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PAO CANADA // MING PAO TORONTO"},{"start":555.555,"end":561.92,"text":"谢谢观看 欢迎订阅"},{"start":686.084,"end":688.265,"text":"由 Amara.org 社群提供的字幕"},{"start":767.5,"end":770.756,"text":"谢谢观看"},{"start":929.216,"end":929.296,"text":"谢谢大家"},{"start":1019.865,"end":1019.946,"text":"谢谢观看"},{"start":1097.2,"end":1097.281,"text":"谢谢大家"},{"start":1238.803,"end":1238.944,"text":"谢谢观看"},{"start":1387.455,"end":1388.64,"text":"谢谢观看,下次见!"},{"start":1487.176,"end":1506.135,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":1746.343,"end":1764.66,"text":"好 我們現在開會 進行討論事項 請宣布討論事項 繼續審查1.115年度中央政府總議宣案關於經濟部部分2.115年度中央政府總議宣案關於經濟部所屬單位國際貿易署 能源署 水利署 地質調查及礦業管理中心 宣布"},{"start":1774.892,"end":1799.791,"text":"我們介紹一下在場的機關首長首先經濟部部長龔明鑫國際貿易署署長劉威廉能源署署長吳志偉水利署署長黎元鵬地質調查及礦業管理中心主任徐明鴻"},{"start":1802.351,"end":1819.343,"text":"經貿人員培訓所所長陳秀全技術師司長郭再聰郭司長行政院經貿談判辦公室執行秘書徐從清行政院主計總署公務預算處專名委吳明修"},{"start":1820.828,"end":1835.316,"text":"好那其他的一些師因為現在時間還有稍微再介紹一下綜合規劃師師長林碧玉投資促進師代理師長呂貞慧國營事業管理師師長胡文忠"},{"start":1838.544,"end":1851.547,"text":"好 再來的話 經濟法治司司長 羅翠玲秘書處處長 魏世剛人事處處長 李花書政風處處長 紀家珍會計處處長 王雅玲統計處處長 黃偉傑資訊處處長 林中仁"},{"start":1864.488,"end":1889.357,"text":"投資審議司司長蘇齊燕因為我很少認識各位所以我大概先讓我認識一下我大概對司長那個技術師司長比較熟一點其他因為比較少接觸所以讓我認識一下好能源署署長到達好吳志偉吳署長"},{"start":1894.022,"end":1922.319,"text":"好經濟部公務預算於4月22號第10次會議詢答結束我們今天依序進行審查審查的程序如下稅率部分依款別以項為單位稅出的部分依機關別以目為單位依序討論現在請一併宣讀今日審查項目跟委員提案宣讀完畢之後我們再進行協商一五年度經濟部及所屬稅務"},{"start":1923.598,"end":1926.183,"text":"第二款罰款及賠償收入133項經濟部2300萬134項產發署287萬135項國貿署1800萬6千元"},{"start":1938.387,"end":1942.67,"text":"136項標檢局及所屬1791萬5千元173項制裁局28萬5千元138項水利局及所屬8772萬5千元139項商業局及所屬2427萬4千元140項中企局及所屬10萬元141項園管局及所屬781萬元"},{"start":1963.899,"end":1966.782,"text":"142項地礦中心95萬3千元143項能源署510萬元第三款規費收入108項經濟部75萬1千元109項產發署648萬元110項標準局標檢局及所屬10億8689萬元111項制裁局47億4457萬3千元"},{"start":1989.122,"end":1991.423,"text":"112項水利署及所屬1753萬7千元113項商業署6億0907萬8千元114項原管局及所屬347萬9千元115項地礦中心3178萬6千元116項能源署"},{"start":2008.755,"end":2029.591,"text":"六千兩百三十萬一千元第四款財產收入一百四十五項經濟部五千三百九十五萬四千元一百四十六項產發數一千兩百九十四萬一千元一百四十七項國貿數十六億四千一百八十八萬七千元一百四十八項標檢局及所數三百零四萬九千元一百四十九項"},{"start":2030.953,"end":2036.637,"text":"制裁局96萬6千元150項水利署及所屬5908萬7千元151項商業署13萬2千元152項中企署62萬元153項園管局及所屬18萬4千元154項地礦中心1億6042萬2千元155項能源署7995萬1千元第5款營業盈餘及事業收入第6項經濟部63億4878萬2千元"},{"start":2059.853,"end":2064.056,"text":"第一幕營業基金營餘繳庫47億2656萬4千元第二幕非營業特種基金剩餘繳庫2718萬6千元第三幕投資損益15億9503萬2千元第七款其他收入142項經濟部3億7181萬3千元"},{"start":2082.048,"end":2085.51,"text":"143項產發署9559萬8千元144項國貿署667萬7千元145項標檢局局所署600萬7千元146項制裁局35萬8千元147項水利署局所署9334萬2千元148項商業署219萬8千元149項中企署20萬7千元150項園館局局所署1億4279萬9千元"},{"start":2110.466,"end":2113.889,"text":"151項地礦中心74萬4千元152項能源署1686萬6千元稅出部分13款經濟部主管第一項經濟部"},{"start":2124.332,"end":2129.498,"text":"第一幕科技專案302億4856萬7千元第二幕延朗外國專業人才1700萬第三幕數位應用及資安韌性1億0828萬8千元第四幕推動投資審議智慧發展2428萬8千元"},{"start":2143.14,"end":2159.431,"text":"第五目 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第四目一般建築及設備一千八百三十萬元 第五目地域背景六百九十三萬五千元 第七項商業署第一目促進商業科技發展十五億一千八百六十五萬六千元 第二目一般行政兩億三千六百七十二萬三千元 第三目"},{"start":2318.829,"end":2333.76,"text":"推動商業服務業升級成長8億8,731萬2千元第四幕非營業特種基金10億元第五幕第一倍金250萬元第八項中企署第一幕中小級新創企業科技應用18億3,376萬2千元"},{"start":2337.382,"end":2359.919,"text":"第二幕一般行政一億五千七百八十五萬元第三幕中小級新創企業發展六十一億八千五百七十七萬八千元第四幕地域背景四百八十八萬一千元第九項原管局及所屬第一幕園區產業升級三億一千九百四十五萬五千元第二幕一般行政四億一千一百零八萬五千元第三幕產業園區業務一億九"},{"start":2364.644,"end":2378.862,"text":"第十項地礦中心第一幕地質及礦業科技發展四億三千兩百二十九萬六千元第二幕一般行政三億零二百二十八萬九千元"},{"start":2379.366,"end":2395.963,"text":"第三目地質調查與礦業管理四億五千五百一十八萬兩千元第四目一般建築及設備物列數第五目地域備金五十三萬四千元第十一項能源署第一目能源科技計畫十億六千九百一十七萬五千元"},{"start":2396.563,"end":2425.124,"text":"第二幕一般行政兩億七千四百五十九萬四千元第三幕能源發展與管理七十二億零九百九十三萬六千元第四幕非營業特種基金一百零六億一千八百八十萬元第五幕一般建築及設備無劣數第六幕地域備金一百五一百二十五萬元二十七二十七款直轄市及縣市政府第五項一般性補助款經濟部主管"},{"start":2426.499,"end":2439.569,"text":"第一幕一般性農業補助水利署及所屬八十億一千七百二十四萬元第二幕產業發展署五百六十萬元提案部分第一項經濟部"},{"start":2441.55,"end":2466.023,"text":"第一案 派員出國計劃 檢列1000萬元楊瓊英等人提案第二案 檢列50萬元陳廷飛等人提案第三案 凍結1000萬元邱志偉等人提案第四案 媒體政策及業務宣導 檢列30%楊瓊英等人提案第五案 科技專案 檢列300萬元陳廷飛等人提案第六案 凍結10%楊瓊英等人提案第七案 凍結5000萬元張家俊等人提案第八案"},{"start":2466.563,"end":2484.719,"text":"冻结2000万元陈廷飞等人提案第9案冻结1000万元邱志伟等人提案第10案冻结1000万元邱志伟等人提案第11案冻结1000万元邱志伟等人提案第12案冻结1000万元钟家斌等人提案第13案冻结500万元陈廷飞等人提案第14案冻结500万元赖瑞荣等人提案第15案"},{"start":2485.523,"end":2505.453,"text":"媒體政策及業務宣導費減列325萬鄭天才等人提案第16案政策研究與推動計劃凍結1%政爭前等人提案第17案凍結10%蔡玉怡等人提案第18案凍結300萬元鍾嘉斌等人提案第19案向下業務費凍結2000萬元呂玉玲等人提案第20案向下委辦費凍結10%鍾嘉斌等人提案第21案工研院科技專案計劃凍結1億元呂玉玲等人提案第22案"},{"start":2516.118,"end":2543.898,"text":"向下獎補助費减列一億元凍結三億元洪玉祥等人提案第二三案其他法人科技專案計劃凍結一億元洪玉祥等人提案第二四案知策會科技專案計劃凍結四分之一振振錢等人提案第二十五案中科院科技專案計劃凍結四分之一振振錢等人提案第二十六案生技中心科技專案計劃凍結四分之一振振錢等人提案第二十七案"},{"start":2544.922,"end":2545.685,"text":"紡織索科技專案"},{"start":2547.813,"end":2575.353,"text":"計劃凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案 第28案金屬中心科技專案計劃凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案 第29案食品所科技專案計劃凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案 第30案車輛中心科技專案推動計劃凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第31案傳播中心科技專案計劃凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案 第32案藥劑中心科技專案計劃凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案 第33案"},{"start":2577.964,"end":2602.1,"text":"經濟中心科技專案計劃 凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第34案 自行車中心科技專案計劃 凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第35案 協計中心科技專案計劃 凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第36案 實質中心科技專案計劃 凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第37案 印刷中心科技專案計劃 凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案"},{"start":2602.58,"end":2616.977,"text":"第38案塑膠中心科技專案計畫凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第39案國衛院科技專案計畫凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第40案仿拓會科技專案計畫凍結四分之一真真錢等人提案第41案"},{"start":2620.918,"end":2636.69,"text":"社研院科技專案計劃凍結四分之一認真錢等人提案第四十二案業學界科技專案計劃凍結四分之一認真錢等人提案第四十三案凍結百分之十蔡玉等人提案第四十四案凍結兩億元呂玉玲等人提案第四十五案凍結兩億元"},{"start":2639.252,"end":2644.579,"text":"洪玉祥等人提案第46案凍結1000萬元陳昭明等人提案第47案延攬外國專業人才凍結100萬元賴瑞榮等人提案第48案凍結5%謝一鳳等人提案第49案外國專業人才延攬企網絡部件計劃業務費"},{"start":2657.315,"end":2683.975,"text":"凍結百分之五張家俊等人提案第五十案數位應用與資安韌性凍結一千萬元邱志偉等人提案第五十一案凍結一百萬元賴樂榮等人提案第五十二案推動數位應用計劃簡列二十一萬九千元陳廷飛等人提案第五十三案凍結四分之一鄭征前等人提案第五十四案智慧政府數位化經濟發展計劃向下智能轉型ABC計劃"},{"start":2685.456,"end":2710.368,"text":"向下經濟治理智能轉型計劃 凍結20%張家俊等人提案 第55案凍結10%鍾嘉斌等人提案 第56案推動資安韌性計劃 向下辦理經濟部轄管關鍵基礎設施提供者資通安全集合防護建議及資安治理成熟度評估輔導並"},{"start":2713.948,"end":2736.894,"text":"協助導入國際公控領域標準強化供應鏈管理以提升資安防護之完整性凍結5%張家俊等人提案第57案推動投資審議智慧發展凍結200萬元邱志偉等人提案第58案凍結100萬元賴瑞榮等人提案第59案擴大建設全球投資"},{"start":2737.854,"end":2754.099,"text":"第六十一案,一般行政向下,基本行政工作維持,業務費向下一般事務費,減列百分之二十,楊瓊瑩等人提案。第六十二案,一般行政向下,基本行政工作維持,業務費向下一般事務費,減列百分之二十,楊瓊瑩等人提案。"},{"start":2755.762,"end":2769.268,"text":"第62案經貿談判檢列1000萬元洪玉祥等人提案第63案凍結2000萬元呂玉玲等人提案第64案向下業務費凍結10%張家俊等人提案第65案國營事業管理凍結500萬元鍾嘉斌等人提案第66案凍結10%張家俊等人提案第67案凍結5%謝亦鳳等人提案第68案凍結100萬元賴若龍等人提案第69案"},{"start":2783.214,"end":2805.652,"text":"基本行政工作維持費向下業務費凍結15%中嘉賓等人提案第七十案綜合企劃凍結500萬元李玉玲等人提案第七十一案向下業務費凍結5%張家俊等人提案第七十二案投資審議凍結200萬元中嘉賓等人提案第七十三案凍結100萬元賴瑞榮等人提案第七十四案"},{"start":2806.132,"end":2814.117,"text":"投資案件之審核及管理減列20%楊瓊英等人提案第75案凍結600萬元呂玉玲等人提案第76案向下業務費向下委辦費減列500萬元洪玉祥等人提案第77案"},{"start":2822.001,"end":2834.465,"text":"經貿人才培育及發展凍結80萬元賴立榮等人提案第78案經貿人員訓練凍結500萬元李玉玲等人提案第79案促進投資凍結2000萬元洪玉祥等人提案第80案凍結500萬元邱毅英等人提案第81案凍結3%謝易鳳等人提案第82案凍結150萬元賴立榮等人提案第83案凍結0.5%陳廷飛等人提案第84案投資資訊服務簡列"},{"start":2851.96,"end":2862.305,"text":"20%楊瓊英等人提案第85案對付外投資台商之服務向下業務費凍結600萬元李玉玲等人提案第86案加速投資台灣之服務計劃凍結500萬元李玉玲等人提案第87案營業基金凍結2000萬元"},{"start":2870.629,"end":2896.601,"text":"洪玉祥等人提案 第八十八案 凍結一千萬元 邱志偉等人提案 第八十九案 凍結一千萬元 邱毅英等人提案 第九十案曾之國營事業辦理無人載具產業發展統籌型計劃 簡列一千一百八十八萬 楊瓊瑛等人提案 第九十一案 凍結百分之五十 張家俊等人提案 第九十二案 凍結二分之一鄭征前等人提案 第九十三案非營業特種基金 經濟作業基金 凍結"},{"start":2898.982,"end":2904.428,"text":"10%楊瓊英等人提案第94案凍結1000萬元邱毅英等人提案第95案凍結1000萬元陳廷飛等人提案第96案經濟特別收入基金凍結10%楊瓊英等人提案第97案凍結1000萬元邱志偉等人提案第98案一般建築及設備向下營建工程向下經濟部"},{"start":2922.388,"end":2926.371,"text":"辦公廳設興建計劃凍結10%陳昌明等人提案第99案交通及運輸設備向下運輸設備費減列100萬元鍾嘉賓等人提案100案到154案主決議請參閱第"},{"start":2940.549,"end":2945.135,"text":"155案媒體政策及業務宣導減列30%楊瓊瑩等人提案156案數位貿易減列100萬元陳廷飛等人提案157案凍結5%謝一鳳等人提案第158案凍結100萬元賴慧用等人提案第159案輔導減碳企業"},{"start":2959.171,"end":2979.367,"text":"提升出口量能計劃凍結100萬元呂玲等人提案第160案凍結100萬元洪玉祥等人提案161案運用數位新貿易模式計劃凍結300萬元邱志偉等人提案第62案向下業務費減裂1000萬元洪玉祥等人提案第63案智慧智慧"},{"start":2980.268,"end":2989.575,"text":"智慧會展 領航計畫 簡列1000萬元 洪玉祥等人提案第164案 國際貿易 凍結150萬元 賴瑞榮等人提案第165案 貿易行政與管理 凍結400萬元 李玉琳等人提案第66案 凍結200萬元 邱志偉等人提案 第167案 向下業務費 向下委辦費"},{"start":3000.083,"end":3019.42,"text":"動結十分之一宗嘉賓等人提案第168案新建國家會展中心設備及投資動結百分之五宗嘉賓等人提案第169案2025年大阪世界博覽會向下業務費向下違半費動結百分之十張家俊等人提案第170案國際經貿合作動結三百萬元呂玲等人提案第171案促進國"},{"start":3025.825,"end":3039.253,"text":"計展會觀光消費消費計劃檢列五千萬元洪玉祥等人提案第172案檢列百分之二十楊求英等人提案第173案凍結兩千萬元呂玲等人提案第174案凍結兩百萬元邱志偉等人提案第175案凍結百分之一"},{"start":3043.936,"end":3050.1,"text":"邱毅寅等人提案 第76案 向下業務費凍結5% 宗嘉賓等人提案第177案 向下委辦費凍結25% 宗嘉賓等人提案178案至183案 主決議請參與"},{"start":3059.488,"end":3084.145,"text":"第184案水資源科技發展凍結100萬元耐熱容等人提案第185案一般行政向下基本行政工作維持費凍結10%振天財等人提案186案水利建設及保育管理凍結500萬元耐熱容等人提案187案水資源開發及維護向下水資源管理向下辦理"},{"start":3085.106,"end":3093.957,"text":"台南海水淡化廠工程計劃 凍結2500萬元陳廷飛等人提案 第188自來水工程辦理無自來水"},{"start":3095,"end":3111.873,"text":"地區供水改善計劃第5期凍結5000萬元李玉玲等人提案第189案自來水工程向下業務費凍結10%楊瓊瑛等人提案第190案凍結10%楊瓊瑛等人提案第191案向下設備及投資凍結20分之一宗嘉賓等人提案第192案向下"},{"start":3120.333,"end":3132.466,"text":"投資凍結二十分之一中嘉賓等人提案第193案凍結二十分之一中嘉賓等人提案第194案向下獎補助費凍結百分之五中嘉賓等人提案第195案"},{"start":3134.281,"end":3143.206,"text":"河川海岸及排水環境營造凍結2000萬元中嘉賓等人提案第196案凍結1000萬元中嘉賓等人提案第197案河川海岸環境營造計畫凍結10%羊球營等人提案第198案凍結500萬元邱志維等人提案第199案凍結500萬元邱志維等人提案200案"},{"start":3156.534,"end":3169.597,"text":"中央管流域整體改善與調適計劃凍結漁園鯉魚林等人提案第201案水災智慧防災計劃第二期凍結5000萬元鯉魚林等人提案第202案凍結1000萬元洪玉祥等人提案203案向下設備及投資凍結5%宗家濱等人提案第24案向下獎補助費"},{"start":3184.201,"end":3204.479,"text":"向下獎勵及慰問 凍結十分之一 蔡宇宇等人提案 第205案地下水保育及水文觀測計劃 凍結一千萬元 楊瓊瑛等人提案 第206案辦理地下水保育管理及地層下限防治第四期計劃 凍結三千萬元 呂玉玲等人提案207案至224案 主決議請參議員"},{"start":3210.475,"end":3233.011,"text":"225案地質及礦業科技發展凍結100萬元戴瑞榮等人提案226案地質科技研究發展向下地熱資源探查與精進技術評估向下業務費及一般事務費減列900萬元宗嘉斌等人提案227案都會區及重要科學園區地質構造"},{"start":3234.372,"end":3240.638,"text":"探查凍結20%楊瓊英等人提案第228案凍結300萬元呂玉玲等人提案229案凍結200萬元邱毅英等人提案230案地質調查與礦業管理凍結100萬元賴若龍等人提案231案凍結10萬元陳廷飛等人提案232案礦業行政及輔導凍結10%鍾嘉斌等人提案"},{"start":3259.046,"end":3265.612,"text":"233案土石資源及爆炸管理凍結100萬元邱志偉等人提案234案到235案阻絕疫情參議院236案雜項"},{"start":3273.086,"end":3288.983,"text":"能源署稅入部分236案雜項收入其他雜項收入增列500萬元張家俊等人提案稅出部分237案媒體政策及業務宣導凍結20萬元賴瑞榮等人提案238案能源科技管理減列500萬元陳廷飛人提案"},{"start":3294.249,"end":3303.016,"text":"239案 凍結10%陽瓊營等人提案240案 凍結3%中嘉賓等人提案241案 凍結1%一些依鳳等人提案242案 再生能源環境建構凍結10%蔡玉宇等人提案243案 凍結10%蔡玉宇等人提案244案 凍結500萬元邱志偉等人提案245案 凍結500萬元邱志偉等人提案246案 凍結200萬元賴瑞榮等人提案247案 綠能系統"},{"start":3323.591,"end":3341.718,"text":"綠能系統技術佈局與推動發展 減列200萬元 凍結300萬元 洪玉祥等人提案 第248案 凍結200萬元 呂玉玲等人提案 第249案淨林排放高雄海洋科技產業創新專區營運計劃 減列1000萬元 洪玉祥等人提案250案 綠能科技示範場域委託專業服務費 減列1000萬元 洪玉祥等人提案"},{"start":3350.662,"end":3360.392,"text":"251案複合式海域示範樞紐及微運計劃凍結1億元洪玉祥等人提案252案凍結10%張家俊等人提案253案萬噸級碳封存模廠示範計劃凍結3000萬元呂玲等人提案254案凍結2000萬元洪玉祥等人提案255案"},{"start":3372.885,"end":3384.711,"text":"綠安轉清燃料電池應用計畫凍結5000萬元洪玉祥等人提案256案能源發展與管理簡列10%楊瓊英等人提案257案凍結1000萬元陳廷飛等人提案258案凍結250萬元賴瑞榮等人提案259案能源規劃與國際交流向下能源領域研究計畫績效"},{"start":3396.517,"end":3404.943,"text":"平建與決策資源 減列100萬元 凍結200萬元 洪玉祥等人提案260案 凍結200萬元 李玉玲等人提案261案 雙邊能源合作推動 凍結400萬元 李玉玲等人提案262案 向下業務費 向下委辦費 減列400萬元 鍾家斌等人提案263案 地熱減碳旗艦行動計畫 凍結200萬元 邱志偉等人提案264案 獎補助費"},{"start":3423.557,"end":3438.21,"text":"對特種基金之補助減列1000萬元中嘉賓等人提案265案凍結2億元洪玉祥等人提案266案台灣電力股份有限公司經營離島供電虧損之補助凍結500萬元邱毅英等人提案第267案凍結200萬元邱志偉等人提案268案"},{"start":3443.467,"end":3467.955,"text":"向下獎補助費對特種基金之補助凍結1億元洪玉祥等人提案269案經濟特別收入基金向下增撥石油基金獎補助費對特種基金向下補助家戶屋頂設置太陽光電加速計畫凍結5000萬元洪玉祥等人提案270案到274案主決議請參閱宣讀完畢"},{"start":3477.469,"end":3484.716,"text":"好我們現在先進行這個經濟部公務預算的一個協商那我們現在繼續進行我們從這個預算科目開始"},{"start":3498.191,"end":3520.346,"text":"第一項的話是經濟部這邊我們前面1234案先處理那首先這個邱志偉文在第三案是改組決議然後其他提案的委員有楊瓊英跟陳婷菲楊瓊英跟陳婷菲還沒"},{"start":3527.901,"end":3541.061,"text":"我看等一下這個先跳過好了我們等一下再回來處理因為後面的案子比較多因為這個前面四個還好來我們先處理第一幕好了好不好第一幕的這個科技專案這裡"},{"start":3543.237,"end":3562.604,"text":"那第一幕的科技專案來講的話呢我們先從5到14第5案到第14案第5案到第14案的話主要這邊第12案中嘉賓委員要不要發表"},{"start":3568.026,"end":3582.311,"text":"我看他這裡因為其他委員都分別有凍結嘛那我們剛剛是不是金額整合一下我是覺得如果聽聽業務單位怎麼報告啦我們金額可以再著談我們先聽一下紀律師"},{"start":3585.515,"end":3603.445,"text":"趙偉各位委員大家好那我想這第一幕部分就是屬於科技預算的部分那在115年進一步有編列的302億大概可以分降大概三分之一是屬於這個我們直接來協助業者補助業者的研發那三分之二是來"},{"start":3604.485,"end":3618.256,"text":"藉由我們法人 法人的首長今天也有來 包括工人醫院知識社會等等來進行研究開發展進行中長期佈局然後落實到產業目前我想大家知道這個產業的競爭非常的"},{"start":3620.437,"end":3638.205,"text":"激烈尤其在國際形勢的一個變化非常快那但是呢也是公開的所以目前在這個台灣的發展尤其在AI半導體的帶動之下其實規格是很明確的所以我們在做這個中長程的開發投入的項目"},{"start":3639.705,"end":3662.076,"text":"這是實打實啦,很明確就是要做什麼,2028、2032必須產出什麼,很清楚那進一步所編列這樣的科學預算就是來幫助跟業者一起來達到這樣的一個產業目標讓我們台灣繼續有這樣的經濟實力跟產業實力那第二個部分是委員也一直提到說希望能夠多給中小企業這樣的補助跟協助"},{"start":3663.877,"end":3688.485,"text":"那在這部AI的半導體浪潮上老實講我們以工學來講就是電機系要帶著機械系跟化工材料房子來一起往前走這個是我們目前的一個使命那有些業者能做就自己我們就給他跟他就是業科來做了如果還需要一點這個法人的研究那我們會在研發之後來做計轉甚至有新創來協助這樣的產業升級轉型所以科學上老實講"},{"start":3692.466,"end":3709.194,"text":"我們說就這個科技產業 電子的部分事實上它的比例 在投入的比例傳統的比例反而比較高傳統的比例反而在今年我們占了56%所以我們還是集中在這些傳統產業因為它需要拉背拉一把"},{"start":3710.074,"end":3730.407,"text":"再來就是說在業科的部分也是一樣在中小企業的加速也提升從今年近三年提升到百分之六十五經費也在百分之五十以上顯示我們對中小企業的投入再來最後是說有一關比較突破或說拔劍的部分那今年五月也公布了RD100這是一個全球研發的奧斯卡獎"},{"start":3731.408,"end":3755.426,"text":"那我想台灣獲得了16項大展名列前茅那也不只是剛才提到供應院擁有最大預算了那我們紡織所也獲得好幾項所以也給供應院很多壓力包括支撐會、金工等等在全世界我們在這樣科技研發很有實力很有實力的內容不只是我們會做做科技的前瞻而且是要能夠落實這個是大家對我們的肯定所以我們還需要一些我知道有些委員跟我們"},{"start":3756.827,"end":3772.952,"text":"提示說這次施害是經費很大那沒有很完整的在預算書裡面幫我們顯現那事實上我們有補充了四大本包括我們怎麼去評鑑怎麼去這個有些成果匯率那整個怎麼去這個這個有什麼樣的一個計劃內容我們都有補充四大本來請委員來這邊做參考 以上好 請鍾委員"},{"start":3777.915,"end":3803.362,"text":"好 那麼謝謝主席 那聽完了主管金官的說明 第五到十四案我看大家的用意都差不多 那科專很重要啦那我看到因為都有擬了很多的主決議文嘛包括邱委員的三個案子 然後賴瑞榮陳廷輝的都有改成主決那我是覺得可以同意改成主決議後 就不予動三"},{"start":3805.431,"end":3828.789,"text":"我說明一下跟莊委員還有各位說明一下因為5到14主要是讓我先他是總共的這個業學界的科專那因為我在法輪待很久看這裡頭比我熟的應該寥寥可數所以我稍微跟委員說明一下就是說我先讓在5到14是讓各位有提案的委員說明一下意見"},{"start":3829.73,"end":3850.329,"text":"那到時候因為他底下涵蓋了他們的業務費公研院還有其他的這個法人 包含是社會精工等等所以我們整個完之後我們再來針對因為他是整個第一幕所以我們在5到10次再加起來這樣就可以了好不好好再來的話是這個"},{"start":3853.614,"end":3868.448,"text":"從第15案第15案到第18案那15案到18案來講的話目前鄭天才委員"},{"start":3870.947,"end":3891.217,"text":"然後有提案然後17案蔡易宇委員改組決議18案鍾嘉斌委員應該改組決議20案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議所以我們15到20好了一起看15到20的話目前就是17、18、20這個改組決議16也改組決議那"},{"start":3897.04,"end":3921.998,"text":"這個鄭天才委有沒有什麼要詢問還是要等業務機關報告好請業務機關報告是那第15案是第15案那我們有去拜會鄭委員那委員已經理解到是這樣的一個是廣洶我們這樣的研發的成果包括一些總統創新獎產業創新獎等等那他的表示說還是尊重我們委員會的決議那也希望委員這邊可以支持"},{"start":3932.162,"end":3940.287,"text":"好那這邊就預算照列就是科技專案這一個第15萬就預算照列632萬5千這裡好 呂玉玲委員的話第19案也請業務單位先說明一下是"},{"start":3952.677,"end":3979.62,"text":"那李委員也是提到有關這個剛才提到的中小我們是不是要加重在傳統產業在中小區的部分那時候我剛剛在一開始的報告裡面有提到事實上我們的加重比例都是在五成以上因為這個大企業台積電不需要我們輔導我們也不會投在那個部分而是這個大企業本部不是藉著跟他合作來拿出規格來給我們這些中小企業一起來做轉型這個是我們等下目前的一個回應以上"},{"start":3983.849,"end":3998.679,"text":"昨天委員會你有參加嗎我昨天咨詢你沒有聽到沒有來也要看啦 看我們的實況因為我們昨天特別提到說我們對研發這些"},{"start":4003.291,"end":4029.642,"text":"是補助的經費大概我們都在電子業跟電腦業在一般傳產方面的話我們沒有輔導傳產有很多包括工具機或者是這個金屬塑膠這個食品業的各方面的研發我們應該要協助他們看你們現在都用導入AI來提升他們的產值跟競爭力跟附加價值對不對所以這方面的話我是希望你們能夠來提升國力他們來研發才有競爭力"},{"start":4032.483,"end":4056.364,"text":"好不好 整個市場才會蓬勃發展這個方面的話 請你們再精進看什麼輔導的方式 好不好雖然我沒有提案 但是我稍微問一下你們這邊是政策研究跟推動計畫嗎第十九案所以應該是比較是屬於智庫類的研究吧智庫類研究應該有推動嗎"},{"start":4059.239,"end":4084.485,"text":"在資歸研究我們是這樣因為我們是中長期的佈局大家必須要先想出中長期五到十年後的技術是什麼這些確定之後我們才會盡有我們的我說有沒有推動經費的工作項目因為看起來政策研究會占比較重比如說MIC R1K各個這些SYNC TANK的研究才對吧是我們把它分離了把科技預算跟這些研究都分離開"},{"start":4087.014,"end":4111.703,"text":"好吧 那李玉玲委員你是凍結兩千萬還是我們少凍一點 凍五百萬凍五百 凍五百凍五百萬 書面報告你多快可以寫我們就可以凍資一個月一個月 你不缺錢"},{"start":4113.846,"end":4138.541,"text":"一個禮拜一個月啦 一個月 我想寫完整一點 抱歉我開始想我好像執政黨咧這個政治人就推動應該可以快一點就寫出來吧 好不好一個禮拜可以還是兩個禮拜兩個禮拜兩個禮拜好了啦 好不好我幫你加速一點啦 因為這個趕快"},{"start":4141.564,"end":4141.926,"text":"兩個禮拜那個書面報告使得動之"},{"start":4146.442,"end":4169.954,"text":"好接下來的話我們處理的是也跟各位委員跟在場的官員報告我們接下來進行到這個法人的科專因為科專我實在太熟了我們先處理21 22主要21 22案就是針對這個公研院公研院的這個科技專案的一個計畫那一樣的我們先請這個業務單位報告說明一下是"},{"start":4174.243,"end":4190.73,"text":"周昭偉跟委員報告21號呂委員提到這個稀土的部分那確實我們就在事實上我們在這個112年就已經投入了我剛才提到技術是一個比較中長期的所以是看到這個問題投入那今年開始我們就要往這個量產 市量產方向來"},{"start":4192.23,"end":4215.487,"text":"來商業化來前進所以也是請委員這邊來各位可以跟我們支持因為這個是感謝委員的指導這個是真的是我們目前很多議者都反映說這個很多原料大陸或說其他國家我掌握那就會影響他後續的供應因為他就隨時會給你斷料然後就跟你談這些經濟安全的議題這是第一個那另外一個是22有關洪委員的部分"},{"start":4219.008,"end":4236.776,"text":"那這也是公務員的部分因為公務員預算今年有139億然後增加大概有20幾%左右那這部分我們想這個公務員這邊因為這一個今年所增加的項目會主要是在這個無人機還有這個所謂的這個機器人的部分我講這兩個以往"},{"start":4238.317,"end":4263.775,"text":"我們不是沒有投入但是真的是比較少那因為大陸的這個發展非常快那不只我們沒有其他國家也都哇這個事實上是也不要說散開就是說這部分會比較沒有投入但是這個地緣政治的影響之下那我覺得我們有機會了包括在民主世界這樣的一個市場起來那等等那現在大家在抵制大陸不能用這種補貼的方式來"},{"start":4266.158,"end":4276.153,"text":"來這個就進行產業發展所以這部分我們是等於說很快那又要達到目標所以有這樣的一個在今年有比較大項目的投入 以上好 我們看一下這個李玉琳委員"},{"start":4279.494,"end":4306.752,"text":"謝謝你剛剛講說你知道稀土我們大概都仰賴著大陸將近有九成的稀土那現在如果兩岸關係緊張的話那我們稀土的購買它的材料的話就非常重要了我們所以要有簡單性的先佈局不能被限縮到所以我們現在應該朝向美國跟加拿大跟澳洲方面來做一個戰略的考量所以你們現在有再往外去購買嗎"},{"start":4308.033,"end":4314.197,"text":"是有就是往這個剛剛委員所提示的這幾個國家都有是吧好那我這邊就著動一點好不好你們積極一點來做是好這個等我"},{"start":4322.518,"end":4344.507,"text":"問完我們再來就21、22案工研院的預算的一個處理我是之前我質詢的時候已經說過就是因為工研院增加的幅度是算很驚人就是增加了26億第二名是金工中心金工中心在嘛"},{"start":4346.274,"end":4351.888,"text":"對嘛就是就是所有的這些科專預算的大幅成長那就落到這"},{"start":4353.546,"end":4381.789,"text":"尤其公園院這麼大然後金工對不對也成長的就是比其他法人的一個占比要高所以上次我是希望說公園院對不對 這個技術師規劃一下就是應該是大帶小這個大帶小要口惠實質就是實質就是說你應該就是把這些的預算就是稍微就是做一些分配啦讓這些小法人的話不管是訪研之策會"},{"start":4384.301,"end":4411.2,"text":"等一下你講因為我對科專太熟啦我八大法輪其他都是非常熟所以我是覺得說如果大家以一個合作大大小公園這樣子的地位是OK的那當然我們私底下也溝通過我覺得這樣的方向也是可以的啦那這個我想只要部長應該沒有意見吧對 就是因為我覺得他這樣子公園院的標靶太大"},{"start":4413.483,"end":4431.935,"text":"像我們這個產業競爭力輔導團基本上是雖然公務員是主責但是所有的法案通通參加對但是那個還是在產發署嘛我現在講的是技術師的研發啦因為我覺得公務員你那個研發太多的時候因為將來萬一政策有變或什麼我們的那個人員嘛"},{"start":4437.458,"end":4462.334,"text":"其實你包括人員增加了那將來政策有變然後那個預算CUT 要兩個做出來所以我也要求公立院事實上在各法院之間橫向的整合可以增加因為他是老大哥嘛那有一些項目可以互相的合作可以互相的支援公立院權力跟物力都比較強他本來就應該要支援其他的法院把事情做好"},{"start":4462.614,"end":4479.652,"text":"對 我是說那個在預算上啦就工作上沒問題 但我在預算的分配上就是拜託部長這邊在明年的這個東西稍微做一下的譬如說他增加實在太多啦增加太多會變成標靶好不好他跟這個金工中心那"},{"start":4480.834,"end":4496.5,"text":"基本上就是讓各個法案另外一個我是建議因為我也寫過那麼多年的計畫書當然機器人的關鍵產業這沒有問題但是我們有很多東西都是overlap的"},{"start":4497.2,"end":4520.259,"text":"比如說我所謂overlap就是因為主機處在挑你們東西的時候一定是說這個名字不能重複嘛計畫名稱不能重複但是你們很多做的事情都一樣所以你們編了很多的東西我都覺得這個第一個編原AI關鍵技術生態系統建構再來無人化創新科技研發的建構"},{"start":4521.9,"end":4530.647,"text":"另外我們當然還有智慧機器可是我們學技術的都知道邊緣AI Edge AI是假設在這幾個算是最大的"},{"start":4532.177,"end":4558.955,"text":"理論上啊對不對因為它等於就是我把AI on chip然後做到這些的microchip或者是control unit上面塞到各個地方你塞到車子它也是HAI你塞到手錶也是HAI你塞到機器也是HAI你塞到無人機無人船斷七八糟都是叫HAI所以你們在這幾個計畫的名稱你後面還有一個叫無人化創新科技載具所以那時候我質詢的點是說到底這些東西"},{"start":4560.436,"end":4585.989,"text":"你們這幾個科專的關鍵計畫的分工啊要很清楚比如說你AGE AI這個比較是for horizontal比如說水平的這個技術方面然後你其他的你要發展的什麼就把那個項目寫清楚沒關係啊比如說該無人機的就無人機該無人車的就無人車該機器人的就機器人該什麼就什麼不然你們這樣包山包海"},{"start":4587.369,"end":4610.287,"text":"有些是DOMA SPECIFIC,有些是毀容的,但是又分不太清楚這明白這個結構性的問題了那我相信這個計畫名稱當然也就寫成忠誠綱要,你可能也不能動了但是我希望在未來你們在做這個明年度預算在說明的時候可以把這幾個的分工切得比較乾淨一點這樣子"},{"start":4611.768,"end":4637.818,"text":"這個是我的一個兩個建議第一個就是預算稍微去把它分配第二個是這幾個相關的把它東西弄清楚一點那第三個大概就是長久結構性的問題因為所有的國客一定要求你們KPI就是什麼記轉、論文但我個人是很討厭這種東西就是一個好的東西那我幹嘛要寫成專利一個很好很好的東西"},{"start":4639.557,"end":4654.134,"text":"對不對我若前專利我就必須要公開所以我覺得它有些KPI跟我們去產業落地的地方有些是矛盾的那這個我也希望說可能也許拜託部長去跟國科會去爭取一下"},{"start":4654.614,"end":4679.247,"text":"就是說這種KPI讓它接近這個我們法輪科專研發成果是可以貼近產業然後快速來做應用的啦不然這個結構性的問題我希望如果你們希望我幫忙去協調去幫你們說也可以因為我覺得這個就是台灣的這一個法輪科專的發展應該要讓它更接近產業落地一點大概是我對這個預算的三點線那"},{"start":4680.828,"end":4700.001,"text":"我這樣好不好 就是因為我還是看你們的報告 我不檢列啦那我少動一點啦我們在這個地方我跟呂玉玲委員我們兩個動 玉玲委員在我們兩個動他八千就可以了好不好那還有委員你要檢列嗎"},{"start":4705.698,"end":4718.729,"text":"剛剛這個當然主席是這個科專的專家提到這個金屬中心金屬中心執行長在嗎在你覺得你預算是這樣子征服夠還不夠我先講我認為不夠啦"},{"start":4722.645,"end":4739.047,"text":"金融中心在高雄它的任務是什麼你協助傳統產業怎麼導入AI怎麼樣導向高科技包括構建包括石化等等在我三年前"},{"start":4740.327,"end":4754.684,"text":"我催促你們成立這個航太有個航太處所以航太處正式成立之後還要編列人員相關預算去協助航太產業的發展所以不管航太產業或者是協助傳統產業來轉型升級"},{"start":4758.14,"end":4770.497,"text":"AI 這非常重要如果重生產業你不升級導向AI重生產業我覺得是非常危險特別是針對中國的相關因素"},{"start":4771.86,"end":4800.266,"text":"所以金屬中心扮演這個協助的角色所以我是覺得這個預算我要請部長金屬中心在劉董事長這個上任之後大家大力來推動各項政策我覺得他做得不錯那我希望說預算能夠再增加到金屬中心然後工研院我沒有特別意見工研院如果做得好我們繼續支持那我覺得這個先做到科專"},{"start":4801.85,"end":4828.258,"text":"雖然這個不是解你也是凍結那我覺得是不是凍結的部分不要凍到金屬中心這個是針對工研院而已金屬在第28案我們都沒有人提案只有鄭振淺委員提案所以您誤會了他沒來沒關係 鄭振淺沒來就照例委員報告金屬中心之所以經費會增加多一點因為我們現在在推動無人機"},{"start":4829.398,"end":4850.23,"text":"在分工上來講的話 金屬中心無人機是扮演比較重要的角色那剛剛也有提到南部的很多的這個產業輔導的部分可以仰賴金屬中心比較多啦所以這個部分為什麼經費會增加多一點 主要的說明先蔡議員 等一下楊瓊英委員"},{"start":4853.286,"end":4868.86,"text":"我們嘉義針對無人機產業的這個亞太中心確實就是委託金屬公司中心來協助那邊的整個中心的一個管理所以我們也多次的跟"},{"start":4870.02,"end":4887.333,"text":"經濟部這邊反映那如果金屬中心必須要肩負起未來包括我們整個嘉義這個亞太包括無人機的一個新創那無人機的甚至測試都是委託金屬中心的話我們希望是可以把能量提高就是說金屬中心必須要"},{"start":4887.893,"end":4906.199,"text":"有可能分配更多的人或者是資源才能把整個能量是撐開的因為整個無人機產業大家也知道這個是不管是國防工業也好或是整個用一個新的一個AI加上無人機的一個趨勢那是需要資源投入的所以以我的建議啦這個最好是不要動"},{"start":4907.219,"end":4927.915,"text":"我還覺得 現在要處理是公園院啦 要處理到二十八的啦是啦 我知道啦 都說到這裡來啦 光是金屬中心跟無人機啊那是附帶或是公園院啦對啊 全都不要動啦 都是邱昭偉的就好讓他三個走比較重要啦好 來 邱委員 楊瓊瓊委員"},{"start":4934.824,"end":4954.805,"text":"其實公園院真的是很重要的角色因為現在經濟部有很多包括新創也好 無人機也好還有AI轉型的部分其實在法人的部分現在經濟部有一個政策我是覺得分為三個階段這是很正確的就是說"},{"start":4955.987,"end":4979.046,"text":"因為法人可能是一半以上委託單位所以當然法人的條件比一般好所以他的預算在這邊會增加而且委託的數量也會增加這第一個這個概念就是希望以大代小有了這個大腦"},{"start":4980.563,"end":4994.076,"text":"之後小腦其實最重要我要給部長說明小腦很重要的是什麼呢小腦是在產業落地真正的這一塊現在全世界你大腦"},{"start":4995.134,"end":5020.867,"text":"研發指揮中心融化在這裡那你的小腦小腦如果沒有建構完成那台灣的產業要怎麼辦所以小腦建構是要也就是等號產業落地所以經濟部現在分為三個部分第一個財團法人的部分法人的部分來協助一半以上那另外就是另外就是真正在做的這一些產業"},{"start":5022.438,"end":5051.055,"text":"我個人充分建議這個小腦的機制產業落地一定要建構好因為你由實際上像我們中部地區溫蘭新店一直到嘉義大概我們的部落產業已經建構基層已經很完整了你根本不用再去像我們工具區、手工具區、扣件、零組件等等的這些包括我們的卡拉車"},{"start":5051.915,"end":5067.005,"text":"全部都建構的是世界一流的只要你來落落就好了馬上就可以量產所以這個小腦的機制產業落地非常重要那有很多的政策為什麼說政策很好但是地方產業感受不到"},{"start":5068.185,"end":5089.57,"text":"因為這個中間沒有去串聯好那所以我們現在仿向有結果論反推的概念也就是由產業也一起來協助產業我們有很多可以的它的能量是已經隱形冠軍非常的多你用產業來帶動他們的產業這個效果非常好"},{"start":5089.83,"end":5111.843,"text":"當然我知道經濟部就算這邊有在做也就這一層產業的這一層有在做但是我覺得力道可以再加強產業有很多的協會啊工協會他們有這個能力的時候那你們可以怎麼樣讓他在小腦的建構的過程當中參與其中這樣才能夠相輔相成"},{"start":5112.964,"end":5141.011,"text":"才能夠真正達到我們要的 拿到我們的結論這是我充分建議 因為我我知道你們在做 可是小腦的部分你做得不夠你是物為物其為 所以我建議小腦產業落地的這一塊一定要好好的去整體的盤點 全國裡頭到底有哪一些可以做的甚至拜託一嘴就要拜託一嘴因為因為現在有很多的廠商 坦白講大的一嘴沒料"},{"start":5142.411,"end":5167.692,"text":"但是你一定要大中小你一定要各個層面就是一帶大小一直帶下去才不會怕因為台灣人很善良我們從最基層的代工開始一直到製創品牌到現在大小差很多可是政府的立場是什麼不管你大不管你中不管你小你都要照顧他要不然你到我們的基層去看我們的中小型現在"},{"start":5169.033,"end":5197.028,"text":"不好耶所以我們要除了你AI等系列的權力支持以外那我們的產業在地產業你要怎麼樣支持他這也是一個很重要的重點因為95%的勞工界人力都在這一塊這一塊帶動了整個民生整個社會的一個生活安定等都在這一塊所以我具體建議你小腦產業落地的這一塊"},{"start":5198.39,"end":5202.321,"text":"一定要加強而且加諸預算這是我的建議"},{"start":5205.079,"end":5233.05,"text":"蔥嘉斌委員是這樣謝謝主席因為前面幾位包括高雄的委員關心金工中心嘉義的委員關心無人機產業然後我們台中的委員也提到未來這個精密金屬的搖籃台中都需要我們工研院跟金工中心雖然金工中心還沒有提到但我先講結論兩個我是覺得這個動的話真的要動也越少越好了至少不要多於剛邱委員多的5000萬至於到金工中心的部分剛他說5000萬"},{"start":5235.239,"end":5260.939,"text":"三千是吧我講八千啦不要緊啦我太了解他們了來你放心好他們都弄得出來那那個但是因為已經提到金工說還是要提一下那為什麼好像頻道的關聯性有的因為都講了嘛你也講到這個金屬工業的產業啦我要說明的是說給大家一個最新的訊息啦就在台灣的台北時間深夜美國參議院外交委員通過了一個2026台灣藍天法案"},{"start":5264.562,"end":5282.49,"text":"他的主旨就在於美國的無人載具無人機產業他們有兩個規格一個是GrainUS一個是BlueUS那我們的工研院早在上個月吧就已經呢結合了業界要跟美國引進GrainUS接軌那麼因為Grain是屬於商用的"},{"start":5282.87,"end":5305.441,"text":"那軍用的部分呢 它的續航供應鏈的要求更為嚴格那美方都已經提出在Blue的部分啊能夠跟台灣的供應鏈能夠接軌所以這個法案的主要內容呢是排除一些台灣的產業鏈跟美方形成一個共同供應的時候的一些障礙那當我們看到整個國際趨勢這個無人載具的產業這麼蓬勃的發展那我們看到這些客串的專案"},{"start":5307.222,"end":5335.825,"text":"都贏錢太慢不足都已經來不及了還要說去凍結還要去刪我覺得都沒有必要那今天沒有人講要刪啦那凍的部分的話我還是講到那個結論希望說少凍啦那至於進攻中心我們除了加碼之外呢還要繼續支持那當然委員有不同的看法這很正常但是希望國家產業能夠繼續前進這是一個那麼那個謝議員委員不用急我們要提供一個歡迎你到我們屏東來參觀一下現在全球啊"},{"start":5336.945,"end":5358.797,"text":"渦輪小型噴射渦輪引擎啊大概只有台灣能夠生產那是因為過去我們在航模這個領域呢多數的國家看到這個市場他也不願意做那台灣的產業很厲害你只要有錢賺市場再小沒有人做客製化的東西都願意做但是最近台灣的航模界都遇到一個問題啊都買不到他們的小型渦輪噴射引擎為什麼因為通通給波蘭"},{"start":5360.421,"end":5379.651,"text":"出口到波蘭去了,那波蘭下到哪裡大家就心智肚明那台灣現在這個小型渦輪噴射引擎已經是整個全世界相關無人機產業當中最重要的一個供應鏈那只是能當業者很低調,甚至我問他說金屬中心有沒有來跟你們輔導一下他說不用啦不用啦,這現在只能等到蓋孫,不用來幫我們輔導啦所以我是覺得大家有機會我們要去業界多關心"},{"start":5386.014,"end":5405.316,"text":"那業界需要政府的經費科專經費的支持那有錢才能做事事情才能做好那我們還是希望呢我們委員會能夠支持台灣的產業自主發展以上謝謝好我們請這個謝一鳳委員我們要講一下我們都非常支持這個不管是無人機產業還有相關的技術研發"},{"start":5406.537,"end":5431.855,"text":"升級等等所以其實今天在委員會即便是凍結那也是希望說大家未來在那個整個無人機產業的方向那我們希望說能夠監督這個這個效率以及這樣子的一個不要說剛才趙委也提到我們不要overlap或者是怎麼樣子就是能夠跨法人的這樣子一個整合所以這個凍結"},{"start":5432.896,"end":5461.957,"text":"並不是代表我們不支持喔是希望監督這個效率以及讓橫向的整合更為有進度喔那所以我剛才對中央委員所提出來這一點是非常不認同喔那也希望說就是說今天在大家這麼就是氣氛和諧然後共同來就是推動我們那個經濟部的科專的這個技術發展的這樣子的一個前提下喔那希望不要有這樣子的發言"},{"start":5464.602,"end":5483.877,"text":"好 我想是這樣子啦 這個我們都絕對支持科專的發展那我還是跟各位說明啦 因為我在法輪工作的經驗絕對應該也沒有人比我久了啦 除了 別人應該也沒有啊我說真的 對不對 在這一場的裡面的話"},{"start":5484.878,"end":5503.655,"text":"那我為什麼我如果再講坦白一點可能這些法人可能都覺得說你把我刪掉還更好其實動起來是更麻煩的啦那我們也不希望說刪啦因為刪也不好看嘛所以我們才用動啦阿不然如果從法人執行面不然你叫這些法人站起來說你要動還是刪還得說你把我刪了吧"},{"start":5508.297,"end":5537.052,"text":"我講實話,我講是在外的啦,我沒有在...對啦,好不好啊我的意思...來,我們培仁院長來那個謝謝主席,還有各位委員讓我大概陳述幾分鐘啦因為我想這個公園...遇太久,因為這是委員還要趕那個是是是,就是說因為公園我想在支出比例最高嘛那我想也是擔負最大責任啦我想這接受監督是應該的啦那這一點我跟各位報告一下"},{"start":5538.152,"end":5552.242,"text":"那剛剛那個剛剛那個我想那個召委提到有幾個計畫我這裡就可以跟各位報告因為公園所有的計畫我都親自看所以我可以跟你保證你剛剛提到那三個計畫是應該是沒有overlap"},{"start":5553.462,"end":5576.973,"text":"HAI那一件事情講的是Middleware第一個是Middleware第二個部分他講的是VRM有一部分是VLA我想因為你才是專家啦他講的是Middleware這一部分我想這是為了造福台灣將來要用在HAI的Hardware將來可以跟國際的Open Source的這個大型原模型可以銜接我想這是要造福台灣的這些產業這個是絕無問題"},{"start":5580.234,"end":5605.332,"text":"那在這個Edge Computing這一部分剛剛講的就是會用到VRM、VLA這些東西那這些東西會變成將來無人機或是機器人研發的一個共通的技術平台那將來它的技術平台出來之後將來會用在機器人跟無人機那這個我一定會仔細因為跟各位委員報告還有跟各位召委報告就是跟召委"},{"start":5606.272,"end":5628.011,"text":"就是說至少工業院的這個無人機的計畫跟這個機器人的計畫我都親自督導這個我想可以查證那我會assure這些事情不會讓大家有overlap那因為我想我們現在的這個無人機跟機器人這兩個計畫這個月剛好在徵求業界的回饋"},{"start":5629.032,"end":5656.455,"text":"事實上就是昨天開始我們所有的年底要預期達到的這些規格現在在尋求業界做談會說我們訂的目標是不是確實是業界所需這個我想我等到這個月把這些弄出來之後我想那個file我會跟各位委員報告這個大概是這樣 謝謝好這個聽張院長一句話這個甚為感動我起立給你支持一下"},{"start":5658.581,"end":5681.932,"text":"這個張院長是第一次到立法院來你上任第一年嘛我覺得他上任第一年他有很多的想法有很多計畫那我們是第一年給張院長給公務員的團隊給他們加油鼓勵打氣那要怎麼樣加油鼓勵打氣預算照列支持不簡列也不凍結這是最好的支持"},{"start":5683.499,"end":5700.806,"text":"象徵意義大於實質意義讓他們有資格讓張院長有面子來執行他相關的政策跟計畫我看這條是不是不要簡略也不要凍結以上是我的建議我要坐下來"},{"start":5703.351,"end":5727.393,"text":"我還是有我的堅持啦我 你要再繼續嗎可以讓我講一下嗎你再給你30秒就好30秒 好 是我們除了做這些先進的研發以外 事實上是剛剛對於這個傳統草原其實我們也非常盡心啦我跟 也跟那個楊前工委員報告我們也跟那個機械工會 還有跟工具工會 事實上我們召開幾次會議把他們的對工業的期望已經"},{"start":5728.294,"end":5755.823,"text":"用來調整我們原來的自機中心的研發規劃那另外一點原來我們機械所的副所長請了原來那個機械工會的文通秘書長現在變成我們機械所的副所長就親自在督導這些事情我想這是非常落地的做法那也跟那個楊委員報告一下我事實上也是譚亞神產商聯運會的顧問所以我想我是非常非常落地的啦跟各位報告一下 謝謝"},{"start":5757.577,"end":5786.957,"text":"我30秒部長你聽到這個就是我講的你的產業落地要怎麼做我們甚至譚雅神我們就聘請你的人來當我們總顧問我們的廠商界已經自己往前進這麼努力在做所以你可以把這個模式到各地去這樣效果會更好因為我是總顧問我當然認識他那我們一起努力在推動我希望是全國一起來"},{"start":5790.058,"end":5808.026,"text":"好我稍微做個結論因為我對公營運營的預算就是剛剛那幾個計畫我認同啦其實我剛剛講HAI應該就是做Horizontal的哪裡要把這些東西的Middleware甚至是我們Vertical Domain Common的這個我們講SLM這些要弄出來"},{"start":5808.726,"end":5823.326,"text":"弄出來之後你這個Vertical Domain再加你的垂直領域的東西去做那因為我們沒有討論金工只是金工是剛好是那個他們預算書編列你的是28萬都沒有人要動你所以這個到時候再看那"},{"start":5824.628,"end":5852.437,"text":"另外就是我剛剛講對公園院剛剛也請求部長的同意就是你在做明年規劃的時候那個預算稍微allocate到其他的這些小的法人因為我相信公園院包山包海很多但是在各個不管是在像資通訊雖然你們有資通所那像紡織、生計等等我覺得讓這些小法人把你們的一些工作再稍微allocate的經費出來給這些其他的一些的法人"},{"start":5852.637,"end":5871.009,"text":"那我覺得這樣子你的預算壓力不要那麼的大啦因為我也不相信錢全部堆給你你的KPI就會做到說非常的outstanding這個我們也不用自欺欺人我做了20我從民國對不對幾百年到現在已經也做了20幾年了24、25年了"},{"start":5873.391,"end":5883.986,"text":"所以基本上來講我們都心知肚明有些話我們都不在這邊公開說明但是我相信你都知道我的誠意啦所以我原本的話是還有撿跟動嘛"},{"start":5885.287,"end":5906.342,"text":"那剛剛這個邱昭偉說先是動五千那我八千五千我加起來就是除半的話這樣可以吧除半的話你就是六千五嘛六千五我再去掉五百嘛好不好我動你六千然後你書面報告兩個禮拜我要的就是兩件事情就是第一個"},{"start":5907.462,"end":5931.492,"text":"剛剛我們那幾個無人機無人載具創新因為那些的分工跟他整個system的一個architecture應該是怎麼做他的KPI第二個就是說明年跟技術師這邊的話在這些預算的allocate的分配讓其他小法人有一些預算的一個平衡這樣子好不好那就兩個禮拜跟我們這樣的書面報告使得動之這樣可以吧可以好"},{"start":5934.435,"end":5955.43,"text":"接下來我們處理的是從23案一直到41案23到41案我稍微說明一下這邊是屬於科技專案也是法人的科專他是屬於扣掉工研院以外的其他法人"},{"start":5956.07,"end":5971.061,"text":"那23萬是他的其他法人的家總所以各位就可以看到其他法人的家總才43億剛剛公園院那個是139億所以其他法人家總起來都還沒有公園院多這也讓各位委員清楚"},{"start":5971.701,"end":5986.832,"text":"那從24案一直到後面的41案各位就可以看到分別是支撤會、中科院、生技中心、紡織所28案剛剛很紅的金工中心、金屬中心"},{"start":5987.933,"end":6014.154,"text":"29是食品所 30是車輛中心 31是船舶 32是藥劑33是經濟中心 也是跟我們楊瓊玉委員這個中部有關係的34 自行車也是在中部的 鞋機中心也是在中部再來的話是36 食肢中心 這個是在花蓮印刷中心 塑膠中心 國衛院到43仿拓 41的話是這個社研院的"},{"start":6018.437,"end":6032.526,"text":"那這邊的話因為提案委員鄭政權委員都不在對不起喔我有23案那個我23案的態度扣合剛剛21、22其實它是連動的"},{"start":6039.707,"end":6060.834,"text":"也就是說 如果你21、22的書面報告讓我不滿意因為我是覺得就是你要讓它平衡那我覺得是 你們就可以看到這個其他法人才43億你們剛剛講的這個金工對不對但是金工已經是14億喔它比所有的階段法人都還要多嘛"},{"start":6061.482,"end":6080.143,"text":"但是我是覺得說從這些總預算就可以看出來就是不要不要太天秤的兩端是不平衡的啦不然你其他這些法人存在的意義我也不曉得是什麼所以我覺得這一塊的話是不是請司長看你有什麼樣的想法"},{"start":6081.058,"end":6096.318,"text":"感謝昭緯公務員的跟我們的建議那事實上剛才就是我們會依照這樣的方式來安排因為剛才講了這個公務員就算在公學院就是電機系的他帶著不能把我們其他的這個學系都忘掉了"},{"start":6096.818,"end":6111.369,"text":"包括生意等等我想這個是我們在意第二個公務員事實上還有很多分包計畫雖然這個是屬於他的但是我想像這個部分我想在效益最大化的前提下我希望他們再把對我來講他KPI會增加"},{"start":6112.17,"end":6130.225,"text":"原來這個計畫那他如果跟更多人合作可不可以增加那我也很開心在完成這個委員的一個期限我的癥結點還是在預算的分配然後讓這個公園院他即使是CUT或者是做預算的挪移其實對他來講他還是大哥的地位"},{"start":6130.805,"end":6143.812,"text":"那它還是大帶小本來就應該負更多的責任但是你要讓其他法案還是可以茁壯成長幫你的這個各領域的這些技術的研發會更好我期待的是這樣子那我23秒我改組決議"},{"start":6146.373,"end":6171.292,"text":"阿主席我覺得這個其實我經常說的在座各位中心都是國家最重要的經濟的這個農耗研發都是最重要的一個角色一定要看重自己那但是因為社會也在整個在變化早期我們台灣從疫苗開始我們去"},{"start":6172.313,"end":6201.09,"text":"國外的時候就帶著疫苗去做外交大家給我們比個讚台灣的聲音到目前為止在全世界還是非常的站上嘔頭但是就在你整個剛剛市長說的因為可能主席講的你沒有聽很清楚我們在講的是說你要看目前社會樣態你要怎麼樣去分配編列這些預算"},{"start":6202.711,"end":6230.827,"text":"編列這些預算譬如說生醫的部分現在最近這幾年一直夯起來那你們還是一樣大概這樣子的方向在做絕對應付應對不來目前社會全球的樣態嘛因為現在變化太大了變化太大了譬如我舉最簡單的例子一間醫界的放射科大家好像覺得放射科不是很重要現在非常重要什麼都要去照照完了來判讀"},{"start":6231.707,"end":6258.471,"text":"所以他變成是很重要的角色 部長所以你的法人的部分你應該要去重新盤點王贊成主席剛才所說的你兩個禮拜你要把它列出來你要怎麼去盤點你的第一個各法人所佔的位置他所分配的以及他所要主掌的他的項目是什麼那你還要去符合現在社會的一個需求"},{"start":6259.69,"end":6284.45,"text":"我覺得這個必須要重新去做整個的調整啦而不是每一年要固定差不多差不多這樣這樣子要跟社會的應變可能會有落差啦這個很重要謝謝就如同剛才昭偉說的就是其實這個其他的除了工研院其他的這些法人的科專"},{"start":6285.71,"end":6311.057,"text":"計劃我看了就是零零總總有一些甚至分配太少那是不是就是說我覺得這個部分我看了我們就先不要動就是以就是說明年度怎麼樣子就是調整尤其這裡面涉及到非常多的塑膠紡織鞋葉還有一些未來的一些前瞻現象車輛中心等等這是實在太多了還有自行車"},{"start":6312.037,"end":6337.088,"text":"那我們是不是就不要凍結啊我沒有要凍啊我說我改組決議委員的意義好我改組決議但是在你的組決議的報告裡面你就是要告訴我因為我說它跟剛剛21、22是連動的也就是說你今天的預算重新分配完之後你在組決要告訴我你明年的那個預算的這個稍微的分配以及各個剛剛楊瓊委員講"},{"start":6338.669,"end":6357.138,"text":"各個小法人的這些中心的角色怎麼讓他更有一個結構型的一個方式來做運作好不好這樣可以嗎可以各位議員這樣可以喔好所以我們23到41就照列了主決議這樣子就可以"},{"start":6358.198,"end":6368.207,"text":"報告主席抱歉因為那個剛有關那個鄭振前委員這個部分我們是有去跟在我已經處理到4041了你已經你已經PASS在"},{"start":6375.562,"end":6400.579,"text":"還沒有啦你現在是法輪科專到41結束好不好接下來的話呢我們要處理的是42到4642到46也跟各位委員說明一下這個是屬於業學界科專剛剛處理的是法輪科專那業學界科專就是我們從熟知的Aplus的這些等等的一些補助的計畫"},{"start":6402.801,"end":6423.934,"text":"其中42案、43案、46案鄭振全、蔡宜晨參委員等主決議在44案,呂毅林委員不在另外是我的45案請技術師說明一下"},{"start":6424.946,"end":6445.688,"text":"是那感謝趙偉跟委員的一個的詮詢那這個部分就是剛才提到在技術室的302億的計畫底下那109億的保管102億的業科我們直接補助給業者那第二個就是有間學科學界把他的技術產業化那在業科部分我們在剛剛有提到剛剛議員有提到說要希望我們多"},{"start":6446.629,"end":6473.946,"text":"這等於說更佈局整個產業那目前我們的方式事實上以往也都有我們都是比照我們都仿效這個搭旁的這種Top-down的方式也就是有主題式增量這不只在茶碗酥有在幾乎是我們目前也往這個方向來走也是各個領域產業所以不是這個A-plus不是業者自己來的而是我們叫他來包括我們現在已經投入了自治貸通訊6G矽光紙等等還有藥物韌性等等的計畫那"},{"start":6475.567,"end":6484.772,"text":"這個部分就等於說是我們也會很注意在這樣的一個因為是我們call的所以我們就會注意在各個產業裡面的評評不能只有單獨一個產業或單獨一個法人來做這樣的一個安排以上"},{"start":6493.746,"end":6518.413,"text":"好 我為什麼當時會提這個45萬我照我的提案說明的很清楚因為我們這一個業學界的科專我們主要希望補助的對象是國內的企業因為國外的企業或是研發中心也是列在這一種業學界科專 對不對所以我意思是說我們國外大廠不管是美光或什麼"},{"start":6519.753,"end":6531.202,"text":"他本來就很有錢的那我們也是希望他來台灣投資不應該像以前我們所在的年代對不對我們還有補助IBM的啦補助Microsoft的"},{"start":6532.833,"end":6556.139,"text":"這在台灣賺了我們那麼多錢那我們還要補助他我這個是一直沒辦法太在意就是太就是沒辦法不去忽略這件事情所以我那時候的水法是說你不要讓這個補助國際的大型企業然後讓本土的企業覺得說我繳的稅對不對然後補助這些人雖然他們也有繳稅啦"},{"start":6557.479,"end":6584.802,"text":"我是覺得說在未來的話應該是儘量是讓他們自己去出錢但是你的這個業學界應該是補助國內的微準第二個點就是我剛剛講的很多的大廠當然不管你是CPO或者是你COWAS的下一代要再做技術的提升這些大廠他本來就會有他們的技術的研發的投入對不對那股票那麼多其實他取得的市場的資金也是多的"},{"start":6585.262,"end":6608.013,"text":"所以我才說是不是有一些的比例對於比如說這些軟體的公司啦對不對對一些比較中小型的去做一些業學學因為Aplus的業績規範都超大啊但有一些的東西比如說它大概差不多在中間企業規模的這種補助可能也要把它思考列入這樣的方向啦我不曉得市長的看法"},{"start":6609.013,"end":6634.85,"text":"我想我們方向上是確實是我認為是一致的第一個在國內研發中我們現在目前也開啟了以往可能有曾經修正過的一個叫國內研發中心那目前我們在去年重新開啟這個就是針對我們國內的研發中心所以當比如說美光它在台灣設置事實上是很先進的HBM我們就主動找南亞你來就你的DDR5來設而且我們會把金額跟規模"},{"start":6635.43,"end":6651.563,"text":"因為我也跟業者講公告定價你有多少投資你有多少就業就大概多少的比例這是第一個那第二個在這些郵報中心來台灣老實講也跟委員報告也不是那麼容易那我這個因為他們願意來那也很多國家在拉他"},{"start":6651.963,"end":6679.302,"text":"比如說我最近有一家我不要講名字玻璃廠他說他已經兩次被韓國拉去了雖然他也不喜歡跟政府申請錢可是在台灣的這間玻璃廠美國公司願意來那我們來支持他這個還沒有成案大概會有這樣的所以不管是美光或是說NVIDIA會用這種情形那至於中小企業我們在業科或是說法科我們的比例或者說金額比例絕對到最近三年是超過五成以上這是我們經常委員的一個指示來去執行的"},{"start":6680.563,"end":6705.965,"text":"就是另外因為它是業學界嘛所以我是覺得有一些的比如像這種比較頂大的像台大、交大這一類的對不對它的一些的學界科專怎麼去跟產業界聯合來申請因為這個時候我知道你們的審查都很嚴苛我覺得這一塊也可以就是有一些的方向去做處理啦好不好那這一塊的話呢我改主決議OK"},{"start":6708.025,"end":6720.854,"text":"我也不去動這個業學界科專我該組決議但是我希望在你明年的預算的規劃應該是朝這個方式來做進行你如果沒有朝這個方向進行就恕我"},{"start":6722.858,"end":6739.287,"text":"好不好 就是我覺得應該是這樣的方向結構嘛因為我在這邊也做了20幾年 那我覺得一個Architecture應該是這樣子走啦那我覺得對產業對我們國內的研發會比較好一點好不好好"},{"start":6741.417,"end":6756.137,"text":"所以我們再回來第一幕的前面的這個因為前面是共通性我想這個因為5到14這一邊的話楊瓊英委員在第六案有沒有什麼要說明的"},{"start":6760.172,"end":6778.921,"text":"因為它是種的對對對 第六案那這個剛剛也在討論過那同時這個也我們大家也已經有溝通過那我有還是一個整個目我有一個重點就是說我們一直認為台灣中小企業是我們很重要的"},{"start":6780.041,"end":6795.13,"text":"的根基我們要怎麼樣去協助他不要忘了他們他們是有工作也有工作的人所以這個部分呢我們一直希望要加強當然剛剛也朝這個方向的說明這三年你們會增加到這個五成的這個範圍"},{"start":6798.232,"end":6807.942,"text":"但是我還是建議你還是每一年要看他的樣態該當增加的就要增加那整個手續方面要怎麼樣簡化讓他們能夠了解"},{"start":6814.248,"end":6841.66,"text":"你不要看他以為他是石頭 我告訴你他們都是翡翠你一把點開 他們的發揮力量無窮所以我就是建議說你每一年 也不是固定那個金額在那裡每一年的滾動式檢討 怎樣去協助中小企業這是第一個 第二個在整個程序方面要怎麼樣去簡化讓他們認識認知感來做申請 這個才是重點才能夠得到答案所以這個部分我就改為主決議"},{"start":6843.737,"end":6844.659,"text":"第六案改組決議鄭天才委員"},{"start":6852.557,"end":6872.913,"text":"我就這個補充剛才召委還有其他委員所提的就是建議明年度的預算的編列剛才從召委還有其他委員所提的這些建議務必要在因為明年度的預算已經現在在籌編了現在在籌編了"},{"start":6876.655,"end":6898.981,"text":"8月底就會送來了對不對按照預算法8月底按照立法院的規定8月底就會送來了所以現在這個階段是一個最好是要去調整的一個階段希望這個你們能夠切實那個把它納入以上好然後呢再補唸第12案莊嘉斌委員改組決議"},{"start":6900.865,"end":6923.064,"text":"好那我們在第一幕經過我們詳細熱烈的討論之後總共第19案動522案動6000那其他23改組決議了嘛45案改組決議所以整個第一幕我們就是動6500萬然後請這個技術師你們就是兩個禮拜內針對這個案子交報告出來這樣子好"},{"start":6933.02,"end":6952.794,"text":"謝謝那接下來的話呢我們進行這個第二幕延展外國專業人才原列1700萬47案到第49案那其中呢47案賴立永委員改組決議48案謝依鳳委員雖然改組決議但是你有沒有要說明的"},{"start":6956.524,"end":6977.279,"text":"我想要请问一下经济部就是关于延揽外国专业人才因为你们其实离目标很远那是不是也应该要对委员会的所有委员说明一下就是说你们要怎么样子做才能达到这个目标那你如果没有办法的话那未来可能在"},{"start":6977.859,"end":6988.722,"text":"就是說AI還有科技的發展上面就會有一些阻礙那當然就是我們如同我們說的我們希望說我們的科專計畫能夠協助國內的傳產還有一些就是說紡織石化業等等"},{"start":6996.044,"end":7008.284,"text":"那怎麼樣子就是說因為你如果外國對於AI的這個部分研發然後沒有辦法擴展到我們國內其他的相關的單位的話那這都會有一個很大的影響"},{"start":7009.975,"end":7030.62,"text":"是 教委 各位委員那投資者這邊就做個說明我們目前因為是透過科專這一筆1700萬來做這個整個Contact Taiwan的攬裁所以陳錄委員提到的我們其實這個外國專業人才我們其實要針對他的大學的專業的背景就是到國外去攬裁的話我們會"},{"start":7032.34,"end":7053.718,"text":"鎖定這些重點的大學 例如泰國就是有法政大學 西敦大學印尼就有萬農理工 這是廠商比較需要的這個對接的學校那我們會去針對這些大學來做攬財那另外廠商他其實有重點佈局的國家所以這些國家也是我們要積極就是去做不管是"},{"start":7054.998,"end":7074.205,"text":"這個攬財的說明會 或者是招商的說明會這都是我們重點的地方那另外廠商很其實其這個人才很重視的是薪資的誘因所以這個部分我們也會跟廠商這邊來做溝通協調那這是我們就是整個會加強的措施那也謝謝委員給我們支持"},{"start":7077.406,"end":7081.011,"text":"所以第二幕原覽外國專業人才預算照列再來的話第三幕數位應用與資安韌性"},{"start":7093.103,"end":7118.22,"text":"第50案邱志偉委員有沒有要說明?51案賴樂榮委員改組決議53案鄭振淺委員改組決議55案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議其他有提案的是陳亭輝委員跟張家俊委員因為都不在"},{"start":7118.8,"end":7147.168,"text":"那我看一下你們應該有找這個陳廷輝委員跟張委員溝通嗎你用開麥克風那你跟他討論完的結果因為目前委員辦公室這邊都是說要現場處理OK好那這樣好了因為他們都不在所以按照我們經紀人會的慣例我們就是預算照列第三幕"},{"start":7150.862,"end":7164.689,"text":"好 接下來我們進行第四幕 推動投資審議智慧發展從第57案到第60案那其中第58案賴若文委員改組決議第60案鄭振淺委員改組決議59案的話請楊瓊英委員59投資底檢的部分 你這個先說明一下對 請說明"},{"start":7181.642,"end":7206.441,"text":"主席跟委員報告其實我們這個項目主要是在做一個資訊系統的導入AI的部分那今年度的這個計畫的重點工作就是要建置智慧客服智慧秘書跟一個智慧助手的服務那其實內容主要就是說我們希望可以透過AI的方式協助投資人或者是民眾可以比較快速的了解投資的相關規定或者是說"},{"start":7207.703,"end":7228.144,"text":"申請的一個相關的一個申辦的一個實務那同時也會在審議系統裡面導入一個AI審議來協助審查的工作那整個目標就是希望可以降低投資人的一個申請負擔那同時也可以提升審查的一個效率那所以這筆預算希望委員這邊可以支持 謝謝"},{"start":7231.798,"end":7257.697,"text":"請楊瓊瑩委員其實部長在這裡我今天真的很希望就是說預算我們當然是支持但是你們的作為要怎麼去做因為目前政府自己也有抒發簿可是目前我們所有的橫向沒有辦法去橫向組織起來那各自做各自的甚至在經濟部底下每一個人都各自做各自的"},{"start":7258.393,"end":7284.38,"text":"我們是不是可以思考要怎麼樣讓人民產業更加的方便而不是只有你這個區塊方便哪一個區塊方便但是當你這個區塊要跨到那個區塊的時候它是不方便的那所以你最後的結果還是不方便這是我今天所提的這個重點所以因為部長也在這裡我真的要就是說因為這個問題我們講過了很多次"},{"start":7287.028,"end":7308.704,"text":"那到底要怎麼去做我覺得一個政府他應該有一個原則連通性而不是各自做各自的那你各部會也是各自做各自的那你部會底下的各單位也是各自做各自的我們稍微一直點頭那這個要怎麼樣去解決這個才是我們省預算最重要的原則"},{"start":7310.287,"end":7336.725,"text":"最重要的原則要怎麼去做讓你們相關單位部長何英雄相關單位他們也可以好好的來做是不是如此我要聽的是這個部長你要不要講講看因為不然你各自各自各自我們每一個人當然大家都知道這個AI很重要非常的重要可是你各自的部件都不一樣到最後串聯是不方便的"},{"start":7337.025,"end":7362.631,"text":"法委員可能分成兩個部分一個部分現在有共通性的部分那像資訊處它會有一個共通性的SOP那希望各個單位都配合這樣的SOP來辦理比如說資訊安全的部分那這個就部分我們主任那您剛剛講的不是真的我個人所提不是另外委員我跟您報告因為它這個投資審查它非常非常的特殊"},{"start":7363.876,"end":7390.21,"text":"只有這個單位因為它是一個委員會形式那個跟其他的單位的這個介面還有這個是比較不一樣它是比較特殊的所以它必須有它自己的這個系統部裡面的是不是對 這是投資審議委員會在做那個投資審查案件就這樣好不好那我們這個不檢我們動5%然後你們提書面資料你看要怎麼做要怎麼做"},{"start":7391.571,"end":7416.828,"text":"因為現在我們每個委員也不知道你們要怎麼做跟楊委員說明就是我們之後提書面資料的部分資訊處這邊會來協助投審師算你因為主要是在於目前資訊處我們每月就有開業務電子化小組的會議那我們會找底下的幾個機關他有一些重大推動事項的話每個月來協助他們審視這樣就很好你要去整合這就是我說的我們動5%然後你提書面資料謝謝"},{"start":7419.15,"end":7444.187,"text":"那邱志偉有問題57案這個我看了一下想一想我改成主決議好57案改主決議我稍微說明一下因為這個應該算是投資師然後是我們資訊投資師然後是那個MIS資訊處的來做系統的設計的對不對"},{"start":7450.129,"end":7476.259,"text":"協助嘛但是就是Business的Process是你們這邊嘛那你這個我只問一個問題就好你這個東西是給審查委員用的還是給外面的廠商用都會就是包括協助申請人的一個瞭解投資規定跟申辦的實務協助他做申辦那另一部分就是在投資審查部好因為如果你講這兩塊我就有點擔心"},{"start":7477.779,"end":7496.926,"text":"最後跟我剛剛楊瓊瑩講如果你是對外申請的部分就是你還有提供給對外申請的部分的話那這個時候就會落到楊瓊瑩委員講或是我們當時在過去的話國科會要求的因為你們現在有中期"},{"start":7498.246,"end":7512.697,"text":"產發署、商發署一大堆的這種給廠商的補助的申請然後那時候廠商都撒不清楚我到底是要投哪一個怎麼審過期了沒有那我記得那一個地方是有一個"},{"start":7514.339,"end":7542.441,"text":"當時是委託工研院後來又是好像給知識派是誰去做的這樣子的一個計畫那個計畫是專門給對外的廠商來弄來做申請所以你這一邊的這一塊的對外廠商應該去跟那邊去整合然後你這一邊的應該是給比如說我們這些審查委員在審的時候對不對怎麼快速的去研判這些東西的輔佐我覺得應該是這樣會比較好吧"},{"start":7543.536,"end":7570.362,"text":"跟主席報告 其實我們這邊審查指的是說投資案的送件就是在整個送件的過程中的一個 一樣啊一樣啊 我覺得你還是還是要把它講清楚啊你這個 我還是照這個楊全委員就動5%那你書面報告書面報告之後去講清楚好不好你把它講清楚書面報告出來動5% 好不好好 所以第4幕的話我們就動5%然後大概書面報告你書面報告多久"},{"start":7574.517,"end":7603.065,"text":"一個月內好一個月內順便報告之後使得動之好接下來我們處理第五目第五目的話我們從第61案到第64案那其中63案呂玉玲委員改組決議64案張家俊委員改組決議那我們先請這個業務單位先報告好不好因為這裡頭提案有楊瓊英跟我"},{"start":7605.785,"end":7630.953,"text":"第五幕一般行政那因為這個當中有一個委員的提案是有關那個就是我們那個投資的收入就是我們那個中鋼等四家等六家直接投資事業的那個收入有減少那這個部分大概是要跟委員報告一下因為115年的收入大概就是114年的股票的一些表現"},{"start":7632.213,"end":7659.798,"text":"那整個114年因為受到那個Art的關係的影響然後也受到這個國際鋼架影響所以主要是中鋼的表現就沒有辦法像過去有這麼好那當中漢翔呢過去的表現很好但是因為他這個也是受疫情的影響所以他整個在做那個F16的構改的時候因為國際的原廠沒有辦法提供材料所以他導致他的工程有點落後那落後以後中科院就給了他大概蠻高額的罰款"},{"start":7661.218,"end":7688.003,"text":"那罰款這個部分所以他就已經先提列一些損失所以導致整個114年的表現就不能如到預期不過索性可以跟楊委員報告就是說在115年的時候這些狀況大概都已經改善了那中鋼在115年的時候到目前為止表現也還不錯那漢祥的部分那透過這個工程會的協助原來的這個罰款也已經大概有絕大部分都能夠返還所以115年表現應該會比"},{"start":7690.185,"end":7693.705,"text":"将来要来得比114年的表现还好以上"},{"start":7694.758,"end":7722.51,"text":"我們請楊瓊瑜委員謝謝主席因為在114年17年分配的數字比你預算數會達六成那113跟114大概都是少了7000多跟400多那也剛剛你說明了這些原因所以部長在這裡我還是部長原則性的問題現在以往我們投資的大概我們自己可以掌控"},{"start":7723.61,"end":7738.727,"text":"大概我們自己可以掌控 你們可以自己掌控現在有很多的因子不是你們可以掌控你比如說 美意和諧了之後照理講 和平了之後 金價應該會降可是當天漲了7%就是你沒有辦法去想像 怎麼會變化剛好相反"},{"start":7745.148,"end":7772.059,"text":"刚好相反照理讲是战争金价要涨那和平怎么金价涨起那一天前几天这个让大家觉得很奇怪的所以这个部分我们也经过充分讨论我要勉励的就是说当然投资者要判断但是压力很大而且现在不是只有国内的因子全球的因子别人怎样怎么连带我们都会有状况"},{"start":7773.3,"end":7782.938,"text":"而且未来比如说在钢的这个部分它的压力会更大你碳水的部分到世界各国哪一个国家都不一样耶"},{"start":7784.008,"end":7808.945,"text":"那他願不願意接受在我們這邊繳他們能不能上岸這個我跟部長討論過而且我也一直希望說你要協助這一些產業由他自己去申請真困難啊政府你應該在世界五大洲這是政府部長你要做的啦這五大洲裡頭他們的license是什麼你應該要由政府本身去做"},{"start":7811.186,"end":7834.071,"text":"這個財政真的是在幫助我們的產業我們一間商廠只要去東歐國家申請要拼不出來而且要花了大概300萬而且還不一定出來喔那我們的政府找了那麼多稅金我們的政府應該就是要協助廠商啊是有能力的廠商自己可以去申請喔但是有能力的有幾家"},{"start":7835.376,"end":7861.214,"text":"我們講了底下基層的他沒有能力自己去申請但是勞動力都在這裡這是連動我們國內的民生社會問題所以我上次已經有建議過部長經濟部說你們應該針對五大洲他們現在要申請的由政府國家隊來幫忙來做申請這才是對啊你們不做這個事情讓廠商自己不收讓他們要投資的"},{"start":7862.594,"end":7872.702,"text":"要因著世界的這個情境隨時變化因為你們跟我們回答113年、114年就是因為怎樣怎樣怎樣我們也沒轍啊 人家世界都這樣 沒轍"},{"start":7876.4,"end":7900.427,"text":"所以不能沒轍 而是我們要想辦法怎麼樣在制度方面好好的協助廠商那你們在判斷投資的時候 等於也是在協助廠商嘛這是一個引導啊 部長這個部分五大洲這些證照你必須要專案的去研討啦去執行之啦 這樣才是真正協助我們的廠商啦"},{"start":7901.527,"end":7924.713,"text":"對不對 人家這麼辛苦 創造了一個王國出來那到時候因為這個問題 那上不了案 很可憐所以這個部分呢 我們今天充分討論我也是勉勵啦 可是部長你要做 你一定要做你點頭 這個都有影音看到 我告訴你所以這個我就改為主決議 謝謝好"},{"start":7930.486,"end":7932.508,"text":"對 61 案楊瓊園改組決議再來是我的 62 案主要是針對經貿談判的一個部分"},{"start":7943.018,"end":7964.75,"text":"因為這個等於就是說他增列的一個經費是增列1000就是比去年上年度增加了1663萬2000那增列的理由是推動參與CPTPP這我聽邱昭偉這樣子一直在講他一直沒有很好的成果真的沒有"},{"start":7967.845,"end":7983.36,"text":"對 但是我覺得你恨鐵不成鋼我是也是恨鐵不成鋼沒有恨鐵不成鋼 我要修正一下我是覺得給他們更大的壓力他們還有更大的動力但是沒有動力不能沒有燃料燃料沒有就是經費是不是先請樓梯先生說明"},{"start":7987.371,"end":8006.329,"text":"來 說明一下是 昭緯各位委員好那個首先說明一下那個昭緯剛剛提到說降上年度增列1663萬那是因為是跟上年度第一次那個預算審查結果相比那事實上後來有8月的時候有追加預算那所以我們現在的預算"},{"start":8007.99,"end":8027.617,"text":"叫去年度兩個加起來其實只有增加500萬左右那因為考慮到我們這個人員的增加還有業務上實際的需要所以沒有增加到那個委員說那麼多那事實上剪裂1000萬也的確是會影響到我們辦公室的運作是那委員剛剛有"},{"start":8029.038,"end":8051.013,"text":"稍微剛剛有提到就是說這CPTPP的這個進展的部分那這個部分的話經貿辦跟這個外交部、經濟部還有相關部會都是一直在努力的在推動那目前推案的關鍵主要是在化解這個政治的阻力因為CPTPP它對於成員國的三原則所謂奧克蘭三原則的部分"},{"start":8051.893,"end":8063.723,"text":"各個成員國都普遍認為是我們已經符合了高標準規範以及良好貿易承諾紀錄的條件那現在的問題就是差在這個共識覺那共識覺的話它就會牽涉到這個國際政治的這個環境"},{"start":8069.088,"end":8082.683,"text":"這個部分的話經貿辦跟相關的部會都一直在努力當中那我們是希望說能夠交委這邊能夠給我們這個辦公室能夠多一點鼓勵我們是希望說能夠這個改成主決議這樣子"},{"start":8085.726,"end":8101.612,"text":"稍微 稍微不是給他們鼓勵啊不是給他們鼓勵啊因為不能檢列你檢列他們都不做事啊應該要給他們監督嘛是不是應該要 對不對沒關係 我等那個邱委員完你們兩個都講完之後我再一起來 邱委員"},{"start":8105.014,"end":8130.526,"text":"我因為過去2019年我跟謝一芬委員我們一起成立這個立法院促進TPP促進會那時候還TPP還不是CPTPP所以我們這個我不能說專家但是我對這方面稍有策略所以從TPP開始第一年我去日本三天兩夜住在個商務旅館拜訪四十幾位國會議員"},{"start":8132.099,"end":8158.229,"text":"那時候我跟林昶佐還有跟呃呃呂孫玲就三天兩夜whp接著第二年又跑去這個加拿大加拿大四個城市從溫哥華到魁北克到多倫多跟這個中加兵委員去跟國會議員遊說接著我們又去厄瓜呃去這個呃厄瓜多自立跟秘魯啊"},{"start":8159.355,"end":8172.595,"text":"生命這個當然這個很重要他們是成員國那中加兵委員他分工是負責東南亞東南亞包括這個汶萊 馬來西亞 越南 新加坡他都去過"},{"start":8173.712,"end":8200.264,"text":"上上月我在新加坡拜訪外經貿部的部長 次長還有兩位國會議員 叫做CPTPP去年度到今年度 我去日本國會去了五趟 全部自費區雖然這個會期是無邊際會期但是我們找這個空檔一天的工作時間拜訪了五六位國會議員總共加起來三四十位就是為什麼立法院那麼努力"},{"start":8201.224,"end":8222.621,"text":"就要協助行政部門因為行政部門包括這個OTN是做統合包括前線部隊的這個經濟部的這個駐外人員包括外交部駐外人員所以各個大使我都有充分保持聯繫就希望說給他們更多的資源 更多的動力所以我昨天質詢是要針對劉署長"},{"start":8226.753,"end":8255.878,"text":"國保署副署長 你們這個基金你們工作計畫就有CPTPP所以我終於繼續建議你你要派你的副署長 你組長都可以去每一個國家走一遍跟他們表達我們希望今年能夠成立工作小組為什麼今年至關重要今年輪值組就是越南越南我們在那邊投資非常之多所以我們當然有一定的影響力在他們當輪值主席國"},{"start":8257.25,"end":8264.756,"text":"要不要受理成立這個工作小組今年是至關重要如果到明年 後年 大大後年"},{"start":8266.073,"end":8291.195,"text":"相對對台灣不是那麼接近的國家那難如登天啊雖然我知道這個工作很困難但是為什麼我念之在之從2019我跟謝立峰成立這個出席會到現在已經過了8年了我們還是持續不退 努力再努力但是行政部門我特別是這個經濟部部長也在這邊包括我們第一線駐外人員經濟部的駐外人員"},{"start":8294.824,"end":8321.16,"text":"包括你們都有組長在那邊嘛包括這個署長包括甚至次長江次長也是這個國貿署署長出身嘛所以這個部分這個經濟部包括結合外交部都要全力來推動雖然很困難我知道但是你不做就完全沒機會你做了最起碼還有一點點機會那OTM扮演什麼角色OTM能力不多啦"},{"start":8322.573,"end":8346.923,"text":"經費也不多 他們是做整合協調的角色做一個決策判斷 等於說是有點幕僚雖然你們是主動談判但是不大不要CPTPP是以大帶小的概念有10個會員國對台灣的經貿都非常重要如果你談不成CPTPP你最起碼透過這個接觸可以多邊帶雙邊你曉得為什麼"},{"start":8349.744,"end":8365.781,"text":"比如說你去跟馬來西亞 你去跟越南縱使他們又馬上答應讓台灣成立工作小組但是你沒辦法幫台灣成立推動小組那是不是我們雙邊的經貿關係我們能不能簽一些協定等等所以以大代小"},{"start":8366.892,"end":8381.562,"text":"所以這個ACPP是高度的戰略的一個政策牽涉到台灣未來的這個國際經貿的這個競爭力所以我是拜託召委是不是這個部分"},{"start":8382.763,"end":8400.052,"text":"因為今年至關重要如果今年不加速推動的話往後會非常困難所以我是拜託是不是委員會能夠不要檢列如果你適度凍結我覺得甚至不要凍結讓他們全力去推動最後半年年底就要"},{"start":8401.175,"end":8415.993,"text":"年底就要這個在越南召開這個會議所以我是拜託委員會是不是能夠支持不要解膩不要甚至不要凍結謝謝好我還有一個問題其實我對這個"},{"start":8417.395,"end":8446.735,"text":"你們很不滿意的我其實都寫在上面了另外就是你們ART啊MOU這些談判的投資細節其實我們到現在都還沒有看到然後每次都是從報紙上然後知道一些很慘烈的消息尤其這個我們楊瓊英委員等等委員諮詢過的不管你是進口馬鈴薯啊農藥啊花生的零關稅其實當時都在你的ART跟這個MOU的一個內容協定裡面所以這個是我第二個"},{"start":8448.195,"end":8461.62,"text":"比較非常覺得你這個預算的值錢為什麼想要減的一個原因因為這裡頭假設我下禮拜要去美國我一定會問你那個1.5N跟2.5N那個N大概是怎麼認定的"},{"start":8462.6,"end":8486.498,"text":"因為這個牽扯到我們整個半導體然後你們301現在的調查的狀況準備如何這些其實我們在立法院都完全不清楚所以這個我只要讓你知道我當時寫這個預算提案的非常非常主要的原因因為這個休官團雖然錢不是很多但是我只是在這邊要表達我說你的經費不是很多啦你看在你這個12億對不對經濟部才"},{"start":8489.6,"end":8516.442,"text":"我們總共經費才5281我當然知道啊你要去聽懂我背後講的意思甚至好像回去看預算提案嘛主要是兩塊CPTPP是剛剛邱委員 謝謝鳳姐來談的我關注的是我的Second Part那個才是影響台灣未來勝據的東西啊跟內容啊好"},{"start":8517.848,"end":8535.443,"text":"這麼多委員幫你求情,我不簡略,我不簡略,你來講,你還要緊嗎?好,謝謝阿伯,我是有感而發,因為我在經濟委員會講過很多次,我們台灣必須要,也一定要去談判,但是呢,就是國內你要怎麼顧,"},{"start":8536.644,"end":8563.752,"text":"那最怕的是什麼 知道而不講可以講的而不講 讓人民沒沒想這個是在談判的這個過程結論當中我們最在意的一點其他的國家 你看日韓人家講到哪裡可以講喔 注意聽喔可以講的他一定告訴他的人民他人民有所準備嘛就像你花生 馬鈴薯"},{"start":8565.305,"end":8593.428,"text":"你們改變誰知道 當我們問的時候才來講才來講 這不應當如此啊你本來這個就可以講的 你就要讓人民知道啊就像張家俊委員一直在強調的花生在他的地方花生 花生都擺齊 要怎麼 政府要怎麼協助 農業部要怎麼協助這個本來就是農業部要講 而且你們要講讓農業部去做準備這是我們的要求嘛你可以在談判過程當中 我再強調一次 可以講的"},{"start":8594.764,"end":8604.133,"text":"你要談到那裡可以講的告訴民眾啊而不是讓我們挖出來像馬鈴薯挖出來的你們一下子一顆一顆剪怎麼一顆一顆剪不要再騙人了好好的大家一起努力為這個國家為這個產業做事"},{"start":8612.393,"end":8638.401,"text":"顧我們的產業嘛這個才是你們談判的目的嘛這也是昭緯他很重要的一個點嘛所以這個我是聽到昭緯講我有感恩發可以講的拜託你們一定要講讓人民有所部署嘛這個不這麼危險對不對你們都說很好很好都從來沒有講說我們損失的在哪裡沒有那個談判沒有損失的啦"},{"start":8639.301,"end":8646.913,"text":"全世界不可能這樣子的啦所以不要把人民當傻子啦好不好這很重要啊所以我主席"},{"start":8649.537,"end":8671.389,"text":"謝謝 謝謝你不用回答 來 時間有限來 我們這邊的話 因為6163 64都改組決議我這邊的話呢 是動 我等於是減略1000 我動以800然後你交報告 你越快越好是 另外 朝偉那個九關那個提案裡面提到說這個提案內容不用說明了 就這樣子結束"},{"start":8673.57,"end":8697.688,"text":"可不可以 文字可不可以改幾座報告就好了啦 你怎麼可能去改你怎麼去overlook主席的決定 你在搞什麼東西啊你怎麼可能去改主席的文字他已經結論給你了啦可是將你結論叫做 笨八百不用管時間 你越看越好啦"},{"start":8699.756,"end":8724.281,"text":"你們書面報告出來就使得動之啊來 第五目 一般行政 凍結800交書面報告之後 使得動之第六目 國營事業管理我們審完第六目 到第七目好了我們就休息一下好不好 因為10點56第六目的話呢 總共是65案到71案"},{"start":8726.328,"end":8752.871,"text":"那其中的話 鍾嘉斌委員改組決議然後67案謝玉鳳委員改組決議68案賴樂榮委員改組決議 69鍾嘉斌委員改組決議然後73是呂毅林 71張家俊所以 那在場的委員有沒有要補充說明或者是要詢問的所以你們都改組決議了 鍾嘉斌委員跟這個謝玉鳳委員"},{"start":8758.521,"end":8773.853,"text":"第六目國營事業管理 原列4099萬照列接下來第七目投資審議的部分72案到76案 72案的話 中嘉賓改組決議 73案大任改組決議74案楊瓊瑩我們先請 因為我有76案也有 所以我們請這個說明 行政部門說明"},{"start":8788.342,"end":8807.77,"text":"這個部分是投資審議是我們投資審議室的業務費那這個部分包括基本行政工作維持費的大概430萬左右那投資案件的審核及管理費有大概2194萬左右那最後部分是投資案件電腦處理作業費用大概是416萬左右那在"},{"start":8811.511,"end":8830.927,"text":"投資審議的部分還有包括一個委託研究的部分它這個主要的工作項目包括三點第一點是整個全球經濟情勢變遷對外人直接投資佈局影響的一個分析那這個主要是了解說整個投資趨勢的變化那各國投資制度的變化那我們這邊也會作為一個檢討的一個參考"},{"start":8833.749,"end":8861.555,"text":"那第二部分是投資案件的一個調查跟管理那這個主要是投資案在核准之後的一個事後管理的部分那還有包括說我們派員到廠商這邊去做實地訪查那最後一個部分是在做一個橋外來台投資的一個便捷化的一個審查作業機制那這個是希望可以透過建立快速或預審制度來加速整個投資的一個效率那以上簡單說明"},{"start":8864.926,"end":8887.192,"text":"好那個楊瓊瑩委員74案74案我們主要用數字會講話因為在公布的答案當中2024年的世界競爭力的年報當中我們在69個國家評比也要很謝謝我們的綜合排名是第6名到113年是提升2名經濟表現是提升至第10名但是"},{"start":8888.132,"end":8906.535,"text":"外人直接投資的流量跟存量在五年內都是劣勢的項目尤其在2025年 114年你是58名以及61名所以這個部分是沒有"},{"start":8907.876,"end":8933.822,"text":"沒有改善而且是在退步的所以就像您剛才所說的我們現在所面對的是全球性的這樣子的一個樣態那你要怎麼去面對你不能只有給我們常常只有給我們一個答案因為全球性怎樣全球性人家有在進步的為什麼我們這一個部分是我們最重要的是我們最重要而且是退步是退步你如果退一年"},{"start":8934.742,"end":8947.835,"text":"那還要退兩年就是應對嘛退三年退四年退五年五年內都是在劣勢的項目內那表示這五年內的整個全球的環境以及國內的產業的環境投資者"},{"start":8950.441,"end":8971.227,"text":"我們沒有去串聯好這是我提的這個案子的重點部長在這裡部長你要聽五年列為劣勢我們每一年通過這樣的預算我們要想要替人民問一句話我們要怎麼改善之這是我的重點那所以呢我這個"},{"start":8975.679,"end":8999.73,"text":"74案所以74案的部分我本來是減劣20%那我現在改為動5%提出面資料但是我拜託你換我拜託你因為產業界很希望要知道經濟的部分外人的投資的這個部分這個也是很重要因為一定要跟世界串聯現在有很多的產業是異業結合而且同業在整病"},{"start":9000.799,"end":9025.948,"text":"那這個部分是產業界他們要要上國際市場很重要的人家願意要投資我們的能量量能量能夠好方向要正確那這個經濟部你應該要去盤點因為我們用數字會講話嗎好不好所以這個部分你們去盤點我動5%你一定要去盤點我要怎麼樣去改變提書面資料使得動之謝謝謝謝委員謝謝"},{"start":9029.721,"end":9052.7,"text":"好 那麼現在是那個蘇師長那雖然我第七十案已經同意改成主決議但是主決的內容希望看到我們投審是這邊再給一個比較明確的內容而不是只是將這個凍結的字樣塗掉那使得動之拿掉而已不是只有一個書面報告那尤其是昨天我才請教過我們的拱部長"},{"start":9055.061,"end":9078.711,"text":"關於對於台灣的高科技產品銷到中國的部分的管制以及中國你們因為投資投診師你們對中國資金來台這個雙向的部分因為我的內容這邊主要是說代理的部分那代理的部分是不是你們能夠對於我們未來不管是"},{"start":9079.929,"end":9107.761,"text":"投診師把關中國資金到台灣來或設立公司或是將台灣的產品輸出到中國去這個雙面性啊稍微描述一下不是只是單純的資金審議而已而是說他們怎麼樣就算是資金沒有問題那在台灣設立公司然後呢又把台灣的產品銷到中國去那這個當然有另外一個國貿署在把關啊但我希望你們雙邊啊資本進來你剛才說的我剛才也幫你收進了"},{"start":9110.426,"end":9132.838,"text":"資本進來跟我們的產品出去是不是雙邊的部分要有一個協調 謝謝李茂 大家情緒都很好"},{"start":9140.64,"end":9163.852,"text":"好那個76案我想要問的是說那個外包單位因為你們這個76案我的意見是說因為你這個是委辦費嘛所以這個是研究報告嗎還是什麼其實有工作項目除了報告之外還有工作項目在裡面對但是主要是工作報告還是外包的研究報告都有都有那你外包的比例是多少"},{"start":9166.741,"end":9191.657,"text":"我的76萬2千萬一定是委辦 委辦一定是外包啊對對對那你的這是委辦誰然後過去都是委辦誰然後做你的智庫做研究我們會把它拆成比較多的案子去處理啦那之前包括中金院那還有製策會的科發所之前的所以他應該就是屬於研究案就對了嘛好 明白"},{"start":9193.496,"end":9213.668,"text":"這樣子好不好 因為我就是我的部分我這邊就跟楊全 因為楊全這樣算完委員算完的話是動5%嘛在這一個幕是109.7那我這邊的話我就差不多動我們就動110萬啦好不好可以吧100萬啦 100萬好了所以第7幕動第7幕就動100萬然後待書面報告之後這個74 76才會動之好不好好 謝謝召委 謝謝委員"},{"start":9224.858,"end":9231.922,"text":"因為有人,休息一下好不好,好,休息一下,休息一個5加1啦,可以啦,5加1"},{"start":9254.701,"end":9266.147,"text":"我們軍區都很和諧那下次你再講話就在插這裡好啦 當然和諧不要這樣講我們的地方重慶上次有去跟委員說就是這個喉嚨斷層的部分事實上今年都有規劃還沒到這個啊等一下討論謝謝謝謝"},{"start":9285.817,"end":9288.098,"text":"這裏有個大廈,這裏有個大廈,這裏有個大廈,"},{"start":9310.913,"end":9328.609,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":9329.129,"end":9329.389,"text":"謝謝大家。"},{"start":9346.11,"end":9347.03,"text":"好,我們今天下午"},{"start":9367.616,"end":9369.397,"text":"嗯嗯嗯嗯嗯嗯"},{"start":9398.664,"end":9399.364,"text":"三點?這樣一個小時可以耶?"},{"start":9427.603,"end":9431.124,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 杨栋梁"},{"start":9452.892,"end":9480.418,"text":"來來來來來"},{"start":9480.458,"end":9480.738,"text":"這裏有個大廈"},{"start":9502.447,"end":9505.448,"text":"這間餐廳的餐廳是一間餐廳的中間餐廳。"},{"start":9536.58,"end":9547.091,"text":"這間餐廳的餐廳是一間餐廳"},{"start":9567.424,"end":9574.99,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 李宗盛"},{"start":9605.893,"end":9607.434,"text":"這裏面是一間餐廳。這裏面是一間餐廳"},{"start":9623.741,"end":9640.44,"text":"這裏是一座大廈。這裏是一座大廈。"},{"start":9647.768,"end":9649.75,"text":"中文字幕志愿者 李宗盛"},{"start":9684.236,"end":9685.237,"text":"看委員到站,好來"},{"start":9707.742,"end":9726.378,"text":"好 接下來我們繼續進行這個第八幕經貿人潮培育及發展主要是77項大樂園委員改組決議李毓林委員78案改組決議所以這個預算照列"},{"start":9728.208,"end":9753.554,"text":"再來的話是第九目促進投資這邊主要的話是79案到第86案那其中的話呢81案先一份委員改組決議82案那日文委員改組決議然後我這邊有一個第79案的這個企業單位先輸你"},{"start":9757.074,"end":9770.391,"text":"是 包括委員 還有趙薇 各位委員好那79案這一邊 洪委員有 趙薇有特別詢問我們是不是這個整個預算編列是不是跟招商 外貿推廣 還有產業輔導"},{"start":9772.193,"end":9791.771,"text":"是不是有業務重疊的情形那我這邊就提出說明那因為我們這整個預算是整個投資促進師整體的預算就一億五千多那這整個是推動型的並不是研究型的計畫那我們裡面主要的業務就是因為整個投資台灣三大方案他延長辦理"},{"start":9792.712,"end":9800.038,"text":"所以他包括事前的審查還有後續的追蹤還有廠商服務的需求有這種增加的趨勢所以我們就來協助廠商就包括他前端要做招商的這種開發案源的這種服務然後接下來由投資台灣事務所做這種一站式的這種投資審查的服務也包括去協調相關部會如果有一些障礙需要排除的話我們會每週來開會"},{"start":9820.473,"end":9842.991,"text":"那還有這個後續的追蹤管理那另外因為廠商他要到各地去佈局所以我們就會在各地包括結合我們駐館去設置這種服務的據點來協助廠商做這種諮詢的服務還有降低他投資的風險所以他這個業務是這種推動型的業務並沒有這種業務重疊的情形那以上做這個說明那那個信義範圍"},{"start":9849.369,"end":9864.287,"text":"我简单讲一下因为也希望说大家可以快一点然后就是现在刚好是毕业季那面临到学校就是说现在是AI元年那所有的毕业生都在担心就是说毕业"},{"start":9864.947,"end":9888.76,"text":"跟被AI取代的問題那我也希望說經濟部在協助廠商的時候那也順便能夠協助畢業生對於未來職癌的發展以及怎麼樣協助畢業生進入到我們需要有人力需求的產業發展然後讓他們的職癌有更好的發揮空間那我認為"},{"start":9890.721,"end":9914.126,"text":"這個部分也要麻煩就是經濟部能夠協助廠商然後協助我們相關的應屆畢業生是的好我對79案的意見其實是這樣子因為你們是在部本部嘛對不對那我意思是說這樣子的工作重疊就是國貿署還有外貿協會不會有"},{"start":9922.054,"end":9944.388,"text":"部長你要說明就到麥克風不然收入不進去無法留下證據不太一樣因為他是投資師是專門就是說如果有台商要回到台灣來要去投資的時候實際輔導他們或是當然解決問題讓他們真的落地外商來台灣也是一樣他是一個一個廠商一個廠商輔導他們落地OK好"},{"start":9954.957,"end":9971.148,"text":"好 那我這個地方來講的話 我就改組決議了那我希望是說可以多促進 尤其是外商啊就來台投資 而不是來台要我們的錢投資啦 就是不要像挖技術師 研發中心的錢"},{"start":9972.549,"end":9988.851,"text":"好 要投資 好不好好 那其他在場的委員 剛剛謝一鳳委員改組決議也有發表意見那我們第九幕促進投資 原列一億五零八四萬九千元這個我們就預算照列謝謝昭偉 謝謝委員"},{"start":9990.933,"end":10005,"text":"好 接下來我們進行第11幕營業基金的審查主要是在87到第92案那其中88案邱志偉委員改組決議92案鄭振淺委員改組決議那我還有一個87案然後現在請葉議長為我做說明"},{"start":10015.477,"end":10042.63,"text":"好 謝謝各位委員關心那這個是我們用公務的預算去增資國營事業來辦理這個無人機的採購那當然這個當中還包括了部分水利署的這個經費在這個12億當中那這個基本上它是一個行政院有一個無人載具的發展產業發展統籌性的計畫那基本上是希望能夠帶以公務的部門"},{"start":10044.571,"end":10066.271,"text":"包括國營事業來帶動國內的無人機的產業發展所以用公務的預算來投資能夠建立這樣子的飛鴻產業的供應鏈那也希望是透過這樣子的方式使得我們本來所有的國營事業或是公部門如果採購不同來源的無人機系統能夠互相整合也能夠用比較大的量來帶動國內的產業發展然後讓民間產業願意投入開發"},{"start":10070.314,"end":10094.691,"text":"那將來實際上採購的時候是由工程會來訂定一個這個共同的採購指引了所以大家可以follow同樣的一個指引好來進行那因為他全部都是用公務預算所以行政機關用公務預算那國營事業就用公務預算以增資的方式來辦理那以上好我看一下齁 呃 楊全文不知好我"},{"start":10095.595,"end":10120.396,"text":"我實在是對這個還是有很多很多的一個不可思議無法理解為什麼是用國庫增資的方式然後由你們來挹注國營事業國營事業如果自己要做就用他自己的業務預算就好了那為何還要你這邊來做這樣的國庫增資的方式"},{"start":10122.633,"end":10141.281,"text":"就是說因為剛剛有跟趙偉大概說明了這個希望是用公務的預算來做統一的挹注那因為在國營事業是這樣如果你要動用到政府的公務的預算的話他只能用增資的方式來處理所以在行政機關就是用公務預算去採購那在國營事業的話就是用公務預算來"},{"start":10142.501,"end":10169.504,"text":"增資國營事業去辦理那當然國營事業如果用它自己的這個營業預算來做進行採購也沒有太多問題那只是說希望能夠整合起來因為它是一個統籌型的計畫那希望用這個我告訴你這個就是我無法理解的地方就是你們都是要安得在一個大Umbrella底下然後就開始把這個預算方散到各我意思是說我沒有阻止你各國營事業去買"},{"start":10170.225,"end":10188.321,"text":"對不對你台電台水他本來巡視就要買了啊所以你不應該是用這一個方式啊意思是說比如說好了他們台電他們各自提他們的預算嘛然後你就自己去做就好了全部都是這樣"},{"start":10190.726,"end":10209.952,"text":"因為這個他除了就是說各國營事業他本身有他的這個需求 巡檢上的需求那有另外一個目的是要支持我們國內的無人機產業的發展所以說如果個別事業去做的話他可能每一個人都採購幾架 三架幾架"},{"start":10211.26,"end":10231.773,"text":"跟每一個它沒有辦法形成一個規模或技術上的一些提升那我們統一來供契約統一來採購的話某一家公司或某一家它技術上就可以因此會比較可以發展的起來比較快速的可以發展起來有它規模效益啦有點是這樣說老實話這個主要是產業推動"},{"start":10234.675,"end":10261.906,"text":"但是是請各國營事業在需要上配合需要上的需求跟推動上的需求兩個都有它的用意存在如果說只是各國營事業它也可以自己去買各個事業去買的話我們也沒有要求說國營事業只能買國內的你可以買國外的都沒有問題但是我們是要求我們國內的產業要產業化是有政策上這樣的需求以上補充"},{"start":10265.677,"end":10284.684,"text":"不是你們都認為很清楚啊我都認為是非常不清楚我的意思就是說這個地方你就是在一個計畫底下去做都沒有問題但我覺得國營事業東西就用他自己的預算去即使他自己去提比如說就說"},{"start":10286.945,"end":10309.77,"text":"從我們外界的角度來看這是觀感問題就是說國庫增資當然是公務預算這些這個就是你們講的流程行政的程序但我意思是說以一個外界觀點或民眾觀點或我們的觀點是說我國庫增資到了中油台電這些東西是希望改善它的營業的結構去改善它的營業的效能 績效"},{"start":10312.608,"end":10321.515,"text":"對不對我增資的目的是為了這件事情而不是我增資去買無人機然後你這個本來就用業務經費可以做的事情"},{"start":10322.694,"end":10351.827,"text":"報告委員那個本來國營事業它對無人商的需求本身就有它的一個需求向的需要那你說它要採購國外國內都沒有問題但是你也可以要求它你是經濟部身為它的主管機關假設我是經濟部我身為這些國營事業的主管機關我當然可以要求它說你今天在公開招標的時候無人機國產化的比例一定要多少也就是說在符合業務哪些範圍裡面國內可以做就自己做你加這個規定就好了啊"},{"start":10352.435,"end":10378.474,"text":"不是因為就剛剛提到嘛這個用剛剛那個理由沒辦法接受啊整個規格或是什麼我們希望公共工程委員會他會統一有一個規格有這樣的一個水準在規格之下我做技術那麼多年這個可以培養我們國內的這個技術力量我想我們在這裡啊知識產業的目標是一致的那因為無人載具或無人機這個產業它在初期的階段"},{"start":10379.278,"end":10406.164,"text":"他如果只有這已經不叫出題了啦我這主要公然因為這事先說完好不好我們本身雖然不像主席在資訊科技業那麼的深入但是在國內的無人載具目前還是停留在對跟外國結合的供應鏈我們去年啊外銷一百二十幾億那整價的部分整機的部分不到二十億大部分都是零組件出口"},{"start":10406.804,"end":10430.578,"text":"那未來如果我們要自主化發展一定要有系統跟整機的一個製造能力而不是成為外國整機我們作為它上游的零組件供應商那可以理解行政院在這相關的預算籌編上希望說能夠把這個訂單的量做規模做大以目前為來瞭解行政院各部會所謂採購無人機除了國防部之外大部分的訂單額數都是相當的少"},{"start":10433.18,"end":10454.854,"text":"老實說這樣的一個市場規模很多先進的無人機大廠也看不上眼目前大概會來台灣爭取訂單的大概就是爭取國防部的訂單那個上千上萬架的那以目前我看金融部所屬的這些國營事業他們採購的規模是不大因此我可以理解如果用在基金當中編一個比較完整的預算那麼這個時候經濟部可以來"},{"start":10456.255,"end":10478.97,"text":"作為政策上對於國內未來有潛力的整機業者我們給他這樣一個訂單希望他能夠幫我們不同的這個國營事業的需求打造他們所適用的無人機載具那我在這裡可以理解趙偉的用心主席的關切就是說在我們國營事業他當然可以用他的業務費去編列去買"},{"start":10480.751,"end":10495.324,"text":"但是我也可以理解 部長希望說我們在政策上有個工具這個工具除了優惠利率之外 當當的同盟之外呢也可以用採購來形成啊我想這樣的說明 謝偉文一直在點頭我想他那麼同意 我們就讓他過吧 謝謝好 我"},{"start":10506.335,"end":10532.904,"text":"我絕對不是不支持但我是覺得說你這樣的做到底有沒有達到一個效果或者是我們在預算介入上是比較統一一致現在的問題就是說產發署也有商業署也有中企署也有你想得到的地方都有無人機的採購甚至我們單獨省台電台水一人連可能糖我也看到都有就是"},{"start":10535.526,"end":10545.502,"text":"就是這個整個預算這樣打下來灑了一堆這個我是覺得就是一個不是很好的一個預算的管理跟使用的一個方式"},{"start":10546.536,"end":10568.2,"text":"所以我才會這樣講而且你們這邊寫的是國庫增資當然那是你行政程序但是從外在的觀點國庫增資還是應該用在營業效率、營業效能你可以去支持台電、台糖、台水對不對這邊去編列五人機它的業務預算去採買甚至你可以是去規範這樣的東西但我覺得這件事情用這樣的方式來做"},{"start":10568.9,"end":10576.507,"text":"我是不太認同我是真的不太認同這樣好不好我楊委員"},{"start":10581.747,"end":10599.837,"text":"我的提案是第90案 也是徐經理委員所提有跟徐經理委員討論過了另外就是說其實是各個單位都有無人機不是只有現在國防甚至我們現在也都一直大家一直在研擬無人機產業的法案"},{"start":10603.059,"end":10628.861,"text":"那這個很重要我想沒有一個人會反對無人機的產業而且是全力支持無人機我想這個是在立法院大家要全力支持也就是我們要怎麼樣讓它有制度化有未來性那所以包括我們也在思考無人機的產業的法案它的主旗勢者到底是誰"},{"start":10630.43,"end":10647.839,"text":"是不是在我們的經濟部部長這個可能你也要這個對不對這個我認為應該是在我們經濟部因為現在大家都認為是國防但是如果是無人機產業的這個部分我個人認為法案的部分應該"},{"start":10649,"end":10664.939,"text":"是在我們的經濟部嘛產業推動是經濟部嘛所以未來我們大家我想藍綠白的委員都有在提案無人機產業的這個法案甚至政府部門也應該有要有院版啊"},{"start":10666,"end":10683.529,"text":"你們現在預計要再提特別預算現在公務預算在各個部門裡頭都有譬如說台水台水他也買了七台農業部也一定會有各個部分都會有因為它的作用不是只有在國防"},{"start":10684.429,"end":10705.092,"text":"其實民生的很多都是啊 防災啊 這些都是啊是 所以報告委員 那個統籌型現在主政就是我們經濟部統籌型計畫所以統籌型的計畫嘛 就是非軍用的部分對對對 應該 所以我認為它的應該因為你一個法案出來 你必須一定要有一個"},{"start":10706.033,"end":10731.376,"text":"主單位嘛所以部長你也認為應該是在經濟部嘛產業推動的部分國防採購那個就國防採購那個當然就是國防那另外啦就是說你這個產業的發展的主旗式單位是誰啊那應該是經濟部嘛產業發展是經濟部那我們今天終於有得到一個答案啦所以大家提案的時候呢那經濟部你也認為應該是你們嗎"},{"start":10732.717,"end":10749.834,"text":"因為我個人也認為應該是經濟部那我們得到一個答案 那個徐經緯也有討論過那陳如剛才主席所說的 其實他是每一個單位都在買那分散在各個部位 那你用增資的方式 也覺得怪怪"},{"start":10750.782,"end":10773.432,"text":"也覺得怪怪的啦我不知道你們怎麼解釋啦支持我們是一定支持啦但是你用這個國庫增資在這個部分國營失業好像也怪怪的啦我不知道你們怎麼解釋啦所以徐經委員這邊喔因為我們這個部分我們是改為主決議啦有喔 謝謝來 稍微的部分"},{"start":10780.765,"end":10809.367,"text":"我要下結論不是我還是有我的原則跟堅持就是我實在是不太在希望看到這種你用國庫增資的方式我覺得你用明年的用什麼樣的方式然後統籌我還是改成是我原本還是凍結啊所以這邊是原列1億2千7百零1萬我少凍一點啦我少凍你一千好不好"},{"start":10810.974,"end":10820.527,"text":"動一千萬啦動一千萬然後書面報告但是你書面報告我希望要加的東西是第一這個是國產化"},{"start":10822.925,"end":10840.253,"text":"國產化的這一個無人機第二將來絕對是要上這個共同採購的供應契約因為你這樣才有辦法去節省成本因為剛剛部長也是這兩點的指示那我希望在這個書面報告我會看到這兩項的一個內容好不好"},{"start":10847.819,"end":10868.076,"text":"我要特別講一個大家都支持無人機甚至預算要怎麼放把它法制化這一個第二個無人機產業他們所碰到因為既然主席是我們經濟部他們的產業需求的配套譬如說他們的這個是非的場域"},{"start":10869.417,"end":10884.868,"text":"是非的產業你的跨距要多長對不對 這一些都要跟產業來符合這個不是我產業可以自己去設置是要由政府去設置這個非常重要 我以上建議 謝謝好 所以在第11幕那我們就是動1000萬然後你就要書面報告後 使得動之"},{"start":10899.123,"end":10917.011,"text":"90案改為主決議好 接下來我們進行第12幕93案到第97案其中94案邱議員改主決議第97案邱志偉委員改主決議那接下來我們就請93案 90案是楊瓊英委員我們請這個業務單位做說明"},{"start":10921.033,"end":10942.182,"text":"好 謝謝 那93 94 95 主要是針對就是大林埔遷村案的一個業務上面 謝謝委員的指教相關書面資料都已經在事先送給各個委員辦公室 包括徐新營委員辦公室那大林埔遷村基本上跟在地居民有溝通是以先遷村後建置園區的處理原則在做處理"},{"start":10943.782,"end":10964.933,"text":"經濟部跟高雄市政府站在一起面對民眾那為了要有一個千吋的共識所以花了一點時間這個效力沒有如主席的期待這個很抱歉但是現在終於大家有共識了也開始展開相關工作115年主要編列的經費60億他是要做安置地區土地的取得還有呢"},{"start":10965.493,"end":10987.906,"text":"相關這個安置地區的工程的新作包括道路、警察局這些建物的施作現在已經有具體的工作要展開所以經過向委員們說明邱議員委員已經同意是改組決議所以這一個項目希望召委還有各個委員能夠來指導跟支持謝謝好 請安排委員我個人提案93跟96經過溝通改為組決議謝謝謝謝委員"},{"start":10993.527,"end":11015.821,"text":"好那93案跟96案也同時改為主決議好那所以呢第12末非營業特種基金預算照列再來接下來我們進行第13末第13末我們主要98跟是99那陳超明委員第98案改主決議鍾嘉斌委員第99案改這個主決議"},{"start":11023.243,"end":11038.37,"text":"鍾嘉賓委員 你有沒有改組決議所以第13目一般建築及設備的話預算照列好 接下來我們進行這個組決議的部分請部長上資訊台 謝謝"},{"start":11041.789,"end":11059.217,"text":"好 第一把案主決議 遵照辦理好 照樣通過101 遵照辦理照樣通過102 遵照辦理照樣通過103 遵照辦理照樣通過104 遵照辦理照樣通過105 遵照辦理照樣通過106 遵照辦理照樣通過107 遵照辦理照樣通過108 遵照辦理照樣通過109 遵照辦理"},{"start":11070.427,"end":11071.928,"text":"有建議修正文字"},{"start":11097.916,"end":11119.09,"text":"118修正文字楊瓊英文有看過嗎大署第二行大署第二行增加可行性評估也就是說研擬專案性營運貸款利息補貼的可行性評估給委員看一下"},{"start":11124.541,"end":11125.882,"text":"你怎麼不打你的離婚"},{"start":11134.54,"end":11162.447,"text":"我要叫你去研議你要給我加一個可行性評估那你研議就是研議了什麼可行性評估事實上意思一樣啦你這太不尊重了不是意思一樣我請你我請你去研議你加一個可行性評估那你是yes or no我是要你的答案耶對不對怎麼可能要不要去學中文啊不是啦不能這樣子的我的主意要你去研議"},{"start":11163.717,"end":11167.38,"text":"我們是建議有一些文字上的修正就是"},{"start":11192.157,"end":11210.141,"text":"6月底改成這個兩個月內因為6月底馬上就到了是不是兩個1、2、3 對改成兩個月內可以嗎你有困難嗎因為6月馬上就到了1、2、3 修正通過"},{"start":11215.718,"end":11220.062,"text":"124案124案這個修正文是委員同意的124案 楊全英委員應該是在那邊吧 有簽過的"},{"start":11246.697,"end":11260.909,"text":"好124案修正通過125案 遵照辦理 常任通過126 遵照辦理 常任通過127 遵照辦理常任通過128 遵照辦理 常任通過129 遵照辦理 常任通過130 遵照辦理"},{"start":11262.13,"end":11264.672,"text":"通過131通過132通過133通過134通過135通過136通過137通過138通過139通過140通過141通過142"},{"start":11287.008,"end":11290.27,"text":"有修正 那委員也同意了好 152修正通過"},{"start":11317.389,"end":11337.702,"text":"153 也是有修正 153 修正通過154 遵照辦理 遵照辦通過好 接下來我們進行經濟部國際貿易署的審查的部分好 我們先看一下這個第三項國際貿易署的第155案"},{"start":11341.159,"end":11360.572,"text":"請那個說明謝謝委員還有趙偉那這個案子主要是在一百五十五案主要是楊委員主要在關心說我們的在這個象下裡面有編列媒體政策跟業務宣導的部分那委員比較關心的是我們怎麼樣使用這個費用"},{"start":11362.893,"end":11383.589,"text":"那這個部分我們主要是在協助那個中小企業他們能夠了解說我們有些貿易推廣的計畫比如說這個智慧領航計畫還有比如說這個數位新貿易模式的這些計畫這些計畫讓業者知道要來使用這些計畫那我們這些計畫其實已經有很大的"},{"start":11385.43,"end":11399.868,"text":"很有成效的效果比如說智慧領航計畫我們有輔導了7000家的廠商帶動大概有18億以上的商機然後另外一個新貿易模式的計畫裡面有兩項工作一個是輔導廠商"},{"start":11402.65,"end":11423.924,"text":"使用AI數位的這種技術這我們輔導了大概有5400家然後另外我們建立一個平台讓業者知道說國際的商機在哪裡那這個平台的會員也有5100個會員所以這個計畫主要是讓中小企業能夠了解我們的貿易推廣相關計畫能夠讓他們有效利用 以上報告 謝謝好 楊瓊委員"},{"start":11426.292,"end":11447.185,"text":"這個主要因為我們一直說中小企業你也聽到我的聲音就是說中小企業你要怎麼樣一直去輔導他因為中小企業你說對自己單打獨鬥那是不可能的所以我們就是一直希望說能夠針對中小企業的這個部分怎麼樣去協助他們認識了解願意"},{"start":11450.307,"end":11475.444,"text":"有這個動作出來是很重要是好所以這個部分我改為主決議謝謝委員好那個OK你先做楊英雄委員15萬改主決議接下來我們進行第一幕不好意思我注意一下因為剛剛我們那個經濟部的部分你那個遇到事案總體的沒有還沒有回來所以那個部分這個部分還沒有處理"},{"start":11477.148,"end":11498.939,"text":"一到四目你還沒處理好一到四目我們先處理好了好不好經濟部的這個一到四目這邊的話主要是這個包含第一個楊全雲委員派員出國計畫還有第四案楊全雲委員這邊媒體政策跟業務宣導這個請經濟部這邊說明一下"},{"start":11503.32,"end":11526.298,"text":"是 昭緯委員 這個這是經濟部部本部的派員出國預算那因為那個經貿辦在裡面的比重比較多所以由經貿辦在這邊來負責做報告那委員在這邊裡面主要是指教的就是說在經貿辦的這個列的裡面是沿用前年度的空範的敘述沒有具體說明"},{"start":11527.339,"end":11530.86,"text":"出國地點及談判重點那這個部分的話我們是有跟委員辦公室這邊有報告過就是說因為國際政治的情勢所以我國的經貿談判對手國通常不願意在協定簽署前就曝光跟我國正在談判"},{"start":11546.084,"end":11564.271,"text":"那我們舉個例子就是說譬如說去年114年的時候我國跟日本在進行數位貿易談判去年12月簽署協定但是在去年整個的過程當中每回合的諮商日本都不願意我們跟外面宣布說我們正在進行談判"},{"start":11565.511,"end":11580.537,"text":"事實上我們跟其他的金貿談判對手國也有這樣的一個狀況所以很抱歉我們沒有辦法說在這個預算的編列上這邊能夠就是詳細的列說要跟哪些國家進行談判是這樣子的情況"},{"start":11582.439,"end":11606.242,"text":"其實這個部分呢也是我們剛剛討論的也就是說你們在整個談判的過程當中如果這個訊息可以告訴民眾我是充分建議在你們談判的過程當中訊息可以告訴民眾讓民眾安心而不是從頭到尾都不知情不可能全部都不能講嘛"},{"start":11606.983,"end":11634.294,"text":"對不對所以這個經過的溝通呢那這一個部分呢我們動5%然後提書面報告謝謝委員謝謝召委好所以我們在一到四案的這個地方總共就是動5%是多少錢用數字好了沒有沒有那個主席那個第一案那個不一樣的你是第一案對對對對對"},{"start":11636.827,"end":11649.995,"text":"這是123啦123同步就陳廷輝、邱志偉、楊瓊英三個這是同一個向下對156是不是150的150萬6千那就150萬 碰150萬好不好報告時的動之好然後還有一個第四案"},{"start":11662.172,"end":11672.081,"text":"第三個是針對經濟部的媒體政策的廣宣的部分那我們都知道就是115年我們的媒體廣宣業務主要還是針對經濟部的施政的重點來做"},{"start":11675.103,"end":11690.462,"text":"就是跟社會大眾跟產業界溝通也希望說經濟部的施政的主軸能夠讓產業及時掌握重要的措施然後讓產業能夠及時掌握重要的訊息來應用那因為去年"},{"start":11693.005,"end":11715.738,"text":"立法院對於我們就是沒宣的這個經費也有要求我們要審慎運用所以其實我們也都隨時在滾動檢討那113年114年其實我們沒宣的執行率都有達到像113年也達到八成以上114年其實也執行到九成接近九成所以我們也都很審慎的在執行這相關的計畫那"},{"start":11718.98,"end":11736.669,"text":"相關的這個媒宣的經費我們的這些執行的內容也有都在官網上做這個公告那也有按計送立法院來備查那這個部分也請委員給予這個支持能夠招列那因為1029萬的媒宣經費裡面也有包含就是剛剛在提案1515萬的那個科專的632632萬的那個媒宣經費裡面那剛剛那個提案也招列"},{"start":11748.214,"end":11772.535,"text":"那是不是也可以請求照煉 那以上做說明 謝謝我主要提這個案 我告訴你 你113年八成 119年九成所以我如果給你檢列18算正常的這是你們的執行成效 因為我們在審預算的時候還是會往前推去看到底你的執行程度到底是怎麼樣 我一直邏輯我想不通"},{"start":11773.456,"end":11802.493,"text":"我一直強調經濟是我們台灣很重要的命脈給錢你花不了那到底是我們給太多還是你在執行方面沒關係我們把問題去講清楚出來因為我們也代表人民來審預算那我一直強調的人民可以知道的不管是國內國外經濟部長在這裡我今天叫了你無數次了請了你無數次我覺得真的政府的政策如果正確的話人民就有福"},{"start":11802.793,"end":11826.096,"text":"政府的政策如果對而不讓人民知道那人民是很傷腦筋啊這也對不起人民啊 對不對所以這個部分呢廣泉的部分還是要加強我覺得你要跟基層的這個跟產業能夠去串聯哪有一個政府給預算你今天我們有了好的政策末端不知道"},{"start":11826.897,"end":11854.487,"text":"那這個是不是我們在整個的方向裡頭要怎麼樣去調整這是我提這個案的目的我希望你能夠好好地去調整希望知道的人可以知道 這個才是我們的目的希望知道的人不知道 你覺得自嗨 那沒有用的好好幫助產業那這個部分是不是我們著動"},{"start":11856.598,"end":11866.144,"text":"你著動50萬 調整你們怎麼做 報告後使的動之好 共50萬元然後順便報告後使的動之 好不好好 謝謝 謝謝莊委 謝謝委員接下來我們繼續經濟部我們到國貿署的第一幕也就是從第156案到163案這邊"},{"start":11886.735,"end":11894.279,"text":"好那這邊的話呢157案謝伊鳳委員改組決議158案賴樂龍委員改組決議然後161案邱志偉委員改組決議然後剩下應該是我的160 166 163請這個業務單位進行報告是"},{"start":11913.882,"end":11915.547,"text":"好 那跟趙薇報告那"},{"start":11918.001,"end":11945.861,"text":"裡面召委主要關心的大概有三個個案一個主要是這個怎麼樣去運用數位新貿易模式這個計畫那另外一個是輔導減碳提升出口能量計畫還有我們運用這些數位新模式計畫或者是智慧領航計畫我們的這個導入的成效大概是怎麼樣那我針對這些個別計畫很緊要跟召委跟委員報告"},{"start":11947.267,"end":11947.287,"text":"那針對"},{"start":11950.609,"end":11977.961,"text":"第一個有關減碳計畫的部分那這個部分委員比較關切說我目前貿易署的計畫跟其他單位比如說產發署的計畫有沒有什麼相輔相成的地方或者是有怎麼樣去分工那這個部分我們先報告一下貿易署這個部分我們的減碳計畫裡面會提供全球碳規範的指引他會cover全球大概50國以上的這個規範讓我們業者能夠知道說全球的規範的發展趨勢是在哪裡"},{"start":11980.322,"end":12003.201,"text":"那另外我們會建立一個所謂的品牌商機的資料庫來掌握全球地碳供應的供應鏈它的市場的要求是怎麼樣讓業者能夠掌握商機那第三個我們也有一個減碳出口能力的評估系統還有這個數位申報報表的部分讓這個企業在真正出口的時候能夠瞭解它的出口的相關的能力"},{"start":12004.162,"end":12031.851,"text":"那另外就我們的瞭解產發署呢主要是在協助國內業者提升量能部分包括在國內的製程使用的設備包括在減碳技術的改善的部分提升業者這個減碳的能量所以我們這個是一個是對外一個是對內相輔相成這個主要是減碳計劃的部分還有一起講嗎是好那另外有關這個"},{"start":12035.663,"end":12055.18,"text":"有關像比如說這個成效的部分那比如說委員官協說我們這個比如說這個使用這個運用數位新貿易模式這個計畫那我們的企業的這個參與的情形然後這個黏著度怎麼樣"},{"start":12056.161,"end":12082.913,"text":"那在這個計畫裡面我們大概在113年跟114年累計超過的使用有5400家這個中小企業來使用然後在這5400家裡面這個像比如說114年有2500家115年有3600家他們基本上這些都是每天會上平台他其實使用的黏著度算是很高的那另外有一個部分呢是在有關這個"},{"start":12085.768,"end":12107.438,"text":"智慧領航計畫這個部分 智慧領航這個部分其實我們已經從111年到114年我們已經完成25件的這個實證案例然後協助7000家的業者 然後帶動了剛剛有報告過 帶動商機大概有超過18億元那另外在智慧領航 我們稍微說明一下它的內涵是什麼"},{"start":12108.078,"end":12132.765,"text":"他會透過這個包括在提升這個在國際展會裡面比如說我們透過AI的翻譯行動的導覽3D的建模像3D建模來講工具機工會就非常支持像因為工具機他這個設備很大很難不容易帶到國外的展會去那我們就用這個3D導覽3D建模的模式那事實上我們的一些業者還是取得到非常讓他們滿意的這個訂單那另外一個部分"},{"start":12136.648,"end":12143.931,"text":"我們也是透過像比如說展前展後的數位的行銷還有這個工廠環境讓這個業者能夠快速的觸及到國際的客戶那這個部分"},{"start":12152.154,"end":12172.766,"text":"這個在11年到14年的這個使用的情形那在未來第二年的這個第二期的計畫呢我們會進一步擴大包括編寫智慧科技的運用的指南然後建立AI媒合的平台然後另外還有推動雲端平台來協助這個業者掌握國際間的商機以上報告 謝謝"},{"start":12174.226,"end":12197.676,"text":"好我的問題是這樣子第一個在160案這個地方主要是在你的福島貿易檢案雖然計畫經費不多但是我是希望說因為你們是就是說以這樣的錢到底是做什麼其實我是覺得倒不如就是產發署去幫你多做一點"},{"start":12198.863,"end":12220.756,"text":"其實你就可以不要做了因為你講的那些什麼碳稅什麼對外規格然後歐盟什麼這些其實那些西蹦都是在產發署環境部這些東西在執行啊對不對我其實有隨便問你一個範疇一範疇二範疇三你也回答不出來啊你怎麼去輔導我又不是不了解你們國貿署"},{"start":12222.583,"end":12242.389,"text":"你產發署是最熟的所以我說我也不是說因為錢少你看我不是因為大小的關係我是認為預算合不合理啊放在你這一個單位那是不是因為可能當初是在一個低碳大帽子底下然後各單位都被迫要投入嘛 是吧我是要幫承辦人員講話因為他們點頭如搗蒜"},{"start":12247.835,"end":12274.976,"text":"因為我太了解了啦所以我是比較直接切在刀口上所以我並不是阻止你做而是我覺得你拿這點預算不適合做因為其實在我們國內碳稅的話基本上你碳費增加然後這些東西我輸出到歐盟的時候那你歐盟跟美國的規格又不一樣這件事情要先解決啊你不要我國內繳了碳費然後到了歐盟我還在繳碳稅我是撥兩成皮這個問題要被解啊"},{"start":12275.576,"end":12296.963,"text":"這才是我們產業的關鍵至於說你要去找幫他整理這些各國單位的資料其實產發組去整理或者是委託你整理其實就夠了所以我覺得你應該要把這件事情如果你要做就要講得很清楚了倒不是預算大小我是覺得對你來講有點負荷太重了那162"},{"start":12299.619,"end":12324.922,"text":"伊朗烈士A案的話呢這個我剛聽你的說明說實在的也是很為難你啦就是說因為你們現在是運用數位性貿易的模式的一個計畫當然你這邊就會因為我很討厭看到這種東西導入AI技術並打造中小企業數據貿易平台又來了其實我們經濟部很多平台然後每個人都跟我講AI AI AI"},{"start":12325.814,"end":12354.094,"text":"那你到底是要解決什麼問題啊這問題的確要讓AI解嘛然後你們拿出來的東西那個在我審查委員或是以前我做計畫的角度160萬你都告訴我說輔導多少家次使用什麼人使用什麼人使用那個對我來講那個對我來講叫output你可能連outcome都沒有就是我用了這個東西對我廠商真正的幫助是什麼"},{"start":12356.16,"end":12380.203,"text":"這個才是我想要看到的啊以前在我們常常被經濟部K的嘛對不對經濟部常常說你們就只會output啊然後outcome啊你們自己寫的東西就這樣子啊然後就要求法人那奇怪我就覺得你們的啊你瞎說對不對我們就用部長就看了那162社你看他們越來了服務900家事業者使用平台然後效益不明啊"},{"start":12381.325,"end":12394.396,"text":"那你委辦是委辦誰做啊?110這個是委辦費啊?這多少錢?這外報單位歷屆是誰?貿協貿協,秘書長今天也在貿協嘛,對嘛貿協會做AI技術導入然後可以打造數據這個我也是覺得很壓抑啊這個我只是要讓你說這個預算的"},{"start":12403.516,"end":12427.632,"text":"因為有很多錢所以也是要合理使用那第三個是智慧會展的領航的計畫這裡因為這個很多年了來這個做幾年了如果從前面的中程綱要來講我們第一期是11到114年之前沒有嗎114開始111到114可是我怎麼記得以前還是有一個這種東西"},{"start":12433.959,"end":12443.966,"text":"在更早之前雖然不是叫這個名字就是什麼智慧會長 智慧導覽就是會長的科技你懂我意思吧來 你說明"},{"start":12446.016,"end":12463.941,"text":"報告主席是那個那時候因為COVID的關係然後不能出去那時候我們就用我們的其他計畫來做一個服務對啊對那時候是放在另外一個放在那個因為我印象中是因為我有接觸過對應該是那時候的會長科技之類的後來做了之後那個會那個"},{"start":12466.872,"end":12495.431,"text":"會員他們覺得很好所以我們才另外起一個機會那我這邊的問題就是說你的這個使用性擴散性比較不夠啦就你剛剛講的例子叫工具機工具只是一個台灣不只工具機台灣還有紡織什麼的所以你除非是告訴我們說你的四年期的中鋼你在這個當中第一個是focus在哪些領域的業者比如說紡織還是自行車還是什麼一個一個一個一個這樣下去的好不好是"},{"start":12496.011,"end":12521.941,"text":"我沒有說不支持但我是覺得你的這個預算跟執行的問題OK我們除了剛剛只是舉工具機啦像五金啦 像紡織啦 像扣件我們其實都有導入對 但是成效啦就是你不要給我output啦因為你們剛剛寫的東西讓我看起來就是不是很好好不好 回答的東西好 趙偉所說的其實我也很贊同就是說怎麼樣子讓這個碳稅喔"},{"start":12523.902,"end":12538.887,"text":"就是說不要說國內已經課了以後到了歐盟未來還要再課那對於相關的產業等等這些永續的這個目標還有應該要有成效就是說成效就是不要讓廠商重複課稅"},{"start":12540.267,"end":12556.547,"text":"那怎麼樣把這個碳稅可以留在台灣嗎那這個部分就是說應該要朝這樣子這個方向去進行那也要麻煩那個昭瑋就是說這個部分是不是我們就看是簡略還是就是說凍結就快點處理好"},{"start":12559.991,"end":12568.454,"text":"我是這樣子 邱委員很簡單講30秒 你說導入扣減 這邊是傳統產業這個傳統產業面對西本的相關的徵收邊境的碳稅哪些產業比較嚴重傳統像鋼鐵產業就相當的嚴重"},{"start":12586.972,"end":12604.231,"text":"對啊 因為鋼鐵很多都是在南部啊扣件跟鋼鐵相關嘛上下游嘛所以這部分你要趕快導入避免說到歐洲很多都是銷歐洲啊像歐洲跟美國是主要市場所以這部分我有希望這個劉書長能夠再加強力道"},{"start":12607.374,"end":12629.171,"text":"協助這個廠商來能夠能夠把這個西邊的問題解決所以我是不建請這個委員會是不是我們就捉動那可以支持因為這個主要是用在協助廠商這個刀口上面如果這個沒有過廠商會會比較辛苦一點我稍微說明一下我沒有我剛"},{"start":12630.56,"end":12643.592,"text":"我也讓邱委員知道其實你叫國貿署做這個有點辛苦啦我是說應該這種碳稅應該是在產發署做比較對你即使不動它原部招列467萬能做什麼I don't believe"},{"start":12645.848,"end":12662.56,"text":"好我的意思是說探索很重要應該是產方署去多付出這樣的東西啦好不好我的意思是這樣好然後整個第一幕這邊的話我們就是呃全部整個動一千萬然後你們提書面報告時的動之好不好就這一幕"},{"start":12665.137,"end":12682.505,"text":"動計1000萬然後加書面報告後10個動次好接下來我們進行這個第三幕主要是在164到177好那其中的話呢164案賴銳榮改組決議166案邱志偉委員改組決議167案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議168案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議170案李玉琳委員改組決議"},{"start":12694.571,"end":12712.735,"text":"然後174案邱志偉委員改組決議176案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議177案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議目前提案的委員有我跟楊瓊英委員主要是在171 172那請這一個國防署說出名"},{"start":12720.362,"end":12723.047,"text":"是 謝謝委員 171 跟 172 主要是在我們的一個"},{"start":12729.016,"end":12757.935,"text":"促進國際觀光消費的這個計劃那這個計劃其實是一個新興計劃那在預算沒有通過之前沒有辦法執行所以呢我們當初在規劃的時候大概從年初開始我們有盤點大概有80個展會但是如果從這個預算過之後我們還要需要一些時間公開招標然後執行可能也大概需要兩個月的時間所以的確在執行面完成這個"},{"start":12759.796,"end":12770.782,"text":"整體的這個這個預算 元劣數的確是有他的困難在 所以這個跟委員報告我們請楊瓊英委員發言謝謝主席 楊瓊英發言 我們看到這個"},{"start":12777.625,"end":12794.287,"text":"你們所提出的國際協議的這個HCA的部分那你三年內你從111年到113年這個在整體性你是有增加一名你從30名提升來29名增加一名但是我們看到的是亞洲排名"},{"start":12795.612,"end":12811.738,"text":"我們是亞洲很驕傲的國家耶但是我們亞洲的排名是從114年的第五名降到112 113我們是降到第七名我們是退步兩名耶亞洲地區退步兩名部長這該當怎麼辦"},{"start":12814.349,"end":12830.109,"text":"對不對 這我們要怎麼樣去思考我們要去怎麼樣去思考像我們台中我們一直努力的不是會展中心 這個是我們賣血很強的那我們也去日本大阪跟 趕快去看"},{"start":12831.01,"end":12856.115,"text":"我們可以這樣學習 接下來要在阿拉伯那我們要怎麼樣去學習嘛那至少你自己亞洲區我們是在降那這個部分我們提案的目的就是希望聽到你們說在我們自己亞洲區我們降一次又一一二一一三我們竟然再降了兩名這個是嚴肅的一個議題我們要怎麼樣去協助那你方案要怎麼樣去改"},{"start":12856.835,"end":12878.295,"text":"哪有這個會這樣子降的 我不知道原因是什麼 我要聽的是這個我跟署長跟部長再提醒一下 再確認一下這是新興計畫 稅法安全還沒有動之剛剛聽署長說全年度有80個會展 立法院通過三讀"},{"start":12880.97,"end":12906.418,"text":"那你還要招標所以招標出去也不見得會招標出去那你現在已經經過了會展已經辦完了會展還有幾個已經辦完了會展還有幾個目前到年底你們盤點還有幾個會展所以你這兩億是編整年度對不對是那已經過去了你現在我如果這個預算通過給你那你可以執行嘛我意思說後面剩下兩個兩三個月的時間"},{"start":12909.816,"end":12938.673,"text":"兩三個月時間你還有幾個會展你需要那麼多錢嗎?或者你的錢你執行的完畢嗎?跟委員報告其實沒有辦法執行完畢因為我們盤點過這個大概那你告訴我你告訴我你告訴我需要多少錢?到年底如果八月最快八月九月通過你還要三讀欸還要招標欸你看看好啦我給你四個月好了八九十十一十二九十十一十二"},{"start":12940.683,"end":12960.934,"text":"大概你要需要多少經費 如果我讓你全部通過的話我是怕你不能執行了這可能 部長你可能要了解一下是 跟委員報告 如果7月通過的話那我們大概會使用的預算大概是4880萬那如果是8月的話 大概是2570萬"},{"start":12965.626,"end":12989.18,"text":"來 鍾嘉賓委員主席我看到主席的1171的提案其實這裡面第二段的那些指出的重點我都相當認同就是說大家都同意要促進國際展會觀光消費那也這個編了新興計畫那因為我們預算的審議的延宕如果在去年審議完略剛剛邱委員所說的 邱召惠所說的"},{"start":12989.6,"end":13007.621,"text":"那這個計畫的兩億元呢就可以充分的用在今年那今年有什麼事情呢其實我在這邊也可以呼應一下我們很多在場的委員都是國際福倫的社友過去這五天啊就是國際福倫大會在台北市召開啊那有多少人來"},{"start":13008.732,"end":13034.406,"text":"那這些人我昨天為了搭捷運回大安會館回宿舍在捷運上就看到很多顯然不是本國人的這些國際他們都穿著有大臉的紅色的服裝那如果說今年類似像這樣大型的年會有這樣的計畫預算的挹注我相信台灣可以更加爭取更多更多的國際會展在台灣舉辦我相信蔣萬恩市長一定很開心"},{"start":13035.226,"end":13062.006,"text":"當年我們國際扶輪總會選擇今年在台北召開國際大會那我相信未來如果這個預算能夠執行的話我們台中市楊瓊議員也可以去爭取啊我們彰化也可以爭取啊高雄也可以爭取啊台南也可以爭取啊這些國際性的大型會展來台灣辦理可以促進我們當地多少的消費跟我們的一個經濟成長所以我相信啊這個計畫大家是肯定的但是陳儒主席召委所提出的就是說這個"},{"start":13063.663,"end":13082.999,"text":"他要精準的鎖定高價值買主以及國際採購商我是覺得這樣的計畫內容的確是可以有分層次的去表達哪些是屬於像什麼福倫社這種來的他就是參加國際年會來的他的消費是一種第二種是買家他本身來參加台灣的各種會展"},{"start":13083.379,"end":13107.747,"text":"它停留的越久它可能對於台灣產業下的訂單就越多那我是建議呢剛剛主席的那個指出的內容呢是不是未來在這個預算我們通過我是希望說能夠全力的支持但是你們在執行的內容上呢的確要分出客源那我最後還是很遺憾的如果這個預算是去年就通過的話那今年台北啊或者台中啊更多的國際會展會在台灣舉辦"},{"start":13111.856,"end":13129.573,"text":"我問你啊我真的很誠實的問你你也誠實回答因為剛剛我為什麼一開始寫檢列五千萬除了剛剛嘉賓委員講的另外我又考到邱委員的這一個方向因為我來自法人我都清楚我剛剛一開始在今天的會議都說過動是凌遲"},{"start":13133.704,"end":13154.789,"text":"所以他剛剛在講我是怕你們預算執行不利我現在是說如果在這邊的話你是說比如說建議我們刪多少剩下是你可以如期執行完的是我們耽誤審查就變成預算執行不利你要動嗎你們預算審查不是執行不利好不好"},{"start":13158.629,"end":13180.16,"text":"他執行得了就對了我這樣建議因為我的提案我覺得我剛剛大家不要歪樓樓我是希望我們在亞洲區我們目前是往後延兩年往後延兩名這個是一個嚴肅的議題我們要怎麼樣去調整我們的腳步你至少在亞洲區我們都延後那我怎麼去世界打仗"},{"start":13181.617,"end":13200.133,"text":"這個很重要我們支持這個預算但是你要有方法因為我點出我們是退步兩民112 113在111年是如此那我們更應該有預算更要去精進方案所以我這樣建議大家通通討論我建議就這個動我們這個是這個"},{"start":13205.185,"end":13227.189,"text":"我建議凍結兩千萬然後你們必須要將方案提出來因為全民在看而且就是說希望說不只是只有北部然後中部或者是南部也應該要加強這個推廣好不好是因為我覺得中南部啦好不好中南部啦 真的"},{"start":13230.776,"end":13259.375,"text":"好這邊的話我們就是針對這邊就是動就是這個171案嘛對不對171就是一直到後面了啦到177就是動兩千萬啦好不好我尊重主委你怎麼尊重我決議但是你如果動那兩千萬那可以動一億八對不對他可以使用一億八齁他動一億八勢必是沒有辦法用到那麼多錢"},{"start":13261.038,"end":13289.507,"text":"那都會 會截繳國庫嘛齁但是你們會有一個問題會變執行一算不利不會有這個問題嗎不會啦不會啦我剛問過不會好 所以我們這邊就是動兩千萬書面報告之後同意動之好不好好 謝謝來來好 可以了 來信息齁我們組結一齁一百組結一百七十萬"},{"start":13292.216,"end":13320.509,"text":"遵照辦理 照案通過179遵照辦理 照案通過180遵照辦理 照案通過181遵照辦理 照案通過182遵照辦理 照案通過183遵照辦理好 照案通過 接下來我們審經濟部水利署及所屬謝謝委員跟早委我們審全部一起來好了 這邊都是第一幕對不對它只有一幕"},{"start":13326.352,"end":13349.978,"text":"第一幕184案的話這個賴樂永委員改組決議所以我們在案通過第二幕一般行政180案鄭天才委員改組決議所以我們預算在列通過第三幕水利建設及保育管理主要是從186到"},{"start":13358.222,"end":13360.967,"text":"194這裡我們先看好那186案的話賴業文改組決議"},{"start":13363.968,"end":13373.336,"text":"再來的話是189案楊瓊英委員這邊改組決議190案楊瓊英委員改組決議191案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議193案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議194案鍾嘉斌委員改組決議好我先停在這邊所以各位委員有沒有什麼要表達"},{"start":13389.909,"end":13392.491,"text":"沒有好接下來我們繼續195-206"},{"start":13399.096,"end":13406.061,"text":"那其中193宗嘉賓委員改組決議193宗嘉賓委員改組決議198邱志偉委員改組決議199邱志偉委員改組決議再來是203宗嘉賓委員改組決議204蔡奕宇委員改組決議在場的有楊全英委員在197案跟這個第205案的提案"},{"start":13425.756,"end":13426.701,"text":"那我自己是202,我們先請這個業務單位說明"},{"start":13429.858,"end":13459.094,"text":"好 謝謝關於197案是楊瓊委員所提的那特別指出來就是我目前在全省所設置的淹水感知器還有CCTV這兩個一般在做淹水的調查的部分妥善率偏低那目前妥善率這整體是86那認為說有些地點它的一個效果沒有特別好那我特別要跟委員報告就是說"},{"start":13459.734,"end":13486.511,"text":"事實上針對CCTV跟淹水感知器確實是我們目前積極推動的重點那我們會加強來改善因為這個是我們補助給縣市政府辦理的那當然這個妥善偏低的原因很多尤其像網路在颱風天的狀況網路也可能比較不穩定還有一些電子設備電池等等那這個我們列為未來的一個推動重點但是在這邊因為我們整個"},{"start":13488.732,"end":13514.29,"text":"治水的預算在這邊有列196億那真正其實用在我們這個智慧的一個剛剛講的這個案件其實不到5億只有4.98億而已那楊委員這邊是希望說希望我們這邊看能不能不要凍結讓我們改成組決議因為這個也是我們未來要推動的方向在197案這個案件以上報告"},{"start":13519.293,"end":13545.528,"text":"197跟205我個人提案我一併講因為同一個幕那這個197案主管單位我們提案的目的是要你怎麼去改善你的執行率不佳的情況而不是告訴我們說比較不穩因為照數字會講話你現在有252個曾經淹過水的村民你還沒有你缺漏的設備"},{"start":13546.568,"end":13575.772,"text":"你還沒有 你還沒有那所以呢 隱私監視的部分呢平均率你是86%那還有更嚴肅的在彰化是你只有不到六成耶你不要欺負我們中部人對 我們怎麼會弄你啊對 你要我們提這個案的目的是什麼 等一下你聽完喔 不好意思目的就是說你到底你要怎麼去改善啊是我們中部不到六成 你欺負我們中部人嘛我當然要提案啊對 我了解對不對 對 對 要怎麼改善"},{"start":13576.232,"end":13600.759,"text":"我跟各位報告 我們現在一國一國都開了一個平台會議這個保温也是我們未來要來力促改善的部分對啊 你怎麼可以這樣一直欺負我們中部人啊平均值86% 我中部不到6成這是第一個 然後第二個 205案205案就是地下水的這個地層下陷的這個問題 我們一併講喔那你們在防治的部分"},{"start":13602.26,"end":13625.998,"text":"預算都給 但是不如你的預期你今天編列預算連你自己的KPI你都達不到那我們會高度質疑我們到底是錢給太多還是因為你的方法不對這兩個都必須要去檢討所以我們才會提出這樣子因為地層下限這個是在我們台灣海島型國家裡頭很重要的課題"},{"start":13627.599,"end":13641.491,"text":"這個預算我們從來沒上過耶但是你一直你的答案是達不到你自己設定的KPI這講不過去而且這是人民非常關注的這個議題所以我要聽的是說"},{"start":13642.512,"end":13659.834,"text":"你的方法當然知道同仁都很辛苦但是你方法要怎麼去調整啊就像你197案你說比較不穩你比較不穩現在科技資訊這麼發達你還是要用很low的很low的當然是不穩嘛那你應該要去調整嘛"},{"start":13661.261,"end":13668.105,"text":"對不對 你要去調整啊 你不調整你每一年預算來這樣子 我們怎麼省啊而且還欺負我們中部人委員報告齁 這個197案 其實主要都是管一政府 我們補助而已因為他的一個維護管理 確實我們現在每個月有開平台會在督促我們沒看到問題點 我們自己自建的沒有問題"},{"start":13682.992,"end":13697.784,"text":"我告訴你齁 今天預算是編在你這裡我們看的是面對的 至於你們去執行 怎麼樣去執行一旦你發覺執行率哪裡有問題 你要怎麼去調整啊為什麼平均值86% 我們這樣子 你要說地方政府怎麼樣這個是我們的責任啦 我們督導的責任 黨代替調整你的腳步啦 這第一個 第二個就是那個205那個"},{"start":13708.112,"end":13728.259,"text":"報告委員 205這一個部分其實趨勢是往下的 趨勢是有的但是因為在這個110跟112這兩年剛好遇到大旱那像 所以它的一個顯著的地層下陷區就變大事實上像114年 我們是零喔"},{"start":13729.319,"end":13748.365,"text":"等一下那個主管單位在這裡我們在討論預算的時候是代表人民我們當點出問題點你要告訴我們你的問題點要怎麼去解決要不是你拿一個114連是零的來跟我搪塞你其他不足的這個是我沒有辦法接受的我請主管機關單位 部長"},{"start":13752.126,"end":13779.668,"text":"對不對我們今天點出問題你要回復我們的問題而不是拿一個來蓋一個帽子啊這不對的其實我跟委員報告是說因為疫情效應防治所以討論到現在因為這個氣候變遷等等的這些相關因素但是我們點出這個就是台灣要安全我們地方要安全嘛大家都要安全嘛那所以呢你們要嚴格的去審視不管是方法"},{"start":13780.228,"end":13789.373,"text":"或者是稽查的這個時間點都必須要因為有時候一夕間整個改變了這沒有辦法去想像的現在這個氣候變遷的這個議題所以那個主席針對197跟205尤其針對197我可以改成主決議但是我要請你們將你們我們剛才討論的方案"},{"start":13805.842,"end":13823.83,"text":"的問題點 你們方案要怎麼去調整尤其我們中部地區不能只有 是是這個六成以下 一定的分地層下限要怎麼去改善資是 非常謝謝 好不好我們會來努力 把你的方向要怎麼做 順便知道出來順便這是你的197改組決議那205呢好197205是一樣"},{"start":13836.67,"end":13846.223,"text":"主決議吧是非常謝謝委員我們會來努力好我的是202案因為主要這一個的話是"},{"start":13848.511,"end":13867.24,"text":"針對你們寫的這些東西我感受的就是關心的就是你們這裡頭是所謂的就是水災智慧防災計畫的第二期所以這裡頭會用到很多的科技的一些的設備那這些的設備來講的話呢基本上"},{"start":13868.752,"end":13891.763,"text":"大概你們就是告訴我這些數量的進階數有多服務但是其實我們用系統是要能夠看出成效所以我覺得這個成效就過去來講還是很多的問題比如說冰水的即時通報、抽水機調度或者是你的整個這個預警的資訊的落差所以基本上來講在你的設備妥適率"},{"start":13892.964,"end":13907.422,"text":"甚至是說你的這整個數據的統計分析到即時的這樣子的傳達我覺得這一塊的智慧化的防災系統在你們現在做出來的東西一點都不即時也不智慧"},{"start":13908.519,"end":13929.887,"text":"所以為什麼我是希望你們好好重新 因為這筆錢是很多錢啊所以我才說小動 我是支持但是我希望看到的書面報告是說你應該把這整個智慧的系統 然後你到底要改善的東西是什麼我們來努力對啊 好 那這整個幕看起來的話我看一下"},{"start":13933.803,"end":13961.335,"text":"我們就動一整幕啦因為一整幕 第三幕這樣比較好多一點不要只動第四節剛剛第三節應該都改組決議嘛對不對好 我們整個這一個第三幕水利建設跟保育管理我們就動你一千萬就好但是你就是針對你的這些房災還有剛剛楊泉委員這樣的東西那你事務報告提完 使得動之好不好謝謝委員 我們來努力"},{"start":13963.817,"end":13967.045,"text":"謝謝 非常謝謝委員 我們來努力好 接下來我們進到組決議的部分那組決議這邊的話 207"},{"start":13973.075,"end":13982.961,"text":"我們遵照辦理 將通過208遵照辦理 將通過209遵照辦理 將通過210遵照辦理 將通過211遵照辦理 將通過212已經經過委員修正文字所以212修正通過213遵照辦理 將通過214遵照辦理 將通過215遵照辦理 將通過216遵照辦理 將通過217遵照辦理 將通過"},{"start":14002.673,"end":14029.046,"text":"218委員同意修正修正通過219委員同意修正再修正通過220委員同意修正再修正通過221委員同意修正再修正通過222遵照辦理好 再通過223遵照辦理再通過224遵照辦理 再通過非常謝謝委員接下來進行經濟幣地質 地礦中心"},{"start":14031.029,"end":14043.151,"text":"主要是第一幕225到229其中225萬賴日穩委員改組決議 226萬鍾嘉斌委員改組決議228案李玉琳委員改組決議 229案邱穎穎委員改組決議在場的是楊瓊英委員 請這一個地況中心主任說明"},{"start":14056.414,"end":14070.289,"text":"好 召委還有委員那定況中心針對委員關心的活動斷層劃設的進度部分因為活動斷層有一些都在延復性或是滿斷層其實需要"},{"start":14073.593,"end":14091.827,"text":"科學的數據還有專家這個諮詢會議的支撐所以說這幾年來我們都陸續按照進度在辦理這些相關的活動斷層的專家會議那局需要這個科目的經費來支持以上"},{"start":14096.558,"end":14111.672,"text":"我想安全是最重要的 因為我們經歷過了921 知道那個痛苦921包括中橫 我從經歷過20年之後 我開始每一年問可不可以動了 可不可以動了 我們每一年就這樣問"},{"start":14112.933,"end":14126.808,"text":"那終於問到第26年說可以動了所以公路局相關單位也編列預算 逐步也沒有辦法一次到位 逐步所以這個歷程 這個過程讓我們一方面也也這個"},{"start":14128.578,"end":14128.718,"text":"委員 已經"},{"start":14158.778,"end":14182.533,"text":"公告到27處了什麼時候27處去年有公告新增因為我給你統計以往你109年到110年是一處嘛你到114年的部分呢112到114就是7月的這個部分呢那是去年的7月是7處嘛那你現在是在增加兩處那去年底有公告新增兩處大跑譜"},{"start":14184.674,"end":14208.571,"text":"大毛埔所以你現在就是等於是7處還有9處那你現在原本你公告的在公告的活動的部分是25處但是我看到你如果以這樣平均值是每一年大概1到3處我不知道你們在專業的在進行當中當你公告一個公告一個25處"},{"start":14213.234,"end":14241.072,"text":"活的在那邊但是人民會害怕可是我們的過程是平均只是一到三處的一個公告嘛到你們現在的進度啊有沒有可能速度可以加快去確認我不知道方案因為我是代表人民人民的害怕我明明知道這25個是有問題的可是你們沒有最後去確認那這一段時間要經過了那麼久會影響到人民"},{"start":14242.045,"end":14269.038,"text":"整個的生活他的安心感還有也會影響到整個都市計畫有則也不行因為不能不安全那無則那一直擺在那裡所以這是人民的心聲所以我提這個案目的就是希望你們到底可以怎麼樣因為現在的這個科技方法越來越好是不是還有精進的空間"},{"start":14270.419,"end":14297.793,"text":"是不是 是你要不要再回答一下包委員喔 生下九處的活動斷層我剛剛有特別跟委員報告大部分都是在掩附性的或是在盲斷 蠻斷層那掩附性的大部分都在都會區所以說上面都已經有一些建築物要去做專探真的要取得很多科學的數據"},{"start":14299.054,"end":14315.975,"text":"還有專家諮詢的意見那這些我們都很慎重每年都有辦一些專家會議在持續在精進這個方面來做一些公告那主席這個經過充分討論我可以就是說"},{"start":14317.915,"end":14332.785,"text":"本來是要凍結20%那因為現在有很多的技術方案等可以去精進那我還有一個要求就是說你公告的在那邊活的在那邊那你是不是可以適度更清楚的告訴人民不要讓他們怕"},{"start":14334.426,"end":14358.144,"text":"你講過一個說他有的 大家要去那邊也怕死對不對 那我們要怎麼樣方法就像您剛才說的 他可能是會重複性還是怎麼樣越多的資訊給民眾 民眾越不會怕嘛 好不好那是不是這樣子 主席 我建議是不是著動一點然後他們去提經濟方案 好不好那是不是我們著動兩百萬 然後順便報告動詞這樣子"},{"start":14361.607,"end":14364.816,"text":"是 好那有什麼主要是這個嗎 了解 謝謝委員"},{"start":14365.936,"end":14382.4,"text":"那我們第一幕的話 我們就是整個動200萬 交出面報告之後 使得動之好 第三幕 地質調查跟礦業管理 主要230案到233案那230案 賴銳榮委員改組決議231案 陳廷輝委員改組決議 232案 鍾嘉斌委員改組決議 233案 邱志偉委員改組決議邱志偉委員"},{"start":14394.21,"end":14422.82,"text":"2333先請主任說明一下好先請主任說明這個部分我跟委員報告委員關心的大概就是砂石碎解區間廠的一些監督管理還有一些包括我們礦業回饋金的撥放情形那砂石碎解區間廠管理的部分過去這個我們在數字上已經改善到已經八成都已經監督完成"},{"start":14423.28,"end":14439.97,"text":"而且監察院也解除列管這個部分是有精進的部分那礦產權益金的這個回饋金的撥放我們去年是撥放第一年那成效也都有按照進度在執行以上"},{"start":14443.508,"end":14467.554,"text":"這個629萬不多你們主要執勤是在縣市政府所以你要請縣市政府做第一線的管理所以全國那麼多沙士廠你這個人員有限 預算有限所以比較想對縣市政府的協助所以有一些有一些狀況可能主要你要先去了解內部的相關的這個處理相關的狀況"},{"start":14470.799,"end":14497.412,"text":"不要說全部都副主任都是組長在執行所以有時候你要更了解委員製導了我們都了解會中心在推動業務的相關狀況你要每一項都要非常清楚好那我這一件還是維持主決議所以一樣好維持主決議所以在第三幕這個預算策略通過在我們針對主決議234案"},{"start":14501.724,"end":14527.653,"text":"這個文字有作修正委員同意了 好依修正通過 235 遵照辦 照案通過好接下來的話我們審理經濟部能源署的部分第七款其他收入這裡 原列1680萬 張家俊委員不在好 照案通過 再來稅出"},{"start":14529.761,"end":14546.187,"text":"第十一項能源署這裡的237案預算照列吧 預算照列再來的話 第十一項能源署這邊237案賴樂永委員改組決議"},{"start":14551.971,"end":14559.695,"text":"好再來的話我們看第一幕能源科技的部分總共這個比較多238到255那其中的話呢240案241、242、243、244、245、246均改成主決議"},{"start":14580.319,"end":14596.071,"text":"好 那其他大概都是我的還有239239對 還有楊瓊英委員還有楊瓊英委員有沒有謝玉鳳委員妳有沒有啊 妳是改組決議對 我改組決議 那楊瓊英委員她改 她改凍結5%凍結5%"},{"start":14613.507,"end":14632.52,"text":"好來就我的案子先說明一下招委的部分我跟招委說明一下那個247案的那個部分那個部分大概就是執行那個整個因為我們這個目是人力科技計畫所以他是去規劃那個人力科技計畫的藍圖的那一塊就是說那後面的部分就開始就是個別一些科技計畫包括"},{"start":14634.201,"end":14655.194,"text":"249案是我們在那個興達那邊有一個海創特區那那個就是培養專門的比如說海事人才比如說像離岸風力的還有一些實驗室深水池的實驗室這個是249案那250案的部分是我們在台南沙崙有一個綠營科技城的示範區那這個部分我們有個專業委託案"},{"start":14656.515,"end":14680.327,"text":"那另外251案的這個部分是因為我們現在有一些像海事工程還有一些離岸風力還有一些福祉風機那我們現在要把它結合起來要發展出一些系統性的一些示範還有運維技術這個部分我們現在250就是委員問到這個部分那另外253案的部分是說因為我們現在還是到因為台灣是一個孤立電網"},{"start":14681.027,"end":14698.12,"text":"到最終我們還是會有一些活力電廠那勢必要搭配的CCS這個技術那所以我們現在在發展這相關的一些技術同時在探尋說台灣有哪些安廠未來可能是有機會做Storage的廠子那255萬這個部分就是因為我們現在輕的應用"},{"start":14700.201,"end":14717.261,"text":"就是邱子維也很關心的氫能用現在大概有兩大塊一個是鞍的部分那氫的部分我們之前有在做那鞍的部分我們現在起了一個新的計畫就是說未來這個鞍怎麼先轉成氫然後氫再用到燃料電池那這個整個技術運用那以上報告"},{"start":14719.582,"end":14744.835,"text":"好我這整個為什麼會提這麼多案子因為我對能源科技因為從以前在能源署不管在做這些能源科技或者是這個虛量反應等等的話其實我參與蠻多的那基本上來講對這些東西的一個發展我倒是覺得說因為你們這些東西有很多是因為政策性的配合的要求"},{"start":14746.479,"end":14767.899,"text":"懂了是吧我不用說太明白沒關係你不用回答政治性的配合要求那我們當然這些法人等等去執行這些的一些能源科技的研發但是事實上來講這我從事這麼多年來講我覺得比較有效果的研發成果是在我們的智慧電網的韌線跟這個虛量反應的這個調度"},{"start":14773.545,"end":14789.819,"text":"這兩塊來講在過去這幾年會做比較多但反而是在新興能源科技就是新興的能源科技產生性能量的話其實這個的效率或是績效並不是那麼的好你懂我意思吧我想要表達的是這一點那當然"},{"start":14792.322,"end":14813.539,"text":"這裡頭還牽扯到一些像我們所在的高雄的海洋科技啦南部的這些的沙崙等等其實我對這些地區我當然沒什麼意見我唯一等一下邱志偉會發言我唯一對沙崙比較感興趣你知道沙崙塞了多少東西你知道嗎沙崙這個地區塞了多少橡木你知道嗎"},{"start":14815.004,"end":14828.876,"text":"我們的確不知道我們知道啦我們是D區是做能源因為我們負責大項目啦我說綠能是一個啦沙羅還有生技還有AI還有資安還有無人機還有機器人"},{"start":14830.827,"end":14852.65,"text":"所以就是說你在這個沙原地區當然我知道這也是像你應該是委託公研院嘛對不對這邊在執行所以就是說當你在一個複合型地區的時候你投入的時候它是不是真正有達到那個績效或者是不是符合那一塊地區的一個發展的宗旨這個是你們要去考慮的這個大概我以上表達我們再請邱志偉委員"},{"start":14854.68,"end":14872.726,"text":"這個沙輪如果塞不進去 要往南移一下入竹湖內 或者甚至是橋頭那邊還有一些產業用地因為剛剛主席關心249案這個高雄海洋科技產業創新園區因為您提檢列"},{"start":14876.414,"end":14888.983,"text":"明天見你也看得我心驚落跳因為新台積溫暖心的這個要講三十分鐘以上我講三十分鐘這十年前我認出的因為數字沒那麼低十年前"},{"start":14893.466,"end":14915.534,"text":"這個計畫然後推動到凍土到興建完成到營運我深深的感情 十幾年了葉外山坑在那裡 可能祖密有去過這個 我每天在那裡玩所以這個培育出了山中心我們有山中心 培育很多的海事人才"},{"start":14916.893,"end":14938.755,"text":"國內外的海事人才所以你只要是海事相關的人才訓練都去山中心所以山中心扮演非常重要的培育的角色訓練的一個場所你稍微可以找個時間去看一下去考察一下我可以幫你導覽的山中心那個做一些水工模擬那些都非常的專業"},{"start":14940.756,"end":14963.268,"text":"而且是國內唯一所以我是覺得這個部分也謝謝這個這個昭偉支持 主席支持這個部分我們是不是就也不要簡列也不要凍結因為經費是不多但是你要扮演非常重要的角色就讓他有一個比較完整聰明的預算來執行相關海洋科技的人才的培育"},{"start":14964.855,"end":14993.366,"text":"不是我是支持我只是說為什麼編在能源署這樣子因為他寫的是那種跟能源科技沒關係他寫的是土地啊實驗室辦公室宿舍會議課程他是你的法人嗎還是什麼對因為這個是金工中心負責去運為啊那所以委託營運的那所以我們這個計畫是有含委託營運還有說他因為他有辦理一些那個課程的授課那些都在那為什麼要掛在能源署啊"},{"start":14994.178,"end":15010.636,"text":"因為我們要發展相關能源科技本來就要這些海事工資成的資源包括以後我們做福斯風機因為那邊我們有一個深水池那邊在全世界只有四顆那些實驗室都是以後能源署管的福斯風機要用的一些設備好"},{"start":15011.877,"end":15037.626,"text":"我對這樣子沒有理解我只是為什麼寫簡列是因為我覺得它跟你的這一個這一個署的業務目的不是很合乎啊因為它算是一個海訓啊海事人才的中心嘛對不對所以基本上我想像的應該就是比如說海洋科技啊對不對然後不管是這個有的沒有的啦但是我說跟淨零碳排再生能源科技我是"},{"start":15038.834,"end":15054.663,"text":"所以我才會這樣子砍你一千萬的意思是這樣好那我想綜合剛剛這整個因為我們是從木的角度來看我想這一個第一木這邊十億的話楊瓊瑩委員在239這邊動5個多少錢啊5300我們動整個木動一千太誇張了吧"},{"start":15072.148,"end":15093.401,"text":"這樣好不好 這個 因為楊全偉他是動百分之五我稍微再幫你們求情一下我們整個 整個這樣下動三千萬然後你趕快去寫書面報告這樣好不好好 謝謝昌偉書面報告沒有沒有沒有 我是說就是這項目嘛項目自行調整這樣可以嗎好 謝謝昌偉那個"},{"start":15101.144,"end":15108.132,"text":"不用解釋了第三幕能源發展與管理這邊主要是256到268這裡那其中的話258改組決議"},{"start":15118.902,"end":15125.008,"text":"然後262宗教兵委員組決議263邱志偉委員組決議264宗教兵委員改組決議267宗教兵委員改組決議然後我的268案跟269案也改組決議好但是我先說268跟269案的組決議請你不要照"},{"start":15145.458,"end":15172.477,"text":"不要照那個我們上面這樣寫我是要你教求完整的這一個報告根據我預算需求提案的東西我一點對你們非常的不開心就是我們寫那麼多預算需求提案寫了那麼久了我們七點辦公室才收到你們的整個雙關說明的檔案好抱歉這個跟委員說我們作業上內部我們以後管智商會好一點抱歉"},{"start":15173.772,"end":15193.943,"text":"還是說我的報告所知都要行政院列管所以你們速度比較慢因為別人都有啊所以我是說你的書面加到昨天晚上7點我才拿到啊所以你給我好好寫是是是楊瓊英委員的256我還沒玩對現在的話要再來回過頭256楊瓊英委員"},{"start":15204.585,"end":15211.134,"text":"好來那個先鋒委員你有要補充他要改組決議他改256案改組決議其他在場的來針對265案的話"},{"start":15222.526,"end":15244.324,"text":"請你說明一下好了跟委員報告 跟召委報告一下那個265萬那個部分是我們就是去補助中油去做地熱的鑽探的工作那因為現在我們整個地熱的發展那個國營是要帶頭那現在其實國營上有一個趨勢就是油公司他為了要轉型"},{"start":15245.305,"end":15259.426,"text":"所以他也是積極去發展相關的低熱工作所以這個部分主要前容就是要交給中油去做低熱專壇用的以上補充地熱的那個現在那個發展的比例好像沒有進展"},{"start":15261.563,"end":15290.519,"text":"跟委員報告一下我們目前大概發展都是傳統型的地熱發電大概現在裝置的話大概13個MW大概主要分布在宜蘭還有北部新北市也有那還有在台東的那個延平那邊也有那還有是金輪那些地區那未來我們現在要發展像這個計畫要做的其實就是我們所謂的加強型EGS就是深層比較深的就是它的井要打超過3000公尺以上"},{"start":15291.039,"end":15303.568,"text":"那現在減成到了1000而已那所以這個技術就是可能要丟給中央去做進一步的技術發展因為你們之前說要到2G港嗎?還是5G港?對 但是那個因為現在技術上對200 現在是200200 對對對對所以"},{"start":15317.553,"end":15336.707,"text":"對那個我們傳統型的一個井一個井配上一個取水井或者是配上一個注水井大概只有一妹左右但是比較深層的話可能一個井配上一級菌型可以五妹所以這個新的技術發展像現在很多油公司都在發展這種我們叫做EGS跟AGS的技術以上好"},{"start":15338.732,"end":15359.435,"text":"好我為什麼對這一個比較堅持因為我們每次質詢的時候對這一塊我們都有提出這樣的一個問題也就是說他現在這一個第二減碳型所使用的這樣的科技的技術就是會有誘發地震的這樣子的一個情況所以那時候我們在質詢的時候基本上就是希望他要能夠"},{"start":15360.396,"end":15381.126,"text":"告知啊就是這樣除非你這個技術去改變那當然要配合台灣的這些地質的中心的狀況那因為中友也在探勘台電也在探勘你這個是委託台電還是委託中友中友中友是OK好我意思是這樣子就是說因為這個東西來講的話呢"},{"start":15385.309,"end":15401.406,"text":"我覺得就是說因為你現在的話呢中有當然是先鑽兩口的深層的地類的探井啦當然如果你發現具有開發25MW的價值的時候我們才續鑽八口的這個我們講水平井這樣子的角度嘛"},{"start":15402.026,"end":15428.193,"text":"那基本上來講的話呢我們現在在115年的重點我看一下你們的預算當然是完成第一口探勘警跟第二口探勘警的專警之前置作業嘛所以基本上你有辦法證明你什麼時候才有辦法證明的三轉二十五MW這件事情的假設前提是成立的我昨天看到半夜啊你怎麼去prove這件事啊"},{"start":15432.659,"end":15459.895,"text":"應該他先才還是要去打下去確定幾後然後去做他們做檢測啦檢測完確定以後他有確定那個量不過目前現在看起來那個宜蘭那邊他目前狀況現在看起來是不錯但是那個整個時程如果我們還是要跟到時候執行計畫的時候要跟中央商場說看能不能夠加速啦好我對於第二攤檢的話第一個就跟蜥蜴鳳尾一樣就是說他到底那個效益是不是我花那麼多錢CP值"},{"start":15460.695,"end":15483.551,"text":"是不是符合的第二個萬一將來真的如果啦不如預期的時候我真的建議就是緊述就是退場了如果真的不如預期越早發現它的價值不管是yes or no我覺得這件事情就應該要有個果斷的決策這樣聽得懂我的意思嗎是是 收到好"},{"start":15486.445,"end":15513.031,"text":"還沒啊好 這樣子好不好 我原本是動兩億嘛我動你五千萬 然後交說明報告之後 使得動資他要動五千五千啊五千啊他動五千啊我已經動兩億了 他變動五千而已 整個第三幕耶他是整個 你是整個嗎整個第三幕啊太多了"},{"start":15515.79,"end":15524.074,"text":"第3部72億欸好來好了五千了七十二億裡面有六十一億多是給台電的那個補助"},{"start":15532.799,"end":15542.028,"text":"主席是書面報告嘛書面報告就通知你寫越快越快就要過了第三步民營發展管理就這樣子了"},{"start":15548.57,"end":15563.696,"text":"在我們針對第四幕非營業特種基金首先第269案這個已經改成主決議了但是我是希望你們對那個配套的措施要去寫成詳細的報告 好不好收到 收到好 謝謝早委"},{"start":15564.096,"end":15580.222,"text":"好 預算照列 第四幕預算照列 再來的話我們進到主決議270項 增照辦理 詐騙通過271 增照辦理 詐騙通過272 增照辦理 詐騙通過273 增照辦理 詐騙通過274 增照辦理 詐騙通過好 請新讀協商結論 新讀協商結論 第一項經濟部部分"},{"start":15590.751,"end":15598.677,"text":"有關派人出國計劃凍結一盤十萬元提出書面報告後使得動之其中第三案改為主決議"},{"start":15600.714,"end":15619.363,"text":"有關媒體政策及業務宣導費,凍結50萬元,提出書面報告後10的動之第一幕,科技專案,凍結6500萬元,兩周內提書面報告後10的動之其中第6案,第12案,第16案,第17案,第18案,第20案,第23案"},{"start":15623.601,"end":15647.344,"text":"第四十二案、第四十三案、第四十五案及第四十六案均改為主決議第二幕元朗外國專案人才預算照列其中第四十七案及第四十八案均改為主決議第三幕數位應用與資安任性預算照列其中第五十案、第五十一案、第五十三案、第五十五案均改為主決議第四幕"},{"start":15649.325,"end":15673.231,"text":"推動投資審議智慧發展 凍結5%一個月內提出書面報告後 使得動之其中第57案、58案及60案均改為主決議第五幕 一般行政凍結800萬元 提出書面報告後 使得動之其中第61案、63案及64案均改為主決議第六幕 國營失業管理預算再列"},{"start":15674.454,"end":15701.821,"text":"其中第65案第67案第68案及第69案均改為主決議第7幕投資審議凍結100萬元提出書面報告後使得動之其中第72案73案均改為主決議第8幕經貿人才培育及發展預算在列第77案及第78案均改為主決議第9幕促進投資預算在列其中第79案第81案82案均改為主決議"},{"start":15703.161,"end":15730.917,"text":"第十一幕 營業基金動九一千萬元提出書面報告後 使得奉之其中第八十八案 第九十案及第九十二案均改為主決議第十五 非營業特種基金預算障礙其中第九十三案 第九十四案 第九十六案及第九十七案均改為主決議第十三幕 一般建築及設備預算障礙 第九十八案 第九十九案均改為主決議主決議入案 第一百案至一百二十二案均改為主決議"},{"start":15732.817,"end":15736.958,"text":"軍招案通過第123案修正通過第124案跟著第一百案之第二123案軍招案通過"},{"start":15752.95,"end":15767.373,"text":"第124案修正通過第125至第151均照案通過第152修正通過第113案修正通過第154案照案通過國貿署部分"},{"start":15769.318,"end":15779.404,"text":"有關媒體政策及業務宣導費預算詔略第155項改為主決議第一幕數位貿易凍結一千萬元提出書面報告後使得動之其中第157第158第161項均改為主決議有關促進國際展會觀光消費計畫凍結兩千萬元提出書面報告後使得動之"},{"start":15798.203,"end":15805.533,"text":"那第164案第166案第167案及168案174案及176案177案均改為主決議主決議部分第178案至於第183案均遭案通過經一部水利署及所屬"},{"start":15816.605,"end":15837.602,"text":"第一幕水資源科技發展預算策略第180案改為主決議第二幕一般行政預算策略第185案改為主決議第三幕水利建設及保育管理凍結1000萬元提出書面報告後使得動之第186案第189案至第199案均改即203案、204案、205案均改為主決議"},{"start":15847.011,"end":15850.993,"text":"主決定部分207至211均照案通過212修正通過213至217均照案通過218至221均修正通過222至224均照案通過"},{"start":15865.989,"end":15892.926,"text":"地质调查及矿业管理中心部分第一幕地质及矿业科技发展冻结200万元提出书面报告后使得通知第225案第226案第228案及第229案均改为主决议第三幕地质调查与矿业管理预算照列第230案至第233案均改为主决议主决议部分第230案修正通过第235案照案通过"},{"start":15893.966,"end":15914.781,"text":"聯署部分 稅務部分 第七款其他收入預算詔列有關媒體政策及業務宣導部分預算詔列 第230案改革組決議第一幕 能源科技計畫凍結3000萬元提出書面包包後 使得凍資其中第240案至第246案"},{"start":15918.106,"end":15944.327,"text":"均改為主決議第三目 能源發展與管理 凍結五千萬元提出書面報告後 使得動之即將第256案 第258案 第262案 第263案 第260案 第267案及第268案均改為主決議第四目 分營業特種基金預算照略 第269案改為主決議主決議部分 第270案至270案均照案通過 宣布人品"},{"start":15946.482,"end":15952.98,"text":"好請問各位同仁有為提案部分照剛剛宣讀的協商結論通過沒有提案的部分均照列請問有異議"},{"start":15955.523,"end":15979.334,"text":"沒有異議通過115年度經濟部及所屬單位國際貿易署、能源署、水利署、地質調查及礦業管理中心預算審查完均本次會議通過之決議文字授權主席及議事人員整理正式別學童機關別審查結果調整今日所列議程處理完均現在散會還沒簽的主決議請拿給我"},{"start":15999.585,"end":16000.586,"text":"這是個六八、六九來這個是"}]}},"supported_relations":[],"relations":[]}