夥伴這個是非常重要的我們希望說台灣的能見度可以讓全世界看到讓大家看到說台灣的好在哪裡多數在台灣投資在台灣下單那我們剛剛看到的就是說台灣的股市暴漲跌暴跌"},{"start":21966.121,"end":21972.016,"text":"那事實上如果現在的股票明天情況也不知道國安基金會不會啟動"},{"start":21973.936,"end":21995.945,"text":"我們在今年1月13國安退場的時候 那個已經我們是很長一段時間啟動國安基金那成效也讓整個股民股市跟經濟的信心定落下來那麼這一次我們還目前還在觀測但是手上除了國安基金之外我們還有其他的重要的股市可以平穩的一個工具我們也在觀察"},{"start":21996.445,"end":22010.502,"text":"所以我們是讓他能夠正常自由的發展所以國安基金不排除隨時會進場有需要的話國安基金有他進場的一些必要條件跟時機這個非經常性因素啊外在的"},{"start":22011.668,"end":22029.839,"text":"這個特殊的情況但這個今天這個因素戰爭它是一個可以看到特定的單一的事項是比較可以掌控的我們最怕那種不曉得原因的那麼無量的那目前看不到這樣子但是我們是非常緊密的在關注國安基金它規模現在多大"},{"start":22033.475,"end":22049.561,"text":"國安基金目前的規模是5000億院長那個是在幾十年前股市大概20兆的時候現在我們台灣的股市的市值有多少目前已經超過了大概好幾倍了"},{"start":22050.194,"end":22077.206,"text":"百多兆對那國安基金有沒有考慮啊要把這個基金規模往上調本席建議是說要兩兆你們的版本是多少這個案子其實在財委會已經討論過了也已經有相關的討論也就是說國安基金的規模其實是不是要隨頭目前股市的市值要增長那這個部分財政部一直採取開放的態度那在財委會的時候我們也做過討論是"},{"start":22078.55,"end":22106.245,"text":"所以現在準備要提高到多少目前來說案子還在大院討論財政部的版本是多少目前來說院版並沒有院版那我們認為其實是可以提高的你是講一兆啦其實我覺得不夠可能要提高到兩兆安定軍心我們希望台灣的經濟還是可以穩定持平的發展下去講到這邊我們就講到台灣的現在財政的情況還好嗎"},{"start":22108.083,"end":22128.114,"text":"我們的體質應該是非常健全的應該不錯我們現在做的就是把傳統產業中小微企業盡量把它穩定往上提升讓它升級如果這樣的話我們的基礎整個體質會更健全現在股市的日均量今天大概七八千億之前還破兆如果說一兆的話那請問"},{"start":22130.216,"end":22155.203,"text":"部長我們一天的證交稅可以有多少收入我們一天看股市的成交量但是目前看起來以一月份來說大概日均量達到9100多億整個證交稅的稅收也比去年同期成長增加200多億預估今年的證交稅應該稅收會荷包滿滿吧應該是會的大概上看多少"},{"start":22156.756,"end":22180.783,"text":"目前來說現在才二月,還要看後續的股市那你預算大概是多少預算目前來說預算案還沒有經過大量的審議完成你編今年編多少我們編當時因為是用4600多億的日均量來編的那應該會成長比這個來得多財政部長每天都笑嘻嘻的我們期待是一個穩定的股市的發展"},{"start":22181.943,"end":22206.042,"text":"我們希望說股市讓大家看得見事實上台灣的優勢全世界當然也慢慢知道我們半導體電子相關真的是很強那我們希望說把台灣的市場做大但是要多多照顧一些年輕人年輕人未來是很辛苦的還有特別是一些剛畢業的學生現在他畢業的話一個月的起薪大概多少"},{"start":22208.821,"end":22224.173,"text":"應該還是大概三萬多塊錢左右三萬多問題現在三萬多薪資就在那個門檻可是院長雞腿便當變貴了以前一個便當70塊"},{"start":22226.366,"end":22242.541,"text":"現在一個便當要多少所以政府一方面希望能夠把這個薪水抬高那另外一方面我們啟用更多的減輕負擔的方式比方說在報稅的時候能減輕所有在扣抵的這個金額同時我們對"},{"start":22243.362,"end":22271.992,"text":"一些特定的家庭也能夠給更多的家庭支持也是減輕家庭的負擔我們用這樣多管齊下的方式把國家經濟成長能夠給全民來共享是分享的概念我們是很支持的所以你記不記得我們去年普發現金一萬塊的時候獲得熱烈的迴響因為一人領一萬快樂常相伴院長你知道"},{"start":22273.463,"end":22302.518,"text":"當初說不能領財政結局也領了請問去領這1萬塊普發現金的比例有多少比例應該相當高那已經領的是2293萬人已經達到我們預估人口數的97.31%到昨天為止97你看民眾多麼需要政府的一個小確幸所以在這裡要提醒"},{"start":22303.26,"end":22329.32,"text":"院長本席主張未來稅收只要超徵達到一定的金額的時候立刻採取普發現金直接匯入民眾的口袋也許你覺得不重要可是我要跟院長說明的是多數的民眾是一萬塊大人小孩通通有希望啊"},{"start":22330.16,"end":22342.752,"text":"小朋友領到這一萬塊的時候他是會感謝的他是會開心的買一些文具用品啊對不對或者是有時候請朋友吃個飯啊這是一種確信嘛"},{"start":22343.433,"end":22363.216,"text":"所以拜託大家趕快來研究一下我已經提案了就是只要稅收超徵的時候超過大概累積3000億以上立刻惡化不說公式化的直接匯入每個人的帳戶做得到做不到"},{"start":22364.097,"end":22390.705,"text":"報告委員政府會期待用更多的精算的方式來讓全民共享達到更公平的社會但今年我們也舉債了三千億政府因為種種這樣財政的規劃今年我們舉債三千億我們本來是可以不舉債的但是普發現金人民接受很好大家能夠促進這個經濟的活絡跟發展但是因而這樣子我們也舉債三千億所以你看發了兩千多億跟舉債三千億對整個財政結構來看"},{"start":22392.335,"end":22414.131,"text":"那不是差不多嗎但是我們還是願意讓全民有分享到經濟成長果實的這樣的公式我們來做一些更公平的分配那院長現在中華民國到底有沒有錢現在是我們的財政比過去幾年當然是好很多包括中央包括地方我們的稅計剩餘逐年都有一些增加了"},{"start":22414.679,"end":22441.495,"text":"是 所以在這兩個情況你的軍購一次就要買1.25兆啊是不是不只軍購 我們還有更大的經濟發展跟科技發展比如我們的AI新時代建設我們各有很多的軌道建設我們各有很多的治水建設 治水的經費這個都必須從中央政府來支付甚至我們幫地方政府也做了縣市館河川的整治工作四年一千億那這個錢都來自這些同樣的這一桶水裡面所以現在國防經費1.25兆"},{"start":22444.779,"end":22445.22,"text":"需不需要繼續推"},{"start":22446.738,"end":22473.763,"text":"我們當然期待因為這個是三合一的一個是我們希望能夠建立一個台灣之盾另外一個是用AI高科技形成一個擊殺鏈帶來第三塊很重要的是發展國防相關的產業這個才是本土的產業有真正正面的一個協助讓他能夠升級起來所以你說有錢要花一點二五兆嘛你能不能留一些資源讓所有全台灣的民眾共享讓大家稍微拚一下"},{"start":22475.411,"end":22498.082,"text":"所以我們現在我們在國民年輕人也好老農津貼也好我們現在對於六大生活補助以及將來我們希望從年輕人從出生開始到養育到教育三個階段能夠成立一個成長計畫我們都在做這樣的工作就是把國家的經費能夠讓全民更多需要的人"},{"start":22499.002,"end":22526.23,"text":"依照社會公平的原則跟精神來分享但是國家的主權安全的維護我們還是不能夠旁落國家安全很重要院長那你說你要編這個1.25兆的同時你能不能思考一下多多照顧未來的年輕人我們一直討論很久本席提出希望給未來的每個小朋友出生兒我們要來設立一個未來丈夫"},{"start":22527.79,"end":22551.405,"text":"未來帳戶啊 現在有嗎現在有未來帳戶 但是它是針對低收跟中低收的家庭所以它的成效就是比較侷限我們已經有想法了 如果讓在我剛剛說的能夠出生養育教育三個階段都能夠有一個零歲一直到18歲一個整套的計畫那現在大概有多少人有這個未來帳戶"},{"start":22552.657,"end":22578.81,"text":"有多少人現在未來帳戶不多只有4萬多人幾萬現在我剛說他針對對象就是低收中低收的家庭我記得應該只有4萬多其實不足3萬多我們希望未來帳戶是全民都有因為人也會老有一天你老的時候你突然發現你口袋沒錢了之後你至少一個未來帳戶"},{"start":22580.567,"end":22594.664,"text":"每個人都有一個未來帳戶那這樣子他心裡比較安心小朋友一出生就有一個未來帳戶所以當我們在講1.25兆龐大數的時候拜託多想一想"},{"start":22595.645,"end":22622.736,"text":"民眾的感受同時並進在處理這幾項重大的事情重大的建設也好國防的預算也好跟社會福利也好都全面要讓它升級那政府現在財政能力我們有機會有能力做這樣的工作但是不能夠把所有的力量集中在某一塊那我們現在做合理的分配我們是在財政能力下是容許這樣來處理的所以國防軍購特別軍購1.25兆逐年8年來實施是沒有問題的"},{"start":22623.922,"end":22635.455,"text":"所以那個1.25兆 編下去以後 台灣就OK 安全當然不是就OK 我們是逐年要你要多編一點啊 你沒有OK你怎麼會覺得1.25兆夠好 那你要提這個錢"},{"start":22642.253,"end":22670.476,"text":"有錢我就支持啊可是你在支持這個1.25兆的時候我也拜託你要照顧這些年輕人這些未來的出生兒啊當然有當然有我們現在是同時並且剛剛委員報告過了那幾個部分都是在衡量整個財政的均衡底下我們做全面性的多元的發展所以錢是要花在刀口上當然我看你也是這個算得很清楚那我請教一下現在我們"},{"start":22671.789,"end":22698.317,"text":"每個人熟悉的四個小朋友還有中華棒球隊國父孫中山先生這兩百塊院長有看過嗎比較少所以問題就來了就是這些錢的使用因為現在有很多人的用信用卡、電子交易等等所以"},{"start":22699.988,"end":22713.301,"text":"現鈔的使用率是越來越低的結果你現在這些鈔票都還滿新的啊而且我覺得重點是滿好用的"},{"start":22714.202,"end":22733.935,"text":"我在台灣只要拿這個現金出去大家收到都很開心接受度很高為什麼在國家現在很需要經費做很多百工百業要支持的項目的時候央行說要改版到底要不要改版"},{"start":22734.813,"end":22751.823,"text":"一直要花多少錢要發新鈔全世界都在用電子商務電子無鈔交易你還要花一筆巨大的費用那個費用不曉得多少去年或前年日幣美金都有發新鈔都有改版"},{"start":22753.21,"end":22777.427,"text":"這個還是一個流通性的問題當然我們鼓勵電子支付或是用塑膠的貨幣但是這種基本上的流通性還是有的我們還是要顧慮到是社會上還是有這個需求那你保存的很好是因為你說保管的很好才會這樣子那有的就比較破舊就必須來做更新同時已經20幾年了現在防偽技術也要加強"},{"start":22779.405,"end":22803.977,"text":"所以你這個新超有編預算要去改版嗎?目前還沒有編目前還沒編,就沒有編了?你們那個編一次喔?我們有預計編喔?編會被民眾罵翻天嗎?不會我收到的,民眾都講說你沒差錢改一次新超要花多少?"},{"start":22807.047,"end":22831.955,"text":"我跟委員報告就是說如果我們改新鈔的時候一張大概會增加1.5塊錢成本那如果說我們沒有改版的話因為現在的技術非常的先進所以到時候如果說微鈔很多的時候那麼社會的成本會更高"},{"start":22833.434,"end":22858.114,"text":"所以就是說現在技術非常高非常先進的時候你不在這個時點來改版的時候那到時候社會成本高那你所花的成本會更高所以現在有尾鈔嗎尾鈔我還是有啊但是目前尾鈔是不高但是我跟委員報告就是說"},{"start":22862.568,"end":22876.908,"text":"其他的國家呢在他的薪酬用20年左右的時候大概都會改版那我們現在是24年24年算是已經很慢的全世界有哪一個國家規定說幾年一定要改版的"},{"start":22877.336,"end":22905.564,"text":"大部分都是十年到二十年現在全部都是電子商務啊沒有 電子商務還是很多地方都是鼓勵大家當然我們也是鼓勵電子支付但是問題是環保啊 對 對 環保但是問題是在於就是說新超可以環保好 那你一直執意要去印新的鈔票全部預算要花多少現在還沒有估算"},{"start":22906.476,"end":22919.722,"text":"大概會多少?我剛剛就講了嘛大概一張會增加1.5你全部要幾張?加起來會有多少金額?那你以去年的金額來算加起來大概會有多少金額?有沒有超過10億?"},{"start":22923.344,"end":22944.325,"text":"每年編的話呢 因為我們本來啊 就是說每年的時候呢我們超郡的這個整操的這個成本本身他就是大概有30億左右了30億啊 對 每年 因為全部的換操啊還有就是說整操啊這個"},{"start":22945.026,"end":22972.261,"text":"所以全部加起來多少差不多30億左右啦那現在就是說我們就說一張會增加1.5萬怎麼上次說是200億沒有沒有沒有沒有那麼多100億總裁的意思是每年有一些鈔票要換新的要是換新的會在30年左右換新鈔我的意思是說你現在改版啊你準備改版把國庫拋棄掉啊現在還沒有決定吧沒有嗎還沒有學來熱嘛"},{"start":22975.011,"end":22988.246,"text":"我覺得不要浪費這個錢而且從小到大我覺得他印象很好我都是靠他長大的拜託不要浪費錢好謝謝第二個問題就是請教央行現在整個國際情勢的變化"},{"start":22995.049,"end":23023.235,"text":"台幣未來走勢是走強還是走跌台幣還是 第一個它是供需來決定第二個如果說美元強的時候其他的貨幣都在Roll的時候基本上台幣也會Roll跟著走就對了對因為這個是國際的會受到國際因素的影響這兩天台幣暴跌沒有暴跌跟其他的貨幣來比較的時候我們是貶的是居中所以"},{"start":23024.875,"end":23043.319,"text":"一美元對新台幣的匯率32塊今天大概31.8左右所以32塊可以說是一個洋金融的防線我們沒有所謂的防線我跟委員報告我還是在強調的匯率還是由供需決定還是供需決定"},{"start":23050.816,"end":23066.796,"text":"那如果台幣走深的話大概會區間是哪裡到哪裡這個不曉得不曉得由市場決定嘛希望說這方面喔股會是要穩定讓民眾不要驚慌"},{"start":23068.264,"end":23086.011,"text":"這個可以做得到嗎新台幣匯率一直都是非常穩定的跟其他的貨幣來比較的話都是相當穩定的最近我們從2月底到現在幾乎是天天沒有天天也隔天召集各相關部會包括外交、交通、經濟、金管、財政都來討論接送國人"},{"start":23090.632,"end":23112.36,"text":"物價穩定油價穩定還有股市安定種種的狀況所以現在有成立一個特別的穩定小組物價穩定小組本來就有的那其他都啟動自己業館內業務的一個緊急應變機制好謝謝那因為本席來自地方我還是要講一些地方建設的爭取這個很重要交通部"},{"start":23117.029,"end":23144.163,"text":"講了大概二十幾年了深坑輕軌深坑輕軌對我們地方來講是非常非常重要的一個建設可是目前在交通部審議中一直沒有突破不曉得他的進度多少以前我記得如果整條蓋起來的話大概是不到一百億現在物價飆漲兩百多億了"},{"start":23146.86,"end":23153.265,"text":"是不是可以請院長可以責成相關單位多多來關心深坑輕軌"},{"start":23155.629,"end":23178.491,"text":"跟委員報告捷運跟輕軌這個系統是地方一般事項所以是地方題不會是交通部講了二十幾年但是深坑輕軌這個可行性研究目前正在我們鐵道局正在審議當中我們可以加速委員也提過很多次了表示說地方的民眾大家很在意那我們審查的速度會盡量來加快好拜託速度很快一點因為早建完建都要建"},{"start":23179.622,"end":23205.184,"text":"做起來的話是地方對政府的一個敬佩畢竟是一個德政而且地方殷切期盼另外有關安坑一號道路第三期的華城快速道路不曉得什麼時候會施作有大概二三十億啦但是他影響了大概三萬五萬人的日常的交通"},{"start":23207.898,"end":23236.969,"text":"跟委員報告這個案子目前是這個新北市政府正在做可行性研究那要等他們可行性研究做完之後可以去爭取內政部的這個生活圈道路的補助計畫好那我再請那個川伯多幫忙一下未來的市長李思川他公務方面也比較強再來請請教一下安坑一號道路延伸至土城的交流道他是接上"},{"start":23237.864,"end":23265.355,"text":"北二高所以這個跟你們有關係吧叫安城快速道路這也是新店安坑區區段徵收作業的一部分嘛牽扯到這個部分新北市政府未來是不是要採取這個區段徵收現在研究它的可行性拜託所以現在上下班堵車堵得很厲害這些案子大部分都在新北市政府你可以現在就請侯市長幫忙好我再拜託那個下一個是傳備來"},{"start":23267.844,"end":23284.618,"text":"那另外就是安坑輕軌,串聯規劃中的捷運中...好,謝謝人民財委員質詢,謝謝主委長、各個相關部會首長備詢,謝謝"},{"start":23299.85,"end":23325.564,"text":"接下來我們請陳冠廷委員質詢 陳經緯委員請準備你好 先請院長跟交通部長"},{"start":23326.69,"end":23342.706,"text":"麻煩請左院長、交通部長備選跟環境部長環境部長備選陳國賢好院長好兩位部長好"},{"start":23343.717,"end":23372.478,"text":"我先請環境部長先請教部長阿里山生鐵是在去年7月通車農業部有推動大阿里山百年週待的計畫觀光署是把阿里山列為國際重要的魅力景區來去重點行銷奮起湖它基本上是我們國家風景區的第二大旅遊據點那也是我們生鐵最大的中途站常駐龍口大概不多大概數百人但是如果只到假日的時候會有國內外的旅客會大批量的進駐"},{"start":23373.942,"end":23392.542,"text":"所以我想請教一下你對那邊的整個包含汙水的處理的系統應該是大概知道那邊是有類似這樣的設備可是最近我們常常聽到來自那邊的鄉親說在非雨季的時候他們感覺到味道非常的重"},{"start":23393.257,"end":23412.777,"text":"那理由是這樣子我們在嘉義縣環保局他過去建置的相關的這個水質淨化的設備他的這個日除理量大概可以容納270噸我想請問部長為什麼我們的鄉親他現在會奇怪在沒有雨季的時候就會覺得味道非常重這個設備是正常運作的嗎"},{"start":23413.727,"end":23436.787,"text":"報告委員因為沒有雨季的話比較乾的時候當然那個水比較少因為那個是屬於利尖的這種所謂的淨水處理設備在民國100年的時候由環保署來補助的所以當然這個乾旱的時候就比較困難那我這個問題我們有跟我們同仁討論其實未來的做法我是建議還是要好好處理因為這種環境如果弄得好"},{"start":23437.327,"end":23448.712,"text":"不要去那個地方奮起舞有一種怪怪的味道這不是一個好事所以我們會來研議說如何把他的接管率能夠提高或是說廠商的商家能夠多做一點點"},{"start":23451.163,"end":23472.536,"text":"這個非常好因為我聽到我們的村長還有當地的村民有提到是不是他的雨水跟污水的分流那邊出現了問題目前有聽到這樣的資訊嗎報告委員這個不是只有這個奮起湖全台灣很多地方都有這個問題因為這個都是屬於地方事務那當然很多有的縣市所長會很認真那當然奮起湖這個地方是屬於這個高山"},{"start":23472.996,"end":23488.475,"text":"他其實又這個人與人之間的住戶又散得很遠所以只能用一個就近就地來處理的一個方式來解決啦那這個我們到時候我們希望我也希望有機會能夠再去看一下看有什麼可以改進的地方"},{"start":23489.316,"end":23509.929,"text":"現在的問題是說剛才我們提到說如果是在旱季的時候味道會重可是如果是在雨季或者是有大水的時候他可能會超過他他雨水跟污水混合就超過他270噸的上限那所以部長有沒有考量過因為他是一個重要的景區有沒有思考說怎麼樣他提高他的這個上限或者是來做其他改善規劃的經費的編列"},{"start":23512.01,"end":23538.256,"text":"這個部分因為我們是處理這個水質他如果上游處理不好就影響到我們這邊那當然這個從源頭改善這個污水下水道的處理是最有用的但是那個地方要處理是非常困難所以我們會再來跟這個地方有機會的話我們也希望到那個地方看一下能不能有一些好的新的方式例如說每個商家他從源頭就可以把油污最重要是這個油污還有這種所謂的污水把它處理掉那才會解決這個問題"},{"start":23539.116,"end":23564.244,"text":"那我們直接我們辦公室也會來去跟黃建部來去一起跟其他有關部門我們就直接下去來去勘察看這個可能要跨部會一起來解決因為這個是我們國家很重要的一個風景區它不僅是風景區它是八島溪上游所以它也是我們仁義潭這個水庫的水源之一啦所以這個東西是不僅僅是跟環保相關跟我們的用水也相關的那我之所以請我們的陳部長江峰部長來的是因為"},{"start":23564.864,"end":23576.862,"text":"所以依照我們的國家風景管理組織的通則的第三條第五款裡面有提到阿里山的阿管處他是掌管這個衛生環境維護及污染防治"},{"start":23577.574,"end":23596.933,"text":"那部長因為我們不會要求這個交通部自己去做一個淨水廠因為那不是你們的權責可是因為你們也有掌管的這個衛生維護跟防刺的這個功能在所以我想請教一下阿板處對於這個污水處理量有沒有做過盤點有沒有提過需求因為"},{"start":23598.451,"end":23615.291,"text":"觀光設施為主污水是屬於環保權責可以配合管理但是這一個阿館桌也同時掌握著污染防治的要求的角色所以如果能夠主動提出需求是不是也可以把整個整體的規劃變得更好是不是請部長簡單回應一下其實我也有點關心"},{"start":23616.913,"end":23644.867,"text":"他可能是有跟我提到說那個地方因為住戶雖然只有幾百人但其實觀光客非常非常的多可以是說 特別是深鐵之後森林鐵道第二大的一個站所以人口不多但是旅客很多那便當店也相當的多因為大家喜歡去那邊吃便當所以他的水污染相對啦尤其是做菜做便當之後的那個剩餘的這個水量確實是影響環境蠻嚴重的那具體的數字他們並沒有提給我"},{"start":23645.447,"end":23672.63,"text":"那我可以請他們去了解一下但未來如果環境部在這個地方要做這個污水處理的改善我們的阿管處一定會配合環境部的這個平台我們一起跨部會來解決這個問題我認為因為主要居住在那邊的常住人口其實不多所以它是一個中央層級的重要的景區我認為是誰飲客誰就要負責所以如果說由交通部說阿管處因為我們是在主力的在推銷這個地方的景區"},{"start":23673.331,"end":23702.091,"text":"那景區當然就會帶來遊客遊客會帶來對土地環境的一些負擔但是同時我們還是要持續維持它能夠成為重要的觀光魅力景點所以我認為必須要有一個這一個部門來去擔任起統籌的一個角色提出需求提出問題那我認為說交通部還是可以扮演這樣的角色因為從剛才的討論我們可以知道這個環境部是水質嘛那交通部觀光那國土管理署是管下水道加一線是執行的單位"},{"start":23702.631,"end":23719.361,"text":"那我們還是必須要有一個部門單位把它當成是自己的組織那把它整體來去處理那院長我可以報告一下這個初步的預算大概是1到1.7億就是假設我們要我們自己鄉親們大家自己在一起看1.7億左右"},{"start":23719.821,"end":23742.796,"text":"那我們前瞻基礎建設過去在水環境的總額是2,508億所以這筆經費我們估計是千分之一不到就可以把這個國家景區的環境做好是不是可以請院長是不是可以啟動我們跨部會的專案來討論一下有沒有這個可行性把這一個奮起舞的這個問題我們把它解決好 阿里山也是國家重要的一座"},{"start":23744.298,"end":23769.64,"text":"神山所以能夠把它的環境維持好應該都是我們共同的責任邀請交通部還有環境部共同的來現場看看如何來改善現在這種污水雨水能夠讓它更清澈清潔的問題這個部分我想亮兩個部會來做處理那我們就會邀請各部門一起來現地場看跟我們當地的這些村落的代表"},{"start":23770.14,"end":23784.612,"text":"那還有這些環境參與者來一起來討論我覺得這個如果能夠解決的話那對阿里山的百年軸線的整個大提升是有絕對幫助的好 謝謝兩位部長那接下來我們請外交部長外交部次長"},{"start":23799.124,"end":23818.738,"text":"市長我們過去的11天中東情勢是非常嚴峻的這期間我們遇到幾個問題其中一方面當然是跟貿易相關跟經濟財政甚至是跟整體的情勢相關另外一個部分就跟外交比較有相關的部分就是撤離僑民的部分"},{"start":23820.419,"end":23833.783,"text":"我對於撤離小米的標準做法我有自己的看法但我現在要提到的是事先預警事先預警的部分是友邦有沒有提供情資說可能會對這一個中東採取什麼樣的打擊"},{"start":23836.386,"end":23853.008,"text":"軍事行動屬於保密我想這個我們主要的友邦比如說日本以色列恐怕他們都不太會提供給即使是區域國家後來說要波及他們也都沒有預警但是我們一直是緊密的在觀察整個中東形勢的一個發展"},{"start":23854.155,"end":23880.927,"text":"228正式的攻擊之前我們已經看到美軍在區域已經做了很多的部署所以我們開始就密切的觀察然後隨時的因應環境的這個變化來調整我們的旅遊警示我在看這個各國的旅遊警示那當初主要都還是聚焦在伊朗或者是以色列那在各國的警示裡面我看到是在2月25號義大利、加拿大、澳洲就已經"},{"start":23882.588,"end":23904.217,"text":"就是極端要求他們的居民盡快離開伊朗那在2月25號英國就撤離外交官2月27號中國波蘭特別是波蘭他多次甚至是有國際的相關的記者會我們都有看到要求他們的公民立刻離開伊朗所以我們看到這一些直接公開快速的警示那當然是有很大的幫助"},{"start":23905.868,"end":23925.272,"text":"在這個作戰之前大概只有4名台灣人在伊朗所以相比之下我們對於伊朗本身的這個撤離的計畫或者是這個行動他可能本身他的影響度就是相對的較小倒是在其他的國家包含這個卡達科威特阿曼"},{"start":23925.692,"end":23941.407,"text":"沙烏地阿拉伯等等的國家外交部有沒有事先做好因應的準備因為事先預判伊朗可能因為他在上一次的這個12日作戰裡面他就已經提到他會讓周遭的國家藏到湖國那有沒有事先做這些預判事先做好外交的準備"},{"start":23942.591,"end":23969.288,"text":"把這些僑民在之前先讓他們做好可能的撤離各種的方案在中東的周遭國家而不限於伊朗跟以色列我們從這個2月28日開始那麼就在外交部在部長的指示之下那麼由這個吳志忠次長那麼成立了這個緊急應變小組每天開會那麼隨著這個燈號做這個調整我們的外館隨時跟我們的僑民保持聯繫"},{"start":23970.819,"end":24000.315,"text":"因為外館那個僑民很多時候都會參加我們外館的活動有很好的聯絡的管道那麼我們委員也知道說其實像杜拜阿布達比甚至卡達都是非常重要的杜哈是非常重要的一個轉機點那這個部分掌握比較困難因為突然的時候比如說卡達的機場一直到昨天才有限度的開放那麼杜拜在這個3月1號遭到攻擊之後關閉一兩天"},{"start":24001.791,"end":24028.773,"text":"從3號開始4、5、6每天都有飛機繼續飛來台灣所以是說我們就把這樣的一個東西所以陸陸續續在那個地方有這個等待轉機而滯留在當地的這個民眾那麼我們國人大概也很少去習慣了出國就去這個外交部網站登陸那麼我們就請我們的這個外館那麼包括到機場去服務包括到這個就地去了解"},{"start":24029.731,"end":24048.007,"text":"盡量的能夠跟他們取得聯繫盡量他們取得聯繫然後幫他們了解班機的這個資訊那包括像這個卡達還繼續關閉領空所以在這個狀況的情況我們的這個是由我們的蘇沙奧地阿拉伯代表處來"},{"start":24049.644,"end":24066.738,"text":"這個殲暇所以我們會請他們從陸路的方式到利雅德再從利雅德搭乘飛機回來台灣先到東南亞國家再轉回來台灣我這樣簡單講就是說預警比後續的撤離更重要預警可以大幅度的減少國人在此地旅遊"},{"start":24067.378,"end":24084.434,"text":"他的密度那到時候我們如果要做撤僑的行動的話所必須負責的代價就會降低所以我還是強調預警比這個撤僑的這個重要性更大所以我可以理解齁那不管是我們事先跟盟友之間的情報交換等等那當你看到其他國家在準備做撤離"},{"start":24086.055,"end":24111.702,"text":"也不需要通知我們就等於是知道該怎麼做那我們目前看到在這一次的這個整個中東的作戰當中有一些歐洲的國家他的反應稍微比較快一點那我們跟這些歐洲國家跟美國之間的關係跟以色列的關係關係不等甚至有些時候不太對的畢竟他們跟他們的國家緊密關係比較重要但是我們還是可以從中得到一些情報那我們盡快的要做一些事先的部署"},{"start":24113.103,"end":24139.098,"text":"跟委員報告兩件事情所以當地我們有四種身份一個是當地的僑民這個跟外館都有聯繫另外一種是旅行的團客這個也掌握得比較清楚比較困難是旅行的散客另外一種就是從其他地方要到阿布達比去轉機的這些轉機客那目前他們不在東東地區還比較好那今天下午會有三個團最後的43個團客旅行團會回來"},{"start":24140.259,"end":24166.32,"text":"那過去幾天回來的時候外交部、交通部還有觀光署還有機場公司都會去現場接機那今天我們看是最後三團43人會回來所以我特別請張敦南秘書長向大院請假讓他到現場做最後的關懷了解整個是不是全數的團客都回來了所以大院長今天是在桃園機場做這樣的工作好 謝院長我們請觀光部長那次長你還是等一下因為跟你還是有關係"},{"start":24167.912,"end":24188.16,"text":"部長我們的民雄航太園區他有分西側跟東側那西側是由這個東側其實都是由中科院來去開發那東側就比較分的軍規級的這個無人機那西側的話可以有更多的不同的廠商都可以來參與那我們在預計大概會有250家廠商進駐可能會有產值是50.5億"},{"start":24189.821,"end":24218.134,"text":"那未來還有2萬平方公尺的這個飛行測試場那簡單來請教一下目前的聽到這些自建廠商他們進廠的施工的期程目前是押在8月目前的進度都一切正常嗎民營熊航太園區民營熊西側的部分我們預計在今年5月工程花包的部分會絕標所以目前狀況一切正常甚至有可能會比較快一點先期已經完成了這個環境影響評估園區的先期規劃"},{"start":24218.959,"end":24245.629,"text":"那我聽到我們中科院也六月就要落成我們這個東測的部分東測的部分先完成也是會準時的落成非常好那我們必須要強調這一個產業對我們來講不只是對GI是對台灣來講非常重要的那一些相關的我們要吸引不僅僅是台灣的廠商進駐還包含國際的廠商我需要說外交部一起協助把這些廠商相關的資訊或者是我們場地的相關資訊英文化交給我們這一些對我們民眾航海演習區有"},{"start":24253.714,"end":24256.475,"text":"我必須要自己發生經驗然後在頂部的這個"},{"start":24265.162,"end":24283.072,"text":"我覺得這應該不是我辦公室要的事情應該是外交部來做的事情這不應該是我辦公室的事情這包含市場產業那包含很多這些工業產業他們現在都會跟太小的國營相關的這些空股的這些公關企業"},{"start":24295.298,"end":24300.921,"text":"因為未來要"},{"start":24304.183,"end":24324.198,"text":"對話的對象可能是台灣的中型企業合作包含這一些當時的企業現在越來越多人都來找我們所以我希望外交部部長扮演多一點角色至少都會在那個社址裡面他指的然後在園區裡面的包含土地廠房的規格以及可能的出稅優惠等等"},{"start":24337.95,"end":24351.341,"text":"好 謝謝陳冠廷委員質詢謝謝卓院長 相關部會所長貝勳 謝謝我們在一長二樓旁聽的來自台北市中文高中葉家鑫老師帶隊的同學我們掌聲歡迎各位立典立法院"},{"start":24352.97,"end":24357.672,"text":"在接下來本日最後一位質詢委員請陳金威委員請質詢好謝謝院長我想請卓院長還有勞動部部長麻煩請卓院長勞動部長備詢好"},{"start":24378.188,"end":24392.455,"text":"院長您辛苦一天但今天有一個蠻大的新聞所以您可能沒有注意到也就是我們的人口來到了第26個月的負成長去年年初我第一次質詢您的時候您說希望有些策略可以達到13萬保衛戰"},{"start":24394.776,"end":24420.034,"text":"結果到年底的時候呢又承認也許不到11萬最後結果是10萬多那剛剛午間的時候最新的新聞出爐了今年2月的新生兒是史上最低6523人1月是8723人那許多婦產科的專家很擔心今年的新生兒甚至不到10萬人所以人力就是一個很重要的戰力這個你也認同"},{"start":24421.375,"end":24445.941,"text":"我今天的質詢會圍繞在少子化還有大健康健康促進等等的可是很多題目是需要各部會一起整合所以院長稍後您給我的回應會格外的重要首先我想請教部長非常肯定這個彈性育嬰留庭您在當委員的時候也非常的關心今年3月終於正式實施這是一個很好的發展1月就實施"},{"start":24446.221,"end":24447.302,"text":"我們是在去年的九月公佈的"},{"start":24460.68,"end":24480.006,"text":"我說從醞釀從你開始醞釀事辦其實從我在當立委的時候就醞釀了你也記得嗎大概是兩年了對嗎我從我當立委的時候就醞釀了關鍵是一些配套的設計那現在涵蓋的範圍有多廣公務人員一併適用了嗎是公務人員適用"},{"start":24480.589,"end":24504.67,"text":"好那我們希望院長都可以多關心您旗下這麼多的公務人員是不是都可以同時兼顧家庭然後兼顧工作那我想知道這個兩年的事辦計畫您對自己的成績看起來是如何因為我查詢了一下參加的有89家企業其中7成6沒有半個員工申請"},{"start":24505.81,"end":24531.07,"text":"實際上有業績的只有21家總共受益的是166人次這樣子的事辦成效想請問部長您自己滿意嗎委員我跟您報告我們從今年元月1月1號開始上路到2月1月到2月的數字目前總共有2700多人申請單日請的育嬰留庭"},{"start":24532.091,"end":24551.381,"text":"然後總共有大概5200多個申請案不是你剛才說的數字在兩個月前我講的是你過去兩年你剛不是說你有一些配套沒做好嗎不是我現在在說的是從今年的1月1號正式可以以日請"},{"start":24552.361,"end":24578.128,"text":"因為前面的之前的事辦其實是要契約主動願意的可是我們在去今年的1月1號的正式上路是就是說只要勞工有提出雇主是不能拒絕的好好我希望之後我們可以看到你的成果我們會讓委員會繼續的講我就跟你再講他的成果就是到1月到2月目前已經有5200多個申請案了"},{"start":24580.009,"end":24594.647,"text":"那我先回顧一下我回顧一下這個是我們在委員會因為這個是執政黨委員對您的comment他之前在評論您的事辦計畫他是這樣子說的當然他講了20分鐘我簡短的播一下"},{"start":24597.898,"end":24614.432,"text":"計畫註定要失敗因為一開始就沒有人主動要參加本來你叫大家去辦這個示範計畫就註定要失敗了結果你就不要你通通都叫示範計畫也不願意照民間的版本去示範出來然後看他的彈性到底有沒有可行結果你一意孤行那註定到的是失敗啊"},{"start":24614.912,"end":24632.745,"text":"第一個這個數據出來,我其實當然非常不滿意啦部長他本來就是做一個故意會失敗的計畫我們都知道,故意你一個方案一定會失敗然後告訴大家說,彈性運營價不可行他們當時就是這樣先這個預設的立場要讓它失敗當然不可行啊"},{"start":24634.588,"end":24659.6,"text":"那個委員你可以看一下那個時間點是2024年的12月18號我知道我剛剛不是一直在問你過去兩年嗎這個政策的推動本來就需要一點時間事辦也需要時間嘛好我現在想說少子化這個危機很多縣市首長都看到了所以蔣萬安市長他最近推出一個育兒減少工時的計畫他看到很多家長的需求啊那我這邊先說"},{"start":24661,"end":24684.322,"text":"衛福部他的comment是樂觀其成因為協助育嬰爸媽有更彈性的時間那您剛剛被林淑芬委員講的這個事辦計劃你現在是批評蔣國安市長政策是象徵性事辦我想請問部長您的標準到底在哪裡跟委員說明你應該把我整段話給看完"},{"start":24684.946,"end":24705.759,"text":"我的意思很簡單是任何一個政策需要把相關的配套措施給做好比方說我們在去年九月推出的單日型的彈性暈暈流停也是因為醞釀了這個把配套一段一段的給做到位所以到今年的頭兩個月才有這樣的成績你自己"},{"start":24708.2,"end":24736.35,"text":"你自己這個示範計畫做了兩年內你也發現所有的政策從上路到開始推到真正落實本來就有很長的準備時間那衛福部認同你卻要開始講說這個是象徵新示範我只想問你一句話我想問你台北市率先推出這樣子方便爸爸媽媽的做法您精神上支不支持我等一下會舉出很多配套我們也可以討論很多配套"},{"start":24736.65,"end":24751.502,"text":"回我完整的說法我認為你應該要把我完整的說法就是今天地方政府願意這樣做嘗試我們當然是正面看待的很好我的一句話前面說的意思是如果配套不夠完善的話"},{"start":24752.543,"end":24772.01,"text":"不希望落入象徵性事辦所以我的意思是大家應該要一起來思考怎麼把配套做得更完善讓它更可行其實你就講你正面看待對啊以你勞動部部長的高度你剛就說得很好啊你可以講說我正面看待但是配套如何做我們中央地方一起來協力所以我今天"},{"start":24773.951,"end":24802.484,"text":"今天要準備的資料其實就是把世界各國的東西拿出來因為院長知道現在我們很急迫可是很多國家其實都做得非常成熟了我覺得我們可以直接考慮是不是我們應用一些成熟國家的做法好 我們現在來看一下其實你剛講的那些配套當時可能有人說可能會標籤化或者是說同事之間會曝光抱怨 歧視主管 靠關係等等的"},{"start":24803.104,"end":24830.797,"text":"這些在英國、歐盟、澳洲、荷蘭他們都已經整個把它法制化了它是一個法定的權利所以有沒有小朋友或者是有的是一般員工到職有需求就可以提出雇主在期限內按照程序處理有合理理由才可以拒絕用機制來降低不確定性並且你在這個地方如果你覺得未來工作是有彈性的你剛好有伴侶你也可以趁機來規劃未來嘛"},{"start":24832.458,"end":24848.752,"text":"那再來我就要講跟我們一樣面臨少子化國家的新加坡跟日本他怎麼做呢新加坡他在疫情後他發現這個彈性工時的企業因為他們去導入work life grant所以發放補助金支持企業"},{"start":24849.673,"end":24869.87,"text":"他從52%爬升到72%那他也發現這些員工的滿意度留任生產力有正面的效果你剛說的配套新加坡也有想到所以並不是所有的產業都適用有符合這個特質他們才會做但是有做的滿意度都很高那我再講到日本"},{"start":24870.45,"end":24894.723,"text":"日本呢他們在疫情後雖然遠距工作有下降可是現在是穩定的持平維持在一個程度所以他們發現說只要他們去補貼企業改造制度設備的成本那企業就可以去照顧這些有育兒或是照顧高齡長者需求的工作型態來連動調整所以去年呢這邊要跟院長報告"},{"start":24896.223,"end":24918.392,"text":"2025年10月開始日本對於家裡有3歲到就學前的小朋友他規定這個企業要從5種多元方案裡選擇至少兩種出來提供裡面就包括蔣萬事長現在提出的比如說調整上下班時間縮短工時每個月至少10天用遠距如果你這個公司是可以用遠距上班的"},{"start":24918.852,"end":24944.856,"text":"育兒支援休假以及托育設施等等那在這邊我是想請院長澤成部長大概多久以內可以評估這樣子的報告出來來研擬中央法規的配套是謝謝委員跟委員報告這種彈性減少工時都是一種可嘗試性的一個工作我們往這個方向來講勞動部已經在做那目前地方政府做的呢我更希望他能夠在"},{"start":24947.275,"end":24973.486,"text":"勞工端還有就是這個代理職務代理人這方面還有就是企業端三方面都能夠完整因為越小的公司這種彈性減少工時它所產生的工作力的減少跟變動是最明顯的所以要想好這些配套部長的意思就是這樣子我已經幫你找好資料了那當然部長那邊也有很棒的研究所台北市政府要想好這些配套"},{"start":24973.926,"end":24988.728,"text":"我有幫你找好資料所以在國外他雇主也可以在法定期限內按程序處理或是有合理的理由來拒絕這邊我都幫你找好資料了之後如果歡迎勞動部您的聯絡人也可以來跟我跟我討論好嗎"},{"start":24991.268,"end":25017.511,"text":"其實我可以直接回答委員我覺得各種讓工作的時間跟職堂能夠更有彈性然後把這個來包容或兼顧這個工作跟照顧小孩的方法我想我們都願意綜合的來做思考可是一樣重點關鍵我們在這幾年的嘗試下我們認為關鍵其實的確是在於配套的完善與否"},{"start":25018.38,"end":25046.501,"text":"這是我原話最重要的點所以我完全不是在批評地方政府或者說風涼話我覺得不要誤會我也沒有這樣子的用意那大概多久以內我們可以出一個研擬報告我剛剛這最後的問句是院長責成部長多久之內可以去朝你這樣中央法規的配套是這個勞動部的那個彈性工事的報告是是是是他剛剛已經有這兩三個月執行的報告那我們應該有一段時間"},{"start":25048.064,"end":25055.391,"text":"報告的內容這個基準數才會準確我們才來做檢討好 謝謝部長您可以回座了 謝謝部長接下來請衛福部部長"},{"start":25057.598,"end":25078.71,"text":"麻煩請衛福部長備詢部長一邊上台的時候我先播放給院長看一段影片現在台灣常常在網路上開始大戰雁同你應該知道有一些店家他是標榜他不接待兒童並且他還會大獲好評有的時候會在地圖上變成他行銷的環節可是看到這個我是非常的贊成"},{"start":25080.071,"end":25098.783,"text":"有網友更在Google地圖共同整理大人友善清單表示要大力支持不接待小孩的店家這些場所包含西餐廳、咖啡廳、寵物餐廳都是最常有小朋友的行為被放到社群公開討論的場所是家長管教不積極還是我們的社會逐漸厭同"},{"start":25103.468,"end":25121.165,"text":"這邊很簡單快速帶過一些數據但是院長應該一目了然根據這個兒萌的統計民眾的驗童程度大概會在六成從輕度到重度那認為應該限制孩童進入的地點包括餐廳、大眾運輸或是咖啡廳家長也感受到非常大的壓力"},{"start":25121.906,"end":25150.248,"text":"所以60%左右的家長他會覺得他出去的時候極不友善那不友善的行為這個網路上都有最近在新聞上常常被播出來就包括被偷拍啊 公審或是直接被噓 被白眼 被趕下車廂等等等等的那我覺得對於目前我們這個國安危機小子化只會越來越嚴重因為一般大眾討厭噪音的跟家長他出門害怕被噴"},{"start":25151.189,"end":25172.433,"text":"以至於他就是很難帶出門很難生小孩那這邊呢我是要給院長很具體的建議因為問題並不是我們希望全國每一個角落都適合嬰幼兒而是我們希望借盡外國的經驗我們希望在城市裡面提供分流的設計來降低衝突"},{"start":25172.933,"end":25188.001,"text":"那這些可以從有一些這個國家的公用機關開始做比如說車站醫院圖書館政府場館等等他會有親子的安撫角落或是站離的產息區讓你安撫好你的小朋友然後我們再回到大眾的場域"},{"start":25189.441,"end":25215.089,"text":"這邊舉幾個案例像這些是機場裡面的這個Calm Room讓他安撫下來或者是像芬蘭的火車上他就直接會有親子的車廂那這邊我也會稱讚我們衛福部或是行政院我們現在也許哺乳室或者是無障礙廁所多功能室我們一到某一個場域我們會有標示我們會找得到我們會知道這個地方有沒有可是像這樣子親子友善的空間"},{"start":25216.089,"end":25232.583,"text":"他沒有被當成一個公共服務來推動沒有被標準化密度也沒有規劃沒有導引沒有維持也沒有民眾可用性所以他會變成想做的人會自發性去做可是沒有的地方就不知道那家長也不知道要到哪裡去找"},{"start":25233.663,"end":25261.39,"text":"這邊呢我要跟院長報告日韓已經開始超車了韓國2024年谷底反彈生育率回升了他們現在今年生育又到0.8當然很多配套住宅或者是這個津貼這些我們也都有在努力追上但是友善職場跟友善公共空間是他們值得我們借鏡的他們會利用企業的誘因還有數位整合我們舉一些比較直觀的"},{"start":25262.75,"end":25282.159,"text":"韓國之前的驗童是比台灣還要嚴重他們曾經爆發非常多的衝突所以政府很積極在解決他們推動這樣子的認證的標章跟貼紙貼在店家前面並且跟他們民眾最常用的地圖去做結合可是當然這件事也不是毫無補助的"},{"start":25282.499,"end":25305.924,"text":"所以根據你的場域他會給予30萬韓元的補助更大就是40萬韓元他讓你去購買這些兒童會用到的產品或者是你可以付保費假使兒童在這個場域受傷那這個韓國市佔率最高的民間地圖他就跟他無縫接軌的串聯所以等於是政府用全國的力量去幫他保護精準的課員"},{"start":25307.364,"end":25331.594,"text":"那再來這個日本熊本熊的標章他就是支援全國的育兒照護事業然後嬰兒休息站等等他去調查如果你這個地方願意提供熱水泡奶點心嬰兒友善停車的遊戲哺乳室等等我們就幫你把它登入全國共通的官方搜尋或者是APP也會直接發放數十萬元不等的補助款"},{"start":25333.514,"end":25355.66,"text":"具體我們來看看台灣現在做什麼剛那個新聞讓我很擔心的就是我們已經有了不要小孩的地圖但是這些爸媽只能自己靠自己他們互相自救他們現在在社群裡面無私的投稿分享有哪些景點哪些餐廳有提供友善兒童的做法然後變成台灣人自己"},{"start":25356.32,"end":25382.068,"text":"自治自救的友善地圖這個本來是政府應該要做的事情所以這邊具體的本席提供四件事情四個建議我希望院長可以答覆第一剛剛我們已經跟勞動部長說了我們希望讓父母縮短工時有配套直接變成大家都可以使用的彈性工時制度這個需要兩到三個月來研議讓所有人可以受惠的可能"},{"start":25382.688,"end":25404.107,"text":"第二個我覺得院長應該可以直接做到請院長通令發函那希望我也可以有副本所有的政府機關立刻去盤點我們的公共空間給孩子一些分流還有安撫的地方並且要讓民眾在手機上可以查詢預測可以使用像這樣子的決心不知道院長可不可以表達"},{"start":25405.165,"end":25427.279,"text":"委員這個建議相當的完整我覺得完全拒絕跟可能家長放任這個都是極端這是極端的例子還是有但是整個社會不應該有那麼強烈的厭同尤其是我們這個少子化的時代但是政府該做的就是讓想要在一個地方能夠安安心心的自己跟他的小孩有一個親子活動的空間"},{"start":25427.819,"end":25451.624,"text":"我們可以提供他一個可以知道哪裡找到這些訊息的我們衛福做了很多這樣的好像這次在過年也做了很多在手機上找到這個訊息我們用這樣的經驗我覺得我們可以全國來做一個大調查所以您一個月內可以發函給這些所有的政府機關去盤點他們的場域有沒有辦法提供這個服務如果是政府機關我很快就可以處理很快就可以 謝謝院長各位說明我們過去也針對這個身障者也有去創造這樣的一些"},{"start":25458.584,"end":25474.509,"text":"盤點然後做APP讓身上朋友要就醫的時候可以查詢剛剛委員這個建議我覺得是非常好把我們過去從友善生育再轉換成友善孩子的環境那我們來一起推動我們第一步先來盤點 後面"},{"start":25475.951,"end":25503.66,"text":"看看如何來做一些指引跟輔導來建立一個友善孩子的空間第三點也很需要院長的幫忙因為你看到他們是有官方的認證跟標章不管你是貼紙或者是你是數位的認證所以他是用公部門的資源去幫店家導客跟曝光讓願意做的人看到我可能有補貼而且我還會獲得認證我對親子友善是好處的"},{"start":25504.66,"end":25521.828,"text":"那我們現在有世界無敵宇宙爆炸牆的速發部對於速發部而言是不是應該是很簡單的我們是不是院長跟速發部部長可以承諾去研發去做這樣子的認證跟地圖因為這兩點是日韓現在做得非常的積極"},{"start":25523.001,"end":25545.753,"text":"既然這個方向第二點的方向大家都認同來做的話那這個部分應該先要有一個執行的一個標準甚至一個未來鑑定的一個流程認定他所以我們先把這些作業做起來那來準備看怎麼樣讓這個場域能夠有一個明顯的標示能夠得到更多在這個行動上支持他的地方"},{"start":25545.953,"end":25570.942,"text":"好第四個因為以上我剛所述的真的是跨部會的責任就從勞動部一直到衛福部可能到抒發部等等的具體要求的院長是不是只是我們政委來協助推動因為很快也許你們又會推動小子化計畫或綱領能不能明確的加入新的一項的指標也就是友善嬰兒友善兒童的環境請院長承諾"},{"start":25574.471,"end":25591.012,"text":"先請部長講一下在我們現在在這個少子女化2.0的行動計畫裡面其實有在推動相關的友善職場那剛剛提到的就是這個友善環境更大我們過去有推動過"},{"start":25592.233,"end":25607.484,"text":"這個高齡友善環境高齡友善城市那我們可以用過去的這個經驗我們來研究把這個友善這個孩子友善兒童的這個環境也來照過去的模式來推動所以您也會在多久以內給我報告"},{"start":25608.377,"end":25625.224,"text":"我們來這個研議一下給委員一個報告多久三個月內好三個月蘇發部長您可以先休息一下那接下來我們請衛福部長再留步最近部長您常在媒體上講到推動這個健康病本席也很支持"},{"start":25626.547,"end":25645.909,"text":"好但是呢這個APP我不知道你自己有沒有使用過這個有幾個問題我想問你這個APP花了900萬開發900萬然後我幫你統計了一下下載量只有500次每天下載的次數是5次操作你操作過了嗎"},{"start":25647.462,"end":25673.387,"text":"跟委員報告我們講的健康幣不是這個APP啦這個是你在媒體上講的你說你未來想委託不是這個APP應該是說我們是透過我們健康存摺那未來我們會導入第一步就是預防保健包含打疫苗啦 癌篩啦 成人健檢啦然後會在健康存摺裡面去轉換成健康幣"},{"start":25674.287,"end":25693.88,"text":"然後這一個要做轉型這個是之前國建署開發的那我們這個叫轉型變成一個這個offline的這個chain來專門做兌換我先播一段影片給你看你會很震驚因為我知道你有在用穿戴式的運動設備你看一下這個app怎麼用"},{"start":25694.841,"end":25717.955,"text":"你每天喝多少水是要自己輸入的所以你自己要統計再來你運動也要自己輸入你可能先看你其他的運動APP再把它輸回來我跑了幾步最後更誇張的是現在很多營養學的APP是拍照就已經告訴你蛋白質多少澱粉多少這個是要自己輸的"},{"start":25718.775,"end":25729.227,"text":"跟委員報告這個APP我非常不滿意你花九百萬了所以才要求它轉型這個是國建署之前開發的所以你九百萬丟到水裡了不會不會這個未來您會很滿意"},{"start":25732.967,"end":25753.54,"text":"那你九百萬做了什麼我看到的是這樣而且昨天我請我助理也去下載我說我認為難用你們是不是認為難用你知道他現在在雙平台都下架了嗎因為我們在做這個轉型當中因為我就是覺得他很不好用這個跟我們現在的期待差太遠所以我們在做轉型"},{"start":25754.025,"end":25779.652,"text":"院長 現在很多穿戴的裝置院長 他花了900萬做出一個電子記事本然後每天要自己輸入步數自己計算蛋白質 你覺得合理嗎現在很多的穿戴裝置都非常的實用便利所以剛剛委員不應該把林部長請下去如果抒發部長在這裡的話我等一下 等一下抒發部還會再上來我只是想要告訴院長還有部長錢不是這樣子亂花的"},{"start":25783.274,"end":25801.547,"text":"900萬開發了一個500元下載現在還不知道多少人已經把它刪掉了再來我對於健康幣的質詢不管是在委員會或者因為剛好是遇到次長次長沒有那麼熟悉後來我就直接再發函院長我很認真我所知寫的三頁"},{"start":25802.407,"end":25830.054,"text":"三頁整整問他說這個點數你想要怎麼計算如果針對一些高風險族群你要不要加權那你有沒有上限我問了非常多的問題結果部長回我一頁他那一頁上面就寫比他新聞採訪還少的內容他寫說促進健康預防逆轉疾病的目標就這樣但是你在新聞說你四月健康必要上路我想問一下你現在覺得會跳票嗎"},{"start":25831.467,"end":25852.785,"text":"整個規劃接近完成待我們跟行政院跟院長報告完畢之後就會對外來宣布是院會跳票嗎我問那麼簡單的問題因為我們還是要跟這個院裡面報告還有現在最後的這個手續正在做最後的確認當中這些這個基礎的"},{"start":25853.683,"end":25877.49,"text":"因為它是兩個APP啦一個是健康存摺的部分這個已經Ready了另外是這個Health Goal的部分現在正在改版還沒有完成那你四月到底會不會跳票我們朝這個目標來努力朝這個目標來努力就是有可能努力不會在四月的時候launch因為據我所知你的結標你說你要改善剛剛那個APP你的結標是三月底耶"},{"start":25881.618,"end":25904.716,"text":"現在已經決標了現在正在做進行這個還要我自己從新聞去找1到4是你講過的話對於5678我很在意的數位落差或者是會不會更讓健康不平等因為國外已經有做過數據他們研究過健康幣後來是比較重視健康的人才會去加入這個Program"},{"start":25905.276,"end":25927.224,"text":"那你是不是要加權還有這個你要怎麼幫自己設KPI因為你說你要配合健康台灣的政策你總要設定說你有了這個健康幣後來你的疫苗施打率增加多少這些可不可以請你的同仁等一下來跟我要我這張slide還有我上次的公文你完全沒有回我"},{"start":25928.064,"end":25949.927,"text":"你可以回覆嗎我們在完整規劃完之後會再跟委員做一個更詳細的說明所以你什麼時候可以說明大概也是三個月內再跟您說明希望衛部這個數位化的工具在這個時代是跟民眾接觸最方便的那剛剛那樣的一個過程那個APP的內容一定要儘速的優化"},{"start":25950.353,"end":25960.504,"text":"好那院長我現在跟你講一個最大的問題如果你今天可以壯士斷腕你可以做下一個決定你會改變很多事這邊請運動部部長文化部部長上台"},{"start":25963.109,"end":25979.988,"text":"請運動部長、文化部長被選不是 衛福部長你還要留著時間暫停 陳委員不好意思我們只能三位叫院長好您看先文化部還先體育部那我們就先運動部跟文化部然後很快再換衛福部長文化部請回時間暫停 謝謝"},{"start":25984.935,"end":25992.588,"text":"運動部跟文化部文化部 民視還有文化部嗎運動部跟文化部好 衛福部請回兩位部長及代理請"},{"start":25998.298,"end":26014.715,"text":"謝謝兩位部長院長我從這邊開始跟你講解其實剛剛講到的健康幣把一些好的行為最後轉化成點數或是紅利這個在其他國家都有做好我先舉新加坡他是把運動幣跟健康幣合併在一起了因為"},{"start":26016.117,"end":26038.396,"text":"運動所轉化的行為你也可以去購買保健食品或者是你就把它換成運動券等等這個是新加坡做的事情他把它整合再來日本做的是速發布等等我們也會請速發布他把政府所有相關的這些紅利點數全部交由速發布去彙整速發布彙整但是各部門設計設計好了之後速發布就找"},{"start":26040.958,"end":26062.368,"text":"民間的支付業者或者是我們這邊可以找財政部所以他們用了一個人民很普遍的支付系統最後他就變成錢他可以去消費所以任何你希望他做的健康行為最後他就會變成錢日本是這樣做的韓國他是把文化跟體育放在一個虛擬的卡片裡面他把這兩個東西結合"},{"start":26064.309,"end":26076.931,"text":"那這邊我是想問文化部還有運動部一個問題先問文化部你有沒有遇過我身邊很多人滿了23歲對於這個一年一次用的APP他就把它刪掉了"},{"start":26078.613,"end":26107.023,"text":"是啊這個有發生嘛所以利益良善的文化幣APP一年用一次23歲不會再發文化幣他就把它刪掉了那我想問運動部長請問你有抽獎是不是抽獎之後他掃完這個QR code換完東西他也就不會再用不會再使用你這個介面了運動部的運動部是用網頁他不是用APP是嗎我們是用網頁沒錯對可是你換完你如果沒有抽到獎或是你抽到獎你使用完你就不會再使用這個網頁了嗎"},{"start":26108.373,"end":26133.625,"text":"理論上是這樣所以院長你現在遇到的最大一個問題是什麼我們三種幣 三種APP那你看剛900萬是這樣子丟掉的我們為什麼要這樣子應該是要很直觀嘛你既然想要促進各種藝文活動 運動 健康你應該留著那個最永續的窗口可能是健康幣"},{"start":26134.525,"end":26149.234,"text":"他會養成習慣那你那個文化幣進來以後23歲沒有可是你跟他並在一起你義務活動還是會被推波你的運動還是會變成閉碼兩位可以回座了所以今天其實院長你需要做一個很大的決定"},{"start":26150.114,"end":26171.896,"text":"未來各種不同的部門還會有不同的幣出現地方政府也有包括你發消費券也有可能別的國家是精簡直觀完全的降低數位落差高齡也不用記什麼部要用什麼幣要用什麼APP他把它全部整合成一個國家生活的錢包"},{"start":26173.217,"end":26196.496,"text":"所以你今天的判斷非常的重要啊我們請速發部上台你看你有沒有辦法做到我幫你想的方法就是速發部可以擔任我們的project manager那財務部他很財政部他比較厲害他負責金流而且他對於台灣配也非常的有經驗看他是要把它變成app還是他要把它結合學日本一樣結合成台灣配"},{"start":26197.777,"end":26219.228,"text":"不然你只是會只要一個部推行什麼幣你就要做一個APP然後重新一直跌床加屋下去像我們現在速發部有一個共同發放平台像是我們普發現金一萬還有客家幣這個都是用速發部共同發放平台去使用"},{"start":26251.371,"end":26252.691,"text":"我們現在的文化幣"},{"start":26256.454,"end":26264.811,"text":"還有客家幣所以在年齡整個金額的數量來看所以在職場的各自的證據再後我也看到"},{"start":26288.891,"end":26291.573,"text":"抱怨會我們本日排定的質詢的委員已經質詢完畢謝謝左院長、曾副院長以及列席的閣員"},{"start":26303.732,"end":26312.631,"text":"我們現在做以下決定下一次會議繼續進行施政方針及施政報告之諮詢再一次感謝王育民委員陪同我們一起參與今天的施政總諮詢現在散會"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}