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1893.56,"text":"沒有我們意識錄確定"},{"start":1896.6399999999999,"end":1900.24,"text":"本日會議邀請國防部部長顧立雄"},{"start":1900.24,"end":1904.04,"text":"報告國軍軍品採購履約爭議與違約"},{"start":1904.59,"end":1908.59,"text":"致貨裝期懲延宕採購策略"},{"start":1908.59,"end":1910.6699999999998,"text":"精進作為並被質詢"},{"start":1910.6699999999998,"end":1912.6699999999998,"text":"現在請顧部長上台報告"},{"start":1922.75,"end":1925.5500000000002,"text":"主席各位委員先進"},{"start":1925.5500000000002,"end":1930.27,"text":"今天印耀制外交及國防委員會史詩專案報告"},{"start":1931.7,"end":1938.18,"text":"陳鵬各位委員對國軍獲得規劃及軍品採購作業現況的關切"},{"start":1938.18,"end":1942.06,"text":"在此表達誠摯的敬意與謝誠"},{"start":1942.06,"end":1945.9,"text":"國軍為因應敵警威脅及戰備任務需求"},{"start":1945.9,"end":1949.54,"text":"持續推動各項武器裝備籌獲"},{"start":1949.54,"end":1953.9,"text":"為新興裝備具有科技快速遠近"},{"start":1953.9,"end":1955.78,"text":"系統整合困難"},{"start":1955.78,"end":1956.98,"text":"希望整合複雜"},{"start":1958.25,"end":1961.77,"text":"供應鏈風險及商業有限等特性"},{"start":1961.77,"end":1964.21,"text":"對裝備獲得規劃及採購履約"},{"start":1964.99,"end":1967.19,"text":"作業軍帶來新的挑戰"},{"start":1967.19,"end":1970.47,"text":"光不除依法辦理各項採購作業外"},{"start":1970.47,"end":1974.47,"text":"亦持續經營採購策略及履歷管理機制"},{"start":1974.47,"end":1978.55,"text":"確保國家預算有效轉化為國軍整體防衛能力"},{"start":1979.35,"end":1983.95,"text":"接續由本部國防採購市主任趙智平中將"},{"start":1983.95,"end":1988.35,"text":"就國軍軍品採購履約爭議與違約至"},{"start":1988.35,"end":1991.83,"text":"貨裝期程延宕採購策略進行作為"},{"start":1991.83,"end":1994.51,"text":"向各位委員提出報告"},{"start":1994.51,"end":1997.55,"text":"敬請各位委員指導與支持"},{"start":2006.3899999999999,"end":2008.59,"text":"主席各位委員先進"},{"start":2008.59,"end":2012.99,"text":"接續報告國軍軍品採購履約爭議與違約"},{"start":2012.99,"end":2016.75,"text":"至貨裝期程延宕採購策略進行作為"},{"start":2016.75,"end":2018.4299999999998,"text":"專案報告依前言"},{"start":2019.12,"end":2022.6,"text":"近年國際安全情勢快速變化"},{"start":2022.6,"end":2025.52,"text":"無人載具、人工智慧、電子作戰"},{"start":2025.52,"end":2028.4399999999998,"text":"及智慧化武器等新興科技裝備"},{"start":2028.4399999999998,"end":2030.8,"text":"已成為現代戰爭的重點"},{"start":2030.8,"end":2033.6,"text":"國軍依據年度兵力整建計畫"},{"start":2033.6,"end":2035.8,"text":"持續辦理各項建案的作業"},{"start":2035.8,"end":2037.6,"text":"以快速籌獲武器裝備"},{"start":2037.6,"end":2039.36,"text":"提升整體防衛能力"},{"start":2039.36,"end":2042.4399999999998,"text":"軍品採購不同於一般商業採購"},{"start":2042.4399999999998,"end":2046,"text":"採購範圍涵蓋武器系統、資訊通信裝備"},{"start":2046.04,"end":2050.92,"text":"無人載具、飛彈系統、艦艇、車輛及各類軍事裝備"},{"start":2050.92,"end":2054.76,"text":"由於全球供應鏈重組、地緣政治變化"},{"start":2054.76,"end":2058.16,"text":"原物料價格波動、關鍵零組件"},{"start":2058.16,"end":2060.72,"text":"短缺及科技快速演進"},{"start":2060.72,"end":2063.72,"text":"使武器裝備獲得策略日趨複雜"},{"start":2064.29,"end":2068.01,"text":"辦理採購作業更需充分考量作戰需求"},{"start":2068.01,"end":2072.77,"text":"產能現況、供應鏈安全、旅約管理及性能驗證等因素"},{"start":2072.77,"end":2076.73,"text":"才能有效降低建案獲得期程、延宕風險"},{"start":2076.73,"end":2079.81,"text":"近年部分採購案件因廠商旅約能力不足"},{"start":2079.81,"end":2083.73,"text":"及地緣政治等因素之影響貨裝期程"},{"start":2083.73,"end":2085.89,"text":"國防部均秉持依法行政"},{"start":2085.89,"end":2088.37,"text":"公開透明及風險管理機制"},{"start":2088.37,"end":2089.73,"text":"持續檢討經濟"},{"start":2089.73,"end":2093.45,"text":"並將各案辦購實務經驗回饋建案計畫單位"},{"start":2093.45,"end":2095.25,"text":"妥適延禮武獲策略"},{"start":2095.25,"end":2097.29,"text":"提升整體採購效能"},{"start":2097.29,"end":2102.45,"text":"並同時兼顧國防自主、供應鏈安全及建軍備戰需求"},{"start":2102.45,"end":2106.33,"text":"二、國軍武器裝備獲得規劃及採購策略"},{"start":2106.33,"end":2108.97,"text":"國軍執行武器裝備籌購程序"},{"start":2108.97,"end":2111.29,"text":"首先啟動建案計畫作業"},{"start":2111.29,"end":2114.93,"text":"區分作戰需求、系統分析與期程工項文件"},{"start":2114.93,"end":2117.0099999999998,"text":"最終完成整體獲得規劃書"},{"start":2117.0099999999998,"end":2118.37,"text":"視預算獲復後"},{"start":2119.16,"end":2125.2,"text":"詢問軍購及國內外商購或委員制的管道或裝"},{"start":2125.2,"end":2127.6,"text":"採購作業為其中重要的環節"},{"start":2127.6,"end":2129.2,"text":"其核心目標在於"},{"start":2129.74,"end":2132.7799999999997,"text":"建案需求及規劃期程內完成貨裝"},{"start":2132.7799999999997,"end":2134.9399999999996,"text":"以快速形成國軍戰力"},{"start":2134.9399999999996,"end":2138.4199999999996,"text":"國軍各單位均依敵情威脅及作案需求"},{"start":2138.4199999999996,"end":2140.9399999999996,"text":"適當規劃採購計畫內容"},{"start":2140.9399999999996,"end":2143.22,"text":"避力如期如質獲得所需裝備"},{"start":2143.22,"end":2147.2999999999997,"text":"三、軍品採購履約爭議主要態樣及原因分析"},{"start":2147.2999999999997,"end":2150.4199999999996,"text":"一、廠商未依契約期程完成交貨"},{"start":2150.4199999999996,"end":2152.7799999999997,"text":"廠商因生產排程落後"},{"start":2152.7799999999997,"end":2156.5,"text":"供料延遲及履約能力不符契約要求"},{"start":2156.5,"end":2160.42,"text":"無法依契約期限完成交貨"},{"start":2160.42,"end":2161.74,"text":"造成契約斬言"},{"start":2161.74,"end":2163.58,"text":"影響裝備交裝時程"},{"start":2163.58,"end":2167.1,"text":"二、交貨品質未符合契約技術規範"},{"start":2167.1,"end":2172.74,"text":"交付裝備經檢驗發現性能、材料、製程或品質"},{"start":2172.74,"end":2174.02,"text":"未達契約要求"},{"start":2174.02,"end":2177.02,"text":"需辦理改善、重置或重新驗證"},{"start":2177.02,"end":2180.02,"text":"至延長驗收及交裝的時程"},{"start":2180.02,"end":2182.58,"text":"三、關鍵零附件供應中斷"},{"start":2182.58,"end":2184.22,"text":"受全球供應鏈重組"},{"start":2184.2599999999998,"end":2187.7,"text":"晶片及特殊材料短缺等因素的影響"},{"start":2187.7,"end":2189.54,"text":"部分關鍵零組件"},{"start":2189.54,"end":2192.14,"text":"原料無法依期取得"},{"start":2192.14,"end":2195.3399999999997,"text":"造成生產停滯及交貨延期"},{"start":2195.3399999999997,"end":2199.3399999999997,"text":"四、國外原廠出口管制及產能調整"},{"start":2199.3399999999997,"end":2202.14,"text":"軍事裝備多處管制性機敏品項"},{"start":2202.14,"end":2203.62,"text":"長壽輸出許可"},{"start":2203.62,"end":2208.14,"text":"技術移轉限制及原廠生產排程調整影響"},{"start":2208.14,"end":2211.22,"text":"使交貨時程產生不確定性"},{"start":2211.22,"end":2214.66,"text":"五、驗收程序及證明文件未完備"},{"start":2214.66,"end":2218.8999999999996,"text":"部分案件因廠商交貨驗收相關證明文件"},{"start":2218.8999999999996,"end":2221.7799999999997,"text":"未完備驗測程序需補正"},{"start":2221.7799999999997,"end":2224.62,"text":"或驗收標準認定的差異"},{"start":2224.62,"end":2227.06,"text":"導致驗收作業反覆辦理"},{"start":2227.06,"end":2228.66,"text":"影響裝裝的進度"},{"start":2228.66,"end":2232.66,"text":"六、國內原廠出口管制性機敏品項"},{"start":2232.66,"end":2234.62,"text":"長壽輸出許可"},{"start":2234.62,"end":2238.62,"text":"技術移轉限制及原廠生產排程調整影響"},{"start":2229.97,"end":2231.73,"text":"廠商履歐能力不足"},{"start":2231.73,"end":2232.85,"text":"部分採購品項"},{"start":2233.45,"end":2235.41,"text":"部分採購案件與規劃"},{"start":2236.24,"end":2236.7599999999998,"text":"階段"},{"start":2236.7599999999998,"end":2238.64,"text":"不予掌握市場供應能力"},{"start":2238.64,"end":2241.9199999999996,"text":"技術承軸度及廠商履歐的能力"},{"start":2241.9199999999996,"end":2244.8799999999997,"text":"導致履歐風險未能事先辨識及因應"},{"start":2244.8799999999997,"end":2246.9599999999996,"text":"四、採購策略具體作為"},{"start":2246.9599999999996,"end":2247.3599999999997,"text":"一、"},{"start":2248.1,"end":2250.86,"text":"強化建案規劃與採購作業"},{"start":2250.86,"end":2252.86,"text":"於建案規劃階段"},{"start":2252.86,"end":2254.7799999999997,"text":"落實作戰需求評估"},{"start":2254.7799999999997,"end":2256.46,"text":"藉系統分析機制"},{"start":2256.46,"end":2259.2599999999998,"text":"完備市場調查及供應鏈分析"},{"start":2259.2599999999998,"end":2262.74,"text":"掌握產能現況及廠商履歐能力"},{"start":2262.74,"end":2265.2999999999997,"text":"強化需求審查及風險評估"},{"start":2265.2999999999997,"end":2269.02,"text":"並建立替代來源及第二供應鏈來源"},{"start":2269.02,"end":2271.62,"text":"以降低採購及履歐的風險"},{"start":2271.62,"end":2272.22,"text":"二、"},{"start":2272.22,"end":2275.58,"text":"落實契約執行及履歐管理"},{"start":2275.58,"end":2277.8199999999997,"text":"持續檢討契約內容"},{"start":2277.86,"end":2281.1000000000004,"text":"完善履歐權利義務、產品保證、"},{"start":2281.1000000000004,"end":2283.06,"text":"違約責任及展延條件"},{"start":2283.06,"end":2284.86,"text":"並藉由專案管理機制"},{"start":2284.86,"end":2287.1000000000004,"text":"建立重要履歐管制節點"},{"start":2287.1000000000004,"end":2289.42,"text":"定期召開專案管制會議"},{"start":2289.42,"end":2292.1000000000004,"text":"落實高風險案件、專案列管、"},{"start":2292.1000000000004,"end":2295.34,"text":"赴堂查核及履歐異常通報追蹤"},{"start":2295.34,"end":2298.7000000000003,"text":"強化契約管理與履歐督導效能"},{"start":2298.7000000000003,"end":2301.06,"text":"確保軍品如期如質交付"},{"start":2301.06,"end":2301.9,"text":"三、"},{"start":2301.9,"end":2303.46,"text":"完善驗收作業"},{"start":2303.46,"end":2305.26,"text":"強化驗收前置作業"},{"start":2305.3,"end":2308.2200000000003,"text":"落實驗收專業編組及分工職長"},{"start":2308.2200000000003,"end":2313.34,"text":"依實況提前完成技術文件審查及測試備變"},{"start":2313.34,"end":2317.7400000000002,"text":"建立標準化驗收程序及分階段檢驗機制"},{"start":2317.7400000000002,"end":2321.1800000000003,"text":"提升驗收作業效率與品質管控能力"},{"start":2321.1800000000003,"end":2325.2200000000003,"text":"確保裝備性能符合契約規範及建軍需求"},{"start":2325.2200000000003,"end":2325.7400000000002,"text":"四、"},{"start":2326.49,"end":2328.41,"text":"健全履歐爭議處理機制"},{"start":2329.21,"end":2332.21,"text":"建立跨單位履歐爭議協調機制"},{"start":2332.21,"end":2336.25,"text":"整合法律採購、監察及技術專業資源"},{"start":2336.25,"end":2340.37,"text":"並優先透過行政院工程會協商機制解決爭議"},{"start":2340.37,"end":2341.41,"text":"必要時踢動"},{"start":2341.98,"end":2347.78,"text":"必要時啟動替代採購措施以降低履歐延宕影響"},{"start":2347.78,"end":2348.58,"text":"五、"},{"start":2348.58,"end":2350.66,"text":"提升採購專業能量"},{"start":2350.66,"end":2353.7,"text":"持續培育採購專業人才"},{"start":2353.7,"end":2357.18,"text":"強化專案管理及教育訓練"},{"start":2357.18,"end":2359.54,"text":"建立履歐管理資料庫"},{"start":2359.54,"end":2360.06,"text":"精進"},{"start":2361.42,"end":2363.1,"text":"經驗傳承與專業能力"},{"start":2363.1,"end":2365.26,"text":"提升整體採購品質"},{"start":2366.06,"end":2366.7799999999997,"text":"五、"},{"start":2366.7799999999997,"end":2367.62,"text":"結語"},{"start":2367.62,"end":2371.58,"text":"面對當前國軍戰力整建及新興科技導入速度"},{"start":2371.58,"end":2372.7,"text":"需求破戒"},{"start":2372.7,"end":2376.42,"text":"國軍除確遵政府採購法規定辦購外"},{"start":2376.42,"end":2380.42,"text":"亦同時強化廠商安全管控等措施"},{"start":2380.42,"end":2385.22,"text":"在兼顧廉政、國安、資安及品質要求的前提下"},{"start":2385.22,"end":2387.58,"text":"有效縮短採購作業期程"},{"start":2387.58,"end":2389.58,"text":"提升國防支援應用效益"},{"start":2390.62,"end":2393.62,"text":"以與整體戰力形成速度"},{"start":2393.62,"end":2394.42,"text":"以上報告"},{"start":2394.42,"end":2397.2599999999998,"text":"進行各位委員先進支持與指教"},{"start":2397.2599999999998,"end":2397.66,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":2403.6,"end":2405.6,"text":"我們現在開始詢答"},{"start":2405.6,"end":2407.6,"text":"本會委員6加2分鐘"},{"start":2407.6,"end":2409.12,"text":"非本會委員5分鐘"},{"start":2409.12,"end":2411.48,"text":"10點30分截止發言登記"},{"start":2411.48,"end":2412.7599999999998,"text":"如有臨時提案"},{"start":2412.7599999999998,"end":2416.44,"text":"請於10點30分之前提出11點左右處理"},{"start":2416.44,"end":2419.08,"text":"現在請羅美齡委員上台諮詢"},{"start":2426.5299999999997,"end":2427.2099999999996,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":2427.2099999999996,"end":2428.0099999999998,"text":"有請顧部長"},{"start":2429.15,"end":2429.75,"text":"顧部長"},{"start":2436.76,"end":2437.6000000000004,"text":"是,羅美齡"},{"start":2467.6000000000004,"end":2470.1600000000003,"text":"干擾的這個法定的這個規格"},{"start":2470.1600000000003,"end":2471.0400000000004,"text":"可是先前呢"},{"start":2471.0400000000004,"end":2473.2000000000003,"text":"我有注意到有一份報導"},{"start":2473.2000000000003,"end":2474.6000000000004,"text":"今年的一個報導"},{"start":2474.6000000000004,"end":2474.96,"text":"他說"},{"start":2474.96,"end":2478.44,"text":"美方戰爭部下轄的安全治理研究所呢"},{"start":2478.44,"end":2480.44,"text":"曾經會同我們資通電軍呢"},{"start":2480.44,"end":2484.84,"text":"前往金門去參觀這一個無人機反制系統的這個"},{"start":2484.84,"end":2486.6800000000003,"text":"這個實測的這個情況"},{"start":2486.6800000000003,"end":2487.6400000000003,"text":"那其實呢"},{"start":2487.6400000000003,"end":2489.4,"text":"美方那時是予以肯定的"},{"start":2489.4,"end":2490.6800000000003,"text":"也表達了對"},{"start":2490.6800000000003,"end":2493.48,"text":"也表達了這個高度的這個興趣"},{"start":2493.48,"end":2495.1600000000003,"text":"然後報導裡面提到說呢"},{"start":2495.16,"end":2498.44,"text":"這個美方肯定的這個建案的結果呢"},{"start":2498.44,"end":2500.92,"text":"到後來是沒有達標"},{"start":2500.92,"end":2502.3199999999997,"text":"也就是說"},{"start":2502.3199999999997,"end":2503.16,"text":"所以我想了解"},{"start":2503.16,"end":2507.16,"text":"除了我們所謂未達到在這個6公里偵測"},{"start":2507.16,"end":2509.52,"text":"4公里外成功干擾的標準之外"},{"start":2509.52,"end":2512.8799999999997,"text":"到底這個無人機的這個反制系統"},{"start":2512.8799999999997,"end":2515.64,"text":"還有沒有其他未達標的這個項目"},{"start":2515.64,"end":2516.2799999999997,"text":"請問部長"},{"start":2517.24,"end":2518.24,"text":"據我的了解"},{"start":2518.24,"end":2521.92,"text":"應該主要就是在於他的那個"},{"start":2521.92,"end":2524.8399999999997,"text":"搜索雷達跟那個被動雷達的部分"},{"start":2524.84,"end":2531.04,"text":"他就面對這些多皮刺的這個無人機"},{"start":2531.04,"end":2534.32,"text":"他沒有辦法有效的這個整合"},{"start":2534.32,"end":2536.2000000000003,"text":"將那個參數"},{"start":2536.2000000000003,"end":2540.04,"text":"把它顯示在系統的操作平台上面"},{"start":2540.04,"end":2541.6400000000003,"text":"那因此這個"},{"start":2542.73,"end":2546.25,"text":"相關的這些識別的這個能力"},{"start":2546.25,"end":2548.5699999999997,"text":"沒有辦法達到我們合約規範的標準"},{"start":2549.29,"end":2552.0099999999998,"text":"所以就是說因為他的系統無法整合"},{"start":2552.0099999999998,"end":2554.21,"text":"所以造成就是說他這個"},{"start":2554.21,"end":2556.77,"text":"是沒有辦法達到我們剛才所提到的"},{"start":2556.77,"end":2559.69,"text":"6公里偵測4公里外干擾的這個"},{"start":2559.69,"end":2561.13,"text":"最主要的這個原因"},{"start":2561.13,"end":2563.33,"text":"是因為他的系統無法整合的關係"},{"start":2563.33,"end":2567.29,"text":"他有一個搜索雷達跟一個被動雷達"},{"start":2567.29,"end":2570.0099999999998,"text":"這兩個雷達的系統可能要"},{"start":2570.0099999999998,"end":2572.17,"text":"要進行相關的整合這樣"},{"start":2572.17,"end":2573.29,"text":"所以他這個部分的話"},{"start":2573.29,"end":2575.45,"text":"其實因為經過三次的這個測試了"},{"start":2575.45,"end":2577.57,"text":"所以這當中其實一開始應該也發現"},{"start":2577.57,"end":2579.3700000000003,"text":"這個因素"},{"start":2579.3700000000003,"end":2582.21,"text":"可是他雖然一再的改進"},{"start":2582.21,"end":2584.3700000000003,"text":"結果還是沒有辦法來"},{"start":2584.3700000000003,"end":2585.9700000000003,"text":"克服這個困難的是不是"},{"start":2585.9700000000003,"end":2586.77,"text":"是這樣子嗎"},{"start":2586.77,"end":2589.17,"text":"對我們這個標一開始"},{"start":2589.17,"end":2591.4100000000003,"text":"應該有進行一個POC的驗證"},{"start":2591.4100000000003,"end":2595.09,"text":"驗證驗測那個由"},{"start":2595.09,"end":2597.73,"text":"這個評選委員會認定他"},{"start":2597.73,"end":2601.25,"text":"這個POC的驗測有通過"},{"start":2601.25,"end":2604.9700000000003,"text":"然後後來再進行這一個實際系統的"},{"start":2604.9700000000003,"end":2605.73,"text":"一個驗測"},{"start":2605.73,"end":2606.8900000000003,"text":"那按照合約的規範"},{"start":2606.89,"end":2609.6099999999997,"text":"就是交貨的時候要進行驗測"},{"start":2609.6099999999997,"end":2613.77,"text":"再來驗證不過就會有進行兩次的復驗這樣"},{"start":2613.77,"end":2615.49,"text":"所以兩次復驗都是還沒過"},{"start":2615.49,"end":2618.49,"text":"像可是我看我之前看到這個報導"},{"start":2618.49,"end":2620.21,"text":"裡面有提到就是說"},{"start":2620.21,"end":2624.25,"text":"其實我們的評分只有兩種兩級的標準"},{"start":2624.25,"end":2626.49,"text":"不是打零分就是打一百分"},{"start":2626.49,"end":2629.97,"text":"國軍對國防部隊這個部分有什麼說法嗎"},{"start":2629.97,"end":2631.6099999999997,"text":"不是零分就是一百分"},{"start":2631.6099999999997,"end":2632.49,"text":"因為他有提到"},{"start":2632.49,"end":2634.77,"text":"因為我看到那個軍事專家有特別有提到"},{"start":2634.77,"end":2636.25,"text":"就是說像美國"},{"start":2636.97,"end":2639.17,"text":"美國的這個"},{"start":2639.17,"end":2642.97,"text":"成功率是設定在超過80%的門檻"},{"start":2642.97,"end":2644.97,"text":"那後續是透過訓練"},{"start":2644.97,"end":2647.81,"text":"系統更新在逐步提升到90%以上"},{"start":2647.81,"end":2649.29,"text":"所以我們有沒有"},{"start":2649.29,"end":2650.89,"text":"按照這樣子的標準"},{"start":2650.89,"end":2654.29,"text":"其實它是遠遠低於這個80%的標準"},{"start":2654.29,"end":2656.97,"text":"還是說我們真的就是標準就設在百分之百"},{"start":2658.09,"end":2660.29,"text":"包圍我就兩個部分向您報告"},{"start":2660.29,"end":2661.4900000000002,"text":"第一個"},{"start":2661.4900000000002,"end":2665.29,"text":"現在運用在戰場上成熟的無人機反制系統"},{"start":2665.29,"end":2667.57,"text":"那他還要再搭配"},{"start":2667.57,"end":2671.09,"text":"那他還要搭配所謂的軟紗或是硬紗"},{"start":2671.09,"end":2672.65,"text":"那今天就這個案子"},{"start":2672.65,"end":2675.13,"text":"我們純粹就軟紗來說明"},{"start":2675.13,"end":2677.8100000000004,"text":"那事實上在作戰場景當中"},{"start":2677.8100000000004,"end":2679.3300000000004,"text":"所謂的無人機增貨率"},{"start":2679.3300000000004,"end":2681.69,"text":"它牽扯到的因素非常多"},{"start":2681.69,"end":2685.69,"text":"包含到本身它資料庫的迭代和擴充的速度"},{"start":2685.69,"end":2689.73,"text":"是否能夠及時滿足無人機的所謂的頻段"},{"start":2689.73,"end":2692.69,"text":"那因為無人機的頻段它也是一直在調整"},{"start":2692.69,"end":2696.61,"text":"可能也是要不讓你的反制系統能夠抓到我"},{"start":2696.61,"end":2697.89,"text":"那第二個"},{"start":2697.89,"end":2701.29,"text":"現在也有的無人機是有自主飛行"},{"start":2701.29,"end":2703.29,"text":"它是不受遙導控的"},{"start":2703.29,"end":2704.89,"text":"它就直接設定路徑"},{"start":2704.89,"end":2706.33,"text":"它是等於是不受干擾"},{"start":2706.33,"end":2710.21,"text":"當然我不再講這個所謂的光纖無人機之類"},{"start":2710.21,"end":2713.85,"text":"就是非光纖無人機也有自主飛行能力"},{"start":2713.89,"end":2716.81,"text":"還有再加上無人機本身的抗干擾能力"},{"start":2716.81,"end":2722.29,"text":"所以基本上在作戰場景實際下的無人機反制系統"},{"start":2722.29,"end":2724.89,"text":"幾乎沒有一個國家會說"},{"start":2724.89,"end":2727.0099999999998,"text":"它只會說它是很高的攔截率"},{"start":2727.0099999999998,"end":2729.69,"text":"但是的確沒有一個國家會說它是百分之百"},{"start":2729.69,"end":2732.41,"text":"那但是在這個外離島的這個"},{"start":2732.41,"end":2734.65,"text":"26套無人機反制系統當中"},{"start":2734.65,"end":2738.93,"text":"我們是依據速發部所核定的在台灣地區使用"},{"start":2738.93,"end":2741.37,"text":"你只要進來我就核定你的一個"},{"start":2741.41,"end":2745.89,"text":"這個飛行的波段這個頻率"},{"start":2745.89,"end":2750.65,"text":"那也就是說這個就是在我們金馬外島台灣地區才能使用"},{"start":2750.65,"end":2757.25,"text":"那這個也都給當初在廠商的公告和契約當中明定"},{"start":2757.25,"end":2761.73,"text":"也就是說應該是明確的知道這樣子的驗測的波段"},{"start":2761.73,"end":2768.73,"text":"所以我們才會訂定說要符合我們的要求這樣子"},{"start":2768.73,"end":2772.89,"text":"那這個要求的標準也是符合外離島地區"},{"start":2772.89,"end":2774.37,"text":"它任務時需"},{"start":2774.37,"end":2775.21,"text":"以上說明"},{"start":2775.21,"end":2779.29,"text":"OK所以其實報導上面所提到的所謂零分跟一百分"},{"start":2779.29,"end":2780.93,"text":"就只有這兩節的標準"},{"start":2780.93,"end":2784.41,"text":"其實國防部其實這個應該是可以來說"},{"start":2784.41,"end":2788.13,"text":"明明大家都這樣子是不是不符合客觀這個原則"},{"start":2788.13,"end":2792.41,"text":"那當然測試可能除了剛剛所提到的波段"},{"start":2792.41,"end":2793.85,"text":"可能還有地形的影響"},{"start":2793.85,"end":2797.09,"text":"天氣的影響這些因素可能就要罵誤嘛"},{"start":2797.09,"end":2798.57,"text":"對不對這個部分"},{"start":2798.61,"end":2800.65,"text":"我們有沒有因為這樣子呢"},{"start":2800.65,"end":2805.69,"text":"來做一個比如說有一些設定一些政策門檻之類的"},{"start":2805.69,"end":2809.3300000000004,"text":"驗測的標準要在五級風寒以下"},{"start":2809.3300000000004,"end":2813.8500000000004,"text":"那驗測當天的天候報告都是符合驗測水準"},{"start":2813.8500000000004,"end":2817.53,"text":"是有那全程錄影錄音都是由驗測方"},{"start":2817.53,"end":2822.53,"text":"跟我們的這個所謂的陸軍的驗測單位來實施認證"},{"start":2822.53,"end":2826.81,"text":"就是說只要是天候不行就會展延到預備日"},{"start":2827.66,"end":2830.1,"text":"OK其實我們這個無人機的反制系統"},{"start":2830.1,"end":2832.3399999999997,"text":"是真的是有它的急迫性"},{"start":2832.3399999999997,"end":2833.18,"text":"像先前呢"},{"start":2833.18,"end":2836.5,"text":"我記得在前年的時候我們還發生就是說"},{"start":2836.5,"end":2839.7799999999997,"text":"比如說中國的它的這個無人機的氣擾"},{"start":2839.7799999999997,"end":2843.06,"text":"結果呢我們國軍只有用石頭啊什麼來做反擊"},{"start":2843.06,"end":2845.2999999999997,"text":"這個這真的是很不堪的一件事情"},{"start":2845.2999999999997,"end":2846.98,"text":"所以它有它的急迫性"},{"start":2846.98,"end":2848.94,"text":"可是現在就是因為測試不過了"},{"start":2848.94,"end":2853.02,"text":"所以這個這個合約就必須要終止了"},{"start":2853.02,"end":2857.18,"text":"那後續呢後續我們要如何來彌補這個戰力的這個空窗"},{"start":2857.18,"end":2858.5,"text":"尤其這段時間"},{"start":2858.5,"end":2860.62,"text":"那我們後面後續的補救方式是什麼"},{"start":2860.62,"end":2862.8999999999996,"text":"重新招標嗎還是用怎麼樣的方式呢"},{"start":2865.61,"end":2869.13,"text":"也跟委員報告事實上這個案子是從"},{"start":2869.13,"end":2874.29,"text":"它其實它的起始應該是在112年就在"},{"start":2874.29,"end":2876.69,"text":"就在擬定它的作序文件"},{"start":2876.69,"end":2880.9300000000003,"text":"那它雖然執行是113到115"},{"start":2880.9300000000003,"end":2886.77,"text":"那相對的我們因應整個的作戰時序和結合科技的迭代"},{"start":2886.77,"end":2893.9700000000003,"text":"我們也都完成了相關的更新更符合我們任務需求的無人機反制系統"},{"start":2894.0099999999998,"end":2898.0499999999997,"text":"也都完成了4階文件的這個作業"},{"start":2898.0499999999997,"end":2899.97,"text":"那現在只要是預算獲付"},{"start":2899.97,"end":2901.93,"text":"我們就可以立刻去籌獲"},{"start":2901.93,"end":2906.0099999999998,"text":"那另外您所說的在外島地區"},{"start":2906.0099999999998,"end":2912.29,"text":"那事實上我們也有佩服目前有相關的這些"},{"start":2912.29,"end":2915.6499999999996,"text":"雷達偵測的相關的系統可以公關並來使用"},{"start":2916.94,"end":2920.46,"text":"好那所以我們可能現在如果只要預算通過的話"},{"start":2920.46,"end":2922.86,"text":"其實我們如果直接用採購"},{"start":2922.86,"end":2929.1000000000004,"text":"其實就已經有符合我們現階段所需的這個無人機反制系統的意思嗎"},{"start":2929.1000000000004,"end":2929.6600000000003,"text":"是不是"},{"start":2929.6600000000003,"end":2930.1800000000003,"text":"部長"},{"start":2930.1800000000003,"end":2933.02,"text":"就是說在一點偶造的特別預算裡面"},{"start":2933.02,"end":2937.82,"text":"我們有一個反制無人機的系統籌勾的規劃"},{"start":2937.82,"end":2942.42,"text":"那這個屬於可惜式的一個無人機的反制系統"},{"start":2942.42,"end":2945.38,"text":"那這個部分如果能夠獲付預算的話"},{"start":2945.38,"end":2950.2200000000003,"text":"那會有入軍統建到各部隊"},{"start":2950.2200000000003,"end":2952.94,"text":"那外離島部分"},{"start":2952.94,"end":2960.2200000000003,"text":"我們應該也會將這個可惜式的無人機反制系統可以配合到外離島地區"},{"start":2961.94,"end":2969.5,"text":"部長提的是一點二五兆還是兩千一百億的這個無人機的這個採購"},{"start":2969.5,"end":2970.6200000000003,"text":"一點二五兆裡面"},{"start":2970.6200000000003,"end":2971.1400000000003,"text":"一點二五兆裡面"},{"start":2971.1400000000003,"end":2973.3,"text":"沒有擺進去這一次兩千一百億"},{"start":2973.3,"end":2977.2200000000003,"text":"兩千一百億的部分是針對無人機跟無人艇"},{"start":2977.2200000000003,"end":2979.1800000000003,"text":"那反制無人機的部分呢"},{"start":2979.1800000000003,"end":2982.9,"text":"有放在一點二五兆的特別預算裡面"},{"start":2982.9,"end":2986.1,"text":"是屬於可惜式的一個無人機的反制系統"},{"start":2986.66,"end":2987.94,"text":"OK 好 謝謝"},{"start":2987.94,"end":2990.06,"text":"因為先前看到了一些疑問"},{"start":2990.06,"end":2994.02,"text":"所以今天來請教我們國防部"},{"start":2994.02,"end":2996.14,"text":"因為時間的這個關係"},{"start":2996.14,"end":3001.22,"text":"那我是覺得說無人機反制系統真的是有它的急迫性跟需要"},{"start":3001.22,"end":3002.7799999999997,"text":"所以呢這部分呢"},{"start":3002.7799999999997,"end":3005.94,"text":"也希望說能夠獲得這個朝野的支持"},{"start":3005.94,"end":3007.5,"text":"能盡速來做建置"},{"start":3007.5,"end":3008.18,"text":"好 以上謝謝"},{"start":3008.84,"end":3009.56,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":3012.98,"end":3013.7000000000003,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":3013.7000000000003,"end":3016.58,"text":"接下來請陳俊宇委員上台諮詢"},{"start":3026.1,"end":3027.2599999999998,"text":"好 謝謝主席"},{"start":3027.2599999999998,"end":3028.7,"text":"我們有請顧部長"},{"start":3028.7,"end":3029.42,"text":"請顧部長"},{"start":3033.4,"end":3034.04,"text":"部長早"},{"start":3036.9900000000002,"end":3039.31,"text":"部長 在這一次的這個報告主題"},{"start":3039.31,"end":3043.31,"text":"確實是我們在建軍備戰上的一項挑戰"},{"start":3043.31,"end":3047.79,"text":"在提升我們防衛任性和建構不對稱戰力的過程當中"},{"start":3047.79,"end":3051.59,"text":"我們國防部要怎麼來確保能夠如期如質"},{"start":3051.59,"end":3055.55,"text":"來獲得我們需求的相關武器裝備"},{"start":3055.55,"end":3059.15,"text":"甚至能夠提升整個我們採購的一個效率"},{"start":3059.15,"end":3063.07,"text":"這也是我們強化我們國防自主力的一個關鍵"},{"start":3063.07,"end":3065.4300000000003,"text":"必須持續精進相關的措施"},{"start":3065.43,"end":3068.5099999999998,"text":"那今天想再和部長您討論"},{"start":3068.5099999999998,"end":3071.5899999999997,"text":"就是有關我們無人系統的一個運用"},{"start":3071.5899999999997,"end":3073.91,"text":"除了正在審查的這個特別條例"},{"start":3073.91,"end":3077.19,"text":"也是因國軍迫切的作戰需求"},{"start":3077.19,"end":3080.5499999999997,"text":"需要快速籌獲相關的這個武器彈藥"},{"start":3080.5499999999997,"end":3082.87,"text":"那之前回覆無人機部隊"},{"start":3082.87,"end":3087.6699999999996,"text":"在三個作戰區大隊已經在四月份編成"},{"start":3087.6699999999996,"end":3092.99,"text":"那部長也提到這個需要持續購置相關的這個無人機"},{"start":3093.0299999999997,"end":3095.95,"text":"避免出現有編無裝的這個情形"},{"start":3095.95,"end":3098.0299999999997,"text":"而特別在外島的部分"},{"start":3098.0299999999997,"end":3101.95,"text":"我們看到這個澎湖在七月份剛成立的無人機部隊"},{"start":3101.95,"end":3106.27,"text":"已經投入在上週的這個聯合防禦操演當中"},{"start":3106.27,"end":3109.83,"text":"也配合我們戰車營執行相關的任務"},{"start":3109.83,"end":3111.27,"text":"那在這部分我想請教部長"},{"start":3111.27,"end":3113.43,"text":"在外島偵射無人機的部隊"},{"start":3113.43,"end":3117.5899999999997,"text":"他對於我們在防衛作戰上有什麼樣一個戰略意義"},{"start":3117.5899999999997,"end":3119.5499999999997,"text":"而隨著這個戰略轉型"},{"start":3119.55,"end":3123.3100000000004,"text":"未來是否會在外離島投入更多的無人機"},{"start":3123.3100000000004,"end":3126.27,"text":"或是水下地面無人載具"},{"start":3126.27,"end":3129.07,"text":"類似這個機器狗等的運用"},{"start":3129.07,"end":3130.9900000000002,"text":"有沒有相關的這個需求"},{"start":3130.9900000000002,"end":3133.19,"text":"這部分是不是部長可以簡要說明一下"},{"start":3133.19,"end":3135.27,"text":"是 我有兩個問題"},{"start":3135.27,"end":3140.71,"text":"第一個就是我們在本島的部分是著重於支援聯合作戰"},{"start":3141.7,"end":3143.7,"text":"重生的防衛跟重要目標防護"},{"start":3143.7,"end":3146.18,"text":"那外島特別澎湖地區"},{"start":3146.18,"end":3149.3399999999997,"text":"那就可以發揮前沿部署的優勢"},{"start":3149.3399999999997,"end":3157.02,"text":"那平時也可以來警戒監控跟應處這個灰色地帶"},{"start":3157.02,"end":3161.7,"text":"那暫時的時候就可以進行這個早期的預警"},{"start":3161.7,"end":3166.1,"text":"然後再來做火力的引導跟水域的突襲等等"},{"start":3166.1,"end":3169.86,"text":"這些在無人的系統應用上面"},{"start":3169.86,"end":3172.22,"text":"它會有發生一定的效果"},{"start":3172.22,"end":3175.3399999999997,"text":"那剛剛我也有提到其他的無人的"},{"start":3175.97,"end":3179.0899999999997,"text":"設備有提到像機器狗的部分"},{"start":3179.0899999999997,"end":3184.73,"text":"現在是由中科院跟它會結合國內外的產業的能量"},{"start":3184.73,"end":3190.29,"text":"來將這些無人的地面載具跟載台來進行整合"},{"start":3190.29,"end":3193.33,"text":"來推動主要是要推動在地生產"},{"start":3193.33,"end":3199.6099999999997,"text":"然後來系統整合以及有關於群控這些等等關鍵的技術"},{"start":3199.6099999999997,"end":3205.73,"text":"那我們之後也會透過一些原型開發"},{"start":3205.73,"end":3211.89,"text":"批量採購等等來加速我們各類無人系統的運用"},{"start":3211.89,"end":3217.73,"text":"好 那另外一個部分我想之前也跟部長您討論過"},{"start":3217.73,"end":3220.05,"text":"我們因應這個中國使用無人機"},{"start":3220.05,"end":3225.17,"text":"對我們外離島營區進行這個所謂的灰帶侵擾"},{"start":3225.17,"end":3230.13,"text":"需要我們趕快來建置一個提升驅離和反制的能力"},{"start":3230.13,"end":3233.25,"text":"那包括先前在討論國防特別預算時"},{"start":3233.33,"end":3237.33,"text":"部長您也提到除了這個可惜式的反制系統"},{"start":3237.33,"end":3243.81,"text":"那也會檢討其他裝備透過主動和被動的方式來進行反制"},{"start":3243.81,"end":3249.57,"text":"對於這個如何盡快提升我們營區反制無人機的這個能力"},{"start":3249.57,"end":3251.25,"text":"完善整個防務網"},{"start":3251.25,"end":3256.21,"text":"我想追蹤我們國防部後續有沒有進一步的規劃"},{"start":3256.21,"end":3259.73,"text":"打算透過什麼方式來籌獲適當的裝備"},{"start":3259.73,"end":3261.73,"text":"這部分是不是請部長簡要說明"},{"start":3263.23,"end":3270.27,"text":"成熟的建案部分就是剛剛有提到的那個可惜式的無人機反制系統"},{"start":3270.27,"end":3272.03,"text":"這是機動式的"},{"start":3272.03,"end":3276.83,"text":"那可以背負來進行"},{"start":3276.83,"end":3283.79,"text":"那後續我想我們會關注一些其他一些軟硬砂的一些技術"},{"start":3283.79,"end":3286.67,"text":"這個包括了自動化的槍塔"},{"start":3286.67,"end":3289.3900000000003,"text":"高冷微射高冷微波"},{"start":3289.39,"end":3293.31,"text":"還有這個一些無人的攔截器"},{"start":3293.31,"end":3294.91,"text":"還有電站的干擾等等"},{"start":3294.91,"end":3299.71,"text":"那我想中院在這個部分上面要扮演一些關鍵的角色"},{"start":3299.71,"end":3307.6299999999997,"text":"那我們也會透過這個DIO的這個國防創新小組來進行"},{"start":3307.6299999999997,"end":3310.27,"text":"一些小品項採購來進行驗證"},{"start":3310.27,"end":3314.83,"text":"這樣子如果國外已經發展這個技術到達一個程度的話"},{"start":3314.83,"end":3315.47,"text":"採購"},{"start":3315.47,"end":3318.75,"text":"就做一個小品項採購來進行驗證"},{"start":3318.75,"end":3324.03,"text":"驗證如果成功的話我們再進行這個建案"},{"start":3324.7599999999998,"end":3328.9199999999996,"text":"好那部長那個無論載具或是反制系統"},{"start":3328.9199999999996,"end":3335.08,"text":"在這個發展創新和這個技術迭代上非常的迅速"},{"start":3335.08,"end":3337.3999999999996,"text":"那之前也討論特別條例的時候"},{"start":3337.3999999999996,"end":3340.52,"text":"提到會透過這個分批採購"},{"start":3340.52,"end":3345.08,"text":"檢討規格讓每一批都能夠進行規格更新"},{"start":3345.08,"end":3348.9199999999996,"text":"在軟硬體可能都有速度上的一個急迫性"},{"start":3348.9199999999996,"end":3354.52,"text":"那這部分除了有DIO負責導入民間成熟的這個科技產品"},{"start":3354.52,"end":3356.7599999999998,"text":"加速創新在國防的應用"},{"start":3356.7599999999998,"end":3361.24,"text":"那目前無論載具以及這個反制系統的籌獲上"},{"start":3361.24,"end":3364.68,"text":"我們如何加速引入新興的科技運用"},{"start":3364.68,"end":3366.92,"text":"那DIO的角色定位又是什麼"},{"start":3366.92,"end":3369.48,"text":"這部分剛剛部長你也大概簡要說明"},{"start":3369.48,"end":3372.84,"text":"那可不可以在細項大概簡單的說明一下"},{"start":3372.84,"end":3375.8,"text":"無人機的採購的部分"},{"start":3377.59,"end":3382.55,"text":"我們現在是要打算透過一個回饋的資訊平台"},{"start":3382.55,"end":3386.3900000000003,"text":"這個回饋會使得使用這個"},{"start":3386.3900000000003,"end":3390.07,"text":"包括我們相關的這些演訓的單位"},{"start":3390.07,"end":3392.71,"text":"他們在使用無人機他們要進行回饋"},{"start":3392.71,"end":3395.19,"text":"然後會提出一些需求"},{"start":3395.19,"end":3399.59,"text":"那另外我們也會結合共研院跟中科院"},{"start":3399.59,"end":3402.23,"text":"還有整平市的這個DIO小組"},{"start":3402.31,"end":3404.87,"text":"還有這個原廠"},{"start":3404.87,"end":3409.59,"text":"還有相關的這些軍種等等"},{"start":3409.59,"end":3411.27,"text":"他們是使用單位"},{"start":3411.27,"end":3415.67,"text":"然後這個共研院跟中科院他們也會去"},{"start":3415.67,"end":3419.51,"text":"除了他們自己本身有相關的研究之外"},{"start":3419.51,"end":3420.71,"text":"他們也會去收集"},{"start":3421.5299999999997,"end":3424.0099999999998,"text":"跟DIO一樣會收集國外的商情"},{"start":3424.0099999999998,"end":3426.1699999999996,"text":"然後回饋到這個平台上面"},{"start":3426.1699999999996,"end":3428.1699999999996,"text":"那如果說這個平台上面"},{"start":3428.1699999999996,"end":3430.89,"text":"我們提出相關的這個需求"},{"start":3430.89,"end":3434.6499999999996,"text":"那麼廠商如果會願意來進一步提供"},{"start":3434.6499999999996,"end":3438.33,"text":"這樣子的一個"},{"start":3438.33,"end":3440.81,"text":"不管是硬體或者軟體的一個"},{"start":3440.81,"end":3442.49,"text":"迭代更新的話"},{"start":3442.49,"end":3447.0499999999997,"text":"那我想我們透過這個特別預算的話"},{"start":3447.0499999999997,"end":3450.0099999999998,"text":"那我們每年都會由評選委員會來"},{"start":3450.09,"end":3451.61,"text":"進行最有力標的審查"},{"start":3451.61,"end":3454.25,"text":"那這些都他的迭代更新的速度"},{"start":3454.25,"end":3456.4100000000003,"text":"都會放入我們加分的項目裡面"},{"start":3456.4100000000003,"end":3459.7700000000004,"text":"好那另一方面我們看到這個台美"},{"start":3459.7700000000004,"end":3461.53,"text":"在軍工合作上"},{"start":3461.53,"end":3465.9300000000003,"text":"在從這個軍售走向共同生產"},{"start":3465.9300000000003,"end":3468.73,"text":"那除了先前已經公開證實的這個"},{"start":3468.73,"end":3469.7700000000004,"text":"155榴彈以外"},{"start":3469.7700000000004,"end":3472.4900000000002,"text":"美國去年在國防授權法案"},{"start":3472.4900000000002,"end":3476.57,"text":"也有提到要啟動和台灣之間的這個無人系統"},{"start":3476.57,"end":3479.9300000000003,"text":"以及反無人系統能力的一個聯合計畫"},{"start":3479.9300000000003,"end":3482.57,"text":"包括共同開發共同生產系統"},{"start":3482.57,"end":3484.65,"text":"提供雙方的這個部隊使用"},{"start":3484.65,"end":3487.13,"text":"而我們在近期也看到報載消息"},{"start":3487.13,"end":3489.13,"text":"在雙方建立的這個共識"},{"start":3489.13,"end":3492.25,"text":"能夠共同合作生產的裝備當中"},{"start":3492.25,"end":3495.77,"text":"由中科院研發的進風一型無人機系統"},{"start":3495.77,"end":3497.9300000000003,"text":"包含這個彈藥本體"},{"start":3497.9300000000003,"end":3501.21,"text":"還有我們單筒發射器地面控制站"},{"start":3501.21,"end":3503.77,"text":"以及模組化戰鬥背包"},{"start":3503.77,"end":3505.61,"text":"那有機會全系統"},{"start":3506.01,"end":3509.13,"text":"在我們這邊生產之後外銷國際"},{"start":3509.13,"end":3513.21,"text":"那有關無人機系統在台美合作的共同生產"},{"start":3513.21,"end":3514.9700000000003,"text":"還有合作外銷的規劃"},{"start":3514.9700000000003,"end":3517.85,"text":"包括如何由美方待委外銷"},{"start":3517.85,"end":3521.4500000000003,"text":"以及相較於使用多年的這個彈簧刀"},{"start":3521.4500000000003,"end":3524.81,"text":"我們的這個進風具有什麼樣的優勢"},{"start":3524.81,"end":3528.33,"text":"那部長有沒有能夠就公開的部分簡要說明一下"},{"start":3529.81,"end":3532.93,"text":"進風的次組打擊能力跟"},{"start":3533.72,"end":3534.2799999999997,"text":"一個"},{"start":3535.62,"end":3537.62,"text":"就是說多載的跨域操控性"},{"start":3537.62,"end":3540.42,"text":"有相當的國際經濟優勢不過"},{"start":3541.35,"end":3544.55,"text":"我想中科院的部分"},{"start":3544.55,"end":3546.55,"text":"跟"},{"start":3546.55,"end":3548.55,"text":"涉及到"},{"start":3548.55,"end":3552.15,"text":"雙方的綁定條款可能沒有辦法在這裡做具體的回應"},{"start":3552.15,"end":3554.95,"text":"那這個進風跟彈簧刀的部分"},{"start":3554.95,"end":3556.95,"text":"兩個相比的話"},{"start":3556.95,"end":3558.95,"text":"部長"},{"start":3559.3599999999997,"end":3561.3599999999997,"text":"這個中科院會"},{"start":3561.3599999999997,"end":3563.3599999999997,"text":"我來說明好了"},{"start":3563.3599999999997,"end":3566.08,"text":"委員去年7月我們在蘇澳外海展演的時候"},{"start":3566.08,"end":3567.4399999999996,"text":"委員也有來參加"},{"start":3567.4399999999996,"end":3569.12,"text":"那時候我們用進風一行"},{"start":3569.12,"end":3571.12,"text":"它的一鍵自主打擊能力"},{"start":3571.12,"end":3573.12,"text":"還有它可以從海上的無人艇"},{"start":3573.12,"end":3576,"text":"從陸上的無人艇和空中的無人機上發射"},{"start":3576,"end":3578,"text":"這些跨載台的"},{"start":3578,"end":3581.2799999999997,"text":"那個發射能力都是比較它具有優勢的地方"},{"start":3582.73,"end":3585.77,"text":"所以應該是進風比較有優勢"},{"start":3585.77,"end":3587.77,"text":"我想"},{"start":3587.77,"end":3589.77,"text":"我想"},{"start":3589.77,"end":3591.77,"text":"我們再看看"},{"start":3591.77,"end":3593.77,"text":"以後有沒有什麼樣子的"},{"start":3593.77,"end":3595.77,"text":"一個具體的進展"},{"start":3595.77,"end":3597.77,"text":"再跟委員報告"},{"start":3597.77,"end":3599.77,"text":"以上謝謝部長"},{"start":3604.11,"end":3606.15,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":3605.95,"end":3607.99,"text":"接下來請陳永康委員上台諮詢"},{"start":3624.97,"end":3627.0099999999998,"text":"請過部長"},{"start":3628.53,"end":3630.57,"text":"中科院李院長"},{"start":3633.49,"end":3635.49,"text":"採購室主任也請一起上來"},{"start":3635.49,"end":3637.49,"text":"採購室主任"},{"start":3637.49,"end":3639.49,"text":"部長好"},{"start":3639.49,"end":3641.49,"text":"前面兩位委員"},{"start":3641.49,"end":3643.49,"text":"都提到了這一次有關"},{"start":3643.49,"end":3645.49,"text":"無人機"},{"start":3645.49,"end":3647.49,"text":"不管是合作生產或者無人機導控"},{"start":3647.49,"end":3649.49,"text":"那麼包括第一個就是"},{"start":3649.49,"end":3651.49,"text":"前面講的這個"},{"start":3651.49,"end":3653.49,"text":"無人機的干擾系統"},{"start":3653.49,"end":3655.49,"text":"因為羅委員也很重視這個"},{"start":3655.49,"end":3657.49,"text":"剛才陸軍參謀長也講了很多的重點"},{"start":3657.49,"end":3659.49,"text":"那這裡面"},{"start":3659.49,"end":3661.49,"text":"我特別提出一點"},{"start":3661.49,"end":3663.5299999999997,"text":"我希望中科院院長做回覆"},{"start":3664.7799999999997,"end":3666.7799999999997,"text":"創未來實際上在八年前"},{"start":3666.7799999999997,"end":3668.7799999999997,"text":"就跟中科院有過合作"},{"start":3668.7799999999997,"end":3670.7799999999997,"text":"那個時候是在小英前任"},{"start":3670.7799999999997,"end":3672.7799999999997,"text":"總統的時候合作"},{"start":3672.7799999999997,"end":3674.7799999999997,"text":"合作的後面"},{"start":3674.7799999999997,"end":3676.7799999999997,"text":"就等於說雙方"},{"start":3676.7799999999997,"end":3678.7799999999997,"text":"沒有達成共識這樣解釋"},{"start":3678.7799999999997,"end":3680.7799999999997,"text":"這個計劃就終止了"},{"start":3680.7799999999997,"end":3682.7799999999997,"text":"因此他就"},{"start":3682.7799999999997,"end":3684.7799999999997,"text":"王主持人出去"},{"start":3684.7799999999997,"end":3686.7799999999997,"text":"就創未來了"},{"start":3686.7799999999997,"end":3688.7799999999997,"text":"所以創未來實際上是原來是學"},{"start":3688.7799999999997,"end":3690.7799999999997,"text":"這個是學校研發"},{"start":3690.7799999999997,"end":3692.7799999999997,"text":"跟中科院那以後外面再有人"},{"start":3692.82,"end":3694.82,"text":"建築成立擴大公司是另外一回事"},{"start":3694.82,"end":3696.82,"text":"這裡面產生了一個重要的"},{"start":3696.82,"end":3698.82,"text":"就是中科院往往在"},{"start":3698.82,"end":3700.82,"text":"跟國內廠商在合作的過程中間"},{"start":3700.82,"end":3702.82,"text":"因為"},{"start":3703.75,"end":3705.75,"text":"有很多是敏感的規格"},{"start":3705.75,"end":3707.75,"text":"實際上因為是"},{"start":3707.41,"end":3709.41,"text":"共同研究了"},{"start":3709.41,"end":3711.41,"text":"所以這個規格他就拿出去了"},{"start":3711.41,"end":3713.41,"text":"拿出去了以後他創未來"},{"start":3713.41,"end":3715.41,"text":"所以他就拓展他的市場"},{"start":3715.41,"end":3717.41,"text":"也到美國國防產業"},{"start":3717.41,"end":3719.41,"text":"在美國也做過演講"},{"start":3719.41,"end":3721.41,"text":"我也聽過這個"},{"start":3720.62,"end":3722.62,"text":"現在他這一次"},{"start":3722.62,"end":3724.62,"text":"不達標"},{"start":3724.62,"end":3726.62,"text":"當然我覺得我們的陸軍是"},{"start":3726.62,"end":3728.62,"text":"遵守自己的規格"},{"start":3728.62,"end":3730.62,"text":"現在就是採購過程中間"},{"start":3730.62,"end":3732.62,"text":"如果"},{"start":3732.62,"end":3734.62,"text":"不達標"},{"start":3734.62,"end":3736.62,"text":"並不是終止合約"},{"start":3736.62,"end":3738.62,"text":"因為有很多東西有罰則"},{"start":3738.62,"end":3740.62,"text":"等於你耽誤了我兩年"},{"start":3740.62,"end":3742.62,"text":"三年的發展時間"},{"start":3742.62,"end":3744.62,"text":"其他家有的就停掉了"},{"start":3744.62,"end":3746.62,"text":"這個部分中科院回應一下"},{"start":3746.62,"end":3748.62,"text":"然後再採購師回應好不好"},{"start":3749.61,"end":3751.65,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":3750.57,"end":3752.57,"text":"首先那個委員剛有提到中科院跟"},{"start":3752.57,"end":3754.57,"text":"創未來之前合作的過程"},{"start":3754.57,"end":3756.57,"text":"的確就是說"},{"start":3757.37,"end":3759.41,"text":"據我了解其實就是大家對"},{"start":3760.55,"end":3762.55,"text":"硬體和軟體"},{"start":3762.55,"end":3764.55,"text":"開發的重要性的程度不同"},{"start":3764.55,"end":3766.55,"text":"所以後來產生了分歧"},{"start":3767.62,"end":3769.62,"text":"硬體開發的部分後來就留在中科院部分"},{"start":3769.62,"end":3771.62,"text":"但是把演算法和軟體"},{"start":3771.62,"end":3773.62,"text":"原本由創未來開發的部分"},{"start":3773.62,"end":3775.62,"text":"就整個拿走了"},{"start":3775.62,"end":3777.62,"text":"所以當時鬧得非常不愉快"},{"start":3778.25,"end":3780.25,"text":"這一次陸軍的在外島的表演"},{"start":3780.25,"end":3782.25,"text":"其實還是又回到"},{"start":3783.38,"end":3785.38,"text":"大概七年多前"},{"start":3785.38,"end":3787.38,"text":"增值的那個原點"},{"start":3787.38,"end":3789.38,"text":"他在他的TR就是他的工序放大"},{"start":3789.38,"end":3791.38,"text":"發射端"},{"start":3791.5099999999998,"end":3793.5099999999998,"text":"他的DOMEDEDGE部分"},{"start":3793.5099999999998,"end":3795.5099999999998,"text":"其實從一開始硬體的問題"},{"start":3795.5099999999998,"end":3796.5099999999998,"text":"就沒有解決好"},{"start":3796.5099999999998,"end":3798.5099999999998,"text":"所以他的雜訊比就一直在"},{"start":3799.44,"end":3801.44,"text":"所以這個問題將來"},{"start":3801.44,"end":3803.44,"text":"我們提供陸軍"},{"start":3803.44,"end":3805.44,"text":"陸軍參謀長您做參考"},{"start":3805.44,"end":3807.44,"text":"也就是說在檢驗"},{"start":3807.44,"end":3809.44,"text":"廠商規格的時候"},{"start":3809.44,"end":3811.44,"text":"檢驗產生的問題"},{"start":3811.44,"end":3813.44,"text":"所以這個問題將來"},{"start":3813.44,"end":3815.44,"text":"我們提供陸軍"},{"start":3815.44,"end":3817.44,"text":"陸軍參謀長您做參考"},{"start":3817.44,"end":3819.44,"text":"也就是說在檢驗"},{"start":3819.44,"end":3821.44,"text":"廠商規格的時候"},{"start":3821.44,"end":3823.44,"text":"檢驗產生的問題"},{"start":3823.44,"end":3825.44,"text":"所以這個問題將來"},{"start":3825.44,"end":3827.44,"text":"我們提供陸軍"},{"start":3820.86,"end":3822.86,"text":"不妨把中科院過去經驗納入"},{"start":3822.86,"end":3824.86,"text":"我們是要"},{"start":3825.65,"end":3827.65,"text":"我們是要解決問題"},{"start":3827.65,"end":3829.65,"text":"而不是去探討現在問題的"},{"start":3829.65,"end":3830.65,"text":"誰的責任"},{"start":3830.65,"end":3831.65,"text":"因為在研發過程中"},{"start":3831.65,"end":3833.65,"text":"本來沒有一個案子是完全成功的"},{"start":3833.65,"end":3835.65,"text":"就是滾動修正"},{"start":3835.65,"end":3837.65,"text":"過去的錯誤經驗"},{"start":3837.65,"end":3839.65,"text":"變成後面成功的墊腳石"},{"start":3839.65,"end":3841.65,"text":"但是不要再犯"},{"start":3841.65,"end":3842.65,"text":"那回過頭來"},{"start":3842.65,"end":3844.65,"text":"那就是請教採購室主任"},{"start":3844.65,"end":3847.65,"text":"您對如果這個履約的過程中間"},{"start":3847.65,"end":3849.65,"text":"他達不到達標"},{"start":3849.65,"end":3851.65,"text":"那是沒收履約金呢"},{"start":3851.65,"end":3852.65,"text":"保證金呢"},{"start":3852.65,"end":3854.65,"text":"還是還有其外罰則"},{"start":3854.69,"end":3856.69,"text":"其實一切都假以雙方"},{"start":3856.69,"end":3858.69,"text":"回歸到契約的規範"},{"start":3858.69,"end":3860.69,"text":"那這個案子的契約規範"},{"start":3860.69,"end":3861.69,"text":"第一個"},{"start":3861.69,"end":3862.69,"text":"他違約"},{"start":3862.69,"end":3865.69,"text":"他沒辦法履行完成這個標的"},{"start":3865.69,"end":3866.69,"text":"第一個"},{"start":3866.69,"end":3867.69,"text":"我們會解除契約"},{"start":3867.69,"end":3869.69,"text":"我們不會付給他任何的價金"},{"start":3870.67,"end":3871.67,"text":"第一個是"},{"start":3871.67,"end":3872.67,"text":"另外"},{"start":3872.67,"end":3874.67,"text":"因為他有預期"},{"start":3874.67,"end":3876.67,"text":"我們會按照預期罰金"},{"start":3876.67,"end":3878.67,"text":"第三個是履約保證金"},{"start":3878.67,"end":3880.67,"text":"履約保證金我們沒收"},{"start":3880.67,"end":3881.67,"text":"第四個就是"},{"start":3881.67,"end":3883.67,"text":"會檢討刊登他的庭權"},{"start":3883.67,"end":3885.67,"text":"所以有以上的四種"},{"start":3885.67,"end":3887.67,"text":"四項的罰則"},{"start":3887.67,"end":3890.67,"text":"好 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277.39,"text":"條例的時候再跟其他的委員"},{"start":5277.39,"end":5279.39,"text":"再更清楚談"},{"start":5279.39,"end":5281.39,"text":"確實大家聽起來有一些"},{"start":5281.39,"end":5283.39,"text":"就是可以用共同供應區"},{"start":5283.39,"end":5285.39,"text":"那有一些因為特殊軍種"},{"start":5285.39,"end":5287.39,"text":"有特殊的考量"},{"start":5287.39,"end":5289.39,"text":"那一塊不可能放上去"},{"start":5289.39,"end":5291.39,"text":"好謝謝"},{"start":5294.56,"end":5296.56,"text":"好謝謝"},{"start":5296.56,"end":5298.56,"text":"接下來請林楚英委員上台諮詢"},{"start":5310.81,"end":5312.81,"text":"謝謝主席有請顧部長"},{"start":5312.81,"end":5314.81,"text":"請顧部長"},{"start":5320.72,"end":5322.72,"text":"是林委員好部長早安"},{"start":5322.72,"end":5324.72,"text":"我有認真的看一下今天的報告"},{"start":5324.72,"end":5326.72,"text":"那麼當然我們都知道"},{"start":5326.72,"end":5328.72,"text":"這個對於這個整個軍事"},{"start":5328.72,"end":5330.72,"text":"採購來說國防部制定了"},{"start":5330.72,"end":5332.72,"text":"相關的作戰計畫跟需求"},{"start":5332.72,"end":5334.72,"text":"之後我們當然是希望"},{"start":5334.72,"end":5336.72,"text":"這些所要的軍備都能夠"},{"start":5336.72,"end":5338.72,"text":"如期到貨如果根據你們"},{"start":5338.72,"end":5340.72,"text":"的這個所謂採購的經濟"},{"start":5340.72,"end":5342.72,"text":"作為的整理當然就有六"},{"start":5342.72,"end":5344.72,"text":"大項的爭議而這個六"},{"start":5344.72,"end":5346.72,"text":"大項的爭議我就不足以"},{"start":5346.72,"end":5348.72,"text":"來來履約的爭議"},{"start":5348.72,"end":5350.72,"text":"我就不足以來念喔"},{"start":5350.72,"end":5352.72,"text":"但是我相信他大概歸結的這個結論"},{"start":5352.72,"end":5354.72,"text":"大概就是說第一個"},{"start":5354.72,"end":5356.72,"text":"當然廠商他高估了自己"},{"start":5356.72,"end":5358.72,"text":"所謂的履約的能力"},{"start":5358.72,"end":5360.72,"text":"再來我相信也是國防部"},{"start":5360.72,"end":5362.72,"text":"可能低估了在這個履約"},{"start":5362.72,"end":5364.72,"text":"的過程當中可能產生的風險"},{"start":5364.72,"end":5366.72,"text":"除了所謂的這個進出口"},{"start":5366.72,"end":5368.72,"text":"的管制或者是"},{"start":5368.72,"end":5370.72,"text":"國外的這些廠商"},{"start":5370.72,"end":5372.72,"text":"他們本身產能的調節"},{"start":5372.72,"end":5374.72,"text":"之外我想其實"},{"start":5374.72,"end":5376.72,"text":"在這個過程當中國防部這些年來"},{"start":5376.72,"end":5378.72,"text":"來做採購一定都有你們"},{"start":5378.72,"end":5380.72,"text":"一定的這個想法了"},{"start":5380.72,"end":5382.72,"text":"那麼我要特別講的是我們現在"},{"start":5382.72,"end":5384.72,"text":"總預算喔雖然在委員會"},{"start":5384.72,"end":5386.72,"text":"已經出去了不過要"},{"start":5386.72,"end":5388.72,"text":"三讀可能最快也要"},{"start":5388.72,"end":5390.72,"text":"八月之後國防部"},{"start":5390.72,"end":5392.72,"text":"其實沒有"},{"start":5392.67,"end":5394.67,"text":"這個不了解"},{"start":5394.67,"end":5396.67,"text":"如果說實質上"},{"start":5396.67,"end":5398.67,"text":"這個採購發生問題沒有辦法"},{"start":5398.67,"end":5400.67,"text":"履約的時候會生機"},{"start":5400.67,"end":5402.67,"text":"所以在我們的這個"},{"start":5402.67,"end":5404.67,"text":"總預算當中其實"},{"start":5404.67,"end":5406.67,"text":"你們已經想出了一個精進的辦法"},{"start":5406.67,"end":5408.67,"text":"其實就是所謂的小量的"},{"start":5408.67,"end":5410.67,"text":"現貨採購然後讓"},{"start":5410.67,"end":5412.67,"text":"部隊來做測試那麼"},{"start":5412.67,"end":5414.67,"text":"在測試過了之後如果"},{"start":5414.67,"end":5416.67,"text":"有他的需求我們再"},{"start":5416.67,"end":5418.67,"text":"把它量產建軍跟"},{"start":5418.67,"end":5420.67,"text":"部署以及參考這個我相信"},{"start":5420.67,"end":5422.67,"text":"在上個月我們在委員會"},{"start":5422.67,"end":5424.67,"text":"這裡我們在審預算的時候"},{"start":5424.67,"end":5426.67,"text":"都有發現這樣的"},{"start":5426.67,"end":5428.67,"text":"方式其實有助於未來"},{"start":5428.67,"end":5430.67,"text":"在履約的時候可以避免剛剛"},{"start":5430.67,"end":5432.67,"text":"我所提的這個兩個狀況發生"},{"start":5432.67,"end":5434.67,"text":"那麼今年度我們"},{"start":5434.67,"end":5436.67,"text":"相對編的是一億三千"},{"start":5436.67,"end":5438.67,"text":"一百七十"},{"start":5438.67,"end":5440.67,"text":"一億三千"},{"start":5440.83,"end":5442.83,"text":"一百七十萬九千元"},{"start":5442.83,"end":5444.83,"text":"但是現在這些預算是卡在"},{"start":5445.64,"end":5447.64,"text":"還沒有辦法三讀"},{"start":5447.64,"end":5449.64,"text":"而有五個單位包括陸軍"},{"start":5449.64,"end":5451.64,"text":"海軍空軍限止不更"},{"start":5452.8,"end":5454.8,"text":"這個資訊電軍部長我想問的是"},{"start":5454.8,"end":5456.8,"text":"我們原本是有一個"},{"start":5456.8,"end":5458.8,"text":"很好的模式可以來"},{"start":5458.8,"end":5460.8,"text":"針對優化或者是"},{"start":5460.8,"end":5462.8,"text":"精進這樣的採購計畫"},{"start":5462.8,"end":5464.8,"text":"但是如果說現在"},{"start":5464.8,"end":5466.8,"text":"總一算就是卡住所以表示"},{"start":5466.8,"end":5468.8,"text":"這一億三千七百多萬"},{"start":5468.8,"end":5470.8,"text":"三千"},{"start":5470.33,"end":5472.33,"text":"一百多萬是不能使用的"},{"start":5472.33,"end":5474.33,"text":"那如果是這樣的話"},{"start":5474.33,"end":5476.33,"text":"我想要問這五個單位"},{"start":5476.33,"end":5478.33,"text":"目前你們這個所謂小量"},{"start":5478.33,"end":5480.33,"text":"的採購的期程是不是就被"},{"start":5480.33,"end":5482.33,"text":"卡住了或者是部長是不是"},{"start":5482.33,"end":5484.33,"text":"了解這樣的一個狀況因為其實"},{"start":5484.33,"end":5486.33,"text":"我們明明有一個優化的計畫"},{"start":5486.33,"end":5488.33,"text":"就是希望透過小量的採購"},{"start":5488.33,"end":5490.33,"text":"可是現在這個預算又卡在"},{"start":5490.33,"end":5492.33,"text":"這裡那麼因為這是新增的"},{"start":5492.33,"end":5494.33,"text":"新增我們都知道"},{"start":5494.33,"end":5496.33,"text":"就是不能用那麼現在"},{"start":5496.33,"end":5498.33,"text":"最快如果八月底總算可以過的時候"},{"start":5498.33,"end":5500.33,"text":"年都過了大半年"},{"start":5500.33,"end":5502.33,"text":"那這些測試"},{"start":5502.33,"end":5504.33,"text":"是不是也就淪為空談"},{"start":5504.33,"end":5506.33,"text":"影響到到底有哪些層面"},{"start":5506.33,"end":5508.33,"text":"那麼這個期程又會造成什麼樣的影響"},{"start":5508.33,"end":5510.33,"text":"我們立法院總不能一邊"},{"start":5510.33,"end":5512.33,"text":"請你們過來報告說"},{"start":5512.33,"end":5514.33,"text":"你們這個旅約有爭議"},{"start":5514.33,"end":5516.33,"text":"然後無法該要到的貨都"},{"start":5516.33,"end":5518.33,"text":"到不了可是我們提出精進"},{"start":5518.33,"end":5520.33,"text":"計畫的時候這些精進計畫又不能"},{"start":5520.33,"end":5522.33,"text":"用那等於行通就擺在"},{"start":5522.33,"end":5524.33,"text":"那裡部長現在的狀況"},{"start":5524.33,"end":5526.33,"text":"到底如何五個單位有受到"},{"start":5526.33,"end":5528.33,"text":"延後嗎那麼他所延後造成的影響"},{"start":5528.33,"end":5530.33,"text":"是什麼"},{"start":5530.07,"end":5532.07,"text":"主要是"},{"start":5532.07,"end":5534.07,"text":"115年的"},{"start":5534.07,"end":5536.07,"text":"我們115年我們116年也會"},{"start":5536.07,"end":5538.07,"text":"編列"},{"start":5538.07,"end":5540.07,"text":"那116年的預算"},{"start":5540.07,"end":5542.07,"text":"還沒送進來"},{"start":5542.07,"end":5544.07,"text":"那115年的部分我們有幾個"},{"start":5544.07,"end":5546.07,"text":"原型開發案跟小品樣採購案"},{"start":5546.07,"end":5548.07,"text":"那因為現在預算還沒有通過"},{"start":5548.07,"end":5550.07,"text":"所以現在就"},{"start":5553.51,"end":5555.51,"text":"屬於新增案確實沒有辦法"},{"start":5555.51,"end":5557.51,"text":"來進入"},{"start":5557.51,"end":5559.51,"text":"這個執行的階段"},{"start":5559.51,"end":5561.51,"text":"好所以我想要知道的是"},{"start":5562.76,"end":5564.76,"text":"我相信"},{"start":5564.16,"end":5566.16,"text":"今天在這裡我們要討論的題目"},{"start":5566.16,"end":5568.16,"text":"就是說如果有一個"},{"start":5568.16,"end":5570.16,"text":"精進計畫可以讓"},{"start":5570.16,"end":5572.16,"text":"我們的旅約能夠"},{"start":5572.16,"end":5574.16,"text":"更有效率那麼這個"},{"start":5574.16,"end":5576.16,"text":"絕對是國防部提出來的一個方式"},{"start":5576.16,"end":5578.16,"text":"所以我想問的是如果"},{"start":5578.16,"end":5580.16,"text":"就在目前來講的話這五個"},{"start":5580.16,"end":5582.16,"text":"單位或者是說海軍"},{"start":5582.16,"end":5584.16,"text":"陸軍空軍或縣止部或自通電"},{"start":5584.16,"end":5586.16,"text":"指揮部可不可以"},{"start":5586.16,"end":5588.16,"text":"來回答就是如果這個"},{"start":5588.16,"end":5590.16,"text":"計畫已經過去大半年了"},{"start":5590.16,"end":5592.16,"text":"但是目前沒有執行那麼對我們"},{"start":5592.16,"end":5594.16,"text":"未來在軍事採購上面會造成"},{"start":5594.16,"end":5596.16,"text":"哪一些具體的影響"},{"start":5596.16,"end":5598.16,"text":"可以回應嗎"},{"start":5600.27,"end":5602.27,"text":"那個陳平思DIO這邊"},{"start":5602.27,"end":5604.27,"text":"跟委員做個回應就是您剛剛提到"},{"start":5604.27,"end":5606.27,"text":"這個少量採購也是我們"},{"start":5606.27,"end":5608.27,"text":"仿照現在歐美國家的一些做法"},{"start":5608.27,"end":5610.27,"text":"那是在軍種"},{"start":5610.27,"end":5612.27,"text":"作戰需求的考量下針對一些"},{"start":5612.27,"end":5614.27,"text":"現貨比較成熟或是有一些部署"},{"start":5614.27,"end":5616.27,"text":"實際的產品趕快"},{"start":5616.27,"end":5618.27,"text":"做一個小量的採購讓軍種"},{"start":5618.27,"end":5620.27,"text":"可以依他的任務的場景做"},{"start":5620.27,"end":5622.27,"text":"一個測試或做某種"},{"start":5622.27,"end":5624.27,"text":"作戰效益的評估"},{"start":5624.27,"end":5626.27,"text":"那陳如委員所說目前因為"},{"start":5626.27,"end":5628.27,"text":"預算的關係所以這樣子的品項"},{"start":5628.27,"end":5630.27,"text":"沒有辦法做採購那不過我們也請"},{"start":5630.27,"end":5632.27,"text":"各個軍種他們"},{"start":5632.27,"end":5634.27,"text":"針對這些項目的這個"},{"start":5634.27,"end":5636.27,"text":"評測計畫已經先完成規劃"},{"start":5636.27,"end":5638.27,"text":"那一旦獲付預算後獲得裝備"},{"start":5638.27,"end":5640.27,"text":"讓軍種可以盡早來啟動"},{"start":5640.27,"end":5642.27,"text":"這樣子裝備的測試"},{"start":5642.27,"end":5644.27,"text":"好我關心的重點就是說"},{"start":5644.27,"end":5646.27,"text":"現在是115年"},{"start":5646.27,"end":5648.27,"text":"但是115年"},{"start":5648.27,"end":5650.27,"text":"因為這是新增計畫"},{"start":5650.27,"end":5652.27,"text":"所以他基本上就沒有辦法去做"},{"start":5652.27,"end":5654.27,"text":"採購也無法做測試"},{"start":5654.27,"end":5656.27,"text":"而現在已經7月"},{"start":5656.27,"end":5658.27,"text":"即將到8月而我們要編的是"},{"start":5658.27,"end":5660.27,"text":"116年"},{"start":5660.27,"end":5662.27,"text":"也就是明年度的預算"},{"start":5662.27,"end":5664.27,"text":"那這些已經"},{"start":5664.27,"end":5666.27,"text":"無法進行採購跟"},{"start":5666.27,"end":5668.27,"text":"測試的這些項目"},{"start":5668.27,"end":5670.27,"text":"或單位你們是要評議到"},{"start":5670.27,"end":5672.27,"text":"116年嗎"},{"start":5672.27,"end":5674.27,"text":"還是說現在"},{"start":5674.27,"end":5676.27,"text":"就是直接用這個部分因為我們知道"},{"start":5676.27,"end":5678.27,"text":"這個其實"},{"start":5678.27,"end":5680.27,"text":"預算在這裡計畫在這裡"},{"start":5680.27,"end":5682.27,"text":"我其實是非常好奇就是"},{"start":5682.27,"end":5684.27,"text":"像現在這樣的預算到底"},{"start":5684.27,"end":5686.27,"text":"應該要怎麼編對國防部來說"},{"start":5686.27,"end":5688.27,"text":"尤其這個是我們今天"},{"start":5688.27,"end":5690.27,"text":"符合我們今天主題就是如何來"},{"start":5690.27,"end":5692.27,"text":"解決我們在採購的過程當中"},{"start":5692.27,"end":5694.27,"text":"然後避免"},{"start":5694.27,"end":5696.27,"text":"履約延遲或發生爭議"},{"start":5696.27,"end":5698.27,"t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