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邀請國防部部長顧立雄報告因應敵情與灰色地帶威脅升高"},{"start":1674.19,"end":1679.19,"text":"國軍如何強化官兵精神戰力建構及心理韌性作為並被質詢"},{"start":1679.19,"end":1683.19,"text":"國防部部長顧立雄政治作戰局局長是順文報告"},{"start":1683.19,"end":1685.19,"text":"委員陳俊宇等12人質詢"},{"start":1685.44,"end":1692.44,"text":"軍友國防部部長顧立雄政治作戰局局長是順文政治作戰局文勳新站處處長王怡紅"},{"start":1694.33,"end":1696.33,"text":"陸軍司令部參謀長陳建義"},{"start":1696.33,"end":1702.33,"text":"憲兵指揮部參謀長張純志及國家中山科學研究院院長李世強等集席答覆"},{"start":1702.33,"end":1706.33,"text":"決定因登記質詢在場委員均已發言完畢報告及巡達結束"},{"start":1706.33,"end":1711.33,"text":"二委員盧美林、林楚英、徐巧芯所提書面質詢列入記錄刊登公報"},{"start":1711.33,"end":1716.33,"text":"三委員所提書面及口頭質詢未及答覆後要求提供之資訊"},{"start":1716.33,"end":1720.33,"text":"請國防部與二中令以書面答覆本會全體委員並赴資本會"},{"start":1720.33,"end":1723.33,"text":"委員令指定期限者從其鎖定"},{"start":1727.09,"end":1729.09,"text":"請醫事人員宣讀報告事項"},{"start":1729.97,"end":1730.97,"text":"報告事項"},{"start":1730.97,"end":1734.97,"text":"邀請外交部部長林佳龍、僑務委員會委員長許家清報告"},{"start":1734.97,"end":1742.97,"text":"外交與僑務協同培育青年國際事業之執行成效與多餘佈局並被質詢宣讀完畢"},{"start":1744.91,"end":1748.91,"text":"好,我們現在介紹在場委員以及與會的官員"},{"start":1748.91,"end":1750.91,"text":"首先介紹陳永康陳委員"},{"start":1752.16,"end":1755.16,"text":"以及外交部林佳龍林部長"},{"start":1756.67,"end":1759.67,"text":"亞東太平洋司林鴻勳林副司長"},{"start":1761.75,"end":1764.75,"text":"亞西吉非洲司袁家良嚴司長"},{"start":1765.68,"end":1767.68,"text":"歐洲司黃軍耀黃司長"},{"start":1769.17,"end":1772.17,"text":"拉美吉加勒比海斯韓智政韓司長"},{"start":1774.07,"end":1778.07,"text":"國條約法律司李憲章理事長"},{"start":1780.97,"end":1784.97,"text":"國際合作及經濟事務司葉志成葉司長"},{"start":1787.94,"end":1791.94,"text":"國際組織司孫檢員孫司長"},{"start":1794.06,"end":1797.06,"text":"國際傳播司張秀蓁張司長"},{"start":1798.64,"end":1801.64,"text":"研究設計會柯良瑞柯主任"},{"start":1803.9,"end":1805.9,"text":"秘書處陳錦麟陳處長"},{"start":1808.59,"end":1811.59,"text":"人事處呂士一呂處長"},{"start":1812.78,"end":1815.78,"text":"政風處孔縣台孔處長"},{"start":1816.37,"end":1818.37,"text":"主席處理配華呂處長"},{"start":1819.65,"end":1823.65,"text":"公眾外交協調會陳怡君陳副執行長"},{"start":1825.6,"end":1830.6,"text":"非政府組織國際事務會江政委江執行長"},{"start":1831.49,"end":1834.49,"text":"臨時事務局鄭政永政局長"},{"start":1835.69,"end":1839.69,"text":"外交及國際事務學院李倩儀黎副院長"},{"start":1841.92,"end":1844.92,"text":"臺灣日本關係協會洪英傑洪秘書長"},{"start":1847.25,"end":1851.25,"text":"成委委員會徐家清徐委員長"},{"start":1853.4,"end":1855.4,"text":"李延慧 李副委員長"},{"start":1856.91,"end":1858.91,"text":"榮耀榮主任秘書"},{"start":1861.07,"end":1864.07,"text":"以及綜合規劃處吳春芳吳處長"},{"start":1865.9,"end":1867.9,"text":"僑民處陳永峰陳處長"},{"start":1869.26,"end":1871.26,"text":"僑教處林紀勇 林處長"},{"start":1872.67,"end":1874.67,"text":"僑商處莊雅淑莊處長"},{"start":1876.63,"end":1878.63,"text":"僑生處張文華張處長"},{"start":1879.69,"end":1881.69,"text":"主席是柯淑玲 柯主任"},{"start":1883.33,"end":1886.33,"text":"曹悟通訓社 羅榮 羅總編輯"},{"start":1887.52,"end":1892.52,"text":"財團法人海華文教基金會 廖雲軒 廖執行長"},{"start":1896.09,"end":1906.09,"text":"本日會議邀請外交部僑務委員會報告外交與僑務協同培育青年國際視野之執行成效與多餘布局並被質詢"},{"start":1906.09,"end":1909.09,"text":"我們現在請外交部林部長上台報告"},{"start":1918.85,"end":1920.85,"text":"主席、各位委員、各位女士先生大家早安"},{"start":1922.18,"end":1934.18,"text":"陳文貴委員會邀請報告外交與僑務協同培育青年國際視野之執行成效與多餘布局來進行專題報告"},{"start":1934.45,"end":1936.45,"text":"那"},{"start":1935.59,"end":1942.59,"text":"青年是台灣未來的棟梁和希望也是台灣外交最重要的資產與公眾外交的堅冰"},{"start":1942.59,"end":1950.59,"text":"那外交部基於總和外交策略、整合資源與僑務委員會、教育部等相關部會協同合作"},{"start":1950.59,"end":1952.59,"text":"擴大青年交流國際網絡"},{"start":1952.59,"end":1955.59,"text":"發揮步步都是外交部的忠孝"},{"start":1955.59,"end":1963.59,"text":"那也呢加強培育具備國際視野、具跨文化溝通能力跟多餘優勢的青年人才"},{"start":1963.59,"end":1967.59,"text":"那也在這次的青年國際視野中,鼓勵青年以自身的專業與行動走向世界"},{"start":1967.59,"end":1973.59,"text":"代表民主台灣分享台灣故事,落實人人都是外交官的理念"},{"start":1973.59,"end":1978.59,"text":"那在政府推動青年國際參與方面,我們的核心目標有三個"},{"start":1978.59,"end":1986.59,"text":"一是呢拓展青年國際視野與實務經驗,培養具全球競爭力的下一代"},{"start":1986.59,"end":1994.59,"text":"二是透過青年真實互動,向國際社會傳遞民主台灣的價值,創新與溫和"},{"start":1995.16,"end":1997.16,"text":"溫暖"},{"start":1997.44,"end":2005.44,"text":"三是建立海內外青年網絡,強化公眾外交永續動能"},{"start":2006.08,"end":2013.08,"text":"那本人在接任外交部長之後,也很重視推動青年參與國際事務跟公眾外交"},{"start":2013.08,"end":2022.08,"text":"特別是本部與教育部僑委會等部會,全力協同推動青年百億海外圓夢基金的計畫"},{"start":2022.08,"end":2028.08,"text":"配合僑委會推動台灣青年海外搭橋計畫與相關培立"},{"start":2028.08,"end":2038.08,"text":"並藉由本部推動國際青年大使、外交小艦兵及選送青年學子赴海外國際非政府組織實習計畫"},{"start":2038.08,"end":2044.08,"text":"等多元的方式,來深化台灣跟友邦以及友好國家的實質交流"},{"start":2044.08,"end":2052.08,"text":"那首先呢,在外交部主導的相關的重要計畫方面呢,有以下"},{"start":2052.33,"end":2054.33,"text":"好,這個"},{"start":2055.46,"end":2060.46,"text":"八個重要的計畫,我再做一些補充的說明"},{"start":2060.46,"end":2064.46,"text":"第一項是青年百億海外圓夢基金計畫"},{"start":2064.46,"end":2066.46,"text":"那賴清德總統在"},{"start":2067.17,"end":2073.17,"text":"這個上年的1月24日宣布啟動青年百億海外圓夢基金計畫"},{"start":2073.17,"end":2077.17,"text":"並納入我國邦交國的青年來台圓夢"},{"start":2077.17,"end":2079.17,"text":"就是一個雙向的圓夢計畫"},{"start":2079.17,"end":2083.17,"text":"那期待以國家力量協助青年拓展國際鏈結交流"},{"start":2083.17,"end":2089.17,"text":"那引領青年多元創意的行動,並培養多元產業的青年人才"},{"start":2089.17,"end":2094.17,"text":"那同時也借以強化我們的固邦還有農邦的工作"},{"start":2094.17,"end":2098.17,"text":"那在外交部全力配合教育部推動該項計畫呢"},{"start":2098.17,"end":2103.17,"text":"上年提報了26案海外翱翔組實施計畫"},{"start":2103.17,"end":2108.17,"text":"提供43名我國青年赴海外機構實習"},{"start":2108.17,"end":2111.17,"text":"那今年更進一步提報了51案"},{"start":2111.17,"end":2116.17,"text":"提供了107個名額給我國青年海外實習機會"},{"start":2116.17,"end":2120.17,"text":"並與教育部合作辦理年度旗艦計畫"},{"start":2120.17,"end":2125.17,"text":"那以農邦計畫青年國際科技交流為主題"},{"start":2125.17,"end":2128.17,"text":"具體內容包括半導體供應的任性"},{"start":2128.17,"end":2130.17,"text":"可信賴網路與數位治理"},{"start":2130.17,"end":2134.17,"text":"主權AI以及新能源與探全合作"},{"start":2134.17,"end":2136.17,"text":"等我國優勢的科技產業"},{"start":2136.17,"end":2139.17,"text":"那提報27案旗艦計畫"},{"start":2139.17,"end":2143.17,"text":"既有48個名額供我國青年來申請"},{"start":2143.17,"end":2146.17,"text":"那這項計畫迄今執行也成果相當豐碩"},{"start":2147.17,"end":2150.17,"text":"如上年全年共協助1463位"},{"start":2150.17,"end":2152.17,"text":"15至30歲的台灣青年"},{"start":2152.17,"end":2154.17,"text":"順利走入國際"},{"start":2154.17,"end":2158.17,"text":"在各國進行間隙跨國合作跟多元的行動"},{"start":2158.17,"end":2162.17,"text":"那另外呢在推動邦交國青年來台圓夢方面"},{"start":2162.17,"end":2165.17,"text":"我們分為計畫型跟提案型"},{"start":2165.17,"end":2169.17,"text":"鼓勵我邦交國的青年透過參與我國政府計畫"},{"start":2169.17,"end":2171.17,"text":"或自主提案來台圓夢"},{"start":2171.17,"end":2175.17,"text":"至今共吸引66名邦交國青年來台交流"},{"start":2175.17,"end":2177.17,"text":"執行情況也相當的良好"},{"start":2177.17,"end":2182.17,"text":"再來第二個重要的計畫是國際青年大使交流計畫"},{"start":2182.17,"end":2186.17,"text":"這個是自2009年起每年都遴選"},{"start":2186.17,"end":2189.17,"text":"優秀大專院校的學生單點青年大使"},{"start":2189.17,"end":2192.17,"text":"赴邦交國及友好國家訪問交流"},{"start":2192.17,"end":2196.17,"text":"至今已培育超過1900名的青年人才"},{"start":2196.17,"end":2201.17,"text":"遍及外交文化科技農業教育及公共事務等不同領域"},{"start":2201.17,"end":2207.17,"text":"由外交部進而輔導組成社團法人台灣國際青年大使協會"},{"start":2207.17,"end":2212.17,"text":"在今年5月在外交部舉行成立大會及第一屆的會員大會"},{"start":2212.17,"end":2219.17,"text":"我們希望透過這些參加過國際青年大使的這些年輕人"},{"start":2219.17,"end":2227.17,"text":"他們雖然後來進入社會也能夠持續來幫助或持續成長"},{"start":2227.17,"end":2232.17,"text":"所以這樣的一個協會的成立讓我們多了將近2000名"},{"start":2232.17,"end":2238.17,"text":"可以來帶領年輕人帶來年輕人這樣的一個傳承跟創新"},{"start":2238.17,"end":2243.17,"text":"這個計畫今年擴大選了46位的國際青年大使"},{"start":2243.17,"end":2251.17,"text":"分兩梯是在8月下旬組團要出訪帛琉以及盛文森克里斯多福還有尼維斯等友邦"},{"start":2252.17,"end":2257.17,"text":"除爭選具備外語宣誡及文化才藝專長的青年學子外"},{"start":2257.17,"end":2260.17,"text":"為了展現台灣的科技創新力"},{"start":2260.17,"end":2264.17,"text":"今年的國際青年大使首度招募無人機飛手加入"},{"start":2264.17,"end":2268.17,"text":"將於太平洋島國論壇Pacific Island Forest"},{"start":2268.17,"end":2271.17,"text":"期間展現台灣的無人機科技"},{"start":2271.17,"end":2275.17,"text":"也將在龍幫特展中協助接待和導覽"},{"start":2275.17,"end":2279.17,"text":"第三個計畫是外交小尖兵世界領航營"},{"start":2279.17,"end":2285.17,"text":"為落實協助我國青年學子積極參與國際的一個政策的這樣的理念"},{"start":2285.17,"end":2289.17,"text":"並培育高中職學生的英語還有國際溝通能力"},{"start":2289.17,"end":2297.17,"text":"外交部和教育部自2002年起就合辦了外交小尖兵英語總指隊選拔活動"},{"start":2297.17,"end":2302.17,"text":"我們進一步把它拓展結合青年百億海外圓夢基金的計畫"},{"start":2302.17,"end":2303.17,"text":"另外同時呢"},{"start":2305.81,"end":2307.81,"text":"調整這個甄選的方式"},{"start":2307.81,"end":2311.81,"text":"以前都是以學校很多精英的學校都視這個為"},{"start":2311.81,"end":2319.81,"text":"一個可能這個學生取得一個更有競爭力可以升學的一個條件"},{"start":2319.81,"end":2323.81,"text":"但是我們在選拔過程當中是採取北中南"},{"start":2323.81,"end":2325.81,"text":"然後先讓一些有志報名"},{"start":2325.81,"end":2329.81,"text":"即使是比較農村的比較偏鄉地區的"},{"start":2329.81,"end":2331.81,"text":"連高中生也可以報名"},{"start":2331.81,"end":2333.81,"text":"那我們經過一週的培訓"},{"start":2333.81,"end":2335.81,"text":"在最後來選拔"},{"start":2335.81,"end":2337.81,"text":"我想這樣才不會有遺珠之憾"},{"start":2337.81,"end":2340.81,"text":"也不會擴大這個城鄉的差距"},{"start":2340.81,"end":2342.81,"text":"那我們也進行更名"},{"start":2342.81,"end":2345.81,"text":"改成外交小尖兵世界領航營"},{"start":2345.81,"end":2349.81,"text":"因為除了英語能力或者是外語能力之外"},{"start":2349.81,"end":2352.81,"text":"其實國際觀以及他專業能力的培養"},{"start":2352.81,"end":2356.81,"text":"還有特別是在青年交流方面其實是很多元的"},{"start":2356.81,"end":2362.81,"text":"那我們也希望能夠促進具有多元不同才能的高中職生"},{"start":2362.81,"end":2368.81,"text":"就能夠參與我們的這個國際的這個交流合作的活動"},{"start":2368.81,"end":2373.81,"text":"好那最第四項是農業青年大使新南向交流計畫"},{"start":2373.81,"end":2377.81,"text":"那這項計畫是外交部跟農業部在2017年起合辦"},{"start":2377.81,"end":2380.81,"text":"農業青年大使新南向交流計畫"},{"start":2380.81,"end":2385.81,"text":"那約徵選20位18歲至45歲距離農林雲木專長的青年"},{"start":2385.81,"end":2388.81,"text":"赴新南向目標國參訪交流"},{"start":2388.81,"end":2394.81,"text":"至今已經參訪交流過菲律賓印尼越南馬來西亞"},{"start":2394.81,"end":2397.81,"text":"印度泰國澳洲等七國那我們進一步擴大"},{"start":2397.81,"end":2400.81,"text":"因為其實新南向已經進入新的階段"},{"start":2400.81,"end":2404.81,"text":"像今年安排是要到荷蘭那荷蘭也是一個農業大國"},{"start":2404.81,"end":2408.81,"text":"特別是智慧農業方面讓他們能夠增廣見聞"},{"start":2408.81,"end":2411.81,"text":"也擴大我們交流的對象"},{"start":2411.81,"end":2415.81,"text":"那也能夠落實我們在農邦計畫的合作裡面的智慧新農業"},{"start":2415.81,"end":2420.81,"text":"包括新人員以及相關的這些主題來加以結合"},{"start":2420.81,"end":2425.81,"text":"那本年預計甄選16名農業青年大使出訪荷蘭"},{"start":2425.81,"end":2428.81,"text":"那協助農青走向世界"},{"start":2428.81,"end":2430.81,"text":"他們的表現都相當的優秀"},{"start":2430.81,"end":2431.81,"text":"都令人驚艷"},{"start":2431.81,"end":2433.81,"text":"很多國家其實都很羨慕"},{"start":2433.81,"end":2435.81,"text":"那這個也結合我們其他的"},{"start":2435.81,"end":2436.81,"text":"包括"},{"start":2438.08,"end":2444.08,"text":"就是青年這個百億海外圓夢計畫"},{"start":2444.08,"end":2446.08,"text":"雙向的交流來推動"},{"start":2446.08,"end":2449.08,"text":"第六個計畫是青年度假打工計畫"},{"start":2449.08,"end":2450.08,"text":"這個也很受歡迎"},{"start":2450.08,"end":2457.08,"text":"那這個計畫就是在對象上是國內18歲到30歲的青年"},{"start":2457.08,"end":2462.08,"text":"協助呢當然有些國家他們年紀稍微提高到35歲"},{"start":2462.08,"end":2464.08,"text":"都可以進行雙向的交流"},{"start":2464.08,"end":2469.08,"text":"那我們也把這個協助度假打工的計畫"},{"start":2469.08,"end":2472.08,"text":"目前已經擴及到18個國家"},{"start":2472.08,"end":2475.08,"text":"都簽有這些度假打工的協定"},{"start":2475.08,"end":2479.08,"text":"那包括紐西蘭、澳大利亞、日本、加拿大、德國、韓國、英國"},{"start":2479.08,"end":2481.08,"text":"也包括這個"},{"start":2482.82,"end":2484.82,"text":"這些度假打工協議"},{"start":2484.82,"end":2489.82,"text":"其實是不斷的在深化跟擴大當中"},{"start":2489.82,"end":2492.82,"text":"那這個出國度假打工的青年攀升"},{"start":2492.82,"end":2496.82,"text":"那為提供個人完整的度假打工資訊"},{"start":2496.82,"end":2498.82,"text":"保障他們的權益跟安全"},{"start":2498.82,"end":2502.82,"text":"外交部跟教育部、法務部、交通部、農業部、衛生福利部"},{"start":2502.82,"end":2507.82,"text":"金融監督管理委員會、小五委員會、內政部、移民署和議政司等"},{"start":2507.82,"end":2511.82,"text":"我們共同編制了一個青年海外度假打工宣導手冊"},{"start":2511.82,"end":2514.82,"text":"提供完整的海外度假打工的資訊"},{"start":2514.82,"end":2518.82,"text":"讓青年朋友能夠一側在手遍遊世界"},{"start":2518.82,"end":2521.82,"text":"為自己增添年輕時候的美麗色彩"},{"start":2521.82,"end":2526.82,"text":"第七個是有關於強化國際交流"},{"start":2526.82,"end":2529.82,"text":"這方面當然包括像獎學金制度"},{"start":2529.82,"end":2531.82,"text":"像台歐連結的獎學金"},{"start":2531.82,"end":2536.82,"text":"還有透過我們跟像美國夏威夷智庫、東西中心等合辦"},{"start":2536.82,"end":2540.82,"text":"各種的這個青年領袖的培育計畫"},{"start":2540.82,"end":2543.82,"text":"其中也包括原住民委員會我們合作"},{"start":2543.82,"end":2551.82,"text":"邀請這些台灣原住民到夏威夷能夠全程參與相關的培訓工程"},{"start":2551.82,"end":2556.82,"text":"也跟法國這個政府所成立的法國非洲基金會"},{"start":2556.82,"end":2559.82,"text":"青年領袖代表團來互訪、交流"},{"start":2559.82,"end":2562.82,"text":"這個成果也相當的豐碩"},{"start":2562.82,"end":2564.82,"text":"法國政府並把這個計畫結合"},{"start":2564.82,"end":2566.82,"text":"我們的青年百億圓夢計畫來辦理"},{"start":2567.82,"end":2571.82,"text":"在去上個月有成果的展現也令人驚豔"},{"start":2571.82,"end":2575.82,"text":"第八項是建置台灣青年放眼世界網站"},{"start":2575.82,"end":2578.82,"text":"及推動全民外交演習營"},{"start":2578.82,"end":2582.82,"text":"這個是屬於公眾外交的領域"},{"start":2582.82,"end":2585.82,"text":"我們也透過這樣短片跟網站的設立"},{"start":2585.82,"end":2589.82,"text":"能夠鼓勵青年加強國際的資訊交流跟互動"},{"start":2589.82,"end":2592.82,"text":"還有提供我們青年參與國際"},{"start":2592.82,"end":2596.82,"text":"包括獎助學金、各種的精英領袖演習班"},{"start":2596.82,"end":2599.82,"text":"跟海外度假打工等及時的資訊"},{"start":2599.82,"end":2604.82,"text":"總是會推動青年交流、擴大多元的視野"},{"start":2604.82,"end":2607.82,"text":"外交部跟我們的"},{"start":2609.72,"end":2613.72,"text":"從2005年起就持續辦理全民外交演習營"},{"start":2613.72,"end":2615.72,"text":"舉辦青年外交論壇"},{"start":2615.72,"end":2619.72,"text":"走遍各地校園跟社會推廣公眾外交的理念"},{"start":2619.72,"end":2622.72,"text":"也增進國人對外交事務的認識和參與"},{"start":2622.72,"end":2624.72,"text":"協助青年拓展國際視野"},{"start":2624.72,"end":2627.72,"text":"並提升跨文化的溝通能力"},{"start":2627.72,"end":2629.72,"text":"在最後結語"},{"start":2629.72,"end":2632.72,"text":"我們期待青年能夠帶著台灣走向世界"},{"start":2632.72,"end":2635.72,"text":"也能夠過程中回頭看看"},{"start":2635.72,"end":2637.72,"text":"更深刻的認識台灣"},{"start":2637.72,"end":2639.72,"text":"看見台灣的價值"},{"start":2639.72,"end":2641.72,"text":"讓世界因為台灣而變得更好"},{"start":2641.72,"end":2643.72,"text":"外交部將在既有的基礎上"},{"start":2643.72,"end":2645.72,"text":"持續全力推動相關的工作"},{"start":2645.72,"end":2647.72,"text":"也再次感謝各位委員"},{"start":2647.72,"end":2650.72,"text":"能夠持續給予指導跟支持"},{"start":2650.72,"end":2652.72,"text":"以上報告,謝謝"},{"start":2656.93,"end":2660.93,"text":"好,接著我們請僑委會許委員長上台報告"},{"start":2673.49,"end":2676.49,"text":"僑委,各位委員先進,大家早安"},{"start":2676.49,"end":2679.49,"text":"青年是國家的實力與未來"},{"start":2679.49,"end":2682.49,"text":"也是我們拓展外交新局的重要生力軍"},{"start":2682.49,"end":2686.49,"text":"今日非常榮幸能夠與外交部共同進行專案報告"},{"start":2686.49,"end":2688.49,"text":"請在此向各位委員說明"},{"start":2688.49,"end":2690.49,"text":"本會在青年培育政策的相關具體成果"},{"start":2690.49,"end":2692.49,"text":"請各位委員不吝指教"},{"start":2693.45,"end":2697.45,"text":"在面對全球競爭的趨勢之下"},{"start":2697.45,"end":2702.45,"text":"培養青年世代已經成為國家永續發展及社會創新的重要關鍵"},{"start":2702.45,"end":2704.45,"text":"本會配合國家政策"},{"start":2704.45,"end":2707.45,"text":"以Move to Next Generation為核心理念"},{"start":2707.45,"end":2709.45,"text":"點燃僑務新動能"},{"start":2709.45,"end":2712.45,"text":"並以海外僑青培養為主軸"},{"start":2712.45,"end":2714.45,"text":"兼顧國內青年培立"},{"start":2714.45,"end":2718.45,"text":"持續的推動多項僑青培育及交流計畫"},{"start":2718.45,"end":2721.45,"text":"深化海內外青年的鏈結"},{"start":2721.45,"end":2724.45,"text":"並建立跨世代合作的平台"},{"start":2724.45,"end":2727.45,"text":"期許新世代能夠成為承先啟後的重要力量"},{"start":2727.45,"end":2729.45,"text":"後執僑務發展的動能"},{"start":2729.45,"end":2733.45,"text":"並持續的拓展國際台灣的影響力"},{"start":2733.45,"end":2735.45,"text":"首先本會自一百年起"},{"start":2735.45,"end":2737.45,"text":"民國一百年起"},{"start":2737.45,"end":2741.45,"text":"即在加拿大、美國、澳洲、巴西等國"},{"start":2741.88,"end":2745.88,"text":"舉辦海外青年文化大使協會的培訓"},{"start":2745.88,"end":2750.88,"text":"俗稱FASCA"},{"start":2750.88,"end":2752.88,"text":"截至114年"},{"start":2752.88,"end":2754.88,"text":"總計15年內"},{"start":2754.88,"end":2757.88,"text":"累計培養了青年文化大使共將近9000人"},{"start":2757.88,"end":2761.88,"text":"成為海外最活躍的青年團體之一"},{"start":2761.88,"end":2765.88,"text":"今年持續的根序強化相關的培養"},{"start":2765.88,"end":2768.88,"text":"多增加了南美洲的阿根廷"},{"start":2768.88,"end":2770.88,"text":"以及歐洲的法國地區"},{"start":2770.88,"end":2772.88,"text":"也讓成立分會"},{"start":2772.88,"end":2774.88,"text":"建立全球的僑民青年網絡"},{"start":2774.88,"end":2777.88,"text":"FASCA透過各項動態、靜態的各種活動"},{"start":2777.88,"end":2780.88,"text":"參與主流的社區、傳統節慶活動"},{"start":2780.88,"end":2783.88,"text":"並在各種活動的類型當中"},{"start":2783.88,"end":2786.88,"text":"設置各樣的台灣行銷活動"},{"start":2786.88,"end":2788.88,"text":"擔任文化導覽大使"},{"start":2788.88,"end":2791.88,"text":"向各界人士行銷台灣"},{"start":2791.88,"end":2794.88,"text":"在各國的主流社會當中"},{"start":2794.88,"end":2797.88,"text":"支援大型的國際運動賽事或台灣日等活動"},{"start":2797.88,"end":2801.88,"text":"充分展現台灣多元文化的特色與青年的活力"},{"start":2801.88,"end":2804.88,"text":"吸引了非常多主流社會的關注"},{"start":2804.88,"end":2807.88,"text":"充分顯示海外僑親與政府攜手推動"},{"start":2807.88,"end":2809.88,"text":"公眾外交的成效"},{"start":2810.6,"end":2814.6,"text":"其次,為了配合國家的雙語政策並增進海外"},{"start":2814.6,"end":2816.6,"text":"僑親對台灣的認識"},{"start":2817.09,"end":2818.09,"text":"本會是"},{"start":2818.71,"end":2821.71,"text":"2006年也就是民國95年起"},{"start":2821.71,"end":2824.71,"text":"與教育部共同辦理海外青年英語福音"},{"start":2825.72,"end":2828.72,"text":"之後,又再邀請課委會及院委會擴大服務面向"},{"start":2828.72,"end":2833.72,"text":"提供海外青年來台服務的機會"},{"start":2833.72,"end":2836.72,"text":"增進對台灣的認識及文化的認同"},{"start":2836.72,"end":2840.72,"text":"同時,也協助國內的中小學學生加強英語能力"},{"start":2840.72,"end":2842.72,"text":"認識不同的國家文化"},{"start":2842.72,"end":2845.72,"text":"迄今已經辦理進入第21年"},{"start":2845.72,"end":2846.72,"text":"總計"},{"start":2847.7,"end":2852.7,"text":"已經有7793位海外的國際志工來台服務"},{"start":2852.7,"end":2855.7,"text":"在國內已經超過5萬名學童受惠"},{"start":2855.7,"end":2859.7,"text":"受到海內外志工及加強的熱烈支持與肯定"},{"start":2859.7,"end":2864.7,"text":"是台灣與國際海外的青年重要的文化交流與情感連結的活動之一"},{"start":2864.7,"end":2866.7,"text":"也是本會在國內外"},{"start":2867.82,"end":2870.82,"text":"青年服務青年的重要績效亮點之一"},{"start":2871.46,"end":2872.46,"text":"今年"},{"start":2873,"end":2876,"text":"英語服務營已在7月31日辦理完成"},{"start":2876,"end":2879,"text":"既有五大州共20個國家"},{"start":2879,"end":2884,"text":"400多名海外青年來擔任我們的英語志工"},{"start":2884,"end":2888,"text":"到國內共有66所國中小進行服務"},{"start":2888,"end":2890,"text":"服務了3000名學童"},{"start":2890,"end":2892,"text":"有效的促進了青年的交流與認識"},{"start":2892,"end":2896,"text":"並提升我國的學童之國際觀"},{"start":2896.95,"end":2898.95,"text":"第三,本會與教育部"},{"start":2899.65,"end":2904.65,"text":"國教組在107年開始及共同辦理"},{"start":2904.65,"end":2909.65,"text":"念念台灣海外僑民兒童及少年"},{"start":2909.65,"end":2911.65,"text":"致效短期體驗計畫"},{"start":2911.65,"end":2913.65,"text":"深受海外僑胞熱烈迴響"},{"start":2913.65,"end":2916.65,"text":"報名人數逐年增加"},{"start":2916.65,"end":2919.65,"text":"只有在疫情期間停辦兩年"},{"start":2919.65,"end":2923.65,"text":"截至115學年度已經超過9"},{"start":2923.65,"end":2926.65,"text":"今年度有超過900人報名"},{"start":2926.65,"end":2931.65,"text":"至今為止已經2600名學童返台"},{"start":2931.65,"end":2938.65,"text":"今年的10月將有674名新的國中小學生"},{"start":2938.65,"end":2941.65,"text":"即將進入台灣的公立中小學"},{"start":2941.65,"end":2944.65,"text":"與學生在日常的校園活動當中"},{"start":2944.65,"end":2947.65,"text":"有共同學習交流的機會"},{"start":2947.65,"end":2952.65,"text":"國內的學生也能夠化身文化大使"},{"start":2952.65,"end":2957.65,"text":"向海外的學伴介紹台灣的風土人情與校園生活"},{"start":2957.65,"end":2960.65,"text":"從中建立對文化的認同與自信"},{"start":2960.65,"end":2963.65,"text":"更能培養多元的文化"},{"start":2965.15,"end":2968.15,"text":"尊重包容國際的這種素養"},{"start":2968.15,"end":2971.15,"text":"並且提升語言的能力與觀點"},{"start":2972.34,"end":2975.34,"text":"此外,本會自109年起"},{"start":2975.34,"end":2978.34,"text":"也辦理了國際數位學伴計畫"},{"start":2978.34,"end":2984.34,"text":"透過線上或實體的方式進行了主題式的教學分享與語言交流"},{"start":2984.34,"end":2987.34,"text":"增進雙方的互動,拓展了學生的視野"},{"start":2987.34,"end":2992.34,"text":"這三年來總計已經媒合了國內168所中小學"},{"start":2992.34,"end":2998.34,"text":"與海外168所的主流學校以及喬生、喬校進行了交流"},{"start":2998.34,"end":3000.34,"text":"參與的國家包含有"},{"start":3000.34,"end":3007.34,"text":"澳洲、美國、加拿大、秘魯、巴西、匈牙利、紐西蘭、法國、英國、德國、西班牙、日本"},{"start":3007.71,"end":3010.71,"text":"菲律賓等國家,參與的學生跟老師"},{"start":3010.71,"end":3014.71,"text":"都建立了非常好的交流管道以及生存的互動"},{"start":3014.71,"end":3019.71,"text":"例如美國的加州、惠景中學與桃園的親浦國小"},{"start":3019.71,"end":3021.71,"text":"及簽訂了備忘錄"},{"start":3021.71,"end":3026.71,"text":"密西根州底特律的耶穌會高中與嘉義女中"},{"start":3026.71,"end":3028.71,"text":"也建立了實體的互訪"},{"start":3028.71,"end":3032.71,"text":"這是我曾經去拜會過的一個非常高檔的學校"},{"start":3032.71,"end":3037.71,"text":"同時愛迪森中學也跟我們的高雄言行國中地鐵姐妹校"},{"start":3037.71,"end":3041.71,"text":"等等都是透過數位交流到實體互訪"},{"start":3041.71,"end":3045.71,"text":"能夠提升我們的青年學子之國際素養與全球競爭力"},{"start":3047.32,"end":3048.32,"text":"本會為福音"},{"start":3049.07,"end":3054.07,"text":"政府的青年政策增進台灣年輕人對政府僑務政策的認知與"},{"start":3054.07,"end":3056.07,"text":"拓展國際的視野"},{"start":3056.07,"end":3060.07,"text":"自106年起推動了海外搭橋計畫"},{"start":3060.07,"end":3064.07,"text":"選送國內外的大專院校優秀學生與暑假期間"},{"start":3064.07,"end":3067.07,"text":"前往海外各國參訪見習"},{"start":3067.07,"end":3070.07,"text":"總計至今已經累計了830名的青年"},{"start":3070.07,"end":3073.07,"text":"透過我們的台灣青年視角"},{"start":3073.07,"end":3077.07,"text":"向全球各界行銷台灣"},{"start":3077.07,"end":3080.07,"text":"是最佳的僑務青年大使"},{"start":3080.07,"end":3084.07,"text":"今年共爭選了82位"},{"start":3084.07,"end":3087.07,"text":"分別從7月到8月之間前往美國"},{"start":3087.07,"end":3092.07,"text":"芝加哥、澳洲、墨爾本、法國、巴黎、日本、東京、韓國"},{"start":3092.07,"end":3098.07,"text":"索爾、越南、胡志明市及馬來西亞、吉隆坡等7個國家地區"},{"start":3098.07,"end":3100.07,"text":"進行參訪跟見習"},{"start":3100.07,"end":3106.07,"text":"行程的內容除拜會我們駐外館處、僑團、僑校、僑台商之外"},{"start":3106.07,"end":3111.07,"text":"當然也針對當地的政經情勢或是學術單位、文化機構"},{"start":3111.07,"end":3114.07,"text":"都安排了相關的參訪"},{"start":3114.07,"end":3120.07,"text":"以及與他們做交流充分的行銷了台灣與建立這個橋樑"},{"start":3120.07,"end":3124.07,"text":"為了讓我們搭橋計畫的學員能夠持續的交流"},{"start":3124.07,"end":3128.07,"text":"本會於113年開始"},{"start":3128.07,"end":3133.07,"text":"更進一步將歷屆的搭橋青年籌組成搭橋青年會"},{"start":3133.07,"end":3135.07,"text":"讓他們定期辦理橋聚時光"},{"start":3135.07,"end":3137.07,"text":"加強彼此之間的連結"},{"start":3137.07,"end":3144.07,"text":"由於我們搭橋計畫深受台灣大專院校學生的喜愛跟肯定"},{"start":3144.07,"end":3146.07,"text":"因此我們從過去只有50幾位"},{"start":3146.07,"end":3149.07,"text":"逐步的提升到82位"},{"start":3149.07,"end":3154.07,"text":"那這過程當中也承蒙我們大院各位委員大力的支持"},{"start":3154.07,"end":3157.07,"text":"那麼至今的辦理的成效都非常良好"},{"start":3157.07,"end":3159.07,"text":"那這些年輕的優秀學子"},{"start":3159.07,"end":3164.07,"text":"也真的是幫台灣在國際社會做非常好的公眾外交"},{"start":3164.07,"end":3168.07,"text":"第五,為增進台灣青年學生對橋物的認識"},{"start":3168.07,"end":3171.07,"text":"培養國內學生多元文化與國際素養"},{"start":3171.07,"end":3177.07,"text":"從113年起我們又針對高中職學生辦理橋物探索營"},{"start":3177.07,"end":3181.07,"text":"三天的研習、交流、座談、參訪跟分組討論"},{"start":3181.07,"end":3183.07,"text":"帶領了我們大學的學生"},{"start":3183.03,"end":3185.03,"text":"高中生關心橋物及國際事務"},{"start":3185.03,"end":3188.03,"text":"培養服務的熱忱、定期參與公共事務"},{"start":3188.03,"end":3195.03,"text":"藉此來提升國內的民眾對於政府外交事務的了解"},{"start":3195.03,"end":3198.03,"text":"至今已經培養了192名高中生"},{"start":3198.03,"end":3203.03,"text":"那麼今年度我們已於8月4號至6號舉辦完畢"},{"start":3203.03,"end":3206.03,"text":"共有63位國內的高中職學生"},{"start":3206.03,"end":3209.03,"text":"分佈在22個縣市"},{"start":3209.03,"end":3212.03,"text":"各個高中職的學生都有參與"},{"start":3212.03,"end":3215.03,"text":"以上第六點要跟各位委員報告"},{"start":3215.03,"end":3222.03,"text":"有鑒於114年賴清德總統宣布啟動青年百億海外圓夢計畫"},{"start":3222.03,"end":3226.03,"text":"希望以國家的力量協助青年拓展國際交流"},{"start":3226.03,"end":3230.03,"text":"引領學生多元創意行動培養多元的產業人才"},{"start":3230.03,"end":3233.03,"text":"後持我國在國際的競爭力"},{"start":3233.03,"end":3238.03,"text":"本會與外交部、教育部等相關部會"},{"start":3239.34,"end":3240.34,"text":"共同合作"},{"start":3240.34,"end":3245.34,"text":"那麼多年來這兩年來已經與海外各個僑團組織合作"},{"start":3245.34,"end":3252.34,"text":"從國際參與到醫療公衛、文化藝術或華語文教學等面向提供了各種的機會"},{"start":3252.34,"end":3259.34,"text":"至今選送26人赴海外進行為期兩週至六個月的培訓"},{"start":3259.34,"end":3261.34,"text":"間隙的一個計畫"},{"start":3261.34,"end":3266.34,"text":"讓青年能夠透過國際的參與更增加專業的職能"},{"start":3266.34,"end":3270.34,"text":"本年度已經選送15人赴美加地區間隙"},{"start":3270.34,"end":3276.34,"text":"未來將持續在此平台上繼續拓展我國的親世代人才之培養"},{"start":3277.8,"end":3280.8,"text":"親世代的青年是國家實力的延伸"},{"start":3280.8,"end":3284.8,"text":"更是提升國家競爭力、促進國際合作最重要的橋樑"},{"start":3284.8,"end":3287.8,"text":"本會會在既有的基礎上持續的強化"},{"start":3287.8,"end":3290.8,"text":"也敬請各位大院委員不吝指教與支持"},{"start":3290.8,"end":3292.8,"text":"感謝大家,謝謝"},{"start":3296.87,"end":3300.87,"text":"現在我們補充介紹王奕川,王委員"},{"start":3301.69,"end":3303.69,"text":"以及陳俊宇,陳委員"},{"start":3304.78,"end":3310.78,"text":"我們現在請問在場委員對於上次會議議事錄有無遺漏或錯誤需要更正之處"},{"start":3310.78,"end":3312.78,"text":"沒有我們議事錄確定"},{"start":3316.46,"end":3318.46,"text":"我們現在開始詢答"},{"start":3318.46,"end":3321.46,"text":"本會委員6加2分鐘,非本會委員5分鐘"},{"start":3321.46,"end":3324.46,"text":"10點30分截止發言登記"},{"start":3324.46,"end":3329.46,"text":"如有臨時提案,請於10點30分之前提出11點左右處理"},{"start":3329.46,"end":3332.46,"text":"現在請陳俊宇委員上台諮詢"},{"start":3340.4,"end":3343.4,"text":"好,謝謝,我們有請嘉隆部長"},{"start":3343.4,"end":3344.4,"text":"請林部長"},{"start":3348.79,"end":3349.79,"text":"部長,早"},{"start":3351.85,"end":3354.85,"text":"部長,針對我們今天的專報主題"},{"start":3354.85,"end":3359.85,"text":"我想培育青年人才對於外交部來說是特別重要"},{"start":3359.85,"end":3364.85,"text":"包括部長在報告當中提到,我們要落實人人都是外交官的這個理念"},{"start":3364.85,"end":3369.85,"text":"我們也有很多跨部會跨國之間的合作計畫在進行"},{"start":3369.85,"end":3375.85,"text":"我們在之前也討論過,我們有服役的外交替代"},{"start":3376.79,"end":3380.79,"text":"替代的藝男以及國會的海外服務團等志工等等"},{"start":3380.79,"end":3384.79,"text":"那都是在推動總和外交非常重要的一個人才庫"},{"start":3385.92,"end":3389.92,"text":"不過我們也注意到在近期的青年交流和培育的工作上"},{"start":3389.92,"end":3391.92,"text":"外交部似乎有新的做法"},{"start":3391.92,"end":3394.92,"text":"例如在報告當中有提到,在今年5月份"},{"start":3394.92,"end":3399.92,"text":"由外交部輔導所成立的台灣國際青年大使協會"},{"start":3399.92,"end":3404.92,"text":"它是來自不同專業不同背景的青年共同組成"},{"start":3404.92,"end":3408.92,"text":"也象徵我們青年大使的外交工作"},{"start":3408.92,"end":3412.92,"text":"更加制度化,也跨領域專業化的階段"},{"start":3412.92,"end":3418.92,"text":"不過在報告當中我們只提到要打造台灣青年公共外交的"},{"start":3419.87,"end":3422.87,"text":"還有國際參與的一個重要平台"},{"start":3422.87,"end":3424.87,"text":"那這部分我想請教部長"},{"start":3424.87,"end":3429.87,"text":"我們台灣國際青年大使協會的這個定位是什麼"},{"start":3429.87,"end":3435.87,"text":"那未來協會我們如何配合外交部的相關政策以及專案的經費補助"},{"start":3435.87,"end":3441.87,"text":"我們要如何能夠進行更實質也更具有效益的一個青年外交"},{"start":3441.87,"end":3444.87,"text":"那具體上我們採取的形式有哪些"},{"start":3444.87,"end":3446.87,"text":"好,報告委員"},{"start":3446.87,"end":3453.87,"text":"因為累積了20多年,有將近2000位這些參加過國際青年大使"},{"start":3453.87,"end":3459.87,"text":"跟我們的這個外交小兼兵等,包括農業這個大使"},{"start":3459.87,"end":3462.87,"text":"其實他們在各個領域表現"},{"start":3462.87,"end":3466.87,"text":"他們都其實可能因為影響了他們"},{"start":3466.87,"end":3468.87,"text":"他們後來有很多其實對推動跟我們"},{"start":3468.87,"end":3470.87,"text":"其實外交是也是很相關的"},{"start":3470.87,"end":3473.87,"text":"我們希望能夠用學長姐來帶學弟妹"},{"start":3473.87,"end":3479.87,"text":"就像我們現在也把留台的獎學金的各國的畢業生"},{"start":3479.87,"end":3481.87,"text":"也是把他們群組化"},{"start":3481.87,"end":3483.87,"text":"這樣子他這個傳承跟創新"},{"start":3483.87,"end":3488.87,"text":"我們就不用都政府要去就是說只要一次性活動"},{"start":3488.87,"end":3491.87,"text":"事實上他參加過之後他可以再回來"},{"start":3491.87,"end":3495.87,"text":"那我是覺得讓這個人才庫可以更大"},{"start":3495.87,"end":3498.87,"text":"那青年也是吸引青年"},{"start":3498.87,"end":3500.87,"text":"他們是相當多元"},{"start":3500.87,"end":3502.87,"text":"我們可以很多次可以向他們學習"},{"start":3502.87,"end":3504.87,"text":"他們有很多的創新"},{"start":3504.87,"end":3508.87,"text":"另外你提到外交替代役確實是一個很大的挑戰"},{"start":3508.87,"end":3515.87,"text":"因為我們過去包括國會具統計有三分之一是來自於這些外交替代役"},{"start":3515.87,"end":3518.87,"text":"那這些完之後他們就投入到外交工作"},{"start":3518.87,"end":3522.87,"text":"可是因為現在兵役從四個月又恢復到一年"},{"start":3522.87,"end":3527.87,"text":"所以這整個制度因為過去是他這個"},{"start":3529.08,"end":3533.08,"text":"就是四個月他可以再簽加六個月"},{"start":3533.08,"end":3535.08,"text":"那在海外服務"},{"start":3535.08,"end":3538.08,"text":"現在就他本來服役就是一年了"},{"start":3538.08,"end":3540.08,"text":"所以這個制度我們希望維持"},{"start":3540.08,"end":3544.08,"text":"說一方面跟國防部還有包括內政部議政署"},{"start":3544.08,"end":3547.08,"text":"那同時也跟教育部都在協調"},{"start":3547.08,"end":3550.08,"text":"我們希望能夠不只不要停止還擴大"},{"start":3550.08,"end":3552.08,"text":"讓年輕人可以透過服役期間"},{"start":3552.08,"end":3554.08,"text":"其實像剛剛講那個無人機"},{"start":3554.08,"end":3558.08,"text":"如果有很多專家派到我們的這些友邦"},{"start":3558.08,"end":3562.08,"text":"去訓練他們其實對雙方面都是很有幫助的"},{"start":3562.08,"end":3566.08,"text":"那這一點我們也敬請這個大院可以支持"},{"start":3566.08,"end":3567.08,"text":"好"},{"start":3567.08,"end":3569.08,"text":"那另外在報告當中也有提到"},{"start":3569.08,"end":3574.08,"text":"外交部的這個國際青年大使交流計畫已經行之有年"},{"start":3574.08,"end":3578.08,"text":"那在今年擴大辦理包括這個國際青年大使還有校園大使"},{"start":3578.08,"end":3582.08,"text":"尤其國會的這個校園大使計畫應該是第一次辦理"},{"start":3582.08,"end":3586.08,"text":"那也準備要帶著他們各自的這個專業"},{"start":3586.08,"end":3588.08,"text":"能夠出訪友邦來進行交流"},{"start":3588.08,"end":3591.08,"text":"那這部分我還是就叫我們部長就是"},{"start":3591.08,"end":3594.08,"text":"青年大使和校園大使他們各自的任務是什麼"},{"start":3594.08,"end":3598.08,"text":"那實際上在訓練和出訪的安排上有什麼的差異"},{"start":3598.08,"end":3601.08,"text":"那如何能夠達到我們預期的一個成效"},{"start":3601.08,"end":3603.08,"text":"這部分是不是部長也簡要說明一下"},{"start":3603.08,"end":3608.08,"text":"好 報告委員其實這個青年人才要變成一個外交的人才"},{"start":3608.08,"end":3610.08,"text":"他是需要經過一個培養的過程"},{"start":3610.08,"end":3615.08,"text":"可是過去我們是好像透過可能一次的面試或徵選"},{"start":3615.08,"end":3619.08,"text":"然後就決定其實有時候會有成相差距也會有貧富的差距"},{"start":3619.08,"end":3621.08,"text":"我們現在是透過學訓用"},{"start":3621.08,"end":3624.08,"text":"透過這樣的一個過程先有志於報名的"},{"start":3624.08,"end":3629.08,"text":"我們就開一個比如說一個營隊或是一個訓練的課程"},{"start":3629.08,"end":3631.08,"text":"然後他經過參與之後"},{"start":3631.08,"end":3634.08,"text":"他們有一些比如說比較偏向個人"},{"start":3634.08,"end":3639.08,"text":"他們有學校可能那麼樣的精英或是聲學"},{"start":3639.08,"end":3643.08,"text":"聲學這個這麼做中心的這些學生"},{"start":3643.08,"end":3645.08,"text":"他也有機會來報名"},{"start":3645.08,"end":3647.08,"text":"經過一個培訓之後"},{"start":3647.08,"end":3653.08,"text":"他可能就被看見他的一個條件是符合的"},{"start":3653.08,"end":3655.08,"text":"所以我們這樣多元的取材"},{"start":3655.08,"end":3659.08,"text":"那事實上從去年開辦以來這樣的效果是非常好"},{"start":3659.08,"end":3666.08,"text":"好 那接續我想請教部長就是有關印太第一島鏈的安全合作的相關議題"},{"start":3666.08,"end":3674.08,"text":"那日本防衛省在這個月初公布2026年防衛白皮書主要延續先前的這個評估定位"},{"start":3674.08,"end":3678.08,"text":"中國是日本前所未有最大的一個戰略挑戰"},{"start":3678.08,"end":3686.08,"text":"那並在內容當中明確指出中國單方面改變現狀企圖的還有它相關的活動"},{"start":3686.08,"end":3689.08,"text":"從第一島鏈向第二島鏈來延伸"},{"start":3689.08,"end":3693.08,"text":"那也持續關切在台灣周邊的這個軍事活動和演習"},{"start":3693.08,"end":3700.08,"text":"更提到中國揮帶行動可能藉由海警執法封鎖台灣等等"},{"start":3700.08,"end":3704.08,"text":"那後續中國外交部也指稱日方"},{"start":3704.94,"end":3708.94,"text":"在抹黑和炒作並提出嚴正的交涉"},{"start":3708.94,"end":3711.94,"text":"那在這個防衛白皮書公布之後"},{"start":3711.94,"end":3720.94,"text":"有外媒特別指出今年社台的文字上保留了台海情勢穩定對國際社會穩定很重要的論述"},{"start":3720.94,"end":3724.94,"text":"但相較於去年似乎有些許的這個微調"},{"start":3724.94,"end":3726.94,"text":"那也值得我們進一步討論"},{"start":3726.94,"end":3735.94,"text":"在這一份的這個白皮書對於這個區域安全還有中日關係延伸到台海情勢所傳達的一個訊息"},{"start":3735.94,"end":3738.94,"text":"以及後續可能造成什麼樣的一個影響"},{"start":3738.94,"end":3741.94,"text":"部長就這個部分你怎麼評估"},{"start":3741.94,"end":3746.94,"text":"報告委員中國的軍事擴張是全面性"},{"start":3746.94,"end":3751.94,"text":"他過去好像是兩岸之間台海的這個問題"},{"start":3751.94,"end":3755.94,"text":"可是現在已經擴充到東海南海甚至整個太平洋"},{"start":3755.94,"end":3760.94,"text":"所以中國的威權軍事的擴張造成的挑戰"},{"start":3760.94,"end":3765.94,"text":"不只是兩岸之間甚至是區域到全球性的"},{"start":3765.94,"end":3767.94,"text":"這個各國都要去回應"},{"start":3767.94,"end":3773.94,"text":"也就簡單來講中共其實是以軍事行動在改變跟就迫害現狀"},{"start":3773.94,"end":3775.94,"text":"那我們要維護嘛"},{"start":3775.94,"end":3780.94,"text":"那台灣現在其實在整個大的戰略上就是跟這些理念相近"},{"start":3780.94,"end":3782.94,"text":"國家在印太地區在第一島鏈"},{"start":3782.94,"end":3787.94,"text":"大家至少要溝通協調來合作來維持"},{"start":3787.94,"end":3791.94,"text":"包括台海跟印太地區的和平跟穩定"},{"start":3791.94,"end":3793.94,"text":"所以中共是一個"},{"start":3795.89,"end":3799.89,"text":"破壞現狀的軍事擴張者這是現實嘛"},{"start":3799.89,"end":3804.89,"text":"中共又要批評別人把這個事實講出來"},{"start":3804.89,"end":3806.89,"text":"難道要被他各個擊破"},{"start":3806.89,"end":3809.89,"text":"然後造成他所謂的新常態"},{"start":3809.89,"end":3813.89,"text":"這個也就是說這個已經是對台灣所做的現在對"},{"start":3813.89,"end":3818.89,"text":"包括日本菲律賓甚至澳洲紐西蘭甚至到太平洋所有的國家"},{"start":3818.89,"end":3824.89,"text":"他一樣都在台灣練好的功夫就到全世界去打架"},{"start":3824.89,"end":3827.89,"text":"所以我們不能夠各個擊破"},{"start":3827.89,"end":3830.89,"text":"我們一定是大家當然要一起來因應"},{"start":3830.89,"end":3837.89,"text":"尤其是理念相近國家這些共同的能夠去捍衛這個現狀不被破壞"},{"start":3837.89,"end":3840.89,"text":"好那謝謝我們部長"},{"start":3840.89,"end":3845.89,"text":"那這部位還是請我們外交部能夠及時掌握相關的一個情資"},{"start":3845.89,"end":3851.89,"text":"並且跟友盟國家能夠進一步強化在安全上的一個相關合作"},{"start":3851.89,"end":3852.89,"text":"來確保我們國家的安全"},{"start":3852.89,"end":3856.89,"text":"我們會透過總和外交三鏈戰略還有農邦計畫"},{"start":3856.89,"end":3859.89,"text":"打區域聯防這樣台灣才不會孤單"},{"start":3859.89,"end":3866.89,"text":"事實上我們透過這樣的一個總和外交的方式"},{"start":3866.89,"end":3872.89,"text":"是有效的去強化了台灣的整個綜合國力能夠在外交上的呈現"},{"start":3872.89,"end":3873.89,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":3877.45,"end":3878.45,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":3880.37,"end":3883.37,"text":"接下來請王毅川委員上台諮詢"},{"start":3890.41,"end":3893.41,"text":"好謝謝主席我們請外交部林部長"},{"start":3893.41,"end":3894.41,"text":"請林部長"},{"start":3902.26,"end":3903.26,"text":"委員長"},{"start":3903.26,"end":3908.26,"text":"部長好你們今天的報告洋洋灑灑寫了很多外交部做青年的工作"},{"start":3908.26,"end":3909.26,"text":"對"},{"start":3909.26,"end":3913.26,"text":"這裡面有一個網站叫做台灣青年放眼世界網站"},{"start":3915.01,"end":3916.01,"text":"這個"},{"start":3916.7,"end":3918.7,"text":"部長你看這個網站的名字"},{"start":3919.38,"end":3922.38,"text":"你覺得你今天報告的內容有沒有全部都在這裡面"},{"start":3924.35,"end":3925.35,"text":"應該是沒有"},{"start":3925.35,"end":3926.35,"text":"應該是沒有"},{"start":3926.35,"end":3927.35,"text":"對"},{"start":3927.35,"end":3931.35,"text":"如果有一個台灣的青年大學生或者是已經開始工作"},{"start":3931.35,"end":3938.35,"text":"他想要參與外交部的青年工作去參加徵選各項的什麼計畫的話"},{"start":3938.35,"end":3944.35,"text":"有沒有一個網站他在那裡可以全部看到你今天報告的這些計畫"},{"start":3945.2,"end":3948.2,"text":"當然我們外交部的網站也可以搜尋"},{"start":3948.2,"end":3952.2,"text":"也不只限於青年放眼短片的網站"},{"start":3952.2,"end":3955.2,"text":"不過這個網站的經營應該更積極"},{"start":3955.2,"end":3960.2,"text":"能夠去結合我們外交部各單位在做的事情"},{"start":3960.2,"end":3962.2,"text":"再多個連結"},{"start":3962.2,"end":3966.2,"text":"因為你們這個網站連百億青年圓夢計畫都沒有"},{"start":3967.55,"end":3968.55,"text":"這個計畫沒有在裡頭"},{"start":3969.17,"end":3973.17,"text":"有一個選送青年學子賦INGO"},{"start":3973.17,"end":3974.17,"text":"這個也沒有"},{"start":3975,"end":3977,"text":"謝謝你的提醒"},{"start":3977,"end":3980,"text":"然後有一個青年外交論壇"},{"start":3980,"end":3981,"text":"這個也沒有"},{"start":3981,"end":3987,"text":"所以我是建議我了解你們應該在不同的部門之間做的網站"},{"start":3987,"end":3993,"text":"既然要讓青年能夠比較容易就多一個連結把它連過去就好了"},{"start":3993,"end":3994,"text":"第一個建議"},{"start":3994,"end":3995,"text":"好我們來改善"},{"start":3995,"end":3996,"text":"部長"},{"start":3996.64,"end":3998.64,"text":"你覺得這些計畫"},{"start":3998.64,"end":4001.64,"text":"因為這裡頭提到幾百人幾千人歷年來的"},{"start":4001.64,"end":4003.64,"text":"你覺得這些人有沒有重複"},{"start":4005.09,"end":4007.09,"text":"呃"},{"start":4006.56,"end":4008.56,"text":"重複但是可能不多"},{"start":4008.56,"end":4013.56,"text":"倒是我認為我們怎麼號召年輕人投入外交"},{"start":4013.56,"end":4015.56,"text":"需要有一個媒介"},{"start":4015.56,"end":4019.56,"text":"這些其實也很多人因此來報考"},{"start":4020.21,"end":4021.21,"text":"這個外交特考"},{"start":4021.21,"end":4022.21,"text":"對"},{"start":4022.21,"end":4025.21,"text":"這個是相當有趣就是說我們越多這樣的平台或活動"},{"start":4025.21,"end":4029.21,"text":"那其實如果年輕人對外交有興趣"},{"start":4029.21,"end":4032.21,"text":"優秀的人才投入外交我們台灣一定有希望"},{"start":4032.21,"end":4034.21,"text":"但是成績合十"},{"start":4034.21,"end":4038.21,"text":"以前在考外交官是相當就是因為"},{"start":4038.21,"end":4040.21,"text":"因為很多人的志業"},{"start":4040.21,"end":4043.21,"text":"可是現在吸引力其他的職業也很多"},{"start":4043.21,"end":4045.21,"text":"所以我們要跟人家競爭人才"},{"start":4045.21,"end":4046.21,"text":"要更聽"},{"start":4046.21,"end":4048.21,"text":"人人都是外交官"},{"start":4048.21,"end":4050.21,"text":"不一定要去外交部上班"},{"start":4050.21,"end":4052.21,"text":"我們最好來考外交官"},{"start":4052.21,"end":4056.21,"text":"當職業外交官我們還是需要專業"},{"start":4056.21,"end":4060.21,"text":"這個包括百億青年圓夢計畫"},{"start":4060.21,"end":4064.21,"text":"我在網站上看到有一個青年"},{"start":4064.21,"end":4066.21,"text":"他說他是第二次得獎"},{"start":4068.21,"end":4070.21,"text":"然後他說我可以教大家怎麼申請"},{"start":4072.17,"end":4074.17,"text":"那因為我一個朋友的小孩"},{"start":4074.17,"end":4076.17,"text":"就去申請這個計畫"},{"start":4076.17,"end":4078.17,"text":"他覺得那是無知天書"},{"start":4078.17,"end":4080.17,"text":"就是說表格"},{"start":4080.17,"end":4082.17,"text":"就叫他去填一些資料"},{"start":4082.17,"end":4084.17,"text":"然後他就問我說"},{"start":4084.17,"end":4087.17,"text":"有人在教怎麼寫這個計畫"},{"start":4087.17,"end":4090.17,"text":"我心裡想說這該不會是公關公司"},{"start":4090.17,"end":4092.17,"text":"該不會是留學顧問公司"},{"start":4092.17,"end":4094.17,"text":"我是沒有去探究"},{"start":4094.17,"end":4096.17,"text":"我的意思是說"},{"start":4096.17,"end":4098.17,"text":"如果有一個民眾說"},{"start":4098.17,"end":4101.17,"text":"這樣外交部就過去通過"},{"start":4101.17,"end":4103.17,"text":"去掉個資以後"},{"start":4103.17,"end":4105.17,"text":"把這個計畫"},{"start":4104.67,"end":4106.67,"text":"放一些範本"},{"start":4106.67,"end":4108.67,"text":"讓大家看一下"},{"start":4108.67,"end":4110.67,"text":"不然有時候要寫人"},{"start":4110.67,"end":4112.67,"text":"他有些有表格化"},{"start":4112.67,"end":4114.67,"text":"可是有些他要自己寫"},{"start":4114.67,"end":4116.67,"text":"他會覺得這樣比較不好用"},{"start":4116.67,"end":4118.67,"text":"這可不可以考慮一下"},{"start":4118.67,"end":4120.67,"text":"報告委員其實教育部有在教人"},{"start":4120.67,"end":4122.67,"text":"你一早來報名"},{"start":4122.67,"end":4124.67,"text":"你什麼都不知道表格"},{"start":4124.67,"end":4126.67,"text":"他也會引導你把這個準備好"},{"start":4126.67,"end":4128.67,"text":"現在這個服務"},{"start":4127.91,"end":4129.91,"text":"教育部啊"},{"start":4129.55,"end":4131.55,"text":"怎麼會召開教育部"},{"start":4131.55,"end":4133.55,"text":"這個案子是教育部主辦的"},{"start":4133.55,"end":4135.55,"text":"我們只是部會之一"},{"start":4135.13,"end":4137.13,"text":"他們有專業的"},{"start":4137.13,"end":4139.13,"text":"業師幫忙輔導"},{"start":4139.13,"end":4141.13,"text":"你寫這個申請書"},{"start":4141.13,"end":4143.13,"text":"這不是外交部"},{"start":4143.13,"end":4145.13,"text":"這教育部"},{"start":4145.13,"end":4147.13,"text":"我們是協判"},{"start":4148.92,"end":4150.92,"text":"我們辦得特別出色"},{"start":4153.29,"end":4155.29,"text":"接下來啊"},{"start":4155.29,"end":4157.29,"text":"有一個建議"},{"start":4157.29,"end":4159.29,"text":"因為我最近看到台中的這個"},{"start":4159.29,"end":4161.29,"text":"應該是明道"},{"start":4161.96,"end":4163.96,"text":"明道中學"},{"start":4173.18,"end":4175.18,"text":"說實在啊"},{"start":4175.18,"end":4177.18,"text":"沒有補助"},{"start":4177.18,"end":4179.18,"text":"我們是希望教育部給他們肯定"},{"start":4179.18,"end":4181.18,"text":"因為他是在台中"},{"start":4181.18,"end":4183.18,"text":"我當市長明道中學是在烏日"},{"start":4183.18,"end":4185.18,"text":"他們真的很積極"},{"start":4185.18,"end":4187.18,"text":"跟他們交流"},{"start":4187.18,"end":4189.18,"text":"互派學生"},{"start":4189.18,"end":4191.18,"text":"他們總統會數人來去看他們的"},{"start":4191.18,"end":4193.18,"text":"各種包括計時交易"},{"start":4193.18,"end":4195.18,"text":"高職也有"},{"start":4195.18,"end":4197.18,"text":"包括做巧克力"},{"start":4197.18,"end":4199.18,"text":"還有各種的才藝"},{"start":4199.18,"end":4201.18,"text":"當然語言是必要的"},{"start":4201.18,"end":4203.18,"text":"所以兩邊的年輕人產生很大的"},{"start":4203.18,"end":4205.18,"text":"激勵的效果"},{"start":4206.51,"end":4208.51,"text":"有沒有可能外交部"},{"start":4208.51,"end":4210.51,"text":"教育部特輪節"},{"start":4210.51,"end":4212.51,"text":"我們要不要我們有一些高中"},{"start":4212.51,"end":4214.51,"text":"去對我們的"},{"start":4214.51,"end":4216.51,"text":"邦交國"},{"start":4215.76,"end":4217.76,"text":"就是說以後如果要問"},{"start":4217.76,"end":4219.76,"text":"帛琉的事情"},{"start":4219.76,"end":4221.76,"text":"都去問明道中學就對了"},{"start":4222.24,"end":4224.24,"text":"反正明道中學"},{"start":4224.24,"end":4226.24,"text":"包括國際教育就針對帛琉"},{"start":4226.24,"end":4228.24,"text":"所以可能整間校裡面"},{"start":4228.24,"end":4230.24,"text":"像這兩百個人"},{"start":4230.24,"end":4232.24,"text":"都知道帛琉這個國家"},{"start":4232.24,"end":4234.24,"text":"然後帛琉的總統來"},{"start":4234.24,"end":4236.24,"text":"帛琉的什麼官員來"},{"start":4236.24,"end":4238.24,"text":"都明道中學"},{"start":4238.24,"end":4240.24,"text":"去接"},{"start":4240.24,"end":4242.24,"text":"就是說這也許是一個方式"},{"start":4242.24,"end":4244.24,"text":"因為我們的學校"},{"start":4244.24,"end":4246.24,"text":"現在很多學校也有國際班"},{"start":4246.24,"end":4248.24,"text":"國際班不一定都要去"},{"start":4248.24,"end":4250.24,"text":"畢國一本"},{"start":4250.24,"end":4252.24,"text":"如果是邦交國"},{"start":4252.24,"end":4254.24,"text":"對我們的外交是不是也有很好的幫助"},{"start":4254.24,"end":4256.24,"text":"不過委員"},{"start":4256.24,"end":4258.24,"text":"這個重點"},{"start":4258.24,"end":4260.24,"text":"我們促成學校之間"},{"start":4260.24,"end":4262.24,"text":"的姐妹校或各種"},{"start":4262.24,"end":4264.24,"text":"的互換學生"},{"start":4264.24,"end":4266.24,"text":"甚至有些學生互相承認"},{"start":4266.24,"end":4268.24,"text":"並聯誌"},{"start":4268.24,"end":4270.24,"text":"這個其實就是把它打通"},{"start":4270.24,"end":4272.24,"text":"連結之後"},{"start":4272.24,"end":4274.24,"text":"它就一直在進行"},{"start":4274.24,"end":4276.24,"text":"這個是我想學校或NGO"},{"start":4276.24,"end":4278.24,"text":"很好的效果"},{"start":4278.24,"end":4280.24,"text":"我不知道你為什麼特別提帛琉"},{"start":4280.24,"end":4282.24,"text":"聽說您是被惠素人總統"},{"start":4282.24,"end":4284.24,"text":"有邀請做為榮譽觀光部長"},{"start":4284.24,"end":4286.24,"text":"所以似乎這個"},{"start":4286.24,"end":4288.24,"text":"對帛琉相當了解"},{"start":4288.24,"end":4290.24,"text":"我們可以用帛琉來做示範"},{"start":4290.24,"end":4292.24,"text":"太平也有三個島國"},{"start":4292.24,"end":4294.24,"text":"也拜託你"},{"start":4294.24,"end":4296.24,"text":"也能夠照顧一下"},{"start":4296.24,"end":4298.24,"text":"馬薩爾群島跟土阿魯"},{"start":4298.24,"end":4300.24,"text":"你要講帛琉我就跟你講帛琉"},{"start":4300.24,"end":4302.24,"text":"帛琉需要我們很多協助"},{"start":4303.54,"end":4305.54,"text":"那可不可以這樣"},{"start":4305.54,"end":4307.54,"text":"我們現在有一些研究生"},{"start":4307.54,"end":4309.54,"text":"可不可以"},{"start":4309.54,"end":4311.54,"text":"外交部幫他們補助"},{"start":4311.69,"end":4313.69,"text":"比如說他去那裡做研究"},{"start":4313.69,"end":4315.69,"text":"外交替代的"},{"start":4315.69,"end":4317.69,"text":"研究生叫外交替代"},{"start":4317.69,"end":4319.69,"text":"都會去那裡做兩年的研究"},{"start":4320.91,"end":4322.91,"text":"也許他們有土木工程"},{"start":4322.91,"end":4324.91,"text":"因為他們現在要吃的建設愛者"},{"start":4324.77,"end":4326.77,"text":"土木工程的老師"},{"start":4326.77,"end":4328.77,"text":"帶著土木工程的研究生"},{"start":4328.77,"end":4330.77,"text":"就去那裡實地做研究"},{"start":4330.77,"end":4332.77,"text":"那裡也有很多海洋可以研究"},{"start":4332.77,"end":4334.77,"text":"海洋相關的"},{"start":4334.77,"end":4336.77,"text":"如果說有這個專案"},{"start":4336.77,"end":4338.77,"text":"一個教授裡面有研究生"},{"start":4338.77,"end":4340.77,"text":"就去那裡一兩年"},{"start":4340.77,"end":4342.77,"text":"然後回來就論文也做完了"},{"start":4342.77,"end":4344.77,"text":"外交替代也服完了"},{"start":4344.77,"end":4346.77,"text":"那我們也協助他們去"},{"start":4346.77,"end":4348.77,"text":"做完他們的建設"},{"start":4348.77,"end":4350.77,"text":"也協助他們在地"},{"start":4350.77,"end":4352.77,"text":"他們在地高中職的畢業生"},{"start":4352.77,"end":4354.77,"text":"也協助他們"},{"start":4354.77,"end":4356.77,"text":"有基本的工程的概念之後"},{"start":4356.77,"end":4358.77,"text":"這是不是一個"},{"start":4358.77,"end":4360.77,"text":"更好的方式"},{"start":4360.77,"end":4362.77,"text":"確實委員的高見"},{"start":4362.77,"end":4364.77,"text":"我們一定要加以推廣"},{"start":4364.77,"end":4366.77,"text":"因為台灣事實上跟海洋"},{"start":4366.77,"end":4368.77,"text":"有這種大學或院"},{"start":4368.77,"end":4370.77,"text":"或系的有六個學校"},{"start":4370.77,"end":4372.77,"text":"台灣的海洋"},{"start":4372.77,"end":4374.77,"text":"我們有限"},{"start":4374.77,"end":4376.77,"text":"博留在第二島鏈"},{"start":4376.77,"end":4378.77,"text":"它那個地理"},{"start":4378.77,"end":4380.77,"text":"是非常特別"},{"start":4380.77,"end":4382.77,"text":"透過這樣的一個"},{"start":4382.77,"end":4384.77,"text":"跟大學合作包括研究所"},{"start":4384.77,"end":4386.77,"text":"然後我們來促成"},{"start":4386.77,"end":4388.77,"text":"因為它那邊有社區大學"},{"start":4388.77,"end":4390.77,"text":"來建立這樣的一個合作計畫"},{"start":4390.77,"end":4392.77,"text":"我們來全力的鼓勵跟支持"},{"start":4392.77,"end":4394.77,"text":"因為我們有技術團"},{"start":4394.77,"end":4396.77,"text":"然後現在就是說"},{"start":4396.77,"end":4398.77,"text":"可以把整個博留的海域"},{"start":4398.77,"end":4400.77,"text":"非常的廣"},{"start":4400.77,"end":4402.77,"text":"我們可以能就就是說"},{"start":4402.77,"end":4404.77,"text":"作為我們的不管教學研究"},{"start":4404.77,"end":4406.77,"text":"或未來在合作上面"},{"start":4406.77,"end":4408.77,"text":"海洋的課題是相當豐富的"},{"start":4408.77,"end":4410.77,"text":"因為有時候我們去協助"},{"start":4410.77,"end":4412.77,"text":"我們的友邦有時候是經費"},{"start":4412.77,"end":4414.77,"text":"有些是幫他們做一些工程"},{"start":4414.77,"end":4416.77,"text":"或者一些物資協助"},{"start":4416.77,"end":4418.77,"text":"之後啊"},{"start":4418.77,"end":4420.77,"text":"畢竟他們後面要接的人"},{"start":4420.77,"end":4422.77,"text":"不夠他們能夠到台灣"},{"start":4422.77,"end":4424.77,"text":"讀書的學生又都很有限"},{"start":4424.77,"end":4426.77,"text":"那與其如此"},{"start":4426.77,"end":4428.77,"text":"那我們讓他們在地"},{"start":4428.77,"end":4430.77,"text":"就能夠把這個人才也順便"},{"start":4430.77,"end":4432.77,"text":"幫他們培養起來"},{"start":4432.77,"end":4434.77,"text":"對兩邊的合作會比較好"},{"start":4434.77,"end":4436.77,"text":"這個再請"},{"start":4436.77,"end":4438.77,"text":"我們放作龍幫計畫"},{"start":4438.77,"end":4440.77,"text":"人才科技資金"},{"start":4440.77,"end":4442.77,"text":"這方面的交流合作"},{"start":4442.77,"end":4444.77,"text":"人才是最重要"},{"start":4444.77,"end":4446.77,"text":"所以剛剛從小到"},{"start":4446.77,"end":4448.77,"text":"這個中小學生"},{"start":4448.77,"end":4450.77,"text":"然後可以到大學研究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teams"},{"start":4935.35,"end":4937.35,"text":"一個協作聯隊的方式在一起"},{"start":4937.35,"end":4939.35,"text":"透過不變跟行政院"},{"start":4939.35,"end":4941.35,"text":"組織法或其他的這些"},{"start":4941.35,"end":4943.35,"text":"組織"},{"start":4943.35,"end":4945.35,"text":"這個結構我們在"},{"start":4945.35,"end":4947.35,"text":"功能面有做了一些調整所以委員"},{"start":4947.35,"end":4949.35,"text":"提到這個因為現在的"},{"start":4949.35,"end":4951.35,"text":"外交的事物跟以前又不一樣"},{"start":4951.35,"end":4953.35,"text":"資訊很發達"},{"start":4953.35,"end":4955.35,"text":"我們國人也是各國"},{"start":4955.35,"end":4957.35,"text":"旅遊"},{"start":4957.35,"end":4959.35,"text":"產生了非常多我們政務跟僑務"},{"start":4959.35,"end":4961.35,"text":"的劃分"},{"start":4961.35,"end":4963.35,"text":"以及從這些部分怎麼去協作"},{"start":4963.35,"end":4965.35,"text":"我們因為我跟"},{"start":4965.35,"end":4967.35,"text":"徐委員長我們是很熟的朋友"},{"start":4967.35,"end":4969.35,"text":"有時候橫向我們兩個的聯絡"},{"start":4969.35,"end":4971.35,"text":"都已經可以很順利"},{"start":4971.35,"end":4973.35,"text":"那當然有注意下面"},{"start":4973.35,"end":4975.35,"text":"跨部會的一個分工合作"},{"start":4976.27,"end":4978.27,"text":"謝謝部長各位委員長"},{"start":4978.27,"end":4980.27,"text":"大家共同努力謝謝"},{"start":4980.27,"end":4982.27,"text":"謝謝陳委員"},{"start":4984.86,"end":4988.86,"text":"謝謝接下來請黃建斌委員上台諮詢"},{"start":4997.98,"end":4999.98,"text":"好謝謝主席我們有請林佳龍"},{"start":4999.98,"end":5001.98,"text":"林部長"},{"start":5009.09,"end":5011.09,"text":"回合"},{"start":5010.25,"end":5012.25,"text":"部長早安"},{"start":5012.25,"end":5014.25,"text":"部長先跟你說一聲辛苦了"},{"start":5014.25,"end":5016.25,"text":"部長最近"},{"start":5016.25,"end":5018.25,"text":"很忙"},{"start":5018.25,"end":5020.25,"text":"身為外交部長你平常是要處理"},{"start":5020.25,"end":5022.25,"text":"國際的情事台美關係"},{"start":5022.25,"end":5024.25,"text":"台日關係然後最近"},{"start":5024.25,"end":5026.25,"text":"部長你有工作又多一個任務"},{"start":5026.25,"end":5028.25,"text":"就是週末要在跑地方"},{"start":5028.25,"end":5030.25,"text":"那幫忙輔選"},{"start":5030.25,"end":5032.25,"text":"這很辛苦"},{"start":5032.25,"end":5034.25,"text":"但是我要提醒部長外交部長是一個"},{"start":5034.25,"end":5036.25,"text":"國家非常重要的職務"},{"start":5036.25,"end":5038.25,"text":"那不是民進黨的"},{"start":5038.25,"end":5040.25,"text":"部長"},{"start":5039.02,"end":5041.02,"text":"總幹事我希望部長不要讓外界"},{"start":5041.02,"end":5043.02,"text":"產生一種印象就是說"},{"start":5043.02,"end":5045.02,"text":"選舉的數位會在外交工作"},{"start":5045.02,"end":5047.02,"text":"之上這部份部長是不是可以"},{"start":5047.02,"end":5049.02,"text":"做得到好我另以"},{"start":5049.02,"end":5051.02,"text":"外交工作為重謝謝部長"},{"start":5051.02,"end":5053.02,"text":"部長現在我要跟部長討論兩個"},{"start":5053.02,"end":5055.02,"text":"駐外管處的問題"},{"start":5055.02,"end":5057.02,"text":"那第一個就是"},{"start":5057.02,"end":5059.02,"text":"最近新聞在播報這個"},{"start":5059.02,"end":5061.02,"text":"駐日內瓦的辦事處處長李冠德"},{"start":5061.02,"end":5063.02,"text":"那目前因為外界對李冠德"},{"start":5063.02,"end":5065.02,"text":"有霸凌下屬職場"},{"start":5065.02,"end":5067.02,"text":"管理私當濫用公帑"},{"start":5067.02,"end":5069.02,"text":"甚至涉及超速等等的爭議"},{"start":5069.02,"end":5071.02,"text":"那我知道這個是屬於"},{"start":5071.02,"end":5073.02,"text":"個案這個個案的具體事實"},{"start":5073.02,"end":5075.02,"text":"外交部應該要依法調查不能"},{"start":5075.02,"end":5077.02,"text":"為省先判但是"},{"start":5077.02,"end":5079.02,"text":"我要請教部長的是說"},{"start":5079.02,"end":5081.02,"text":"外交部對駐外管處主管的"},{"start":5081.02,"end":5083.02,"text":"平等管理能力以及紀律"},{"start":5083.02,"end":5085.02,"text":"的要求到底有沒有一套"},{"start":5085.02,"end":5087.02,"text":"有效的監督機制"},{"start":5087.02,"end":5089.02,"text":"因為駐外的處長"},{"start":5089.02,"end":5091.02,"text":"代表不只是他個人代表是中華民國"},{"start":5091.02,"end":5093.02,"text":"政府那"},{"start":5093.02,"end":5095.02,"text":"外交官在國外的一言一行他都"},{"start":5095.02,"end":5097.02,"text":"可能影響國家的形象"},{"start":5097.02,"end":5099.02,"text":"如果說一個主管在管內"},{"start":5099.02,"end":5101.02,"text":"讓部署感受到霸凌"},{"start":5101.02,"end":5103.02,"text":"濫用公帑甚至還出現交通違規"},{"start":5103.02,"end":5105.02,"text":"等等的爭議"},{"start":5105.02,"end":5107.02,"text":"那麼外交部不能就只說說"},{"start":5107.02,"end":5109.02,"text":"正在調查或是尊重程序"},{"start":5109.02,"end":5111.02,"text":"這樣就來結束喔"},{"start":5111.02,"end":5113.02,"text":"所以本席要問的是說"},{"start":5113.02,"end":5115.02,"text":"到底這個事件我們調查"},{"start":5115.02,"end":5117.02,"text":"查到了什麼有沒有對相關"},{"start":5117.02,"end":5119.02,"text":"人員進行訪談"},{"start":5119.02,"end":5121.02,"text":"那有沒有保護可能會"},{"start":5121.02,"end":5123.02,"text":"受到不當對待的下屬"},{"start":5123.02,"end":5125.02,"text":"那如果這個查證屬實"},{"start":5125.02,"end":5127.02,"text":"外交部會不會追究"},{"start":5127.02,"end":5129.02,"text":"行政甚至是刑事的責任"},{"start":5129.02,"end":5131.02,"text":"那更重要的是說"},{"start":5131.02,"end":5133.02,"text":"我們駐外的管處"},{"start":5133.02,"end":5135.02,"text":"不是誰的山頭"},{"start":5135.02,"end":5137.02,"text":"也不是哪一個主管"},{"start":5137.02,"end":5139.02,"text":"到國外就無法無天喔"},{"start":5139.02,"end":5141.02,"text":"我希望外交部能夠把這件事情來查清楚"},{"start":5142.48,"end":5144.48,"text":"那第二個部分部長大家一起回答"},{"start":5144.48,"end":5146.48,"text":"第二個部分就是說"},{"start":5146.48,"end":5148.48,"text":"因為你之前一直強調談的關係良好"},{"start":5148.48,"end":5150.48,"text":"甚至你自己在"},{"start":5150.48,"end":5152.48,"text":"只能在睡日本機場的時候"},{"start":5152.48,"end":5154.48,"text":"你也豁達的表示說"},{"start":5154.48,"end":5156.48,"text":"你自己覺得沒有很委屈"},{"start":5156.48,"end":5158.48,"text":"那我尊重部長你個人的修養"},{"start":5158.48,"end":5160.48,"text":"你自己睡機場你可以說沒關係"},{"start":5160.48,"end":5162.48,"text":"不委屈這是個人的選擇"},{"start":5162.48,"end":5164.48,"text":"今天問題來了"},{"start":5165.08,"end":5167.08,"text":"如果這個不是你自己睡哪裡的問題"},{"start":5167.08,"end":5169.08,"text":"而是中華民國代表"},{"start":5169.08,"end":5171.08,"text":"在國際場合受到不合理的待遇"},{"start":5171.08,"end":5173.08,"text":"這個就不是部長"},{"start":5173.08,"end":5175.08,"text":"你覺得不委屈就算了"},{"start":5175.08,"end":5177.08,"text":"因為像這一次里昂代表"},{"start":5177.08,"end":5179.08,"text":"參加長期元報和平紀念典禮"},{"start":5179.08,"end":5181.08,"text":"卻被安排在其他國家"},{"start":5181.08,"end":5183.08,"text":"使節後方的位置"},{"start":5183.08,"end":5185.08,"text":"這個對我們來說就是矮化"},{"start":5185.08,"end":5187.08,"text":"那甚至事後日方"},{"start":5187.08,"end":5189.08,"text":"還強硬的出面來表示說"},{"start":5190.46,"end":5192.46,"text":"是我們主動表達"},{"start":5192.46,"end":5194.46,"text":"參加意願後他們才"},{"start":5194.46,"end":5196.46,"text":"同意讓我們出席"},{"start":5196.82,"end":5198.82,"text":"像這種日方打破外交默契"},{"start":5198.82,"end":5200.82,"text":"出面打臉的狀況"},{"start":5200.82,"end":5202.82,"text":"在過去是非常非常的罕見"},{"start":5202.82,"end":5204.82,"text":"所以我也要請教部長說"},{"start":5204.82,"end":5206.82,"text":"你過去跟我們說"},{"start":5206.82,"end":5208.82,"text":"台日關係持續友好深化"},{"start":5208.82,"end":5210.82,"text":"沒有因為卓院長"},{"start":5210.82,"end":5212.82,"text":"公開去日本東京看球賽"},{"start":5212.82,"end":5214.82,"text":"而遭到日本官員表達不滿"},{"start":5214.82,"end":5216.82,"text":"受到這個影響"},{"start":5216.82,"end":5218.82,"text":"你睡機場也是因為行程的安排"},{"start":5218.82,"end":5220.82,"text":"沒有感到委屈"},{"start":5220.82,"end":5222.82,"text":"那為什麼這次我方的代表"},{"start":5222.82,"end":5224.82,"text":"受到這樣子的對待"},{"start":5224.82,"end":5226.82,"text":"卻讓人家看到是另外一回事"},{"start":5226.82,"end":5228.82,"text":"就是說台日真的如您所說的"},{"start":5228.82,"end":5230.82,"text":"依然這麼樣的穩固"},{"start":5232.53,"end":5234.53,"text":"那麼我們代表出席這麼重要的場合"},{"start":5234.53,"end":5236.53,"text":"為什麼會出現這樣子的安排"},{"start":5238.77,"end":5240.77,"text":"儘管說外交廠的座位"},{"start":5240.77,"end":5242.77,"text":"他的安排可能涉及到"},{"start":5242.77,"end":5244.77,"text":"很多的因素"},{"start":5244.77,"end":5246.77,"text":"那也不會單"},{"start":5246.77,"end":5248.77,"text":"我也不會單一用一個座位"},{"start":5248.77,"end":5250.77,"text":"就判斷台日關係"},{"start":5250.77,"end":5252.77,"text":"但是本席想要問說"},{"start":5252.77,"end":5254.77,"text":"當台灣代表明顯被安排在"},{"start":5254.77,"end":5256.77,"text":"相對後方的位置"},{"start":5256.77,"end":5258.77,"text":"外交部有沒有事先掌握"},{"start":5258.84,"end":5260.84,"text":"那這件事情"},{"start":5260.84,"end":5262.84,"text":"事件我方在表達立場之後"},{"start":5262.84,"end":5264.84,"text":"有沒有持續來交涉"},{"start":5264.84,"end":5266.84,"text":"那有沒有得到回應"},{"start":5266.84,"end":5268.84,"text":"得到的回應又是什麼"},{"start":5269.2,"end":5271.2,"text":"更重要的是"},{"start":5271.2,"end":5273.2,"text":"部長你自己可以覺得說"},{"start":5273.2,"end":5275.2,"text":"睡機場沒有什麼"},{"start":5275.2,"end":5277.2,"text":"那是因為你個人的感受"},{"start":5277.2,"end":5279.2,"text":"那如果今天中華民國的國隔在國際的場合的"},{"start":5279.2,"end":5281.2,"text":"尊嚴受到矮化"},{"start":5281.2,"end":5283.2,"text":"這個不是林佳龍個人覺得"},{"start":5283.2,"end":5285.2,"text":"委不委屈的問題"},{"start":5285.2,"end":5287.2,"text":"所以這個才是本席要提醒部長的地方"},{"start":5287.2,"end":5289.2,"text":"因為外交的責任"},{"start":5289.2,"end":5291.2,"text":"不能告訴人民說這沒關係"},{"start":5291.2,"end":5293.2,"text":"我們不敢委屈"},{"start":5293.2,"end":5295.2,"text":"因為外交的責任是當國家代表"},{"start":5295.2,"end":5297.2,"text":"受到不合理對待的時候"},{"start":5297.2,"end":5299.2,"text":"就要站出來替國家爭取"},{"start":5299.2,"end":5301.2,"text":"他應該有的尊重"},{"start":5301.2,"end":5303.2,"text":"所以在這邊本席要請部長正面的回答"},{"start":5303.2,"end":5305.2,"text":"你口中的"},{"start":5305.2,"end":5307.2,"text":"台日關係依舊穩固"},{"start":5307.2,"end":5309.2,"text":"究竟是建立在實際的"},{"start":5309.2,"end":5311.2,"text":"外交待遇上"},{"start":5311.2,"end":5313.2,"text":"或者只是建立在"},{"start":5313.2,"end":5315.2,"text":"國人的認知上面"},{"start":5315.2,"end":5317.2,"text":"如果說台日的關係真的很穩固"},{"start":5317.2,"end":5319.2,"text":"那外交部更應該要拿出"},{"start":5319.2,"end":5321.2,"text":"證據讓國人看到"},{"start":5321.2,"end":5323.2,"text":"而不是我們每次遇到爭議的時候"},{"start":5323.2,"end":5325.2,"text":"反而被審公"},{"start":5325.2,"end":5327.2,"text":"台日友好沒有問題"},{"start":5327.2,"end":5329.2,"text":"或是不委屈不是這樣的話就可以解決"},{"start":5329.2,"end":5331.2,"text":"部長利用這個機會你來說明一下"},{"start":5331.2,"end":5333.2,"text":"謝謝委員"},{"start":5334.49,"end":5336.49,"text":"不是睡機場"},{"start":5336.49,"end":5338.49,"text":"是在機場"},{"start":5338.07,"end":5340.07,"text":"飯店"},{"start":5340.07,"end":5342.07,"text":"早上五點"},{"start":5342.07,"end":5344.07,"text":"包機就到"},{"start":5344.07,"end":5346.07,"text":"這個"},{"start":5346.07,"end":5348.07,"text":"是純粹是"},{"start":5348.07,"end":5350.07,"text":"行程的安排"},{"start":5350.07,"end":5352.07,"text":"我是再次說明"},{"start":5352.07,"end":5354.07,"text":"我不是像電影院的"},{"start":5354.07,"end":5356.07,"text":"有些人就是在機場裡面"},{"start":5356.07,"end":5358.07,"text":"是機場的旅館"},{"start":5358.07,"end":5360.07,"text":"我們台灣也有其實也都"},{"start":5360.07,"end":5362.07,"text":"真的很舒適"},{"start":5362.07,"end":5364.07,"text":"至於說這一次"},{"start":5364.07,"end":5366.07,"text":"有關於所謂日本核爆"},{"start":5366.07,"end":5368.07,"text":"這個紀念的這個活動"},{"start":5368.07,"end":5370.07,"text":"我跟委員報告"},{"start":5370.07,"end":5372.07,"text":"我是跟日方都有溝通的"},{"start":5372.07,"end":5374.07,"text":"管道也暢通"},{"start":5374.07,"end":5376.07,"text":"我們也有分工"},{"start":5376.07,"end":5378.07,"text":"比如大使去廣島"},{"start":5378.07,"end":5380.07,"text":"處長去長崎"},{"start":5380.07,"end":5382.07,"text":"廣島因為在遷"},{"start":5382.07,"end":5384.07,"text":"就鞏固了我們台日關係"},{"start":5384.07,"end":5386.07,"text":"雖然我們沒有邦交國"},{"start":5386.07,"end":5388.07,"text":"他把我們視同邦交國"},{"start":5388.07,"end":5390.07,"text":"我們當然是非常的肯定"},{"start":5390.07,"end":5392.07,"text":"可是在長崎"},{"start":5392.07,"end":5394.07,"text":"因為他過去就是說"},{"start":5394.07,"end":5396.07,"text":"當然"},{"start":5396,"end":5398,"text":"有一些比較不友善的"},{"start":5398,"end":5400,"text":"這個行為"},{"start":5400,"end":5402,"text":"那這一次他們希望有改善"},{"start":5402.97,"end":5404.97,"text":"所以其實跟外面報道"},{"start":5404.97,"end":5406.97,"text":"是有出路的"},{"start":5406.97,"end":5408.97,"text":"並不是說像去年那個樣"},{"start":5408.97,"end":5410.97,"text":"中間又隔一個走道"},{"start":5410.97,"end":5412.97,"text":"他我們的處長到的時候"},{"start":5412.97,"end":5414.97,"text":"也是報到他也是專人"},{"start":5414.97,"end":5416.97,"text":"引導入座"},{"start":5416.97,"end":5418.97,"text":"也有帶了一個就是所謂"},{"start":5418.97,"end":5420.97,"text":"使節團的那個花很大"},{"start":5421.21,"end":5423.21,"text":"所以我認為某個程度來講"},{"start":5423.21,"end":5425.21,"text":"對方也可能感受到"},{"start":5425.21,"end":5427.21,"text":"不管是"},{"start":5427.21,"end":5429.21,"text":"我們的誠意或他們社會的壓力"},{"start":5429.21,"end":5431.21,"text":"那我是認為"},{"start":5432.35,"end":5434.35,"text":"但是"},{"start":5434.49,"end":5436.49,"text":"我們仍然不滿意"},{"start":5436.49,"end":5438.49,"text":"我們還是希望說"},{"start":5438.49,"end":5440.49,"text":"因為這樣一個活動"},{"start":5440.49,"end":5442.49,"text":"能夠"},{"start":5442.64,"end":5444.64,"text":"就是說這個"},{"start":5444.64,"end":5446.64,"text":"跟一般使節團一樣"},{"start":5446.64,"end":5448.64,"text":"完全一樣"},{"start":5448.64,"end":5450.64,"text":"可是事實上這裡面在實質上是一樣"},{"start":5450.64,"end":5452.64,"text":"可是他們對於台灣的"},{"start":5452.64,"end":5454.64,"text":"跟我們的外交關係或我們的"},{"start":5454.64,"end":5456.64,"text":"國家的這個定位"},{"start":5456.64,"end":5458.64,"text":"是確實"},{"start":5458.64,"end":5460.64,"text":"不是邦交國"},{"start":5460.64,"end":5462.64,"text":"所以我覺得在外交是很複雜"},{"start":5462.64,"end":5464.64,"text":"我們不可能都百分百"},{"start":5464.64,"end":5466.64,"text":"用我們期待的標準"},{"start":5466.64,"end":5468.64,"text":"有時候中間就要來來往往"},{"start":5468.64,"end":5470.64,"text":"慢慢去拉近這個距離"},{"start":5470.64,"end":5472.64,"text":"所以我認為說外面有一些"},{"start":5472.64,"end":5474.64,"text":"可能認為說他們這個"},{"start":5474.64,"end":5476.64,"text":"有點矮化我們"},{"start":5476.64,"end":5478.64,"text":"很不禮貌啦"},{"start":5478.64,"end":5480.64,"text":"我也黨都表達了"},{"start":5480.64,"end":5482.64,"text":"這是我們的國家的立場"},{"start":5482.64,"end":5484.64,"text":"可是也要鼓勵"},{"start":5483.34,"end":5485.34,"text":"他們朝改善的方向"},{"start":5485.34,"end":5487.34,"text":"來這個發展"},{"start":5489.32,"end":5491.32,"text":"部長這當然就是了解"},{"start":5491.32,"end":5493.32,"text":"不好意思主席我在耽誤一點時間"},{"start":5494.94,"end":5496.94,"text":"我相信其實部長我們都要釋出三立"},{"start":5496.94,"end":5498.94,"text":"但是如果真的有不禮貌的新聞"},{"start":5498.94,"end":5500.94,"text":"我們也應該要講話"},{"start":5500.94,"end":5502.94,"text":"部長你聽那個回應你這樣"},{"start":5502.94,"end":5504.94,"text":"是你要參加我給你來"},{"start":5506.14,"end":5508.14,"text":"聽到你怎麼想"},{"start":5508.14,"end":5510.14,"text":"我們一直拜託人家讓我們參加你多久"},{"start":5510.14,"end":5512.14,"text":"所以你今天來你拜後面"},{"start":5512.14,"end":5514.14,"text":"那是我很尊重你"},{"start":5514.75,"end":5516.75,"text":"他們是有到副市長陳吉"},{"start":5516.75,"end":5518.75,"text":"跟我們交涉"},{"start":5518.75,"end":5520.75,"text":"也有議員"},{"start":5520.75,"end":5522.75,"text":"大家都想促成"},{"start":5522.75,"end":5524.75,"text":"基本上這個是一個"},{"start":5524.75,"end":5526.75,"text":"和報是一個和平紀念的活動"},{"start":5526.75,"end":5528.75,"text":"我是覺得這次裡面"},{"start":5528.75,"end":5530.75,"text":"的拿捏我們已經做了"},{"start":5531.25,"end":5555.6,"text":"區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區區"},{"start":5556.11,"end":5558.11,"text":"外交還是要來往啊"},{"start":5558.11,"end":5561.11,"text":"我是鼓勵我的我們的管處長啊"},{"start":5561.11,"end":5562.11,"text":"要發揮創意"},{"start":5562.11,"end":5564.11,"text":"讓他們授權他們"},{"start":5564.11,"end":5566.11,"text":"有一點彈性的空間"},{"start":5566.11,"end":5568.11,"text":"因為在第一線打仗啊"},{"start":5568.11,"end":5570.11,"text":"外交是沒有煙消的戰爭"},{"start":5570.11,"end":5572.11,"text":"24小時111個外館"},{"start":5572.11,"end":5574.11,"text":"我們隨時都在作戰"},{"start":5574.11,"end":5575.11,"text":"謝謝部長這樣的說明"},{"start":5575.11,"end":5578.11,"text":"我想利用這個機會讓國人也看到就是說"},{"start":5578.11,"end":5581.11,"text":"當我們的外交情況遇到這種情形"},{"start":5581.11,"end":5583.11,"text":"我們該表達什麼樣的方式"},{"start":5583.11,"end":5585.11,"text":"另外一場堅定"},{"start":5585.11,"end":5587.11,"text":"態度很溫柔"},{"start":5587.11,"end":5589.11,"text":"但是方法很有策略"},{"start":5589.11,"end":5591.11,"text":"另外就是有分手提到的問題"},{"start":5591.11,"end":5593.11,"text":"就是外交使節這些事情"},{"start":5593.11,"end":5595.11,"text":"就是如何把這個事情"},{"start":5595.22,"end":5600.22,"text":"我很正面看到"},{"start":5600.22,"end":5602.22,"text":"我們外交部的同仁"},{"start":5602.22,"end":5604.22,"text":"以具名的方式"},{"start":5604.22,"end":5606.22,"text":"來提出檢舉"},{"start":5606.22,"end":5608.22,"text":"因此在7月底我們收到的時候"},{"start":5608.22,"end":5610.22,"text":"我們就已經立案"},{"start":5610.22,"end":5613.22,"text":"然後8月2號就組成專案調查小組"},{"start":5613.22,"end":5616.22,"text":"然後現在呢我們的理事長也返國了"},{"start":5616.22,"end":5618.22,"text":"因為這個事情"},{"start":5618.22,"end":5619.22,"text":"他檢舉的項目非常多"},{"start":5619.22,"end":5620.22,"text":"涉及很多單位"},{"start":5620.22,"end":5623.22,"text":"恐怕不是我們公文往返啊"},{"start":5623.22,"end":5624.22,"text":"能夠辦理的"},{"start":5624.22,"end":5626.22,"text":"所以我們就請他回來"},{"start":5626.22,"end":5629.22,"text":"然後來面對這個調查小組"},{"start":5629.22,"end":5631.22,"text":"因為這都是很多外部委員都是專業的"},{"start":5631.22,"end":5634.22,"text":"有法律的有諮商的這些專家"},{"start":5634.22,"end":5636.22,"text":"我們就信任他們"},{"start":5636.22,"end":5638.22,"text":"我們也希望這個程序能夠加速"},{"start":5638.22,"end":5640.22,"text":"那把他釐清事實"},{"start":5640.22,"end":5642.22,"text":"因為有一些可能"},{"start":5642.22,"end":5645.22,"text":"這個雙方面的一個認知或證據是什麼"},{"start":5645.22,"end":5646.22,"text":"那我們就把他提出來"},{"start":5646.22,"end":5649.22,"text":"我們也不要馬上就下結論"},{"start":5649.22,"end":5652.22,"text":"然後給這個調查專業的小組"},{"start":5652.22,"end":5654.22,"text":"有一個調查的空間"},{"start":5654.22,"end":5656.22,"text":"好謝謝部長"},{"start":5656.22,"end":5658.22,"text":"部長那個還是關心你"},{"start":5658.22,"end":5660.22,"text":"真的要利用假日好好學習"},{"start":5660.22,"end":5661.22,"text":"平時真的國事如麻"},{"start":5661.22,"end":5662.22,"text":"外交的處境"},{"start":5662.22,"end":5663.22,"text":"剛剛我們聊起來就是"},{"start":5663.22,"end":5666.22,"text":"一件小事情都可以忙成這樣子"},{"start":5666.22,"end":5668.22,"text":"所以你班上的時候你也多睡一會"},{"start":5668.22,"end":5670.22,"text":"我都在睡一會"},{"start":5670.22,"end":5672.22,"text":"一路來找我"},{"start":5672.22,"end":5673.22,"text":"那副算的工作"},{"start":5673.22,"end":5675.22,"text":"很多人都在做你多睡一會"},{"start":5675.22,"end":5677.22,"text":"就是人才嘛"},{"start":5677.22,"end":5678.22,"text":"就好學習啊"},{"start":5678.22,"end":5680.22,"text":"好謝謝部長謝謝謝謝部長"},{"start":5680.22,"end":5681.22,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":5683.95,"end":5684.95,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":5686.28,"end":5689.28,"text":"我們接下來請許中信委員上台諮詢"},{"start":5698.35,"end":5699.35,"text":"親愛的女士"},{"start":5699.35,"end":5702.35,"text":"我會想請許家清先生上台"},{"start":5703.43,"end":5705.43,"text":"請許委員長"},{"start":5707.22,"end":5709.22,"text":"國務卿"},{"start":5709.22,"end":5710.22,"text":"國務卿"},{"start":5713.7,"end":5715.7,"text":"啊呀"},{"start":5715.46,"end":5716.46,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5716.46,"end":5717.46,"text":"非常好"},{"start":5717.46,"end":5719.46,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5719.46,"end":5720.46,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5720.46,"end":5721.46,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5721.69,"end":5722.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5722.69,"end":5723.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5723.69,"end":5724.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5724.69,"end":5725.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5725.69,"end":5726.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5726.69,"end":5727.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5727.69,"end":5728.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5728.69,"end":5729.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5729.69,"end":5730.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5730.69,"end":5731.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5731.69,"end":5732.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5732.69,"end":5733.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5733.69,"end":5734.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5734.69,"end":5735.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5735.69,"end":5736.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5736.69,"end":5737.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5737.69,"end":5738.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5738.69,"end":5739.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5739.69,"end":5740.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5740.69,"end":5741.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5741.69,"end":5742.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5742.69,"end":5743.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5743.69,"end":5744.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5744.69,"end":5745.69,"text":"我聽到你們的英文"},{"start":5727.27,"end":5729.27,"text":"Fraganji in English"},{"start":5731.22,"end":5734.22,"text":"Fraganji in English"},{"start":5735.27,"end":5735.77,"text":"Good"},{"start":5737.36,"end":5740.36,"text":"First of all, I would like to complain to you."},{"start":5741.56,"end":5743.56,"text":"On the 29th of this year"},{"start":5744.82,"end":5746.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5746.82,"end":5747.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5747.82,"end":5748.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5748.82,"end":5749.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5749.82,"end":5750.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5750.82,"end":5751.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5751.82,"end":5752.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5752.82,"end":5753.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5753.82,"end":5754.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5754.82,"end":5755.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5755.82,"end":5756.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5756.82,"end":5757.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5757.82,"end":5758.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5758.82,"end":5759.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5759.82,"end":5760.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5760.82,"end":5761.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5761.82,"end":5762.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5762.82,"end":5763.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5763.82,"end":5764.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5764.82,"end":5765.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5765.82,"end":5766.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5766.82,"end":5767.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5767.82,"end":5768.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5768.82,"end":5769.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5769.82,"end":5770.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5770.82,"end":5771.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5771.82,"end":5772.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5772.82,"end":5773.82,"text":"the whole Japanese"},{"start":5750.07,"end":5751.07,"text":"Chinese Community"},{"start":5752.25,"end":5754.25,"text":"and the Japan"},{"start":5754.63,"end":5756.63,"text":"Taiwanese Chamber of Commerce"},{"start":5756.63,"end":5758.63,"text":"register the legislative"},{"start":5760.03,"end":5762.03,"text":"and you are former"},{"start":5762.94,"end":5763.44,"text":"VICE"},{"start":5763.97,"end":5764.97,"text":"Minister Zhang"},{"start":5766.07,"end":5768.07,"text":"Taiwanese"},{"start":5768.77,"end":5770.77,"text":"and the third generation of"},{"start":5771.47,"end":5772.47,"text":"Taiwanese"},{"start":5772.47,"end":5773.47,"text":"Japanese"},{"start":5773.76,"end":5775.76,"text":"they did not speak Mandarin"},{"start":5776.68,"end":5778.68,"text":"they can only speak Mandarin"},{"start":5778.68,"end":5780.68,"text":"as a simple sentence"},{"start":5780.68,"end":5782.68,"text":"so this kind of situation"},{"start":5782.68,"end":5783.68,"text":"for me"},{"start":5784.34,"end":5785.34,"text":"to use Japanese"},{"start":5786.49,"end":5788.49,"text":"to host the banquet"},{"start":5788.49,"end":5789.49,"text":"and entertain them"},{"start":5791.5,"end":5792.5,"text":"And secondly"},{"start":5793.91,"end":5795.91,"text":"2023"},{"start":5796.39,"end":5797.39,"text":"There was a"},{"start":5797.88,"end":5798.88,"text":"English teaching"},{"start":5799.85,"end":5801.85,"text":"volunteer service program"},{"start":5802.74,"end":5804.74,"text":"to praise in Taiwan right"},{"start":5804.74,"end":5805.74,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5806.14,"end":5807.14,"text":"There was a"},{"start":5807.66,"end":5809.66,"text":"Miao Li Primary Pupil"},{"start":5810.5,"end":5812.5,"text":"Who speak very well English"},{"start":5812.5,"end":5813.5,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5813.5,"end":5815.5,"text":"To express his"},{"start":5815.56,"end":5817.56,"text":"Greater to appreciation"},{"start":5817.94,"end":5818.94,"text":"to the volunteer"},{"start":5818.94,"end":5819.94,"text":"English teacher"},{"start":5820.39,"end":5822.39,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5828.44,"end":5829.44,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5829.44,"end":5830.44,"text":"That is great"},{"start":5832.1,"end":5833.1,"text":"Thank you"},{"start":5833.53,"end":5835.53,"text":"We also have the opportunity"},{"start":5835.53,"end":5837.53,"text":"for them to visit Taiwan"},{"start":5838.92,"end":5840.92,"text":"to know Taiwan's culture"},{"start":5841.48,"end":5843.48,"text":"and to know Taiwan's humanity"},{"start":5844.2,"end":5845.2,"text":"That is great"},{"start":5845.4,"end":5846.4,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5846.4,"end":5847.4,"text":"I will do my best"},{"start":5847.4,"end":5848.4,"text":"I will keep going"},{"start":5848.4,"end":5849.4,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5853.21,"end":5855.21,"text":"The formal conference"},{"start":5856.81,"end":5858.81,"text":"What kind of language did you use"},{"start":5858.81,"end":5861.81,"text":"First time I will ask every audience"},{"start":5861.81,"end":5864.81,"text":"What kind of language they can understand"},{"start":5864.81,"end":5868.81,"text":"Most young people"},{"start":5868.81,"end":5870.81,"text":"understanding English only"},{"start":5870.81,"end":5871.81,"text":"They just"},{"start":5871.81,"end":5872.81,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5872.81,"end":5874.81,"text":"Etherly people"},{"start":5874.81,"end":5877.81,"text":"Most can speak Mandarin, English"},{"start":5877.81,"end":5879.81,"text":"and Taiwanese or Hakka"},{"start":5879.81,"end":5883.81,"text":"So I will use those languages"},{"start":5883.81,"end":5885.81,"text":"The first and second generation"},{"start":5885.81,"end":5887.81,"text":"They can speak Mandarin"},{"start":5891.81,"end":5892.81,"text":"I don't think so"},{"start":5894.81,"end":5895.81,"text":"But why not"},{"start":5895.81,"end":5897.81,"text":"The third generation"},{"start":5897.81,"end":5900.81,"text":"They cannot speak Mandarin very well"},{"start":5904.81,"end":5906.81,"text":"Who use Mandarin"},{"start":5907.81,"end":5909.81,"text":"Do you understand"},{"start":5909.81,"end":5911.81,"text":"The conference time"},{"start":5912.81,"end":5914.81,"text":"So your answer"},{"start":5914.81,"end":5915.81,"text":"Remind me"},{"start":5915.81,"end":5916.81,"text":"Legislator Xu"},{"start":5916.81,"end":5919.81,"text":"I know you just come back from USA"},{"start":5919.81,"end":5921.81,"text":"I always follow you"},{"start":5921.81,"end":5925.81,"text":"Your answer remind me of your predecessor"},{"start":5925.81,"end":5926.81,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5926.81,"end":5927.81,"text":"From Ye Gong Chao"},{"start":5928.69,"end":5929.69,"text":"講笑言"},{"start":5930.36,"end":5932.36,"text":"That's why in everywhere"},{"start":5932.36,"end":5934.36,"text":"I always speak local languages"},{"start":5935.73,"end":5940.73,"text":"They facing the first and second generation of overseas Chinese"},{"start":5940.73,"end":5944.73,"text":"At that time they still can use Mandarin to communicate with each other"},{"start":5944.73,"end":5945.73,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5945.73,"end":5946.73,"text":"But they"},{"start":5947.25,"end":5950.25,"text":"Still very fluent with English"},{"start":5950.25,"end":5951.25,"text":"I understand"},{"start":5952.4,"end":5955.4,"text":"I think you say"},{"start":5955.4,"end":5956.4,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5957.67,"end":5958.67,"text":"But"},{"start":5959.81,"end":5961.81,"text":"They still speak local languages"},{"start":5963.27,"end":5964.27,"text":"That's for us"},{"start":5964.27,"end":5965.27,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5967.99,"end":5968.99,"text":"Yes"},{"start":5969.55,"end":5970.55,"text":"Ye Gong Chao"},{"start":5971.9,"end":5973.9,"text":"They can use Chinese to speak"},{"start":5973.9,"end":5976.9,"text":"But they still very fluent with English"},{"start":5977.59,"end":5978.59,"text":"So what"},{"start":5978.96,"end":5979.96,"text":"OK"},{"start":5980.33,"end":5981.33,"text":"Then"},{"start":5981.31,"end":5982.31,"text":"Would you please"},{"start":5983.37,"end":5987.37,"text":"Translate your own paragraph language into Chinese into English now"},{"start":5988.18,"end":5990.18,"text":"I always do that"},{"start":5990.18,"end":5991.18,"text":"Legislator Xu"},{"start":5991.18,"end":5992.18,"text":"I always do that"},{"start":5993.12,"end":5997.12,"text":"Would you please translate your own language into English"},{"start":5998.22,"end":5999.22,"text":"But now"},{"start":5999.22,"end":6000.22,"text":"Yes"},{"start":6000.33,"end":6001.33,"text":"OK"},{"start":6002.05,"end":6003.05,"text":"So"},{"start":6004.7,"end":6005.7,"text":"Inside"},{"start":6006.27,"end":6007.27,"text":"Lose"},{"start":6013.95,"end":6014.95,"text":"They"},{"start":6014.95,"end":6015.95,"text":"Will"},{"start":6015.95,"end":6016.95,"text":"Through"},{"start":6016.95,"end":6017.95,"text":"These"},{"start":6017.95,"end":6018.95,"text":"U.T."},{"start":6018.95,"end":6019.95,"text":"Culture"},{"start":6019.95,"end":6020.95,"text":"Participants"},{"start":6019.65,"end":6021.65,"text":"To know our Taiwan"},{"start":6030.95,"end":6031.95,"text":"Thank you"},{"start":6038.06,"end":6039.06,"text":"Help"},{"start":6040.12,"end":6043.12,"text":"Our young students open their vision"},{"start":6043.12,"end":6046.12,"text":"That is not good enough for your job"},{"start":6046.12,"end":6047.12,"text":"Let me do it for you"},{"start":6048.66,"end":6051.66,"text":"Those here are not for the Taiwanese or Chinese"},{"start":6052.62,"end":6053.62,"text":"Yours"},{"start":6054.07,"end":6055.07,"text":"Thank you"},{"start":6065.67,"end":6066.67,"text":"Thank you"},{"start":6067.83,"end":6068.83,"text":"And on the other hand"},{"start":6069.88,"end":6071.88,"text":"We can let our pupils have the chance"},{"start":6073.28,"end":6074.28,"text":"To learn English here"},{"start":6076.54,"end":6078.54,"text":"To know Taiwan's culture"},{"start":6078.54,"end":6081.54,"text":"Know this piece of dance humanity"},{"start":6081.54,"end":6082.54,"text":"And on the other hand"},{"start":6082.54,"end":6083.54,"text":"That Taiwan's pupils"},{"start":6083.54,"end":6084.54,"text":"Legislator Xu"},{"start":6084.54,"end":6087.54,"text":"That's why we need more budget"},{"start":6087.54,"end":6088.54,"text":"To do more"},{"start":6088.54,"end":6092.54,"text":"Lose like English volunteer program"},{"start":6092.54,"end":6095.54,"text":"Or more bus car program"},{"start":6095.54,"end":6097.54,"text":"So you should support us"},{"start":6097.54,"end":6100.54,"text":"Give us more budget"},{"start":6100.54,"end":6102.54,"text":"Not only just ask me"},{"start":6102.54,"end":6103.54,"text":"Because I have"},{"start":6103.54,"end":6105.54,"text":"Not enough budget"},{"start":6105.54,"end":6108.54,"text":"When you visit the United States"},{"start":6108.54,"end":6110.54,"text":"What kind of language you use"},{"start":6110.54,"end":6112.54,"text":"To address the formal Chinese"},{"start":6112.54,"end":6113.54,"text":"I will"},{"start":6113.54,"end":6114.54,"text":"I will"},{"start":6114.54,"end":6115.54,"text":"I will do that"},{"start":6115.54,"end":6118.54,"text":"What did you use"},{"start":6118.54,"end":6119.54,"text":"What did you use"},{"start":6119.54,"end":6120.54,"text":"OK"},{"start":6120.54,"end":6121.54,"text":"I will"},{"start":6122.4,"end":6123.4,"text":"I will"},{"start":6123.4,"end":6125.4,"text":"We are both to three then right"},{"start":6125.4,"end":6126.4,"text":"OK"},{"start":6126.4,"end":6127.4,"text":"Yes"},{"start":6127.4,"end":6128.4,"text":"What kind of language"},{"start":6128.4,"end":6131.4,"text":"Will you intend to address the formal Chinese there"},{"start":6132.14,"end":6133.14,"text":"OK"},{"start":6133.14,"end":6134.14,"text":"OK"},{"start":6134.14,"end":6135.14,"text":"That's good"},{"start":6135.14,"end":6136.14,"text":"Thank you"},{"start":6136.14,"end":6137.14,"text":"Thank you"},{"start":6138.55,"end":6139.55,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":6141.75,"end":6145.75,"text":"因為我們在中華民國的國會殿堂"},{"start":6145.75,"end":6147.75,"text":"上一次林佳龍部長"},{"start":6147.75,"end":6148.75,"text":"回答許委員"},{"start":6148.75,"end":6151.75,"text":"許委員用什麼樣的語言"},{"start":6151.75,"end":6153.75,"text":"那我想都沒有問題"},{"start":6153.75,"end":6155.75,"text":"不過因為我們在"},{"start":6155.75,"end":6158.75,"text":"我們的國會殿堂的質詢"},{"start":6158.75,"end":6159.75,"text":"是有記錄"},{"start":6159.75,"end":6161.75,"text":"有公報記錄的"},{"start":6161.75,"end":6162.75,"text":"上一次林佳龍部長"},{"start":6162.75,"end":6166.75,"text":"是用我們的國語中文來回答"},{"start":6166.75,"end":6169.75,"text":"我想所有的語彙的官員"},{"start":6169.75,"end":6171.75,"text":"都要注意到這一點"},{"start":6172.18,"end":6173.18,"text":"跟召委報告"},{"start":6173.18,"end":6175.18,"text":"等一下我會把它全部翻譯好"},{"start":6175.18,"end":6176.18,"text":"提供參考"},{"start":6176.18,"end":6177.18,"text":"不好意思"},{"start":6177.18,"end":6178.18,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":6178.18,"end":6179.18,"text":"因為我也是臨時被"},{"start":6179.18,"end":6180.18,"text":"那個許委員"},{"start":6180.18,"end":6181.18,"text":"我也不知道我今天要"},{"start":6181.18,"end":6182.18,"text":"好謝謝"},{"start":6182.18,"end":6183.18,"text":"要被要求的語文"},{"start":6183.18,"end":6186.18,"text":"請陳冠廷委員上台質詢"},{"start":6191.97,"end":6192.97,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":6196.43,"end":6199.43,"text":"好我們請林佳龍部長"},{"start":6199.43,"end":6200.43,"text":"好請林部長"},{"start":6209.17,"end":6210.17,"text":"部長好"},{"start":6210.17,"end":6211.17,"text":"我也好"},{"start":6211.17,"end":6212.17,"text":"我們今天見證"},{"start":6212.17,"end":6213.17,"text":"我們台灣慢慢的要邁向雙語國家"},{"start":6213.17,"end":6215.17,"text":"那這是一個好的開始"},{"start":6217,"end":6219,"text":"那我們先談一下外交好了"},{"start":6219,"end":6221,"text":"其實今天可能沒有辦法"},{"start":6221,"end":6222,"text":"直接來談這個"},{"start":6222,"end":6223,"text":"我們今天專案的事情"},{"start":6223,"end":6225,"text":"我今天想要談一下就是"},{"start":6225,"end":6226,"text":"就是我們國家預算增加"},{"start":6226,"end":6229,"text":"那當然我們有看到說"},{"start":6229,"end":6231,"text":"真的內政的政策"},{"start":6231,"end":6232,"text":"有包含要刺激消費等等"},{"start":6232,"end":6233,"text":"那我想說"},{"start":6233,"end":6234,"text":"隨著我們的進行預算"},{"start":6234,"end":6235,"text":"經費的增加"},{"start":6235,"end":6236,"text":"我們在外交上面的資源"},{"start":6236,"end":6237,"text":"怎麼去配"},{"start":6237,"end":6238,"text":"怎麼去分配"},{"start":6238.99,"end":6239.99,"text":"我為什麼會講這件事情"},{"start":6239.99,"end":6240.99,"text":"是因為"},{"start":6241.44,"end":6242.44,"text":"有多次"},{"start":6242.44,"end":6243.44,"text":"現在的美國政府"},{"start":6243.44,"end":6244.44,"text":"川普總統"},{"start":6245.94,"end":6246.94,"text":"他們的多次發言"},{"start":6246.94,"end":6247.94,"text":"常常會針對我們台積電"},{"start":6248.91,"end":6250.91,"text":"那我們可以理解到"},{"start":6250.91,"end":6252.91,"text":"美國對於他們再工業化"},{"start":6252.91,"end":6253.91,"text":"那對再工業化"},{"start":6253.91,"end":6255.91,"text":"以及他們的經濟成長"},{"start":6255.91,"end":6257.91,"text":"是有他們自己對自己的要求"},{"start":6257.91,"end":6259.91,"text":"那他們希望把工作留在美國"},{"start":6259.91,"end":6261.91,"text":"這些我們都理解"},{"start":6261.91,"end":6263.91,"text":"那我們在拜登政府時期"},{"start":6263.91,"end":6266.91,"text":"那那個時候的溝通是很順暢"},{"start":6266.91,"end":6267.91,"text":"那時候的溝通順暢"},{"start":6267.91,"end":6268.91,"text":"在於說他們知道說"},{"start":6268.91,"end":6270.91,"text":"最有效率的方式"},{"start":6270.91,"end":6272.91,"text":"是讓全球分工"},{"start":6272.91,"end":6275.91,"text":"包含在友邦國家內的分工"},{"start":6275.91,"end":6276.91,"text":"也就是說"},{"start":6276.91,"end":6278.91,"text":"如果台灣是一個可信賴的夥伴"},{"start":6278.91,"end":6279.91,"text":"在台灣生產"},{"start":6279.91,"end":6280.91,"text":"在台灣製造晶片"},{"start":6280.91,"end":6282.91,"text":"對於美國的利益"},{"start":6282.91,"end":6284.91,"text":"是更加有經濟效率的"},{"start":6285.55,"end":6288.55,"text":"那拜登政府理解這個狀況"},{"start":6289.29,"end":6292.29,"text":"不過在美國政府大概更替之後"},{"start":6292.29,"end":6294.29,"text":"那他們政策會調整"},{"start":6294.44,"end":6296.44,"text":"政策調整不是對或錯"},{"start":6296.44,"end":6297.44,"text":"那會影響到我國嘛"},{"start":6297.44,"end":6299.44,"text":"因為他們會不斷強調說"},{"start":6299.44,"end":6303.44,"text":"這個希望在美方的國土內"},{"start":6303.44,"end":6304.44,"text":"自己來去生產晶片"},{"start":6304.44,"end":6308.44,"text":"自己來去擴大他們的工業能量"},{"start":6309.05,"end":6311.05,"text":"那這個時候我們必須要放住的資源就多了"},{"start":6311.05,"end":6313.05,"text":"也就是說我們以前過去"},{"start":6313.05,"end":6315.05,"text":"我們跟國會議員來去交流"},{"start":6315.05,"end":6319.05,"text":"過去是跟這個智庫來去交流"},{"start":6319.94,"end":6322.94,"text":"那現在我們當然要把資源放更多"},{"start":6322.94,"end":6324.94,"text":"在於能夠接觸到"},{"start":6324.94,"end":6327.94,"text":"川普總統及其智囊團"},{"start":6327.94,"end":6330.94,"text":"甚至是他背後的支持者、贊助者"},{"start":6331.65,"end":6333.65,"text":"的這個可能性"},{"start":6335.4,"end":6336.4,"text":"配置"},{"start":6336.4,"end":6339.4,"text":"那過去當然是很多是在傳統的外交"},{"start":6340.09,"end":6342.09,"text":"那我們是不是要思考一下"},{"start":6342.09,"end":6344.09,"text":"非傳統的方式"},{"start":6344.09,"end":6346.09,"text":"不管是你說遊說的方式也好"},{"start":6346.09,"end":6349.09,"text":"或者是擴大遊說的能力也好"},{"start":6349.87,"end":6351.87,"text":"那"},{"start":6350.79,"end":6353.79,"text":"我們講有些是機密有些是非機密的"},{"start":6353.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謝謝部長"},{"start":6507.55,"end":6509.55,"text":"我剛剛提到的是"},{"start":6509.55,"end":6511.55,"text":"我當然覺得是台積電"},{"start":6511.55,"end":6512.55,"text":"他去赴美他投資"},{"start":6512.55,"end":6514.55,"text":"經過我們的審查之後赴美投資"},{"start":6514.55,"end":6516.55,"text":"他符合自己的企業利益"},{"start":6516.55,"end":6517.55,"text":"這個我們都知道"},{"start":6517.55,"end":6518.55,"text":"而且說真的"},{"start":6518.55,"end":6520.55,"text":"台積電是全球的產業"},{"start":6520.55,"end":6521.55,"text":"業的重要的一環"},{"start":6521.55,"end":6522.55,"text":"他也在全球佈局"},{"start":6522.55,"end":6523.55,"text":"他在日本也佈局"},{"start":6523.55,"end":6524.55,"text":"在美國也佈局"},{"start":6524.55,"end":6526.55,"text":"他未來也在歐洲佈局"},{"start":6526.55,"end":6527.55,"text":"這個我們都知道"},{"start":6527.55,"end":6528.55,"text":"但是我們要知道的是說"},{"start":6528.55,"end":6530.55,"text":"美國總統的一句話"},{"start":6530.55,"end":6532.55,"text":"他對市場的波動是非常大的"},{"start":6532.55,"end":6533.55,"text":"也就是說我們怎麼樣"},{"start":6533.55,"end":6535.55,"text":"剛才有提到"},{"start":6535.55,"end":6536.55,"text":"怎麼樣把資源"},{"start":6536.55,"end":6537.55,"text":"除了傳統外交"},{"start":6537.55,"end":6539.55,"text":"剛才部長你還沒有提到"},{"start":6539.55,"end":6541.55,"text":"非傳統外交的方式"},{"start":6541.55,"end":6543.55,"text":"要怎麼樣去編列"},{"start":6543.55,"end":6545.55,"text":"甚至你用機密外交我都不反對"},{"start":6547.24,"end":6548.24,"text":"他的每句話都很重要"},{"start":6548.24,"end":6549.24,"text":"的意思就是說"},{"start":6549.24,"end":6551.24,"text":"有人在影響他"},{"start":6551.24,"end":6553.24,"text":"那我們也需要"},{"start":6553.24,"end":6558.24,"text":"猶太人這個公共利益團體"},{"start":6558.24,"end":6560.24,"text":"在美國的這些相關的"},{"start":6561.12,"end":6563.12,"text":"大型的遊說團體"},{"start":6563.12,"end":6564.12,"text":"他就是一個例子"},{"start":6564.12,"end":6566.12,"text":"他們甚至能夠成功的"},{"start":6566.12,"end":6569.12,"text":"來去塑造美國的國家政策"},{"start":6569.12,"end":6571.12,"text":"去塑造美國的外交政策"},{"start":6572.1,"end":6574.1,"text":"現在台灣的資源是"},{"start":6574.73,"end":6576.73,"text":"這50年以來最大的"},{"start":6576.73,"end":6577.73,"text":"我們國家的影響力"},{"start":6577.73,"end":6579.73,"text":"是這50年來最大的"},{"start":6579.73,"end":6580.73,"text":"我們的經濟的影響力"},{"start":6580.73,"end":6583.73,"text":"現在是G20等級的"},{"start":6583.73,"end":6584.73,"text":"更何況是科技能力"},{"start":6584.73,"end":6585.73,"text":"那我們怎麼樣有效的"},{"start":6585.73,"end":6586.73,"text":"用這些資源"},{"start":6586.73,"end":6587.73,"text":"外交資源"},{"start":6587.73,"end":6590.73,"text":"來去用非傳統外交的方式"},{"start":6590.73,"end":6592.73,"text":"達成我們的國家利益"},{"start":6592.73,"end":6593.73,"text":"這個部長心中"},{"start":6593.73,"end":6595.73,"text":"有沒有一些想法策略"},{"start":6596.59,"end":6598.59,"text":"其實美國的民主政治"},{"start":6598.59,"end":6600.59,"text":"他就是某種程度"},{"start":6600.59,"end":6601.59,"text":"也是遊說政治"},{"start":6601.59,"end":6602.59,"text":"那因為台灣是得到"},{"start":6602.59,"end":6604.59,"text":"美國人民廣泛的支持"},{"start":6604.59,"end":6605.59,"text":"跨黨派"},{"start":6605.59,"end":6606.59,"text":"包括參眾兩院"},{"start":6606.59,"end":6607.59,"text":"所以這時候行政部門"},{"start":6607.59,"end":6608.59,"text":"誰當總統"},{"start":6608.59,"end":6610.59,"text":"其實我們跟國務院的溝通"},{"start":6610.59,"end":6611.59,"text":"也非常的順暢"},{"start":6611.59,"end":6612.59,"text":"所以才能夠你看"},{"start":6612.59,"end":6615.59,"text":"包括我們所謂的對等關稅"},{"start":6615.59,"end":6618.59,"text":"我們得到所謂最高15%不疊加"},{"start":6618.59,"end":6621.59,"text":"最近無人機就最清楚"},{"start":6621.59,"end":6622.59,"text":"台灣是大贏家"},{"start":6622.59,"end":6624.59,"text":"如果就輸出美國來講"},{"start":6624.59,"end":6625.59,"text":"那更重要的是"},{"start":6625.59,"end":6627.59,"text":"我們怎麼樣跟美國結合起來"},{"start":6627.59,"end":6629.59,"text":"把無人機的產業做大"},{"start":6629.59,"end":6630.59,"text":"所以這一些"},{"start":6630.59,"end":6632.59,"text":"我們實際上是用很少的資源"},{"start":6632.59,"end":6634.59,"text":"尤其是我們駐美處的"},{"start":6634.59,"end":6636.59,"text":"真的是各國都很羨慕"},{"start":6636.59,"end":6638.59,"text":"我想包括韓國瑜院長去"},{"start":6638.59,"end":6639.59,"text":"他都有感受到"},{"start":6639.59,"end":6642.59,"text":"我想包括楊永康委員"},{"start":6642.59,"end":6644.59,"text":"其實當時也是在駐美"},{"start":6644.59,"end":6645.59,"text":"第一線"},{"start":6645.59,"end":6647.59,"text":"我們的人發揮的效益"},{"start":6647.59,"end":6649.59,"text":"我想是人家的十倍大以上"},{"start":6649.59,"end":6650.59,"text":"現在是怎麼樣"},{"start":6650.59,"end":6651.59,"text":"這個團隊"},{"start":6651.59,"end":6652.59,"text":"因為現在的談判已經記錄到"},{"start":6652.59,"end":6654.59,"text":"不只是傳統外交"},{"start":6654.59,"end":6656.59,"text":"包括科技外交"},{"start":6656.59,"end":6657.59,"text":"這一些新興科技"},{"start":6657.59,"end":6659.59,"text":"在整個外交上的作用是非常的大"},{"start":6659.59,"end":6661.59,"text":"所以我們跨部會的合作非常重要"},{"start":6661.59,"end":6663.59,"text":"所以不管從Art或者是說"},{"start":6663.59,"end":6668.59,"text":"所謂的這個投資的合作備忘錄"},{"start":6668.59,"end":6671.59,"text":"或者是有關於現在供應鏈重組裡面"},{"start":6671.59,"end":6672.59,"text":"細甚事等等"},{"start":6672.59,"end":6674.59,"text":"其實我們很忙碌是在對"},{"start":6677.32,"end":6678.32,"text":"這樣一個美國政策"},{"start":6678.32,"end":6681.32,"text":"事實上美國政客連續性是大於變動性"},{"start":6681.32,"end":6684.32,"text":"其實川普第一任就提出乾淨網絡的政策"},{"start":6684.32,"end":6687.32,"text":"然後拜登就變成數位團結的政策"},{"start":6687.32,"end":6689.32,"text":"現在又回到所謂的這個"},{"start":6689.32,"end":6692.32,"text":"人工智慧的安全的供應鏈"},{"start":6693.2,"end":6695.2,"text":"有一些變化是個人風格"},{"start":6695.2,"end":6697.2,"text":"但是有一些基本上是政策"},{"start":6697.2,"end":6700.2,"text":"來更深層的是民意的基礎"},{"start":6700.2,"end":6702.2,"text":"那以半導體或是AI來講"},{"start":6702.2,"end":6704.2,"text":"就像黃仁勳講的"},{"start":6705.65,"end":6707.65,"text":"是台灣救了美國的半導體產業"},{"start":6707.65,"end":6709.65,"text":"沒有台灣的話可能這個半導體產業"},{"start":6709.65,"end":6711.65,"text":"美國就已經瓦解掉了"},{"start":6711.65,"end":6713.65,"text":"所以我們是共生夥伴關係"},{"start":6713.65,"end":6715.65,"text":"這樣一個戰略的觀點來看的時候"},{"start":6715.65,"end":6717.65,"text":"我們要看得清楚什麼是本"},{"start":6717.65,"end":6718.65,"text":"什麼是比較是"},{"start":6718.65,"end":6719.65,"text":"謝謝部長"},{"start":6719.65,"end":6721.65,"text":"我最後再講一句就是說"},{"start":6721.65,"end":6723.65,"text":"我們除了投資現在也要投資未來"},{"start":6723.65,"end":6726.65,"text":"所以投資現在意思就是說現在的政府"},{"start":6726.65,"end":6728.65,"text":"那投資未來就是接下來十年的布局"},{"start":6728.65,"end":6730.65,"text":"那我們的產業也是"},{"start":6730.65,"end":6731.65,"text":"我們現在國家有餘裕"},{"start":6731.65,"end":6733.65,"text":"除了所謂普發之外"},{"start":6733.65,"end":6735.65,"text":"我們也要去布局未來的十年"},{"start":6735.65,"end":6737.65,"text":"包含量子科技 太空科技"},{"start":6737.65,"end":6740.65,"text":"還有我們的新世代的這個半導體的科技"},{"start":6740.65,"end":6742.65,"text":"新世代的基礎結成都要"},{"start":6742.65,"end":6746.65,"text":"同樣的外交也必須要做好相應的布局"},{"start":6746.65,"end":6749.65,"text":"那我們過去四年準備"},{"start":6749.65,"end":6752.65,"text":"跟這個可能的任何的潛在的"},{"start":6752.65,"end":6753.65,"text":"不管是總統人選"},{"start":6753.65,"end":6755.65,"text":"或者是未來的領袖要做好準備"},{"start":6755.65,"end":6757.65,"text":"那接下來也是要做好各樣的準備"},{"start":6757.65,"end":6762.65,"text":"包含我自己看有許多州長他們"},{"start":6762.65,"end":6763.65,"text":"美國總統裡面"},{"start":6763.65,"end":6766.65,"text":"州長成為總統的確實是不在少數"},{"start":6766.65,"end":6768.65,"text":"那一些州的利益"},{"start":6768.65,"end":6771.65,"text":"跟我們台灣的哪一些區塊"},{"start":6771.65,"end":6772.65,"text":"比如說哪一些"},{"start":6772.65,"end":6773.65,"text":"比方說大台中地區"},{"start":6773.65,"end":6774.65,"text":"我們大嘉義地區"},{"start":6774.65,"end":6776.65,"text":"這樣的利益怎麼做結合"},{"start":6776.65,"end":6779.65,"text":"對我們未來台美關係非常重要"},{"start":6779.65,"end":6780.65,"text":"那幾個州"},{"start":6780.65,"end":6783.65,"text":"不管南卡還是北卡"},{"start":6783.65,"end":6785.65,"text":"還是幾個關鍵州 賓州等等"},{"start":6785.65,"end":6786.65,"text":"我們不管"},{"start":6786.65,"end":6788.65,"text":"威斯康辛也是好密西根都"},{"start":6788.79,"end":6789.79,"text":"都可以"},{"start":6789.79,"end":6791.79,"text":"那我們預先先思考一下"},{"start":6791.79,"end":6795.79,"text":"哪一些是具有展望性的政治人物"},{"start":6795.79,"end":6796.79,"text":"以及他的州"},{"start":6796.79,"end":6798.79,"text":"可以跟台灣的哪些產業鏈來去做連結"},{"start":6798.79,"end":6799.79,"text":"就像剛才"},{"start":6800.91,"end":6801.91,"text":"部長有提到"},{"start":6801.91,"end":6803.91,"text":"那步步都是外交部"},{"start":6803.91,"end":6804.91,"text":"那你也提到說"},{"start":6804.91,"end":6807.91,"text":"我們現在已經走到總和經濟區了"},{"start":6807.91,"end":6808.91,"text":"那總和經濟裡面"},{"start":6808.91,"end":6809.91,"text":"除了價值之外的利益"},{"start":6809.91,"end":6810.91,"text":"怎麼樣的去結合"},{"start":6810.91,"end":6811.91,"text":"我想很重要"},{"start":6811.91,"end":6813.91,"text":"那特別現在當然共和黨的"},{"start":6813.91,"end":6815.91,"text":"很多都對我們很熟悉"},{"start":6815.91,"end":6816.91,"text":"但我還是要強調"},{"start":6816.91,"end":6818.91,"text":"我們除了國防"},{"start":6818.91,"end":6819.91,"text":"我們也需要外交官"},{"start":6819.91,"end":6822.91,"text":"因為最終來去經過國防"},{"start":6822.91,"end":6823.91,"text":"經過安全"},{"start":6823.91,"end":6825.91,"text":"甚至經過這一些衝突之後"},{"start":6825.91,"end":6829.91,"text":"最後要去做整個總結的"},{"start":6829.91,"end":6830.91,"text":"還是要外交官"},{"start":6830.91,"end":6832.91,"text":"或者是說在防範這一切的發生的"},{"start":6832.91,"end":6834.91,"text":"也是要外交官"},{"start":6834.91,"end":6836.91,"text":"那外交官他必須要很熟悉這一些人"},{"start":6836.91,"end":6838.91,"text":"也就是說他需要長期的培養"},{"start":6838.91,"end":6840.91,"text":"我們去訪美的時候我都很"},{"start":6842.19,"end":6844.19,"text":"記得說一些我們"},{"start":6844.19,"end":6845.19,"text":"因為立法院的處長也很了不起"},{"start":6845.19,"end":6848.19,"text":"花很多時間都把每一位"},{"start":6848.19,"end":6850.19,"text":"他們過去的接觸的這些縣的名字"},{"start":6850.19,"end":6851.19,"text":"都記得起來"},{"start":6851.19,"end":6853.19,"text":"十年二十年累積起來"},{"start":6853.19,"end":6854.19,"text":"所以職業外交官是非常重要的"},{"start":6854.19,"end":6855.19,"text":"我常常講說"},{"start":6855.19,"end":6857.19,"text":"什麼外交才子什麼的"},{"start":6857.19,"end":6859.19,"text":"外交才子如果沒有經過"},{"start":6859.19,"end":6860.19,"text":"時間跟經驗的累積的話"},{"start":6860.19,"end":6862.19,"text":"那他是什麼外交才子"},{"start":6862.19,"end":6864.19,"text":"那只是被政治任命的"},{"start":6864.19,"end":6866.19,"text":"我也是經過選災選出來的"},{"start":6866.19,"end":6867.19,"text":"如果被政治任命的話"},{"start":6867.19,"end":6868.19,"text":"我算什麼外交才子"},{"start":6868.19,"end":6869.19,"text":"我什麼都不是啊"},{"start":6869.19,"end":6871.19,"text":"我沒有過去的這些人"},{"start":6871.19,"end":6874.19,"text":"其實議員當外交官是正常的"},{"start":6874.19,"end":6877.19,"text":"以後各位委員其實都是大使級的人物"},{"start":6877.19,"end":6878.19,"text":"不過我跟委員分享一個"},{"start":6878.19,"end":6880.19,"text":"你剛講那個重點就是說"},{"start":6880.19,"end":6881.19,"text":"我們在對美工作裡面"},{"start":6881.19,"end":6884.19,"text":"其實美國是聯邦制我們很強調州"},{"start":6884.19,"end":6886.19,"text":"所以兩年前我去開區域會報"},{"start":6886.19,"end":6888.19,"text":"我們就針對subnational"},{"start":6888.19,"end":6889.19,"text":"所以五十個州"},{"start":6889.19,"end":6891.19,"text":"我們現在all politics local"},{"start":6891.19,"end":6893.19,"text":"所以這一些眾議員參議員"},{"start":6893.19,"end":6895.19,"text":"到州長到甚至總統副總統"},{"start":6895.19,"end":6897.19,"text":"他很多是來自於他州內的時候"},{"start":6897.19,"end":6899.19,"text":"選出來他的選區"},{"start":6899.19,"end":6900.19,"text":"所以這個經營"},{"start":6900.19,"end":6901.19,"text":"我跟委員報告"},{"start":6901.19,"end":6903.19,"text":"我們花非常非常多心思在邀訪"},{"start":6903.19,"end":6906.19,"text":"不是只有全國性的這種參眾議員"},{"start":6906.19,"end":6908.19,"text":"我們到這個州的層級下面的"},{"start":6908.19,"end":6911.19,"text":"所以我們台灣有設了20幾個美國州"},{"start":6911.19,"end":6913.19,"text":"在那邊有辦事處"},{"start":6913.19,"end":6915.19,"text":"我們現在那邊又加了一個鳳凰城"},{"start":6915.19,"end":6916.19,"text":"新的辦事處"},{"start":6916.19,"end":6918.19,"text":"我們是14個管處在美國"},{"start":6918.19,"end":6921.19,"text":"那個真的是深入到美國最基層到社區"},{"start":6921.19,"end":6924.19,"text":"所以我們為什麼花那麼少的資源"},{"start":6924.19,"end":6926.19,"text":"可以達到這麼好的外交效果"},{"start":6926.19,"end":6929.19,"text":"是來自於我們整體的對美國的這種政治"},{"start":6929.19,"end":6930.19,"text":"除了理念相近"},{"start":6930.19,"end":6933.19,"text":"兩邊的人民共享自由民主"},{"start":6933.19,"end":6935.19,"text":"和平跟繁榮的價值以外"},{"start":6935.19,"end":6938.19,"text":"其實很重要的是我們跟他"},{"start":6938.19,"end":6940.19,"text":"不管是投資採購或留學生"},{"start":6940.19,"end":6942.19,"text":"人才的交流等等"},{"start":6942.19,"end":6944.19,"text":"這一些全面性網絡化"},{"start":6944.19,"end":6946.19,"text":"在美國的社會生根"},{"start":6946.19,"end":6948.19,"text":"我認為在這一次的投資美國"},{"start":6948.19,"end":6950.19,"text":"我們之後我想台灣會進入到"},{"start":6950.19,"end":6952.19,"text":"一個台美關係的新境界"},{"start":6952.19,"end":6953.19,"text":"新的階段"},{"start":6953.19,"end":6955.19,"text":"就是已經不是早期的僑民"},{"start":6955.19,"end":6956.19,"text":"或者是留學生"},{"start":6956.19,"end":6958.19,"text":"現在有第二代甚至台商"},{"start":6958.19,"end":6960.19,"text":"像北美洲台商會組織起來"},{"start":6960.19,"end":6961.19,"text":"再去敲門"},{"start":6961.19,"end":6963.19,"text":"在美國的行政跟國會部門"},{"start":6963.19,"end":6965.19,"text":"他提出的政治主張"},{"start":6965.19,"end":6969.19,"text":"其實美國的政治人物他是更重視的"},{"start":6969.19,"end":6971.19,"text":"所以我們一定要從草根來"},{"start":6972.56,"end":6975.56,"text":"參與美國的這個政策的行程"},{"start":6975.56,"end":6976.56,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":6978.86,"end":6979.86,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":6981.07,"end":6984.07,"text":"我們接下來請徐喬新委員上台諮詢"},{"start":6991.75,"end":6992.75,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":6992.75,"end":6994.75,"text":"我們是不是能夠有請林佳龍林部長"},{"start":6994.75,"end":6995.75,"text":"請林部長"},{"start":7004.02,"end":7005.02,"text":"部長好"},{"start":7005.02,"end":7008.02,"text":"我想今天想要跟你討論一個很嚴肅"},{"start":7008.02,"end":7010.02,"text":"但是大家都很關注的議題"},{"start":7010.02,"end":7013.02,"text":"就是我們近期的外交部"},{"start":7013.02,"end":7016.02,"text":"有爆發的這個霸凌的事件"},{"start":7016.02,"end":7018.02,"text":"我想我們先從整個"},{"start":7018.02,"end":7020.02,"text":"就是這幾個月以來"},{"start":7020.02,"end":7023.02,"text":"大半年來所發生的這個霸凌"},{"start":7023.02,"end":7026.02,"text":"再細步到這一次的個案的事件"},{"start":7026.02,"end":7028.02,"text":"所以首先想要問一下部長"},{"start":7028.02,"end":7030.02,"text":"你自己的掌握就是說"},{"start":7030.02,"end":7032.02,"text":"上任以來"},{"start":7032.02,"end":7036.02,"text":"外交部有多少起的這個霸凌的申訴案"},{"start":7036.02,"end":7038.02,"text":"或是比較嚴重的一些案件"},{"start":7039.32,"end":7042.32,"text":"我想大概兩年多啦"},{"start":7042.32,"end":7044.32,"text":"應該十件左右啦"},{"start":7044.32,"end":7045.32,"text":"差不多"},{"start":7045.32,"end":7047.32,"text":"差不多就是至少有八起以上嘛"},{"start":7047.32,"end":7051.32,"text":"那根據外交部的這個安全及衛生"},{"start":7051.32,"end":7053.32,"text":"防護委員會的審議結果"},{"start":7053.32,"end":7055.32,"text":"其中兩起是不予受理"},{"start":7055.32,"end":7057.32,"text":"兩起調查完畢"},{"start":7057.32,"end":7060.32,"text":"還有四起是在調查當中"},{"start":7060.32,"end":7062.32,"text":"那我想要請問一下就是說"},{"start":7062.32,"end":7064.32,"text":"您當時有推出"},{"start":7064.32,"end":7066.32,"text":"在七月的時候推出三大措施"},{"start":7066.32,"end":7070.32,"text":"那是要來應對職場霸凌的現象"},{"start":7070.32,"end":7072.32,"text":"那請問一下這個宣布以來"},{"start":7072.32,"end":7074.32,"text":"自己覺得那我們推出的"},{"start":7074.32,"end":7076.32,"text":"這樣的一個作為"},{"start":7076.32,"end":7078.32,"text":"有哪邊還有可以精進的地方"},{"start":7078.32,"end":7080.32,"text":"可以調整的地方"},{"start":7080.39,"end":7083.39,"text":"其實教育宣導"},{"start":7083.39,"end":7086.39,"text":"然後跟申訴管道把它暢通"},{"start":7086.39,"end":7089.39,"text":"以及如果這個部長是可以得到"},{"start":7089.39,"end":7091.39,"text":"我們外交部同仁的信任"},{"start":7091.39,"end":7095.39,"text":"他會很樂於從內部來反應"},{"start":7095.39,"end":7098.39,"text":"不然的話可能就爆料一大堆"},{"start":7098.39,"end":7099.39,"text":"我覺得"},{"start":7099.39,"end":7101.39,"text":"那我鼓勵是具名最好"},{"start":7101.39,"end":7103.39,"text":"那像這一次以這一個"},{"start":7103.39,"end":7105.39,"text":"我們駐內瓦辦事處的情形"},{"start":7105.39,"end":7106.39,"text":"就是因為有具名"},{"start":7106.39,"end":7108.39,"text":"所以我們在七月底"},{"start":7108.39,"end":7112.39,"text":"就已經接到這個檢舉或申訴的時候"},{"start":7112.39,"end":7116.39,"text":"我們實際上就成立了專案調查小組"},{"start":7116.39,"end":7118.39,"text":"所以已經將近三個禮拜了"},{"start":7118.39,"end":7120.39,"text":"這個我有一個不同意見"},{"start":7120.39,"end":7122.39,"text":"就是說具名當然好"},{"start":7122.39,"end":7125.39,"text":"但是很多的同仁因為畢竟文官嘛"},{"start":7125.39,"end":7128.39,"text":"所以好不容易做了這個外交官"},{"start":7128.39,"end":7131.39,"text":"然後他有時候迫於他自己的"},{"start":7131.39,"end":7132.39,"text":"這個生涯發展的壓力"},{"start":7132.39,"end":7136.39,"text":"他不見得敢於用這個具名的方式"},{"start":7136.39,"end":7137.39,"text":"做申訴"},{"start":7137.39,"end":7139.39,"text":"但並不等同於霸凌沒有發生"},{"start":7139.39,"end":7141.39,"text":"或是我們外交部上級的官務聚調"},{"start":7141.39,"end":7143.39,"text":"沒有處理我們還是會來判斷之後處理"},{"start":7143.39,"end":7145.39,"text":"對所以我覺得呢"},{"start":7145.39,"end":7147.39,"text":"我倒不認為說這個我會由"},{"start":7147.39,"end":7150.39,"text":"霸凌被爆出來的這個案件數量"},{"start":7150.39,"end":7153.39,"text":"來評估外交部做得好不好"},{"start":7153.39,"end":7155.39,"text":"而是我們每一起"},{"start":7155.39,"end":7157.39,"text":"包含被公布出來的"},{"start":7157.39,"end":7158.39,"text":"被社會討論的"},{"start":7158.39,"end":7160.39,"text":"我們外交部有沒有辦法"},{"start":7160.39,"end":7162.39,"text":"有沒有能力來積極的調查"},{"start":7162.39,"end":7165.39,"text":"去還給這些可能被霸凌的人員一個公道"},{"start":7165.39,"end":7168.39,"text":"所以案件數量的話我們可以看一下"},{"start":7168.39,"end":7171.39,"text":"我不會因為數量多"},{"start":7171.39,"end":7173.39,"text":"我就認為是外交部處理得好或不好"},{"start":7173.39,"end":7176.39,"text":"但是呢我也必須要提到"},{"start":7176.39,"end":7181.39,"text":"其實近年來外交部出現了很多的霸凌案"},{"start":7181.39,"end":7182.39,"text":"你可以看到"},{"start":7182.94,"end":7184.94,"text":"是有一些室友上面"},{"start":7185.9,"end":7186.9,"text":"類似的地方"},{"start":7186.9,"end":7189.9,"text":"比如說很多都是屬於冷暴力"},{"start":7189.9,"end":7192.9,"text":"然後家屬因為他們就是外派在外面"},{"start":7192.9,"end":7194.9,"text":"所以家屬理論上"},{"start":7194.9,"end":7197.9,"text":"你作為家屬這個公事公辦"},{"start":7197.9,"end":7199.9,"text":"那私事的話不能公辦"},{"start":7199.9,"end":7202.9,"text":"那所以遺址棄使這個是不對的"},{"start":7202.9,"end":7204.9,"text":"然後呢你看幾乎都是這樣子"},{"start":7204.9,"end":7207.9,"text":"就是比較多是可能羞辱性的"},{"start":7207.9,"end":7210.9,"text":"然後這個還有這個過度的苛責"},{"start":7210.9,"end":7212.9,"text":"冷暴力等等的"},{"start":7212.9,"end":7214.9,"text":"那"},{"start":7214.57,"end":7217.57,"text":"先前不是在外交部也有發生就是"},{"start":7217.57,"end":7220.57,"text":"就是我們這個經貿小組的這個不幸的事件"},{"start":7220.57,"end":7221.57,"text":"我想您應該很清楚"},{"start":7221.57,"end":7224.57,"text":"那好險不是這個在外交部"},{"start":7224.57,"end":7227.57,"text":"但是我還是要提到就是"},{"start":7227.57,"end":7230.57,"text":"如果我們對於這些霸凌案"},{"start":7230.57,"end":7233.57,"text":"沒有辦法適當的快速的去制止的話"},{"start":7233.57,"end":7234.57,"text":"那你很難說"},{"start":7234.57,"end":7237.57,"text":"後續如果發生讓人遺憾的事情的時候"},{"start":7237.57,"end":7238.57,"text":"那都來不及了"},{"start":7238.57,"end":7240.57,"text":"所以我想請問一下就是目前"},{"start":7240.57,"end":7242.57,"text":"這上面的集體"},{"start":7242.57,"end":7247.57,"text":"還有沒有一些我們還沒有調查完畢正在調查的"},{"start":7247.57,"end":7250.57,"text":"可不可以一次替大家說明一下就是說"},{"start":7250.57,"end":7253.57,"text":"現在還有哪幾起可能他在媒體上面"},{"start":7253.57,"end":7255.57,"text":"有被揭露公開的霸凌案"},{"start":7255.57,"end":7256.57,"text":"我們還在調查當中"},{"start":7256.57,"end":7259.57,"text":"那我們大概需要多久的時間能夠調查完畢"},{"start":7259.57,"end":7262.57,"text":"好我請我們人事處長請問一下"},{"start":7264.03,"end":7265.03,"text":"跟委員報告"},{"start":7265.03,"end":7268.03,"text":"畫面上提供的這個部分"},{"start":7268.03,"end":7270.03,"text":"除了李冠德"},{"start":7270.96,"end":7273.96,"text":"李處長這個案子還在現在還在處理中"},{"start":7273.96,"end":7276.96,"text":"其他的我們都已經處理完畢了"},{"start":7276.96,"end":7280.96,"text":"那有後續申訴就是有成立"},{"start":7280.96,"end":7282.96,"text":"然後有做懲處的部分嗎"},{"start":7282.96,"end":7283.96,"text":"有"},{"start":7283.96,"end":7285.96,"text":"哪些可不可以做一個比較詳細的說明"},{"start":7285.96,"end":7286.96,"text":"這邊沒有"},{"start":7286.96,"end":7287.96,"text":"都沒有"},{"start":7287.96,"end":7289.96,"text":"那其他的部分可不可以跟大家說明一下"},{"start":7289.96,"end":7293.96,"text":"就是說有哪幾起近期的霸凌申訴案"},{"start":7293.96,"end":7297.96,"text":"那後續有確定做懲處的"},{"start":7297.96,"end":7298.96,"text":"做懲處的"},{"start":7298.96,"end":7300.96,"text":"你們就是有成立"},{"start":7300.96,"end":7302.96,"text":"霸凌申訴案有成立的"},{"start":7302.96,"end":7304.96,"text":"我們如果有成立的話"},{"start":7304.96,"end":7306.96,"text":"我們是譬如說如果是"},{"start":7306.96,"end":7308.96,"text":"嚴重的話我們才會懲處"},{"start":7308.96,"end":7310.96,"text":"如果是說像館長"},{"start":7310.96,"end":7313.96,"text":"有成立所謂的職場霸凌的話"},{"start":7313.96,"end":7315.96,"text":"我們馬上就是把他調回部裡面"},{"start":7315.96,"end":7316.96,"text":"就是把他的那個"},{"start":7316.96,"end":7319.96,"text":"那你大概在近幾年還有哪些"},{"start":7319.96,"end":7322.96,"text":"這個部分因為那個案子並沒有見報"},{"start":7322.96,"end":7325.96,"text":"是不是事實上我們會後再跟那個委員報告"},{"start":7325.96,"end":7327.96,"text":"好你可以再跟我報告沒有問題"},{"start":7327.96,"end":7329.96,"text":"但是我也要提到就是說"},{"start":7329.96,"end":7331.96,"text":"這些人他會去"},{"start":7333.52,"end":7335.52,"text":"講這個申訴案或是講這個霸凌案"},{"start":7335.52,"end":7337.52,"text":"那他一定也會希望就是說"},{"start":7337.52,"end":7339.52,"text":"他處理會有一個結果"},{"start":7339.52,"end":7342.52,"text":"所以我們大概平均"},{"start":7342.52,"end":7345.52,"text":"平均大概要幾個月能夠調查完畢"},{"start":7345.52,"end":7347.52,"text":"因為我看到有的一個月的"},{"start":7347.52,"end":7349.52,"text":"有個兩個月的"},{"start":7349.9,"end":7351.9,"text":"再跟委員說明一下"},{"start":7351.9,"end":7354.9,"text":"因為發生的事件都是在外館"},{"start":7354.9,"end":7357.9,"text":"所以中間我們除了就是會一些"},{"start":7357.9,"end":7359.9,"text":"先做一些行政釐清以外"},{"start":7359.9,"end":7362.9,"text":"然後我們還要跟外部委員先討論"},{"start":7362.9,"end":7364.9,"text":"討論完了以後還要跟"},{"start":7364.9,"end":7366.9,"text":"就是外館的館員約時間"},{"start":7366.9,"end":7367.9,"text":"因為會有時差嘛"},{"start":7367.9,"end":7368.9,"text":"然後他們可能內部"},{"start":7368.9,"end":7370.9,"text":"自己也要收集一些證據"},{"start":7370.9,"end":7373.9,"text":"所以原則上我們都一定會依照"},{"start":7373.9,"end":7374.9,"text":"公務人員保障法"},{"start":7374.9,"end":7376.9,"text":"還有那個安慰辦法的規定"},{"start":7376.9,"end":7378.9,"text":"在期限內完成"},{"start":7378.9,"end":7379.9,"text":"但是多久"},{"start":7379.9,"end":7381.9,"text":"只要我們收到受理的話"},{"start":7381.9,"end":7383.9,"text":"我們一個月內一定要確定要不要受理"},{"start":7383.9,"end":7385.9,"text":"受理確定受理的話"},{"start":7385.9,"end":7387.9,"text":"兩個月內要完成調查"},{"start":7387.9,"end":7390.9,"text":"好那接下來我要問的是部長"},{"start":7390.9,"end":7392.9,"text":"這個因為我們回到個案來談"},{"start":7392.9,"end":7395.9,"text":"駐日內瓦的處長爆出爭議之後"},{"start":7395.9,"end":7397.9,"text":"新聞裡面提到"},{"start":7397.9,"end":7399.9,"text":"李冠德知道被申訴以後"},{"start":7399.9,"end":7403.9,"text":"找了召集辦事處的同仁開會施壓"},{"start":7403.9,"end":7404.9,"text":"就我們現在的了解"},{"start":7404.9,"end":7405.9,"text":"有沒有這件事情"},{"start":7406.97,"end":7407.97,"text":"啊"},{"start":7407.92,"end":7409.92,"text":"應該是有開會但內容"},{"start":7409.92,"end":7412.92,"text":"因為我們要等受調查者回來做說明"},{"start":7412.92,"end":7413.92,"text":"嗯"},{"start":7413.92,"end":7414.92,"text":"他已經回來了"},{"start":7414.92,"end":7415.92,"text":"他已經回來了嗎"},{"start":7415.92,"end":7418.92,"text":"那什麼時候可以得到一個合作"},{"start":7418.92,"end":7419.92,"text":"在專案小組安排"},{"start":7419.92,"end":7421.92,"text":"因為這個會讓大家"},{"start":7421.92,"end":7423.92,"text":"為什麼我前面會問部長您就是說呢"},{"start":7423.92,"end":7425.92,"text":"所謂的這個"},{"start":7425.92,"end":7427.92,"text":"具名跟不具名的這個問題"},{"start":7427.92,"end":7428.92,"text":"你看這個就很明顯了"},{"start":7430.03,"end":7432.03,"text":"我們先假設說新聞報道是真的"},{"start":7432.03,"end":7433.03,"text":"那如果今天"},{"start":7433.03,"end":7434.03,"text":"如果事實明確"},{"start":7434.03,"end":7436.03,"text":"就算沒具名我們一樣會敗訴"},{"start":7436.03,"end":7437.03,"text":"對因為我要講的事情是說"},{"start":7437.03,"end":7438.03,"text":"因為霸凌的申訴"},{"start":7438.03,"end":7440.03,"text":"他最麻煩的地方就在於說"},{"start":7440.03,"end":7443.03,"text":"他檢舉之後他第一件事情找的"},{"start":7443.03,"end":7444.03,"text":"是找所有人來"},{"start":7444.03,"end":7445.03,"text":"那我問一下喔"},{"start":7445.03,"end":7448.03,"text":"你們就你們現在所了解的就是他"},{"start":7448.03,"end":7451.03,"text":"被申訴之後找大家開會的用意"},{"start":7451.88,"end":7453.88,"text":"是針對他個人的這個案子"},{"start":7453.88,"end":7455.88,"text":"還是說呢只是例行性的會議"},{"start":7455.88,"end":7456.88,"text":"就算是例行性的會議"},{"start":7456.88,"end":7458.88,"text":"還是額外增加的一個會呢"},{"start":7460.15,"end":7462.15,"text":"這個都要等他回來說明啊"},{"start":7462.15,"end":7464.15,"text":"對那你等了老半天之後"},{"start":7464.15,"end":7466.15,"text":"你就是到時候這件事情傳過水靈魂"},{"start":7466.15,"end":7468.15,"text":"大家想知道的部分就沒有了"},{"start":7468.15,"end":7470.15,"text":"這個也會列入調查的範圍啊"},{"start":7470.15,"end":7472.15,"text":"那你最後調查會公開嗎"},{"start":7472.15,"end":7474.15,"text":"這個案子調查報告會不會公開"},{"start":7474.15,"end":7476.15,"text":"這個程序怎麼走"},{"start":7476.15,"end":7478.15,"text":"沒有因為像舉例來講好了"},{"start":7478.15,"end":7480.15,"text":"剛才講的其他的霸凌的案子"},{"start":7480.15,"end":7482.15,"text":"那你有的你霸凌案成立了"},{"start":7482.15,"end":7484.15,"text":"可是呢你就依照好"},{"start":7484.15,"end":7486.15,"text":"你們的規定也好或怎麼樣的"},{"start":7486.15,"end":7488.15,"text":"但是你最後只是調職"},{"start":7488.15,"end":7490.15,"text":"那很多事情也沒有公開"},{"start":7490.15,"end":7492.15,"text":"可是我就舉這個例子來講"},{"start":7492.15,"end":7494.15,"text":"李冠德的事情都已經在上了新聞了"},{"start":7494.15,"end":7496.15,"text":"而且被檢舉的包含您剛講的"},{"start":7496.15,"end":7498.15,"text":"他可能有具名包含有很多的市政提出來"},{"start":7498.15,"end":7500.15,"text":"那如果你們調查了兩個月以後"},{"start":7500.15,"end":7502.15,"text":"調查報告沒有辦法公開的話"},{"start":7502.15,"end":7504.15,"text":"對於社會上很多民眾是沒有辦法交代的"},{"start":7504.15,"end":7506.15,"text":"所以我想要問一下部長"},{"start":7506.15,"end":7508.15,"text":"我們能不能去承諾說"},{"start":7508.15,"end":7510.15,"text":"等案接下來調查小組"},{"start":7510.15,"end":7512.15,"text":"調查完畢之後"},{"start":7512.15,"end":7514.15,"text":"再去識別化"},{"start":7514.15,"end":7516.15,"text":"你可能有些事情"},{"start":7516.15,"end":7518.15,"text":"再去識別化你可能有些各自的規定等等"},{"start":7518.15,"end":7520.15,"text":"在法律的允許的情況之下"},{"start":7520.15,"end":7522.15,"text":"能夠把案情公開"},{"start":7522.15,"end":7524.15,"text":"因為我們總不希望今天在媒體上講說"},{"start":7524.15,"end":7526.15,"text":"你看"},{"start":7526.15,"end":7528.15,"text":"被申訴之後施壓"},{"start":7528.15,"end":7530.15,"text":"那到最後有或沒有呢"},{"start":7530.15,"end":7532.15,"text":"你總要給社會上一個交代跟說明吧"},{"start":7532.15,"end":7534.15,"text":"是包委員因為現在雙方的"},{"start":7534.15,"end":7536.15,"text":"認知跟說明差距很大"},{"start":7536.15,"end":7538.15,"text":"所以說要調查"},{"start":7538.15,"end":7540.15,"text":"不過我也是中和跟委員報告"},{"start":7540.15,"end":7542.15,"text":"一個外交官的培養是很不容易"},{"start":7542.15,"end":7544.15,"text":"那在外館也是在"},{"start":7544.15,"end":7546.15,"text":"很大的壓力工作下"},{"start":7546.15,"end":7548.15,"text":"因為涉及到外交的戰場"},{"start":7548.15,"end":7550.15,"text":"真的是沒有驗消的戰爭"},{"start":7550.15,"end":7552.15,"text":"那可能會做的是改善"},{"start":7552.15,"end":7554.15,"text":"工作環境"},{"start":7554.15,"end":7556.15,"text":"讓這個管道申訴可以暢通以外"},{"start":7556.15,"end":7558.15,"text":"你剛剛講我要打斷你一下"},{"start":7558.15,"end":7560.15,"text":"因為你外交官很難培養"},{"start":7560.15,"end":7562.15,"text":"那他霸凌的人如果他霸凌"},{"start":7562.15,"end":7564.15,"text":"那一個人好OK你給他"},{"start":7564.15,"end":7566.15,"text":"培養起來"},{"start":7566.15,"end":7568.15,"text":"一個人霸凌五個人"},{"start":7568.15,"end":7570.15,"text":"這樣的話五個人不就在權益上"},{"start":7570.15,"end":7572.15,"text":"大家都很辛苦"},{"start":7572.15,"end":7574.15,"text":"今天是被檢舉的人你可能覺得說"},{"start":7574.15,"end":7576.15,"text":"他這工作很辛苦幫他工作"},{"start":7576.15,"end":7578.15,"text":"他們也很辛苦"},{"start":7578.15,"end":7580.15,"text":"所以我還是要幫這些企劃去"},{"start":7580.15,"end":7582.15,"text":"他今天之所以會有人來申訴"},{"start":7582.15,"end":7584.15,"text":"一定是有一些狀況"},{"start":7584.15,"end":7586.15,"text":"但是狀況嚴重有沒有到達"},{"start":7586.15,"end":7588.15,"text":"這個霸凌的界線是你們調查小組"},{"start":7588.15,"end":7590.15,"text":"要去做調查的"},{"start":7590.15,"end":7592.15,"text":"有些涉及非霸凌事項有些涉及霸凌的部分"},{"start":7592.15,"end":7594.15,"text":"所以我希望可以得到一個承認"},{"start":7594.15,"end":7596.15,"text":"就是本案到底調查小組"},{"start":7596.15,"end":7598.15,"text":"會不會公開"},{"start":7598.15,"end":7600.15,"text":"我們調查小組"},{"start":7600.15,"end":7602.15,"text":"這個程序在進行中結果如何"},{"start":7602.15,"end":7604.15,"text":"那我們一定是把情懷放在"},{"start":7604.15,"end":7606.15,"text":"什麼情況下會公開什麼情況下會不公開"},{"start":7606.15,"end":7608.15,"text":"因為現在才剛開始我們就是"},{"start":7608.15,"end":7610.15,"text":"專案調查小組"},{"start":7610.15,"end":7612.15,"text":"一點時間跟空間"},{"start":7612.15,"end":7614.15,"text":"我知道外界很關心"},{"start":7614.15,"end":7616.15,"text":"程序要走好"},{"start":7616.15,"end":7618.15,"text":"對當然啦我沒有說程序不走好但是你調查完之後"},{"start":7618.15,"end":7620.15,"text":"他是什麼情況之下"},{"start":7620.15,"end":7622.15,"text":"會不公開什麼情況之下"},{"start":7622.15,"end":7624.15,"text":"會公開你這點你總是要"},{"start":7624.15,"end":7626.15,"text":"我們都有相關的規範"},{"start":7626.15,"end":7628.15,"text":"我們也讓專案調查小組"},{"start":7628.15,"end":7630.15,"text":"因為這些都是外部委員"},{"start":7630.15,"end":7632.15,"text":"很多都是專業經驗"},{"start":7632.15,"end":7634.15,"text":"所以你官方要跟大家講一下"},{"start":7634.15,"end":7636.15,"text":"你現在要回覆我"},{"start":7636.15,"end":7638.15,"text":"就是說"},{"start":7638.11,"end":7640.11,"text":"調查完之後不是好他霸凌有成立"},{"start":7640.11,"end":7642.11,"text":"那成立的話什麼樣的程度"},{"start":7642.11,"end":7644.11,"text":"那他這個"},{"start":7644.11,"end":7646.11,"text":"我們的調查技術會公開"},{"start":7646.11,"end":7648.11,"text":"那什麼樣程度以下他是不會公開"},{"start":7648.11,"end":7650.11,"text":"這個應該是知道的吧"},{"start":7650.11,"end":7652.11,"text":"沒有這個個案到具體這麼細"},{"start":7652.11,"end":7654.11,"text":"因為涉及到我們外交機密或等等"},{"start":7654.11,"end":7656.11,"text":"我們要中和去考量"},{"start":7656.11,"end":7658.11,"text":"那一定要等這個程序走到一個階段"},{"start":7658.11,"end":7660.11,"text":"我現在真的沒有辦法講說SNO的問題"},{"start":7660.11,"end":7662.11,"text":"到底要公布到什麼程度"},{"start":7662.11,"end":7664.11,"text":"那涉及到我們外交業務"},{"start":7664.11,"end":7666.11,"text":"那也請委員給我們一點課編"},{"start":7666.11,"end":7668.11,"text":"我認你講這個東西就變成是說"},{"start":7668.11,"end":7670.11,"text":"所有人都要因為你講說"},{"start":7670.11,"end":7672.11,"text":"是不是所謂的外交機密"},{"start":7672.11,"end":7674.11,"text":"我剛剛講了你會去示示博化"},{"start":7674.11,"end":7676.11,"text":"你會去去"},{"start":7676.11,"end":7678.11,"text":"你的機密沒有人讓你公開給大家"},{"start":7678.11,"end":7680.11,"text":"但是譬如說我舉個例子"},{"start":7680.11,"end":7682.11,"text":"這個人他被申訴之後"},{"start":7682.11,"end":7684.11,"text":"有沒有去靠近施壓人家"},{"start":7684.11,"end":7686.11,"text":"這個沒有涉及任何機密"},{"start":7686.11,"end":7688.11,"text":"我們也要去調查"},{"start":7688.11,"end":7690.11,"text":"對我沒有否認說你要去調查"},{"start":7690.11,"end":7692.11,"text":"我問的是調查完以後"},{"start":7692.11,"end":7694.11,"text":"那到底發生了什麼事情"},{"start":7694.11,"end":7696.11,"text":"到底有沒有涉及霸凌霸凌的程度是如何的"},{"start":7696.11,"end":7698.11,"text":"我還是希望能夠給全民一個交代"},{"start":7698.11,"end":7700.11,"text":"因為這個是你都已經被眾多的人去討論了"},{"start":7700.11,"end":7702.11,"text":"是因為有交代的人"},{"start":7702.11,"end":7704.11,"text":"需要一點時間"},{"start":7704.11,"end":7706.11,"text":"我們來努力謝謝委員"},{"start":7706.42,"end":7708.42,"text":"好謝謝"},{"start":7708.53,"end":7710.53,"text":"我們接下來請沈柏楊委員上台諮詢"},{"start":7733.74,"end":7735.74,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":7735.74,"end":7737.74,"text":"有請部長謝謝"},{"start":7744.69,"end":7746.69,"text":"部長你好"},{"start":7746.69,"end":7748.69,"text":"今天這個題目在講"},{"start":7748.69,"end":7750.69,"text":"這個青年國際事業"},{"start":7750.69,"end":7752.69,"text":"所以我就針對這一點來說"},{"start":7752.69,"end":7754.69,"text":"那第一個就是說"},{"start":7754.69,"end":7756.69,"text":"這是我這樣列出來"},{"start":7756.69,"end":7758.69,"text":"就是目前按照我們的書面報告"},{"start":7758.69,"end":7760.69,"text":"我們外交部有在做的一些計畫"},{"start":7760.69,"end":7762.69,"text":"那第一個這個青年百億海外"},{"start":7762.69,"end":7764.69,"text":"圓夢基金計畫"},{"start":7764.69,"end":7766.69,"text":"這一點大概是這個"},{"start":7766.69,"end":7768.69,"text":"最耳熟能詳的啦"},{"start":7768.69,"end":7770.69,"text":"那後面還有很多其他的這個我不贅述"},{"start":7770.69,"end":7772.69,"text":"那我想先問就是說"},{"start":7772.69,"end":7774.69,"text":"我們現在針對"},{"start":7774.69,"end":7776.69,"text":"尤其是一二啦還有這一個五啦"},{"start":7776.69,"end":7778.69,"text":"就是說我們的確"},{"start":7778.69,"end":7780.69,"text":"一直把人才送出去"},{"start":7780.69,"end":7782.69,"text":"看起來申請也熱烈這個都OK"},{"start":7782.69,"end":7784.69,"text":"那我們現在對於他們"},{"start":7784.69,"end":7786.69,"text":"回來這件事情"},{"start":7786.69,"end":7788.69,"text":"就是說畢竟就是"},{"start":7788.69,"end":7790.69,"text":"我知道因為外交部其實最主要是要負責跟外面的銜接啦"},{"start":7790.69,"end":7792.69,"text":"等等之類"},{"start":7792.69,"end":7794.69,"text":"所以如果他們要回來這件事情"},{"start":7794.69,"end":7796.69,"text":"除了跨部會之外可能地方上"},{"start":7796.69,"end":7798.69,"text":"也要來試著做做看"},{"start":7798.69,"end":7800.69,"text":"那不知道這一個現在以外交部的立場來講"},{"start":7800.69,"end":7802.69,"text":"知不知道說他們現在回來的這個狀況"},{"start":7802.69,"end":7804.69,"text":"就是說他們出去之後"},{"start":7804.69,"end":7806.69,"text":"多少人回來"},{"start":7806.69,"end":7808.69,"text":"或是說把這些東西帶回來"},{"start":7808.69,"end":7810.69,"text":"或是說他不一定回來"},{"start":7810.69,"end":7812.69,"text":"但他可能在海外做了一些事情之後"},{"start":7812.69,"end":7814.69,"text":"又有投資回來台灣這樣子"},{"start":7814.69,"end":7816.69,"text":"報告委員我們之所以會去把"},{"start":7816.69,"end":7818.69,"text":"這些二三十年來累積的人才庫"},{"start":7818.69,"end":7820.69,"text":"把它建立"},{"start":7820.69,"end":7822.69,"text":"另外也希望它持續的交流"},{"start":7822.69,"end":7824.69,"text":"互動因為有些人可能"},{"start":7824.69,"end":7826.69,"text":"在人生的後面階段又會跟我們外交"},{"start":7826.69,"end":7828.69,"text":"業務有交集"},{"start":7828.69,"end":7830.69,"text":"所以我們也組織起來就是國際青年大使協會"},{"start":7830.69,"end":7832.69,"text":"讓他們學長姐來帶學弟妹"},{"start":7832.69,"end":7834.69,"text":"另外剛剛有INGO"},{"start":7834.69,"end":7836.69,"text":"很多會持續互動"},{"start":7836.69,"end":7838.69,"text":"我們有活動會發通知"},{"start":7838.69,"end":7840.69,"text":"因為我們各種的論壇"},{"start":7840.69,"end":7842.69,"text":"國際的交流"},{"start":7842.69,"end":7844.69,"text":"這個"},{"start":7844.69,"end":7846.69,"text":"所以這些人才是很寶貴的"},{"start":7846.69,"end":7848.69,"text":"我想已經夠大到一個規模"},{"start":7848.69,"end":7850.69,"text":"我們應該讓它可以自轉"},{"start":7850.69,"end":7852.69,"text":"所以然後橫向的"},{"start":7852.69,"end":7854.69,"text":"這個交流其實有很多"},{"start":7854.69,"end":7856.69,"text":"創新會產生"},{"start":7856.69,"end":7858.69,"text":"其實我們總和外交"},{"start":7858.69,"end":7860.69,"text":"包括所謂的"},{"start":7860.69,"end":7862.69,"text":"NGO的外交"},{"start":7862.69,"end":7864.69,"text":"這些都列為重點"},{"start":7864.69,"end":7866.69,"text":"就是希望說能夠整合民間的力量"},{"start":7866.69,"end":7868.69,"text":"這些人才是在跨領域"},{"start":7868.69,"end":7870.69,"text":"我們也希望號召人才來投考"},{"start":7870.69,"end":7872.69,"text":"外交寬"},{"start":7872.69,"end":7874.69,"text":"因為優秀的人才"},{"start":7874.69,"end":7876.69,"text":"他覺得台灣現在的國力"},{"start":7876.69,"end":7878.69,"text":"還有我們在國家的形象"},{"start":7878.69,"end":7880.69,"text":"在國際上"},{"start":7881.04,"end":7883.04,"text":"我們可以很受感"},{"start":7883.04,"end":7885.04,"text":"我本身是念政治系"},{"start":7885.04,"end":7887.04,"text":"我們發現那個時代"},{"start":7887.04,"end":7889.04,"text":"很多人都是青年"},{"start":7889.04,"end":7891.04,"text":"報國"},{"start":7891.04,"end":7893.04,"text":"去投考外交官"},{"start":7893.04,"end":7895.04,"text":"我也希望說帶動起來大家的熱情"},{"start":7895.04,"end":7897.04,"text":"讓台灣因為"},{"start":7897.04,"end":7899.04,"text":"年輕人願意去做外交工作"},{"start":7899.04,"end":7901.04,"text":"能夠走向國際"},{"start":7901.04,"end":7903.04,"text":"讓世界能夠走入台灣"},{"start":7903.04,"end":7905.04,"text":"謝謝部長"},{"start":7905.04,"end":7907.04,"text":"當然他們以外交體系的期盼來講"},{"start":7907.04,"end":7909.04,"text":"就是說"},{"start":7909.04,"end":7911.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7911.04,"end":7913.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7913.04,"end":7915.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7915.04,"end":7917.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7917.04,"end":7919.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7919.04,"end":7921.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7921.04,"end":7923.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7923.04,"end":7925.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7925.04,"end":7927.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7927.04,"end":7929.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7929.04,"end":7931.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7931.04,"end":7933.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7933.04,"end":7935.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7935.04,"end":7937.04,"text":"外交部的外交部"},{"start":7937.04,"end":7939.04,"text":"這個我們就是"},{"start":7939.04,"end":7941.04,"text":"有賴跨部會的一個努力"},{"start":7941.04,"end":7943.04,"text":"國安委員報告"},{"start":7943.04,"end":7945.04,"text":"像外交替代役"},{"start":7945.04,"end":7947.04,"text":"後來進入國火會"},{"start":7947.04,"end":7949.04,"text":"有很多人生的志願因此改變"},{"start":7949.04,"end":7951.04,"text":"相當豐富的一個領域"},{"start":7951.04,"end":7953.04,"text":"為什麼最近外交替代役"},{"start":7953.04,"end":7955.04,"text":"因為我們希望能夠不只保存"},{"start":7955.04,"end":7957.04,"text":"還能夠擴大"},{"start":7957.04,"end":7959.04,"text":"包括無人機的飛手訓練"},{"start":7959.04,"end":7961.04,"text":"現在在帛琉"},{"start":7961.04,"end":7963.04,"text":"這些如果在國外"},{"start":7963.04,"end":7965.04,"text":"有個一年時間"},{"start":7965.04,"end":7966.62,"text":"那我覺得台灣在走向外交"},{"start":7966.62,"end":7970.42,"text":"因為我們的這個正式的外交空間受到壓縮"},{"start":7970.42,"end":7973.88,"text":"這種比較有創意的非傳統式的外交"},{"start":7973.88,"end":7975.76,"text":"那事實上是透過我們全民"},{"start":7975.76,"end":7978.92,"text":"在各個領域都能夠走向國際"},{"start":7978.92,"end":7980.7,"text":"所以剛剛確實從青年時代"},{"start":7980.7,"end":7982.66,"text":"我們就要培養更多的人"},{"start":7982.66,"end":7983.8,"text":"來參與國際事務"},{"start":7983.8,"end":7985.44,"text":"對 我在這邊放的"},{"start":7985.44,"end":7987.36,"text":"有一個國際青年大使的交流計畫"},{"start":7987.36,"end":7988.74,"text":"就跟剛剛部長回的"},{"start":7988.74,"end":7989.76,"text":"這個非常類似"},{"start":7989.76,"end":7991.8,"text":"這個就是一個很好的循環機制"},{"start":7991.8,"end":7993.04,"text":"那不過剛剛部長提到一點"},{"start":7993.04,"end":7994.54,"text":"我覺得也是蠻重要的"},{"start":7994.54,"end":7996.54,"text":"就是說因為現在就是這種"},{"start":7996.54,"end":7998.54,"text":"sub-state這種diplomacy"},{"start":7998.54,"end":7999.34,"text":"變得越來越多"},{"start":7999.34,"end":8001.34,"text":"就是城市的外交變得很多"},{"start":8001.34,"end":8003.34,"text":"那現在中國就是"},{"start":8003.34,"end":8005.34,"text":"我們現在以外交部的立場"},{"start":8005.34,"end":8006.62,"text":"我們都知道就是說"},{"start":8006.62,"end":8008.62,"text":"中國可能像我們之前在講2758啦"},{"start":8008.62,"end":8009.46,"text":"等等之類"},{"start":8009.46,"end":8010.92,"text":"它有這種非常整體的"},{"start":8010.92,"end":8012.46,"text":"針對這個國會"},{"start":8012.46,"end":8014.22,"text":"然後希望他們要怎麼發聲"},{"start":8014.22,"end":8016.22,"text":"然後我們要怎麼去應對中國的打壓"},{"start":8016.22,"end":8018.22,"text":"但因為中國的打壓還有另外一種就是"},{"start":8018.22,"end":8020,"text":"它在城市的層級"},{"start":8020,"end":8022,"text":"就是它還沒有直接上升到"},{"start":8022,"end":8023.4,"text":"那個中央的層級"},{"start":8023.4,"end":8025.4,"text":"那我們最近也遇到有一些"},{"start":8025.4,"end":8026.4,"text":"國外的城市"},{"start":8026.4,"end":8027.4,"text":"它可能在"},{"start":8027.4,"end":8029.4,"text":"就是因為中國的施壓之下"},{"start":8029.4,"end":8031.4,"text":"可能在吃了台灣豆腐"},{"start":8031.4,"end":8033.4,"text":"什麼等等之類的"},{"start":8033.4,"end":8035.4,"text":"那在這一個層級的時候對我們來講"},{"start":8035.4,"end":8037.4,"text":"畢竟外交部它管的是"},{"start":8037.4,"end":8038.4,"text":"比較中央層級"},{"start":8038.4,"end":8040.4,"text":"剛剛有講到其實我們現在在美國"},{"start":8040.4,"end":8042.4,"text":"辦事處越來越多"},{"start":8042.4,"end":8044.4,"text":"現在美國有沒有14個"},{"start":8044.4,"end":8046.4,"text":"14個就是說"},{"start":8046.4,"end":8048.4,"text":"因為現在我們會遇到很多就是"},{"start":8048.4,"end":8049.4,"text":"它在州的層級"},{"start":8049.4,"end":8051.4,"text":"在城市的層級來做"},{"start":8051.4,"end":8053.4,"text":"那剛剛部長提到的這一點"},{"start":8053.4,"end":8054.4,"text":"其實就變得特別的重要"},{"start":8054.4,"end":8056.4,"text":"因為我們變成我們要很綿密"},{"start":8056.4,"end":8058.4,"text":"不是只有在最高層級要應對"},{"start":8058.4,"end":8060.4,"text":"我們在州的層級"},{"start":8060.4,"end":8062.4,"text":"在城市的層級現在都要去應對對方的"},{"start":8062.4,"end":8063.4,"text":"這樣的一個打壓"},{"start":8063.4,"end":8065.4,"text":"那所以這一個"},{"start":8065.4,"end":8066.4,"text":"市民的外交啦"},{"start":8066.4,"end":8067.4,"text":"國民的外交啦"},{"start":8067.4,"end":8069.4,"text":"這一種其實就變得相形重要"},{"start":8069.4,"end":8072.4,"text":"不過我現在比較擔心的事情就是說"},{"start":8072.4,"end":8074.4,"text":"剛剛部長也有提到現在在推這個"},{"start":8074.4,"end":8076.4,"text":"青年NGO大使計畫嘛"},{"start":8076.4,"end":8078.4,"text":"我們想要去搶這樣的一個"},{"start":8078.4,"end":8080.4,"text":"話語權啊什麼等等之類的"},{"start":8080.4,"end":8082.4,"text":"但是因為就是對方現在"},{"start":8082.4,"end":8084.4,"text":"在打壓的層級我剛剛講"},{"start":8084.4,"end":8085.4,"text":"眾生變多了"},{"start":8085.4,"end":8087.4,"text":"那但是呢我們現在呢就是"},{"start":8087.4,"end":8088.4,"text":"我這次看到"},{"start":8088.4,"end":8090.4,"text":"我們的媒體政策的業務宣導費"},{"start":8090.4,"end":8092.4,"text":"是統三五十"},{"start":8092.4,"end":8094.4,"text":"然後國外的旅費和這一個"},{"start":8094.4,"end":8096.4,"text":"出國訓練費統三七十啦"},{"start":8096.4,"end":8098.4,"text":"三十或十"},{"start":8098.4,"end":8100.4,"text":"裡面外交部遇到的是十這一個"},{"start":8100.4,"end":8102.4,"text":"喬委會等一下是七十"},{"start":8104.15,"end":8106.15,"text":"這個對我來講"},{"start":8106.15,"end":8108.15,"text":"我覺得這個是在我剛剛講的"},{"start":8108.15,"end":8110.15,"text":"我們現在面臨的困境之下"},{"start":8110.15,"end":8112.15,"text":"這個會變得有點麻煩耶"},{"start":8112.15,"end":8114.15,"text":"所以不知道現在"},{"start":8114.15,"end":8116.15,"text":"然後現在八月又要再送明年度的總預算嘛"},{"start":8116.15,"end":8118.15,"text":"因為我可能會遇到這樣的事情"},{"start":8118.15,"end":8119.15,"text":"那現在我想問部長"},{"start":8119.15,"end":8121.15,"text":"那等一下也想問委員長就是說"},{"start":8121.15,"end":8122.15,"text":"我們現在應該要怎麼做"},{"start":8122.15,"end":8124.15,"text":"要怎麼辦"},{"start":8123.52,"end":8125.52,"text":"這確實會有影響"},{"start":8125.52,"end":8127.52,"text":"因為全世界現在都想跟台灣交往"},{"start":8127.52,"end":8129.52,"text":"我們很久的出去"},{"start":8129.52,"end":8131.52,"text":"要把握時機啦"},{"start":8131.52,"end":8133.52,"text":"那當然因為預算刪減"},{"start":8133.52,"end":8135.52,"text":"當然我們也是要依照這個來執行"},{"start":8135.52,"end":8137.52,"text":"只是說"},{"start":8137.52,"end":8139.52,"text":"在那個"},{"start":8139.67,"end":8141.67,"text":"媒體宣傳費用"},{"start":8141.67,"end":8143.67,"text":"我們就多有一些"},{"start":8143.67,"end":8145.67,"text":"要有一些亮點"},{"start":8145.67,"end":8147.67,"text":"透過什麼樣的方式可以擴大宣傳"},{"start":8147.67,"end":8149.67,"text":"所以我們那個國傳師"},{"start":8149.67,"end":8151.67,"text":"包括我們公眾會"},{"start":8151.67,"end":8153.67,"text":"還有包括我們各個單位其實在"},{"start":8153.67,"end":8155.67,"text":"要發揮創意"},{"start":8155.67,"end":8157.67,"text":"其實更有效果的達到國際宣傳的效果"},{"start":8157.67,"end":8159.67,"text":"即使預算收到刪減"},{"start":8159.67,"end":8161.67,"text":"那另外就是因為現在"},{"start":8161.67,"end":8163.67,"text":"包括邀訪只要來過台灣的人"},{"start":8163.67,"end":8165.67,"text":"無不稱讚台灣"},{"start":8165.67,"end":8167.67,"text":"我想立委在接觸這個團裡面"},{"start":8167.67,"end":8169.67,"text":"所以怎麼樣廣泛的邀訪"},{"start":8169.67,"end":8171.67,"text":"派人出去尤其是年輕人"},{"start":8171.67,"end":8173.67,"text":"那剛剛委員講了一個重點"},{"start":8173.67,"end":8175.67,"text":"其實中國現在在全世界包括孔子學院"},{"start":8175.67,"end":8177.67,"text":"大家都知道他都是有統戰目的"},{"start":8177.67,"end":8179.67,"text":"所以中國現在是往年輕人"},{"start":8179.67,"end":8181.67,"text":"到城市下面"},{"start":8181.67,"end":8183.67,"text":"然後招待非常多"},{"start":8183.67,"end":8185.67,"text":"所以現在美國"},{"start":8185.67,"end":8187.67,"text":"也有警覺到這個問題"},{"start":8187.67,"end":8189.67,"text":"包括對台灣也是"},{"start":8189.67,"end":8191.67,"text":"青年工作變成他們現在的統戰的重點"},{"start":8191.67,"end":8193.67,"text":"所以我們在青年的交流上面"},{"start":8193.67,"end":8195.67,"text":"必須要加強"},{"start":8195.67,"end":8197.67,"text":"然後不管是雙向的"},{"start":8197.67,"end":8199.67,"text":"我們出去後他們進來"},{"start":8199.67,"end":8201.67,"text":"也不只是政府"},{"start":8201.67,"end":8203.67,"text":"我想所有的各個領域"},{"start":8203.67,"end":8205.67,"text":"包括你剛剛講城市"},{"start":8205.67,"end":8207.67,"text":"或者是說文化"},{"start":8207.67,"end":8209.67,"text":"科技各種的外交領域"},{"start":8209.67,"end":8211.67,"text":"讓他全面性的去對接"},{"start":8211.67,"end":8213.67,"text":"我覺得這是總和外交"},{"start":8213.67,"end":8215.67,"text":"我們希望能夠去把他連結起來"},{"start":8215.67,"end":8217.67,"text":"當然這些人才"},{"start":8217.67,"end":8219.67,"text":"台灣已經有一些年輕人"},{"start":8219.67,"end":8221.67,"text":"有趣於外交"},{"start":8221.67,"end":8223.67,"text":"有一些可能是網紅"},{"start":8223.67,"end":8225.67,"text":"就做了很多記錄"},{"start":8225.67,"end":8227.67,"text":"產生的影響力"},{"start":8227.67,"end":8229.67,"text":"包括我們去年在辦大阪師婆的時候"},{"start":8229.67,"end":8231.67,"text":"我們很有限的預算100萬"},{"start":8231.67,"end":8233.67,"text":"辦了一個真球短影音"},{"start":8233.67,"end":8235.67,"text":"就Fighting 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陳委員我們的服務對象"},{"start":8295.67,"end":8297.67,"text":"因為都是在海外"},{"start":8297.67,"end":8299.67,"text":"所以如果我們沒有了這些旅費"},{"start":8299.67,"end":8301.67,"text":"我們就會變成對所有海外僑胞"},{"start":8301.67,"end":8303.67,"text":"沒有辦法"},{"start":8303.67,"end":8305.67,"text":"善盡到我們該盡的義務"},{"start":8305.67,"end":8307.67,"text":"其實這個費用不單是我在用"},{"start":8307.67,"end":8309.67,"text":"還包括我們駐外的同仁"},{"start":8309.67,"end":8311.67,"text":"他們有時候要去轄防"},{"start":8311.67,"end":8313.67,"text":"他們要去很多監俠國"},{"start":8313.67,"end":8315.67,"text":"都是要用同樣這一筆旅費"},{"start":8315.67,"end":8317.67,"text":"所以我們今天"},{"start":8317.67,"end":8319.67,"text":"到目前為止"},{"start":8319.67,"end":8321.67,"text":"事實上我們的預算被刪了七成"},{"start":8321.67,"end":8323.67,"text":"六成 但我們已經都執行了八成"},{"start":8323.67,"end":8325.67,"text":"這樣的狀況下我們等於是"},{"start":8325.67,"end":8327.67,"text":"從九月開始就沒有錢了"},{"start":8327.67,"end":8329.67,"text":"就零 那我們的沒宣預算"},{"start":8329.67,"end":8331.67,"text":"根本不叫沒宣預算"},{"start":8331.67,"end":8333.67,"text":"我們只是維持我們官網"},{"start":8333.67,"end":8335.67,"text":"基本的運作 這種錢"},{"start":8335.67,"end":8337.67,"text":"我們連中共的"},{"start":8337.67,"end":8339.67,"text":"零點零一趴的比例"},{"start":8339.67,"end":8341.67,"text":"都不到 所以我們"},{"start":8341.67,"end":8343.67,"text":"作為政府部門我們"},{"start":8343.67,"end":8345.67,"text":"應該要有基本的告知"},{"start":8345.67,"end":8347.67,"text":"人民足夠資訊的"},{"start":8347.67,"end":8349.67,"text":"義務 所以這種"},{"start":8349.67,"end":8351.67,"text":"義務直接的被預算砍掉"},{"start":8351.67,"end":8353.67,"text":"我認為這個是對人民"},{"start":8353.67,"end":8355.67,"text":"非常大的傷害 以上報告謝謝"},{"start":8355.67,"end":8357.67,"text":"對 因為我之前在質詢過"},{"start":8357.67,"end":8359.67,"text":"蠻多次的時候其實也一直都有提到"},{"start":8359.67,"end":8361.67,"text":"官網的重要性 因為"},{"start":8361.67,"end":8363.67,"text":"官網算是我們傳遞知識"},{"start":8363.67,"end":8365.67,"text":"還有傳遞這些訊息非常重要的媒介"},{"start":8365.67,"end":8367.67,"text":"所以那時候我還特別講說"},{"start":8367.67,"end":8369.67,"text":"官網的辟謠要怎麼做啊等等之類的"},{"start":8369.67,"end":8371.67,"text":"我們在國防外交委員會"},{"start":8371.67,"end":8373.67,"text":"那今天假設我們今天立委"},{"start":8373.67,"end":8375.67,"text":"也有一些外交任務 假設我們有外交任務"},{"start":8375.67,"end":8377.67,"text":"大家跟你講說你不能出國"},{"start":8377.67,"end":8379.67,"text":"那我要怎麼做外交任務"},{"start":8379.67,"end":8381.67,"text":"那這是很簡單的道理嘛 他說你有網路"},{"start":8381.67,"end":8383.67,"text":"就把你的官網的費用也把它拿掉"},{"start":8383.67,"end":8385.67,"text":"那你網路你這個也打不出去"},{"start":8385.67,"end":8387.67,"text":"你實體也出不去 然後國外"},{"start":8387.67,"end":8389.67,"text":"現在面臨的是中國的"},{"start":8389.67,"end":8391.67,"text":"打壓 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其實截至6月12號為止有114個"},{"start":8762.79,"end":8766.79,"text":"那比我們外交駐外的管束還多啊"},{"start":8766.79,"end":8770.79,"text":"而其中有87個是有國會聯誼的公用"},{"start":8770.79,"end":8772.79,"text":"所以國會外交非常重要"},{"start":8772.79,"end":8774.79,"text":"所以說我認為啦"},{"start":8774.79,"end":8777.79,"text":"現在台灣以台灣面對中國這樣的狀況"},{"start":8777.79,"end":8780.79,"text":"其實外交不止外交部正式offical的"},{"start":8780.79,"end":8783.79,"text":"包括僑委會經營台商"},{"start":8783.79,"end":8784.79,"text":"甚至於台僑"},{"start":8784.79,"end":8786.79,"text":"而立法院其實就是經營國會外交"},{"start":8786.79,"end":8788.79,"text":"就以本席看到的"},{"start":8788.79,"end":8791.79,"text":"其實你見的這兩位法國的國會議員剛好也是我的好朋友"},{"start":8791.79,"end":8793.79,"text":"他們都特別提到了"},{"start":8793.79,"end":8795.79,"text":"比如說像Helen她就提到"},{"start":8795.79,"end":8799.79,"text":"台灣跟中國美國跟歐洲之間的關係其實是要深化交換意見"},{"start":8799.79,"end":8801.79,"text":"而另外我這位好朋友Cardi"},{"start":8801.79,"end":8803.79,"text":"她更提到了"},{"start":8803.79,"end":8806.79,"text":"中國是透過亞洲其他鄰近的國家"},{"start":8806.79,"end":8811.79,"text":"透過經濟脅迫的方式來構成對台灣的施壓"},{"start":8811.79,"end":8814.79,"text":"但是就像剛剛我特別為什麼要你來舉例就是"},{"start":8814.79,"end":8818.79,"text":"知不知道現在台商被中國滲透的很嚴重"},{"start":8818.79,"end":8820.79,"text":"甚至於把名單交出去"},{"start":8820.79,"end":8824.79,"text":"這個對於台商國外來講是非常危險的"},{"start":8824.79,"end":8828.79,"text":"對您提到歐洲地區尤其滲透的非常嚴重"},{"start":8828.79,"end":8830.79,"text":"而在我們台灣喔"},{"start":8830.79,"end":8833.79,"text":"我認為其實國人可能沒有感受到"},{"start":8833.79,"end":8836.79,"text":"但我們都知道啦AI假影片也非常多"},{"start":8836.79,"end":8838.79,"text":"本席呢上網去囉"},{"start":8838.79,"end":8842.79,"text":"發現既然也有你的AI假影片"},{"start":8842.79,"end":8845.79,"text":"然後操作你假考察真旅遊"},{"start":8845.79,"end":8847.79,"text":"然後再來帶風向"},{"start":8847.79,"end":8851.79,"text":"我認為其實這個部分都是跟中國的滲透有關"},{"start":8851.79,"end":8854.79,"text":"我想認知作戰一直持續不斷"},{"start":8854.79,"end":8857.79,"text":"而且這個煙囂早就已經開打"},{"start":8857.79,"end":8860.79,"text":"那我們在面對這樣的一個處境裡面"},{"start":8860.79,"end":8864.79,"text":"除了持續加強提供國人更多有用的資訊"},{"start":8864.79,"end":8866.79,"text":"破解這些迷思之外"},{"start":8866.79,"end":8871.79,"text":"當然我們也要更進一步做更多的這個組織聯繫的工作"},{"start":8871.79,"end":8875.79,"text":"尤其近年來我們有觀察到中共在海外的發展"},{"start":8875.79,"end":8878.79,"text":"已經不再是過去傳統模式"},{"start":8878.79,"end":8885.79,"text":"只是拉攏部分這個立場比較接近的政治的這些團體"},{"start":8885.79,"end":8890.79,"text":"事實上他們現在已經逐漸的往台派的各種團體"},{"start":8890.79,"end":8892.79,"text":"不斷的在邀約滲透"},{"start":8892.79,"end":8896.79,"text":"最新的做法是他直接說我要頒一個什麼獎給你"},{"start":8896.79,"end":8898.79,"text":"然後你請你來跟我們領獎"},{"start":8898.79,"end":8902.79,"text":"然後我們有些台商或者有些喬教的資深工作者說"},{"start":8902.79,"end":8906.79,"text":"奇怪了我在你們本來就已經會頒獎給我"},{"start":8906.79,"end":8908.79,"text":"我幹嘛去領中國的獎"},{"start":8908.79,"end":8911.79,"text":"但是他們用這樣的方式企圖去收買人心"},{"start":8911.79,"end":8917.79,"text":"希望把我們原來所組織的這一些網絡一個一個要拔掉"},{"start":8917.79,"end":8920.79,"text":"所以這樣子的步步進逼已經是迫在眉睫"},{"start":8920.79,"end":8925.79,"text":"所以我想這些AI身為的影片一定會推陳出新"},{"start":8925.79,"end":8929.79,"text":"不斷的就每一次政治攻防的時候就會出現"},{"start":8929.79,"end":8932.79,"text":"但是我相信台灣作為一個民主國家"},{"start":8932.79,"end":8934.79,"text":"我們還是會有試圖能力"},{"start":8934.79,"end":8938.79,"text":"而且我們也要強化我們所有不同generation"},{"start":8938.79,"end":8941.79,"text":"不管是資深公民或者是年輕一代"},{"start":8941.79,"end":8946.79,"text":"大家都能夠辨識這個AI身為的認知作戰"},{"start":8946.79,"end":8948.79,"text":"對我們社會的破壞跟影響"},{"start":8948.79,"end":8952.79,"text":"謝謝委員給我這個機會有機會來詳細說明"},{"start":8952.79,"end":8956.79,"text":"好本期要特別提出來的就是像這種的攻擊就是讓你卻步"},{"start":8956.79,"end":8958.79,"text":"讓你自斷手腳不敢出國"},{"start":8958.79,"end":8961.79,"text":"然後認為說好像有攻擊就畏懼"},{"start":8961.79,"end":8966.79,"text":"像這樣的做法其實就是希望你不要走出國門"},{"start":8966.79,"end":8971.79,"text":"然後去把這個所謂的僑民或者是僑團把他鞏固起來"},{"start":8971.79,"end":8975.79,"text":"我要提醒的是我一再的提到現在他們的手法手段當中"},{"start":8975.79,"end":8978.79,"text":"不只是透過金錢甚至於是滲透"},{"start":8978.79,"end":8983.79,"text":"甚至於是把我們原本現存的屬於台派的支持中華民國"},{"start":8983.79,"end":8988.79,"text":"台灣的這樣的勢力感出原本他自己創立的"},{"start":8988.79,"end":8989.79,"text":"不論是"},{"start":8990.69,"end":8994.69,"text":"相關的就是所謂的商業的或者是"},{"start":8994.95,"end":8999.95,"text":"文化連結的或是相關的教育的把原本的創辦人"},{"start":8999.95,"end":9002.95,"text":"然後透過翻群的方式把人趕走"},{"start":9002.95,"end":9004.95,"text":"而這樣的滲透是非常恐怖"},{"start":9004.95,"end":9008.95,"text":"所以我還是要支持的是你要勇敢的走出國門"},{"start":9008.95,"end":9012.95,"text":"到我們的朝界去持續的穩住台商台橋"},{"start":9012.95,"end":9014.95,"text":"這個對我們來講非常重要"},{"start":9014.95,"end":9017.95,"text":"謝謝謝謝委員我會盡我最好"},{"start":9022.91,"end":9024.91,"text":"好下面請馬文君委員諮詢"},{"start":9027.24,"end":9029.24,"text":"OK 馬文君"},{"start":9032.76,"end":9035.76,"text":"謝謝主席麻煩請徐委員長"},{"start":9036.96,"end":9037.96,"text":"好"},{"start":9038.03,"end":9039.03,"text":"徐委員長"},{"start":9042.96,"end":9043.96,"text":"馬召委長安"},{"start":9043.96,"end":9044.96,"text":"委員長早"},{"start":9044.96,"end":9048.96,"text":"剛剛其實委員大概也都有提到"},{"start":9048.96,"end":9053.96,"text":"就我們秋委會在對外的這些任務上面"},{"start":9053.96,"end":9055.96,"text":"其實這幾年我相信"},{"start":9055.96,"end":9058.96,"text":"在跟過去比起來秋委會的預算是增加的"},{"start":9058.96,"end":9059.96,"text":"是的"},{"start":9059.96,"end":9063.96,"text":"基本上大家都是傾向支持"},{"start":9063.96,"end":9066.96,"text":"可是當發生有什麼樣的爭議事件"},{"start":9066.96,"end":9069.96,"text":"或者應該要怎麼樣去說明解釋的時候"},{"start":9069.96,"end":9073.96,"text":"我想沒有必要用這些相關的預算"},{"start":9073.96,"end":9078.96,"text":"當然我們在過去可能在這個過程當中"},{"start":9078.96,"end":9082.96,"text":"比如說跟前兩任委員長比較"},{"start":9082.96,"end":9087.96,"text":"疫情期間同政員前委員長"},{"start":9087.96,"end":9089.96,"text":"他因為只出過一趟"},{"start":9089.96,"end":9091.96,"text":"所以他花不到百萬"},{"start":9091.96,"end":9094.96,"text":"在疫情前有落差"},{"start":9094.96,"end":9095.96,"text":"聽我講完"},{"start":9095.96,"end":9096.96,"text":"好"},{"start":9097.61,"end":9099.61,"text":"疫情前吳欣欣委員長"},{"start":9099.61,"end":9101.61,"text":"她四年花了1100萬"},{"start":9101.61,"end":9103.61,"text":"她也是不到一半"},{"start":9103.61,"end":9106.61,"text":"我想如果要做好橋委會的工作"},{"start":9106.61,"end":9109.61,"text":"我們政務官其實最重要的"},{"start":9109.61,"end":9111.61,"text":"她的政策目的"},{"start":9111.61,"end":9115.61,"text":"除了開疆闢土也要推動新的政策"},{"start":9115.61,"end":9118.61,"text":"目前面臨中共很多"},{"start":9118.61,"end":9120.61,"text":"不管她是打壓拉攏"},{"start":9120.61,"end":9122.61,"text":"或者用什麼樣的手段"},{"start":9122.61,"end":9124.61,"text":"或者什麼樣的方式"},{"start":9124.61,"end":9127.61,"text":"可能這個本來我們都自以心知肚明"},{"start":9127.61,"end":9130.61,"text":"我們也非常清楚都會受到這些"},{"start":9130.61,"end":9133.61,"text":"打壓跟拉攏跟攻擊"},{"start":9133.61,"end":9134.61,"text":"可是我們應該要怎麼做"},{"start":9134.61,"end":9137.61,"text":"這是大家支持預算的一個很重要的原因"},{"start":9137.61,"end":9139.61,"text":"到底應不應該出去"},{"start":9139.61,"end":9143.61,"text":"這個部分要看我們在這個過程當中"},{"start":9143.61,"end":9148.61,"text":"我們是不是有得到應有的這些效果跟成果"},{"start":9148.61,"end":9150.61,"text":"因為我們看到僑務工作"},{"start":9150.61,"end":9153.61,"text":"要提出怎麼樣更新更有見解的施政方針"},{"start":9153.61,"end":9155.61,"text":"而不是只是出國"},{"start":9155.61,"end":9157.61,"text":"因為如果在一個國家"},{"start":9157.61,"end":9160.61,"text":"那你面對全世界其他國家"},{"start":9160.61,"end":9162.61,"text":"我們有橋委會的地方"},{"start":9162.61,"end":9163.61,"text":"你能夠做到多少"},{"start":9163.61,"end":9166.61,"text":"這個部分不是光是出國就可以做到的"},{"start":9166.61,"end":9169.61,"text":"所以我們現在要看到的是"},{"start":9169.61,"end":9172.61,"text":"他實質的政策效益跟成果到底是什麼"},{"start":9172.61,"end":9175.61,"text":"人民會感受到你花納稅錢的時候"},{"start":9175.61,"end":9177.61,"text":"是有什麼樣的價值"},{"start":9177.61,"end":9179.61,"text":"這才是我們在監督預算的時候"},{"start":9179.61,"end":9180.61,"text":"所要做的工作"},{"start":9181.61,"end":9184.61,"text":"那這個部分因為像這一次"},{"start":9184.61,"end":9188.61,"text":"今天大概本來沒有討論到這個部分"},{"start":9188.61,"end":9191.61,"text":"不過因為在今年的預算審查的時候"},{"start":9191.61,"end":9194.61,"text":"也因為委員長特別有提到"},{"start":9194.61,"end":9196.61,"text":"你有不得不走的行程"},{"start":9196.61,"end":9198.61,"text":"然後有不得不見的人"},{"start":9198.61,"end":9204.61,"text":"所以我們為了僑委會把5月20號才審預算"},{"start":9204.61,"end":9207.61,"text":"這也本席也被民進黨團攻擊"},{"start":9207.61,"end":9209.61,"text":"說我故意拖延預算的審查"},{"start":9209.61,"end":9210.61,"text":"稍微的期住"},{"start":9210.61,"end":9213.61,"text":"所以我們也希望就這個部分"},{"start":9213.61,"end":9216.61,"text":"當委員長要出國的時候"},{"start":9216.61,"end":9218.61,"text":"這個部分其實在審查預算的時候"},{"start":9218.61,"end":9221.61,"text":"我相信大家沒有特別的為難"},{"start":9221.61,"end":9224.61,"text":"可是如果還要花很多的心思"},{"start":9224.61,"end":9227.61,"text":"在這裡討論這樣子的一個議題"},{"start":9227.61,"end":9229.61,"text":"我覺得這接下來的預算審查"},{"start":9229.61,"end":9231.61,"text":"大家可能會有更多的攻防"},{"start":9231.61,"end":9234.61,"text":"我們希望看到的是我們實質的效益"},{"start":9234.61,"end":9238.61,"text":"因為讓我們面對有這麼多的一些對岸的"},{"start":9238.61,"end":9240.61,"text":"他更多的資源"},{"start":9240.61,"end":9243.61,"text":"我們沒有辦法跟他比資源的情況之下"},{"start":9243.61,"end":9245.61,"text":"你就必須要有一個新的做法跟政策"},{"start":9245.61,"end":9248.61,"text":"這是我們本席要在這裡提出來的"},{"start":9248.61,"end":9252.61,"text":"所以這個部分我們也請在後續怎麼樣提出這些"},{"start":9252.61,"end":9254.61,"text":"謝謝 稍微的指導"},{"start":9254.61,"end":9255.61,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":9257.17,"end":9260.17,"text":"這個部分我們後續如果還有意見"},{"start":9260.17,"end":9263.17,"text":"我們在新的那個預算的時候"},{"start":9263.17,"end":9268.17,"text":"我們希望不要把它放在這種政治攻防"},{"start":9268.17,"end":9271.17,"text":"我們要的是它實質的意義跟價值"},{"start":9271.17,"end":9273.17,"text":"現在預算都已經過了"},{"start":9273.17,"end":9275.17,"text":"所以就這個部分我們期待委員長"},{"start":9275.17,"end":9278.17,"text":"在新的這些做法裡面"},{"start":9278.17,"end":9280.17,"text":"會在這個基礎上繼續努力"},{"start":9280.17,"end":9281.17,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":9281.17,"end":9283.17,"text":"好 接下來我們請林部長"},{"start":9283.88,"end":9284.88,"text":"有請林部長"},{"start":9291.78,"end":9292.78,"text":"好"},{"start":9292.79,"end":9294.79,"text":"好 謝謝部長"},{"start":9294.79,"end":9298.79,"text":"部長 剛剛其實局委員有特別提到"},{"start":9298.79,"end":9302.79,"text":"就是說我們近期可能有一些外館"},{"start":9302.79,"end":9306.79,"text":"它不管是有一些相關的事件發生"},{"start":9306.79,"end":9308.79,"text":"尤其是霸凌的案件"},{"start":9308.79,"end":9312.79,"text":"那我們也看到可能剛剛也提到大概有十件左右"},{"start":9312.79,"end":9316.79,"text":"可是有一些見報或者大家覺得說"},{"start":9316.79,"end":9318.79,"text":"已經比較有嚴重的狀況"},{"start":9318.79,"end":9321.79,"text":"這個部分我們希望外交部可以去正視"},{"start":9321.79,"end":9329.79,"text":"因為包括像過去資深的這個外交官"},{"start":9329.79,"end":9331.79,"text":"也擔任過外交部長"},{"start":9331.79,"end":9333.79,"text":"也是我們國安會的秘書長"},{"start":9333.79,"end":9334.79,"text":"就是李大維"},{"start":9334.79,"end":9337.79,"text":"他在回憶錄的部分他也提到"},{"start":9337.79,"end":9339.79,"text":"其實很多駐外館處的主管"},{"start":9339.79,"end":9343.79,"text":"他跟土皇帝的這種表現"},{"start":9343.79,"end":9346.79,"text":"其實真的是現象還滿普遍的"},{"start":9346.79,"end":9353.79,"text":"因為只要外交部他有一個流傳的說法"},{"start":9353.79,"end":9355.79,"text":"就是飛機的輪子一拉起來以後"},{"start":9355.79,"end":9357.79,"text":"人就變不一樣了"},{"start":9357.79,"end":9360.79,"text":"因為在外面畢竟天高皇帝遠"},{"start":9360.79,"end":9365.79,"text":"我們所有的層層的主管沒有辦法一一的去掌控"},{"start":9365.79,"end":9367.79,"text":"其實他又是一個比較封閉的"},{"start":9367.79,"end":9369.79,"text":"我們在所有駐外館處裡面"},{"start":9369.79,"end":9371.79,"text":"其實他的人員並不多"},{"start":9371.79,"end":9373.79,"text":"大家是非常的辛苦沒有錯"},{"start":9373.79,"end":9377.79,"text":"可是在底下基層的這些外交人員"},{"start":9377.79,"end":9379.79,"text":"其實他們的工作更辛苦"},{"start":9379.79,"end":9383.79,"text":"因為所有大大小小的事情都是由他們要來做"},{"start":9383.79,"end":9385.79,"text":"所以就這幾個部分"},{"start":9385.79,"end":9387.79,"text":"我們在這裡還是要提出來"},{"start":9387.79,"end":9391.79,"text":"因為包括像我們看到比較嚴重的幾個"},{"start":9391.79,"end":9395.79,"text":"像日內瓦辦事處這個都可以拒免"},{"start":9395.79,"end":9398.79,"text":"剛剛有提到說拒免或不拒免"},{"start":9398.79,"end":9399.79,"text":"不過"},{"start":9401.64,"end":9403.64,"text":"他真的可以得到解決嗎"},{"start":9403.64,"end":9405.64,"text":"這是大家擔心的剛剛有提到"},{"start":9405.64,"end":9407.64,"text":"其實他是比較封閉的"},{"start":9407.64,"end":9411.64,"text":"而且是比較小眾的辦事的範圍"},{"start":9411.64,"end":9413.64,"text":"所以他如果拒免"},{"start":9413.64,"end":9419.64,"text":"萬一如果沒有獲得一個很好的處理或解決的時候"},{"start":9419.64,"end":9422.64,"text":"對他們未來是有很大的影響"},{"start":9422.64,"end":9425.64,"text":"這是大家為什麼不敢拒免的一個很重要的原因"},{"start":9425.64,"end":9427.64,"text":"剛剛部長也有提到"},{"start":9427.64,"end":9429.64,"text":"如果不拒免其實我們還是會處理"},{"start":9429.64,"end":9432.64,"text":"我們更希望其實是更用審慎的態度去處理"},{"start":9432.64,"end":9434.64,"text":"如果大家會提到"},{"start":9434.64,"end":9435.64,"text":"因為像過去"},{"start":9436.33,"end":9439.33,"text":"在早期的年代我們提到教育好了"},{"start":9439.33,"end":9441.33,"text":"以前老師那種打罵"},{"start":9441.33,"end":9444.33,"text":"掉起來打或者騰條怎麼抽"},{"start":9444.33,"end":9446.33,"text":"那時候好像時空見慣"},{"start":9446.33,"end":9448.33,"text":"回去還會挨父母的打"},{"start":9448.33,"end":9451.33,"text":"可是現在連責罵已經都不行了"},{"start":9451.33,"end":9453.33,"text":"所以像我們現在霸凌的標準"},{"start":9453.33,"end":9455.33,"text":"應該要怎麼樣去拿捏"},{"start":9455.33,"end":9457.33,"text":"甚至我們先舉幾個"},{"start":9457.33,"end":9461.33,"text":"就是日內瓦辦事處現在這個"},{"start":9461.33,"end":9464.33,"text":"可能必須要做比較審慎的調查"},{"start":9464.33,"end":9468.33,"text":"另外駐美代表余大雷夫婦的這個部分"},{"start":9468.33,"end":9471.33,"text":"我們好像也沒有特別說"},{"start":9471.33,"end":9473.33,"text":"有什麼樣的情況發生"},{"start":9473.33,"end":9478.33,"text":"可是事實上在有這麼多的人員調職"},{"start":9478.33,"end":9480.33,"text":"或者更換的情況底下"},{"start":9480.33,"end":9483.33,"text":"或者其他相關大家都已經提出一些市政"},{"start":9483.33,"end":9489.33,"text":"我們還有另外就是在駐巴西聖保羅辦事處"},{"start":9489.33,"end":9493.33,"text":"就是王組長墜樓身亡的這個事件"},{"start":9493.33,"end":9495.33,"text":"當時外交部我們在查查的時候"},{"start":9495.33,"end":9497.33,"text":"也說霸凌沒有成立"},{"start":9497.33,"end":9500.33,"text":"可是事實上到最後可能處長"},{"start":9500.33,"end":9503.33,"text":"他是被依貪污治罪條例起訴"},{"start":9503.33,"end":9505.33,"text":"他被起訴這過程當中"},{"start":9505.33,"end":9507.33,"text":"跟這個組長其實也是有一些"},{"start":9507.33,"end":9509.33,"text":"事件是相關聯的"},{"start":9509.33,"end":9512.33,"text":"是不是有在和消的情況底下"},{"start":9512.33,"end":9514.33,"text":"有被做不當的要求等等"},{"start":9514.33,"end":9516.33,"text":"那這些其實在在都顯示"},{"start":9516.33,"end":9520.33,"text":"我們當時在處理這個霸凌的這個調查"},{"start":9520.33,"end":9524.33,"text":"也是也是委外的這些專家學者"},{"start":9524.33,"end":9526.33,"text":"可是他們卻沒有成立"},{"start":9526.33,"end":9528.33,"text":"我們看到這麼多還有"},{"start":9528.33,"end":9533.33,"text":"另外就是今年在4月份駐波士頓"},{"start":9533.33,"end":9537.33,"text":"台北經濟辦事處這個處長"},{"start":9537.33,"end":9540.33,"text":"這個也是長期霸凌部署的這個部分"},{"start":9541.8,"end":9543.8,"text":"我想這些都是有見報"},{"start":9543.8,"end":9545.8,"text":"而且都有受到高度的關注"},{"start":9545.8,"end":9548.8,"text":"可是我們幾乎都沒有成立的情況底下"},{"start":9548.8,"end":9552.8,"text":"那還有人敢好好的去做這樣子的一個"},{"start":9552.8,"end":9556.8,"text":"提出或相關的這些申訴嗎"},{"start":9558.23,"end":9561.23,"text":"報告委員因為現在所謂霸凌"},{"start":9561.23,"end":9563.23,"text":"這些是違法行為"},{"start":9563.23,"end":9566.23,"text":"我們當然透過教育要讓我們的同仁都了解"},{"start":9566.23,"end":9568.23,"text":"那怎麼營造好的工作環境"},{"start":9568.23,"end":9572.23,"text":"然後改善過去不良的工作文化"},{"start":9572.23,"end":9576.23,"text":"那當然我們必須要把法律上面的權益"},{"start":9576.23,"end":9579.23,"text":"對同仁的保障做好包括申訴"},{"start":9579.23,"end":9582.23,"text":"那另外是有一些怎麼樣去讓工作環境"},{"start":9582.23,"end":9585.23,"text":"可以減少這種高壓下"},{"start":9585.23,"end":9589.23,"text":"的一種對人的不尊重甚至霸凌"},{"start":9589.23,"end":9591.23,"text":"那我說整體來講"},{"start":9591.23,"end":9593.23,"text":"當然要與時俱進"},{"start":9593.23,"end":9596.23,"text":"那因為那個環境我們怎麼去改善"},{"start":9596.23,"end":9597.23,"text":"它要有一個過程"},{"start":9597.23,"end":9601.23,"text":"所以我們就建立了當然職場的一些就是說"},{"start":9601.23,"end":9604.23,"text":"去的方法"},{"start":9604.23,"end":9608.23,"text":"那我們讓大家信任我們外交部長"},{"start":9608.23,"end":9610.23,"text":"即使你是居民或是沒有居民"},{"start":9610.23,"end":9612.23,"text":"只要是有事實我們都會辦理"},{"start":9612.23,"end":9614.23,"text":"但是我們會保密"},{"start":9614.23,"end":9617.23,"text":"那在這個時候如果一個我們過去的"},{"start":9617.23,"end":9619.23,"text":"駐外的館長"},{"start":9619.23,"end":9620.23,"text":"比如說或者是長官"},{"start":9621.55,"end":9623.55,"text":"也許過去這個"},{"start":9623.55,"end":9626.55,"text":"這個平行式的一些作風現在是"},{"start":9626.55,"end":9628.55,"text":"要很容易我要去教育他們"},{"start":9628.55,"end":9630.55,"text":"然後也要有一個申訴管道"},{"start":9630.55,"end":9632.55,"text":"最後還是要改善整個工作環境"},{"start":9632.55,"end":9634.55,"text":"讓大家不要隨時處於一種"},{"start":9634.55,"end":9638.55,"text":"就是一種非常高壓的一種人際關係下"},{"start":9638.55,"end":9639.55,"text":"因為時間的關係"},{"start":9639.55,"end":9641.55,"text":"我們現在要說的是"},{"start":9641.55,"end":9643.55,"text":"今天如果有同仁提出來"},{"start":9643.55,"end":9645.55,"text":"表示他們覺得受到影響"},{"start":9645.55,"end":9648.55,"text":"那這些影響都必須要去重視"},{"start":9648.55,"end":9652.55,"text":"因為如果我們全部都不成立的情況底下"},{"start":9652.55,"end":9654.55,"text":"會讓人家覺得這個可能"},{"start":9654.55,"end":9658.55,"text":"有更大的一個勢力在保護他們"},{"start":9658.55,"end":9660.55,"text":"因為所以他可以更肆無忌憚"},{"start":9660.55,"end":9662.55,"text":"因為他怎麼做都沒有關係"},{"start":9662.55,"end":9665.55,"text":"今天外交的業務在都是在國外"},{"start":9665.55,"end":9668.55,"text":"有很多外交的事務是非常繁雜"},{"start":9668.55,"end":9670.55,"text":"而且也沒有辦法真的沒有辦法"},{"start":9670.55,"end":9673.55,"text":"像我們說愛朝九晚五"},{"start":9673.55,"end":9675.55,"text":"或者有什麼樣的那個"},{"start":9675.55,"end":9678.55,"text":"應該要怎麼樣去做這些協調工作"},{"start":9678.55,"end":9680.55,"text":"或者不應該有無理的要求"},{"start":9680.55,"end":9683.55,"text":"所謂的無理要求是讓他們做違法的事情"},{"start":9683.55,"end":9687.55,"text":"這已經非常愉悅的這個本分"},{"start":9687.55,"end":9690.55,"text":"這可能也不是說過去的習慣怎麼樣"},{"start":9690.55,"end":9692.55,"text":"所以這個部分我們特別提出來"},{"start":9692.55,"end":9695.55,"text":"我們也希望因為林部長您現在是"},{"start":9695.55,"end":9698.55,"text":"外交部最高的這樣的主管"},{"start":9698.55,"end":9699.55,"text":"你也是他們的大家長"},{"start":9699.55,"end":9703.55,"text":"每一位他們在近來外交部服務"},{"start":9703.55,"end":9704.55,"text":"都非常的不容易"},{"start":9704.55,"end":9707.55,"text":"不是只有這些處長或所謂的館長"},{"start":9707.55,"end":9711.55,"text":"還有更多的基層的這些外交人員"},{"start":9711.55,"end":9714.55,"text":"其實他們在工作的場域都非常不容易"},{"start":9714.55,"end":9715.55,"text":"你更應該要保護他們"},{"start":9715.55,"end":9718.55,"text":"如果有外力介入的時候"},{"start":9718.55,"end":9722.55,"text":"我想你更應該可以提供更大的肩膀"},{"start":9722.55,"end":9724.55,"text":"這個部分我們要在這裡特別提出來"},{"start":9724.55,"end":9726.55,"text":"另外再用一點點時間就是說"},{"start":9726.55,"end":9729.55,"text":"我們這一次針對WTO"},{"start":9729.55,"end":9731.55,"text":"沒有辦法參加的事情"},{"start":9731.55,"end":9733.55,"text":"依據外交部對外的新聞稿"},{"start":9733.55,"end":9736.55,"text":"是說我們已經有嚴正抗議"},{"start":9736.55,"end":9739.55,"text":"卡麥隆才正式我國以正確的身分尊嚴"},{"start":9739.55,"end":9742.55,"text":"參與應有的權利"},{"start":9742.55,"end":9744.55,"text":"而且我們繼續提出來"},{"start":9744.55,"end":9750.55,"text":"所以我們代表團可以獲得豁免簽證的補救措施"},{"start":9750.55,"end":9751.55,"text":"可是到最後"},{"start":9751.55,"end":9756.55,"text":"卡麥隆提出了這些補救的措施以後"},{"start":9756.55,"end":9758.55,"text":"我們還是沒有參加"},{"start":9758.55,"end":9760.55,"text":"我想要請教到底為什麼"},{"start":9761.53,"end":9763.53,"text":"因為他那個名字錯了"},{"start":9763.53,"end":9766.53,"text":"我們的駐WTO他的綜合判斷"},{"start":9766.53,"end":9769.53,"text":"會是要求更改說會來不及"},{"start":9769.53,"end":9771.53,"text":"當時OTN也有正題他的判斷"},{"start":9771.53,"end":9772.53,"text":"有多少人錯"},{"start":9772.53,"end":9774.53,"text":"還有幾個是對的"},{"start":9774.53,"end":9776.53,"text":"就一個是對的"},{"start":9776.53,"end":9778.53,"text":"其他名字都是物質"},{"start":9778.53,"end":9782.53,"text":"那物質他沒有辦法及時去修正嗎"},{"start":9782.53,"end":9785.53,"text":"因為民國物質其實不是很困難的事情"},{"start":9785.53,"end":9787.53,"text":"因為往返需要飛機時間等等"},{"start":9787.53,"end":9789.53,"text":"他們的判斷是屬於已經"},{"start":9789.53,"end":9792.53,"text":"幾乎是來不及的時間"},{"start":9792.53,"end":9795.53,"text":"部長我在這裡要特別提出來"},{"start":9795.53,"end":9799.53,"text":"他已經是有豁免簽證的這些文件"},{"start":9799.53,"end":9801.53,"text":"他現在我們用的是說"},{"start":9801.53,"end":9804.53,"text":"我們有一些錯誤資訊的這些文件"},{"start":9804.53,"end":9806.53,"text":"要進入卡麥隆"},{"start":9806.53,"end":9808.53,"text":"我想這個部分我們應該"},{"start":9808.53,"end":9811.53,"text":"這要及時去修正都沒有很大的困難"},{"start":9811.53,"end":9813.53,"text":"可是我們去選擇沒有出席"},{"start":9813.53,"end":9816.53,"text":"這個通盤評估聽起來好像就是"},{"start":9816.53,"end":9819.53,"text":"黃昭元大使他的決定"},{"start":9819.53,"end":9822.53,"text":"所以他到底有沒有衡量"},{"start":9822.53,"end":9824.53,"text":"到底有沒有衡量"},{"start":9824.53,"end":9826.53,"text":"WTO沒有"},{"start":9826.53,"end":9827.53,"text":"這是我們自己選擇的"},{"start":9827.53,"end":9829.53,"text":"我們跑都飛都要到"},{"start":9829.53,"end":9833.53,"text":"所以我們出席就是我們才是正正的目的"},{"start":9833.53,"end":9835.53,"text":"我要提醒一個"},{"start":9835.53,"end":9837.53,"text":"因為有一個你剛剛有提到"},{"start":9837.53,"end":9839.53,"text":"至少有一個他的資訊"},{"start":9839.53,"end":9841.53,"text":"他所有的資料是正確"},{"start":9841.53,"end":9844.53,"text":"那一個也可以代表我們出席這個會議"},{"start":9844.53,"end":9847.53,"text":"因為我們每年編了非常高額的運算"},{"start":9847.53,"end":9848.53,"text":"參加WTO"},{"start":9848.53,"end":9853.53,"text":"而且WTO是我們目前唯一可以很正式的發生的"},{"start":9853.53,"end":9854.53,"text":"一個重要的平台"},{"start":9854.53,"end":9856.53,"text":"可是我們卻選擇沒有出席"},{"start":9856.53,"end":9859.53,"text":"而且是第一次選擇沒有出席"},{"start":9859.53,"end":9862.53,"text":"我們在所有的這些場域底下"},{"start":9862.53,"end":9864.53,"text":"我們是怎麼樣評估的"},{"start":9864.53,"end":9866.53,"text":"他的輕重輕重"},{"start":9866.53,"end":9868.53,"text":"其實我覺得好像這個"},{"start":9868.53,"end":9870.53,"text":"這個由個人的那個選擇"},{"start":9870.53,"end":9874.53,"text":"會判斷犧牲掉我們一個很大的權益"},{"start":9874.53,"end":9878.53,"text":"所以這個部分我們要求在未來"},{"start":9878.53,"end":9880.53,"text":"因為這個是非常遺憾的事情"},{"start":9880.53,"end":9883.53,"text":"今天如果說有一個助團的大使"},{"start":9883.53,"end":9886.53,"text":"他因為他8月底會回來對不對"},{"start":9888.46,"end":9889.46,"text":"8月底"},{"start":9889.46,"end":9894.46,"text":"還要陪同海基跟貝爾斯的大使要回台灣"},{"start":9894.46,"end":9901.46,"text":"所以我們的外交部的預算其實也沒有什麼匱乏"},{"start":9901.46,"end":9903.46,"text":"他想要回來還是可以回來"},{"start":9903.46,"end":9907.46,"text":"黃教練大使有必要好好的對全體國人解釋說明"},{"start":9907.46,"end":9912.46,"text":"當我們一直關切國際經貿談判人才斷層之際"},{"start":9912.46,"end":9914.46,"text":"我們之前也發生了非常遺憾"},{"start":9914.46,"end":9919.46,"text":"就是我們的楊總談判代表"},{"start":9919.46,"end":9921.46,"text":"其實他的霸凌案是成立的"},{"start":9921.46,"end":9925.46,"text":"所以這個部分其實為什麼會受到重視"},{"start":9925.46,"end":9927.46,"text":"我相信部長也非常清楚"},{"start":9927.46,"end":9929.46,"text":"那我們在這個部分"},{"start":9929.46,"end":9934.46,"text":"我們選擇放棄台灣在國際經貿平台上面發生的結會"},{"start":9934.46,"end":9937.46,"text":"我覺得這真的是造成非常大的損失"},{"start":9937.46,"end":9941.46,"text":"而且也對我們未來可能也會造成衝擊"},{"start":9941.46,"end":9943.46,"text":"如果你一而再再而三"},{"start":9943.46,"end":9946.46,"text":"如果還有其他的主辦國也照這樣的模式"},{"start":9946.46,"end":9947.46,"text":"那我們是不是都不參加"},{"start":9947.46,"end":9950.46,"text":"我們過去也常常在講說我們退出聯合國以後"},{"start":9950.46,"end":9952.46,"text":"我們的位置就被佔了"},{"start":9952.46,"end":9955.46,"text":"如果我們現在採取這樣的模式"},{"start":9955.46,"end":9959.46,"text":"我覺得對我們來說可能也會造成後續一個很大的影響"},{"start":9959.46,"end":9962.46,"text":"那這個部分有必要請黃大使回來的時候"},{"start":9962.46,"end":9964.46,"text":"也必須對國人說清楚"},{"start":9964.46,"end":9965.46,"text":"反正他要回來了"},{"start":9965.46,"end":9967.46,"text":"我稍微回應一下委員"},{"start":9967.46,"end":9970.46,"text":"因為我也相當認同委員的意見"},{"start":9970.46,"end":9972.46,"text":"對方有錯"},{"start":9972.46,"end":9974.46,"text":"包括主辦國這個柯麥龍"},{"start":9974.46,"end":9976.46,"text":"我們抗議也有效"},{"start":9976.46,"end":9979.46,"text":"在這個時候當然我們要爭取抗議中參與"},{"start":9979.46,"end":9981.46,"text":"那因為有一些程序上的問題"},{"start":9981.46,"end":9983.46,"text":"我們就要全力來克服"},{"start":9983.46,"end":9986.46,"text":"我認為台灣的外交處境很困難"},{"start":9986.46,"end":9988.46,"text":"並不是對方打壓"},{"start":9988.46,"end":9989.46,"text":"我們就抗議而已"},{"start":9989.46,"end":9992.46,"text":"在抗議中要能夠去參與"},{"start":9992.46,"end":9994.46,"text":"那要是不凸顯問題"},{"start":9994.46,"end":9996.46,"text":"這可能會形成一些對不對"},{"start":9996.46,"end":9997.46,"text":"對方就得寸進尺"},{"start":9997.46,"end":9999.46,"text":"那我們也這次得到各國的支持"},{"start":9999.46,"end":10001.46,"text":"因為這個發生在WTO"},{"start":10001.46,"end":10004.46,"text":"大家都覺得是很錯誤的事情"},{"start":10004.46,"end":10006.46,"text":"所以我們是有道理啦"},{"start":10006.46,"end":10008.46,"text":"可是怎麼樣在做法上"},{"start":10008.46,"end":10012.46,"text":"如果時間上或者是說各種可能性"},{"start":10012.46,"end":10015.46,"text":"我想這個是應該要做一些來檢視"},{"start":10015.46,"end":10016.46,"text":"看怎麼樣能夠"},{"start":10016.46,"end":10019.46,"text":"我們最重要的就是能夠參與"},{"start":10019.46,"end":10022.46,"text":"國際很多的像這樣子的一個會議"},{"start":10022.46,"end":10025.46,"text":"尤其WTO是非常不容易的"},{"start":10025.46,"end":10027.46,"text":"這也是我們現在存在的一個"},{"start":10027.46,"end":10030.46,"text":"最重要的一個組織"},{"start":10030.46,"end":10033.46,"text":"所以如果說我們自己選擇退出不參與"},{"start":10033.46,"end":10036.46,"text":"那未來他們其他就可以"},{"start":10036.46,"end":10039.46,"text":"按照這樣的模式複製下去"},{"start":10039.46,"end":10041.46,"text":"因為我們最重要的就是參與"},{"start":10041.46,"end":10043.46,"text":"當你自己都沒有參與的時候"},{"start":10043.46,"end":10046.46,"text":"用這樣的理由你下次還是會碰到"},{"start":10046.46,"end":10049.46,"text":"所以這個部分我們這一次在這裡提醒"},{"start":10049.46,"end":10053.46,"text":"是希望怎麼樣去應付或克服這樣的一個狀況發生"},{"start":10053.46,"end":10055.46,"text":"而不是我們自己就不參加"},{"start":10055.46,"end":10059.46,"text":"你如果說像我們因為民昌的關係"},{"start":10059.46,"end":10063.46,"text":"我們台灣現在是簽證還有入境"},{"start":10063.46,"end":10065.46,"text":"還有所有這些行政上的"},{"start":10065.46,"end":10069.46,"text":"簽證跟入境在我們的技術上面"},{"start":10069.46,"end":10070.46,"text":"其實它都是可以克服的"},{"start":10070.46,"end":10072.46,"text":"當然我們自己也常常出國"},{"start":10072.46,"end":10074.46,"text":"你即使一般平民老百姓要出國"},{"start":10074.46,"end":10077.46,"text":"有什麼樣可能有一些務實的時候"},{"start":10077.46,"end":10079.46,"text":"其實他再做一個即時的調整就好了"},{"start":10079.46,"end":10081.46,"text":"更何況剛剛你也提到"},{"start":10081.46,"end":10083.46,"text":"我們還有人是正確的資訊"},{"start":10083.46,"end":10085.46,"text":"如果他可以代表我們出席"},{"start":10085.46,"end":10087.46,"text":"你就不應該放棄這樣的機會"},{"start":10087.46,"end":10089.46,"text":"這是我們111的要求"},{"start":10089.46,"end":10091.46,"text":"他們當然說明是因為時間上來不及"},{"start":10091.46,"end":10092.46,"text":"即使他改過"},{"start":10092.46,"end":10093.46,"text":"但是我認為說"},{"start":10094.74,"end":10096.74,"text":"我們還是要盡一些可能"},{"start":10096.74,"end":10098.74,"text":"去在抗議中參與"},{"start":10098.74,"end":10100.74,"text":"他這個有錯"},{"start":10100.74,"end":10103.74,"text":"我們是他這個打壓我們有錯"},{"start":10103.74,"end":10104.74,"text":"我們抗議有效"},{"start":10104.74,"end":10107.74,"text":"那這個中間地帶怎麼樣去積極參與"},{"start":10107.74,"end":10109.74,"text":"就是委員剛剛提醒我們會來加強"},{"start":10109.74,"end":10111.74,"text":"部長對任何一個舉辦國來說"},{"start":10111.74,"end":10114.74,"text":"有錯對他們來說無關痛癢"},{"start":10114.74,"end":10115.74,"text":"可是我們沒有參加"},{"start":10115.74,"end":10118.74,"text":"對我們來說是非常非常嚴重的損失"},{"start":10118.74,"end":10122.74,"text":"這攸關我們在國際我們發生的機會"},{"start":10122.74,"end":10124.74,"text":"是 好 我們會努力"},{"start":10128.42,"end":10130.42,"text":"我們下一位請王恩祥委員諮詢"},{"start":10140.3,"end":10141.3,"text":"好 感謝主席"},{"start":10141.3,"end":10142.3,"text":"有請外交部林部長"},{"start":10143.07,"end":10144.07,"text":"有請林部長"},{"start":10150.83,"end":10152.83,"text":"部長長 委員好"},{"start":10152.83,"end":10154.83,"text":"這個因為我過去在大學服務"},{"start":10154.83,"end":10156.83,"text":"所以今天這個專報的主題"},{"start":10156.83,"end":10158.83,"text":"是特別有感"},{"start":10158.83,"end":10159.83,"text":"那我過去在學校裡面"},{"start":10159.83,"end":10161.83,"text":"其實也非常贊成"},{"start":10161.83,"end":10164.83,"text":"這個送一些我們的大專的這個學生"},{"start":10164.83,"end":10167.83,"text":"集體去到國外去看看"},{"start":10167.83,"end":10169.83,"text":"這個國際的一些事務"},{"start":10169.83,"end":10171.83,"text":"其實對於這個他們對我們自己"},{"start":10171.83,"end":10174.83,"text":"本身國家在國際的處境"},{"start":10174.83,"end":10175.83,"text":"我們的艱難"},{"start":10175.83,"end":10178.83,"text":"其實有非常非常好的一個影響"},{"start":10178.83,"end":10179.83,"text":"那他們回來之後"},{"start":10179.83,"end":10181.83,"text":"也是我覺得就是像部長說的"},{"start":10181.83,"end":10183.83,"text":"就是人人都是外交官"},{"start":10183.83,"end":10184.83,"text":"部部都是外交官"},{"start":10184.83,"end":10186.83,"text":"我覺得那個影響非常非常大"},{"start":10186.83,"end":10188.83,"text":"所以我也非常贊成"},{"start":10188.83,"end":10190.83,"text":"繼續要推動這樣的一個事務"},{"start":10190.83,"end":10193.83,"text":"不過我們在這個做這件事情的時候"},{"start":10193.83,"end":10196.83,"text":"在找推學生到一些國際的組織去"},{"start":10196.83,"end":10199.83,"text":"那也遭遇到一些打壓"},{"start":10199.83,"end":10202.83,"text":"那我想這個打壓是持續的"},{"start":10202.83,"end":10204.83,"text":"那在這個事件之前"},{"start":10204.83,"end":10205.83,"text":"我就問一下"},{"start":10205.83,"end":10206.83,"text":"因為最近這個有一個"},{"start":10206.83,"end":10207.83,"text":"很重要的外交事件"},{"start":10207.83,"end":10209.83,"text":"就是摩洛哥"},{"start":10209.83,"end":10211.83,"text":"他好像跟以前這個"},{"start":10211.83,"end":10212.83,"text":"羅馬尼亞跟這個"},{"start":10212.83,"end":10214.83,"text":"好像也不大一樣"},{"start":10214.83,"end":10217.83,"text":"他好像停發我們的V-Share"},{"start":10217.83,"end":10219.83,"text":"這事我們會再說"},{"start":10219.83,"end":10220.83,"text":"那部長這個"},{"start":10220.83,"end":10222.83,"text":"這個我想國安都很關切"},{"start":10222.83,"end":10224.83,"text":"這個大家去北非"},{"start":10224.83,"end":10225.83,"text":"大概都去觀光很多"},{"start":10225.83,"end":10226.83,"text":"我剛好因為有朋友"},{"start":10226.83,"end":10228.83,"text":"剛好就要去"},{"start":10228.83,"end":10231.83,"text":"剛好就沒辦法去到那裡"},{"start":10233.25,"end":10235.25,"text":"繼續他這個旅途"},{"start":10235.25,"end":10236.25,"text":"不小心這個外交部"},{"start":10236.25,"end":10238.25,"text":"先掌握摩洛哥這個狀況"},{"start":10239.68,"end":10240.68,"text":"大概是怎樣"},{"start":10240.68,"end":10242.68,"text":"我們要做什麼樣的處置嗎"},{"start":10242.68,"end":10243.68,"text":"是"},{"start":10243.68,"end":10244.68,"text":"報告委員"},{"start":10244.68,"end":10246.68,"text":"因為我們也持續在查證中"},{"start":10246.68,"end":10248.68,"text":"這是因為他"},{"start":10248.68,"end":10251.68,"text":"因為電子簽證的適用對象"},{"start":10251.68,"end":10253.68,"text":"是因為他在做調整"},{"start":10253.68,"end":10254.68,"text":"而沒把我們納入"},{"start":10254.68,"end":10256.68,"text":"還是這麼有針對性"},{"start":10256.68,"end":10258.68,"text":"那當然"},{"start":10258.68,"end":10262.68,"text":"我們還在做最後的這個確認當中"},{"start":10262.68,"end":10264.68,"text":"不過因為我們也表達到"},{"start":10264.68,"end":10267.68,"text":"我們的立場跟我們的這個抗議"},{"start":10267.68,"end":10270.68,"text":"但是這個事情是技術性"},{"start":10270.68,"end":10273.68,"text":"層面很高還是政治性的原因"},{"start":10273.68,"end":10275.68,"text":"這個還有待最後的釐清"},{"start":10275.68,"end":10277.68,"text":"那當然我們繼續對等"},{"start":10277.68,"end":10280.68,"text":"就是外交就是對等跟互惠"},{"start":10280.68,"end":10283.68,"text":"我們同樣會對他們"},{"start":10283.68,"end":10286.68,"text":"有這樣子的一個就是說限制"},{"start":10286.68,"end":10288.68,"text":"對因為我有去"},{"start":10288.68,"end":10290.68,"text":"我們辦公室有試著去看看"},{"start":10290.68,"end":10292.68,"text":"大概有多少的人次到摩洛哥去"},{"start":10292.68,"end":10293.68,"text":"因為很多都是觀光"},{"start":10293.68,"end":10295.68,"text":"而且他可能透過轉機"},{"start":10295.68,"end":10297.68,"text":"會被定能夠"},{"start":10297.44,"end":10299.44,"text":"這個精準的掌控"},{"start":10299.44,"end":10300.44,"text":"不過我們可以掌控"},{"start":10300.44,"end":10302.44,"text":"摩洛哥入境我們台灣的一個狀況"},{"start":10302.44,"end":10304.44,"text":"我覺得比例上可能會有很大的差異"},{"start":10304.44,"end":10305.44,"text":"也就是說我們做這個動作"},{"start":10305.44,"end":10307.44,"text":"可能不一定收到一個效果"},{"start":10307.44,"end":10309.44,"text":"當然外交是基於這個是基準"},{"start":10309.44,"end":10311.44,"text":"對等"},{"start":10311.44,"end":10313.44,"text":"但是我們當然積極去協調"},{"start":10313.44,"end":10317.44,"text":"目前初步間接掌握的資訊"},{"start":10317.44,"end":10319.44,"text":"他們有一部分的原因"},{"start":10319.44,"end":10322.44,"text":"是因為他們的這個電子簽證"},{"start":10322.44,"end":10325.44,"text":"這適用對象沒有納入我國"},{"start":10325.44,"end":10329.44,"text":"我們當然在協調爭取"},{"start":10329.44,"end":10333.44,"text":"可是這是不是政治性的干涉"},{"start":10333.44,"end":10335.44,"text":"這當然也都不能夠排除"},{"start":10335.44,"end":10338.44,"text":"就是在這個時機我們會加快來做確認"},{"start":10338.44,"end":10340.44,"text":"但是在解決問題之前"},{"start":10340.44,"end":10343.44,"text":"我們只好先採取對等的措施"},{"start":10343.44,"end":10344.44,"text":"對因為我剛剛說"},{"start":10344.44,"end":10346.44,"text":"其實很多我們的國人是到那邊去觀光"},{"start":10346.44,"end":10349.44,"text":"所以現在他們其實就有一些狀況"},{"start":10349.44,"end":10350.44,"text":"就是我不知道"},{"start":10350.44,"end":10353.44,"text":"這個跟我剛剛說前面這個奧地利亞"},{"start":10353.44,"end":10355.44,"text":"那個好像有一些駕照的狀況"},{"start":10355.44,"end":10356.44,"text":"又不大一樣"},{"start":10356.44,"end":10357.44,"text":"那不一樣"},{"start":10357.44,"end":10360.44,"text":"我不知道外交部這邊是不是要做一個什麼"},{"start":10360.44,"end":10362.44,"text":"讓國內人知道說"},{"start":10362.44,"end":10363.44,"text":"如果真的發生了"},{"start":10363.44,"end":10365.44,"text":"我很擔心他像電影一樣"},{"start":10365.44,"end":10367.44,"text":"飛下來剛好就失效這樣子"},{"start":10367.44,"end":10371.44,"text":"我想目前發生的有幾個歷史是在非洲"},{"start":10371.44,"end":10372.44,"text":"對"},{"start":10372.44,"end":10373.44,"text":"因為中國當然在那邊的影響力"},{"start":10373.44,"end":10374.44,"text":"因為非洲54國"},{"start":10374.44,"end":10377.44,"text":"那53個國都他的建交國"},{"start":10377.44,"end":10381.44,"text":"我們建交只有這個史瓦蒂尼"},{"start":10381.44,"end":10386.44,"text":"但是歐洲的情形基本上經過交涉之後"},{"start":10386.44,"end":10389.44,"text":"基本上他們都採取歐盟模式"},{"start":10389.44,"end":10390.44,"text":"是比較一致"},{"start":10390.44,"end":10393.44,"text":"那至於某個哥因為他在北非"},{"start":10393.44,"end":10397.44,"text":"可是又是國人旅遊很常去的這個地點"},{"start":10397.44,"end":10401.44,"text":"所以這個確實會有他對國人的影響"},{"start":10401.44,"end":10403.44,"text":"那我們也在交涉當中"},{"start":10403.44,"end":10407.44,"text":"那目前透過其他國家也在幫忙"},{"start":10407.44,"end":10411.44,"text":"能夠確認到底對方這個新的措施是"},{"start":10411.44,"end":10414.44,"text":"因為技術上的引述能夠來改善"},{"start":10414.44,"end":10418.44,"text":"那我們當然就相對會改變我們對他的一些限制"},{"start":10418.44,"end":10422.44,"text":"如果沒有的話當然這個事情就會成為一個外交事件"},{"start":10422.44,"end":10423.44,"text":"是"},{"start":10423.44,"end":10424.44,"text":"就是韓市情部長就是說"},{"start":10424.44,"end":10425.44,"text":"因為我有一些朋友"},{"start":10425.44,"end":10427.44,"text":"你說是不是有一些SOP也告訴他們"},{"start":10427.44,"end":10428.44,"text":"現階段"},{"start":10428.44,"end":10429.44,"text":"因為他們有些是拿到"},{"start":10429.44,"end":10430.44,"text":"有些還沒拿到"},{"start":10430.44,"end":10431.44,"text":"有些還是身體中"},{"start":10431.44,"end":10433.44,"text":"他們這個不同的狀況"},{"start":10433.44,"end":10434.44,"text":"是不是有一些"},{"start":10434.44,"end":10436.44,"text":"告訴他們怎麼去處理這個事情"},{"start":10436.44,"end":10437.44,"text":"好來這樣的建議"},{"start":10437.44,"end":10438.44,"text":"請他跟我們聯絡"},{"start":10438.44,"end":10440.44,"text":"我們應該都有這個窗口"},{"start":10440.44,"end":10441.44,"text":"可以做說明"},{"start":10441.44,"end":10442.44,"text":"好"},{"start":10442.44,"end":10444.44,"text":"我們再回到剛剛這個"},{"start":10444.44,"end":10447.44,"text":"我們的青年大使的狀況的部分"},{"start":10447.44,"end":10450.44,"text":"因為我知道部長就有不同的做法"},{"start":10450.44,"end":10452.44,"text":"成立一個青年大使協會"},{"start":10452.44,"end":10455.44,"text":"那我前面有一些委員提到這個"},{"start":10455.44,"end":10457.44,"text":"就是我們有做一些培訓"},{"start":10457.44,"end":10459.44,"text":"或者常常參加一些我們的一些活動"},{"start":10459.44,"end":10460.44,"text":"那這個人才困的部分"},{"start":10460.44,"end":10462.44,"text":"現在大概狀況是怎麼樣"},{"start":10463.31,"end":10464.31,"text":"好"},{"start":10464.25,"end":10466.25,"text":"我們以幾種"},{"start":10466.25,"end":10468.25,"text":"就是國際青年大使"},{"start":10468.25,"end":10469.25,"text":"農業青年大使"},{"start":10469.25,"end":10470.25,"text":"外交小尖兵"},{"start":10470.25,"end":10473.25,"text":"還有參加過我們培訓的"},{"start":10473.25,"end":10475.25,"text":"INGO的交流合作"},{"start":10475.25,"end":10478.25,"text":"這個相當大的一個人才庫"},{"start":10478.25,"end":10479.25,"text":"是"},{"start":10479.25,"end":10480.25,"text":"那也累積了20幾年"},{"start":10480.25,"end":10483.25,"text":"所以我們希望他們能夠來幫忙"},{"start":10483.25,"end":10486.25,"text":"後續的更年輕的人能夠"},{"start":10486.25,"end":10488.25,"text":"來參與國際交流"},{"start":10488.25,"end":10489.25,"text":"大概是這個目的"},{"start":10489.25,"end":10491.25,"text":"那有一些也因為這樣的過程"},{"start":10491.25,"end":10495.25,"text":"他又進一步可能來報考外交官"},{"start":10495.25,"end":10499.25,"text":"或因為參加我們國會的志工"},{"start":10499.25,"end":10501.25,"text":"或技術團等等"},{"start":10501.25,"end":10505.25,"text":"我們希望讓外交人才的流動深遷"},{"start":10505.25,"end":10508.25,"text":"不是只有職業外交官這一鬼"},{"start":10508.25,"end":10510.25,"text":"可是跟其他鬼之間"},{"start":10510.25,"end":10511.25,"text":"也可能會產生交流"},{"start":10511.25,"end":10514.25,"text":"這也是包括這樣大專青年"},{"start":10514.25,"end":10516.25,"text":"很多人因為他一次性的參加這個活動"},{"start":10516.25,"end":10517.25,"text":"他改變他的志向"},{"start":10517.25,"end":10519.25,"text":"把他更投入到外交工作"},{"start":10519.25,"end":10521.25,"text":"也許他因為剛進社會"},{"start":10521.25,"end":10523.25,"text":"他必須要在職場上"},{"start":10523.25,"end":10524.25,"text":"可是到一個程度之後"},{"start":10524.25,"end":10526.25,"text":"他可能想到外交"},{"start":10526.25,"end":10528.25,"text":"做一個職業外交官"},{"start":10528.25,"end":10529.25,"text":"那我們都是歡迎"},{"start":10529.25,"end":10530.25,"text":"剛剛委員講"},{"start":10530.25,"end":10532.25,"text":"我們現在希望說是培養"},{"start":10532.25,"end":10534.25,"text":"讓一些想進入外交領域的人"},{"start":10534.25,"end":10536.25,"text":"至少我們像大學"},{"start":10536.25,"end":10538.25,"text":"有一些合作計畫"},{"start":10538.25,"end":10539.25,"text":"也可以來增補"},{"start":10539.25,"end":10541.25,"text":"讓這些人可以進行"},{"start":10541.25,"end":10543.25,"text":"包括我們參加各種"},{"start":10543.25,"end":10545.25,"text":"我們的這些交流合作的計畫"},{"start":10545.25,"end":10547.25,"text":"剛剛前面王毓川委員他也提到"},{"start":10547.25,"end":10549.25,"text":"這個人才庫的那個"},{"start":10549.25,"end":10550.25,"text":"就是重複性的狀況"},{"start":10550.25,"end":10552.25,"text":"會不會很多人其實是"},{"start":10552.25,"end":10555.25,"text":"過去是比較針對語言"},{"start":10555.25,"end":10556.25,"text":"跟所謂的產業"},{"start":10556.25,"end":10557.25,"text":"要求"},{"start":10557.25,"end":10559.25,"text":"我們現在其實很多元化"},{"start":10559.25,"end":10560.25,"text":"包括像無人機"},{"start":10560.25,"end":10562.25,"text":"像很多的理工科的這些東西"},{"start":10562.25,"end":10564.25,"text":"像我們龍幫計畫有八個旗艦"},{"start":10564.25,"end":10566.25,"text":"我們就針對這八個旗艦"},{"start":10566.25,"end":10568.25,"text":"比如說像智慧醫療跟鮮剛產業"},{"start":10568.25,"end":10571.25,"text":"我們台灣非常多對於知通訊"},{"start":10571.25,"end":10573.25,"text":"很了解的人到巴拉圭"},{"start":10573.25,"end":10575.25,"text":"巴拉圭為什麼把它建置成這個"},{"start":10575.25,"end":10577.25,"text":"建立那麼好"},{"start":10577.25,"end":10578.25,"text":"物美價廉"},{"start":10578.25,"end":10579.25,"text":"經過將近十年"},{"start":10579.25,"end":10581.25,"text":"就是我們這些外交替代役"},{"start":10581.25,"end":10584.25,"text":"還有志工還有這些技術團"},{"start":10584.25,"end":10586.25,"text":"其實是在幫他們建立"},{"start":10586.25,"end":10587.25,"text":"那我們不能講說"},{"start":10587.25,"end":10589.25,"text":"因為他們基本上"},{"start":10589.25,"end":10592.25,"text":"就是其實幫忙這些國家"},{"start":10592.25,"end":10594.25,"text":"建立電子化的政府"},{"start":10594.25,"end":10596.25,"text":"是幫助非常大的"},{"start":10596.25,"end":10598.25,"text":"那個因為委員長"},{"start":10599.12,"end":10600.12,"text":"不好意思"},{"start":10600.12,"end":10601.12,"text":"因為這邊有提到"},{"start":10601.12,"end":10603.12,"text":"所謂的搭橋"},{"start":10603.12,"end":10604.12,"text":"其實看起來"},{"start":10604.12,"end":10606.12,"text":"很多是台灣這邊的旗艦"},{"start":10606.12,"end":10607.12,"text":"這兩邊有沒有什麼樣"},{"start":10607.12,"end":10609.12,"text":"大家的互動"},{"start":10609.12,"end":10610.12,"text":"搭橋計畫基本上"},{"start":10610.12,"end":10612.12,"text":"就是台灣的大學生"},{"start":10612.12,"end":10614.12,"text":"我們為了培育他們"},{"start":10614.12,"end":10616.12,"text":"有對國際的認識"},{"start":10616.12,"end":10618.12,"text":"以及對我們僑務的一些興趣"},{"start":10618.12,"end":10620.12,"text":"所以我們過去幾年"},{"start":10620.12,"end":10623.12,"text":"特別從台灣的大學生裡面選拔"},{"start":10623.12,"end":10626.12,"text":"他們都是外語能力非常優秀"},{"start":10626.12,"end":10629.12,"text":"而且也對台灣的認同度非常高"},{"start":10629.12,"end":10632.12,"text":"他們也很願意去學習的這些學生"},{"start":10632.12,"end":10633.12,"text":"所以他們到海外去"},{"start":10633.12,"end":10634.12,"text":"事實上我們跟外交部"},{"start":10634.12,"end":10635.12,"text":"都有一些合作"},{"start":10635.12,"end":10636.12,"text":"因為有很多的點"},{"start":10636.12,"end":10638.12,"text":"我們的學生也會去拜訪"},{"start":10638.12,"end":10640.12,"text":"然後我們也會請外交部"},{"start":10640.12,"end":10642.12,"text":"幫我們協同去聯繫"},{"start":10642.12,"end":10644.12,"text":"我們當地的一些二級政府"},{"start":10644.12,"end":10646.12,"text":"或三級政府的拜會"},{"start":10646.12,"end":10648.12,"text":"那這些學生去的時候"},{"start":10648.12,"end":10650.12,"text":"也會讓我們在國際的這一些"},{"start":10650.12,"end":10651.12,"text":"政府部門覺得說"},{"start":10651.12,"end":10652.12,"text":"哇你們台灣來的年輕人"},{"start":10652.12,"end":10653.12,"text":"水準很好"},{"start":10653.12,"end":10655.12,"text":"可以很清楚的用外語"},{"start":10655.12,"end":10656.12,"text":"跟他們侃侃而談"},{"start":10656.12,"end":10657.12,"text":"所以我們這個也是一種"},{"start":10657.12,"end":10659.12,"text":"實質的國民外交"},{"start":10659.12,"end":10662.12,"text":"對所以我當然希望這些年輕人"},{"start":10662.12,"end":10664.12,"text":"在這個外交部跟僑務會"},{"start":10664.12,"end":10665.12,"text":"這邊的一個努力下"},{"start":10665.12,"end":10666.12,"text":"我們希望真的"},{"start":10666.12,"end":10667.12,"text":"以後這些年輕人"},{"start":10667.12,"end":10669.12,"text":"對我們的國際處境很了解"},{"start":10669.12,"end":10671.12,"text":"這些未來的主人公"},{"start":10671.12,"end":10673.12,"text":"都是台灣的外交官"},{"start":10673.12,"end":10674.12,"text":"好感謝"},{"start":10674.12,"end":10675.12,"text":"感謝部長"},{"start":10675.12,"end":10676.12,"text":"謝謝王委員謝謝"},{"start":10677.27,"end":10678.27,"text":"好謝謝"},{"start":10679.7,"end":10683.7,"text":"我們接下來請賴世寶委員上台諮詢"},{"start":10694.55,"end":10696.55,"text":"謝謝主席以及各位先進"},{"start":10696.55,"end":10699.55,"text":"有請外交部的林部長"},{"start":10709.26,"end":10710.26,"text":"來部長你好"},{"start":10710.26,"end":10711.26,"text":"好你好"},{"start":10711.26,"end":10714.26,"text":"幾個問題不大不小的問題"},{"start":10714.26,"end":10720.26,"text":"那最近看到其實日本的首相"},{"start":10720.26,"end":10721.26,"text":"要告訴早苗"},{"start":10722.47,"end":10725.47,"text":"在那個靖國聲色外邊"},{"start":10725.47,"end":10728.47,"text":"沒有離太遠的地方等於遙跡"},{"start":10728.47,"end":10730.47,"text":"可是他們的官員"},{"start":10730.47,"end":10734.47,"text":"包括防長幾位閣員都進去了"},{"start":10734.47,"end":10736.47,"text":"這樣的一個情況"},{"start":10736.47,"end":10738.47,"text":"外界就解讀了"},{"start":10738.47,"end":10739.47,"text":"某種程度來講"},{"start":10739.47,"end":10742.47,"text":"在高市早苗的領導之下"},{"start":10742.47,"end":10745.47,"text":"日本是不是逐漸的要恢復"},{"start":10745.47,"end":10747.47,"text":"走向軍國主義"},{"start":10747.47,"end":10751.47,"text":"畢竟對於特別是在核武這一方面"},{"start":10751.47,"end":10753.47,"text":"他原來有三不原則"},{"start":10753.47,"end":10756.47,"text":"不要生產不要運輸什麼之類的"},{"start":10756.47,"end":10757.47,"text":"那這個"},{"start":10759.14,"end":10761.14,"text":"又加上他們的防長"},{"start":10761.74,"end":10764.74,"text":"來去這個靖國聲色"},{"start":10764.74,"end":10765.74,"text":"這是一個很敏感的問題"},{"start":10765.74,"end":10767.74,"text":"特別在8月15號"},{"start":10767.74,"end":10770.74,"text":"他是一個戰敗的紀念日"},{"start":10770.74,"end":10773.74,"text":"那麼他同篇沒有提到反省"},{"start":10773.74,"end":10775.74,"text":"沒有提到過去來講的話"},{"start":10775.74,"end":10777.74,"text":"日本的首相都會提這個東西"},{"start":10777.74,"end":10780.74,"text":"他這次的高市沒有提到什麼反省"},{"start":10780.74,"end":10781.74,"text":"好像他做錯"},{"start":10781.74,"end":10783.74,"text":"沒有他們就認為就這個"},{"start":10783.74,"end":10785.74,"text":"換言之我要強調一個是"},{"start":10785.74,"end":10787.74,"text":"現在的日本首相"},{"start":10787.74,"end":10791.74,"text":"基本上他要改寫日本侵略"},{"start":10791.74,"end":10795.74,"text":"奧戰的時候侵略世界各國的這個歷史"},{"start":10795.74,"end":10796.74,"text":"他改寫這個歷史"},{"start":10796.74,"end":10800.74,"text":"那結果韓國當然要大幅的抗議"},{"start":10800.74,"end":10802.74,"text":"然後中國大陸也抗議"},{"start":10802.74,"end":10804.74,"text":"台灣點幾次呢"},{"start":10804.74,"end":10806.74,"text":"兩次了尊重"},{"start":10806.74,"end":10808.74,"text":"這兩個字尊重喔"},{"start":10809.57,"end":10810.57,"text":"我請問部長"},{"start":10810.57,"end":10812.57,"text":"你這個尊重什麼意思啊"},{"start":10813.75,"end":10815.75,"text":"我想外交部了解"},{"start":10815.75,"end":10818.75,"text":"這個日本社會對這些歷史議題"},{"start":10818.75,"end":10820.75,"text":"有多元的看法"},{"start":10820.75,"end":10822.75,"text":"那所以我們當然也期待"},{"start":10822.75,"end":10825.75,"text":"要不斷的去檢討"},{"start":10825.75,"end":10828.75,"text":"不要再重犯過去發動戰爭"},{"start":10828.75,"end":10830.75,"text":"這樣的罪行"},{"start":10830.75,"end":10832.75,"text":"可是也要同時期待"},{"start":10832.75,"end":10834.75,"text":"共同來維護區域的和平和穩定"},{"start":10834.75,"end":10837.75,"text":"對當前我想台日的關係"},{"start":10837.75,"end":10840.75,"text":"我們也希望能夠就是說"},{"start":10840.75,"end":10843.75,"text":"有助於我們區域的和平和穩定"},{"start":10843.75,"end":10844.75,"text":"你知道在奧戰期間"},{"start":10844.75,"end":10846.75,"text":"我們台灣人死多少人你知道嗎"},{"start":10850,"end":10852,"text":"要看你怎麼計算"},{"start":10852,"end":10853,"text":"你Google一下都有啊"},{"start":10853,"end":10855,"text":"3萬多人啊"},{"start":10855,"end":10856,"text":"有人講十幾萬啦"},{"start":10856,"end":10858,"text":"但是精準來講3萬多人"},{"start":10858,"end":10862,"text":"而且裡面被動員的人有20萬人"},{"start":10862,"end":10863,"text":"那是他能夠很少"},{"start":10864.49,"end":10866.49,"text":"基本上來講的話奧戰期間"},{"start":10866.49,"end":10868.49,"text":"台灣是被日本奴隸"},{"start":10868.76,"end":10870.76,"text":"台灣是被日本那時候"},{"start":10870.76,"end":10872.76,"text":"所以台灣的地位尷尬"},{"start":10872.76,"end":10875.76,"text":"日本的殖民地然後是什麼"},{"start":10875.76,"end":10876.76,"text":"戰敗國"},{"start":10876.76,"end":10878.76,"text":"可是回到中華民國是戰勝國"},{"start":10878.76,"end":10879.76,"text":"變這個樣子"},{"start":10879.76,"end":10880.76,"text":"會有這個東西"},{"start":10880.76,"end":10882.76,"text":"那可是我們看喔"},{"start":10883.53,"end":10886.53,"text":"看喔陳水扁是民進黨第一個"},{"start":10886.53,"end":10888.53,"text":"當中華民國的總統"},{"start":10889.32,"end":10891.32,"text":"他對這件事情"},{"start":10891.34,"end":10893.34,"text":"的表現都比你們現在強硬"},{"start":10893.34,"end":10894.34,"text":"你們現在尊重啊"},{"start":10894.34,"end":10896.34,"text":"尊重的意思什麼意思"},{"start":10896.34,"end":10897.34,"text":"叫樂見其成"},{"start":10898.7,"end":10899.7,"text":"可以這樣子嗎"},{"start":10899.7,"end":10901.7,"text":"可以對一個侵略國"},{"start":10901.7,"end":10903.7,"text":"然後他的過去這樣侵略全世界"},{"start":10903.7,"end":10906.7,"text":"造成世界這麼大的一個傷害"},{"start":10906.7,"end":10909.7,"text":"然後他的首相居然現在來講"},{"start":10909.7,"end":10911.7,"text":"完全180度轉變了"},{"start":10911.7,"end":10913.7,"text":"變成是他們都沒有任何的錯"},{"start":10913.7,"end":10914.7,"text":"都是別人的錯"},{"start":10914.7,"end":10916.7,"text":"他們活該"},{"start":10918.76,"end":10919.76,"text":"要被打"},{"start":10919.76,"end":10920.76,"text":"變這個樣子"},{"start":10920.76,"end":10921.76,"text":"他要改寫這樣歷史"},{"start":10921.76,"end":10924.76,"text":"然後我們死了在那段時間"},{"start":10924.76,"end":10926.76,"text":"最保守的估計是3萬人以上"},{"start":10926.76,"end":10928.76,"text":"然後我們都不敢講話"},{"start":10928.76,"end":10930.76,"text":"只有講兩個字叫尊重"},{"start":10930.76,"end":10933.76,"text":"這個東西太軟弱了吧"},{"start":10933.76,"end":10936.76,"text":"那個林部長太軟弱了"},{"start":10936.76,"end":10938.76,"text":"你要知道馬政府"},{"start":10938.76,"end":10939.76,"text":"檢討跟反省"},{"start":10939.76,"end":10941.76,"text":"來要反省啊"},{"start":10941.76,"end":10942.76,"text":"他都沒有反省啊"},{"start":10942.76,"end":10943.76,"text":"對不對"},{"start":10943.76,"end":10945.76,"text":"你要呼籲他要反省啊"},{"start":10945.76,"end":10947.76,"text":"你要想喔"},{"start":10947.76,"end":10949.76,"text":"馬政府的時候"},{"start":10950.25,"end":10952.25,"text":"2008到2016年"},{"start":10952.25,"end":10955.25,"text":"外交部總共發表了13篇"},{"start":10955.25,"end":10957.25,"text":"官方的文章"},{"start":10957.25,"end":10958.25,"text":"最少最少"},{"start":10958.25,"end":10961.25,"text":"我們當然知道對日本關係很重要"},{"start":10961.25,"end":10964.25,"text":"但最少都表示遺憾啦"},{"start":10965.1,"end":10967.1,"text":"還很客氣沒有講到抗議啊"},{"start":10967.1,"end":10968.1,"text":"韓國是抗議"},{"start":10968.1,"end":10970.1,"text":"中國大陸是抗議啊"},{"start":10970.1,"end":10971.1,"text":"然後最少我們講個遺憾"},{"start":10971.1,"end":10974.1,"text":"然後民進黨執政政府都不敢講"},{"start":10974.1,"end":10975.1,"text":"遺憾這兩個字不敢講"},{"start":10975.1,"end":10976.1,"text":"都講尊重"},{"start":10976.1,"end":10978.1,"text":"讓人家瞧不起啊"},{"start":10978.1,"end":10979.1,"text":"結果你可以看啊"},{"start":10979.1,"end":10980.1,"text":"比較一下啊"},{"start":10980.1,"end":10981.1,"text":"我們對日本這麼好"},{"start":10982.58,"end":10983.58,"text":"日本的"},{"start":10983.58,"end":10986.58,"text":"在2011年日本的311地震"},{"start":10986.58,"end":10990.58,"text":"台灣捐了68.5億新台幣"},{"start":10990.58,"end":10991.58,"text":"全球之冠"},{"start":10993.5,"end":10995.5,"text":"反過來就是來講他們"},{"start":10995.5,"end":10997.5,"text":"當然我們是這個什麼"},{"start":10997.5,"end":10999.5,"text":"這個能杯幾杯"},{"start":10999.5,"end":11001.5,"text":"我們當然是這個support"},{"start":11001.5,"end":11003.5,"text":"代表我們對日本非常友好"},{"start":11003.5,"end":11007.5,"text":"但是後來2024年台灣"},{"start":11007.5,"end":11009.5,"text":"4月3號的花蓮地震"},{"start":11009.5,"end":11010.5,"text":"日本捐多少"},{"start":11011.27,"end":11012.27,"text":"幾千萬而已啊"},{"start":11013.58,"end":11014.58,"text":"就是你會發現啊"},{"start":11014.58,"end":11016.58,"text":"我們有一點熱淋貼冷屁股啊"},{"start":11016.58,"end":11017.58,"text":"你不覺得嗎"},{"start":11017.58,"end":11018.58,"text":"然後以前"},{"start":11018.58,"end":11020.58,"text":"以前你的前面的外交部長"},{"start":11020.58,"end":11023.58,"text":"吳釗燮說日本是我們的大格格"},{"start":11026.46,"end":11027.46,"text":"有照顧到"},{"start":11027.46,"end":11029.46,"text":"有照顧到你啊"},{"start":11029.46,"end":11031.46,"text":"包括最近的李應洋"},{"start":11031.46,"end":11033.46,"text":"他的座位也被欺負"},{"start":11033.46,"end":11034.46,"text":"就排在什麼什麼海"},{"start":11034.46,"end":11037.46,"text":"這個這個長期的什麼什麼活動"},{"start":11038.85,"end":11039.85,"text":"沒有他去廣島"},{"start":11039.85,"end":11042.85,"text":"他去廣島也有長期長期他就沒去嘛"},{"start":11042.85,"end":11043.85,"text":"廣島就是處長"},{"start":11043.85,"end":11045.85,"text":"長期他沒去嘛"},{"start":11045.85,"end":11047.85,"text":"他最後都排在海外"},{"start":11047.85,"end":11048.85,"text":"就排在海外時"},{"start":11048.85,"end":11050.85,"text":"排到很後面就是說"},{"start":11050.85,"end":11052.85,"text":"就是說我們一直說"},{"start":11052.85,"end":11054.85,"text":"台日多重要多重要"},{"start":11054.85,"end":11055.85,"text":"結果"},{"start":11056.55,"end":11058.55,"text":"我告訴好幾個面向嘛"},{"start":11058.55,"end":11060.55,"text":"你光捐款就差很多"},{"start":11060.55,"end":11062.55,"text":"我們給68億"},{"start":11062.55,"end":11063.55,"text":"然後他們給幾千萬"},{"start":11063.55,"end":11064.55,"text":"都是大地震"},{"start":11064.55,"end":11066.55,"text":"差很多很多"},{"start":11066.55,"end":11068.55,"text":"你不覺得真的是"},{"start":11068.55,"end":11070.55,"text":"真的是我們真的是一頭栽進去"},{"start":11070.55,"end":11072.55,"text":"然後我們的駐日代表"},{"start":11072.55,"end":11074.55,"text":"幾乎都變成幫助日本代表"},{"start":11074.55,"end":11076.55,"text":"變這個樣子"},{"start":11076.55,"end":11077.55,"text":"很悲哀啦"},{"start":11077.55,"end":11079.55,"text":"我今天特別來跟你講這個"},{"start":11079.55,"end":11081.55,"text":"看你現在也是軟趴趴的"},{"start":11081.55,"end":11082.55,"text":"不敢講什麼話"},{"start":11082.55,"end":11084.55,"text":"面對日本不敢講那個的話"},{"start":11084.55,"end":11086.55,"text":"他們的首相越來越強硬"},{"start":11086.55,"end":11088.55,"text":"有那個趨勢"},{"start":11088.55,"end":11090.55,"text":"要走向軍國主義的覆辟"},{"start":11091.87,"end":11093.87,"text":"結果我們現在"},{"start":11094.06,"end":11095.06,"text":"基本上來講的話"},{"start":11095.06,"end":11096.06,"text":"還是等地氣"},{"start":11096.06,"end":11097.06,"text":"然後就尊重"},{"start":11097.06,"end":11099.06,"text":"尊重就是四個字"},{"start":11099.06,"end":11100.06,"text":"樂見其成"},{"start":11100.06,"end":11101.06,"text":"四字樂見其成"},{"start":11103.13,"end":11106.13,"text":"發動戰爭的這個歷史要不斷的"},{"start":11106.13,"end":11108.13,"text":"你有沒有樂見其成啊"},{"start":11108.13,"end":11110.13,"text":"你是不是樂見其成"},{"start":11110.13,"end":11112.13,"text":"他們的首相"},{"start":11112.13,"end":11114.13,"text":"可能不要概念轉換"},{"start":11114.13,"end":11116.13,"text":"好幾個層次的問題"},{"start":11116.13,"end":11117.13,"text":"你尊重什麼意思嗎"},{"start":11117.13,"end":11118.13,"text":"尊重你發表的啊"},{"start":11118.13,"end":11120.13,"text":"你發表尊重什麼意思啊"},{"start":11120.13,"end":11121.13,"text":"尊重什麼意思啊"},{"start":11121.13,"end":11123.13,"text":"就是外交部瞭解"},{"start":11123.13,"end":11126.13,"text":"會對於這些重大的歷史議題"},{"start":11126.13,"end":11128.13,"text":"有多元的看法"},{"start":11128.13,"end":11131.13,"text":"但是對歷史要不斷的檢討"},{"start":11131.13,"end":11132.13,"text":"反省"},{"start":11132.13,"end":11134.13,"text":"請問日本的二戰是不是侵略"},{"start":11134.13,"end":11135.13,"text":"世界各國"},{"start":11135.13,"end":11136.13,"text":"當然他是侵略啊"},{"start":11136.13,"end":11137.13,"text":"是嗎"},{"start":11137.13,"end":11138.13,"text":"那就不能講"},{"start":11138.13,"end":11139.13,"text":"說尊重啊"},{"start":11139.13,"end":11140.13,"text":"怎麼可以尊重呢"},{"start":11140.13,"end":11142.13,"text":"不是尊重侵略喔"},{"start":11142.13,"end":11144.13,"text":"是多元的看法"},{"start":11144.13,"end":11146.13,"text":"因為現在他已經改變了過去"},{"start":11146.13,"end":11147.13,"text":"委員啊"},{"start":11147.13,"end":11148.13,"text":"現在在談的是進國神社"},{"start":11148.13,"end":11149.13,"text":"還是談二戰"},{"start":11149.13,"end":11151.13,"text":"兩個都談"},{"start":11151.13,"end":11152.13,"text":"這不太一樣啦"},{"start":11152.13,"end":11153.13,"text":"因為第一個"},{"start":11153.13,"end":11155.13,"text":"我想第二個是進國神社"},{"start":11155.13,"end":11157.13,"text":"第一個先談首相"},{"start":11157.13,"end":11160.13,"text":"日本首相對於二戰的詮釋"},{"start":11160.13,"end":11163.13,"text":"他侵略世界各國的權勢"},{"start":11163.13,"end":11164.13,"text":"他已經改變了"},{"start":11164.13,"end":11166.13,"text":"過去好像要反省"},{"start":11166.13,"end":11167.13,"text":"現在都沒有反省了"},{"start":11167.13,"end":11168.13,"text":"我們認為"},{"start":11168.13,"end":11169.13,"text":"就是"},{"start":11169.13,"end":11171.13,"text":"所以你剛剛講了嘛"},{"start":11171.13,"end":11172.13,"text":"不只反省要檢討"},{"start":11172.13,"end":11174.13,"text":"要避免能夠"},{"start":11174.13,"end":11177.13,"text":"你剛才就是尊重他多元的看法"},{"start":11177.13,"end":11180.13,"text":"就是等於尊重他改變"},{"start":11180.13,"end":11181.13,"text":"沒有沒有"},{"start":11181.13,"end":11183.13,"text":"我們外交部同仁啊"},{"start":11183.13,"end":11185.13,"text":"這個新聞稿不是這個樣子"},{"start":11185.13,"end":11186.13,"text":"你寫尊重啊"},{"start":11186.13,"end":11187.13,"text":"我看老闆一定是寫尊重"},{"start":11187.13,"end":11189.13,"text":"我全文都看了"},{"start":11189.13,"end":11190.13,"text":"尊重"},{"start":11190.13,"end":11191.13,"text":"尊重"},{"start":11191.13,"end":11192.13,"text":"不能尊重啊"},{"start":11192.13,"end":11194.13,"text":"這個怎麼可以尊重"},{"start":11194.13,"end":11196.13,"text":"日本社會就是問題"},{"start":11196.13,"end":11198.13,"text":"歷史要證實"},{"start":11198.13,"end":11200.13,"text":"他侵略的事實"},{"start":11200.13,"end":11201.13,"text":"要證實這個"},{"start":11201.13,"end":11203.13,"text":"當然你可以原諒"},{"start":11203.13,"end":11204.13,"text":"但是不能忽視"},{"start":11204.13,"end":11205.13,"text":"他是侵略"},{"start":11205.13,"end":11206.13,"text":"讓台灣人"},{"start":11206.13,"end":11207.13,"text":"死掉三萬多人"},{"start":11207.13,"end":11209.13,"text":"其他的國家都死很多人"},{"start":11209.13,"end":11212.13,"text":"日本是二戰的一個元凶"},{"start":11212.13,"end":11213.13,"text":"這裡面"},{"start":11213.13,"end":11214.13,"text":"進國神社裡面"},{"start":11214.13,"end":11216.13,"text":"裡面都是祭拜的"},{"start":11216.13,"end":11218.13,"text":"都是那個一等一的戰犯"},{"start":11218.13,"end":11219.13,"text":"很清楚那些"},{"start":11219.13,"end":11221.13,"text":"進國神社很複雜"},{"start":11221.13,"end":11223.13,"text":"不是只有祭拜那些戰犯"},{"start":11223.13,"end":11224.13,"text":"他就是因為混在一起"},{"start":11224.13,"end":11226.13,"text":"所以問題很複雜"},{"start":11226.13,"end":11227.13,"text":"我是覺得我們是"},{"start":11227.13,"end":11229.13,"text":"所謂了解日本社會"},{"start":11229.13,"end":11231.13,"text":"對這個歷史的議題"},{"start":11231.13,"end":11232.13,"text":"有多元的看法"},{"start":11232.13,"end":11233.13,"text":"對啦"},{"start":11233.13,"end":11234.13,"text":"但是"},{"start":11234.13,"end":11235.13,"text":"但是"},{"start":11235.13,"end":11236.13,"text":"這個不一樣的喔"},{"start":11236.13,"end":11238.13,"text":"尊重就等於同意啊"},{"start":11238.13,"end":11242.13,"text":"我們要維護和平穩的"},{"start":11242.13,"end":11244.13,"text":"我們今天所有的立委提案"},{"start":11244.13,"end":11245.13,"text":"我說尊重"},{"start":11245.13,"end":11246.13,"text":"那什麼意思"},{"start":11246.13,"end":11247.13,"text":"尊重就是說"},{"start":11247.13,"end":11249.13,"text":"我不同意你啦"},{"start":11249.13,"end":11250.13,"text":"基本上是這樣"},{"start":11250.13,"end":11251.13,"text":"沒有把你學去了"},{"start":11251.13,"end":11253.13,"text":"請你看詳細的一點"},{"start":11253.13,"end":11255.13,"text":"看了我才會跟你執行的"},{"start":11255.13,"end":11257.13,"text":"我跟你講這個部長"},{"start":11257.13,"end":11259.13,"text":"對日本要強硬一點"},{"start":11259.13,"end":11260.13,"text":"不能這樣子"},{"start":11260.13,"end":11261.13,"text":"包括他跟菲律賓"},{"start":11261.13,"end":11263.13,"text":"一起化經濟海域"},{"start":11263.13,"end":11264.13,"text":"這樣揮擊他"},{"start":11264.13,"end":11265.13,"text":"跟台灣揮擊你"},{"start":11265.13,"end":11266.13,"text":"你也尊重"},{"start":11266.13,"end":11267.13,"text":"什麼尊重"},{"start":11267.13,"end":11268.13,"text":"然後那個重生鳥教"},{"start":11268.13,"end":11269.13,"text":"明明是個教"},{"start":11269.13,"end":11270.13,"text":"他還說是個島"},{"start":11270.13,"end":11271.13,"text":"你也尊重"},{"start":11273.77,"end":11274.77,"text":"對不對"},{"start":11274.77,"end":11275.77,"text":"杜德日本"},{"start":11275.77,"end":11277.77,"text":"杜德旁邊的菲律賓"},{"start":11277.77,"end":11279.77,"text":"這樣嚇得要死"},{"start":11279.77,"end":11280.77,"text":"只有一個"},{"start":11280.77,"end":11282.77,"text":"我們敢大聲的對中五大陸"},{"start":11282.77,"end":11283.77,"text":"因為這個政治操作"},{"start":11283.77,"end":11284.77,"text":"抗中保台"},{"start":11284.77,"end":11286.77,"text":"我不要敢大聲"},{"start":11286.77,"end":11288.77,"text":"其他亂啪啪的"},{"start":11288.77,"end":11289.77,"text":"中國在侵略台灣"},{"start":11289.77,"end":11290.77,"text":"我們在表達開玩笑"},{"start":11290.77,"end":11292.77,"text":"其他亂啪啪的"},{"start":11292.77,"end":11293.77,"text":"這個很悲哀啊"},{"start":11293.77,"end":11295.77,"text":"這個林部長不能"},{"start":11295.77,"end":11296.77,"text":"他的"},{"start":11296.77,"end":11297.77,"text":"他要扭曲歷史"},{"start":11297.77,"end":11298.77,"text":"不能尊重啦"},{"start":11298.77,"end":11300.77,"text":"他進國神社"},{"start":11300.77,"end":11301.77,"text":"也要"},{"start":11301.77,"end":11302.57,"text":"遺憾啊"},{"start":11303.16,"end":11304.24,"text":"最好是抗議的"},{"start":11304.24,"end":11304.74,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":11304.74,"end":11305.24,"text":"好"},{"start":11306.16,"end":11306.66,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":11310.13,"end":11313.13,"text":"我們接下來請劉璇婷委員上台諮詢"},{"start":11317.42,"end":11318.76,"text":"謝謝主席外交部長的邀請"},{"start":11318.76,"end":11319.76,"text":"前林部長"},{"start":11329.13,"end":11329.63,"text":"部長"},{"start":11329.63,"end":11330.13,"text":"你好"},{"start":11330.13,"end":11330.63,"text":"這"},{"start":11331.13,"end":11332.13,"text":"高市找苗"},{"start":11332.13,"end":11333.13,"text":"針對進國神社"},{"start":11333.13,"end":11334.13,"text":"你剛才講得清楚"},{"start":11334.13,"end":11336.13,"text":"剛剛質詢的時候有一段辯論"},{"start":11336.13,"end":11337.13,"text":"沒有辯論啦"},{"start":11337.13,"end":11339.13,"text":"交流溝通"},{"start":11339.13,"end":11340.13,"text":"離心問題啦"},{"start":11340.13,"end":11342.13,"text":"不然討論的東西有時候不對焦"},{"start":11342.13,"end":11343.13,"text":"是啊"},{"start":11343.13,"end":11344.13,"text":"會各說各話"},{"start":11344.13,"end":11346.13,"text":"這議題之所以敏感"},{"start":11346.13,"end":11347.13,"text":"就是因為裡面供奉的"},{"start":11347.13,"end":11348.13,"text":"所謂的甲級戰犯"},{"start":11348.13,"end":11349.13,"text":"那過去的時候"},{"start":11349.13,"end":11351.13,"text":"當然日本會隨著它執政黨的改變"},{"start":11351.13,"end":11354.13,"text":"在這個界線上面會有一些調整"},{"start":11354.13,"end":11355.13,"text":"那每一次的調整"},{"start":11355.13,"end":11358.13,"text":"它當然都會挑動敏感的這個外交神經嘛"},{"start":11358.13,"end":11360.13,"text":"那我想台灣是當初"},{"start":11360.13,"end":11361.13,"text":"這個被殖民的地方"},{"start":11361.13,"end":11363.13,"text":"也是戰爭的受害人啦"},{"start":11363.13,"end":11364.13,"text":"這部長"},{"start":11364.13,"end":11365.13,"text":"你就直接一點嘛"},{"start":11365.13,"end":11366.13,"text":"你樂不樂見"},{"start":11367.2,"end":11369.2,"text":"他們重新重視進國神社這件事"},{"start":11369.2,"end":11371.2,"text":"甚至是小拳跑去參拜"},{"start":11371.2,"end":11372.2,"text":"你樂見這樣的事嗎"},{"start":11372.2,"end":11373.2,"text":"我覺得參拜是為是"},{"start":11373.2,"end":11376.2,"text":"但對歷史的反省檢討"},{"start":11376.2,"end":11378.2,"text":"然後避免再發生悲劇啦"},{"start":11378.2,"end":11379.2,"text":"你就樂見不樂見"},{"start":11379.2,"end":11382.2,"text":"然後當下我們就是要共同來維護"},{"start":11382.2,"end":11385.2,"text":"這個台海跟印太的和平跟穩定"},{"start":11385.2,"end":11387.2,"text":"那我們也不能夠就是說去"},{"start":11387.2,"end":11391.2,"text":"這個無視於現在台灣正面對"},{"start":11391.2,"end":11392.2,"text":"東博的威脅"},{"start":11392.2,"end":11393.2,"text":"你不要指責別的事情"},{"start":11393.2,"end":11394.2,"text":"你樂不樂見這件事就好"},{"start":11394.2,"end":11395.2,"text":"這個是兩個層次的問題"},{"start":11395.2,"end":11396.2,"text":"因為剛剛賴世保委員很關心"},{"start":11396.2,"end":11397.2,"text":"說你這個尊重"},{"start":11397.2,"end":11398.2,"text":"到底是什麼意思呢"},{"start":11398.2,"end":11399.2,"text":"對吧"},{"start":11399.2,"end":11400.2,"text":"請我們去看一下"},{"start":11400.2,"end":11401.2,"text":"他那個文字嘛"},{"start":11401.2,"end":11404.2,"text":"就是日本社會對於這個問題"},{"start":11404.2,"end":11405.2,"text":"有不同意見嘛"},{"start":11405.2,"end":11406.2,"text":"你剛剛講過的話"},{"start":11406.2,"end":11407.2,"text":"就不用再說了"},{"start":11407.2,"end":11408.2,"text":"並不是說所謂尊重"},{"start":11408.2,"end":11409.2,"text":"是什麼參拜"},{"start":11409.2,"end":11410.2,"text":"這不可能"},{"start":11412.51,"end":11415.51,"text":"我不會陷入到所謂委員的這個"},{"start":11415.51,"end":11416.51,"text":"因為這個就是所謂"},{"start":11416.51,"end":11418.51,"text":"我們了解日本社會對這個問題"},{"start":11418.51,"end":11419.51,"text":"也是很分歧"},{"start":11419.51,"end":11421.51,"text":"那我再換一個事"},{"start":11421.51,"end":11422.51,"text":"我們有個立場"},{"start":11422.51,"end":11425.51,"text":"最近我們的主事代表李毅洋大使"},{"start":11425.51,"end":11426.51,"text":"對不對"},{"start":11426.51,"end":11427.51,"text":"長期這個事情"},{"start":11427.51,"end":11428.51,"text":"顯然是被矮化"},{"start":11428.51,"end":11429.51,"text":"你樂見這樣的事嗎"},{"start":11429.59,"end":11431.59,"text":"他是去廣島"},{"start":11431.59,"end":11434.59,"text":"所以其實我們受到不但被矮化"},{"start":11434.59,"end":11438.59,"text":"還幫我們視為同樣的使節團"},{"start":11438.59,"end":11439.59,"text":"這個表達肯定"},{"start":11439.59,"end":11442.59,"text":"因此長期在後面"},{"start":11442.59,"end":11443.59,"text":"那是由處長去"},{"start":11443.59,"end":11445.59,"text":"那是經理人道"},{"start":11445.59,"end":11446.59,"text":"然後的一個關懷"},{"start":11446.59,"end":11448.59,"text":"因為他基本上是一個和報"},{"start":11448.59,"end":11450.59,"text":"然後是一個和平的紀念日"},{"start":11450.59,"end":11452.59,"text":"所以我們基本上是"},{"start":11452.59,"end":11454.59,"text":"有很好的溝通的管道"},{"start":11454.59,"end":11457.59,"text":"所以我們不能把去年的情形"},{"start":11457.59,"end":11459.59,"text":"跟今年的把它混在一起"},{"start":11459.59,"end":11461.59,"text":"這個嚴正的抗議"},{"start":11461.59,"end":11462.59,"text":"降格出席"},{"start":11462.59,"end":11464.59,"text":"然後長期是任何還有所回應等等"},{"start":11464.59,"end":11466.59,"text":"這個看起來不是很友好的溝通"},{"start":11466.59,"end":11468.59,"text":"因為李毅洋大使的抗議"},{"start":11468.59,"end":11469.59,"text":"我是理解的"},{"start":11469.59,"end":11471.59,"text":"遇到矮化你當然要抗議"},{"start":11472.18,"end":11473.18,"text":"對不對"},{"start":11473.18,"end":11475.18,"text":"我覺得李毅洋大使可能把去年"},{"start":11475.18,"end":11477.18,"text":"跟今年的把它弄在一起"},{"start":11477.18,"end":11480.18,"text":"其實對方是有展現改善的誠意"},{"start":11480.18,"end":11482.18,"text":"但是我們不滿意"},{"start":11482.18,"end":11486.18,"text":"但是即使我們的外交處境很困難"},{"start":11486.18,"end":11488.18,"text":"我們還是要在參與中"},{"start":11488.18,"end":11489.18,"text":"來表達我們的立場"},{"start":11489.18,"end":11492.18,"text":"這就是台灣今天的問題就是說"},{"start":11492.18,"end":11493.18,"text":"我們不被承認"},{"start":11493.18,"end":11495.18,"text":"我們依然還是要自我承認"},{"start":11495.18,"end":11496.18,"text":"我現在要追問一下"},{"start":11496.18,"end":11499.18,"text":"你不可能每一件事情都得到"},{"start":11499.18,"end":11501.18,"text":"像我們有建交國家的對待"},{"start":11501.18,"end":11505.18,"text":"說我們跟日本其實是在東京很多的往來"},{"start":11505.18,"end":11508.18,"text":"也是在一個中間的地帶"},{"start":11508.18,"end":11509.18,"text":"你先聽我把話講"},{"start":11509.18,"end":11511.18,"text":"我是很擔心最近事態的一些發展"},{"start":11511.18,"end":11513.18,"text":"從它前面的一個化解"},{"start":11513.18,"end":11516.18,"text":"從這個看棒球事件的一些爭議跟爆料"},{"start":11516.18,"end":11518.18,"text":"跟你在過境的時候遇到一些風波"},{"start":11518.18,"end":11520.18,"text":"到長期的這件事情"},{"start":11520.18,"end":11523.18,"text":"這個日本恐怕受到不小的壓力"},{"start":11524.47,"end":11526.47,"text":"他們當然有來自中國的壓力"},{"start":11526.47,"end":11528.47,"text":"但跟台灣的關係還是非常友好"},{"start":11528.47,"end":11530.47,"text":"我們溝通管道也很暢順"},{"start":11530.47,"end":11532.47,"text":"我就要問外交部處理遇到"},{"start":11532.47,"end":11533.47,"text":"我們現在很清楚對不對"},{"start":11533.47,"end":11535.47,"text":"這大家都是了解事情的人"},{"start":11535.47,"end":11538.47,"text":"你現在手下這麼多外交界非常資深的"},{"start":11538.47,"end":11540.47,"text":"這些文武百官都非常清楚"},{"start":11540.47,"end":11542.47,"text":"他顯然是面對到很大的地緣的壓力"},{"start":11542.47,"end":11544.47,"text":"他面對到這樣的壓力的時候"},{"start":11544.47,"end":11545.47,"text":"我們是基於是好朋友"},{"start":11545.47,"end":11547.47,"text":"所以體諒以為難的困境"},{"start":11547.47,"end":11549.47,"text":"我們不要多做升溫"},{"start":11549.47,"end":11551.47,"text":"還是我們還是要堅持本來的原則"},{"start":11551.47,"end":11552.47,"text":"把話說清楚"},{"start":11552.47,"end":11554.47,"text":"有時候說的有些東西是用做的"},{"start":11554.47,"end":11556.47,"text":"外交的微妙之處就在這裡"},{"start":11556.47,"end":11559.47,"text":"說的多不代表就關係好"},{"start":11559.47,"end":11561.47,"text":"有時候做的多你要看實質"},{"start":11561.47,"end":11564.47,"text":"那因為我們要共同去面對中共的打壓"},{"start":11564.47,"end":11566.47,"text":"他不只打壓台灣也打壓日本"},{"start":11566.47,"end":11567.47,"text":"也打壓日本"},{"start":11567.47,"end":11568.47,"text":"我們當然要聯合起來"},{"start":11568.47,"end":11571.47,"text":"一起阻止中共改變現況"},{"start":11571.47,"end":11573.47,"text":"我現在看不出來有聯合的跡象"},{"start":11573.47,"end":11575.47,"text":"比如說以李洋大使這一段的抗議等等"},{"start":11575.47,"end":11576.47,"text":"反而是看到說"},{"start":11576.47,"end":11578.47,"text":"台日之間的關係顯然出現了摩擦"},{"start":11578.47,"end":11580.47,"text":"他的前半段在講的是"},{"start":11580.47,"end":11582.47,"text":"他去廣島受到了禮遇"},{"start":11582.47,"end":11586.47,"text":"跟其他的有邦交國家是一樣的"},{"start":11586.47,"end":11588.47,"text":"我是覺得你要看前半段"},{"start":11588.47,"end":11589.47,"text":"因為他去的是廣島"},{"start":11589.47,"end":11591.47,"text":"長期是由處長去"},{"start":11591.47,"end":11593.47,"text":"這個就是溝通過的"},{"start":11593.47,"end":11595.47,"text":"他如果只講前半段那也就算"},{"start":11595.47,"end":11597.47,"text":"他就是因為前面有抗議的動作"},{"start":11597.47,"end":11598.47,"text":"長期政府還回應說"},{"start":11598.47,"end":11600.47,"text":"這跟外務省也有關對不對"},{"start":11600.47,"end":11602.47,"text":"然後以前是你說要來的"},{"start":11602.47,"end":11605.47,"text":"有市政府層級辦的活動"},{"start":11605.47,"end":11607.47,"text":"市政府層級辦"},{"start":11607.47,"end":11608.47,"text":"我們在地方政府辦的時候"},{"start":11608.47,"end":11609.47,"text":"當然跟外交部也有關係"},{"start":11609.47,"end":11610.47,"text":"還是我們現在"},{"start":11610.47,"end":11611.47,"text":"為什麼兩個字會不一樣"},{"start":11611.47,"end":11613.47,"text":"會代表他們內部有不一樣的做法"},{"start":11613.47,"end":11616.47,"text":"我們要好的我們要肯定鼓勵"},{"start":11616.47,"end":11619.47,"text":"不好的我們就是說要表達"},{"start":11619.47,"end":11623.47,"text":"但是參與還是一個重點"},{"start":11623.47,"end":11625.47,"text":"我們不出席很多活動"},{"start":11625.47,"end":11626.47,"text":"我們就沒有發言權"},{"start":11626.47,"end":11628.47,"text":"你當然可以講很多的外交辭令"},{"start":11628.47,"end":11629.47,"text":"我們的處境就這麼困難"},{"start":11629.47,"end":11630.47,"text":"你看我們在亞裔"},{"start":11630.47,"end":11632.47,"text":"亞裔的改革我們還是抗議中"},{"start":11632.47,"end":11633.47,"text":"參加好幾十年"},{"start":11633.47,"end":11634.47,"text":"你說你可以說"},{"start":11634.47,"end":11636.47,"text":"要怎麼說怎麼說都可以"},{"start":11636.47,"end":11637.47,"text":"但我告訴你"},{"start":11637.47,"end":11638.47,"text":"我就提醒你而已"},{"start":11638.47,"end":11639.47,"text":"這個事情大家都在看"},{"start":11639.47,"end":11641.47,"text":"我想我們都很客觀很實評的"},{"start":11641.47,"end":11643.47,"text":"看這個事就是人家顯然受到壓力"},{"start":11643.47,"end":11644.47,"text":"可能會做一定的調整"},{"start":11644.47,"end":11646.47,"text":"你外交部要好好因應這件事情"},{"start":11646.47,"end":11648.47,"text":"你今天講我要體諒他"},{"start":11648.47,"end":11650.47,"text":"兩邊之間為止就很好的默契"},{"start":11650.47,"end":11651.47,"text":"我們表達不滿意"},{"start":11651.47,"end":11653.47,"text":"但不滿意的過程當中"},{"start":11653.47,"end":11655.47,"text":"我們依然可以適當的方式參與"},{"start":11655.47,"en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你就接到了"},{"start":11806.29,"end":11809.29,"text":"對我知道這個事情在媒體見光之後"},{"start":11809.29,"end":11811.29,"text":"他還去召集他下面人"},{"start":11811.29,"end":11813.29,"text":"然後開始一條一條對這個事情"},{"start":11813.29,"end":11814.29,"text":"你現在讓他回去"},{"start":11814.29,"end":11815.29,"text":"這不能夠干擾調查"},{"start":11815.29,"end":11816.29,"text":"如果有這個行為"},{"start":11816.29,"end":11820.29,"text":"有這個行為並列入調查的範圍"},{"start":11820.29,"end":11821.29,"text":"所以我現在就要問你"},{"start":11821.29,"end":11823.29,"text":"在這個調查期間你講兩個月"},{"start":11823.29,"end":11825.29,"text":"對不對被調查人被申訴人"},{"start":11825.29,"end":11828.29,"text":"有沒有暫停職務或調整職務的必要"},{"start":11828.29,"end":11829.29,"text":"要看他的情形"},{"start":11829.29,"end":11830.29,"text":"我們先把他調回"},{"start":11830.29,"end":11833.29,"text":"就是讓他不要在現場去影響這個調查"},{"start":11833.29,"end":11834.29,"text":"這個本席非常關心"},{"start":11834.29,"end":11837.29,"text":"你看這個速度都很快"},{"start":11837.29,"end":11839.29,"text":"馬上把他調回"},{"start":11839.29,"end":11840.29,"text":"所以你看繞了半天"},{"start":11840.29,"end":11842.29,"text":"這就是我問你問題的原因"},{"start":11842.29,"end":11843.29,"text":"你今天是這兩個月"},{"start":11843.29,"end":11844.29,"text":"他都要待在台灣接受調查"},{"start":11844.29,"end":11846.29,"text":"也避免他回去干擾調查"},{"start":11846.29,"end":11847.29,"text":"這是一種"},{"start":11847.29,"end":11848.29,"text":"或者是你這個時間"},{"start":11848.29,"end":11849.29,"text":"這兩個月是最長時間"},{"start":11849.29,"end":11851.29,"text":"我們可能可以加速"},{"start":11851.29,"end":11852.29,"text":"那你就告訴大家要"},{"start":11852.29,"end":11854.29,"text":"專業的調查專案小組"},{"start":11854.29,"end":11856.29,"text":"那你就告訴大家要留多久的時間"},{"start":11856.29,"end":11858.29,"text":"比如說你至少要留兩個禮拜三個禮拜"},{"start":11858.29,"end":11859.29,"text":"我要完成所有的什麼樣的事情"},{"start":11859.29,"end":11860.29,"text":"因為這個事情"},{"start":11860.29,"end":11863.29,"text":"他這個檢舉的內容非常的多"},{"start":11863.29,"end":11864.29,"text":"是阿"},{"start":11864.29,"end":11865.29,"text":"好多其他項目"},{"start":11865.29,"end":11867.29,"text":"有一些當事人包括李處長"},{"start":11867.29,"end":11869.29,"text":"他也都在說明不是如此"},{"start":11869.29,"end":11870.29,"text":"那我們必須兩照並程"},{"start":11870.29,"end":11872.29,"text":"互往互衝"},{"start":11872.29,"end":11873.29,"text":"所以我是覺得"},{"start":11873.29,"end":11875.29,"text":"站在這個調查前面"},{"start":11875.29,"end":11876.29,"text":"他也是一個基於"},{"start":11876.29,"end":11878.29,"text":"部長你剛剛有講說"},{"start":11878.29,"end":11879.29,"text":"可以讓他干擾調查對不對"},{"start":11879.29,"end":11880.29,"text":"不可以讓他干擾調查"},{"start":11880.29,"end":11882.29,"text":"所以相關的這個規定裡面"},{"start":11882.29,"end":11883.29,"text":"就有寫其實是可以"},{"start":11883.29,"end":11885.29,"text":"我們後續如果需要調查時間前"},{"start":11885.29,"end":11886.29,"text":"我們當然有代理制度"},{"start":11886.29,"end":11888.29,"text":"也有其他的發布"},{"start":11888.29,"end":11889.29,"text":"那你現在是啟動還是不啟動"},{"start":11889.29,"end":11890.29,"text":"什麼時候就走"},{"start":11890.29,"end":11891.29,"text":"現在就剛回來"},{"start":11891.29,"end":11892.29,"text":"馬上開會就知道"},{"start":11892.29,"end":11894.29,"text":"因為初步我想人事處都會"},{"start":11894.29,"end":11897.29,"text":"對這個事情是一定是非常關注"},{"start":11897.29,"end":11898.29,"text":"我們既然把他調回"},{"start":11898.29,"end":11900.29,"text":"就是希望加速調查"},{"start":11900.29,"end":11901.29,"text":"所以你繞了半天"},{"start":11901.29,"end":11902.29,"text":"你繞了半天你還是沒講"},{"start":11902.29,"end":11904.29,"text":"到底要不要暫停職務"},{"start":11904.29,"end":11905.29,"text":"還是你今天說"},{"start":11905.29,"end":11906.29,"text":"大家問完了"},{"start":11906.29,"end":11907.29,"text":"過了一個禮拜就放回去了"},{"start":11907.29,"end":11909.29,"text":"他就是已經影響我們外館的運作"},{"start":11909.29,"end":11911.29,"text":"他已經調回了"},{"start":11911.29,"end":11913.29,"text":"那我們現在是看這個時間"},{"start":11913.29,"end":11914.29,"text":"就是這個啟動專案"},{"start":11914.29,"end":11915.29,"text":"開第一次會"},{"start":11915.29,"end":11916.29,"text":"因為我們就已經立案"},{"start":11916.29,"end":11919.29,"text":"然後這個時間都早於媒體報導"},{"start":11919.29,"end":11920.29,"text":"這代表我們主動"},{"start":11920.29,"end":11921.29,"text":"要查辦這個事"},{"start":11921.29,"end":11922.29,"text":"所以你今天如果很清楚"},{"start":11922.29,"end":11924.29,"text":"就講說我要徹查到底"},{"start":11924.29,"end":11925.29,"text":"而且我要避免他干擾"},{"start":11925.29,"end":11927.29,"text":"你就講說在調查的時間內"},{"start":11927.29,"end":11928.29,"text":"給他退去就好了"},{"start":11928.29,"end":11929.29,"text":"我的態度跟立委一樣"},{"start":11929.29,"end":11930.29,"text":"只是我講話"},{"start":11930.29,"end":11931.29,"text":"我比較不會"},{"start":11931.29,"end":11932.29,"text":"那他到底會回去嗎"},{"start":11932.29,"end":11933.29,"text":"說那種比較好像就是"},{"start":11933.29,"end":11934.29,"text":"因為我們現在看到的訊息"},{"start":11934.29,"end":11936.29,"text":"是他回台接受調查"},{"start":11936.29,"end":11937.29,"text":"那他其實他怎麼做"},{"start":11937.29,"end":11938.29,"text":"你是假設性的問題"},{"start":11938.29,"end":11939.29,"text":"我們可能很快就把他調查"},{"start":11939.29,"end":11941.29,"text":"調查離親之前是不可能回去"},{"start":11941.29,"end":11942.29,"text":"因為你馬上就是"},{"start":11942.29,"end":11943.29,"text":"至少要把證據都弄完"},{"start":11943.29,"end":11944.29,"text":"不能來來去去"},{"start":11944.29,"end":11946.29,"text":"也不可能那麼多的時間"},{"start":11946.29,"end":11947.29,"text":"所以他現在還在國內"},{"start":119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剛剛我講的這個"},{"start":12029.62,"end":12030.62,"text":"馮光中"},{"start":12030.62,"end":12031.62,"text":"前面講的余大雷"},{"start":12031.62,"end":12032.62,"text":"羅昌發等等"},{"start":12032.62,"end":12034.62,"text":"都是因為住外嘛"},{"start":12034.62,"end":12035.62,"text":"天高黃地遠"},{"start":12035.62,"end":12036.62,"text":"對吧"},{"start":12036.62,"end":12037.62,"text":"所以他常常有一些"},{"start":12037.62,"end":12038.62,"text":"不太好的習慣"},{"start":12038.62,"end":12039.62,"text":"對不對"},{"start":12039.62,"end":12040.62,"text":"或者是不太乾淨的一些文化"},{"start":12040.62,"end":12041.62,"text":"我們從制度面的一個角度"},{"start":12041.62,"end":12043.62,"text":"外交部要如何徹底改善"},{"start":12043.62,"end":12045.62,"text":"這個公款可能被挪用的問題"},{"start":12047.09,"end":12049.09,"text":"這個公務員依法行政"},{"start":12049.09,"end":12051.09,"text":"如果有違法就要辦"},{"start":12051.09,"end":12053.09,"text":"那另外一個改善工作環境"},{"start":12053.09,"end":12055.09,"text":"讓大家其實"},{"start":12055.09,"end":12057.09,"text":"這個我們不能為外館"},{"start":12057.09,"end":12059.09,"text":"因為在就是說"},{"start":12059.09,"end":12061.09,"text":"去做任何理化"},{"start":12061.09,"end":12063.09,"text":"包括現在對於罷齡"},{"start":12063.09,"end":12064.09,"text":"性侵"},{"start":12064.09,"end":12066.09,"text":"這些都是新的法律規定"},{"start":12066.09,"end":12067.09,"text":"很嚴格的"},{"start":12067.09,"end":12068.09,"text":"我們要教育"},{"start":12068.09,"end":12070.09,"text":"另外就是要讓他可以"},{"start":12070.09,"end":12071.09,"text":"就是說申訴"},{"start":12071.09,"end":12072.09,"text":"那其他其實是"},{"start":12072.09,"end":12074.09,"text":"做工作環境的改善"},{"start":12074.09,"end":12076.09,"text":"把那些不太好的文化"},{"start":12076.09,"end":12077.09,"text":"因為外館"},{"start":12077.09,"end":12078.09,"text":"我們不能夠去合理化"},{"start":12078.09,"end":12080.09,"text":"但是外館確實是在"},{"start":12080.09,"end":12082.09,"text":"很大的一種內外的壓力之下"},{"start":12082.09,"end":12083.09,"text":"在工作"},{"start":12083.09,"end":12085.09,"text":"那怎麼樣館長能夠以身作則"},{"start":12085.09,"end":12086.09,"text":"創造一個好的工作環境"},{"start":12086.09,"end":12087.09,"text":"這個才是資本之道"},{"start":12087.09,"end":12088.09,"text":"基本上"},{"start":12088.09,"end":12089.09,"text":"這個本席對於你"},{"start":12089.09,"end":12090.09,"text":"對外管處的這些預算"},{"start":12090.09,"end":12092.09,"text":"我們原則上都會"},{"start":12092.09,"end":12093.09,"text":"大家都知道派駐是一件"},{"start":12093.09,"end":12094.09,"text":"很辛苦的事情"},{"start":12094.09,"end":12095.09,"text":"我從來不多加為難"},{"start":12095.09,"end":12096.09,"text":"但是"},{"start":12096.09,"end":12098.09,"text":"如果立法院作為把關的機關"},{"start":12098.09,"end":12099.09,"text":"都不多加為難"},{"start":12099.09,"end":12100.09,"text":"因為我們大家體恤"},{"start":12100.09,"end":12101.09,"text":"這個公務人員的辛勞"},{"start":12101.09,"end":12102.09,"text":"外交人員的辛勞"},{"start":12102.09,"end":12103.09,"text":"都不把關"},{"start":12103.09,"end":12105.09,"text":"但是你的內控機制不好的話"},{"start":12105.09,"end":12107.09,"text":"我們要怎麼跟國人大眾交代呢"},{"start":12107.09,"end":12109.09,"text":"所以本席建議外交部"},{"start":12109.09,"end":12112.09,"text":"你針對相關管處的經費"},{"start":12112.09,"end":12113.09,"text":"你至少內控機制"},{"start":12113.09,"end":12115.09,"text":"你要怎麼樣要變嚴格"},{"start":12115.09,"end":12116.09,"text":"你總做得到吧"},{"start":12116.09,"end":12117.09,"text":"以前常常講"},{"start":12117.09,"end":12118.09,"text":"天空皇帝人"},{"start":12118.09,"end":12119.09,"text":"我就做一本準一本"},{"start":12119.09,"end":12120.09,"text":"所以它核銷量很方便"},{"start":12120.09,"end":12121.09,"text":"所以奇奇怪怪的東西"},{"start":12121.09,"end":12122.09,"text":"就跑出來"},{"start":12122.09,"end":12123.09,"text":"問題就出在這裡"},{"start":12123.09,"end":12124.09,"text":"那你的內控機制"},{"start":12124.09,"end":12125.09,"text":"要如何做改善呢"},{"start":12125.09,"end":12127.09,"text":"你外部就研議一下"},{"start":12127.09,"end":12128.09,"text":"研議一下"},{"start":12128.09,"end":12129.09,"text":"你的人事會計等等"},{"start":12129.09,"end":12131.09,"text":"一些單位外管裡面討論一下"},{"start":12131.09,"end":12132.09,"text":"怎麼樣加強這個內控的機制"},{"start":12132.09,"end":12133.09,"text":"你要給立法院"},{"start":12133.09,"end":12134.09,"text":"國外外交委員一些交代"},{"start":12134.09,"end":12135.09,"text":"好不好 部長"},{"start":12135.09,"end":12136.09,"text":"我給你一點時間"},{"start":12136.09,"end":12137.09,"text":"這個一方面"},{"start":12137.09,"end":12138.09,"text":"李冠德案子你當然要徹查"},{"start":12138.09,"end":12140.09,"text":"而且你要保證他不能干涉調查"},{"start":12140.09,"end":12142.09,"text":"第二相關的內控機制"},{"start":12142.09,"end":12144.09,"text":"請你對外宣示兩個月"},{"start":12144.09,"end":12146.09,"text":"兩個月之後請你一併跟國人大眾說明"},{"start":12146.09,"end":12147.09,"text":"可以嗎"},{"start":12147.09,"end":12148.09,"text":"對 我們會加速"},{"start":12148.09,"end":12149.09,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":12149.09,"end":12150.09,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":12152.76,"end":12155.76,"text":"好 接下來請楊瓊英委員上台諮詢"},{"start":12165.05,"end":12166.05,"text":"楊瓊英發言"},{"start":12166.05,"end":12167.05,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":12167.05,"end":12168.05,"text":"邀請部長"},{"start":12168.05,"end":12169.05,"text":"請林部長"},{"start":12178.67,"end":12179.67,"text":"部長好"},{"start":12179.67,"end":12180.67,"text":"我也好"},{"start":12180.67,"end":12181.67,"text":"好"},{"start":12181.17,"end":12183.17,"text":"延續剛剛的議題"},{"start":12183.17,"end":12185.17,"text":"我們大家在國外的時候"},{"start":12185.17,"end":12187.17,"text":"都可以感觸到"},{"start":12187.97,"end":12189.97,"text":"派駐外館的同仁很辛苦"},{"start":12191.76,"end":12193.76,"text":"今天發生了這樣的事情"},{"start":12194.4,"end":12196.4,"text":"也表示我們對外交部"},{"start":12197.38,"end":12199.38,"text":"有改進精進的空間"},{"start":12200.66,"end":12201.66,"text":"我們當然不希望"},{"start":12203.54,"end":12206.54,"text":"這個不法的行為去影響整個"},{"start":12206.54,"end":12208.54,"text":"外交部的形象"},{"start":12208.54,"end":12211.54,"text":"跟外館同仁的辛苦的一個抹殺"},{"start":12211.54,"end":12215.54,"text":"尤其外館在每一個國家五大州裡頭"},{"start":12215.54,"end":12218.54,"text":"他因為他的物價指數也好"},{"start":12218.54,"end":12219.54,"text":"更相關"},{"start":12220.53,"end":12221.53,"text":"那麼"},{"start":12221.85,"end":12224.85,"text":"每一個國家的情況不一樣"},{"start":12224.85,"end":12226.85,"text":"我在這邊具體建議你"},{"start":12226.85,"end":12228.85,"text":"部長你應該擇其專案"},{"start":12229.01,"end":12232.01,"text":"每一個五大州的一個樣態"},{"start":12232.25,"end":12234.25,"text":"你如果是一事"},{"start":12234.47,"end":12237.47,"text":"的一個補助方式協助方式"},{"start":12237.47,"end":12240.47,"text":"那當然會有這些不法的事情發生"},{"start":12240.47,"end":12242.47,"text":"當然不法是絕對不行"},{"start":12242.47,"end":12245.47,"text":"公務人員一定要依法來做"},{"start":12245.47,"end":12247.47,"text":"不管你在哪一個情境上面"},{"start":12247.47,"end":12249.47,"text":"但是明明白白"},{"start":12249.47,"end":12251.47,"text":"有這樣子的一個漏洞"},{"start":12252.34,"end":12253.34,"text":"事情展示"},{"start":12254.08,"end":12256.08,"text":"那在這樣子國人都非常的關心"},{"start":12256.08,"end":12258.08,"text":"大家也知道外館的人員很辛苦"},{"start":12258.79,"end":12260.79,"text":"甚至連他們防護的租金"},{"start":12260.79,"end":12262.79,"text":"他自己還要再貼"},{"start":12263.01,"end":12265.01,"text":"在這樣的情況之下"},{"start":12265.01,"end":12267.01,"text":"又發生這樣的一個"},{"start":12266.33,"end":12268.33,"text":"一事的這樣子的一個事件"},{"start":12269.15,"end":12270.15,"text":"您身為部長"},{"start":12270.15,"end":12271.15,"text":"你覺得"},{"start":12272.22,"end":12274.22,"text":"你的立場要怎麼做"},{"start":12274.26,"end":12275.26,"text":"要怎麼樣去清淨"},{"start":12277.26,"end":12278.26,"text":"報告委員"},{"start":12278.26,"end":12279.26,"text":"當然對同仁的工作環境"},{"start":12279.26,"end":12281.26,"text":"有物質的也有精神面的"},{"start":12281.26,"end":12283.26,"text":"在他們的"},{"start":12283.26,"end":12284.26,"text":"比如說剛講的"},{"start":12284.26,"end":12286.26,"text":"因為物價"},{"start":12286.26,"end":12288.26,"text":"升高"},{"start":12288.26,"end":12290.26,"text":"他們整個包括"},{"start":12290.26,"end":12291.26,"text":"住的問題"},{"start":12291.26,"end":12293.26,"text":"我們怎樣進行"},{"start":12293.26,"end":12295.26,"text":"房屋的補貼是符合物價"},{"start":12295.26,"end":12296.26,"text":"的調升"},{"start":12296.26,"end":12297.26,"text":"然後地利加急"},{"start":12297.26,"end":12299.26,"text":"有些地方真的工作的"},{"start":12299.26,"end":12301.26,"text":"負擔特別重"},{"start":12301.26,"end":12303.26,"text":"我們還是要有點差異化"},{"start":12303.26,"end":12304.26,"text":"那再來當然"},{"start":12304.26,"end":12305.26,"text":"我想對一個外交官"},{"start":12305.26,"end":12307.26,"text":"他關心的是他的家人"},{"start":12307.26,"end":12309.26,"text":"包括孩子的教育"},{"start":12309.26,"end":12310.26,"text":"這一些我們國家"},{"start":12310.26,"end":12311.26,"text":"現在都有很多福利"},{"start":12311.26,"end":12313.26,"text":"我們也希望適用在"},{"start":12313.26,"end":12314.26,"text":"我們的外交官"},{"start":12314.26,"end":12315.26,"text":"比如說"},{"start":12315.26,"end":12317.26,"text":"這個教育的"},{"start":12317.26,"end":12319.26,"text":"只理這個補貼"},{"start":12319.26,"end":12322.26,"text":"另外當然有涉及到一些像健保等等"},{"start":12322.26,"end":12323.26,"text":"那也很感謝"},{"start":12323.26,"end":12325.26,"text":"我想包括總統院長"},{"start":12325.26,"end":12328.26,"text":"還有大院的支持"},{"start":12328.26,"end":12330.26,"text":"我們在預算上是有反應"},{"start":12330.26,"end":12333.26,"text":"再包括這個所謂的"},{"start":12333.26,"end":12334.26,"text":"地利加急"},{"start":12334.26,"end":12335.26,"text":"房屋補貼"},{"start":12335.26,"end":12336.26,"text":"兒女教育"},{"start":12336.26,"end":12337.26,"text":"還有健保"},{"start":12337.26,"end":12338.26,"text":"還有其他的"},{"start":12339.06,"end":12341.06,"text":"這些福利跟權益上面"},{"start":12341.06,"end":12343.06,"text":"這個是物質面"},{"start":12343.06,"end":12345.06,"text":"另外就是改善工作環境"},{"start":12345.06,"end":12347.06,"text":"知道為何而戰為誰而戰"},{"start":12347.06,"end":12349.06,"text":"我們台灣我們現在總和外交"},{"start":12349.06,"end":12351.06,"text":"三連戰略龍幫計畫"},{"start":12351.06,"end":12353.06,"text":"都讓我們的外交官"},{"start":12353.06,"end":12354.06,"text":"更清楚的願景"},{"start":12354.06,"end":12356.06,"text":"也讓他們可以整合跨部會"},{"start":12356.06,"end":12358.06,"text":"甚至民間的支援"},{"start":12358.06,"end":12360.06,"text":"所以大家是比較有成就感"},{"start":12360.06,"end":12361.06,"text":"比如說我去歐洲"},{"start":12361.06,"end":12362.06,"text":"我很清楚"},{"start":12362.06,"end":12363.06,"text":"我開區域會報"},{"start":12363.06,"end":12365.06,"text":"那我可以走遍G7"},{"start":12365.06,"end":12366.06,"text":"那同仁的士氣會好"},{"start":12366.06,"end":12368.06,"text":"因為他看到部長可以走出去"},{"start":12368.06,"end":12370.06,"text":"那你看我們的投資"},{"start":12370.06,"end":12373.06,"text":"包括在美國日本歐洲"},{"start":12373.06,"end":12376.06,"text":"這個當然增加我們外交的籌碼"},{"start":12376.06,"end":12377.06,"text":"我們也在善用"},{"start":12377.06,"end":12380.06,"text":"因為這個政府跟民間的公私協力"},{"start":12380.06,"end":12381.06,"text":"也是非常重要"},{"start":12381.06,"end":12382.06,"text":"不可能靠政府"},{"start":12384.26,"end":12386.26,"text":"跟精神"},{"start":12386.26,"end":12387.26,"text":"你回答了這麼多"},{"start":12387.26,"end":12389.26,"text":"我之所以願意給你講這麼多"},{"start":12389.26,"end":12390.26,"text":"也就是你知道"},{"start":12391.48,"end":12392.48,"text":"在外館的同仁"},{"start":12392.48,"end":12393.48,"text":"尤其是女性"},{"start":12394.09,"end":12395.09,"text":"他在居住的時候"},{"start":12396.05,"end":12398.05,"text":"他因為他物價指數漲得不得了"},{"start":12398.85,"end":12399.85,"text":"甚至連房租啊"},{"start":12399.85,"end":12401.85,"text":"他倍增三倍增"},{"start":12401.85,"end":12404.85,"text":"所以他必須要越住越郊外"},{"start":12404.85,"end":12405.85,"text":"所以他安全"},{"start":12405.85,"end":12408.85,"text":"這個我已經看到一個問題的關鍵"},{"start":12408.85,"end":12410.85,"text":"就是時間拖長之外"},{"start":12410.85,"end":12412.85,"text":"交通往後的安全問題"},{"start":12412.85,"end":12413.85,"text":"在這個議題裡頭"},{"start":12413.85,"end":12415.85,"text":"你講了那麼多"},{"start":12415.85,"end":12418.85,"text":"也就是知道你還有很大的進進空間"},{"start":12418.85,"end":12420.85,"text":"一方面防弊"},{"start":12421.52,"end":12423.52,"text":"二方面讓我們的外館人員"},{"start":12423.52,"end":12426.52,"text":"怎麼樣可以安心公平"},{"start":12427.97,"end":12428.97,"text":"這個是非常重要"},{"start":12428.97,"end":12430.97,"text":"你把你的經營方案給本席"},{"start":12430.97,"end":12432.97,"text":"接下來我要跟你討論的是"},{"start":12432.97,"end":12434.97,"text":"青年國際化"},{"start":12434.97,"end":12435.97,"text":"我認為青年國際化"},{"start":12435.97,"end":12437.97,"text":"他不是說你只有帶他出國一次"},{"start":12437.97,"end":12440.97,"text":"那交了一個報告回來就結案了"},{"start":12440.97,"end":12442.97,"text":"他應該不是如此吧"},{"start":12442.97,"end":12446.97,"text":"所以因此我也要特別針對今年"},{"start":12446.97,"end":12449.97,"text":"我們的這個國際青年大使的計畫"},{"start":12449.97,"end":12452.97,"text":"六百個人來應徵"},{"start":12452.97,"end":12453.97,"text":"五十個通過"},{"start":12453.97,"end":12455.97,"text":"那這五十個通過呢"},{"start":12455.97,"end":12457.97,"text":"還有增加首次十名的"},{"start":12457.97,"end":12460.97,"text":"科技應用組的這個青年大使"},{"start":12460.97,"end":12463.97,"text":"那這表示青年非常的希望能夠參加"},{"start":12463.97,"end":12466.97,"text":"非常希望參加"},{"start":12466.97,"end":12468.97,"text":"所以你整個外交部"},{"start":12468.97,"end":12470.97,"text":"在青年外交的部分"},{"start":12470.97,"end":12472.97,"text":"你的成功指標是什麼"},{"start":12473.95,"end":12474.95,"text":"好 報告委員"},{"start":12474.95,"end":12476.95,"text":"當然我們經過過去挑選"},{"start":12476.95,"end":12478.95,"text":"是為了比如說"},{"start":12478.95,"end":12480.95,"text":"語言人力的才藝專長"},{"start":12480.95,"end":12482.95,"text":"但現在多元取材之後"},{"start":12482.95,"end":12484.95,"text":"我們讓他去對接對方"},{"start":12484.95,"end":12485.95,"text":"那這個就是"},{"start":12487.7,"end":12489.7,"text":"這樣青年早一點有國際經驗"},{"start":12489.7,"end":12490.7,"text":"對他一生影響很大"},{"start":12490.7,"end":12492.7,"text":"他也可能會未來持續去關心"},{"start":12492.7,"end":12494.7,"text":"跟參與這個外交"},{"start":12494.7,"end":12495.7,"text":"那以剛剛講這個所謂"},{"start":12495.7,"end":12497.7,"text":"科技應用組就是無人機"},{"start":12497.7,"end":12499.7,"text":"那這個台灣有很多的這些"},{"start":12499.7,"end":12501.7,"text":"請針對本席的提問"},{"start":12501.7,"end":12505.7,"text":"青年外交你的成效指標是什麼"},{"start":12505.7,"end":12507.7,"text":"有量有值嘛"},{"start":12507.7,"end":12508.7,"text":"數量跟這個"},{"start":12508.7,"end":12510.7,"text":"我們的這個值的指標都有"},{"start":12512.62,"end":12515.62,"text":"第一個人數我們已經報告上有了嘛"},{"start":12515.62,"end":12516.62,"text":"至於說他的"},{"start":12516.62,"end":12517.62,"text":"請教"},{"start":12517.62,"end":12519.62,"text":"青年外交你的成效指標"},{"start":12519.62,"end":12520.62,"text":"到底是什麼"},{"start":12520.93,"end":12522.93,"text":"我們可以做個調研嘛"},{"start":12522.93,"end":12524.93,"text":"比如說我們針對現在成立這些"},{"start":12524.93,"end":12527.93,"text":"這個國際青年大使"},{"start":12527.93,"end":12528.93,"text":"我舉個例子"},{"start":12528.93,"end":12532.93,"text":"我們那個農業青年大使的效果都非常好"},{"start":12532.93,"end":12534.93,"text":"他們包括到馬來西亞到澳洲"},{"start":12534.93,"end":12538.93,"text":"去交流展現台灣的青龍的"},{"start":12538.93,"end":12540.93,"text":"這個真的是很棒"},{"start":12540.93,"end":12542.93,"text":"我們認為因為你身為部長"},{"start":12542.93,"end":12544.93,"text":"我們的成效指標很重要"},{"start":12544.93,"end":12545.93,"text":"雖然現在講不清楚"},{"start":12545.93,"end":12548.93,"text":"沒關係你事後書面資料給本席"},{"start":12548.93,"end":12551.93,"text":"你的成效指標到底是什麼"},{"start":12551.93,"end":12553.93,"text":"那因為我們要看的"},{"start":12553.93,"end":12556.93,"text":"不是說你出訪的次數或者是人數"},{"start":12556.93,"end":12557.93,"text":"對"},{"start":12557.93,"end":12559.93,"text":"應該是要看他出訪之後你產生"},{"start":12559.93,"end":12562.93,"text":"多少的實質外交的成果"},{"start":12562.93,"end":12564.93,"text":"比如說青年返國之後"},{"start":12564.93,"end":12566.93,"text":"有多少人他繼續"},{"start":12566.93,"end":12568.93,"text":"他成為國際的NGO"},{"start":12568.93,"end":12570.93,"text":"比如說他是國際"},{"start":12570.93,"end":12572.93,"text":"參與了國際的組織"},{"start":12572.93,"end":12574.93,"text":"外交相關的專業人才"},{"start":12574.93,"end":12576.93,"text":"以及有多少人你持續"},{"start":12576.93,"end":12580.93,"text":"在外交體系裡頭相關類別裡頭"},{"start":12580.93,"end":12582.93,"text":"去參與了國際交流"},{"start":12582.93,"end":12585.93,"text":"以及參與了國際的宣導"},{"start":12586.55,"end":12589.55,"text":"那有沒有跟當地的這個青年"},{"start":12589.55,"end":12591.55,"text":"成為長期的合作"},{"start":12591.55,"end":12595.55,"text":"以及最後將這些的經驗跟經歷"},{"start":12595.55,"end":12600.55,"text":"轉化為教育科技文化的一個實質交流"},{"start":12600.55,"end":12603.55,"text":"這個才是我們有要的啊"},{"start":12603.55,"end":12605.55,"text":"你有沒有量化的去追蹤啊"},{"start":12605.55,"end":12606.55,"text":"這些成效"},{"start":12606.55,"end":12607.55,"text":"是"},{"start":12607.55,"end":12608.55,"text":"量化是有啦"},{"start":12608.55,"end":12610.55,"text":"質化我們要再努力"},{"start":12611.49,"end":12614.49,"text":"量化的數字這個都可以找得到"},{"start":12614.49,"end":12617.49,"text":"但是質化的這個衡量"},{"start":12617.49,"end":12619.49,"text":"因為其實年輕人出國的時候"},{"start":12619.49,"end":12622.49,"text":"可能在他心中種下一個種子"},{"start":12622.49,"end":12624.49,"text":"因為影響是需要時間的"},{"start":12624.49,"end":12626.49,"text":"請你本期再講的時候"},{"start":12626.49,"end":12628.49,"text":"提問的時候你就待會再讓你講"},{"start":12629.82,"end":12633.82,"text":"那麼你應該要有你的量化的一個追蹤啊"},{"start":12633.82,"end":12635.82,"text":"你沒有這些成效"},{"start":12635.82,"end":12636.82,"text":"難怪你"},{"start":12636.82,"end":12637.82,"text":"有啦我們在提供給委員"},{"start":12637.82,"end":12638.82,"text":"量化是有啦"},{"start":12638.82,"end":12640.82,"text":"你的成效目標是打不出來的啊"},{"start":12640.82,"end":12642.82,"text":"真正的質化是需要真的長期觀察"},{"start":12644.59,"end":12645.59,"text":"我們會做一個調查"},{"start":12645.59,"end":12646.59,"text":"去追蹤"},{"start":12646.59,"end":12647.59,"text":"經過委員這樣的建議"},{"start":12647.59,"end":12650.59,"text":"我們來好好系統性的來去評估"},{"start":12650.59,"end":12651.59,"text":"感謝"},{"start":12651.59,"end":12652.59,"text":"這些成效"},{"start":12652.59,"end":12653.59,"text":"再給委員來指教"},{"start":12653.59,"end":12655.59,"text":"所以你願意改進願意精進"},{"start":12655.59,"end":12658.59,"text":"本期也希望得到你的方案"},{"start":12658.59,"end":12662.59,"text":"所以我們認為出國前的培訓海外的交流"},{"start":12662.59,"end":12664.59,"text":"以及你回國後的追蹤"},{"start":12664.59,"end":12667.59,"text":"國際合作的媒體"},{"start":12667.59,"end":12670.59,"text":"青年外交人才庫這一系列"},{"start":12670.59,"end":12674.59,"text":"你才能夠真正的去達成你的成效目標嘛"},{"start":12674.59,"end":12675.59,"text":"是不是"},{"start":12675.59,"end":12676.59,"text":"是"},{"start":12676.59,"end":12677.59,"text":"是那就要做好不好"},{"start":12677.59,"end":12678.59,"text":"我們來"},{"start":12678.59,"end":12679.59,"text":"你把你的方案提出來"},{"start":12679.59,"end":12680.59,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":12680.59,"end":12681.59,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":12681.59,"end":12682.59,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":12682.59,"end":12683.59,"text":"謝謝楊委員"},{"start":12687.94,"end":12688.94,"text":"好"},{"start":12688.94,"end":12690.94,"text":"接下來請蘇清泉委員"},{"start":12690.94,"end":12692.94,"text":"蘇清泉蘇清泉委員不在"},{"start":12692.94,"end":12694.94,"text":"請葉源之葉源之葉源之委員不在"},{"start":12694.94,"end":12696.94,"text":"請羅美齡委員上台質詢"},{"start":12704.78,"end":12705.78,"text":"謝謝主席"},{"start":12705.78,"end":12708.78,"text":"有請僑委會徐家清委員長"},{"start":12708.78,"end":12709.78,"text":"請徐委員長"},{"start":12715.7,"end":12716.7,"text":"歐美女孩"},{"start":12717.23,"end":12720.23,"text":"委員長這段時間辛苦了"},{"start":12720.23,"end":12721.23,"text":"謝謝"},{"start":12721.23,"end":12724.23,"text":"我沒有看到其實前陣子"},{"start":12724.23,"end":12727.23,"text":"委員長應該是非常的困擾"},{"start":12727.23,"end":12731.23,"text":"面對一些不實留言的指控"},{"start":12731.23,"end":12734.23,"text":"那當然我們有看到現在各界"},{"start":12734.23,"end":12737.23,"text":"像這個全美台灣同鄉會"},{"start":12737.23,"end":12739.23,"text":"還有我們也看到美洲"},{"start":12739.23,"end":12742.23,"text":"歐洲甚至東南亞的一些橋界"},{"start":12742.23,"end":12747.23,"text":"都對委員長受到這些不實的指控"},{"start":12747.23,"end":12750.23,"text":"都提出了非常嚴重的抗議"},{"start":12750.23,"end":12753.23,"text":"那我有看到全美台灣同鄉會有提到"},{"start":12753.23,"end":12754.23,"text":"就是說僑務工作"},{"start":12754.23,"end":12756.23,"text":"不是外界所想像的那樣"},{"start":12756.23,"end":12758.23,"text":"就是說撿個彩拉或者是說"},{"start":12758.23,"end":12761.23,"text":"這個詞其實真正的僑務工作"},{"start":12761.23,"end":12763.23,"text":"它是要服務這個僑民"},{"start":12763.23,"end":12766.23,"text":"還有就是要肩負台灣的惡鬼"},{"start":12766.23,"end":12767.23,"text":"外交等等"},{"start":12767.23,"end":12768.23,"text":"絕對不是說"},{"start":12768.23,"end":12770.23,"text":"跟著出去吃了一點甜點"},{"start":12770.23,"end":12773.23,"text":"然後就認為僑委會沒有在做事情"},{"start":12773.23,"end":12777.23,"text":"其實如果有跟過委員長的這個行程"},{"start":12777.23,"end":12780.23,"text":"大家都知道說這是鐵人行程"},{"start":12780.23,"end":12783.23,"text":"連一點喘息的這個時間都沒有"},{"start":12783.23,"end":12784.23,"text":"所以我在這裡"},{"start":12784.23,"end":12786.23,"text":"我在想委員長應該這陣子"},{"start":12786.23,"end":12788.23,"text":"有很多話要說"},{"start":12788.9,"end":12790.9,"text":"我想希望就是說委員長這個時候"},{"start":12790.9,"end":12793.9,"text":"應該也替僑委會說個話"},{"start":12793.9,"end":12795.9,"text":"到底僑委會的工作是什麼"},{"start":12795.9,"end":12797.9,"text":"就只有吃甜點看電影嗎"},{"start":12797.9,"end":12799.9,"text":"我想委員長應該這陣子"},{"start":12799.9,"end":12802.9,"text":"謝謝委員給我這個機會"},{"start":12802.9,"end":12805.9,"text":"事實上我覺得我們住在同仁比我更辛苦"},{"start":12805.9,"end":12807.9,"text":"因為我雖然每一次到訪"},{"start":12807.9,"end":12810.9,"text":"有時候沒有從台北帶同仁"},{"start":12810.9,"end":12813.9,"text":"過去也很多委員長也是基於尊爵預算"},{"start":12813.9,"end":12815.9,"text":"常常一個人獨行的狀況也有"},{"start":12815.9,"end":12817.9,"text":"那偶爾也有帶一個人帶兩個人"},{"start":12817.9,"end":12819.9,"text":"那過去這幾年在疫情後"},{"start":12819.9,"end":12822.9,"text":"因為全球的機票都變很貴"},{"start":12822.9,"end":12824.9,"text":"加上各種變數很大"},{"start":12824.9,"end":12826.9,"text":"有時候我們到了某一些地方"},{"start":12826.9,"end":12828.9,"text":"臨時機票被cancel"},{"start":12828.9,"end":12830.9,"text":"或者是飛機嚴重delay"},{"start":12830.9,"end":12833.9,"text":"或者是發生什麼天候因素影響等等"},{"start":12833.9,"end":12834.9,"text":"我們就都不能起飛"},{"start":12834.9,"end":12836.9,"text":"然後再k一張新的機票"},{"start":12836.9,"end":12839.9,"text":"我可以上得了機同仁卻上不了機"},{"start":12839.9,"end":12842.9,"text":"所以已經發生過太多的這種意外"},{"start":12842.9,"end":12844.9,"text":"所以後面我們就基於這樣的狀態"},{"start":12844.9,"end":12845.9,"text":"後來都說好"},{"start":12845.9,"end":12847.9,"text":"那就盡量讓local people"},{"start":12847.9,"end":12849.9,"text":"也是我們派駐在海外的同仁"},{"start":12849.9,"end":12853.9,"text":"即便我們僑委會是有派42個點"},{"start":12853.9,"end":12855.9,"text":"但是我們全球有111個"},{"start":12855.9,"end":12857.9,"text":"我們外交部所派駐的管處"},{"start":12857.9,"end":12860.9,"text":"很多的外交同仁也是在積極的協助我們"},{"start":12860.9,"end":12863.9,"text":"執行我們沒有派點的地方"},{"start":12863.9,"end":12865.9,"text":"所以我對他們的辛苦我都非常感謝"},{"start":12865.9,"end":12870.9,"text":"很多的工作並不是那麼大家想的容易"},{"start":12870.9,"end":12872.9,"text":"比方說我們很多的僑區"},{"start":12872.9,"end":12874.9,"text":"事實上大家居住都非常分散"},{"start":12874.9,"end":12878.9,"text":"那如果是在平常非上班日的話"},{"start":12878.9,"end":12880.9,"text":"還好大家還可以聚集在一起"},{"start":12880.9,"end":12883.9,"text":"如果在上班日他還要繼續工作"},{"start":12883.9,"end":12886.9,"text":"我們根本有時候很難把他請到"},{"start":12886.9,"end":12889.9,"text":"說我所在的那個城市"},{"start":12889.9,"end":12892.9,"text":"所以常常有些時候是一半一半"},{"start":12892.9,"end":12894.9,"text":"又要有實體又要有線上"},{"start":12894.9,"end":12896.9,"text":"我經常在這個行程當中"},{"start":12896.9,"end":12899.9,"text":"這個會議是這樣子雙軌在進行的"},{"start":12899.9,"end":12901.9,"text":"有些人他不能實體來參加"},{"start":12901.9,"end":12903.9,"text":"我們就同時開線上的"},{"start":12903.9,"end":12905.9,"text":"那有些人可以實體來參加"},{"start":12905.9,"end":12907.9,"text":"我們現場就進行說明"},{"start":12907.9,"end":12909.9,"text":"但是要setting要做這些聯絡"},{"start":12909.9,"end":12913.9,"text":"都是我到以前我們所有的僑務同仁"},{"start":12913.9,"end":12914.9,"text":"或外交部同仁"},{"start":12914.9,"end":12917.9,"text":"就要積極去幫我們做這樣子的聯繫工作"},{"start":12917.9,"end":12919.9,"text":"所以我雖然是一個人跑"},{"start":12919.9,"end":12920.9,"text":"但事實上所有的行程"},{"start":12920.9,"end":12923.9,"text":"都是由我們在地的僑務秘書"},{"start":12923.9,"end":12925.9,"text":"或是我們外交部同仁在陪同"},{"start":12925.9,"end":12929.9,"text":"很多的工作不是一個人單獨可以完成"},{"start":12929.9,"end":12931.9,"text":"所以我個人雖然說"},{"start":12931.9,"end":12933.9,"text":"飛來飛去很辛苦沒錯"},{"start":12933.9,"end":12935.9,"text":"但是我覺得我們住外同仁是更辛苦"},{"start":12935.9,"end":12937.9,"text":"剛剛楊委員也特別提到"},{"start":12937.9,"end":12939.9,"text":"我們有過去幾年因為"},{"start":12939.9,"end":12944.9,"text":"在歐美國家物價真的嚴重上漲"},{"start":12944.9,"end":12947.9,"text":"我都還記得我疫情後那兩年"},{"start":12947.9,"end":12949.9,"text":"我每次出一次差"},{"start":12949.9,"end":12951.9,"text":"我每次要倒貼一次錢"},{"start":12951.9,"end":12953.9,"text":"所以大家以為我日資費領很多"},{"start":12953.9,"end":12956.9,"text":"殊不知那時候的旅館費是高很多"},{"start":12956.9,"end":12959.9,"text":"所以後來外交部也知道現實狀況"},{"start":12959.9,"end":12961.9,"text":"所以我開始積極做調整"},{"start":12961.9,"end":12964.9,"text":"但是再怎麼調海外很多國家的物價"},{"start":12965.73,"end":12969.73,"text":"這個指數的上漲速度總是比台灣快很多"},{"start":12969.73,"end":12970.73,"text":"所以在這樣的狀況下"},{"start":12970.73,"end":12974.73,"text":"我真的很不忍心我們的同仁確實是"},{"start":12974.73,"end":12978.73,"text":"在他們所能夠拿到的防補預算裡面"},{"start":12978.73,"end":12980.73,"text":"他只能住越來越遠的地方"},{"start":12980.73,"end":12982.73,"text":"然後開車要開越來越久"},{"start":12982.73,"end":12986.73,"text":"確實有我們覺得擔心的問題就是安全"},{"start":12986.73,"end":12988.73,"text":"所以類似這樣的狀況"},{"start":12988.73,"end":12990.73,"text":"與其關心我跑幾個國家"},{"start":12990.73,"end":12993.73,"text":"不如更加關心我們住外同仁"},{"start":12993.73,"end":12999.73,"text":"怎麼樣可以得到合理的一些該有的協助跟補助"},{"start":12999.73,"end":13001.73,"text":"除了很基本的這些以外"},{"start":13001.73,"end":13003.73,"text":"我也認為這幾年我們同仁"},{"start":13003.73,"end":13005.73,"text":"真的很使命必達的"},{"start":13005.73,"end":13010.73,"text":"在海外盡力的希望讓世界的朋友"},{"start":13010.73,"end":13012.73,"text":"越來越認識台灣"},{"start":13012.73,"end":13014.73,"text":"所以我們也很努力在下一代"},{"start":13014.73,"end":13018.73,"text":"我們所有的同仁現在語言程度都要提高很多"},{"start":13018.73,"end":13021.73,"text":"因為我們都是在多語進行的狀態"},{"start":13021.73,"end":13025.73,"text":"包括本會編的教材已經進到11個語言的版本了"},{"start":13025.73,"end":13029.73,"text":"就知道說我們90幾個華語文學習中心"},{"start":13029.73,"end":13031.73,"text":"我們不是憑空的"},{"start":13031.73,"end":13034.73,"text":"一夕之間就突然間錢灑下去"},{"start":13034.73,"end":13035.73,"text":"我們就做得到"},{"start":13035.73,"end":13040.73,"text":"我們都是要從在地的僑團僑校的協力教師"},{"start":13040.73,"end":13043.73,"text":"才能來幫我們做這樣子一個工作"},{"start":13043.73,"end":13046.73,"text":"國內的教師我們還不一定派得出去"},{"start":13046.73,"end":13048.73,"text":"因為他們不會用當地的語言"},{"start":13048.73,"end":13050.73,"text":"而在交國際朋友"},{"start":13050.73,"end":13054.73,"text":"是必須要用當地的語言來進行教學"},{"start":13054.73,"end":13055.73,"text":"在德國用德文"},{"start":13055.73,"end":13057.73,"text":"在法國用法文"},{"start":13057.73,"end":13059.73,"text":"在西班牙語系國家用西語"},{"start":13059.73,"end":13062.73,"text":"在日語系國家用日文"},{"start":13062.73,"end":13065.73,"text":"所以在這樣的過程當中我們事實上是"},{"start":13066.29,"end":13069.29,"text":"多面向的要負擔很多很多的工作"},{"start":13069.29,"end":13071.29,"text":"所以包括本會同仁"},{"start":13071.29,"end":13074.29,"text":"大家不但是華語台語或講以外"},{"start":13074.29,"end":13076.29,"text":"很多人還學共同華"},{"start":13076.29,"end":13078.29,"text":"還學各種當地的語言"},{"start":13078.29,"end":13081.29,"text":"有兩語三語四語的人都是大有人在"},{"start":13081.29,"end":13085.29,"text":"所以老實說我認為我們外交同仁是"},{"start":13085.29,"end":13087.29,"text":"非常非常的不簡單"},{"start":13087.29,"end":13090.29,"text":"因為他們面對的挑戰跟訓練"},{"start":13090.29,"end":13093.29,"text":"是遠遠比其他世界各國"},{"start":13093.29,"end":13095.29,"text":"我覺得都來得更優秀"},{"start":13095.29,"end":13098.29,"text":"因為他們不是只有接受一般的"},{"start":13098.29,"end":13100.29,"text":"這種外交的挑戰"},{"start":13100.29,"end":13102.29,"text":"他們是double的挑戰"},{"start":13102.29,"end":13105.29,"text":"每一天我們都在外面面對中共"},{"start":13105.29,"end":13107.29,"text":"設下的各種各樣的障礙"},{"start":13107.29,"end":13110.29,"text":"跟一般國家我們可以正常進行的狀況"},{"start":13110.29,"end":13111.29,"text":"常常都是不一樣"},{"start":13111.29,"end":13114.29,"text":"所以我們就是要這麼的迂迴"},{"start":13114.29,"end":13116.29,"text":"軟性各種的創意"},{"start":13116.29,"end":13120.29,"text":"去達到最終我們要努力的目標"},{"start":13120.29,"end":13122.29,"text":"那我在這邊我也要藉這個機會"},{"start":13122.29,"end":13124.29,"text":"感謝我們全球的巧包"},{"start":13124.29,"end":13127.29,"text":"如果不是大家這麼願意協助"},{"start":13127.29,"end":13131.29,"text":"我們對於第一代之後的僑民"},{"start":13131.29,"end":13134.29,"text":"老實說我們是很急迫的希望"},{"start":13134.29,"end":13137.29,"text":"跟他們產生更多的交流互動跟連結"},{"start":13137.29,"end":13141.29,"text":"二代以後如果跟台灣沒有任何連結關係的話"},{"start":13141.29,"end":13144.29,"text":"沒有文化跟語言的傳承關係的話"},{"start":13144.29,"end":13146.29,"text":"接下來他就是當地國的人民了"},{"start":13146.29,"end":13150.29,"text":"再來我們也沒有什麼僑民可以再聯繫了"},{"start":13150.29,"end":13153.29,"text":"所以這幾年我們每一個外派的同仁"},{"start":13153.29,"end":13155.29,"text":"老實說除了專業要訓練以外"},{"start":13155.29,"end":13157.29,"text":"語言的能力都要要求以外"},{"start":13157.29,"end":13162.29,"text":"他們還要接受各種各樣新的政策任務的挑戰"},{"start":13162.29,"end":13164.29,"text":"但是大家都沒有怨言"},{"start":13164.29,"end":13166.29,"text":"還是持續往前邁進"},{"start":13166.29,"end":13168.29,"text":"這是我最感謝他們的地方"},{"start":13169.1,"end":13171.1,"text":"謝謝委員長的這個說明"},{"start":13171.1,"end":13174.1,"text":"真的僑務工作真的是非常的繁雜"},{"start":13174.1,"end":13176.1,"text":"也是非常的辛苦"},{"start":13176.1,"end":13179.1,"text":"如果你沒說出來可能很多人都不知道"},{"start":13179.1,"end":13181.1,"text":"僑務委會的工作是什麼"},{"start":13181.1,"end":13184.1,"text":"那這些辛苦其實真的是很不為人道"},{"start":13184.1,"end":13186.1,"text":"如果說你不了解的話"},{"start":13186.1,"end":13189.1,"text":"你還真的想說整天就看到委員長飛來飛去"},{"start":13189.1,"end":13193.1,"text":"那其實我們外交國防的委員"},{"start":13193.1,"end":13197.1,"text":"其實也有很多機會接觸到這個僑包"},{"start":13197.1,"end":13199.1,"text":"我們也常常要到國外去"},{"start":13199.1,"end":13201.1,"text":"那其實每一次遇到僑包"},{"start":13201.1,"end":13204.1,"text":"其實僑包對委員長的這個肯定"},{"start":13204.1,"end":13207.1,"text":"你的辛苦他們是非常的肯定"},{"start":13207.1,"end":13209.1,"text":"對你的評價其實是非常高的"},{"start":13209.1,"end":13211.1,"text":"所以為什麼這一次有這些指控出來之後"},{"start":13211.1,"end":13214.1,"text":"我們可以看到世界各國的僑包都願意站出來"},{"start":13214.1,"end":13217.1,"text":"替委員長說一聲不平"},{"start":13217.1,"end":13220.1,"text":"所以這一點的話我想委員長你這個應該"},{"start":13220.1,"end":13223.1,"text":"你也可以得到很大的安慰"},{"start":13223.1,"end":13226.1,"text":"因為你的努力是不是得到了這個肯定"},{"start":13226.1,"end":13229.1,"text":"所以這個部分的話我想僑委會未來的工作"},{"start":13229.1,"end":13232.1,"text":"還是非常的這個忙碌"},{"start":13232.1,"end":13234.1,"text":"尤其是面對這個中國的這個打壓"},{"start":13234.1,"end":13236.1,"text":"這一切都是很不容易"},{"start":13236.1,"end":13238.1,"text":"所以我們希望說"},{"start":13238.1,"end":13240.1,"text":"不管是朝野來講"},{"start":13240.1,"end":13245.1,"text":"大家應該是一致對外來支持僑委會的這個工作"},{"start":13245.1,"end":13248.1,"text":"那當然我們也希望就是委員長"},{"start":13248.1,"end":13251.1,"text":"如果說有做了這麼多"},{"start":13251.1,"end":13254.1,"text":"其實應該適時的跟國人來做報告"},{"start":13254.1,"end":13256.1,"text":"讓大家知道說僑委會的工作是什麼"},{"start":13256.1,"end":13258.1,"text":"感謝羅委員的支持"},{"start":13258.1,"end":13260.1,"text":"我們也很支持國會外交"},{"start":13260.1,"end":13262.1,"text":"要持續的拓展"},{"start":13262.1,"end":13265.1,"text":"我們也會盡我們所能在每一個點上協助"},{"start":13265.1,"end":13268.1,"text":"可能我們可以安排的這個機會"},{"start":13268.1,"end":13270.1,"text":"請委員進行繼續這個指教"},{"start":13270.1,"end":13272.1,"text":"OK 以上謝謝"},{"start":13274.85,"end":13276.85,"text":"好 謝謝"},{"start":13278.18,"end":13280.18,"text":"好 我們現在還有鄭正前"},{"start":13280.18,"end":13282.18,"text":"鄭正前 鄭正前委員不在"},{"start":13282.18,"end":13284.18,"text":"請洪孟凱委員"},{"start":13284.18,"end":13286.18,"text":"洪孟凱 洪孟凱委員不在"},{"start":13286.18,"end":13288.18,"text":"我們今天已經以登記質詢的委員"},{"start":13288.18,"end":13290.18,"text":"除不在場以外"},{"start":13290.18,"end":13292.18,"text":"均已發言完畢 報告及詢討結束"},{"start":13292.18,"end":13294.18,"text":"本日會議有黃仁委員 王定宇委員"},{"start":13294.18,"end":13296.18,"text":"提出書面質詢"},{"start":13296.18,"end":13298.18,"text":"請列入記錄刊登公報"},{"start":13298.18,"end":13300.18,"text":"委員書面及口頭質詢"},{"start":13300.18,"end":13302.18,"text":"未及答覆的部分"},{"start":13302.18,"end":13304.18,"text":"或要求補充資料者"},{"start":13304.18,"end":13306.18,"text":"請相關機關兩週內"},{"start":13306.18,"end":13308.18,"text":"以書面答覆"},{"start":13308.18,"end":13310.18,"text":"委員由約定期限者從其鎖定"},{"start":13310.18,"end":13312.18,"text":"本日會議到此結束"},{"start":13312.18,"end":13314.18,"text":"三會 謝謝大家 辛苦了 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